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Since Episode III players have had the story behind Kuylen's big target, the Mausoleum of Demnos, thrust in their faces. The story as provided is deliberately ambiguous and doubted- with good reason- by modern day scholars.

Whilst Avalar was a semi-myth that Kuylen proved existed- rather like Troy- the Mausoleum of Demnos- in SOME form- was known to exist for certain. But the Jedi never found it, and any Sith who ever saw it is long dead. Hence whilst there has been much debate about it, there can be no proof of what it is one way or another.

I will provide again the story of the Mausoleum here. What I would like players to do, just for fun, is to makes guesses- educated or otherwise- on what they think the truth of it is! And then we can compare at the end.

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Thousand of years ago, whilst the Sith were at the height of their power, millennia before the final Sith War, Darth Bane, and Avalar, there was a powerful, mighty and feared Sith Lord named Darth Demnos. His Sith army- the Cult of Demnos- was one of the most dangerous threats the Galaxy ever faced.

One day, Demnos came to a world, and there he built his own final resting place, his tomb- his Mausoluem. And there Darth Demnos ended his own life, committing suicide. But such was his power with the Force, that when he ended his own life he became spiritually 'one' with the structure of the Mausoleum, and the Mausoleum, cloaked in the power of the Sith, faded from sight.

The Cult of Demnos endured, with the Mausoleum as their headquarters. And the story went that if anywhere there was a Sith novice without a Master, then that Sith could venture to the Mausoleum, and if he were truly interested in completing his training, then the Mausoleum would reveal itself to him, and he would enter and find the instruction he sought.

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Now, modern experts in the field consider this story as nonsense. The idea that a mighty Sith Lord, at the peak of his power and influence, would actually kill himself as part of a selfless act designed to aid others is patently ridiculous- it is against the very nature of the Sith. And whilst the Force holds many mysteries, there is never any known instance of the Force actually being able to act like a cloaking device on a physical structure!

Therefore, today's historians believe the most likely scenario is that Demnos was murdered by his own apprentice- as is the Sith way- and that this apprentice used Demnos' name as a rallying point to continue the strength of the Cult of Demnos. As for the invisible Mausoleum, this is most likely allegorical- the Sith have always been hard to sense and find, as indeed the Mausoleum never was. However, of course, even the most prideful historians admit that this is only speculation, and that the truth will most likely be never known.

-

The theory, therefore, is that Kuylen and his followers, having received a basic grounding in the Sith from the information they stole from Avalar, will be accepted by the Mausoleum and they will complete their training inside. But if Kuylen knows more than he is letting on, he is keeping quiet about it, and the Dark Side players are as much in the dark as anyone.

However, the following 100% true facts will now be revealed:

- The Mausoleum does exist

- It IS on the planet at the co-ordinates players have received

- Whatever the truth, the Sith themselves considered the Mausoleum important LONG after the Cult of Demnos ceased to exist. Because the Astrolabe contains the readings for Avalar AND the Mausoleum. As Avalar was 'only' built just over a thousand years ago, and as the Astrolabe only contains the most vital of locations, it means that even in the final Sith war- when that Astrolabe must have been built- the Sith Lords wanted to know where the Mausoleum was. So there must be SOMETHING there!

- As explained in my little preview, the Jedi are, for some reason, so scared of the Mausoleum being found that they deliberately destroyed all possible means of doing so.

(And no-one ever asked Ascar where he got his Astrolabe from... oh well! Maybe you guys will meet him again one day...)

So then, let's hear your ideas on the truth!

We all assumed he found the Astrolabe while digging on a Sith world or crap like that...though he probably stole it from the Jedi Archives when he left the Order or something.

I'm not sure. The Mausoleum could just be a big fancy building built by the Sith, but then again, the myths could be true...

In any case, I'm going to kill people and Jedi with Sith powers or no Sith powers, I'm content.

If it had been in the Jedi Archives it would not work. It isn't actually important where he got it from, though.

Would a Sith building of a long-dead Sith Lord of no relevance to the Sith in the last Sith war have made its way on to the Astrolabe, if all it was was a building, is something to think about there, Rex.

I've got it! The Sith were HOPING the Jedi would find these coordinates, and the Mausoleum is actually a giant booby trap for the Jedi weaklings! WAHAHAHAHA!!! Umm... Nevermind...

well...you said it does exist....so something is there. Maybe a few old rumours flourished the situation a bit to exagerate some parts, don't know.
There might be this, though.
The mausoleum won't simply show itself at us (if those parts are true) because we know what we've read of the avalar tablets and want to be real siths. maybe there are some more extreme testings.
...and kuylen betrays us. and we find out and have to deal with it. dunno..i'll think more about it

Oh so just BLOW OFF my theory, EH?!

I'm APPALLED!!!!

I'm DISGUSTED!!!!!!

I'm... VERY, VERY HUNGRY!!!!!

Naw, I don't care, no hard feelings, Dexxy m'boy.

Both of those are very good theories. I hope the part about Kuylen blowing us off doesn't happen though, even though that is very Sith-like.

What do people think happened to Demnos?

It is more likely to me that his apprentice killed him and took his name, rather than he committed suicide. Unless he was a very eccentric Sith Lord...

The spirit of Exar Kun became tied to the Massassi temple on Yavin 4 and yet Luke didnt sense it until it was nearly too late. Therefore I would have thought it possible that Demnos has done the same thing. Whether through suicide or murder he had enough skill to tie his spirit to the mausoleum.
I don't think it's strictly invisable but mearly hidden from view. If you go seeking in the right place and maybe pass a test of worthiness then Demnos will reveal himself. Because light siders would not pass the test they will never find it and non-force sensitives would be oblivious it anyway.

Sounds about right....

Whilst it is coincidence that it turned out that the EU had a old Sith doing a similar thing as to the plot my brother came up with (which he always trieds to make as a big a Star Wars style cliche as possible), you may note that he and I are always pretty happy to accept EU references in our game (as opposed to discussion of the films), with a few common sense exceptions. Like the Ysalamiri.

So yes, Demnos's legend has precedent. But is it a self-fulfilling precedent- Exar did it, so people said Demnos did too? Ooh, now I am playing with you...

Hey you asked for our thoughts, well I dont have many so please be gentle with them

highly unlikely..what kind of a legendary sith lord would he be, then?

A very eccentric one...

Darth Pointless?

What if Demnos simply, kinda, sortof, like did kill himself.........to preserve himself type thing, and the WORTHY sith that comes in will get possesed by his spirt. And then he will raise another army, and there will be a new sith order.

Good idea Cels it could be that's how he's become immortal. By giving himself over to the force and then possesing the bodies of would be followers he can live forever without becoming old and wrinkly like Palpatine...

LL Plpatine should use some Nivea revitalising lotion

Yeah, that way he can do more damage through out time, every darksider that descovers the mossuleam is obviously worthy, thus he can posses them, do his dirty work, and then go back to the mossulean to wait for another that is wothy,

Sounds interesting...

I do not, of course, want to move away from the original question- please continue to submit your theories- but I will also ask, as people have been putting forwards all sorts of ideas- how much do you think Kuylen knows?

I think he knows more than he lets on. He's pretty secretive anyway. For example, he left Malastare without telling us much except get supporting forces or something like that.

That said, he delivered on it.

Kuylen acts like a military commander- he tells his men what they need to know but no more. But he stands by them- he did not build a team of expendable pawns, but has constructed a trained, disciplined elite team of people he wants to be able to depend on. Dissent is not tolerated and he kills both the disobedient and the failed out of hand- but he stands by those who serve him, no matter what.

But that said... how much can you ever REALLY trust a Dark Sider? There is a lot of power up for grabs here.

I think Kuylen knows something that noone else knows, something very weird about the mausoleum

Well...you can't! For example, a Jedi was helping a pack of Padawans escape Vader, but the Empire was planning to blow up the ship. To save their lives, he made a deal with Vader that he would join him if he let the Padawans live. Vader shook on it, but he's a Sith! You can't trust them! Vader had the Padawans blown to pieces and told the Jedi he had no place in the Empire. He left the Jedi to rot with his conscious...

EU, btw.

Yes, but point made- deceit, deception and treachery are the Dark Side way. Kuylen's firm point of view is that the internecine struggle that destroyed the Sith can be prevented with sufficient military discipline, as is the way of his people.

Well, soon you guys will be playing for keeps- and this theory will be put to its first test.

He knows what he needs to know. But I feel something coming which he did not pedict. I feel it...........

most likely

Hmm I wonder... I dont suppose Kuylen's already possesed by the weakened spirit of Demnos who is really just trying to get back his full power by returning to the mausoleum...

Kuylen steps into the room, his eyes glowing redly.

"Hello 'Galder', hello 'Rah', my old... friends... absolutely nothing of interest happened to me in my uneventful absence. Now, put on these black cloaks."

Celsius has grasped the basic idea that there will actually be a story for the Dark Siders, yes...

er... posted in the wrong thread, ush?

awh..sounds very interesting, and i'm most curious. But, yes, i also think kuylen knows more than he's telling. And not necessarily things that are not important to be said.

No, I was making light of the possessed Kuylen idea, yerss.

my bad, squeeze me

A very kind offer...

hehe

Go rex

Go as in go away or go as in "I'm the Man!"?

tha second one

Had an idea Ush has run out of ideas and he's going to pick the best one from here....

yea like in the 3.5 DMG a%die to see what your next adventure will be about

I think the Mausoleum is actually a secret Jedi base and the Jedi invented the Demnos myth to keep people away from it...

Youre the one that writes the story Ush. So how can we possibly believe that what you said is true. Thatd ruin it .

Cool! I grasped something.

HEY EHY HEY NANANANANANN

Carefull there Celsius your palms will go hairy and you'll go blind!

Why?

Because of what he's grasping? ...Oh well nevermind I'll leave being funny to funny people!

He's grasping an idea so his hands will go furry and he'll go blind, eh?

As long as he's not a Dark Jedi...

Baylin, who here is funny?

*peers around*

I see absolutely no funny people whatsoever...

*gasps*

(6th Sense impression) I see un-funny people...

*Twilight Zone theme*

Well I for one, as you all know, don't trust Kuylen any further than I can throw him. With the Force. Which will be my next trick....

Demnos....not sure. Although I am in complete agreement with the idea of no Sith committing a selfless suicidal act. Thats ludicrious, given all the information the Jedi have regarding the Sith. The Masoleum must have such incredible power, uncontrollable perhaps, by Jedi standards and that is why the Council had the Astolabes in their possession rendered unusable. Perhaps one Jedi tapping into the Masoleum could create a chain reaction of sorts, causing a 'contamination' of the Light Side ?

I know one thing for sure. If the Masoleum is built under a bloody volcano, I'm going to be pissed.

(adds in Volcano)

I think the Mausoleum is already being used by Palpatine, which is how he got his power, and why he is so keen to stop Kuylen.

Well, now we know we can't trust THAT idea... Thanks for aiding our process of elimination...

So sure are you, Dak. Maybe Ush has a copy of the Episode III script and he's reading off of that.

*gasps* MAYBE Ush is really GEORGE LUCAS!!!! *dramatic chord*

Ush, how many flannel shirts are in your closet ?

*peeks in closet*

OMG - THEY ARE ALL FLANNEL !!!!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !!!!!!!!

(grows beard)

Wow...you're hair is incredibly gray for a man born in 1977...

And now, I shall mix things up...

I posted four 100% true facts on the first post.

Actually... one of them is VERY misleading...

First post of the Dark-Side then?

Errr... no, of this thread.

4 might be the last 4 things you wrote up in the first post...

As for the misleading thing, dunno.

Ok, just to be clear. In the first post of this thread I gave you four facts I said were totally true, but I am now telling you that one of them is actually misleading.

Oh, I get it now. I knew what you were talking about, but I didn't get it exactly...

My guess would be the last statement. I can't believe the Council would order the Astrolabes disabled SOLELY to prevent the discovery of the Mausoleum.

Is that not good enough reason for you then? Masters these days...

Now, the Dark Siders might have some fresh perspective on this now... however, guesses had best wait until the good guys get there too...

Indeed...otherwise we'll let them know about stuff...but we won't.

Hey folks, remember this thread?

Time is running out before the truth will be known. You have all learned a lot.

What are your final guesses?

Tired off guessing, lets just plunge ourselves in, we're going to find out soon enough anyway!

The truth is but days away...

Oh boy fun!
Well we know that the entire base is a big bomb!!
Oh and there is probably some large source of corrupting self-destroying power that those dark-siders are going to attempt to get and probly destroy themselves.
*Sigh*

we went to all that damn trouble for NOTHING?

Yup!

awh.....it's kind of..disappointing...
lemme guess.kuylen kills himself?

Gosh my sides nearly split when I read that, and I though Rah's anti-climatic end to the game was bad, well not as bad as getting there only to read that plaque!

(My guess is that Ush has more up those never ending sleeves of his, I cant somehow believe after all this time (what is it 3 years?) that he would end it so erm simply....)

it blends with the universe, though..but..that's it

Heheheh...

Sorry about that guys. With luck, some of the post-scripts will help put things in perspective...

(runs from rampaging mob)

hehe I say we crucifice him

Torches and Pitchforks for everyone!!!!!

Added:
Holy Sh!t!
Go back and read the facts Ush posted,
They accually make sence, but it all kinda revolves around the mausoleaum being a bomb! not a sith power source.
The Dark Jedi and such would be interested because it would be kinda like a safe haven,
and the Jedi wouldn't wanna go there, because they are against killing and wiping out an entire sentient species or xenocide.

It makes soo much sence,
Wow, Ush accually knew what he was doing!

neah...there's no justification for a whole dispatch of jedi, merely for one planet. besides..the jedi knew nothing of the device...(these jedi, at least. our players)
but i guess it makes sense...that's not the problem...the problem is, it's damn disappointing

Much grumpiness I sense in you...

Incidentally, the bit I 'lied' about, as I mentioned before in this thread, was about the Jedi being so scared of the Mausoleum that they destroyed all evidence of how to get there.

Actually, it was ZEITON they didn't want found.

yeah..liar....ofcourse....if you'd have told us that from the beginning...we'd have figured it out

Ush has never ending sleeves, Baylin?

*looks at Ush's sleeves*

Are you sure?

Now that makes sense. They probably knew that the Mausoleum was dusty and didn't have anything there (or DID IT? *Twilight Zone music*), but the Jedi wanted to make sure Zeiton never destroyed itself, or had a Dark Jedi dictator.

Exactly. And as described in the story re-cap, even with the Sith destroyed, the Jedi feared that one of their own would do over Zeiton again one day.

And they feared correctly...

But he's the tricky thing. Did Kuylen just vanish into thin air? Maybe there was something there that Kuylen found, but we didn't find it because he already had, or something like that. Kind of like "Finders, Keepers, Losers, Weepers."

Just a thought there...

Oh I'm sure Kuylen will be back! In fact maybe our first darkside adventure should be to go look for him, afterall we are supposed to work for him and stuff.

I should think that Galder, Takuan, and Rah would be pissed with Kuylen for leading them through Zeiton for nothing...

Plus, Nume Rand will kind of become our head thing, once Zink finishes the load-out.

Kuylen knows where the Archive is...

Ok so we go find Kuylen and woop his butt for the leading us on a wild goose chase then. Oh and beat the location of the archive out of him too.

Sure you will...

well..takuan's not against kuylen...

Coward!

neah...call it an...old master allegiance...stuff like that

*Baby Talk voice*
Aww..
Is da itty-bitty dark sider afrawed of big strong master Kuylen? Aww...

Well, Rah and Galder will have cold feelings towards Kuylen, though they'll still flock to him since he's powerful and knows lots of safe places and Sith secrets. Takuan can feel whatever he goddamn pleases, especially since Rah and Galder seem to bag on him in the game preview for being kinda weak. Takuan can have hit a low in his life in those 2 years...

Hell, I think all the vets hit their lows during that point. Being reunited with Kuylen and having more recruits ought to brighten their spirits.

Ha ha, one year on, dummied the Dark Siders with Demnos twice...

Man, you guys just WANT there to be something so bad!

(For those of you who weren't here, this thread was pinned to the top of the area for about eight months as we tried to compare predictions with reality)

There may be an ironic link between this and Demnos' talent with deception...

You are truly a malicious being, I love how you abuse Galder's mind...

Geez, yes we want something to be there...of course!