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could shmi be lying to qui gon? or just not realize what happend to her?

I can't get the scene out of my head when shmi is overlooking qui gon taking to obi wan about anakin's midichorian count and the sith music ooozzing into the end of that scene as we see shmi with a suspicious look on her face!!!

could anakin be a clone of an past great sith lord? our old pal palpatine could be behind this!

hey, I know this is a long shot, but ya never know...now that would be a good shocker/bombshell (lucas style)

Well, it is possible..but I always thought she just looked concerned.

the whole thing seems sort-of mysterious. shmi may have not wanted to say anything else, or maybe she really didn't know anything else. the fact remains, anakin's midi-chlorian count is huge. if he did have a father, i want to know who it was.

by the way, can shmi use the force? would make sense if she could. two really powerful parents create a super hero or something. okay, maybe not.

I think if she could use the Force that QC would have sensed it. I am still believing that there really isn't a father, thus explaining Anakin's power. If the life forms that create the Force created him, it explains how he is the choosen one

I agree with Dim. Shmi only looked worried or concerned to me. And she did not seem to be force-sensitive in any way, but I guess you never know.

I think a dark Jedi may be Anakin's father,maybe Christopher Lee.But having two Skywalkers discovering their fathers are evil Jedi would kind of be dull don't you think?Who knows it could even be Palpatine.I do think Shmi knows who the father is though.

I agree that Shmi just looks concerned while standing by the door at night. But I don't think that we'll find out that Anakin has a father. I know we should expect to see lots of plot-twists and surprises, but Anakin being conceived by the midichlorians seemed to be a rather important matter in his role as the chosen one and it is unlikely that Lucas will change it.

I know...I agree with all of you, but I can't help but notice the sith music mixed into the end of that scence and think there was a hint of some sort....


I'm probobly paranoid on this one...I know...

No! Like I said before, the Medichlorians and Shmi conceived him. That's why his medichlorian count was "off the charts".

Why does Anakin have blonde hair when his mother has brown?

The father maybe had blond?

If there is a father that is.

Which I beleave there is.

Maybe midi's are blond.

I had a debate on another board one the official bio's on StarWars.com revealing possible clues. It struck me that Shmi's bio did not mention anything about Anakin's conception but did tell how she could sense him so well. This might mean Anakin's origins are still open.

queeq out

Yes I heard that she could sense when he was near or far away.

Maybe she gave Anakin his Jedi reflexes.

If she has so many midichlorians within her then how comes she doesn't really show much jedi traits (apart from the one we just mentioned)

Because she was deprived of those skills being a slave.She didn't have a mentor that could open up her skills.That is why she showed no signs.

"Because she was deprived of those skills being a slave." So was Anakin, yet he showed Jedi reflexes and seeing into the future.
This midi thing is getting out of hand, hopefully Qui-Gon was wrong on this one.

queeq out

Thanx for that info EJ.

Why should Shmi be Force sensitive. Whilst it is true that some children inherit Jedi traits from there parents, it is obvious that this is not always the case.

The Council seek out potential Jedi, why would they do this if all they had to do was wait until a Jedi spawned a child then just show up to "adopt" the child?

Seems to me that the potential to be a Jedi is as mach a randomness of nature as it is an inheritable trait. The required set of conincidences required may only appear very rarely.

Rememeber also that Jedi numbers are estimated at around 10,000 as far as I can remember, that's not very many in a big galaxy. Vary rare a Jedi is indeed.

Good point. So can animals be force-sensitive too? I'd like to see a sarlacc use a lightsabre.

or a Jawa...

"The force flows through all living beings" so despite Queegs comment, Yes I believe they could have the potential to use the force.

I would imagine a force sensative animal would problem develop force skills out of instinct as they would lack the brain capacity to develop anything of any complex nature.

Back on Topic: The force line could pass down many generations beofre the correct "match up" is found genitically to prodcue a force child.

If a Jedi and a non-Jedi can produce someone like Luke then would that mean someone with parents that are BOTH Jedi would be extremely Force-sensitive? As far as I know, not even in the EU have we seen someone who has parents who are both Jedi.

Good point DD, I have always wondered that myself. In the new books Luke and Mara are about to have a child, talk Force power, wow! It would be interesting to see how much force power a child of 2 Jedi would have

Yeah especially when one of those Jedi is Luke Skywalker. We could be looking at a seriously powerful young Jedi Knight here.

This could be awesome or then again it could mean that they have a force null child.

Remember, 2 red headed people don't always have a red headed child. All this assumes that an anaology between force inheritance and genetics can be made.

Yeah good point. I suppose it depends on what average percentage of sperm carry the midichlorian genetics to the egg.
But then I guess we're never going to find that out.

Well it would support the scientific side of the Force that was in TPM when we heard of the midichlorians.

Scientific? Midi-chlorians? *insane laughter*

queeq out

What?...did you think SW had no science?

Well, the midi's are hardly to be considered a scientific explanation or approach of the Force. They are merely transmitters of the Force, but that's all. So there's not much science about it, just an announcement of the existence of such bacteria.

queeq out

I wonder why Lucas didn't stay within the more mystical element of the Force. I would have thought it would be obvious that fans would be a little disappointed with the introduction of midichlorians, so I wonder why he didn't make them be...oh, I don't know.....Force energy or something. A Force energy field that surrounds Force-sensitive beings like Anakin.
And Qui-Gon could have said to Obi-Wan over the comlink, "I'm sending you a blood sample. I want an analysis of the energy waves being produced by the blood."

Ok, that sounded silly, but ya know what I mean.

The midi-chlorian concept confounded me too. I was spoon fed on Ben's "its an energy field created by all living things. It surrounds us and penetrates us, it binds the galaxy together". Nothing about midi's there. Seems to be a completely external thing according to Ben. Or maybe he gave Luke "his point of view" again.

I never liked the midi-thing. As if Lucas tried to find an explanation why Anakin was so strong with the Force and why it was transmitted to offspring. I doubt that was necessary. I doubt anyone would care about that for real, just part of the mystery, I'd say. This kind of explaining is plain boring. Alfred Hitch@#%$ is one of my favourite directors and he hated explaining because it was BORING. He was sure right on that one.

On the other hand, there is the possibility that the midi-thing is a Jedi misunderstanding which proposes the necessity of a Jedi Purge and would give an explanation why the midi's weren't mentioned in the OT. And maybe through the purge they find that it was wrong to depend on the midi's. It would sure help explaining to Luke where he came from. "Your grandpa is a bunch of bacteria". Anyone care to tell him that?

queeq out

I agree that it's obvious that the reason Lucas introduced the midichlorians is because he needed to find a way to describe just how strong Anakin was with the Force. But like you said, it wasn't nessecary. I think my version (above) would be better and it ties in perfectly with what Ben says about "energy."
Basically, Lucas should have just said that Jedi's cells don't contain midichlorians, but in fact they contain high amounts of energy, which is what gives them their reactions and speed and agility and strength and ability to control the Force.

I think GL might have needed the midis to set the stage for some plotwork in the upcoming film...I don't want to condem the midi development until I have some evidence that GL WON'T go anywhere with it.

I hope GL does something more with the midi's. It's the only way he can save the midi-scenes in TPM.

queeq out

Yes. Although I didn't like the midichlorian idea, it's too late now and so Lucas must continue with it. He can't possibily just leave it in TPM and never have it mentioned in Episode 2 and/or 3. It also may give him a chance to wind around the scientific element of the Force and make them seem more mythical, like the fans would prefer.

I'd just love it if the midi-theory of the Jedi turned out to be a hoax. There must be some reason why OB1 and Yoda gave up on the prophecy-thing in the OT. If the midi's were not the explanation of Force-sensitivity, then there would be no chosen one. And yet there is... it takes Luke to draw him out. (Although I still believe Luke suits the role of chosen one much better)

queeq out

That's because we've only seen the OT and just one of the prequels, in which Anakin is only a little boy. I'm sure that during the course of the next two films our view of Anakin will change a great deal and he will indeed seem like the Chosen One.

I don't know. We've already seen him in four out of six movies and Luke only three out of six.

The thing is, Luke is the first one to turn from the dark side. He uses his anger to defeat Vader, gets praised for it by Palpy and almost gets killed for it. Only then Vader turns, moved by his son's love for him.

Also it would make a great dramatic turn of events, when the one everyone believed to be the Chosen One turned out not to be him. Everyone stops believing in the prophecy, then Luke comes along and destroys the Empire. And I know that it was actually Vader who killed the Emperor, but without Luke's great example he would never have done that.

I know it won't happen, because Lucas said Anakin was the Chosen One, but I just like this scenario better.

queeq out

I don't think we can really say that Luke was turned from the dark side...it's more like he was almost turned and then pulled back..IMO..

And I have never thought that Luke was the Chosen One...other than flirting with the dark side...what is really so extraordinary about him..really?

Wow Dim!Love the sig.Will you please e-mail me the different types of sabers?

What is so special about Luke?

Well, lets just see, he happens to be the Greatest Jedi of all time. He is able to face down Palpatine and Vader and not die, no others could do that. I know he doesn't kill the Emperor but I think if he would have kept he Lightsaber he could have, but thats besides the point. He senses the goodness in Vader when even Yoda and OB1 couldn't do that. He becomes a Jedi in about 2 weeks, others need years. He is able to resist the very heart of the Darkside in the face of two of the most powerful Sith Lords ever. He is raised on Tatooine, thats an accomplishment all in its own. I know, I know, you don't like using the EU, but he I am pretty sure that even in EP7,8,9 he would have rebuilt the Jedi order single handly. Not to mention that he just kicks some major butt. Sorry, about all that, but Luke is my all time favorite character. Oh wait, I almost forgot, he blew up the Death Star as well.

I agree, JediMaster.

And I do believe it's a bit more than flirting with the dark side. He USES his anger to destroy Vader. Something like that probably made Vader turn, realising the power of the Dark Side.

Now remember that line from Yoda (which is the clue to my preference of Luke being the Chosen One): "Once you start down the Dark Path, forever will it dominate your destiny, consume you it will, as it did Obi-Wan's apprentice."
Now, Luke DID start down the Dark Path in ROTJ when he defeated Vader and yet he managed to turn back. And then Vader followed his example.

queeq out

Yes good point, Queeq. Perhaps this shows us that there need not be a chosen ONE. A chosen TWO perhaps? Or maybe, because Vader escapes his destiny by turning to the Dark Side it means he is no longer the Chosen One Luke takes his place. I know that the Chosen One isn't a title that can be swapped around to other people or anything, it is just a name for THE greatest Jedi there ever was. But still, both Anakin AND Luke have there own reasons why they could both be considered the Chosen One. We'll find out more in Ep 2 and 3.

Well, of course there is ONE chosen one, because ONE should bring balance to the Force. In pure, cold fact Vader brings that balance by dropping Palpy down the chute, but it cuold never have happened without Luke. So who is the true hero. IMHO it is Luke.

queeq out

I agree queeq, Anakin may fill the prophecy but his destiny was fulfilled by his son. Anakin kills Palpy and that brings the balance but Luke is the one who gives Anakin the strength to kill him. Without Luke the galaxy would have fallen into complete darkness, because without the push from Luke Anakin would have become completely wrapped up in the darkside of the Force. I know that Leia was also a Skywalker but had Luke died, who could have taught her?

Filling vs. fulfilling the prophecy. That is really a good one, JediMaster3838.
And I agree about Leia. She didn't even realise she had the powers Luke and Anakin had. Guess she was not very sensitive to the Force.

queeq out

Something tells me Lucas may never tell us who the Chosen One actually is out of Anakin and Luke. It would be good if he just left it to us to decide.

He already did. In several interviews, but maybe he will not stress it like that in the movies and leave it a little in the middle.

queeq out

Luke, The Greatest Jedi of all time??? Who in the world said that...He wasn't an exceptional Jedi...he barely knew what he needed to when he faced Vader and Palpatine..Now, I'm not saying that the kid didn't have potential to become an exceptional jedi...but I think that it's too much to assume that Luke was anything near that...I do think he was a hero..but that's a different matter.


And noone else can fullfill your destiny...

They can if Lucas says so...

Which Lucas hasn't, just for the record.

Lucas has staed that this si the story of a little boy who grew up, becamse corrupted by greed and power and was then redeemed. That's Anakin.

"He is the chosen one, why can't you see it" to paraphrase a now dead Jedi master.

I think we all know that RC. I just think that had Luke not been there Vader would have never brought balance and so Luke was partly responsible for the balance hence the "fulfilling" part. And who is to say that Luke cannot be more powerful than Anakin? Anakin could be the Choosen One by why can't Luke be more powerful. By saying that Anakin is the most powerful because he is the choosen one is saying that there can never be anyone more powerful than Anakin. I don't think that is true. I just think that it is Anakin's destiny to bring balance that is why is the choosen one, that does not make him the best Jedi. It is possible for Luke or someone else to be more powerful. I mean, if Anakin is so powerful then how is it that Obi-Wan defeated him and knocked him into the Lava pit?

I just watched that part in the movie, going back to the original question. I've heard in many, many instances how QG was evil underneath, that his intentions in training Anakin were selfishly made and done in haste, and that was why the council was opposed to him. They could all sense something was wrong with the Jedi Master, but non could quite place it, not even Yoda. I think it's for this unforseen "evil" side of QG that the coucil doesn't train Anakin. This scene seems to point to that, it's like the scene in which Palpy smirks as they cut away from him watching the Queen head back to Naboo. Little hints towards what I feel will be major developments in Ep2. Schmi looking very nervous about QG's intrest in her son, while evil music softly plays in what would be a calm scene point towards suspicios things involved. I think in Ep2 Yoda and OB1 will uncover a bombshell about the "true" meaning behind Anakins discover and QG's desperate desire for him to be trained. A big deal will be what happens to Ani when he finds out, and who tells him(palpy?). All this from one scene, but I find it to be VERY interesting meterial for what twists might appear in EP2!

back to the chosen one. the main theories are that its anakin for destroying the jedi or for destroying palpantine(empire) or even luke for being the one responcible for turning vader and thus killing palpantine. but what if luke is actually the chosen one because he started down the dark path but came back. the empire (sith) are destoyed and the galaxy is left with one jedi who is "balanced"/ goes both ways, so to speak.

JM: Luke may have been instrumental in help vader redeem himself, but at the end of the day it was Anakins decision to make. Anakin saw what Palpatine was doing to his son and, in my mind, related this to the attrocities throughout the galaxy and thought "NO MORE!" and hence Palpatine meets Reactor in chilling style.

To Xizors point, being selfish does not make QG evil, just misdirected. QG was his own man and appeared to be extremely string willed. I may be wrong, but I don't think we will discover that QG was really evil. He had toomany good and true traits to be evil. IMHO...

Sorry, but what does IMHO mean? People keep using it and I don't know what it means.

Anyway, perhaps Qui-Gon's good traits are there so that Lucas doesn't want us to suspect anything. Like Xizor said, there will be a ton of surprises and twists that will work well with little hints in TPM and I think that's what's going to make the Prequel Trilogy seem so clever.

I think IMHO means in my humble opinion, but I could be wrong. And I hope that your are right DD. I expect at LEAST one major surprise but hope for many ones.

Yes...IMHO does mean "in my humble opinion"...

And I have no idea what would be better than something as suprising as "Luke, I am your father"...I hope you're right...

What is Vader had said "Luke, I am your mother"... now THAT would have been a surprise!!!!

..."Anakin I am your father"-Jar Jar Binks now THAT would be surprise. J/K.

LOL, IMHO OC.

queeq out

Has any one considered the fact that Shmi may have been a prostitute when she was younger?

Would YOU tell Qui Gon that's how this remarkable little boy was concieved?

I guess that could be a possibility, but I don't think she was anything but a slave. I heard her family was killed by space pirates when she was a child and she was taken to Tatooine to become a slave. From then on she was swapped around from master to master. I don't think she would have been in prostitution at the same time.

Maybe she was raped by one of her masters. That could explain why she was so reluctant to talk about it. And then the real question is to whom Shmi belonged before she conceived Anakin.

queeq out

Or she could have been pushed into iot my a "pimp" Hott. Ok, sounds stupid but this senario could be true.

Actually, if the recent plots ideas about Shmi's fate are to be believed we may never know. According to them she wikll only be a on screen for a short while as she is beaten by Tusken Raiders and dies in Anakins arms only minutes after he finds her in the desert.

Some reunion huh?

This is starting to get out of hand people.:/

This is Star Wars people...not Shmi Does Tatooine...the answer is simple...Anakin has no daddy...NO DADDY...he's not normal...(I think everyone can atleast agree to that)

Nope, can't agree cos we don't know for sure yet. And, as I said earlier, I don't think it will be resolved if that plot synopsis at Aldera.Net is true.

Shmi does Tatooine, now that IS funny.

I agree with Ratcat. Until the saga is complete you could even say that Vader isn't really Luke's father and he was lying in the OT. Nothing is set until we hear the whole story.

It's npot so much that, but yes you are right.

I was more thinking along the lines that if Shmi dies without revealing it then effectively her story could die with her.

Yes, I agree. If Lucas wants to do anything sensible with those midi's, he'd better deliver Anakin's dad somehow. Shmi's response to Qui-Gon's question is too unsettling to dismiss the fact that Anakin had a dad at all.

queeq out

One thing I DON'T want to see is Plapatine turning out to be the father. But then, as I have said so many times, I hate it when things get too interconnected.

Yeah that would be too much.

Yes I would hate for Palpy to be the father too. If he does indeed have a father then the best bet would be Christopher Lee as he is certainly force-powerful and possibly plays a banished Jedi, which would explain why he is unknown.

That is an idea with some merit, I think I could almost go for that. I just wonder how they would have met?

Maybe Dooku owned Shmi before Gardulla.

queeq out

Okay...Lee being Anakin's dad could be interesting...I'll give you that.

A bit forced, but somehow I could buy that story. I wouldn't like it very much, but if Anakin has a dad, midi-chlorian-wise he should have some kind of Jedi father.

That is weird isn't it? Where do all these Force sensitive kids come from? It seems Jedi are celibate although that is not confirmed. If they are not, they might have their own breeding centres.

queeq out

It is funny when you think about Star Wars characters doing regular day-to-day things like we would would in the real world. Like the topic about whether Darth Vader shaves or not.
Do Jedi Knights look at pornography now and then? Do they watch TV sitcoms in their spare time? Do they play on computer games? Do they go on the internet and make posts on forums about incoming movies?
All these things are things that characters from the Star Wars universe might do, but we will never find out, so Queeq, I don't think we'll ever come across any breeding centres.

Like Qui-Gon said,"It's a hard life."

It's liki imagining the Queen on the toilet, you just can't picture it...

Haha.

But that didn't really answer my question. Where do Force sensitive kids come from if midi's are genetically tranferred onto the next generation? That means either their parents are Jedi (remember Qui-Gon saying that if Anakin had been born under the republice they would have found him at an early age) or their parents where undetected Force sensitive people as well. It didn't really have anything to do with what they do in daily life, but it has to do where padawans conme from (and spare me the birds and bees story)

queeq out

I think we kinda did this to death already, not repremand intended. The "Force Gene" for want of a better description could be rare and require just the right match up to actually produce a Force child.

Bit of biology, though it's been a few years. This is a very simplified model so none of you Biology grads pick me up on it OK.

Mum has brown hear, her "Hair Gene" contains 1 brown and 1 red
Daddy has blond hair, his "Hair Gene" contains 1 blonde and 1 red
Red is the least dominant gene and requires two to make a red headed child therefore the chance of a red headed child are about 1 in 4.

The equation is a lot more complicated than this but you get the idea. This could then be translated to force children.

Another example, there was an afro-american couple in the 1980's who had a white child and it was discovered that a few generatons back in both family lines then had been a white spouse on each side and the genes had carried through being regressive until the couple met and had a child who by chance managed to inherit a large proportion of the genes.

OK, I get that. Thanks for the reprimand.

But still, a Jedi or very Force sensitive person must have reproduced somehow. And a lot of them too. Ten thousand active Jedi at the time of TPM. But then again, the universe is a big place.

queeq out

WHAT BLOODY REPRIMAND. ???

Are Jedi Celebate?

I guess if they're not married they'd have to be. Well in the book according to Saint EJ anyway.

I think Jedi must have relationships. They're not monks or nuns are they. We've really seen so little of the Jedi still that it's very hard to make any assumptions about the way they live their lives.

OOPS, another reprimand by RC. Sorry, massa.

Well, exactly right. We don't know much about their relationships, that's why it's fun to speculate about it. Will Anakin get in trouble because of his desire to marry Padme?

queeq out

<Ratcat pulls out a large stick and proceeds to beat queeg to death with it>

I think the must do, though I'm still uncertain as to how the Jedi structure works I think that the way it's been portrayed in the EU with Jedi Knights living on their how planets once they have been trained.

<Wipes blood from stick and wanders away whistling to himslef>

Thank you sir, may I have another.

What a violent place this is...

So there might be breeding centres after all... *limps away in hurry picking up one of his eyes that fell out after RC beat him*

Uuuugghh, I'm off to die somewhere...in peace...

queeq out

Hey Ratcat, did you know that there was once a black couple who had twins and one was black and the other white. The white one was racist towards the black one later in life.

Anyway, about this Jedi sex thing. I reckon that Jedi are certainly allowed to have sex during free time, but not during missions and I don't think they need to be married. Sex is just sex. Even Jedi shouldn't have to stick by rules where you can only have it under certain circumstances.

That maybe the family I was talking about. I was only remembering something I heard a few years back.

So the Jedi and kinda militaristic in that regard. No sex on duty???

Yeah I guess thats the only time when it would be disrespectful. But anytime else is fine. Well I reckon so anyway. Of course I could be totally wrong and Jedi never ever have sex.

Actually, I'd have to disagree. Could you imagine Ewan McGreggor agreeing never to have sex again!?!?!? The mans a sex mad perve!!!

What do you mean "never to have sex... AGAIN"? When did he have sex if Jedi are not supposed to have any. He was a 25-year old padawan when we first met him.

queeq out

It's never said that Jedi are celebate...Plo Koon has a bunch of wives doesn't he?...end of story. As far as Ewan goes...I'm hard pressed to think of movies that he didn't get naked for..he seems to revel in that..

Dim got my point. Ewan McGreggor is such a complete pervert it's untrue.

He's famous for getting his kit off. There was an ongoing joke during EpI filming that he was trying to get GL to put in a scene where OB1 runs naked across the screen.

He also enjoys his sex life very much, according to a recent UK TV appearance where he discussed it at great length.

I always think people who always talk about their sex life (alot) must have feelings of inadequency... Maybe he just does it to make himself seem more exciting...

and with that...This topic is closed (100th post!)