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Hate to post new thread. But look what I have thought : Zion and the Matrix are a continuous program. Like interconnected or something. It is not a Matrix and then inside it another one. Just 2 Matrices. And the real world would be an exact copy of the real real world (or not). I am sure there have been a bunch of posts concerning this idea, forgive me for not being original . My question is: why is there the ability for a human being to be free of the Matrix (exit the program, roll off the pod in a tube...you know the stuff that happened to Neo when he got freed) in the first place? It is too power-eating (less humans-less energy) to really free human beings just to create and complete the path of the One when they could do it in Matrix-style.

the red pill disrupts his 'input output signal' and they flush him out thinking he is dead or something

Yes but the sentinel grabed him and saw that he wasn't dead! OK another irrelevant thing that came into my mind (but I don't want to open a new thread). Why in the Smith "fire" image (my avatar) you can see Smith's face but not his eyes? It is like the black glasses are blocking whatever this thing is from getting out. I believe that the same exists inside the Matrix as well.

yeh the docbot checked him out, he wasnt conscious in the matrix anymore, so he got flushed to be recycled.. im guessing

The machines don't have eyes... they have sensors, and because Neo was tubeless, it SENSED that he was dead. The reason the sunglasses block what is behind them is because they are adhering to the rules of the matrix. You cannot see past my sunglasses when I wear them, so why should this be any different? The fire is Smith himself, not his fashion accessories

No! It's fashion accessories. Just like the golden code with Seraph. Now everybody has a code style. I want my code red!

But Neo could see under the clothes of the lady in Mero's restaurant (the code spreading, blood and all this stuff (in code of course) and through her underwear Why is this different from the sunglasses?

Maybe he's not choosing to see under the glasses? Or maybe the glasses are actually part of the code? I mean, the Agents have eyes but only Matrix-eyes, if you know what I mean... coz they rely on their earpieces to feed them information. They 'see' in code anyway right, maybe the sunglasses are some sort of encryption/decryption tool? I dunno.. it's a better question than I first thought.

just for the LOOK i guess

sith_darth_jay

It's not a simple question. Think : why Neo had removed his sunglasses when he was talking to the Oracle and put them back on again when he met Smith? Same with Morpheus when he was fighting the agent in the truck.

ok i dont think i phrased it right
he wasnt conscious (dead) in the matrix, yeh it sensed it, and he got flushed out

Why did the sentinel check him then? Apart from removing the plug. Don't they have temperature sensors and stuff? Anyway I assume that the whole stuff was right. Where Neo fell, in the pool, weren't there dead human bodies?

The eyes are the windows of the soul...Neo, or any other figure, for that matter, takes off their sunglasses when they are being truthful, or are together, or are with someone to be respected...they put them back on when respect is gone, or they meet their adversary...

Jedi I have thought that and I fully agree with your opinion BUT why do the glasses hide the eyes in matrix code/fire state? I suppose that the glasses our heroes wear are not just simple sunglasses!

jedi, there are instances in both movies where the players inside the matrix aren't wearning sunglasses when fighting. additionally, there are numerous instances when ppl are speaking with someone they respect and are still wearning sunglasses. this should dispel your theory that ppl take off glasses when they meet their adversary or take them off when they're with someone they respect. ALL, there's NOTHING to the sunglasses thing: it's just meant to look cool.

i thought the architect explained this quite clearly. the machines need zion to exist because they introduced choice in the equations of the matrix in order to make it work. the 1% that doesn't accept the matrix, "if left unchecked, would constitute an escalating probability for disaster" (meaning if they don't unplug, the matrix will crash).

also, sunglasses can disguise bad actors because than they dont have to show hardly any emotion

Watching MR without subtitles seems clearer than watching it with! Well rysdigital you have given a good answer. Thank you (Smith style)

OK, the second part was kinda me just rambling, and i will give that too you, but that still doesn't dispel the fact that the eyes are seen as the "window to the soul"...Its not gonna be done everytime, but, for instance, when Neo takes off his glasses to talk to the Oracle, its kinda subliminal for "read whatever you need to tell me what i need to know" but puts them back on when fighting Smith, almost like keeping what he's thinking a secret...oh, and the bros. are notorious for making even the most minute thing very important, so, yes, there is probably a reason behind this, just like there is a reason behind the characters names, the license plates on their cars, the colors of the lighting, and the books on a shelf...all very important and lend themselves to the story...

burlyman> sunglasses can be used for this because the eyes are very important for visual in a movie. but this movie is different, I rule that out here because.
1) Hugo is an excellent actor, watch LOTR.
2) Keanu is a decent actor, watch Hardball.
3) Laurence is more of a stage actor, though he is a decent movie guy himself, anyone see the satellite commercial? He gained a lot of weight.

Anyways. Personally I think it fits in just fine with Matrix and there is no problem. I didn't say you did, just clarifying. They may be giving stiff performances all simply because they are all part machine, if the Deus Ex Machina spoil is real.

As far as another MWAM... please give it up. Official reviews have stated there is no MWAM... I think it's safe to assume there is NO MWAM in any form.

Back to sunglasses, (since this thread derived from the topic)... There was an idea I read a while back where it stated programs glasses were squarish and rebels were more roundish. It doesn't work anymore because at the ship meeting before the Neo vs Agents fight there are rebels with square glasses.

Too bad though, was a nice theory. I still just think they are there for visual coolness. Being able to see the eyes and windows to the soul or not.

hey, i didnt say they werent good

...

The first question was why Fire Smith is black where his glasses are. And I didn't say there was an MWAM.

maybe smith has no eyes now??

Argh!

I'm sorry, maybe I read the title of the tread and thought otherwise....

As for the question. That's why I posted about sunglasses, but I don't have anything to say about the 'blackness behind his glasses' because I don't have any ideas about that besides his eyes are not there!....

carl> if they are machines, then...(dun dun dun) MWAM!!!

But they can be machines and there still not be a (dun dun dun) MWAM...

Besides... there is no MWAM :P official reviews already said so

NO MWAM O F F I C I A L L Y ! ! !

G e t i t i n t o y o u r b r a i n

DID THEY SAY "THERE IS NO MWAM"?!?!?!?! NO, and besides, if they ARE machines, then that would mean it IS a program, ALL of it, as in Matriculated, which is the SAME THING as MWAM...

WHO said they were machines? I didn't.

Our body IS an organic MACHINE though, so your point is trying to prove what?

JediHDM> DID THEY SAY "THERE IS NO MWAM"?!?!?!?! NO

Yes, they did. There is three reviews that were posted at MatrixFans.net TLFC, and Ain't It Cool News. The reviews are 'legitimate', one coming from a sci-fi movie critic. In the reviews somebody said: "the thing I liked most was that there was no MWAM, you will be like WOW! after the movie."

I can't remember the quote exactly but it was pretty much like that. Check around if you want. I found it on the front page of MatrixFans.net

JediHDM> if they ARE machines, then that would mean it IS a program, ALL of it, as in Matriculated, which is the SAME THING as MWAM...

I was referring to how people are machine-like because they must be in order for the machines to keep them in the pods. When The One reloads the matrix and picks 23 individuals, the machines 'probably' and I'm just guessing because I obviously don't know. That the machines are much better at taking the 'machine' out of them. Thus they look and feel human without plugs.

This would make everybody part machine. It doesn't mean there is a MWAM.

Carl, have you looked at that review from Ain't It Cool News? Y'know the one that says "A Matrix within a Matrix? Luckily for us the Wachowski's are better than that"? Yeah, about that. The article that has the review says, and I quote, "It has been determined that the following review is complete and total BULLS***!".

Well, so much for being reliable.

If anyone wants to confirm this, it's at triple w dot aintitcoolnews dot com /display.cgi?id=16340

(Sorry about that, but I can't post links yet)

Oh, and just as a disclaimer, that site has some coarse language. Just so you know.

www.aintitcoolnew.com/display.cgi?id=16340

There.

Well, since there was NO Matrix within the Matrix...
Closing.