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interesting Theory.

no traitor, except our belief in non-existent choice...(yes, the mero is right, at least as i see it, but i believe MWAM, so...) Also, Omega, this is part of why i support MWAM, BECAUSE OF this fact, plus "i do not believe in coincedence, i see providence, i see purpose"

the PROPHECY is a lie, however, from what happens when Morpheus is talking about purpose, i tend to believe that Purpose IS there, guiding EVERYTHInG...And if there IS a traitor, aside from Bane, it might be Locke, perhaps...Mad at the world for always going against him, not being able to control his captains...Not even his own WIFE...i dont know, perhaps there ISN't any traitors...

Locke and Niobe are not married - Morpheus is a fanatic and has been brainwashed into "believing" the prophecy which was all just a scam. Before he was "brainwashed" (let us say that for the time being ), he was with Niobe.

As far as a traitor, it is completely plausible and possible.

Brainwashed, now, eh, Sifer?

So next you'll call her Doctor Oracle, or what?

Go read "Morpheus" thread...it's been updated

Omega> yes, it is easy to say it is all purpose in hindsight, but when i was watching the movie the first time i thought the same thing...also, isn't it kinda amazing how things happen, in both real world and Matrix, at the EXACT time they NEED to happen, for the "prophecy" to be completed, ie Neo going to the Source...i mean, if it had been off by just one SECOND, Neo would have been dead...so, i will STILL stick to my PURPOSE-OBSESSION, until i am proved otherwise when Revolutions comes out, or until you ALL BOW DOWN BEFORE MY SUPERIORITY....JJ, that was my evil side coming out for a sec, i repressed him, for the moment...

I aint bowing down to anybody - Considering that is a point of the Matrix movies

I doubt that there could be another traitor. Every human in Zion knows the Machines are drilling and they will all soon be dead if everything goes to plan. There is nothing they can do, not even reinserting themselves. What good is that going to do? The machines will still destroy Zion. Why would they give up Neo or Morpheus? I doubt anyone would, they are too busy having dancing (jk). But really, no one knows about Smith except those aboard the Logos and Nebuchadnezzar so no one is going to sell out to Smith. Neo is in cahoots with the Machines in Revolutions. So in what way can there be a traitor?

Sifer> HAHA...
Spydar> WHAT THE HECK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?!?!?!

uhhhhhh.... (looking left and right)... ummm..... hmmm... I don't know. I was just saying I don't think there is another traitor. What sense would that make. It would be a waste of time. Neo and the machines are working together soooo no one is going to give neo up the machines. no one is going to give zion up the machines because the machines are digging (remember?). no one is going to give either Zion or Neo to Smith because no one knows about Smith except for those aboard the Logos and Neb... get it? no traitor.

If there was a traitor the sick bastard would be dead in 24...72... or however many hours.

I'll bow down to both of you when there is a traitor. But will you bow down to me when Neo dies and saves the human race and there is no MWAM.

Omega> i have done it before, i will do it again, IF you are right...see?http://www.killermovies.com/forums/images/moresmilies/notworthy.gif
Spydar> no

JediHDM> Right! And I did bow down to you before when you got me those .http://www.killermovies.com/forums/images/moresmilies/pray.gif trailers...

Spydar> Why? The traitor might be ready to be placed back in a pod

Omega> i remember that, i had almost forgotten about those...hmmm, something to rewatch, yes? although, i wonder when WB releases them to general public, ie quicktime version...
spydar> still no

Jedi, Omega> I bow down. Ahh what the heck, Sifer I bow to you too. As a matter of fact, all the usual suspects, I am bowing right now (trust me on this) You are all great. I really mean that.

Ok... please continue

It doesn't matter if they are in the POD or not. Neo made the choice to save Trinity. A choice the Architect said would destroy the human race. That means all of them, even the people in the pods. There is already too much going on in the story for there to be another traitor. Revolutions = traitor free.

No traitor. Bane is dead. Smith has taken him over. Smith could aid the architect if it meant he could get a piece of it....Power is his main interest. The sentinels were there because Smith manages to tip em off, and the architect sent them once Neo was out of the source and gave Morpheus the 411 on the prophecy.

got it

maybe it was smith//bane.. not that he was trying to help the machines but perhaps the crew figured something out or perhaps smith simply new what would happen when they succeded and he didnt want that to happen, so that he could still get to neo.. he could of just wanted to get rid of the crew for any # of reasons... cause once they are gone no ones in his way

I don't think there are any other traitors. There could be, but I doubt it.

Here's why:

Smith has the ability to control sentinels. If you listen very closely when Morpheus is talking in the building, he says: "When I see three ships, three captains...." ...... "I see PURPOSE."

It is not Morpheus saying PURPOSE, but Smith. It then shows the sentinels alter whatever plans they were doing and instantly head towards the ships. That's how the sentinels know where the ship is.

Now, remember that Neo and Smith share a similarity because of their apparent sharing of code. This obviously would make them equal, thus Neo could somehow stop the sentinels in the real world.

We don't know exactly how yet because it's PROBABLY explained in Revolutions.

There is no MWAM, and if there is, the W Bro's screwed up one of the best Trilogy's of ALL TIME. If it is only a dream, I will take all matrix products I own and lay them in the road, then repeatedly run over them with my car. (if only I had the willpower)

Seriously, that would be lame. If you really want to get in depth and read millions of different theories, www . matrix fans . net

WOW, thats some pretty powerful words for a newb...Hmmm, im not sure how to respond.

you cant say they screwed up cause of an ending.. maybe they think your opinions are screwed up?.. while i agree that i dont believe there was a traitor.. im tired of people launching bush like pre-imptive strikes at the bros for possible theories and endings.. even if one of them is true and you hate it.. a lot of people prolly love it and as stupid as you think they are.. remember the bros are the ones making the $$

and they are MUCH smarter than ALL of us...

WOW indeed!!! Thats what I'm looking for. Jedi give that (wo)man a cookie!!!

i dont know omega what carl says sounds pretty logical and a good explanation. just because smith is unplugged doesnt mean he cant control sentinals. if neo can in the real would why would smith not be able to (not my reason & explanation, but just food for thought). just because he is an exile doesnt mean he cant do that.

Omega> HAHAHA...
Spydar> IM NOT GIVING HER A COOKIE.

Pretty sure the Brothers are fans of Bill Hicks - I recommend watching some of his shows. I think you will see ALOT of relevance

And Carl - nicely put - Someone who agrees with me on the PURPOSE being Smith not Morpheus thing...

I find it funny that no matter who posts, if it is their first post they are considered newbies. While I understand completely what a newbie is and that I am in fact a newbie to THIS site, I happen to be a huge matrix fan.

forumcrew = you cant say they screwed up cause of an ending

The end is what everyone is waiting for. The Wachowski Brothers have elevated this story into one of the best of ALL TIME, an instant classic in 1999. Their storytelling and innovation is awesome. The W. Brothers make movies for themselves and for their fans while keeping simple enough to make average movie goers happy, we all know this.

An ending where Neo wakes up would suck, it's an old story, we've seen it before and the Brothers aren't like that. MWAM is just so lame, the idea made my 80 year old grandmother upset.

No, I trust the W. Brothers to give us something new, unique. An ending that is befitting of the Matrix title. What I said was IF NOT, then I would be upset.

For everyone else who posted, cool. You can have your opinions too, but I never said they were wrong, not yet anyway. In fact, does anyone here know what will happen yet? Probably not. So we'll just have to wait until Nov. 5th

There are lots of explanations and theories, and that's the richness of the W. Brothers minds. These movies are my favorite. I'm glad somebody made them cause I would be one of those Star Wars freaks if it wasn't for The Matrix.

And by the way, I don't even have an account at matrixfans . net.... I visit their boards because they are not rude to quote 'newbs'

It seems some people have power problems just because they've been a 'message board fan' for longer than somebody else. I saw the second showing of The Matrix in 1999 in my hometown theater.

I have been a fan ever since. When people dogged Reloaded, I crammed cake in their face. It's all opinion but I find that most people who dog Reloaded either never watched part 1 or don't understand the movies. One guy had no clue about Revolutions, despite seeing 'To Be Concluded' at the end of Reloaded.

I came here and signed up and posted. I've been going to matrixfans . net for a year and never signed up. I've only been coming here for 3 days.

Man am I glad I did that

I'm not sorry for thinking MWAM is lame and that there is probably not another traitor.

Finally someone understands me!!!

if they ended it with him in a dream yes i would agree they ruined it carl.. but the bros are far ane beyond that... but mwam.. that is a good possibility and i think a lot of people would be happy with it.. (and im not trying to put you down.. just tired of so many people putting down a movie thats not out) how do you think//want the movie to end carl?

Well then I'm sorry for my um.. blatant outcry, but the reason I sincerely hate MWAM is because.... it isn't new. They've done such a good job of keeping us suspenseful, then that theory was out like 5 minutes after everyone saw Reloaded. My guess is that they did it on purpose so that everyone would think MWAM, just my idea. Tired of reading about MWAM.

Anyway. Since you asked nicely, I'd have to say that an ending where Neo sacrifices himself for humanity might be good. Not a lot of movies do that but the idea is old behind that too.

As far as MWAM ideas go. I would say that being in Limbo and explaining that and the ending of an epic story will be hard enough let alone explaining that they are yet again within some matrix.

I don't think the Twins are in Revolutions, which bums me out, but at least I understand they don't really have much to offer the main story (as far as I know) So it's still good. I would like to see somebody talking to the Mero about Neo's predecessors and also about the 'old days'

I know it's assumed as the Oracles vision, but I would like to see exactly why Smith looks like he is fire. I want to know exactly why the architect meets Neo, if in fact he does, since we all know he said .... "We won't." Even though we think it's simply because the Arch didn't predict Neo's choices.

The only other major issue I really want to know. What's really eating me is: Does the Mero fight?

wow this is interesting. you dudes are true.

um, if it is your first post you ARE a newb, no skirting that fact...i understand that you have been a Matrix fan since 99, however, it gets annoying listening to different people telling us the same thing everyweek, because we are the ones who have been here. So i am not sorry for giving Newbs a hard time.

oh, and those of us who HAVE been here for a while have REASON to get mad at newbs, the number one reason being that we have to re-explain ourselves EVERYDAY to someone ELSE who has just joined, and after a week that gets QUITE ANNOYING...you stay around for a while, and you, too, will feel the SAME WAY...also, think about how much the Bros changed our idea of the way the movie was going in about fifteen minutes...i mean, in that time, our thinking goes from, "Neo is the one, This Matrix is the only one, the war is about to be over" to "Neo is one of SIX, this matrix is just another iteration, the war will NEVER be over", so it really wouldn't take that long to explain MWAM, especially since they already set the scene for it in Reloaded...I didnt say i think it is going to happen, but it is the most logical and provable conclusion based on the evidence that we have at the moment...

JediHDM> but it is the most logical and provable conclusion based on the evidence that we have at the moment...

Like the thinking of a machine?

Anyways, I understand. I'm not here to just post random crap and then jet after a couple days. I'll be hanging around until this forum is gone most likely, whether I'm posting or not.

There will be things we may find in the film 5 years from now and look back. "Man we were stupid to not see that!...."

Carl> of course like the thinking of a machine, didnt you know, im a cyborg...

No, it's good to know that

Does Agent Johnsons smile from upgrade scene.

Actually Smith has seen the code that dispatches the sentinels so maybe he can control them. In addition, he has taken over other Agents and he can hear the orders from the mainframe.

I'm sick of this shit: Jedi, whoever else, stop ****in flaming the newbies or I will come round and chop your ****in head off - ok, bit extreme, but do you get my point?...Good! Reason: I've been here longer than you - LMAO