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Would it be the death of a mother he hasn't seen for 10 years or the death of a woman he has fallen deeply in love with over the last 10 years?

He was nine when he left Tatooine, his mothers memory must be getting awefully dim. (no pun intended)

where did you here his mom was going to die??

Well, it's a rumour. But then again the clue is already in TPM when Yoda notices Anakin's strong feelings for his mother. Anakin fears for her and fear leads to hate, hate leads to suffering. Shmi's death may cause a chain reaction to Anakin's feelings thus triggering his hate and bingo: the journey to the Dark Side is complete.

queeq out

yeah, she really wasn't well played

Oh, you think the acting is the cause that Lucas kills her off?

queeq out

Actually, I never said anyone would die. Rumours have circulated on the deaths of one or both of the characters mentioned over the last 6 months.

I just woder where people think Anakins deepest feelings will lie 10 years afger TPM.

I agree with DD. I think it will be a combination of factors that will lead up to and utimately cause Anakin's turn to the dark side. I only hope no one will call him "Ani" in ep2. Yeesh.

Well Padme might, especially if their relationship has flourished in the 10 years. Old habits being hard to break and all that.

Plus Shmi may, he's her little boy after all..

I just hope Anakin doesn't call Amidala Ami or Paddy.

I think it will be a gradual decline towards the dark side over the next film and the first half of EII. I am pretty sure that Shmi will die and this will probably be the first step. I think he will have so much going on that as bad as it would be to him for her to die he will have to move on quickly. He may end up surpressing his emotions as all these things add up and then Obi-Wan will have to confront him about his slip towards the dark side and this will cause him to snap, thus leading to their confrontation at the volcano.

Paddy... hehehehe

I agree with Mace. I think Shmi's death will indeed be the first step in the path that will cause him to fall. Shmi will probably die in Ep2, something will happen to Padme that may cause a breach of Anakin's trust in the Jedi. Other events will culminate until his fall to the dark side. The question remains, what happens to him that will make him turn so drastically from an innocent boy caring for others and giving "hope to those who have none" to the Dark Lord of the Sith who "must obey his master"? A clue must lie in the nature of Palpatine's evil power over Anakin somehow.

queeq out

With that said, I hope it doesn't comedown to Palpatine using some kind of "Mind Control" over Anakin. Yes, I know he will be persuasive and manipulative but pue out and out puppeteering would just diminish the whole persona of Darth Vader in the grand scheme of things.

I agree RC. I think GL has sort of hinted that the main basic reason for Anakin turning to the Dark Side is because it is an easier path than the one he already follows. Although it would seem surprising I personally believe that Palpatine might not play that much of an important role in Anakin's turn. I think that his life will just get too rough on him and too tough with all these tragic events and wars going on around him. So Palpatine will make a deal with him: join the most powerful force in the galaxy and get away from all the troubles in his current life in return for dedication to his master and constant practise in the Sith arts.
I think Palpatine just gives him the last kick after his fight with Obi-Wan.

Good point DD. Although... I wonder what OB1 meant when he told Luke: "This is a dangerous time for you, when you will be tempted by the dark side." It could point out that Luke's at a stage where he is beginning to master his powers and where the dark side is an easy alternative. On the other hand, it could also mean that Luke because noticable in the Force and that Palpy may move towards him ("There is a disturbance in the Force".

I don't know really. I kinda like the idea that Anakin falls due to his own faults, but who offers him the alternative path? It must be Palpy, somehow...

queeq out

I am a strong believer that Obi-Wan is the major reason for Anakin turning. In the OT Obi-Wan always looks guilty for what happened. I know that may be natural, but perhaps Obi-Wan is supposed to be protecting Padme and she is killed that would be interesting.

I don't want it to be Anakin's own fault that he turns to the Dark Side. It want all the other characters to be responsible so that they learn from their mistakes and it would also make it seem more tragic if Anakin became evil not by himself but because other people force him to somehow.

the council may strip jedi rank away from him

Well, OB1 was responsible for his padawan, so Anakin's failure is automatically OB1's failure.
And I think it's too easy too blame it on others. Of course, their conduct will influence Anakin, but for me it must be totally clear it is Anakin who chooses the Dark Side. Otherwise his redemption is not so very strong. I would find it very weak if Anakin becomes the victim of the series. The fact that he started his training at a later age must have something to do with it. Probably he gets disappointed with people because of his own views as taught by his mother. But his views may be a little too confined to one planet to fit the problems of the universe. It's his disappointment in people that will cause him to fall, I think.

queeq out

I agree, it has to be clear cut that his ultimate failure is brought about by his own actions. If others are to blame in any way then the whole redemption thing is worthless and doens't mean anything.

He needs to be seen to have been making some kind of atonement in ROTJ for his earlier failures.

Ratcat! We... agree...?

queeq out

RC, I couldn't have said that better myself.

Thanks Gundark.

queeg, you have this idea that I just want to disagree all the time?

Just pulling your leg.

And it's queeQ, with Q's, not with a Q and a G.

queeq out

Everytime I see "queeq out" I think of "Kirk out". Hehehe. Nothing personal, queeq. Just a certain point of view.

Boy queeqer...yer pretty pick for someone who just picked random letters for their name...

And it is just me or does anyone else notice Gundark's unexplained euphoria?

Dim in

*punch* Dim off. hehehe

So you liked that "Kirk/queeq out" analogy, eh, Gundark. You pretty quick and never mind Dim's euphoria statement. She's just jealous she didn't notice it first.

queeq very out

I noticed it....I just wanted to ignore your "James T. Kirk"ism
*rubs her nose*
Do I look like a pit droid?

Dim in

OK, well that kinda kills the whole Red Dwawf thread from last month.

OK, Queeq, where did that come from. I assume the capitalisation of the name is acceptable?

Can we just him Qq

He just made up the name...it doesn't have anything to do with anything....I don't know if you want to capitalize it...he already got on you about spelling it with a "g"...very picky for a man with a made up name

OK, so DRAGGING this back on to topic (Gotta keep those mercenaries happy!!!)

I was thinking about this and I thought I would express it on a more personal level, not that I want this to obligate anyone else to do the same. Anyway, here goes.

###If you are at all suspicious about discussing death then DO NOT READ ON###


OK, so my family situation isn't the same as Anakin Skywalker. I see my Mom every day almost, we live 2 streets away from each other, purely by chance before I get any accusations of being tied to Mommies apron strings....
Also remember that my wife and I have been together for over 11 years and met in out teens.

Right, that's the caveats out of the way.

So, if my Mom were to die then Yes I would be upset but I would get over it relatively quickly. The death of a parent is a natural progression of life. In the natural order of things children are not suppose to die before their parents.

Now if on the other hand my wife were to die then I think that I would be absolutely devastated and could not imagine ever recovering from that, though I would imagine that in time you would have to.

OK, my point is this. When in relationship with a lover/girlfriend/boyfriend/partner/etc, or whatever your chosen designation is for such things, you have a lot more invested in that relationship than anything with your parents.

What's the saying? You can choose your friends (or lovers) but not your family.

Anyway, for those that have read this through, that is my depressing thought for the day.....

OK, now that we FINALLY sorted out my name-thing, we can continue the debate.

RC, I don't really get what you want to say with all that. That Anakin's mother's death should not be the cause of his hate? But then again, Anakin was raised only by his mother, he had no fatherly role model until Qui-Gon and OB1 came along. So his attachment to the mother he was in a way forced to be separated from may be a lot stronger than we think. If her death becomes suspicious somehow with a certain false link to the Jedi, there might be hell to pay.

queeq out

Well basically, I was attepting to quantify my answer to the original question of what would have the biggest effect on his life. Like I said, we choose our wives/husbands/partners, we have no choice in who our parents are.

Ah I see. You may have a point, unless the mother has a very special place in one's life. I think this is the case with Anakin.
Anakin's fatherlessness may have something to do with that. He might feel responsible for her and might tend to blame his mother's death on himself, until he finds out what "really" happened.

queeq out

He was only nine, he couldn#t have gotten that attached to her.

Sorry, that was a joke in a film once, can't remeber what though.

Seriously, very tue I guess but he was a very independant child, I'm not sure if he was a close as you say. Well no more that any other nine year old would be.

I think you're underestimating the trauma you go through when you loose a parent...My dad died almost 5 years ago and there's still times that it all floors me again and I end up bawling like a baby..

Well, that says it all, I guess.

I think children are affected by the loss of parents, especially if they had a close relationship with them. And I do think Anakin had that with his mom. Check out the goodbye scene in TPM and ignore the bad acting for a moment. I think that may turn out to be the most important and even crucial moment of the film.

queeq out

One more comment on queeq's name..if we use just "q" for short, that's the name of one of the bad guys on Star Trek Next Generation. Ahem.

I think we shall see in the next ep just how strong Anakins tie with him mother is. He has no other family, a couple of friends and he's a slave (was). Not much love other than from his mother in that situation. So I'm sure there is an incredible bond there and also a relationship with Padme is going to be VERY strong (making up for love he didn't get from a father and brothers/sisters.

Maybe I just hard hearted. My father died 2 years ago, but following the initial trauma's I got over it. Well apart from the breakdown and clinical depression last Christmas(seriously).

Little tip, when the doctor offers you the happy pills, ask to see a shrink instead. I put on 40Ibs before I knew it.

Can we please drop the thing about my name. I never heard any complaints elsewhere. It's only five letters, there are two sets of the same letter and you don't even need to put in any capitals. Easy enough, right. Bunch of illiterate and dyslectic SW fans, you.

queeq out

Nufing rong wivv bieng dicklessic.

You sound like a German now. I don't know if that's a compliment.

queeq out

I'm not sure UBH would appreciate that comment.

Heh heh, in that last post Ratcat, where you were speaking funny, I thought that last word was something else.

Yeah, so did I...but my mind's in the gutter...Oh well, it's all Swedish to me..

UBH won't mind once he finds out where I'm from

queeq out

I wasn't going to comment on that word either, but I'm in the gutter with Dimmy too. But I don't think its Swedish..maybe Greek. queeqilyboy, I won't make one more comment about your name at your request, but that doesn't mean the rest of you can't !!!

So, are the ladies enjoying the gutter? What are you doing down there anyway? Gossiping?

queeq out

Why what ELSE could Dim and possibly be doing down there ?

Hmmmmm, nothing like Guttertrash <ouch>

Where are you from queeqy?

Well, I think I'll save that little secret until UBH gets mad at me for that little comment. You may guess, though. Maybe I'll even tell you when you're right? Just add up everything you read from me. Deduct carefully and your investigations may render the proper solution. I will promise you one thing, though. I will tell you when you're wrong. Chocks away, mate.

queeq out

"White Christmas" is playing on the radio here at the office. I love that song, just thought I'd mention it to bring a little holiday cheer to all you wookiees.

I say queeq is from......Denmark.

Germany or Austria. Hopefully the latter as I find it the nicer of the two.

Nope...keep guessing...

How about India ?

Am I allowed to guess?

The North Pole?

Mars ???0]

Okay, I'm starting a topic on this in GDF...

Anyone else have ideas on Anakin's Mom/Padme relationships?

All wrong and NO, Dim is not allowed to guess.

Okay, strict Mod, back to topic. Maybe Anakin tries to rid himself of his guilt to do better for Padme. That may be the reason why their love grows so strong, that Padme remains sad till the day she dies. At leats, that's how Leia remembers her.

queeq out

Do you think GL will show Anakin (after he goes back to free his mom) trying to explain to his mom how Padme was actually the queen in disguise when they met her..yada yada yada ? I think probably not, there will be too much going on when Anakin does finally go back to Tatoonine and I doubt Padme will be with him on that trip. Seems unlikely.

I agree. And IF that would happen, it would be the highlight of boredom of the entire saga.

queeq out

I think it should be incorporated somehow. Perhaps something like this;

Anakin finds Shmi.

Anakin: Mom, you won't believe what happened to me.
Shmi: Tell me.
Anakin: Well, first of the Padme was actually the ..... Wipe to different scene.

That way, things are explained to her, but we don't have to sit through it.

Hehehehe, that's very blunt. Wipe, sorry Anakin but it's not like you have anything interesting to tell. Maybe you'd be more interesting if you're evil. Heck, if you're a cool bad guy we might even cast you for another four movies.

queeq out

queeq, you can't have it both ways, though you seem to want to.

In one post you say it would be boring and then you knock my idea for a scene thsat shows Shmi being told without the audience having to sit it out.

Me thinks you're just spoiling for a fight.

PUT 'M UP! PUT 'M UUUP!

I think you are misreading. I had fun reading your suggestion because it was in line of what I said. But I think Anakin should not explain anything, nor make a lame attempt. Or as Master Hitchcock used to feel like: explaining is boring.

queeq out

Bully!

But if he hasn't seen her for ten years, he's gonna have to fill her in on some of the details surely.

or is it a case of;

"Heu Mom, I'm a Jedi now but don't sweat it!"

He can tell her endless stories about him blowing up droid control ships and Padme's underwear. I don't care. As long as he doesn't do it on screen.

queeq out

Exactly, Jeez you make it difficult sometimes.

Not difficult, accurate. And... sorry...

queeq out

Hmmmmmm. Maybe we should get Lucas to make a special version for you with 10 hours of "Tales with Anakin" and make you watch it.

Well, I almost sat through The Ewok Adventure... twice... maybe I'll be able to see some of it.

queeq out

I think were in for a very moving scene when Anakin is reunited with his mother after all that time. If she dies in Episode 2 ,(which I belive to be a strong possibility), that would really push him over the edge. I agree that there are other factors governing his journey to the darkside, but the death of his mother will be the main driving force behind it.
Anakin and his mother have a unique bond as there was no father present at his conception. His guilt at leaving her behind and the effect of not having her present during his adolescent years will be a burden on his shoulders (Jedi or not)He's only human after all, and his training was commenced at a late stage.Her death would be the final blow for him!
As for Padme, I believe she will survive episode 2 to be killed off in the concluding chapter of this first saga.

So what you're saying is that Anakin is like 75% of kids in the south of London.

LOL..:-)

Actually, that probably wasn't such a nice thing to say, but oh well.

I think it is a safe bet that Padme will die in Episode 3 and not 2. I thought I read somewhere that Natalie Portman had signed a three picture deal. Some people are saying that she won't die in the prequels, but she has too, Lucas said it would be "very dark" well Padme dying would be "vey dark" and also a very sad moment in the movie. Her last words..."my children..<cough>...take care of them, they are the only hopes."

RC:

And JM, so far I'd like to hold on to Leia's memories of her mother. Since children hardly remember anything before their 4th year of age, I'm quite sure Padme will survive the PT. Darkness does not necessarily imply death.

queeq out

But as Leia puts it, she doesn't have memories as such, more feelings.

In the novel, Leia has memories of hiding in a trunk.

But did she remember the chocolate cake from her 5th birthday?

Ah, now we getting to the important details, RC. I'm impressed.

I know Leia sad she had just feeling but she did have some idea about her mother: beautiful, kind, yet sad. That seems pretty much like a live one and not someone she'd ever know except at birth. Just my 0.02.

queeq out

RC, you know mentioning chocolate cake will lead us right back to food will which will lead us right to .....CHICKEN !!!!! Run ! Here comes Daft !!!!!

More Daft McNuggets? I'm stuffed...

queeq out

with chicken feathers ?

Taxidermy is my life.

queeq out

Sorry, but someone told me there was some chicken here.

Well?

Yep, he just walked in.

queeq out

Okay people...you can only talk about chicken if you can work it into a theory... And I don't want to see something as easy as Shmi chokes on a piece that Palpy made for her...okay?

Shmi chokes on a chicken bone? Sounds like a valid theory, where did you hear that?

queeq out

You know in TPM at the beginning of the Gungan Battle when the MTTs open up and reveal hundreds of battle driods? Well as I saw it on pirate CD the quality wasn't particularly good and it took a long while to finally work out that they were Battle Droids in crouch positions. When I first saw them I thought they were loads of chickens and the Trade Federation were going to use them to lure the stupid Gungans out from the energy shield.

Just thought I'd throw that in there so that you can laugh at how daft I am.

Hahahahahha yeah...that must have been really poor quality!

Well, actually you're not as daft as you think DD. Dim shouldn't be laughing. In the Making of TPM George Lucas explained that the movement of the battle droids in battle was inspired by the flocking of pigeons. This is a true story, go and read it.

So, DD, your insights serve you well.

queeq out

In the ParkWars spoof on TPM trailer they used chickens for the battledroids

See Daft. Time to change your name.

queeq out

So does this mean we will be welcoming Darth Perceptive soon?

Hehehehe.

Twilight is upon this thread and soon night must fall.

queeq out

Rest sweet thread, you were a good friend...

perhaps anakins deepest feelings after 10 years lie within and for himself , an arrogance that results in his downfall. Perhaps he feels like he already lost his mother when he left hisa home world. PErhaps finding out who his father is may turn him. I for one find hard to believe that the true choosen one, the ultimate force user etc etc could ever fall from grace.

I'm not sure we will find out who his father is. Could we really endure another "I am your father" scene.

Though I do agree that Anakin may well have been brooding over the 10 year period.

Lucas has already stated that Anakin IS the true chosen one. Without him the nevents that lead to the balance being achieved would never have happened.

Well, RC, I for sure cannot stand another "No, I am your father scene". Although Lucas did show a tendency to repeat himself in TPM.

Brooding is good, that'll work.

And no night must fall. Strong am I with this thread, but not that strong.

queeq out

But strong with the dark side is this tread.

Anyway, we'll see.

*waiting*

queeq out