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What d'you believe? D'you believe Plato was telling the truth about this antediluvian world, or was the story a way to rally the citizens of Greece to learn from their mistakes and not repeat them?

is there any evidence for atlantis?

People believe they have found ruins of Atlantis throughout the world. Plato's description can be found mostly everywhere, from the island of Crete to the icelands of Antartica. Large stones have even been found off the coast of Bimini, that some claim are the outer walls or roads of Atlantis.

wasn't it Socrates description? or maybe im mixing up. but yes, Platos (or Socrates) description of Atlantis was very evident.

The actual location is debatable. I think that there was once an Utopian society in ancient world. Plato must have known something about such a place. I think those writtings of Plato giving full details of Atlantis are missing.

if it existed it is funny to say the least that those who knew the civilisation were not able to pinpoint the location of the city

some place it between greece and egypt, others near italy, others near gibraltar, others for the coast of west-africa...

I was more thinking of the Mediterrenean. Since is a volcanic area it would explain the earthquakes which supposly sunk the city.

"Beyond the Straits of Gilbrator," Plato describes. . . "or you know them as the Pillars of Heracles, in the Atlantic Ocean."

it should be near the Mediterranean...

it can be anyone since no one up to this point has given an exact location nor that it is even true! for all you know it might even be on Thera

Thera does seem to be the greatest possible location for Atlantis. It does harbour many of the traits Plato described: hot and cold springs, unity, man in tune with nature seen by the frascos, temples...etc.

That's it! Maybe the Atlanteans were actual ALIENS!!!

No one can pin point the actual location of Atlantis because is a Spaceship! Yeah!

*puts down occult mysteries book*

...the lost city of atlantis is up my ass

Atlantis is a legendary island in the Atlantic, west of Gibraltar, that sunk beneath the sea during a violent eruption of earthquakes and floods some 9,000 years before Plato wrote about it in his Timaeus and Critias. In a discussion of utopian societies, Plato claims that Egyptian priests told Solon about Atlantis. Plato was not describing a real place any more than his allegory of the cave describes a real cave. The purpose of Atlantis is to express a moral message in a discussion of ideal societies, a favorite theme of his. The fact that nobody in Greece for 9,000 years had mentioned a battle between Athens and Atlantis should serve as a clue that Plato was not talking about a real place or battle. Nevertheless, Plato is often cited as the primary source for the reality of a place on earth called Atlantis.
(From A Skeptics Dictionary http://skepdic.com/atlantis.html)

before the eruption yes but it's not west of gibraltar

what if there was a real place TO?

Yerssot> There is no proof. Show me some, THEN we can talk

that's the point, what is certain in history?

ok people! atlantis is up my ass! you can go visit me and stick your hand up my ass, when you put it in, go to the left, not the right, people always do that. You'll find aqua man from justice league in there too

Sorry, moonwalker... before we can visit Atlantis up your ass, you must take your finger out of it first. It's not nice to point.

The Omega > People also believed Troy was a fable before Heinrich Schlieman found TROY in 1870. He excavated 9 cities, one with large e'nuff walls told in Homer's story The Illaid.

It has never been confirmed that Schlieman found Troy, he believed he did find Troy. Others archeologist have contradicted his findings.
The fable of Troy has probably some truths to it but TROY itself are a fable. But events have happened and these events transformed intto TROY.

But that it was TROY Schlieman found is NOT A FACT AT ALL

yup, too true I'm afraid...

they found a city that matches almost the geographical elements mentioned in the story, but from all the cities they ever found, either the size didn't make sense or it wasn't destroyed at all, or whatever.
Not a single layer fits the description

sorry, just warming up for my resit greek history

what Schlieman found could very much be what Homer described as the city called Troy, so the place might be real. The Trojan war as Homer wrote it is fictional though. Of all the recorded stuff abouyt the wars with Spartans and Greeks it is kind of strange that Troy never got mentioned at all, they had a lot of war against minor Asia though so fact sometimes aspire story of fiction

but as of Atlantis we could have a similare thing as with Troy, a historical event that lead to a legend.
One of the events that might have inspired Plato is the eruption of the volcano on Santorini which created a tidal wave that destroyed the cosatal villages of the Minoan culture on Crete. Knossos that were situated inland survived the tidal wave but the volcanic ash covered and defoliated the island. This caused a famine which brought Knossos to a downfall and the remaining Minoans was overrun by the Mycaeneans of greece. End of an civilisation, and very much a candidate of the origin of the Atlantis Myth

to nitpick on troy again, finti, it is very difficult to get what Troy Homer wrote about but that's about it, should keep it ontopic

hmm, finti, that Atlantis thing you wrote is the same as I wrote about the eruption on Thera

Sorry Yers I overlooked your post there

pfff, who doesn't

true

Belief is in the eye of the beyond I guess.

maybe

There was a major world flooding at the end of the last ice age. Before this, the majority of the continentall shelfs were above water level, as well as a huge subcontinent in the indonesia/sundaland area (which was bigger than modern day india and bigger than modern day australia).
Many now believe that it was a volcano (krakatoa) on the sundaland subcontinent that erupted 11'600 years ago and spread its ash throughout the world, much of it landing on the polar glaciers, helping to melt the ice caps and bring an end to the last ice age. Although I dont believe that there was ever a place called 'Atlantis', I do believe that there were many pre-flood civilizations that were destroyed by the submergence, and that the most prosperous of these would have been in sundaland, as it would have been by far the largest lowland fertile land mass on the planet at the time. This was also the region in which a race of mini-humans were recently revealed to have been living up until the end of the last ice age, along with many other extinct lifeforms (including mini-elephants).

The whole idea of Altantis is cool.But we have yet to know if it is real or not.It could be or it could not be real.We may never know but it is still interesting never teh less.
See you around!JM

Found!

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20041115/od_uk_nm/oukoe_odd_cyprus_atlantis&e=5

I'm from Atlantis.

I would like to think there's a race of people living a completely different life underwater but there's not so I just let it go.

-AC

Lets blow Gjallarhorn (the horn blown to sound Ragnarok)

http://www.atlan.org/articles/atlantis2/
http://www.atlan.org/articles/checklist/

Most popular beliefs on locations of lost civilization:
1.Sundaland/Indonesia
2.San Tropini
3.Mexico (where circular irrigated canals have been found that resemble solon's description of them- about 9500 years old)
4.Crete/Thera
5.Mid-Atlantic Ridge/Azores
6.Incan Peru
7.Indus Valley
8.Antarctica

Heimdal is now blowing the horn

http://www.earth-history.com/Index.html

Finti, you said what I wanted to say (and I was preparing this stuff in my head all the way to your post). Anyway, the Minoan city of Akrotiri on Santorini (which was Thera) was destroyed when the volcano erupted and half the island imploded. The resulting tidal wave hit the Minoan civilisations on Crete which is 70 nautical miles away. Interestingly, they never found any human or even animal remains at Akrotiri which is still perfectly preserved due to the ash from the volcano. It is therefore believed that the Minoans at Akrotiri fled the island and ended up somewhere (probably dead - see tidal wave description). It was widely believed that this was Atlantis (see implosion detail). However, it has also been debated that Atlantis was close to Indonesia somewhere. There seems to be some kind of proof that a "great trek" took place over Siberia or Mongolia or something (shit, I really can't remember). So that's my piece of the puzzle.

If it helps at all, I once dreamt that I lived underwater and could breath normally without Scuba gear. Someone mentioned that somewhere.

Oh, Finti - The Palace of Knossos on Crete was destroyed three times before they were finally overrun. Not sure of the order here but the ash got them, a great fire broke out after an earthquake caused the pitoi (olive oil "jugs" to fall over, and I think a flood pretty much wiped them out the last time. Writing on Minoan "tablets" called Linear B has still not been deciphered so no-one really knows what happened or how these people lived. They were a great civilisation though. I've been to Knossos, they even had flushing toilets and proper irrigation. This stuff is really interesting. Researchers have tried to piece together as much as they can but without understanding Linear B, this has been quite hard.

how many times do i have to hear this ; Atlantis was never lost !

We are here ! IN THE MIDDLE OF THE MEDITERRANEAN

Is it possible that the founders of the 'atlantis' indonesian civilization were really time-travellers from 100-200 years in our future?
They could have taken back with them and used all sorts of futuristic technology and settled in sundaland, knowing that their existance would be covered up by the coming flood, so they could get away with whatever they wanted (hence the lack of morals of the pre-flood civilization found in many myths). Also, they would have thought of themselves as gods compared to the local species of 'humans', or at least the primitive natives would have thought of the founders of that civilation as godlike.

NO

Of course Atlantis existed! Bobby from Dallas was "The man from Atlantis" and I saw it on TV, so it must be true.

Why not? Anything is plausible. I've been theorising the same thing.

The legend is based on the Minoan civilization. Plato's numbers are exaggerated by a factor of ten and the pillars of Heracles referred to in his time aren't the ones we think of now. Recent excavations have found evidence to back this up, like animals that weren't native to the area but the "Atlanteans" were said to have (can't remember which ones).

Its incredible how such a legend has been built-up over time, especially all the crazy stuff like advanced technology and magic.....

I never heard the thing about magic. I did however hear that they'd found a "model" of a plane or jet or some flying machine in an old Incan ruin which, when tested in a wind tunnel, was perfectly aero-dynamic.

Im not talking about 'atlantis'. I was talking about a lost civilization that was submerged at the end of the last ice age, but was NOT called atlantis.

Oh, I think I'm lost here. I don't think I read your post properly.

When plato referred to the atlantic ocean, you must understand that at the time, the greeks thought that the medditerranian was the hwole world, and that what they called the 'atlantic ocean' was ANY water outside of the medditteranian, as they believed that it was surrounded entirely by a world ocean, which they referred to as the 'atlantic'. They didnt define it in the same way that we do.

Also, plato said that 'atlantis' had elephants, and there have been discoveries recently that have found that a race of mini-elephants lived in indonesia.

I am 100% certain that there WAS a civilization based in sundaland/indonesia/south china sea that was submerged at the end of the last ice age, and that while it was no paradise, it was one of the greatest civilizations of its time and was advanced for its time (not necesserally advanced by todays standards)

I don't know. I think that ancient civilisations were advanced even by today's standards. They might not have had cell phones or wireless or satellite connections but their knowledge of science and astronomy and other things were definitely right up there. The Minoans themselves were quite advanced as were the Egyptians and the Incas. That aside, your bit on Indonesia correlates with what I've read. I've posted it earlier somewhere.

I'm sure they could've brought elephants to an island in the Mediterranean. Hannibal had them in North Africa....

they knew of India as the outher rim of the Persian empire, and that is a certain distance from the Mediterranean.

The other day upon returning home from uni I switched on the TV, and Macgyver was on, in some movie about Atlantis. Inside an active volcano or something. Quite silly and has nothing to do with this argument, but....

they still run that show here too , at daytime that is....

. well nothing about the atlantis myth is more silly than any of the other.......and dont worry about it not being a part of the argument

Good to hear, although really I should never have doubted, Macgyver is classy and appropriate in all conversations.

ha. I remember the macgyver episode where he discoveres atlantis.

I remember the MacGyver episode where everyone was eaten by killer ants. So maybe, and this a big maybe, Atlantis was eaten by killer ants and hence, no physical evidence.

Well, if it could work on MacGuyver, then it could surely work in the real world......