Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

"Jesus said to him, `I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me." - John 14:6

Does this mean Ghandi is in hell? I was told by seminary student that I met in Texas that unless I accept Jesus Christ as my personal saviour I don't go to heaven. I thought about this for a while and began thinking about famous non-Chrisitian and wondering if they were in hell. I asked a priest and got the same basic answer. I thought that if there was a heaven Ghandi must be there and that if he wasn't it was bullshit. That is basically what made me skeptical of Christianity as an early teen. I have since stopped believing in Christianity and any notion of heaven and hell, but I would like to see how the Christians respond to this thread.








~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"By the way, I am high. I'm HIGH!!!" - Dave Chappelle

A benign Creator should look at actions rather than dogma and trivialities.

agreed, I don't believe that if there were a god in heaven that he would allow something like that. But, what i'm trying to figure out is are there Christians out there who would say that Ghadi did go to heaven, and how they justify this when the Gospel of John clearly states that the only way to the father is through Jesus.

WOW! How people interpret the NT amazes me! Anyways no matter what I think is still doesn't change if Ghandi is in Heaven or Hell. Of course if you're an Atheist you don't believe in that mumble jumble.

According to South Park, yes, he is.

Watching saddam and Satan make love. All day and all night.....

IF there is a heaven he should be in it, but I believe there is so no.

Fun fact: Gandhi opposed modern medicine so much that he let his wife die rather than allow her to get a shot of penicilin. Later, when Gandhi himself needed modern medical treatment, his resistence to modern medicine mysteriously dissapeared.

No point to telling you that, really. I just thought it was interesting.

people will believe whatever they want to believe. the problem starts when people start imposing sh!t on other people. religion is one huge propaganda all in all. i don't care what church, i.e religion, it is, there will be a collection basket attached to it. i'm catholic, and yes i practice. i'm there but i do not put in the basket? why? because if i want to donate something, i'd do it myself. another point in case are the mormons. how many percent of their living do they "donate" to their church? and may i ask what their church has done for them?

my point being, believe whatever you want to believe. i believe ghandi is not in hell because HE believes he is worthy of heaven...

Im wondering why more of the hardcore christians on KMC have chosen not to respond to this thread. Any idea why?




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"By the way, I am high. I'm HIGH!!!" - Dave Chappelle

There is no hell.
It's just something religious people made up to scare you into joining their cult!

Turbo_Cajun>

What made those seminar-students the sole authorities on the Christian Bible. Half of it is symbolic anyways -ACCORDING to Christians.

What they're saying is also - that anyone born before Christ, and anyone su unfortunate to live a good life, but in a remote area of planet Earth before missionaries started stuffing Bibles down their throats will ALSO not be in heaven.
Ah, religion - the contradictions, the hypocricy.

...The idiocy.

I personally dont think they know shit, but if i can't believe what i hear from seminary students, or priests, or the gospel of john, i would say that Christianity as a religion, is......unreliable?

Thank you though for responding.

Ghandi is in hell but pedophile priests just have to confess their sins and they'll be partying it up with Jesus! pimp

OH MY GOD TEX THAT IS A GREAT SIG!!!!!

Ghandi got re-incarnated.

From a Christian perspective, it's not what we did, but what He did. *gets bashed for posting things from a Christian point of view*

I'll get other reasons why Ghandi is in Hell later...It's getting late and my parents are yelling at me bag

I don't think Hell is even a Christian concept. Wasn't Good/Evil Heaven/Hell a concept of Zoroastrianism?

indigenous religions have had concepts of a spirit world since the begining of time.... few have a heaven/hell concept, but there is an idea of a world we go to after death.




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"By the way, I am high. I'm HIGH!!!" - Dave Chappelle

Yes, but not, I think, eternal hell.

I don't believe in heaven or hell, so no, Ghandi is not there.

That might be, I think there is a mix of many myths/cultural beliefs in the bible. Can't remember if hell was mentioned in the old Testament but the great span of time from the old to the new Testament introduces many different and contradicting terms.

Before the Bible and Zoroaster almost all lengends from ancient times talk of mainly 3 worlds known to human. 1) The earth 2) Heavenly planets (not 'heaven' in christian terms) and 3) Underworld (Below the earth world, not 'hell' in christian terms).

And back to the original question: I'm inclined to answer no, but I'm not christian and to imply a christian hell for Ghandi takes a christian to answer. But we know that is meaningless. It would be wrong to assume anything.

I dont want this thread to die on me... i want to hear from you ppl, can you christians explain (believe?) that your kind and merciful god has sent one of the most famous non-violent activists in the world to hell despite his good work on earth?

Ghandi=Hell?
If Ghandi's in Hell, I guess I don't have any chance.

Thats why i quit church....smelled like bullshit to me

Which Church?
Roman Catholic?
Be more specific.

we've managed to scare them all away

Episcopal/Anglican....but i quit going to other ppl's churchs too

No. Nobody is in Hell yet... except, of course, Satan and his "subordinate" evils...

Where does it say that in the Bible? Are you a christian?

Why? Did the Bible say dead are already in Hell?

I don't know if im following you.... are you saying their is a purgatory or something or does no one go to hell? Where do you think people go when they die, either they don't go anywhere, or they go to heaven, or they go to hell, or they go somewhere else. And I never read the Bible so don't ask me about it.

Ok... so me believes in the Bible... and it doesn't mention of a "purgatory" .. so I don't believe in it.

Since I believe in the Bible... I should say that when people die... they go to their grave ... the body clings to the ground... and the soul dies with the body and stays in the ground. Dead will soon rise up on Judgement Day... and that would be the right time to receive either the promise in Heaven or the punishment in Hell.

okay... so on this "judgement day" does ghandi go to heaven or hell?

I'm not God, TC. God saves us through His mercy.

"All those who sinned without the law will also perish without the law, and all those who sinned under the law will be judged by the law."
Romans 2:12

And I agree with that.

I don't believe there is a hell...I believe most of the bible is made up some stories were made with good intent as stories to learn from then demonized to control the populace

and then there are all those who doesnt give a shite wondering what makes the chrisitan faith more right than other faiths.

They werent written with good intent though, it says right in there about they are the only way and how everyone else isnt getting to heaven.

More of that in Romans-

13-For the hearers of the law are not righteous before God, but the doers of the law will be declared righteous.
14-So when Gentiles, who do not have the law, instinctively do what the law demands, they are a law to themselves even though they do not have the law.
15-They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts. Their concience testify in support of this.

Romans 2:13, 14 and 15

so by the Christian bible, absolutely Hes in heaven!

guess I'm screwed too. There's no way He's in hell if there is one. He did more for world peace than Jesus.

Except that Paul was talking about Christian Gentiles. Paul also says that idolaters will not inheret the kingdom of God (1 Corinthians 6:9), and that would include Hindus.

Bold...

Mahatma Gandhi is one of the most respected leaders of modern history. A Hindu, Ghandi nevertheless admired Jesus and often quoted from the Sermon on the Mount. Once when the missionary E. Stanley Jones met with Ghandi he asked him, "Mr. Ghandi, though you quote the words of Christ often, why is that you appear to so adamantly reject becoming his follower?"

Ghandi replied, "Oh, I don't reject your Christ. I love your Christ. It's just that so many of you Christians are so unlike your Christ."

Apparently Ghandi's rejection of Christianity grew out of an incident that happened when he was a young man practising law in South Africa. He had become attracted to the Christian faith, had studied the Bible and the teachings of Jesus, and was seriously exploring becoming a Christian. And so he decided to attend a church service. As he came up the steps of the large church where he intended to go, a white South African elder of the church barred his way at the door. "Where do you think you're going, kaffir?" the man asked Ghandi in a belligerent tone of voice.

Ghandi replied, "I'd like to attend worship here."

The church elder snarled at him, "There's no room for kaffirs in this church. Get out of here or I'll have my assistants throw you down the steps."

From that moment, Ghandi said, he decided to adopt what good he found in Christianity, but would never again consider becoming a Christian if it meant being part of the church.

-I hope that clears up some of your confusion.
-Also its ridiculous to even ask such a question, for obvious reasons.

In that case... Ghandi could be "judge under the law" since he had come to know the "law" himself.

From there, he could be able to recognize the "law of God" yet he refused, in some other way... if not directly.

But he could be "judge by the law of God"... Anyway, God is always good... He saves His people through His mercy.

If he shows mercy why does he not accept everyone into his kingdom? And why did he not given the bible and the word of god, etc to everyone everywhere instead of having missionaries following soldiers and spread christianity by force?

Didn't he give His "words" and "laws" to everyone... in order to be saved?

God always wanted ALL men to be worthy into His Kingdom, didn't He?

Turbo-Cajun

Because the whole thing is based on belief.
Belief to spread it, belief to believe it.
How is it spread by force?

If god did exist, didnt he give you the Bible.
Ghandi loved jesus, whats your excuse.

You ask how Christianity is spread by force. If you are not familiar with the history of the indigenous people of North, Central, and South America I feel that is a failure on the part of your History teachers, and I really am sorry that I dont have the time to give you a play by play on the last 400 years of brutality spread by Christians. The fact is that "good christians" settling in America killed more innocent people than Hitler did. They did it under the banner of christianity and they were cold about it. I will not even try to explain to you why Christianity has been responsible for war and pain earlier before that, up till the point where it was created. Christians seem to think that they have found this loop hole that allows them to do what they want as long as they ask god to forgive later, while they act immorally and unjustly 6 days of the week and ask for mercy on the 7th, most people who have any real set of beliefs and are sincere about it care enough to live their life along those principles everyday, which is why i have more respect for a Buddhist monk who has spent ten years living in a monastery than some pedophile priest, and not only do i have more respect for them personally - I have more respect for their beliefs and what they are trying to represent. If Christians lived their lives according to the Bible I might concider it because it has demonstrated some level of the virtues it attepts to teach, but they as a whole do not live according to what their god says so why should I?

Amen

Chris·tian
adj.
1. Professing belief in Jesus as Christ or following the religion based on the life and teachings of Jesus.
2. Relating to or derived from Jesus or Jesus's teachings.
3. Manifesting the qualities or spirit of Jesus; Christlike.

Thats what a christian is.

Jesus never forced anyone to believe.

chrisitans have though

So are you saying that everyone who has claimed to be christian who has forced thier religious beliefs onto others is not in fact a christian?

It aint a claim it is their excuse to justify christianity

Christians have no right preaching their bullsh** across the world

they can do it in their asigned places, churches and the likes

Im sick of getting free copies of the new testament as i walk through the hallways at my school

they are allowed to do that?. Where do you live

F-ucking rural Minnesota....sigh....

Every couple weeks they have either the mormon or some group of christians passing out religious litterature.

Its pretty gay

Its at Southwest Minnesota State University....

lol, one of my friend told me i should dress like jesus and go stand in front of their booths....i have long brown hair and a beard, lol, thatd be funny as hell...

Minnesota huh, if there is a Norse(Norwegian) state in the US Minnesota is it

Yup, lots of Norweigans here... some of the little towns you go to there are still some old people that are still very traditional i guess. I was born in Capetown, South Africa so i can't claim any of that herritage, haha, but yeah during the holidays you can get some good food here from that area of the world

Are they from the school, or from some religious group within the school?

religious groups within student organizations and from the community

give them Darwins "origin of the species" in return

Unfortunately, Mister Gandhi is in Hell. You have to remember that even people of such greatness in world history who do not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and/or accepted Him as their personal Redeemer.

who said hell was a bad place

Hmm, Dante, author of the Divine Comedy, creates a place called Purgatory for the "noble Pagan", the good people, who didn't believe in the so called "one religion". This place included those that came before Christ (thus before they could know of God). One guesses it must also contain children who died before they could chose Jesus, and the alike. This seemed to be an attempt to make God seem nicer, see, he could reward even those who weren't saved. Personally I think God should and would be above pledges and oaths of loyalty, and would not give to "the ultimate evil" souls who were good and pure, just because they didn't believe. I am probably more Buddhist, but I (if I) believe in a supremely good God I would refuse to believe he/she/it would be so vindictive. So Gahndi is either in Heavan, or of having some quite time in a non-hell place.

Ah... Purgatory is what Catholics believe in. They believe they go to Heaven for good works but if you haven't and you believe in Christ, you go to Purgatory and eventually you go to Heaven.

Children don't go to hell or purgatory. You have to be of a certain age to get in, according to the bible. Heaven is all ages, on the other hand. Hell isn't God's favourite place, and if he can get you into heaven on a technicality, then he will.

You say that with a considerable ammount of certainity, which is funny because Christians are supposed to judge not lest thou be judged. I was asking for an opinion not a condemnation. But anyways, correct me if i understand you wrong.... christianity, despite the actions of christians as individuals, is a supposedly a religion that worships a merciful god, a god that created man in his own image, would send a peaceful man who lost his life through spreading non-violent protest, much like jesus did, to eternal damnation because he was not a christian? Sounds pretty hypocritical...

If there was a heaven he would be in. But I dont believe there is a heaven or a hell. And if there were god he would let him be in heaven, though he didnt believe in him, and if there were a god he should be so fair to let people into heaven who deserve it.

Thats kind of how i was thinking...

If you kick your mother in the balls and run off with her purse, the woman who raised you, not just birthed you then should you be allowed in the playpin? No matter how many good acts you do as you walk on the sidestreets?

1) my mother does not have balls, and i would perfer you not talk about her.

2) if i did do something to hurt my parents, i am fairly certain that i would be forgiven because even though sometimes what i do does hurt those i care about, we are family and my family takes care of each other.

God has never helped me out, and Im not holding my breath.

Also what Ghandi did did not equal kicking god in the balls... If Ghadi was saying stuff like "Kill the white man!" or "**** Jesus" i could understand you making that comparison, however, as stated earlier in this thread by someone else, Ghandi had some respect for christianity, he was not against Christianity, and the views and message he was spreading was not entirely incompatible with what a christian peace activist might use. Martin Luther King Jr. admired Ghandi, and used alot of his techniques in his non-violent protests.

Christians tend to forget that their god was originally created by other people.
Suddenly, anybody who was around before is screwed.
If any of this was real, what a person did in their life would be what counts......

Christianity/Catholicism is completely hypocritical.

A loving god? Sure he is, when he's in the mood for it. He seems to be more of an egotist in the descriptions given by followers. He'll save you, if you buy this bible, bumper sticker, and WWJD keychain proclaiming him your saviour. He'll save you, if you've been a saint to everyone and everything for your entire life, otherwise you get stuck in limbo until he tells you that you can come out. WWJD? He'd give you a time out...for all eternity!! MUAHAHAHAHAHA

None of it adds up really.

Plus they say all natural disasters are caused by an angry jesus. Dude, science. It's proven. Plate tectonics, cloud formations, tornados....its not because Jesus is pissed that he can't find the remote for his tv. It's science. The fact that people still believe in that crap is beyond me. Come on, we've come a long way since the times of writing in stone. Modern science and medicine exist now. The bible was written back when they didnt have it. It's probably really really exaggerated too. Jesus walked on water=jesus stepped in a puddle...it was really just an inside joke with Jesus and his buddies. From that night, ya know, at that party...oh man great times....

Someone should have told him to wait a couple thousand years, then he could have used an eraser on those ten commandments.

Good points, there. It really is time for people to begin advancing their way of thinking out of stories written thousands of years ago.....

it is often hard to let kid stories go

Joseph Campbell said we need a new mythology, something that speaks to us now. And that was in 1986.....

let the music talk, it can be mans new mythology

Well I guess it depends on the person writing the music. I don't have much confidence in a lot of the music being made now, not when it comes to teaching people anything...

Oh I’m not sure, things like "Bounce" could teach you that you must get up from life's misdemeanours. You have to be a music freak to actually hear most of the words though...

Bounce?

Bon Jovi

..........people are supposed to learn from Jon Bon Jovi?

If they can learn from music, why not?

Bon Jovi has nothing to teach.........

He has a lifestyle, and therefore can teach. He has songs from his heart, therefore we can learn.

If his lifestyle has any value. I'm not sure I'd want to learn what's in his heart.

This thread has gone terribly astray......

thumbs_upbandtoot

Very creative......

Ghandi isn't in hell because there's no such place.......

Are you sure for any reason?

Someone thought it up a long time ago. Fiction isn't reality, so yeah, I'm sure.

That is no proof. Somebody thought up gravity, and what you said could just as stupidly be applied to that.

.............getting a bit testy, are you? The overwhelming difference is that gravity can be proven to exist which is what negates this example everytime I see it.

What's with the insult? Thought we were having a civil discussion here....

So did I. Then you sprout out something about Christianity being unprovable. Here's an example of where that would be false. The simplist form of life is a virus. They cannot live without a seperate being. Ergo, life needs a kick to get started.

Actually, that doesn't make the point. Things in the environment kickstart life.
I didn't realize you were taking this from a religious perspective.....

1. What things?
2. Hell is religious. If you don't want God, the you've got to go somewhere...

If you don't believe in that stuff, there isn't any place you go to.....

And there's no point in discussing the origin of life since I know what your response will be.

Its OK if people don't think like you do.

Hell is your choice. It's not burning it's a caesarean from god.

Actually, i'm curious as to how. The virus thing sits high in my mind, along with the unmixability of the chemicals, and the mere 500 million years in wich cosmic rays were there and oxygen was not.

Yup, but i'm curious how they think.

I just saw a program about that a few days ago; see if you can find the website for a show called NOVA, its far too long to explain here.

I saw paragraphs, and can explain. Meteors burn life. The sea breaks complex molecules. The best idea is soft clay, but it helps it on the same level in building life as a bottle of water in building the Empire State Building.

Actually, its been shown that molecules on meteors are actually combined by the impact into more complex compounds.....
Life can survive in harsh places similar to what was on Earth then, over time, they grew and changed the atmosphere to what it is now.

Where?
I know, but how did virus' survive?

They drew sustenance from different sources. I really can't explain a two hour show here, but if you're interested, look it up.

Public TV can be badass sometimes, i used to watch stuff like nova all the time. I learned a lot of stuff from that channel...

I dont know. I am not God. I don't decide who gets to go to heaven and who has to go to hell. If I did know, I would most certianly tell you, but I don't.

lol, im more interested getting some opinions from people rather than an actual answer. Thats why i kinda jumped on one or two people who posted on this thread earlier, but do you think that he made it in if there is one or do you think he got sent downstairs or do you think that religion and the idea of heaven and hell is bull shit? We wont know the answer for sure in this life, regardless of your beleifs, no one will know for sure. But how bout this, if i meet up with him before you do... i ll try contact you from beyond the grave.

we have to get through Jesus huh so we pay him off then, do you thnk he has change for 30 silver coins

Heheh, I am still inclined to believe if there is a heaven and hell then those who are good would be allowed in to heaven. It is hard to fathom that a truly good God, as I said before, would refuse salvation on what I see as a rather fickle thing. And it is also hard to believe that a mistake, like not believing in that religion for our short time on earth would be cause enough for a good person to be damned for all eternity.... And I would question the ultimate ability of the Bible to really give an answer, as really, it is not Gods true word, it is the way men, mortals, interpreted it..... and the way the Church wants it seen. After all, there are all the so called heretical Gospels which claim to be word of God, but the Church doesn't recognise them, as it doesn't fit in with the Church's doctrine.....

lol

I dont think everyone caught that, but it was funny as hell...

no2

1. Do you really expect to get in if you don't believe in his existence? Do you believe that even Gandhi is good compared to Jesus (on the basis that Jesus is perfect, in that he's questioning from inside our beliefs), God cannot tolerate sin, so if you don't try and get forgiveness, why should he make an exception for them?

2. One such has a giant cross that goes beyond the skies, and two who's head goes into the skies exiting the tomb. Sexism is present in one (the only way a woman can get into heaven is by becoming a man). Many have stupid ideas like the date of the apocalypse. Why should we accept things that we don't see reality in, even vaguely?

Those books are probably being symbolic like Revelations......

Why accept things we can't see reality in, indeed? That's why some people question things like religious dogma. Some don't question, others do. If it were true, then Ghandi wouldn't be in. But if entrance were based on how a person lived their life, I think he'd make it.

As I remember from my time in sunday school, Jesus died for the sins of the world. Jesus died for the sins of the world, not just the sins of christians and Jews. God knew the sinful nature of humans when he sent Jesus, why would he send his only son to save the souls of a small number of believers of christianity, when he loves all his creation? Would he not want all of his creation saved? especially if we are supposedly made in his image?

And what is this about God not tolerating sin? He supposedly forgives sin all the time. Why can you confess and ask for forgiveness from some pedophile preist and have god forgive you, but the idea we cold ask god face to face for forgiveness after we die is out of the question?


I dont have any idea what you were trying to say in part II... so im not going to even try respond to that.

When Jesus first came, He did indeed come to save the world, but when he returns he returns as the judge to crush evil. Thats how it goes..

So that would be the problem with asking for forgiveness face to face. I guess its to late...

Firstly - You have to accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your personal redeemer and saviour and live by it day by day and to reach out to the world. Once you have done this, you are 'saved.'

Secondly - Good works do not launch yourself into heaven. I am sure that Ghandi himself had committed sins throughout his life. The only sinless person that has lived on this Earth was the Lord Jesus Christ.

Thirdly - Unfortunately, I disagree with you on this point Turbo-Cajun that 'Jesus died for the sins of the world, not just the sins of christians and Jews.' Jesus died for the world for those sins of the world that and who to come to know him as the Son of God and has accepted it. Christ did not die for the Jews, he died for those whom believed in him - John 3:16 'For God so loved the world, that He gave His one and only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not persih, but have eternal life.' The Jews could not believe that a man who went around and preached the Word of God was their King, their Messiah.

Your going to probably hate me for saying this but

Jesus was Jewish

Yes, Jesus "King of the Jews" Christ...

So was everyone else in Jeruselem back in the day. Who did God send Jesus to save if he didn't send them to save the Jews? I think that if Jesus was the son of God, he would be here to die for the sins of everyone, but we must be reading different Bibles...

who can blame them

Finti-

you make people laugh

Biblically, Jesus Christ can not save the whole world (that would include the evil-doers) ... God has the law of "one will pay for his own sins" ... So, if Jesus would save the whole world, He would be breaking that law. God's will that matters on how Jesus Christ will save humankinds... it's not only believing in Him ... There is God's will which is ought to be followed and obeyed .. because to believe is one thing and to obey is yet another thing.

In connection to God's will, Christ created Himself a "one new man" (from two, He made it one) ... and in the sight of God, it is really one new man - the "head" and the "body". The "head" is responsible of his "body" and is the saviour of it. So Christ wouldn't be breaking God's law when He'll save only His recognized "Body".

hii there

For one thing, God doesn't send you to hell, you send yourself there. We all have a choice, 2 choices: heaven or hell, we make the choice on where we spend eternity. You can't serve 2 Gods, you either serve one and hate the othere, there's no inbetween.

Jesus did Die for EVERYONE.

Well, I didn't see that Christ really did die for EVERYONE ... He only die for His "body".

what the hell are you talking about jury? you arent making sense to me, please try explain it again...

These can be found in the Bible

are there any particular quotes you want to mention? or are you just making something up that sounds absurd in hopes that some aethiest will scour the bible searching for it only to find that he was fooled?

It's just that I forget the exact Biblical verses. But it is surely written in the Bible. I'll post it when I got it.

I'm waiting for it.

Thanks Just not right now.

well if this god of yours is omnipotent and master of all creation, what was the purpose of creating hell. If he was truly the master of all creation he would have handled evil and hell from the start.
If this god is so good and loving, and heaven was a place as christians define it. God wouldnt have tolerated a hell, he just would have a heaven for his followers and nothing for the rest.

probably why they are called biblical verses

probably why they are called biblical verses

I think that it was his way of saying that hes not making this bs up, rather he is quoting someone who made this bs up a couple thousands years ago and got it published.

Someone finally said it.....

indeed

it is your right to not believe in heaven or hell. but what was said is true. but any christian should know not to say whether ghandi resides in hell or not because that is passing judgment on someone

god didnt create sin sin was created by us where the absence of is.

That's why its not worth getting mad about. Everyone has different ideas, so we look for whatever common ground there is.

that should read absence of god is

good call

i'll kill you.

did no one read my retort on the bible page?

Sense, I didn't get your response......

But what I said doesn't really need anything added or changed because that's the way life works, from what I've seen.

Yes, The Lord Jesus Christ was a Jew and so were his disciples however he did not die for the Jews to leave a eternal life in Heaven. He died for those who believe in him as the Son of God, the Savior of Mankind.

Christ's mission on Earth was to become the King of the Jews on Heaven, while the Jews believed that he'd be an earthly king. However they were wrong and this was not the Messiah that they believe that came and walked on this earth, two thousand years ago! The Jews put their own King on that cross. It wasn't Pontius Pilate and the Roman Empire. It were the Jews that chanted out Jesus' name when Pilate asked the Jewish population what to do with him. So it is quite clear.

However there were many Jews after the death and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ that came to know the Lord.

The reason why I disagree that 'He died for us all' is because it seems that you don't need to come to the Lord and proclaim that he is the Son of God and you have a personal relationship and he's the mediator inbetween you and the Lord.

it is only according to the christian faith they were wrong.

According to Jewish Rabbis that I have spoken to say that the man that the Christians believe in wasn't the true Son of God.

still it doesnt change the fact of my last post