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In FotR, and the end of RotK, when the butterfly comes, could it not be said that the butterfly was Radagast?
In the LotR book, it is said:
"Radagast is, of course, a worthy wizard, a master of shapes and changes of hue."
Could PJ not say that the butterfly was Radagast, and that he had come with tidings to Orthanc?
Or, that it was an emissary of Radagast, sent to Orthanc with tiddings, and then later to signal the coming of the Eagles?
Think on this.

Mothy wasnt in the book versions

So no, its not radagast

said could PJ say that it "WAS".
'Cause Elves weren't in Helm's Deep in the book, so by your logic, they weren't Elves.

Yeah but the elves at helms deep say 'hello, we are good looking elves, we will help'

In FotR and RotK there is NOTHING WHATSOEVER that indicates The moth is radagast

Holy shit....your hardcore........you need 'absolute evidence'.....
What about when PJ and Fran Walsh said 'We just don't show them going into the Old Forest...."Yeah, jack shit, you guys are just lazy.
Maybe no one else would have sat and watched a 12-hour movie, but I would've.

So would i, but what does that have to do with anything?

Tom bombadil puts nothing into the story, maybe if he waltzed into the battle at the black gate and sang the orcs to death, maybe they would have put him in FotR

But he does nothing

Hello tom, Bye Tom.

All he does is give them the swords, which they were instead given by galadriel

Because galadriel must give them that, instead of the real gifts, as there was no scouring, so no need for seeds

See.....I forgot that.....AND THAT PISSES ME OFF, SO MUCH, IT'S NOT FUNNY.
DEATH TO THE USURPERS!

OMG i just realized an important point about the Sword used to kill the Wraith king... Tom gave merry the only sword by fate that could peirce his armor... that is a really important over looked fact... everyone thought the wraith king just died by a normal weapon

Hey....your right!
Good for you, for figuring that out!
I didn't......................

Blast, I thought it was "Radgast"...so much for my theory that the wizards had seven letters in their names.

EDIT: Who is the other, less-known wizard that I can't think of? There's Saruman, Gandalf, Radagast, and...?

in the films Aragorn gives them swords...
galadriel gives them daggers which they loose...
merry and pippin are armed by citiy armies of minas tirith and edoras...
sam still has his sword form aragorn...
and obviously frodo gets sting from bilbo...

every one pitches in!

as for Tom Bombadil... he illustrates that the ring does not effect everything... he gives the ring depth...

the one sad thing about loosing tom, is the loss of the Barrow wight...
that would have been a cool scene!

... and the two Blue Wizards (Ithryn Luin), Alatar and Pallando.


The idea of the Moth and Radagast is interesting... but I dont think PJ would think so much about ideas like that

The function of R. would be quite different from the book where he unknowingly leads Gandalf into Saruman's, hm, trap, while in the film - he'd rescue him?

How dare you call them lazy you git. Sorry for the language but that annoys me to shit calling them lazy. a 7 year project gone excellent and you call them lazy? Good call

as for Radagast.....he rules, he was Gwaihir's drinking buddy and sent them to the black gate so he could steal his pint

Discos - ah its been a while since you have all heard my nonsence

Ok, so the Radagast=Moth thing is ruined....(by the way, I PMed him last night about the two Ithryn Luin).....

The elf captain at Helm's Deep was unbearably ugly. It detracted from the purpose.

or he might have also sent the moth

Thats what I said..........

Haldir wasnt ugly.

droolio

in the movie? yes he was

So...I think we were talking about a Moth...weren't we ?

I am just saying that it is pretty good luck that that Eagle came along for Gandalf when he was ontop of Isengard...or else he might have still been up there !!!

no, but it's pretty good luck that a moth flew hundreds of meters in the air over a mine...
and that it was just when he was on top of isengard... lol

Yes...that too in itself was very good luck ! And the leap that Gandalf made onto the back of the Eagle...this was amazing.

Though I think I might have forgotten a key issue...how did Gandalf regain his Staff from Sauroman

If the eagle had not come.
The tale would have been very different
as in the books, when gandalf escapes saruman isnt there, he is being questioned by the nazgul.

He goes up to the top of the tower to ask gandalf for forgivness and friendship. but gandy is gone

And in the book, its even more lucky that a giant eagle just happens to be flying around isengard

It's not known if that tale is true.
Read Unfinished Tales.
Tolkien never fully 'Finished' that Tale.

It is true.

Okie dokie, smokie.

we have already discussed this.....Mothy's name is LARRY!

Yes, that is true

The Idea that Radagast(or his presence) is in the movie in the form of a moth....(THE MOTH)...Interests me so much, and its a wonder I never noticed it before...(and I'm extrmly greatfull to melkor for finding a topic that as far as I know HASN"T BEEN DISCUSSED YET!)
Your theory makes perfect sence...Radagast is know for his nature and especially birds...ect. And dosn't gandalf use radagast as a mesenger or somthing for the eagles?(itBook)

Gandalf is imprisoned on top of ORTHANC and Radagast finds him...Gandalf whispers somthing in his ear...(which I didn't understand till now...I mean why was he talking to the moth? -to give radagast a message, of course!) finaly its clear to me...Radagast is in the backround of the movie the whole time...cloaked in a desguise.
In ROTK we find that Radagast is coming to the aid of gandalf(and the world) again, He brings the Eagles, and who else could convince Gwahir and the others to fly to the aid of Middle Earth, but for RAdagast, if not for gandalf, Radagast is the ONLY one who could of convinced the eagles to come...
Ok thats looking at it from a movie point of view....in the books I understand the difs...
Seeing as gandalf was busy, PJ put Radagast in the movie, to be a messenger to the eagles....but instead of introducing us to a totaly NEW 'person' PJ and his briliant mind...uses radagast in a way that is magical: in the form of a moth...
and gives us that awe and wonder, the same awe and wonder, when we see gandalf's fireworks the first time, or Saruman's treachery...the only kind of awe that could come from a Wizard: Radagast.

Thanks Smodden.

btw this is whats so great about LOTR...there is always somthing new to discover, and find. It never gets old.

Radagast did not really do his duty to the Valar though, as he didn't even act to the full extent of his poor abilities.

I feel that way too, because he became sidetracked from his true purpose (to battle Sauron (not literally)).

not that the three colourful wizards ever counted for much

Which colorful wizards?
Alatar, Pallando, and Aiwendil (Radagast)?

the two blue ones and the brown one white and grey are not 'colourful' colours

And I may add that Saruman's morality and true power decreased along with his melanin (to the hair follicles)

Well, Radagast became pretty much a monk, and the Blue Wizards (Ithryn Luin) went into Rhun.

Rhun...AKA East....a.k.a.....MORDOR...
Its a theory...
I mean they wander off towards the east...never to return again...sounds suspicious...maybee they were converted...or somthing/destroyed/died/became evil???not sure...

To be fair, brown ain't much of a colour either.

Not sure either, though Saruman accompanied them to their destiny, before he became evil.

Do you mean destiny or destination?
and are you sure it was BEFORE Saruman became Evil?
because if he was evil then...several things could change.

It was just around the time that they arrived (give or take a hundred or so years).........before Saruman studied Sauron, and the Rings..................and Alatar and Pallando were told to go East, I think............

In the Hobbit Gandalf and gwahir are friends. And has helped him before.

This is true. I wish there was a story about Radagast.. Would be very interesting - he's the Mud Wizard(Not mad, you'll notice. That was Saruman)

There are seven wizards mentioned in the hobbit. Gandalf talks to Radagast and they mention the Necromancer fought by the council while the expedition is lost in the forest.

There are not seven wizards!
Don't know where you get your knowledge from..........................

There are five wizards, aren't there? I always thought so.

The two blue wizards founded various cults in the east

Thats not confirmed, thats just what Tolkien said in his Letters, to explain what may have happened to them.

There is a council mentioned in the Hobbit of many wizards that stood against the Necromancer in Mirkwood and pushed him out... maybe there was only five... i read the Hobbit 5 years ago and i keep seeing seven in my head...

Well......I take a look at my copy.....

The council was made up of many members...5 of which were wizards...I also know Galadrial was a member of the council too...so that makes 6...I know there was another member....I think you right about the '7' though...
but not all 7 were wizards...

btw the council was awesome! so many powerfull people assembyled in one place. deciding the fate of the world and then going out and battling the giver in mirkwood!...I loved that part of the books...

No, three were Istari.
Council members were:
Saruman (Head), Galadriel, Celeborn, Elrond, Gandalf, Radagast, Cirdan, Erestor, Glorfindel, and it is recorded that the sons of Elrond, Elladan and Elrohir, were at least at the Council which decided the Siege on Dol Guldur.
There were seven 'Normals': Saruman, Gandalf, Elrond, Galadriel, Radagast, Celeborn, and Cirdan.
Four known 'Lieutenants', or, 'Scribes': Elladan, Elrohir, Erestor, and Glorfindel.
Haldir is said to be among the Councillors aswell.

The other two Ithryn Luin (Blue Wizards) went into Rhun.

oh...luin and the other dude, wern't there? ok....
erm...ok

so when Gandalf says in FOTR, "I must see saruman...he's the head of my order"...what does that mean?
my order?
of the white council? of the 5 wizards?

Well, thats contradictory.
In Unfinished Tales, it seems that Saruman is the Head of the Five, yet other sources seem to point out that Gandalf was the more learned, and indeed wiser.
But, by that, in the movie, I believe the writers of the movie meant the Five, because the White Council isn't even mentioned.
And even then, it is strange, because only two Wizards are in the movie.
Gandalf gives the impression there are many wizards in Middle-earth, when that is false: there are five 'Wizards'. Mages are many, indeed, but they do not follow the Istari's code.
In Valinor, I do believe that there were many Istari.

I always loved that there was a difference btween Wizards Mages and Sorcerers

There is, because Wizards belong to the Order, the Heren Istarion.

Wizards are similar to Sorcerers as in they both retain the natural ability to use magic.. but sorcerers are mortals that share blood with dragons which are adept in those abilities
while Mages are the studiers who train through books to use magic

Whatever......it's probably different in the works of Tolkien anyways.....

it is