Apocalypse Vs Thanos?

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Thee_superman
Who would win? They have about the same strangh level

VENOMfan
I think thano's is more powerfull.......way more actually especially if he gets that infinity gauntlet

LeAtHerRFace
Apacolypes. Since his got the Horsemen to back his @$$ up!.

kal-el
could someone give me run down of these two's powers/strength level?. I know a bit about apocolypse but not much of Thanos, just what the marvel encyclopedia says.

Never
I listed those in the Marvel and DC Universe in terms of who is the most powerful. Thanos is #1 for a reason wink Notice Apocalypse did not make the list?

kal-el
ok but what can he do guy?

VENOMfan
well, there isnt much he cant do..........If im correct whatever he thinks happens when he has that infinity gauntlet

Never
Pretty much. From the OHOTMU:

"Thanos possessed incalculable superhuman power. By far the most powerful of the Titanian Eternals, Thanos was a mutant whose massive, heavy-bided body was born with the capacity to synthesize cosmic energy for certain personal uses. (This is a trait that Thanos shared with his father Alars and all Earthborn Eternals but not with Titan-born Eternals. Through still unknown bionic amplification, Thanos increased his physical strength and resilience to levels surpassing even the strongest of the Earth Eternals. Through meditation and certain mystical techniques, Thanos augmented his power in still other ways, enabling him to tap, transform, and direct vast quantities of cosmic energy for destructive force. His skin in nearly invulnerable, particularly against heat, cold, electricity, radiation, toxins, aging, and disease, and he can survive indefinitely without food or water even before his "curse" from Death left him immortal, unable to die. His mind is also invulnerable to most forms of psychic attack, and can project a psionic blast of energy as well as blasts of plasma/cosmic energy from his eyes and hands. He usually employs a hovering chair with additional offensive weapons and the ability to teleport fantastic distances. Deadliest of all Thanos's attributes, perhaps, was his mind, whose superhuman level of intellect was totally dedicated to the annihilation of life."

VENOMfan
unless im overshooting his abilities, Darksied may have been a much better opponent for Thanos

LeAtHerRFace
Darkseid would destroy Thanos.

VENOMfan
already sounds like a better match laughing

LeAtHerRFace
lol

Never
Actually Darkseid and Galactus are almost on the same level in terms of power - and Galactus owned Darkseid.

Thanos would beat the Sunny Delight out of Galactus.

Will let you figure out the rest~

LeAtHerRFace
Where the hell did you get that info?

kal-el
well if Darkseid is so hard, how come he admitted defeat to superman way back in the early 90s.

Magee
aye yes

Never
John Byrne, who wrote the issue wherein Darkseid and Galactus fought (Silver Surfer kicked Orion's ass in that issue as well - damn near killed him). Darkseid unleashed his Omega Beams, and...Galactus smirked at him. He then raised his hand, unleashed a beam, and put Darkseid on his ass.

Thanos is also, without a doubt, more powerful than Galactus by leaps and bounds.

Eidolon
Didn't the living Tribune eventually defeat Thanos by just thinking or making the infinty gauntlet loose it's powers or something.

kal-el
(in his first appearance might I add)
Well no-ones answered this. even you superman doubters.So can someone explain it to me coz from what I've heard, Thanos is like a God and you guys are saying Darkseid is on a par with him.

Never
Not sure about that. Will research it...and Thanos with the Heart of the Universe is more powerful than even The Living Tribunal. Infinity Gauntlet grants him mastery over Time, Space, Power, Mind, the Soul, and Reality.

And...Doomsday put Darkseid on his ass with 2 punches. Get real. Do remember that his Omega Beams failed against Doomsday AND Galactus? What will they do to Thanos, who cannot die?

Thanos trained Gamora, one of the top hand 2 hand martial artists in the entire Marvel Universe.

Thanos went toe to toe with Odin in Asgard.

Checkmate?

LeAtHerRFace
Well.. in that case. Why did they make Thanos vs Darkseid in a Marvel vs DC clash?. Isnt there anyone stronger in DC that could take Thanos on?...

Magee
krona maybe?? wink

Rasta
I quote;



I'm sure one of those characters from the DC universe would be on par with Thanos. But then it's still hard to tell who would win, with so much power.

eleveninches
No Question

Thanos could kill a thousand apocalyses.

Thanos is a truely cosmic being, a god, immortal, and was the supreme being of the marvel universe
(though i don't think he quite compares to the living tribunal)

Never
God yes, there are TONS that could defeat Thanos - and again, this just underscores how horribly overpowered DC Comics is.

Batmite, Myx, any 5th dimensional imps; The Spectre, Lucifer, Michael, Krona, Azrael, Superman Prime - list goes on and on and on.

eleveninches
Superman defeating Thanos????
I think not!!

Thanos was the supreme being of the marvel universe

eleveninches
Also, In the recent run of Thanos comic book, if Thanos could easily beat Galactus, then why does he admit that he is no match for Galactus, and that Galactus is the most deadliest and dangerous enemy he has ever faced

VENOMfan
continuity in comics is ridiculous

LeAtHerRFace
Your tellin me!! evil face

LeAtHerRFace
Isnt Krona the strongest of the 5th dimensional imps?. And who were those Blue and Red brothers that was fighting in the Marvel vs DC comic?. Those guys were really strong.

Rasta
I don't think there is such thing as an overpowered character in a comic. It's not like it matters, it's doubtful that you're going to see comic after comic being made about characters such as Micheal, Lucifer, The Presence, The Source. Etc.

VENOMfan
thank god for that, nobody likes a serie's about problems being "blinked" out of existence.....

beliveable character's facing odd's is was make's a story

Gregory
Actually Lucifer does have his own comic, but it's well done.

I agree with you, though. The simple existence of a lot of powerful characters does not make a universe "overpowered."

Never
Read closer. I said Superman Prime, the one from the 853rd Century who makes Pre-Crisis Superman look like Brittney Spears. You know, the one who hibernated in the sun for thousands of years? The one who has the last of the Green Lantern Rings? Yes, that one.

Now you were saying...?

And yes, the existence of a universe with ~100 characters whom are a step above Marvel's SINGLE most powerful character makes DC Universe's characters overpowered.

Krona is not an Imp. He's been around since like...the dawn of time. Blue and Red brothers...? Have to pull out that issue and look. Anywho, Krona was the one in the DC vs. Marvel who was owning Galactus, and badly. Like...really badly. Grandmaster was afraid of him.

Thanos vs. Galactus? I keep saying...Thanos with the Heart of the Universe. He is still more powerful than Galactus with the Infinity Gauntlet, in my opinion. Not sure why they wrote it in that manner - guess Venomfan summed it up best with his continuity comment.

Gregory
Overpowered? Meaning too powerful. Too powerful for what, exactly?

Never
Too powerful, period. See where Batmite and Mxy are (on the list of ubers)? Imps from the 5th Dimension who can do...anything. Evil Mxy destroyed the entire universe and recreated it because he was bored. Parallax has done the same, if I recall correctly.

This is nothing new. Superman was considered "overpowered" (apparently the concept of a character who could do anything negatively impacted a writer's ability to pen a creative story arc), hence "Crisis On Infinite Earths."

LoL, Doomsday evolved beyond death and does not even make the list of DC's "ubers."

tkitna
I think we're over exaggerating the might of Thanos. First of all, lets take the infinity gems out of the equation because he only possesed these for a mere moment in time. Any being with the power of the infinity gems aquires that power. That power just happens to be absolute.

I dont think Thanos can defeat beings such as Galactus, Collector, Living Tribunal, Ego, Eternity, Celestials, Death, Stranger, In-Betweener, and Epoch. These are supreme cosmic entitys. Thanos doesnt possess that kind of power. The Silver Surfer has battled Thanos (and usually lost but nontheless) many times and he is only a small portion of Galactus's cosmic power.

Darkseid and Thanos is probably the closet matchup DC and Marvel has, but I feel that Thanos is a good bit more powerful than Darkseid.

I also feel that Phoenix and Binary had powers that were greater than Thanos. They did devour worlds after all.

Never
Most potential matchups involving Thanos include the Infinity Gauntlet because of just that - without it there would be not contest. Same reason many will debate King Thor, Ultimate 616 Colossus, Sun-dipped Superman, full potential Iceman, et cetera.

If you do not think that with the Infinity Gems Thanos can defeat some of those you listed, might want to read up on whom he already defeated with it wink

Thanos sans the Infinity Gauntlet = no match for Darkseid.

And by the way...LoL I keep pointing out that I was referencing Thanos with the Heart of the Universe.

Never
Just remembered - Thanos defeated The Living Tribunal who is more powerful than Galactus, Eternity, Ego, Collector, Death, Celestials, the In-Betweener, and Epoch.

That answers that.

tkitna
I agree with the Infinity Gems he could defeat these beings, but if anybody possessed the infinity gems they would have that power also. Its just that not anybody would have the mind and skill to use them.

I've been away from comics for about six years so could somebody explain the "Heart of the Universe" to me. I'm not familiar with that.

I've seen that the DC's ubers have been mentioned. Where would Marvels "Impossible Man" fit in that category? Just curious.

Never
Not sure why you insist on attempting to separate Thanos from the Infinity Gauntlet. That's like mentioning Dr. Jekyll sans his potion.

Anywho, one resource regarding the Heart of the Universe:

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/akhenaton.htm

tkitna
Does Thanos contain the power of the infinity gems now? If not, why are we including a power he only had for a six comic run? If he does, I understand.

Thanks for link. I just read up on it. Heres the quote that loses me some-
Thanos would not be allowed to hold the power cosmic. Even with his new self-awareness and new inner peace, his ego would force him to absorb everything in the universe after getting attacked by the gods and heroes of earth. After Adam Warlock forced him to realize the futility of his actions, Thanos gave up all to restore all that he had destroyed.

Sounds just like the infinity guantlet storyline to me, but who did Thanos give the power up to? Adam? And, who did not allow Thanos to hold the power? Himself? Sorry, just a bit confused.

***Hey Never, i'm still curious as to what you think about the comparison between the DC ubers and the "Impossible Man"? Are they comparible or are the ubers way more powerful? Sorry, just trying to catch up some.

Never
Because one more often than not includes Thanos with The Infinity Gauntlet when creating potential matchups, regardless of whether or not he currently possesses it. This is not just me. Example?

http://www.electricferret.com/fights/issue_146.htm

Would you prefer Thanos with the Cosmic Cube?

Regarding your questions, you answered them both yourself wink

The Impossible Man. Purple costume? Pointy head? Have not heard that name in about 20 years...LoL, we called him "Pop Up Man."

Mmm, they are capable of molecular manipulation. Lots of DC's ubers can destroy and recreate entire multiverses.

They do not compare at all.

tkitna
Thanks for all the information.

I messed up with my question. I meant the DC imps in my comparison to the "Impossible Man". I realize he's a goofy character, but it came to me that I thought I read a book where there was an entire planet of "Impossible People". I know for sure that he hooked up with a female species of his kind and they had a litter of kids. Just imagining the untapped power and madness of an entire planet of those characters. He could after all, do just about anything.

Magee
Going bak a little about Thanos and Darkseid. When DC and Marvel met up Thanos found Darkseid who he thought was his counterpart (other half). Darkseid challenged Thanos to a duel to the death and of course Thanos accepted the events across the pair of universes would come to echo this titanic struggle. All of creation would learn of the existance of two brothers...beings _beyond_ gods. Countless billions of years before, the pair had come into a conflict so vast, it destroyed the pre-existing universe and created a new one. The forces unleashed seperated the brothers...and their shattered conciousnesses gave birth to a multiverse. Over the eons they finally regained their sentience, but without any knowledge of one another. Now, after recent cosmos-shaking events...the brothers had once again become aware of one another, and were prepared to renew their timeless conflict. These two obviously being Thanos and Darkseid. The merge also brought 2 beings in to one and one union this was Thanoseid (Darkseid and Thanos). I thought that to be funny. Anyway. However, the amalgam universe would be short-lived...and the union would be found to be the result of a last-ditch effort of the Living Tribunal and the Spectre to save the cosmos. Later Thanos found himself on Earth, and came into conflict with Lobo. The pair battled, threatening to destroy the surrounding city. Thanos, eager to find Darkseid, finally brushed Lobo aside. Soon Darkseid arrived and before the pair could grapple, they found themselves opposed by some of both universes most powerful heroic beings. Soon, the Living Tribunal journeyed to the Nexus of the Multiverse in an attept to convince the brothers to reconcile, and instead found the pair battling...a conflict which had already begun to tear reality asunder. As the brothers battled, the skies of Earth became filled with blood...blood which rained down upon the surface of the planet. This sight moved Thanos enough to state that it was the most beautiful thing he had ever seen. The Brothers clashed again, ripping the pair of noble beings asunder...a move which allowed the brothers to see into the souls of the dying men. The nobility and sacrifice they saw in these two unique men so moved them, that the fueding cosmic brothers ceased their battle, clasped hands and admitted in unison that his counterpart had done well. The brothers then parted...and reality was restored, returning all involved to their proper place in the multiverse. And there u go. Thats wat happened when Thanos and Darkseid met up big grin

Marvelguru.tru
Apocalypse would beat Thanos and if you know anything about the two opponents you would have to agree with me. Apocalypse is indestructible, he can alter his mass immensely, he can shape shift to his hands to make extremely powerful projectiles and he can alter matter! Alter matter people! This means he can absorp ambient energy, and even create forcefields his powers are incalculable! Thanos isnt shit have you ever seen him challenge any one wiithout the infinity gauntlet? Didnt think so ! Thanos needs the infinty gauntlet to be a fromidable opponent for Apocalypse. And just to set the record straight no one is more powerful than Galactus, he eats planets!The most powerful form of power is cosmic and he is the master of it.And if that isnt enough for you Galactus created Silver Surfer with one finger!And Silver surfer has strenght to match Colossus', he is totally indestructible and has a control over cosmic energy, He could level a large state with a force blast!

eleveninches
/\
No Way!

Thanos is a titan, apocolypse is just a mutant.
Thanos is almost a cosmic being, he was the ultimate being in the marvel universe for a time, and defeated galactus.
Apocolypse might be a threat to the earth, but thanos is a threat to the universe if he became evil.

It took apocolypse 5000 years or so and he still has not conquered his home planet (even when most on his planet are weaker than him), whereas Thanos conquered Titan in almost no time at all, (even though most titans were not much weaker than him)

Never
And you call yourself "Marvelguru?" roll eyes (sarcastic)

Galactus, most powerful? Purchase Excalibur #61 and read it, please?

Ever heard of Eternity? Death? The One Above All? The Living Tribunal? They are all quite a bit above Galactus.

Thanos defeated The Living Tribunal. This puts Galactus where?

Phoenix defeated Galactus. Drops him down even further!

Thanos would defeat both Galactus AND Apocalypse. Matters not if Apocalypse is "indestructible," what would happen when Thanos dropped him into a black hole? Scattered his molecules across the cosmos?

Surely you jest!

Rasta
Really, he beat the Living Tribunal? I thought that guy was ****ing god-like. Got any pics of that? That'd be sweet.

eleveninches
Did Thanos use the infinity gauntlet when he beat the living tribunal, cos i can't see him doing it without it

Magee
He also defeated eternity. And yes he did have the infinity gauntlet but even with out it im know he could destroy Apocolypse. I mean Thanos has got what class 100 strength??, teleportation, telepathic powers and psi abilities, he can also disrupt and manipulate matter. Also his powers were increased by Death when she returned him to life, giving him the might to fight such powerful beings as Tyrant, and Odin (King of Norse Gods) on nearly even ground. His body is tremendously resistant to injury, can go without food, water and even air for an indefinate period. His body is also able to withstand a total vaccum (such as in deep space). His abilities to manipulate cosmic energy have been increased to a high degree, and he can utilize it to grant himself near-invulnerability, or to project the energy from his eyes or hands in the form of light, heat or concussive force. He is also highly intelligent, with a highly cunning and logical mind. He possesses not only the Advanced knowledge of the Titans, but also technology and skills gained from all over the Universe. Thanos is also a hightly skillled combatant, possessing knowledge of many different styles of combat from throughout the universe. So there u go. Apocalypse is no match for Thanos big grin

eleveninches
I meant he couldn't defeat living tribunal without the infinity gauntlet, not that he couldn't defeat apocolypse

eleveninches
I totally agree

MaverickIce
Ok the Inifintiy gaunlet ended when LT seperated Thanos with a thought. Never, Galactus was very weak when Phoenix fought him. Galactus can't "lose" a battle because it is a phoecy that says Galactus must stay for a "final battle" and can't die until then........

Linkalicious
can someone name a couple of comics with Thanos in them where he kicks total ass? I have the whole Inifinity Guantlet series and he kicks ass and i have a few Silver Surfer comics where he fights Thanos and they go to an almost stand still. I'm really interested in seeing Thanos beat Living Tribunal...which comic and what # is that one?

eleveninches
Theres the current Thanos series, in which he has just finished dealing (for now) with galactus and an extra dimentional mysterious villain.

Never
Did not know "losing" a battle was commensurate with dying...? No prophecy states that Galactus cannot lose a battle. Galactus is, however, a fundamental thread of the fabric of the Marvel Universe.

Regarding Phoenix...well Phoenix defeated him...like, easily.



What? What series did you read? The series that I possess has Adam Warlock stating that "Thanos is truly invincible, utterly omnipotent. Our allies' power is less than nothing against Thanos' might."

Allies consisted of Galactus, Eternity, The Living Tribunal, two Celestials, Adam Warlock, Silver Surfer, The Avengers, Quasar...The Living Tribunal refused to intervene. EVERYONE attacked and vaporized Thanos - but for a split second, because with a mere thought he trapped them ALL in suspended animation.

In the last issue Thanos was tricked after he discarded his corporeal body and Nebula got a hold of The Infinity Gauntlet as he was in spirit form. Nebula trapped him in cement, remember?

So um...what issue did you read?

Linkalicious
^ i remember it being like that!!! I think it was a What If? Comic where Silver Surfer had the Guantlet and LT dismantled it...but i'm not too sure w/o checking my comic collection.

MaverickIce
I thought you said you never read it? Anyway, it was a what if story that I got mixed up.... and can you review Exuliber # ??? that galactus lost in

MaverickIce
It might have to do with that Thanos isn't connected to it besides in the Infinity series....

Never
Went and purchased it.

Re: Thanos "not being connected to it," debate anyone on the internet regarding Thanos vs. Darkseid, Green Lantern, whomever. He will have The Infinity Gauntlet. Thanos is inextricably linked to The Infinity Gauntlet.

Review it? Grrr...

Cover, she's in the traditional green and gold costume. Phoenix is out cruising and spots energy signatures from Galactus' machinery. She tells Galactus that he must cease all activity at once; Galactus says "I will brook no interference. I have need of sustenance." Phoenix pledges to stop him, no matter the cost.

Now.

They only show panels of the battle similar to Paul Smith's illustration of the Wolverine/Silver Samurai battle in Uncanny #173ish. No dialogue until Galactus falls. Anywho...

First page: Fight looks even. Second page: You can definitely tell that the tide is turning. Only word on the panel is "Meanwhile..." Phoenix is shown deflecting his eyeblasts. Third page: Shows Phoenix directing a blast in Galactus' right eye. Looks as if his helmet is short-circuiting. He misses a blast with his left hand, and is falling backward, right hand raised similar to one shielding one's eyes from the sun. Fourth page: actually this one has several panels. First shows Galactus' mouth opening, energy pouring from both eyes. Second shows Galactus falling, energy (smoke? cannot be, it is yellowish) trailing from him. One hand is on the ground. Third shows has him laying on his stomach, and the dialogue ensues wherein Phoenix learns more about the nature of The Phoenix Force.

His entire helmet/mask has cracks in it, and the area on which he stands looks like ground zero.

He was...Karl Mallowned in that encounter. Phoenix departs after their dialogue; Galactus resumes feeding.

malkavian
Apoc vs Thany?? Hmmm tuff one
I would say Thanos wins, coz he has the power of the gods
while Apoc just thinks he is a god smile

eleveninches
They feud in the new thanos series, but galactus realises what thanos intended to do and turned on hunger

Wynndar
Thanos was not more pwerful than the tribunal...eternity begged the tribunal to stop Thanos and the tribunal snuffed him out...even with the guantlet.

Never
Two things. Here is the quote in case you missed it as regards to who is more powerful between Thanos and LT:



And Thanos already defeated Living Tribunal.

wolverine8888
if thanos doesent got the gauntlet then hill deffently lose

Maelstrom
I will wager existance is not about power but about being. Apocalypse has mastered aging to agelessness and all his achievements are within his ownership. The mere fact that he persues power is nothing more than a distraction to those who want it. Plus his mutant power to turn his body into manuverable apparal is to bad.

Magee
Infinity gauntlet or no infintity gauntlet Thanos would still beat on apacolypse, bad. When Thanos did have the infinty gauntlet he was unstopable, im sure he killed eternity but im not sure and the only reason he lost it was because he was trying to impress death by showing he could defeat the remaining heros without it, wich he did, hulk,silver surfer, galactus?? not sure, captain marvel and varias others. but im a little rusty on Thanos :/

Maelstrom
If you develope your own powers like Apocalypse your being is not of this eternity. Thus someone who destroys it can't destroy you. Even in the bible God's promise is that what is for you is not of this Eternity.

wolverine8888
with out gunlet he loses there no dought with it well there no dought he win

JuggernautFan
for all who says thanos will win, let's not count apocalypse out just yet. neither has said to have a specific limit to thier strength. well wait, actually apocalypse has. his strength is unlimited. he doesn't have to get mad, or subconsciously will himself stronger, he simply is. thanos has taken on powerful beings before and shown to be superior, but that doesn't mean he has no limits in strength. strength advantage apocalypse. apocalypse also is a warrior born and raised. even before his mutant powers were given birth he was extremely skilled in the usage of weapons and of his own body. fighting ability again apocalypse. apocalypse has mastered time travel, and has lived for 5000 years since his birth. he has more than enough experience at his disposal to hold his own with thanos. both are immortal. both are basically almost indestructable. let's also look at other abilities. apocalypse can shape his body to any outward appearance he can imagine. on top of all this, he can grant himself any power he so chooses. And i do mean any power. he can mold shape and grant himself any power. a powerful gift if you ask me. also, let's look at intelligence. thanos is probably more intelligent given that he has seen things and experienced things beyond just earth based travels such as apocalypse. but his intelligence isn't all that much greater. i'm not sure what the person meant when creating this thread, but i'm sure it wasn't thanos with the gauntlet or thanos controlling the heart of the universe vs. apocalypse. so we will stick with just apocalypse vs. thanos at normal levels of power. i'd say with all else being just about even apocalypse should win with his diversity experience and intelligence.

JuggernautFan
not to mention he can further augment himself (like thanos already did) using celestial technology. which is amongst the most advanced anywhere. more advanced than thanos can concieve of.

Magee
Yes, now let me state Thanos powers.
Thanos has durability reaching off the scale, he once fought the Magus to a standstill, and displayed no injuries after being knocked down. In a later battle, he withstood the combined assault of the Thing and Thor with no apparent injury. He also fought Galactus and easily withstood the battle, against someone who had shrugged off the combined assault of the Silver Surfer, Beta-Ray Bill, Terrax, Ganymede, Jack of Hearts, Morg, and Gladiator. Thanos needs no food,air or water and is immortal. His healing ability is so immense that he can pinpoint the source of pain, injury and heal it with in minutes. Before Thanos died and was brought back to life by death he contained class 100 strength this clearly places him in a class alongside such beings as Thor and the Hulk in the strength department. While it is not proven that Death increased his strength along with his resilience and other abilities, it is assumed that she did so. However, the level to which it was increased is unknown. One topic of frequent debate revolves around whether or not Thanos' base strength is greater than the base level of strength for the Hulk. An incident during the Infinity War leans towards the fact that under normal circumstances, Thanos is stronger than the Hulk. Fans of the giant, naturally, refuse this...ignoring the ability of one of the two key forces of this universe ( Namely Death ) to augment anyone to nearly any level she so chooses. Like other cosmic Eternals, Thanos is sustained by cosmic energy. No amount of pure physical exertion can tire him because his metabolism is sustained by this energy. Only sustained usage of cosmic energy can tire him appreciably. Thanos' reflexes and speed are above normal human levels. While not able to compete in this area at the level of speedier, more agile heroes like Spider-Man, Thanos is far faster than a being of his size ( 6'7" in height, 985 lbs of mass. ) should have a right to be. Thanos has also displayed Telepathic abilities but The level of Thanos' telepathic prowess is unknown. It is presumed to be at a low level. When he decided to make a move against the Goddess during the Infinity Crusade, he employed the aid of Professor Charles Xavier to utilize his telepathic abilities. It bears mentioning that Xavier is ranked as arguably the most powerful psionic on Earth, and likely ranks among the top Psionics in the known Universe. Despite the presumably low level at which he is able to gain telepathic egress into another's mind, Thanos is a formidable psionic combatant, having shown prowess sufficient enough to defeat both Drax and Moondragon in mental combat. While willpower isn't a quality that can be easily measured...Thanos' force of will is the equal of anyone's. It has been theorized that Thanos possesses the innate ability to teleport himself over unknown distances...however the final answer is an inconclusive one. It is true that most cosmic Eternals possess the ability to teleport themselves and others psionically. Most Eternals find the process an unpleasant one, and usually prefer not to use the ability unless absolutely necessary. During Thanos' gambit against the Magus, he seemingly used his own teleportational abilities to teleport himself and his allies. He even mentioned the difficulty involved in teleporting others, due to the intense concentration required to accomplish the feat. Thanos has displayed great versatility in the use of his energy projection powers. Not only is he able to project energy as a concussive force, but he's also able to use the energy to form force-shields, concussion waves, gamma radiation bursts, infrared heat-beams, and disruptor beams. His chief uses of the cosmic energy he draws upon are in the forms of disruptor beams from his eyes, and concussion blasts from his hands. The exact level of force Thanos can exert through his concussion beams is unknown. It has been speculated that the nature of Thanos' cosmic energy reserve may be quasi-mystical in nature. Certainly comments made by Odin during his battle with the Mad Titan would lend support to this theory, as he stated that Thanos tapped into a reserve of 'Dark' power. Considering Thanos' knowledge of things arcane, it is quite possible that his energies are partially mystic in nature. Thanos may not be as accomplished in this area as others, such as the Eternal named Sersi, but he definitely is able to manipulate matter on the atomic level. He displayed this ability in one of his initial appearances when he turned the Skrull, Skragg, into stone. Bionics, since Thanos is in a new body, it seems unlikely that any bionic devices were carried over following his rebirth. Any devices he carries within him at this time would have been added at some point after the Infinity Gauntlet affair. Considering that his might had been augmented over its former staggering levels by Death, it seems unlikely that he would have a need for further physical enhancement. Thanos has not been seen to utilize spell magics in any of his appearances that I can recall. That doesn't mean that he doesn't know how to use spells, as it has been stated that he used mystical techniques alongside technilogical ones to increase his might. It is unknown what fighting arts Thanos knows. His knowledge of combat styles seems to be quite broad, as he instructed his ward, Gamora, training her to become the most lethal female assassin in known space. It is stated that he learned most of his fighting skills while dwelling in some of the most dangerous areas of known space following his banishment from Titan. He spent more than 80 years in these perilous environs, honing his deadly abilities. Evidence suggests that Thanos is the equal of any herald of Galactus, and is likely just a notch below a Skyfather ( Such as Odin and Zeus ) in terms of sheer power.
Now ur telling me that Apacolypse could beat Thanos? I would have to seriously doubt that.

JuggernautFan
most anything you typed about thanos can be said about apocalypse. he can harness virtually any type of power that he desires. through the use of his technologies he can augment strength (which is unlimited anyway, it isn't just set at "100" ton's) reflex's stamina (which he doesnt tire) and any other attributes that he already has. it's not impossible for thanos to lose here. it's likely that slip ups could occur on either side. i'm just saying don't count apocalypse out. he has had 5000 years experience, he is a trained warrior. he has no remorce. and he has the abilities to do what needs to be done here. also vice versa is true. thanos has ran with the best of them. so it could sway either way.

Maelstrom
Goals in mind as well. Thanos is a godhood type with absolute power goals. Apocapalypse wants to create a race of mutants that have as varied and vast amounts as eachother. Thanos would face an endless # of all powerfull "Apocapalypses" vs one absolute power.

JuggernautFan
not sure what you are saying with that last post maelstrom. please clarify.

Wynndar
This would be an interesting battle...Jugfan and Magee have really good points...but I think Magee is right, if you look at the histories of who Apoc, and Thanos have considered worthy opponents, I think Odin is more impressive than cable and cyclops...I dont want to underestimate Apoc, he could be much more powerful than he seems, just never had a chance to show it off yet, he is a very mysterious villain...I think his conversation with Uatu (the watcher) during the Onslought battle shows there may be more going on than we think...Apoc is still learning, harnessing the knowledge of the celestials, eventually he could perhaps be right up there with Thanos...concerning Thanos' strength, it has been mentioned before, when they found that false corpse of his with the strength enhancers in the bone's, that Thanos' strength easily surpasses that of the Hulk's at normal conditions...I think his battle with earthly heroes like the Thing and Thor supports this...Although some say Apoc can achieve any powers he imagines, this is not true...he can enhance his own powers and imagine new one's that are analogous to the originals....but he hasnt shown he can spontaneously control the power cosmic, warp flight, or teleportation across vast distances or dimensions like Thanos...Thanos has enough power to destroy a moon, maybe even a planet...what could Apoc do against that?...If you examine their goals and their former battles, Apoc is not yet on the same level as Thanos.

JuggernautFan
ahhh, that makes perfect sense now that you explained it. not that magee's explanation wasn't good. i do think apoc could win though. it's not totally out of the question. but it does seem his goals, are just on a lesser level than thanos. also it seems that thanos has over the years accomplished more. i think that the writing they do on apoc is bad. he should easily be a match for all other mutants atleast.

Never
This is wrong, Apocalypse has not been characterized as such (omnipotent) in ages.

Theoretically - or at one point - Apocalypse should have been in the same range as Thanos, but he is not.

Wynndar
Honestly..i think Thanos would beat Apoc...but he is not interesting and i would rather se more stories about Apoc

Magee
Wynndar u should read the infinity war saga its fantastic but i wouldnt say much for infinity crusade or abyss. big grin

Evangel94
Thanos

Mider
at there normal power levels i think Apocaplyse would take Thanos i mean its not that i want to see that but he is one of the most powerful Mutants alive and his origins are totally unknown but it may be that he is even more powerful then he lets on i mean he has been seen talking with the watcher, the high evelotionary, and supposidly he even owns a ship built by the celestials. Thanos on the other hand has gaised into the infinity well, courted death, has commited galactic genocide, and even risin to the highest level of power. Apocaplyse can win power to power even against Thanos but i belive Thanos is smart enough to stop Apocaplyse using his fast knowledge.

Wynndar
Apoc doesnt even belong in the same sentence with someone who held his own against Odin and Tyrant...Apoc cant hold his own against Cable

MERCILOUS
Apoc is a lowly mutant compared to the Titan.

who?-kid
Theoretically, Apocalypse has a reasonable chance defeating Thanos. I know Thanos is many times more popular than Apocalypse, and lots of people will freak out, but I still believe Apocalypse has what it takes to defeat Thanos.

Thanos is not as invincible as some fans think he is.

It will be close, and Thanos is I think more cunning, but don't count Apocalypse out (Thanos of course will probably win, he has even more chance of defeating Apocalypse than vice versa, but still...).

jinzin
apocalypse has some cool powers, he's got the horesmen, could amass an army just as well, and he's got the intelligence, and the cunning,,,,,,,but what he doesn't have is any way to keep from being blinked out of existance by thanos. damn I liked apocalypse too.

srankmissingnin
Even if they are at the same strength Thanos wins. Unlike his animated counterpart the comic version of Apocalypse wasn't to competent.

MERCILOUS
Apocalypse is an ancient omnimorph. Thanos is a Titan. That is of the planet "Titan" which I beleive the weakest member of the race is pretty much as strong as Thor. And this isn't a thread about who can amass what army and who has the best lackeys it's a 1on1. Even if it where Thanos still wins.

who?-kid
No way.

MERCILOUS
No way? Are you being sarcastic?

who?-kid
Not really. The weakest member of Titan is no match for Thor. Not even an average member. The stronger members, sure, bring it on, but they still get their asses kicked.

wrathofachilles
Yeah, Thanos is the most powerful of the Titans, but his strength level is comparable to Thor, thus the weaker members are not. Apocalypse is a powerful mutant, but he's not cosmic level. Thanos takes this, but him beating 'the Sunny Delight' out of Galactus is crap. Not going to happen without the IG.

Beyonder
Thanos is a MUTANT among his people the Eternal Titans. You think human mutants are powerful before - but this is a Eternal Titan mutant you're talking about. Apocalypse better pray for mecy and hope his begging would amuse The Mad Titan.

Krissy Von Doom
Titan Eternals are weaker than Earth Eternals but Thanos is a unique case. You're not gonna compare Thanos to, say, Starfox.

K3VIL
Thanos is a member of alien Eternals of Titan, moon of Saturn.
He possess energy stores ability at great level, sufficient to go head to head with Galactus, and also he can enhance his strenght and durability with this energy, to go head to head with both Thor and The Thing, (but i think Thor is still above Thanos), also Thanos possess total immortality, he cannot dead, thanks to the Dead entity that decide that Thanos cannot die.Apocalypse?He can absord ambiental or external energy, on a livel above that of Thanos, in terms of physical strenght:
Apocalypse can surpass Hulk level if we talk about excess of class 100strenght, it means that Apo can reach class 200 at max, or near that, if Hulk goes sufficiently mad, bye bye Apo.Thanos, can enhance his strenght at levels to go head to head, with Thor, The Thing, and in a 1vs1 as been saw, with Silver Surfer, Apocalypse isn't on Thanos level.

Wynndar
Thanos is above Thor, after his first punch ko'd Thing, his second one ko'd Thor...well that and being able engage Odin and Tyrant

wrathofachilles
Classic Thor, but not Current Thor *even without Odinpower*

And there is no '200' level. Hulk is not 100 level, he is 100+ which includes all of the characters that are beyond measurement like Hulk, Thor, Hercules, Silver Surfer, etc. They are capable of lifting millions of tons.

Wynndar
I doubt there would be any difference...even modern Hulk was knocked around by Thanos in a partially astral manifestation...ur right about 200 level.

K3VIL
Wynndar when i say class 200, it means a great aughment of strenght by Apo, bu the Hulk can anyway surpass him, i know that all the Class 100 being you write can lift millions of tons, just saying that if Apo can reach a 10% of their strenght, the Hulk will anyway own him, cause the more he gets angry, the more he gets strong.

wrathofachilles
Yes but Thanos was stalemated by Odin, and current Thor is far more powerful, so that tells me Thor is superior to Thanos. He's superior to Galactus.

Phoenix Force
APOCALYPSE mainly because DC sux and Marvel Rocks...or better yet...prof. X would win...he can just shut down their minds

radioboy121
Both are in the Marvel Universe. I'm unsure of the effectiveness of Professor Xavier's telepathy against either combatant.

Wynndar
current Thor far more powerful than classic Odin?...please convince me...

wrathofachilles
Because Current Thor has as much power as Odin plus mastery over the Asgardian runes. Surtur killed Odin and he expressed fear of Thor in a recent issue. When I say 'far' more powerful, I just mean enough that it is noticeable.

Wynndar
hmm....i thought classic Odin had mastery of the runes too..he seemed basically omnicient...doesnt Odin have mastery of the runes by his mythological definition?...which he acquired shortly after creation, in Norse mythology.

Beyonder
Surtur with the Twilight Sword > Surtur w/o it

wrathofachilles
The mythological Odin had mastery over the runes, I don't know if Marvel Odin did or not, but I know it was understood that Current Thor is more powerful than Odin. Maybe it's due to the fact that he gained more wisdom than Odin ever did by putting out both his eyes instead of one, or the fact that he gained the Odinpower in addition to his own natural strength and Mjolnir.

spidermonkey
embarrasment oops, wrong thread. sorry guys.

spidermonkey
This thread: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/...ocalypse+thanos

and people think A-pac would win one-on-one. laughing

golem370
Tribunal just restored order and said I work for a Person even more powerful then the Infinity Gems I assume he meant one of the Brothers

kgkg
Originally posted by golem370
Tribunal just restored order and said I work for a Person even more powerful then the Infinity Gems I assume he meant one of the Brothers
The brothers have been retcon to be pawns of LT , and Spectre

babel10
For many of the people saying Thanos is too powerful based on his battles with Odin and Tyrant. However, just because Apocalypse battles with Cable and the Xmen it doesn't mean that he is less powerful. If you look through Age of Apocalypse, Cable's Future, and the Tweleve the Xmen diddn't beat Apocalypse based on power. They beat Apocalypse because Mr. Sinister setup ways to bring out Apocalypse during his hibernation.
As far as power goes Thanos may have the Power Cosmic, superstrength surpassing the Hulk, and Durability that can withstand beatings from Odin. That being said I find it hard to believe that Apocalypse wouldn't be able to manage these same feats. Since Apocalypse could become a giant possibly a thousand feet or so. In addition Apocalypse can tap an extradimesional source allowing him to increase his strength and degree of power he takes in. In addiion Apocalypse can alter his atomic structure. The way I see it is that Thanos would most likely get overwhelmed by Apocalypse, which result in him retreating.

ImmortalOne
Originally posted by kgkg
The brothers have been retcon to be pawns of LT , and Spectre

What ??

Dr.SpiderHulk
Apocalypse is older and stronger than the xmen at once....Thanos do seem tough but not so that tough....I say Apocalypse....but it is close.

the Darkone
Thanos is one of the most powerful begins in the universe, Thanos as an eternal his powers dwarfs Apocalypse literally. Thanos like all eternal can manipulate cosmic energies for numerous use increase strength, speed, durability, agility, mental, energy projection. Thanos is over 10,000 years old only eternal that are older than him is mentor 40,000, forgotten one 35,000, Interloper 35,000, Ikaris 20,000. He study black arts of the eternal increase his body output with bionic implants, tremendous meditation. Thanos powers are on lower skyfahter level like Zuras former leader of the eternal, Thanos is one of the most powerful eternal/titans he has fought more powerful beings that apocalypse has ever dreamed of and won or stalemate them silver surfer, adam warlock, thor, the thing, the maker (true beyonder), fallen One, Tyrant, The Runner, Grandmaster, The Champion of the Universe, Captain Marvel, in-betweener, the collector, x-man, the hulk, drax the destroyer, Odin most of these people will just b***h slap apocalypse like $2 ho and apocalypse is only a mutant not a god not even a low skyfather. Thanos is smarter, stronger and powerful then he is, adam warlock even stated that they have never seen Thanos true power he holds back, even Odin gave the titan respect that was able too tap into some dark cosmic power of some sort.


And where talking about apocalypse who can't even get pass the x-men, avengers, cable, magneto, eternal etc. Apocalypse was even scare of Onslaught, and you think he can f**k with a being who had destroyed half the marvel universe with a snap of finger(infinity gaunlet), and later blink the universe out of existence with the heart of the universe. Apocalypse has wet dreams about those feats, that he will neverhappen for him at all in his life.

Thanos will make apocalypse his lap dog. You know how darkseid be punking kalibak samething with apocalypse like a little b***h.


Thanos 10/10.

Lord S
Originally posted by babel10
For many of the people saying Thanos is too powerful based on his battles with Odin and Tyrant. However, just because Apocalypse battles with Cable and the Xmen it doesn't mean that he is less powerful. If you look through Age of Apocalypse, Cable's Future, and the Tweleve the Xmen diddn't beat Apocalypse based on power. They beat Apocalypse because Mr. Sinister setup ways to bring out Apocalypse during his hibernation. Well until that day comes that Apocalypse battles beings on par with Odin and Tyrant, he'll always be regarded as inferior to Thanos in every respect.

As far as power goes Thanos may have the Power Cosmic, superstrength surpassing the Hulk, and Durability that can withstand beatings from Odin.

Thanos does not have the 'Power Cosmic'...though he does wield tremendous cosmic power.

That being said I find it hard to believe that Apocalypse wouldn't be able to manage these same feats.

Well give us a real reason why...Apocalypse couldn't withstand an optic blast from Cyclops, a TK attack from Jean Grey, and more recently a whisper from Black Bolt. You really think he can go toe-to-toe with beings like Odin and Tyrant???

Since Apocalypse could become a giant possibly a thousand feet or so. In addition Apocalypse can tap an extradimesional source allowing him to increase his strength and degree of power he takes in. In addiion Apocalypse can alter his atomic structure.

Size means absolutely nothing...Sentinels are friggin huge, but get chopped down to size by the X-Men with regularity. As far as his 'extradimensional power' goes, until he's actually displayed this uncanny ability in a comic book, I won't believe it.

The way I see it is that Thanos would most likely get overwhelmed by Apocalypse, which result in him retreating.

Well then you'd have to be an ignorant X-fanboy on crack, and I hope you're not that.

the Darkone
Originally posted by Lord S
Well until that day comes that Apocalypse battles beings on par with Odin and Tyrant, he'll always be regarded as inferior to Thanos in every respect.

As far as power goes Thanos may have the Power Cosmic, superstrength surpassing the Hulk, and Durability that can withstand beatings from Odin.

Thanos does not have the 'Power Cosmic'...though he does wield tremendous cosmic power.

That being said I find it hard to believe that Apocalypse wouldn't be able to manage these same feats.

Well give us a real reason why...Apocalypse couldn't withstand an optic blast from Cyclops, a TK attack from Jean Grey, and more recently a whisper from Black Bolt. You really think he can go toe-to-toe with beings like Odin and Tyrant???

Since Apocalypse could become a giant possibly a thousand feet or so. In addition Apocalypse can tap an extradimesional source allowing him to increase his strength and degree of power he takes in. In addiion Apocalypse can alter his atomic structure.

Size means absolutely nothing...Sentinels are friggin huge, but get chopped down to size by the X-Men with regularity. As far as his 'extradimensional power' goes, until he's actually displayed this uncanny ability in a comic book, I won't believe it.

The way I see it is that Thanos would most likely get overwhelmed by Apocalypse, which result in him retreating.

Well then you'd have to be an ignorant X-fanboy on crack, and I hope you're not that.


He is on crack. Thanos has throw down with some of marvels big dogs and still standing. Apocalypse would get rape by tyrant and odin, please apcoalypse isn't even in the top 20 of the most powerful beings.

Mainstream
Originally posted by the Darkone
He is on crack. Thanos has throw down with some of marvels big dogs and still standing. Apocalypse would get rape by tyrant and odin, please apcoalypse isn't even in the top 20 of the most powerful beings.

I guy who takes over the world for 2000 years isn't in the top 20 most powerful beings....you must have been looking at a old out dated list....early 1940's I'd be guessing no...gambit12

"who needs guns when you can turn a card into a bomb"

ImmortalOne
Id prefer a charged-up bullet than a charged up card !!!!

Anyway, you guys read the Thanos respect thread !!

Mainstream
Originally posted by ImmortalOne
Id prefer a charged-up bullet than a charged up card !!!!

Anyway, you guys read the Thanos respect thread !!


but Cards are easiler to throw and don't make Gambit pockets lumpy...and I'll go to the thread. gambit12

K3VIL
Thanos has concrete facts.
Thanos always win or stalemate, anyway, he manage to survive.
Apocalypse durability, energy manip/emission and physical strenght never showed to be on Thanos level.
Tyrant's blast which atomized half of his fortress will destroy Apocalypse, Thanos took it and was still alive.Yes he wasn't able to K.O. Tyrant, but still was on his feet.
Apocalypse only REAL feet is Cable saing he will rule in the future.
Actually, he has got his ass beaten on major occasions.
If/When Thanos lose, he does it in a respectful way.

the Darkone
See that's Apocalpyse worring about taking over a world as where thanos has took over the universe a big difference. Thanos will mind rape Apocalpyse like lap dog.

babel10
Originally posted by Lord S
Well until that day comes that Apocalypse battles beings on par with Odin and Tyrant, he'll always be regarded as inferior to Thanos in every respect.

As far as power goes Thanos may have the Power Cosmic, superstrength surpassing the Hulk, and Durability that can withstand beatings from Odin.

Thanos does not have the 'Power Cosmic'...though he does wield tremendous cosmic power.

That being said I find it hard to believe that Apocalypse wouldn't be able to manage these same feats.

Well give us a real reason why...Apocalypse couldn't withstand an optic blast from Cyclops, a TK attack from Jean Grey, and more recently a whisper from Black Bolt. You really think he can go toe-to-toe with beings like Odin and Tyrant???

Since Apocalypse could become a giant possibly a thousand feet or so. In addition Apocalypse can tap an extradimesional source allowing him to increase his strength and degree of power he takes in. In addiion Apocalypse can alter his atomic structure.

Size means absolutely nothing...Sentinels are friggin huge, but get chopped down to size by the X-Men with regularity. As far as his 'extradimensional power' goes, until he's actually displayed this uncanny ability in a comic book, I won't believe it.

The way I see it is that Thanos would most likely get overwhelmed by Apocalypse, which result in him retreating.

Well then you'd have to be an ignorant X-fanboy on crack, and I hope you're not that.

As for Apocalypse battling beings on par with Odin and Tyrant I would say The High Evolutionary and PE Ikaris qualify. Since the High Evolutionary has beaten Thor, and held his own against Galactus. PE Ikaris is the most powerful Eternal from Earth who's power is on par with Thanos.

Well give us a real reason why...Apocalypse couldn't withstand an optic blast from Cyclops, a TK attack from Jean Grey, and more recently a whisper from Black Bolt. You really think he can go toe-to-toe with beings like Odin and Tyrant???

Well for an answer to Apocalypse not dealing with the Xmen, he defeated 6 in under sixty seconds. This was in X-cutioners Song part 5, when Apocalypse was severely weakened. In X-factor Annual 3 Apocalypse toys with High Evolutionary, not stalemated since The High Evolutionary couldn't land one blow. In addition Apocalypse battled Ikaris in New Eternals: Apocalypse Now #1. Apocalypse also easily overpowered the Hulk in Incredible Hulk #456 by choking him out. So I think these are a few reasons why Apocalypse could hang with Odin or Tyrant. But, since you insist on bringing up the Odin and Thanos battle need I remind you it was a completely one sided beating for Thanos. Odin completely humiliated Thanos in the battle they had. However, Thanos managed better against Tyrant. That Blackbolt whisper wouldn't happen to be from Black Panther tie-in #7 would it. Since they terribly wrote Apocalypse in this issue.

Size means absolutely nothing...Sentinels are friggin huge, but get chopped down to size by the X-Men with regularity. As far as his 'extradimensional power' goes, until he's actually displayed this uncanny ability in a comic book, I won't believe it.

You say size means nothing, yet the Sentinels took over the world in Days Future Past where the Sentinels slaughtered many X-men. As for Apocalypse's extradimensional power, this is the power that can immeasurably increase his strength beyond what it already is. In addition Tap into more power if necessary. However, since Apocalypse is already more powerful than most of his enemies he has no need to tap into the extradimensional power.

Well then you'd have to be an ignorant X-fanboy on crack, and I hope you're not that.

Actually I'm a more of an Avengers and Thor fan than a X-men fan. It's just that I couldn't see Apocalypse loosing to Thanos. Now Darkseid I could understand him beating Apocalypse because of the Omega Effect.

the Darkone
Thanos is cursed by death, so when he came back from the dead he became more powerful than before. Thanos has cosmic/plasma energy projection, he can manuiplate any forms of energy where Apocalpyse can't, he can teleport vast distances, vast psionic powers, and other abilities he had battle Skyfathers Odin , Tyrant and cosmic dietys, who the f**k has Apocalpyse has fought worth talking about.

the Darkone
Thanos has fought beings that will crush Apocalpyse to dust. Thanos has fought Odin to a stand still, In-betweener for the mind gem and won, Champion of The Universe for the power gem and won, Galactus, The Maker (true beyonder), The Runner for the space gem, Tyrant, Adam Warlock, Silver Surfer, Grandmaster, The Runner, The Magus the list goes on you have to have some serious power to f**k with these guys and live, Apocalpyse would get rape from jump.

Who has Apocalpyse has fought worth even talking about, nobody can't get pass the X-men and you want to compare Apocalpyse to Thanos, you should get your comics and sale them.

leonheartmm
when the heck has apoc ever defeated high evolutionary?! thas crazy.

long pig
When did Thanos actually fight the In Betweener? I thought he found him in the nexus where IB had no power.

I don't think Thanos could handle IB in the slightest. He's on another level.

Maestro
Thanos didn't beat IB, he just tricked him into giving him the gem he had.

Lord S
Originally posted by babel10
As for Apocalypse battling beings on par with Odin and Tyrant I would say The High Evolutionary and PE Ikaris qualify. Since the High Evolutionary has beaten Thor, and held his own against Galactus. Ikaris and the High Evolutionary together are not a match for someone like Tyrant...let alone Odin. HE holding his own against Thor does not qualify him to be on par with a Skyfather. Gladiator held his own against Thor as well...beat the crap out of him, does that mean he can suddenly challenge Odin, too?

PE Ikaris is the most powerful Eternal from Earth who's power is on par with Thanos.

Uh, not even close. What has he done to convince you that he's equal to Thanos? Thanos is vastly powerful Titan Eternal who easily dwarfs all of his fellow Eternals.

Well for an answer to Apocalypse not dealing with the Xmen, he defeated 6 in under sixty seconds. This was in X-cutioners Song part 5, when Apocalypse was severely weakened.

An achievement, to be sure. While Thanos has taken on both Thor and Thing at the same time, and put them both down. He regularly bitchslaps the Silver Surfer, and has slapped both Hulk and Drax, calling them 'dull-witted brutes'.

In X-factor Annual 3 Apocalypse toys with High Evolutionary, not stalemated since The High Evolutionary couldn't land one blow.

Why are you making it sound so one-sided? They were both sort of sparring. Nothing more. It's not like it was total Apoc domination. Give me a break.

In addition Apocalypse battled Ikaris in New Eternals: Apocalypse Now #1. Apocalypse also easily overpowered the Hulk in Incredible Hulk #456 by choking him out.

You think Thanos can't handle Ikaris? As mentioned, he bitchslaps the Silver Surfer like it's nothing...the Surfer is way more powerful than Ikaris, and would humiliate Apocalypse with ease. Apoc hardly 'choked the Hulk out'...he was restraining him, yes, but as mentioned above, Thanos easily slapped Hulk and Drax at the same time at the end of 'Infinity Gauntlet'.

So I think these are a few reasons why Apocalypse could hang with Odin or Tyrant.

Yet he gets completely owned by Cyclops...so I guess Cyclops can hang with Odin and Tyrant as well, right? Not to mention Jean Grey, who was able to crack Apoc's mask open, exposing his human face.

But, since you insist on bringing up the Odin and Thanos battle need I remind you it was a completely one sided beating for Thanos. Odin completely humiliated Thanos in the battle they had. However, Thanos managed better against Tyrant.

And the point being made is that if you put Apocalypse in Thanos' place...he doesn't last very long.

That Blackbolt whisper wouldn't happen to be from Black Panther tie-in #7 would it. Since they terribly wrote Apocalypse in this issue.

Why is it whenever Apocalypse loses it's considered 'bad writing'? Maybe that's the way he is MEANT to be written. As a crappy villain, which is what he is. In 5000 (or 2000, not sure) years he's accomplished next to squat. His name doesn't deserve to be in the same sentence with someone as accomplished as Thanos.

You say size means nothing, yet the Sentinels took over the world in Days Future Past where the Sentinels slaughtered many X-men.

So what? Sentinels still almost always gets put down by X-Men with relative ease.

As for Apocalypse's extradimensional power, this is the power that can immeasurably increase his strength beyond what it already is. In addition Tap into more power if necessary.

I know you read this out of a bio...but until it's displayed in an actual comic book, it's nothing more than hyperbolas speculation. Just like his 'incalculable strength' and famous ability to 'grant himself any power he chooses'. It's all a crock of shit, IMO.

However, since Apocalypse is already more powerful than most of his enemies he has no need to tap into the extradimensional power.

If he's so damn powerful, why does he get pwn3d all the time? Because of Mr. Sinister's scheming? Still, if he was so powerful wouldn't he be able to overcome anything?

Here's the part where you tell me that he's a bad guy, and bad guys lose...well Thanos is a bad guy too, and he loses also, but at least he manages to pull off impressive feats before losing, and that's the only way you can judge who the stronger villain is, and Thanos is easily way ahead of Apocalypse, and outclasses him in every respect.

It's just that I couldn't see Apocalypse loosing to Thanos. Now Darkseid I could understand him beating Apocalypse because of the Omega Effect.

Wait, so you can see Apocalypse losing to Darkseid but not Thanos? There's no logic there, cause Thanos is widely regarded as being on par, or a little more powerful than Darkseid.

Anyway, in the end it all boils down to one thing: Apocalypse is sorely outclassed against Thanos.

End of story.

Lord S
Here's what would happen if these two ever met...

babel10
Originally posted by Lord S
Ikaris and the High Evolutionary together are not a match for someone like Tyrant...let alone Odin. HE holding his own against Thor does not qualify him to be on par with a Skyfather. Gladiator held his own against Thor as well...beat the crap out of him, does that mean he can suddenly challenge Odin, too?

PE Ikaris is the most powerful Eternal from Earth who's power is on par with Thanos.

Uh, not even close. What has he done to convince you that he's equal to Thanos? Thanos is vastly powerful Titan Eternal who easily dwarfs all of his fellow Eternals.

Well for an answer to Apocalypse not dealing with the Xmen, he defeated 6 in under sixty seconds. This was in X-cutioners Song part 5, when Apocalypse was severely weakened.

An achievement, to be sure. While Thanos has taken on both Thor and Thing at the same time, and put them both down. He regularly bitchslaps the Silver Surfer, and has slapped both Hulk and Drax, calling them 'dull-witted brutes'.

In X-factor Annual 3 Apocalypse toys with High Evolutionary, not stalemated since The High Evolutionary couldn't land one blow.

Why are you making it sound so one-sided? They were both sort of sparring. Nothing more. It's not like it was total Apoc domination. Give me a break.

In addition Apocalypse battled Ikaris in New Eternals: Apocalypse Now #1. Apocalypse also easily overpowered the Hulk in Incredible Hulk #456 by choking him out.

You think Thanos can't handle Ikaris? As mentioned, he bitchslaps the Silver Surfer like it's nothing...the Surfer is way more powerful than Ikaris, and would humiliate Apocalypse with ease. Apoc hardly 'choked the Hulk out'...he was restraining him, yes, but as mentioned above, Thanos easily slapped Hulk and Drax at the same time at the end of 'Infinity Gauntlet'.

So I think these are a few reasons why Apocalypse could hang with Odin or Tyrant.

Yet he gets completely owned by Cyclops...so I guess Cyclops can hang with Odin and Tyrant as well, right? Not to mention Jean Grey, who was able to crack Apoc's mask open, exposing his human face.

But, since you insist on bringing up the Odin and Thanos battle need I remind you it was a completely one sided beating for Thanos. Odin completely humiliated Thanos in the battle they had. However, Thanos managed better against Tyrant.

And the point being made is that if you put Apocalypse in Thanos' place...he doesn't last very long.

That Blackbolt whisper wouldn't happen to be from Black Panther tie-in #7 would it. Since they terribly wrote Apocalypse in this issue.

Why is it whenever Apocalypse loses it's considered 'bad writing'? Maybe that's the way he is MEANT to be written. As a crappy villain, which is what he is. In 5000 (or 2000, not sure) years he's accomplished next to squat. His name doesn't deserve to be in the same sentence with someone as accomplished as Thanos.

You say size means nothing, yet the Sentinels took over the world in Days Future Past where the Sentinels slaughtered many X-men.

So what? Sentinels still almost always gets put down by X-Men with relative ease.

As for Apocalypse's extradimensional power, this is the power that can immeasurably increase his strength beyond what it already is. In addition Tap into more power if necessary.

I know you read this out of a bio...but until it's displayed in an actual comic book, it's nothing more than hyperbolas speculation. Just like his 'incalculable strength' and famous ability to 'grant himself any power he chooses'. It's all a crock of shit, IMO.

However, since Apocalypse is already more powerful than most of his enemies he has no need to tap into the extradimensional power.

If he's so damn powerful, why does he get pwn3d all the time? Because of Mr. Sinister's scheming? Still, if he was so powerful wouldn't he be able to overcome anything?

Here's the part where you tell me that he's a bad guy, and bad guys lose...well Thanos is a bad guy too, and he loses also, but at least he manages to pull off impressive feats before losing, and that's the only way you can judge who the stronger villain is, and Thanos is easily way ahead of Apocalypse, and outclasses him in every respect.

It's just that I couldn't see Apocalypse loosing to Thanos. Now Darkseid I could understand him beating Apocalypse because of the Omega Effect.

Wait, so you can see Apocalypse losing to Darkseid but not Thanos? There's no logic there, cause Thanos is widely regarded as being on par, or a little more powerful than Darkseid.

Anyway, in the end it all boils down to one thing: Apocalypse is sorely outclassed against Thanos.

End of story.

Ikaris and the High Evolutionary together are not a match for someone like Tyrant...let alone Odin. HE holding his own against Thor does not qualify him to be on par with a Skyfather. Gladiator held his own against Thor as well...beat the crap out of him, does that mean he can suddenly challenge Odin, too?

Ikaris is the Prime Eternal so that puts him near Zuras in terms of power which rivals Thanos. As for the High Evolutionary, what makes you say he couldn't hold his own with Odin if he did with Galactus.

Uh, not even close. What has he done to convince you that he's equal to Thanos? Thanos is vastly powerful Titan Eternal who easily dwarfs all of his fellow Eternals.

PE Ikaris is at least equal to Zuras, who was able to battle Zeus. Zeus is an equal of Odin in terms of power. Thus PE Ikaris could hold his own against Thanos.

An achievement, to be sure. While Thanos has taken on both Thor and Thing at the same time, and put them both down. He regularly bitchslaps the Silver Surfer, and has slapped both Hulk and Drax, calling them 'dull-witted brutes'.

Well I agree Thanos putting down Thing and Thor at the same time is impressive. However, what I'm having trouble understanding is that you assume Apocalypse can't do the same. Since Thing gets easily overpowered by beings arounds the Hulks strength. As for Thor, he is powerful, but could also be taken out by people like Gladiator, and probably War Hulk. Since Apocalypse Stronger than Hulk and highly versatile he could also manage beating Thor and Thing at the same time. The Silver Surfer is powerful and possesses the power cosmic, however, Thor has managed to give the Surfer trouble.

Why are you making it sound so one-sided? They were both sort of sparring. Nothing more. It's not like it was total Apoc domination. Give me a break.

It was one-sided. Apocalypse teleported to the High Evolutionary and proceeded to lecture him on evolution while still staying several steps ahead in the fight.

You think Thanos can't handle Ikaris? As mentioned, he bitchslaps the Silver Surfer like it's nothing...the Surfer is way more powerful than Ikaris, and would humiliate Apocalypse with ease. Apoc hardly 'choked the Hulk out'...he was restraining him, yes, but as mentioned above, Thanos easily slapped Hulk and Drax at the same time at the end of 'Infinity Gauntlet'.

I didn't say Thanos couldn't beat PE Ikaris, Thanos probaly could, but he couldn't easily dominate him. The Silver Surfer is powerful, but I doubt he could humiliate Apocalypse. Since Apocalypse is so versatile he could adapt to the way the Surfer fights.

the point being made is that if you put Apocalypse in Thanos' place...he doesn't last very long.

I'm not so sure since Apocalypse when he is healthy is as versatile as you can get. Odin probably would have a hard time hitting Apocalypse since he can easily shift his body to maneuver around any attack.

Why is it whenever Apocalypse loses it's considered 'bad writing'? Maybe that's the way he is MEANT to be written. As a crappy villain, which is what he is. In 5000 (or 2000, not sure) years he's accomplished next to squat. His name doesn't deserve to be in the same sentence with someone as accomplished as Thanos.

In 5,000 years Apocalypse has accomplished a lot such as periodically through history altering beings in order to become future henchmen. Apocalypse is responsible for Mr. Sinister, Exodus, Ozymandias, and Archangel each from a different part of human history. Apocalypse also takes over the world for over a thousand years in the future.

babel10
I know you read this out of a bio...but until it's displayed in an actual comic book, it's nothing more than hyperbolas speculation. Just like his 'incalculable strength' and famous ability to 'grant himself any power he chooses'. It's all a crock of shit, IMO.

As for Apocalypse having incalculable strength , his strength is definitely incalculable. However, Thanos, Morg, Angry Hulk, Gladiator, Hercules to name a few all have incalculable strength. But, since Apocalypse can change his size, density, and composition Apocalypse could raise his strength to an even higher degree than the ones mentioned.

If he's so damn powerful, why does he get pwn3d all the time? Because of Mr. Sinister's scheming? Still, if he was so powerful wouldn't he be able to overcome anything?

Apocalypse does overcome virtually any and everything put in his way. Such as Cable, who was made by Sinister to rid the world of Apocalypse. Cable only managed this when Apocalypse didn't have a body in the 12 storyline. In addition, Ozymandias, and Mr. Sinister were also providing information for when Apocalypse was vulnerable.

Here's the part where you tell me that he's a bad guy, and bad guys lose...well Thanos is a bad guy too, and he loses also, but at least he manages to pull off impressive feats before losing, and that's the only way you can judge who the stronger villain is, and Thanos is easily way ahead of Apocalypse, and outclasses him in every respect.

I'm not convinced since Thanos under his own power is impressive. But, what you might be referring to is when he had the Infinity Gauntlet, the Heart of the Universe, etc. Which doesn't qualify as saying he's the stronger villain.

Wait, so you can see Apocalypse losing to Darkseid but not Thanos? There's no logic there, cause Thanos is widely regarded as being on par, or a little more powerful than Darkseid.

I said I could see Apocalypse loosing to Darkseid's omega effect, which wipes people out of existence. But, if Darkseid doesn't use it than Apocalypse would dominate him. But, not only Apocalypse would fall to the omega effect. Thanos, Odin, The heralds of Galactus, The High Evolutionary, and Adam Warlock would also all be wiped from existence from the omega effect.

Smaxxer
Originally posted by Lord S
An achievement, to be sure. While Thanos has taken on both Thor and Thing at the same time, and put them both down. He regularly bitchslaps the Silver Surfer, and has slapped both Hulk and Drax, calling them 'dull-witted brutes'.

I agree with most of your post (not everything), but Thanos is afraid of Hulk (his own words).

Apocalypse isn't.

the Darkone
Thanos is one of the most powerful eternals, Thanos can do what other eternal's can do but better. Thanos is like batman he thinks 10 steps ahead of his opponents and before they least expects open a can of whoop a$$. Thanos has cosmic and plasma energy blast and can fuse the two power source into a power blast like he did against Galactus, and he held his own against a Cosmic God he would blink Apocalypse out of existences.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Smaxxer
I agree with most of your post (not everything), but Thanos is afraid of Hulk (his own words).

Apocalypse isn't.

Well that conclusively ends all debate doesnt it? confused wink

Magic_attack
...

Beyonder
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Well that conclusively ends all debate doesnt it? confused wink

Yes. Sort of like how Godlike Cable could keep up with Surfer and matter manipulate during the fight - yet says he's no match for Apocalypse. wink

I guess Apocalypse would stalemate or beat Surfer then. evil face

Smaxxer
Originally posted by Beyonder
I guess Apocalypse would stalemate or beat Surfer then. evil face
Maybe. Who knows.

ImmortalOne
Com on guys......... Thanos will win !!!

Lets say Apoc used full powers, grew into a 600ft giant, charging his fists till it glows, grins his teeth, ....... So what, show me Apoc's full power blast !!!

It cant take out a mega-fortress !!! It cant empower someone with the power of a thunder god !!! All it does is just flatten Jean Gray's boobs !!!

And Thanos, ..... dude he made Galactus had a stomach ache !!! Took a blast from Tyrant, Odin, Thor, Thing, ............. and lived to tell about it !!!

Lord S
Ok, here we go again...

Originally posted by babel10
Ikaris is the Prime Eternal so that puts him near Zuras in terms of power which rivals Thanos. Prime Eternal only in name...he hasn't shown me anything that would indicate that he is quite at the level of Zuras. For crying out loud he got stabbed in the chest by Apocalypse...how pathetic is that?

As for the High Evolutionary, what makes you say he couldn't hold his own with Odin if he did with Galactus.

Because he DIDN'T hold his own with Galactus. Did you even read that issue...or are you just copying what you've read on here from others? FF 175...they started out with a casual conversation, which intensified to threats, then a few blasts were exchanged, but missed, then Galactus nailed him SQUARE with an eye blast...immobilizing him and sending him into the Negative Zone.

No 'holding his own' for the Evo...I call it a clear-cut victory for Galactus.

PE Ikaris is at least equal to Zuras, who was able to battle Zeus. Zeus is an equal of Odin in terms of power. Thus PE Ikaris could hold his own against Thanos.

And you base that grand assessment on what? On the title of 'Prime Eternal'?

Well I agree Thanos putting down Thing and Thor at the same time is impressive. However, what I'm having trouble understanding is that you assume Apocalypse can't do the same.

Don't assume that I assume anything...I was merely responding to your boasting about Apocalypse being able to get past the X-Men B-team...one against six. Do you really think Thanos would have any trouble against them??

Since Apocalypse Stronger than Hulk and highly versatile he could also manage beating Thor and Thing at the same time.

When has it ever been proven that Apocalypse is stronger than the Hulk? Perhaps you refer to when he recruited Hulk to become War. Apoc was immobilizing Hulk, (who was having power fluctuations and shrapnels inside his brain), for a few seconds, while trying to tell him he just wanted to talk. Then Hulk stopped, and Apoc talked him into becoming a horseman.

Hardly a display of brute strength on the part of Apoc.

It was one-sided. Apocalypse teleported to the High Evolutionary and proceeded to lecture him on evolution while still staying several steps ahead in the fight.

Again, that was not a fight...more like a philosophical conversation, with a little sparring. The Evo even considered forcing Apoc back to continue, after he teleported away, but considered it to be a waste of time.

I didn't say Thanos couldn't beat PE Ikaris, Thanos probaly could, but he couldn't easily dominate him.

Why not?

The Silver Surfer is powerful, but I doubt he could humiliate Apocalypse. Since Apocalypse is so versatile he could adapt to the way the Surfer fights.

Yet he can't adapt to the way Cyclops fights...you really think he stands any chance against the Silver Surfer?!? What the hell are you smoking?

I'm not so sure since Apocalypse when he is healthy is as versatile as you can get. Odin probably would have a hard time hitting Apocalypse since he can easily shift his body to maneuver around any attack.

Laughable statement, to say the least. Considering Cyclops was able to optic blast him into submission, Odin should have absolutely no trouble. Apocalypse had trouble fighting Loki, and was only able to contain him with the help of Caliban. You really think he's on par with Odin?

In 5,000 years Apocalypse has accomplished a lot such as periodically through history altering beings in order to become future henchmen. Apocalypse is responsible for Mr. Sinister, Exodus, Ozymandias, and Archangel each from a different part of human history. Apocalypse also takes over the world for over a thousand years in the future.

So he's a mad scientist...big deal. Who isn't? He isn't even half as accomplished as Dr. Doom...who has even toyed with Ultron...making him his thrall...a guy that could probably give old blue lips a run for his money.

As for Apocalypse having incalculable strength , his strength is definitely incalculable. However, Thanos, Morg, Angry Hulk, Gladiator, Hercules to name a few all have incalculable strength. But, since Apocalypse can change his size, density, and composition Apocalypse could raise his strength to an even higher degree than the ones mentioned.

Sheer speculation on your part.

Apocalypse does overcome virtually any and everything put in his way.

Except a well placed optic blast.

I'm not convinced since Thanos under his own power is impressive.

Then you obviously haven't read much Thanos over the years. Drop that silly X-book and read something more interesting. Read 'Thanos Quest'...which many people regard as his shining moment...where went on his mission to collect the Infinity Gems. Going toe-to-toe with Tyrant and Odin were also under his own power. It must really get under the skin of X-fanboys that Apocalypse has not been given the same attention and respect.

But, what you might be referring to is when he had the Infinity Gauntlet, the Heart of the Universe, etc. Which doesn't qualify as saying he's the stronger villain.

I made no mention of Infinity Gauntlet, or HoTU. Nice try.

I said I could see Apocalypse loosing to Darkseid's omega effect, which wipes people out of existence. But, if Darkseid doesn't use it than Apocalypse would dominate him.

O-k...whatever you say. rolleyes1

Once again you've proven that you don't know jack about the subject at hand.

Thanks for playing...call me when you're ready for another round.

Originally posted by Smaxxer
I agree with most of your post (not everything), but Thanos is afraid of Hulk (his own words).

Apocalypse isn't. Then how come he had no qualms about slapping him (and Drax) at the same time? What you conveniently neglect to mention is that he said infamous line during 'Thanos Quest'...before the 'Infinity Gauntlet'. Ask him today and I highly doubt he's afraid of anybody. Good try, come again.

Maybe. Who knows.

Dude, you're a tool.

leonheartmm
i dont understand if apocalypse is everythin people SAY he is than why doiesnt he change himself into the ultimate nullifier or sumthin and destroy the abstracts, i mean its JUST A GADGET

Mainstream
Originally posted by leonheartmm
i dont understand if apocalypse is everythin people SAY he is than why doiesnt he change himself into the ultimate nullifier or sumthin and destroy the abstracts, i mean its JUST A GADGET


in due time my dear child ....in due time bur2

leonheartmm
i dont understand if apocalypse is everythin people SAY he is than why doiesnt he change himself into the ultimate nullifier or sumthin and destroy the abstracts, i mean its JUST A GADGET and apoc SHOULD be able to copy it right down to the molecule, why is THE GREAT APOCALYPSE FORCED TO TURN HIS HANDS INTO GIANT DRILL WHEN HE CAN JUST TURN HIS ENTIRE FREAKIN BODY INTO A PHOTON GUN?! give it up people apoc is never gonna beat thanos!

Mainstream
Originally posted by leonheartmm
i dont understand if apocalypse is everythin people SAY he is than why doiesnt he change himself into the ultimate nullifier or sumthin and destroy the abstracts, i mean its JUST A GADGET and apoc SHOULD be able to copy it right down to the molecule, why is THE GREAT APOCALYPSE FORCED TO TURN HIS HANDS INTO GIANT DRILL WHEN HE CAN JUST TURN HIS ENTIRE FREAKIN BODY INTO A PHOTON GUN?! give it up people apoc is never gonna beat thanos!

in due time bur2

babel10
Originally posted by Lord S
Ok, here we go again...

Prime Eternal only in name...he hasn't shown me anything that would indicate that he is quite at the level of Zuras. For crying out loud he got stabbed in the chest by Apocalypse...how pathetic is that?

As for the High Evolutionary, what makes you say he couldn't hold his own with Odin if he did with Galactus.

Because he DIDN'T hold his own with Galactus. Did you even read that issue...or are you just copying what you've read on here from others? FF 175...they started out with a casual conversation, which intensified to threats, then a few blasts were exchanged, but missed, then Galactus nailed him SQUARE with an eye blast...immobilizing him and sending him into the Negative Zone.

No 'holding his own' for the Evo...I call it a clear-cut victory for Galactus.

PE Ikaris is at least equal to Zuras, who was able to battle Zeus. Zeus is an equal of Odin in terms of power. Thus PE Ikaris could hold his own against Thanos.

And you base that grand assessment on what? On the title of 'Prime Eternal'?

Well I agree Thanos putting down Thing and Thor at the same time is impressive. However, what I'm having trouble understanding is that you assume Apocalypse can't do the same.

Don't assume that I assume anything...I was merely responding to your boasting about Apocalypse being able to get past the X-Men B-team...one against six. Do you really think Thanos would have any trouble against them??

Since Apocalypse Stronger than Hulk and highly versatile he could also manage beating Thor and Thing at the same time.

When has it ever been proven that Apocalypse is stronger than the Hulk? Perhaps you refer to when he recruited Hulk to become War. Apoc was immobilizing Hulk, (who was having power fluctuations and shrapnels inside his brain), for a few seconds, while trying to tell him he just wanted to talk. Then Hulk stopped, and Apoc talked him into becoming a horseman.

Hardly a display of brute strength on the part of Apoc.

It was one-sided. Apocalypse teleported to the High Evolutionary and proceeded to lecture him on evolution while still staying several steps ahead in the fight.

Again, that was not a fight...more like a philosophical conversation, with a little sparring. The Evo even considered forcing Apoc back to continue, after he teleported away, but considered it to be a waste of time.

I didn't say Thanos couldn't beat PE Ikaris, Thanos probaly could, but he couldn't easily dominate him.

Why not?

The Silver Surfer is powerful, but I doubt he could humiliate Apocalypse. Since Apocalypse is so versatile he could adapt to the way the Surfer fights.

Yet he can't adapt to the way Cyclops fights...you really think he stands any chance against the Silver Surfer?!? What the hell are you smoking?

I'm not so sure since Apocalypse when he is healthy is as versatile as you can get. Odin probably would have a hard time hitting Apocalypse since he can easily shift his body to maneuver around any attack.

Laughable statement, to say the least. Considering Cyclops was able to optic blast him into submission, Odin should have absolutely no trouble. Apocalypse had trouble fighting Loki, and was only able to contain him with the help of Caliban. You really think he's on par with Odin?

In 5,000 years Apocalypse has accomplished a lot such as periodically through history altering beings in order to become future henchmen. Apocalypse is responsible for Mr. Sinister, Exodus, Ozymandias, and Archangel each from a different part of human history. Apocalypse also takes over the world for over a thousand years in the future.

So he's a mad scientist...big deal. Who isn't? He isn't even half as accomplished as Dr. Doom...who has even toyed with Ultron...making him his thrall...a guy that could probably give old blue lips a run for his money.

As for Apocalypse having incalculable strength , his strength is definitely incalculable. However, Thanos, Morg, Angry Hulk, Gladiator, Hercules to name a few all have incalculable strength. But, since Apocalypse can change his size, density, and composition Apocalypse could raise his strength to an even higher degree than the ones mentioned.

Sheer speculation on your part.

Apocalypse does overcome virtually any and everything put in his way.

Except a well placed optic blast.

I'm not convinced since Thanos under his own power is impressive

Then you obviously haven't read much Thanos over the years. Drop that silly X-book and read something more interesting. Read 'Thanos Quest'...which many people regard as his shining moment...where went on his mission to collect the Infinity Gems. Going toe-to-toe with Tyrant and Odin were also under his own power. It must really get under the skin of X-fanboys that Apocalypse has not been given the same attention and respect.

But, what you might be referring to is when he had the Infinity Gauntlet, the Heart of the Universe, etc. Which doesn't qualify as saying he's the stronger villain.

I made no mention of Infinity Gauntlet, or HoTU. Nice try.

I said I could see Apocalypse loosing to Darkseid's omega effect, which wipes people out of existence. But, if Darkseid doesn't use it than Apocalypse would dominate him.

O-k...whatever you say. rolleyes1

Once again you've proven that you don't know jack about the subject at hand.

Thanks for playing...call me when you're ready for another round.

Then how come he had no qualms about slapping him (and Drax) at the same time? What you conveniently neglect to mention is that he said infamous line during 'Thanos Quest'...before the 'Infinity Gauntlet'. Ask him today and I highly doubt he's afraid of anybody. Good try, come again.

Maybe. Who knows.

Dude, you're a tool.

Prime Eternal only in name...he hasn't shown me anything that would indicate that he is quite at the level of Zuras. For crying out loud he got stabbed in the chest by Apocalypse...how pathetic is that?

I wouldn't say pathetic since Apocalypse did once get the better of the High Evolutionary. If Apocalypse can get the better of The Evolutionary then he could also manage the same with Ikaris.

Because he DIDN'T hold his own with Galactus. Did you even read that issue...or are you just copying what you've read on here from others? FF 175...they started out with a casual conversation, which intensified to threats, then a few blasts were exchanged, but missed, then Galactus nailed him SQUARE with an eye blast...immobilizing him and sending him into the Negative Zone.

No 'holding his own' for the Evo...I call it a clear-cut victory for Galactus.

Yes, I did read the issue. Continuing the High Evolutionary returned from the Negative Zone. Then the High Evolutionary Evolved Galactus beyond needing a body. Which kept Galactus from dying in that issue also. I never said the Evolutionary is equal to Galactus, but Galactus only sent the High Evolutionary to the Negative Zone. Sending the High Evolutionary to the Negative Zone doesn't mean a clear-cut victory.

Don't assume that I assume anything...I was merely responding to your boasting about Apocalypse being able to get past the X-Men B-team...one against six. Do you really think Thanos would have any trouble against them??

Apparently you do assume too much since you assume I'm ignorant of Thanos and his showings. Thanos could get past six X-men, however what made my statement about Apocalypse going through six X-men a feat was that Apocalypse was in severely weakened state.

babel10
When has it ever been proven that Apocalypse is stronger than the Hulk? Perhaps you refer to when he recruited Hulk to become War. Apoc was immobilizing Hulk, (who was having power fluctuations and shrapnels inside his brain), for a few seconds, while trying to tell him he just wanted to talk. Then Hulk stopped, and Apoc talked him into becoming a horseman.

Hardly a display of brute strength on the part of Apoc.

Yes, it was in Hulk #456 where the Hulk was easily manhandled by Apocalypse. I suggest you reread the issue, because the Hulk was being overwhelmed until Hulk asked Apocalypse to let him go. Apocalypse let him go, but told Hulk that he was now in the service of Apocalypse. So either through force or not Hulk was becoming Apocalypse's horseman.

Why not?

Thanos under his own power is the most powerful Eternal considering Zuras is dead. However, since Ikaris is now Prime Eternal his normal abilities have been increased. The level of Ikaris's control of cosmic energy has increased, and he could also increase his strength with his new levels. In addition Ikaris has the advantage in agility, and is a very well developed hand to hand fighter. So I think Ikaris could hold his own against Thanos.

So he's a mad scientist...big deal. Who isn't? He isn't even half as accomplished as Dr. Doom...who has even toyed with Ultron...making him his thrall...a guy that could probably give old blue lips a run for his money.

Apocalypse is far more accomplished than Dr. Doom as a mad scientist. Since Apocalypse doesn't just toy with his creations but personalizes them. Literally, like how he gave Archangel blue skin and metal wings. However, when it comes to mad scientist Mr. Sinister embodies the concept of mad scientist.

Ultron could give Apocalypse a run for his money?
Explain!

Yet he can't adapt to the way Cyclops fights...you really think he stands any chance against the Silver Surfer?!? What the hell are you smoking?
All you keep referring to is low showings of Apocalypse. In X-factor#68 Apocalypse was blasted with the combined power of Jean Grey, Cable, and Cyclops. Why else would his optic blast be so powerful. However, that being said Apocalypse was in a weakened state since he was stationary and could only fire blast at the Inhumans and X-factor. But, under normal conditions Apocalypse could handle cyclops easily as he did in the early issues of X-factor.

Laughable statement, to say the least. Considering Cyclops was able to optic blast him into submission, Odin should have absolutely no trouble. Apocalypse had trouble fighting Loki, and was only able to contain him with the help of Caliban. You really think he's on par with Odin?
Again! you have to resort to using Cyclops's optic blast, which wasn't only his power but a combined effort of Jean Grey, Cable, and Cyclops.
In addition Apocalypse was weakened, not at normal levels in which he could utilize his many abilities. The battle in X-factor#50 in which Apocalypse saw through Loki's disguise.

Loki may not be as powerful Odin and Thor. However, Loki is highly intelligent and sneaky, since he managed to manipulate the Surfer in Surfer#4. Loki's deceptiveness could make him a threat to lots of people. So despite Loki not having as much raw power as Thor and Odin, he manages through his trickery.

Sheer speculation on your part.

How is it sheer speculation since all the people mentioned have Incalculable strength one way or another. However, each have to use some kind of power as a means to reach the higher levels of strength. However, since Apocalypse has complete control of his atomic structure he could shift his strength to high levels as well as adjusting his body to compliment the strength increase. Which none of the others listed could do, thus they would reach their limit in strength before the Apocalypse.

Example Apocalypse easily overpowering a struggling Hulk in Hulk#456

Except a well placed optic blast.
Yet again referring to the same issue, which the Optic blast was powered by three people that resulted in a retreat by Apocalypse.

Then you obviously haven't read much Thanos over the years. Drop that silly X-book and read something more interesting. Read 'Thanos Quest'...which many people regard as his shining moment...where went on his mission to collect the Infinity Gems. Going toe-to-toe with Tyrant and Odin were also under his own power. It must really get under the skin of X-fanboys that Apocalypse has not been given the same attention and respect.

So you assume I'm and X-fanboy and not aware of Thanos story lines.
I own Thanos Quest, Cosmic Powers #6, and Warlock and the Infinity Watch #25, which were all excellent issues. That why I decided to own them in my collection. But, I agree Thanos Quest was impressive since Thanos humiliated Champion of the Universe and the Grandmaster.

O-k...whatever you say.

Once again you've proven that you don't know jack about the subject at hand.

Thanks for playing...call me when you're ready for another round.
.

Well, for one Darkseid's power let him erase people from existence so it could erase anyone short of Galactus. Since in the Crossover Galactus was completely unaffected by the Omega Effect. However, if Thanos is still banned from Death's Realm than even the Omega Effect may not work. However, normal Thanos under his own power would succumb to the the Omega Effect.

King KAM
Lets get real here......Thanos is marvels most powerful cosmic villain, he is smarter than apoc, stronger,and far more the tactician, show me what Apoc has done to prove he is better than thanos....and that he is stronger, apoc isnt even the strongest mutant so how is he going to beat someone who is above herald level

King KAM
Originally posted by babel10
When has it ever been proven that Apocalypse is stronger than the Hulk? Perhaps you refer to when he recruited Hulk to become War. Apoc was immobilizing Hulk, (who was having power fluctuations and shrapnels inside his brain), for a few seconds, while trying to tell him he just wanted to talk. Then Hulk stopped, and Apoc talked him into becoming a horseman.

Hardly a display of brute strength on the part of Apoc.

Yes, it was in Hulk #456 where the Hulk was easily manhandled by Apocalypse. I suggest you reread the issue, because the Hulk was being overwhelmed until Hulk asked Apocalypse to let him go. Apocalypse let him go, but told Hulk that he was now in the service of Apocalypse. So either through force or not Hulk was becoming Apocalypse's horseman.

Why not?

Thanos under his own power is the most powerful Eternal considering Zuras is dead. However, since Ikaris is now Prime Eternal his normal abilities have been increased. The level of Ikaris's control of cosmic energy has increased, and he could also increase his strength with his new levels. In addition Ikaris has the advantage in agility, and is a very well developed hand to hand fighter. So I think Ikaris could hold his own against Thanos.

So he's a mad scientist...big deal. Who isn't? He isn't even half as accomplished as Dr. Doom...who has even toyed with Ultron...making him his thrall...a guy that could probably give old blue lips a run for his money.

Apocalypse is far more accomplished than Dr. Doom as a mad scientist. Since Apocalypse doesn't just toy with his creations but personalizes them. Literally, like how he gave Archangel blue skin and metal wings. However, when it comes to mad scientist Mr. Sinister embodies the concept of mad scientist.

Ultron could give Apocalypse a run for his money?
Explain!

Yet he can't adapt to the way Cyclops fights...you really think he stands any chance against the Silver Surfer?!? What the hell are you smoking?
All you keep referring to is low showings of Apocalypse. In X-factor#68 Apocalypse was blasted with the combined power of Jean Grey, Cable, and Cyclops. Why else would his optic blast be so powerful. However, that being said Apocalypse was in a weakened state since he was stationary and could only fire blast at the Inhumans and X-factor. But, under normal conditions Apocalypse could handle cyclops easily as he did in the early issues of X-factor.

Laughable statement, to say the least. Considering Cyclops was able to optic blast him into submission, Odin should have absolutely no trouble. Apocalypse had trouble fighting Loki, and was only able to contain him with the help of Caliban. You really think he's on par with Odin?
Again! you have to resort to using Cyclops's optic blast, which wasn't only his power but a combined effort of Jean Grey, Cable, and Cyclops.
In addition Apocalypse was weakened, not at normal levels in which he could utilize his many abilities. The battle in X-factor#50 in which Apocalypse saw through Loki's disguise.

Loki may not be as powerful Odin and Thor. However, Loki is highly intelligent and sneaky, since he managed to manipulate the Surfer in Surfer#4. Loki's deceptiveness could make him a threat to lots of people. So despite Loki not having as much raw power as Thor and Odin, he manages through his trickery.

Sheer speculation on your part.

How is it sheer speculation since all the people mentioned have Incalculable strength one way or another. However, each have to use some kind of power as a means to reach the higher levels of strength. However, since Apocalypse has complete control of his atomic structure he could shift his strength to high levels as well as adjusting his body to compliment the strength increase. Which none of the others listed could do, thus they would reach their limit in strength before the Apocalypse.

Example Apocalypse easily overpowering a struggling Hulk in Hulk#456

Except a well placed optic blast.
Yet again referring to the same issue, which the Optic blast was powered by three people that resulted in a retreat by Apocalypse.

Then you obviously haven't read much Thanos over the years. Drop that silly X-book and read something more interesting. Read 'Thanos Quest'...which many people regard as his shining moment...where went on his mission to collect the Infinity Gems. Going toe-to-toe with Tyrant and Odin were also under his own power. It must really get under the skin of X-fanboys that Apocalypse has not been given the same attention and respect.

So you assume I'm and X-fanboy and not aware of Thanos story lines.
I own Thanos Quest, Cosmic Powers #6, and Warlock and the Infinity Watch #25, which were all excellent issues. That why I decided to own them in my collection. But, I agree Thanos Quest was impressive since Thanos humiliated Champion of the Universe and the Grandmaster.

O-k...whatever you say.

Once again you've proven that you don't know jack about the subject at hand.

Thanks for playing...call me when you're ready for another round.
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Well, for one Darkseid's power let him erase people from existence so it could erase anyone short of Galactus. Since in the Crossover Galactus was completely unaffected by the Omega Effect. However, if Thanos is still banned from Death's Realm than even the Omega Effect may not work. However, normal Thanos under his own power would succumb to the the Omega Effect.
oh yeah, and Thanos intellect is on a level far more superior than that of anyone earth born, including richards.

Xplosive
Look we have to make some clear here. In X-Factor 68, Cyclops himself said he, other X-Factor plus Black Bolt scream, he said we shot with everything we got at Apocalypse, doing absolutely nothing, Apocalypse has unmacthable supremacy. So Cyclops first shot with everyhing he got doing nothiing and being a joke to Apocalypse, and with help of others, including Black Bolt, but then few minute later, suddenly he had enough power to defeat Apocalypse. No, they linked as one, Jean, Cable and Cyclops, they linked as full combined powers of those three, which Cyclops shot with blast, combined powers of those three. They defeated Apocalypse, Apocalypse wasnt moved and telepored away, he became weakened, he was defeated.

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