Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Does anyone despise this fat little turd as much as me?

no, because he's more talented than you ever will be

I think he is rather good, and has produced a lot of good work, although I was suprsed at how he went of at Maddona (although I don't really like her, so I don't really have a problem with it )

Made me like him more

I don't like his music, but I certainly don't hate him... He writes and plays all his own music, which is somewhat remarkable in today's music scene.

LMFAO.. and amity75 appreciating it was even cooler..

n e wayz elton John is no doubt a talented singer and has some wonderful songs....... thts all i can say.. or all i know bout him though.. and ya he bashed madonna.. not the smartest thing2do i guess

Anyone forgetting the airport incident?

My sentiments exactly! Or the time he was caught setting fire to 50 quid notes which had been inserted up rentboys bums?

I think I despise him much, much more then you will ever despise him.

He wrote Tiny Dancer which is in the top ten best songs of all time. Then he has a host of other great songs.

Bernie Taupin is the musical brains behind most of his songs.

He has some good songs. But yeah, he is very despiseable. Which is why I despise him.

yea that makes sense except he only wrote the lyrics

He doesnt write hsi own songs though

He's got some great songs...but I wouldn't say I'm a fan

he may be talented, but he has a repulsive personality.so self centred,rude and ignorant

He only diss Madonna to get more attention for himself. Musicians are full of it! They only want to elevate their record sales by being controversial. Oldest trick in the book.

btw- I don't like Madonna either.....like a virgin my

my only problem with elton john is that he is REALLY REALLY gay. Not that i care one bit about the fact he is gay, but its funny how much he shows it. I dont know much about his personality other than that, but i guess its bad from what you all say

As far as I know, that never happened. A tabloid--the Sun?--claimed that Elton John hired rent boys, but he sued them for libel, proved it never happened, and won a great deal of money--which, incidently, he donated to charity. And is the "airport incident" when he insulted photographers who were mobbing him? Because I don't blame him one bit.

As for his music ... I thought Candle In the Wind was pretty good. Not really a fan.

He started getting negative towards the airport workers for not treating him like a celebrity, they treated him like a, SHOCK, normal person.

The Sun is a terrible newspaper, don't read it.

I was on a course in London one time and I saw him coming out of Harvey Nichols. He's a tiny wee man.

Despise him? No, in fact, I think he's the greatest EVER! I am willing to bet that if most of you knew anything about him, you'd realize that all those bands and artists thet you think are so great consider him to be the best too. I'm not saying that he hasn't put out some really crappy music, but from 1970 through 1976 he totally rocked. Then he started this trend of releasing an album that was excellent and then following it up with an album that totally sucks.

As for being treated like a celebrity, he doesn't want to be treated like a celebrity...he deserves it.

How many of you guys that say he sucks like John Lennon? Well, when John Lennon gave his first interview after the break up of the Beatles he was asked what sound impressed him the most? His answer was Elton John. When Lennon finally got to meet Elton, he fell to his knees in front of him. Elton John, David Bowie and John Lennon were best friends, and Lennons last live performance was at an Elton John concert in Madison Square Garden.

If David Bowie and John Lennon say he's one of the best, they would know what they were talking about....

Plus, I love his music...So I have to stick up for him.

Elton John is as stated a fat turd!!!

Originally posted by amity75
Bernie Taupin is the musical brains behind most of his songs.

Do you sit on your face when you talk out of your ass?

Originally posted by amity75
Does anyone despise this fat little turd as much as me?

Isnt Elton a fagg*t

fantastic piano player... also does alot for up and coming musicians that he likes...helps give them a break by giving them slots on his tour...Ryan Adams was one such person...i have some stuff where Ryan does the vocals on Eltons songs (tiny dancer,rocket man and daniel) and elton does the vocals on firecracker, answering bell and sweet carolina...

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Do you sit on your face when you talk out of your ass? No, I sit on your mothers.

Cap't. Fantastic, I couldn't have said it better myself. I fell in love with his music a long time ago. There is no denying his ability to write lyrics, and he can light up a room full of Jehovah's Witnesses. He is charismatic and intelligent. And he adores Eminem, who is the leading homophobe of the moment but still loves Elton. I don't think he's self-absorbed or any of that bullshit. I think anybody who says that they don't like them has no appreciation for music. I would give anything to see him play.

Did I at any point criticise his music?

Ok, so...you don't criticize is music, which means you like it? But you don't like him as a person? Is that what you're getting at?

Originally posted by amity75
No, I sit on your mothers.

Is an overweight woman in her mid fifties the best you can do for yourself? You might as well be sleeping with Elton John.

Originally posted by Ketchuptome
Isnt Elton a fagg*t

Yes, but so are you. What's your point?

Originally posted by Ketchuptome
Isnt Elton a fagg*t

What the hell has that got to do with anything, tipical toy town e-gansta remark

I never at any point mentioned his music but if people are happy listening to mundane ballad after poorly structured boring pop song then that's up to them.

Yeah. Your opinion must be right. That's why he's sold more records over his thirty plus year career, been covered by every act out there and has more platinum albums than any other artist. What music do you listen to? When you answer, I'll tell you how they owe their career to people like Elton John.

My favourite artist and the one I listen to most is Mozart. Now tell me how he was influenced by Elton.

Elton will have enough money in the future to buy the Flux Capacitor and go back in time and influence Mozart.

FACT.

And no doubt have sex with him.

Originally posted by Red Superfly
Elton will have enough money in the future to buy the Flux Capacitor and go back in time and influence Mozart.

FACT.

LMAO. That's funny.

Hey, if Mozart wants to screw Elton, then good for him. But somehow I don't believe you listen to Mozart. If you do, good for you. I personally prefer Bach. It takes a great amount of talent to write music that you cannot even hear. I can't handle much classical music, anyway.

If Elton wasn't great, he wouldn't have sold so many albums, as Cpt. Fantastic said. Nobody can compare to him. He's the best at what he does. And that's writing great pop songs that influence millions. Jesus, man, he rewrote one of his classics for the Princess of England. I don't think anybody else will ever be given that honor.

Originally posted by Jeff_Atello
Jesus, man, he rewrote one of his classics for the Princess of England. I don't think anybody else will ever be given that honor. Oh come on! If you're referring to the princess of Wales then she was just as big an attention seeking media whore as Elton! And that version of candle in the wind is frequently voted the worst song of all time in this country in opinion polls! And as someone with a Batchelor of Education in music who has successfully completed an audition in performance in their major composer of study (in my case Mozart) and passed a diagnostic test on his compositions at the Royal Academy of Music and Drama where two Majors were undertaken and passed with honours, I think I'm quite up tp speed on my Mozart thank you very much.

just gonna say Elton John has a beautiful voice - well at least way back when he did...

Originally posted by amity75
Oh come on! If you're referring to the princess of Wales then she was just as big an attention seeking media whore as Elton! And that version of candle in the wind is frequently voted the worst song of all time in this country in opinion polls! And as someone with a Batchelor of Education in music who has successfully completed an audition in performance in their major composer of study (in my case Mozart) and passed a diagnostic test on his compositions at the Royal Academy of Music and Drama where two Majors were undertaken and passed with honours, I think I'm quite up tp speed on my Mozart thank you very much.

Congratulations on your accomplishments. By the way, how many top 40 singles did you have between 1970 and 1996? Oh, and in which decade were you the most popular recording artist in terms of sales and popularity?

Elton John is a musical prodigy; He began playing the piano at the age of four, and by the age of eleven, he had earned a scholarship to the Royal Academy of Music. At what age did you begin studying at the Royal Academy of Music? Considering that you are 23 years old now, it must have been much later than age eleven.

Originally posted by amity75
Oh come on! If you're referring to the princess of Wales then she was just as big an attention seeking media whore as Elton! And that version of candle in the wind is frequently voted the worst song of all time in this country in opinion polls! And as someone with a Batchelor of Education in music who has successfully completed an audition in performance in their major composer of study (in my case Mozart) and passed a diagnostic test on his compositions at the Royal Academy of Music and Drama where two Majors were undertaken and passed with honours, I think I'm quite up tp speed on my Mozart thank you very much.

Mozart? Please, some one who listened to Mozart would have a much more evolved sense of appretiation for Elton's music. In fact, Elton was playing Mozart when he was five years old. BY EAR!

If you wanna talk about Elton and Diana, then that's something I can't defend. Sure they were friends, but I despise that song. In fact, I despise the reason it exists at all. I'll never defend Elton writting a song for her.

Above and beyond that, Elton is a god. If you think you know music, then you would agree with every other musical scholar out there and say that Elton John is a prodigy. Not only a prodigy, but a musical genious. He sat down in front of the piano when he was 3 years old and started playing what he heard on the radio. I'd like to see you accomplish half as much in the time alotted to your own useless life.

He did a cool cover of Pinball Wizard.

He only rewrote that song for her. I though it was a great thing of him to do and I like the song. But I also liked Diana. Oh well, that's not the subject. Elton is amazing and that's all there is to it.

Jeez amity75, why start a thread bashing Elton John only
when I'm pretty sure there are plety of other, far bigger,
jerks in the music industry.

Besides, regardless of his personal attitude, he is a great
artists. One of my favorite actually.

"Goodbye Yellow Brick Road" is a true classic.

Songs like "Your Song", "Rocket Man", "Someone Saved My
Life Tonight", and "I Guess That's Why They Call It the Blues"
are unforgettable as well. "Step into Christmas" is also a fun
song I like.

Youa re right though about the "Candle in the Wind" Diana
remake. That sucked big-a** time.

Originally posted by King Burger
Jeez amity75, why start a thread bashing Elton John only
when I'm pretty sure there are plety of other, far bigger,
jerks in the music industry.


Bigger, yes. But, most pop stars gain weight when the public eye isn't on them.


Elton John is a god. Plain and simple.

I have to agree.

It's kind of sad to think that almost all of Elton's best songs still come from his 1974 greatest hits album. How could he be so great for five years and then pretty much lame for the last thirty? He dried up as a talent a very long time ago.

Originally posted by Whisper
It's kind of sad to think that almost all of Elton's best songs still come from his 1974 greatest hits album. How could he be so great for five years and then pretty much lame for the last thirty? He dried up as a talent a very long time ago.

That's crap. You only think he was good for five years because that's all you have listened to: his '74 greatest hits album. There are countless tracks on his albums that were not released as singles that blow some of his "greatest hits" out of the water. I'll agree, that most of his early '80s albums are only as good as the singles that were taken off of it. But, since he stopped sucking down bottles of whiskey and snorting pounds of cocain, he's bounced back.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
That's crap. You only think he was good for five years because that's all you have listened to: his '74 greatest hits album. There are countless tracks on his albums that were not released as singles that blow some of his "greatest hits" out of the water Someone pays attention to Elton John? I thought people only paid him to plagarize his own songs and sleep at the foot of the bed. Gimme a break. And how would you know what I do or do not listen to?

Originally posted by Whisper
Someone pays attention to Elton John? I thought people only paid him to plagarize his own songs and sleep at the foot of the bed. Gimme a break. And how would you know what I do or do not listen to?

Prove me wrong. There are songs on dozens of albums that are better than a lot of hit greatest hits. Name some of them for us. Tell us which albums of his are his best and which are his worst. Express something more than what you have up to this point. And yeah, I'd sleep at the foot of his bed. If that was an insult, you're stating the obvious. And there's not much of an insult in that. Tell us who you listen to that has had a tenth of the impact on the musical world.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Prove me wrong. There are songs on dozens of albums that are better than a lot of hit greatest hits. Name some of them for us. Tell us which albums of his are his best and which are his worst. Express something more than what you have up to this point. And yeah, I'd sleep at the foot of his bed. If that was an insult, you're stating the obvious. And there's not much of an insult in that. Tell us who you listen to that has had a tenth of the impact on the musical world. His best album? Tumbleweed Collection - This is one terrific record, with some of Elton's most gorgeous vocal hooks ("Where To Now St. Peter?", anthemic refrains ("My Father's Gun" and the downright touching "Talking Old Soldiers." I find that the low-key production (not as bombastic as the surrounding studio LP's) and Americana bent give the record a pretty coherent sound - Buckmaster's quiet arrangement of "Come Down In Time" is stunning. (Though I recommend tuning out Taupin's rubbishy lyrics as much as possible.) The closest thing to a weak track, "Love Song"
His worst album? Take your pick from "Blue Movies", "Victim of Love", "Leather Jackets" (The production is total soft-rock hell, with all sorts of 80's electronic gimmicks and about as much personality as tapioca pudding. Practically the only entertainment value is the cover's ridiculous picture of Elton and the band dressed up as leather-fetishist bikers)
Other points of non-interest? - His entire Disney catalog.

Originally posted by Whisper
His best album? Tumbleweed Collection - This is one terrific record, with some of Elton's most gorgeous vocal hooks ("Where To Now St. Peter?", anthemic refrains ("My Father's Gun" and the downright touching "Talking Old Soldiers." I find that the low-key production (not as bombastic as the surrounding studio LP's) and Americana bent give the record a pretty coherent sound - Buckmaster's quiet arrangement of "Come Down In Time" is stunning. (Though I recommend tuning out Taupin's rubbishy lyrics as much as possible.) The closest thing to a weak track, "Love Song" I'll suspend my belief that you looked that up on the internet somewhere. Instead, I give you my respect..for now. And while I agree that Tumbleweed Connection is an excellent album, there are other songs on it that go beyond the ones you've listed. And Bernies lyrics are excellent. Your comment there is, in my opinion, more proof that you looked this opinion up on the net somewhere.(most teenagers don't use words like 'bombastic' and gorgeous') Why? Because I've heard that exact review of his lyrics only once; and that was on the net. When I remember it, I'll back up my opinion. Otherwise, Bernies lyrics are considered to be some of the best in all of Rock and Roll.

Originally posted by Whisper
His worst album? Take your pick from "Blue Movies", "Victim of Love", "Leather Jackets" (The production is total soft-rock hell, with all sorts of 80's electronic gimmicks and about as much personality as tapioca pudding. Practically the only entertainment value is the cover's ridiculous picture of Elton and the band dressed up as leather-fetishist bikers)
Other points of non-interest? - His entire Disney catalog.

Victim of Love...by far his worst album. Heads and shoulders above any terrible recording he's done. I told you before his 80's greatest hits were just that...the greatest songs he wrote in the 80's. I also agree, I would be happy to toss out any of his work in animated movies. It gives too many young people the wrong impression of him.

****it ass

Originally posted by Ketchuptome
****it ass

well said. but, I believe you got handed your ass a while ago. Stick with what you know: running away from the fight.

Man, who the hell says "I can be the stunt double of Peewee Herman"

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Congratulations on your accomplishments. By the way, how many top 40 singles did you have between 1970 and 1996? Oh, and in which decade were you the most popular recording artist in terms of sales and popularity?

I had 59 top 40 singles and the 1990's.

Originally posted by SlipknoT
I had 59 top 40 singles and the 1990's.

Who did?

I got respect for the man, absolutely. I respect him as a piano player and like a few of his songs but I think calling him a God is overdoing it.

He's not a God when it comes to music, or anything else.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I got respect for the man, absolutely. I respect him as a piano player and like a few of his songs but I think calling him a God is overdoing it.

He's not a God when it comes to music, or anything else.

-AC

And who are your musical gods AC?

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
I'll suspend my belief that you looked that up on the internet somewhere.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
And who are your musical gods AC?

I don't have lots, because there aren't that many. Needless to say it doesn't matter who mine are anyway, Elton John isn't a God.

First person that storms to mind is Mike Patton. Does more for music in an album than Elton John does in his entire career. Debate that if you want. I only need reel off Patton's body of work to show you that he's more talented, versatile, adaptable and genius than Elton John can hope to be.

Jimi Hendrix for obvious reason.

Billy Corgan.

Tool as a collective.

Rush as a collective.

Elton John is like U2. Reputation legend, not talent legend. None of those bar Hendrix are as or more well known than Elton. Everyone of them are worlds more talented. Not even worth comparing.

-AC

notworthy

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I don't have lots, because there aren't that many. Needless to say it doesn't matter who mine are anyway, Elton John isn't a God.

AC, I ask who your musical gods are because of one reason. Musical gods are like assholes, everyones got one. Much like yourself I'm sure, I take it as a personal attack when someone badmouths them. It's like putting down my opinion.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
First person that storms to mind is Mike Patton. Does more for music in an album than Elton John does in his entire career. Debate that if you want. I only need reel off Patton's body of work to show you that he's more talented, versatile, adaptable and genius than Elton John can hope to be.

Reel away my friend. I looked the both of them up in a google search, admittedly, because I don't know who he is. In more than one interview, he was compared to an early Elton John. Not only did the interviewer compare him to Elton John, but Patton himself(on more than one occasion) said that Elton John was a major musical force in his development. And several times stating that Elton John is his favorite singer. If you want the sites, I can PM then to you.


Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Jimi Hendrix for obvious reason.

Sure, I'll agree that Hendrix is a great player. In many ways, Elton is the Jimi Hendrix of the piano. Hendrix set his guitar on fire, Elton did the same with his piano. Actually, he blew it up. But, Jerry Lee Lewis did the same. Elton used a bottle of tequilla. Jimi played the guitar behind his back. Elton lays on top of the piano. He plays it from underneath the piano. He plays it backwards as well.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Billy Corgan.

I liked a couple of Smashing Pumpkin's songs. Tonight was genious.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Tool as a collective.

Yeah, I'm not sure wheter to take this one seriously or not. I know you do, so I will. However, I think you might want to ellaborate on this one too.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Rush as a collective.

No comment. But they look like a really old version of U2.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Elton John is like U2. Reputation legend, not talent legend. None of those bar Hendrix are as or more well known than Elton. Everyone of them are worlds more talented. Not even worth comparing.

-AC

I understand what you're trying to say. However, U2 (a band I actually like, I only own their double greatest hits, and even there there are probably on 7 or 8 songs I even listen to) is a band that has been caught up in the same money driven music industry that produced the Backstreet Boys and N'Sync. Music for profit. Now, they're alot better than the boy bands, but part of the same machine. Elton John however is part of the talented THEN profit group of artists. This group of artists who worked their asses off and were recognized by one record label and then worked their asses off to get the public to buy their albums. I understand that Mike Patton is likely the same kind of musician. That's why I had to look him up.

Don't assume that because Elton John is known in every part of the world, is one of the top selling artists of all time, has more platinum albums than most of his peers and has a thirty year career that he has been force fed to the public. Elton John sat down at the piano when he was four years old and started playing what he heard on the radio, by ear. Elton John didn't release his first album and shoot to super stardom. He released his second album and went to America, where he exploded into this huge sensation. Just like the Beatles and any number of other legendary artists. Now, I'm willing to admit he isn't really a god, but then again, no one is. I'm also willing to admit that he has released so shitty shitty albums. But, I also willing to bet that Jimi Hendrix would have to, if he hadn't died at such a young age.

I'm also willing to admit that Elton John is no David Bowie. He hasn't spawned a whole new genre of music. What Elton does is take music in his genre to a new level. Even Billy Joel has stated that his music went in a different direction because he saw what Elton John was doing and said if he took his music to a whole new level, then it would be a sad immitation of Elton John.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Reel away my friend. I looked the both of them up in a google search, admittedly, because I don't know who he is. In more than one interview, he was compared to an early Elton John. Not only did the interviewer compare him to Elton John, but Patton himself(on more than one occasion) said that Elton John was a major musical force in his development. And several times stating that Elton John is his favorite singer. If you want the sites, I can PM then to you.

Jimi had influences, he's still better than any of them. Comparing Patton to Elton John is seriously silly if you know who Mike Patton is.

Discography:
The Real Thing, Angel Dust, King for a Day Fool for a Lifetime, Album of the year all by Faith No More. Possibly and arguably the most influential band of the last decade or more.

Self titled, Disco Volante, California by Mr. Bungle. One of the most out there, afraid of nothing, experimental genius bands to exist.

Self titled, Mit Gas by Tomahawk. Rock, hard, but not like any other Hard Rock out there.

Amunaza Del Mundo, The Director's Cut, Delirivm Cordia, Suspended Animation by Fantomas. One of the craziest, most ambitious bands. Although that applies to every Patton band. Delirivm Cordia being one of the most frightening, disturbing, genius masterpieces of an album to ever be created.

Adult Themes for Voice, Pranza Oltranzista by Himself. Classical meets everything else in a car crash, basically. Sounds beautiful, astounding, insane. I'll keep going....

General Patton Vs The X-Ecutioners by Himself and The X-Ecutioners. Yes, a Hip Hop album better than most Hip Hop albums.

Irony Is a Dead Scene by The Dillinger Escape Plan and himself. Another giant slab of "Look what I can do because I'm a musical God."

Other albums include: Kaada-Patton collabo, he has collabo'd with Bjork, not to mention Dan the Automator with Lovage.

He's created more influencial, genius, broad, varied and adaptable music over his career than Elton John. Comparing the two is ridiculous.


Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Sure, I'll agree that Hendrix is a great player. In many ways, Elton is the Jimi Hendrix of the piano. Hendrix set his guitar on fire, Elton did the same with his piano. Actually, he blew it up. But, Jerry Lee Lewis did the same. Elton used a bottle of tequilla. Jimi played the guitar behind his back. Elton lays on top of the piano. He plays it from underneath the piano. He plays it backwards as well.

Elton John is the Jimi Hendrix of the Piano? Are you a joking? The man is a great pianist......that's it. He's no Tori Amos. Him playing piano in different positions doesn't equate to Hendrix's ability to create otherworldly guitar music. I could learn and easily play Elton John stuff. No guitarist could say the same with Hendrix.

Originally posted by Da Moose
Yeah, I'm not sure wheter to take this one seriously or not. I know you do, so I will. However, I think you might want to ellaborate on this one too.

Tool = The greatest band on Earth. Collectively more musically gifted than but a few bands. I view them as a whole, a musical God.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
No comment. But they look like a really old version of U2.

U2 aren't worthy of being Rush road crew.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
I understand what you're trying to say. However, U2 (a band I actually like, I only own their double greatest hits, and even there there are probably on 7 or 8 songs I even listen to) is a band that has been caught up in the same money driven music industry that produced the Backstreet Boys and N'Sync. Music for profit. Now, they're alot better than the boy bands, but part of the same machine. Elton John however is part of the talented THEN profit group of artists. This group of artists who worked their asses off and were recognized by one record label and then worked their asses off to get the public to buy their albums. I understand that Mike Patton is likely the same kind of musician. That's why I had to look him up.

Elton is talented, I respect the man and what he's done. I'd only call his reputation legendary though. Not his music. Because Mike Patton, if anyone, is worthy of the label musical God. On sheer ability alone.

Nobody is the same kind of musician as Mike Patton.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Don't assume that because Elton John is known in every part of the world, is one of the top selling artists of all time, has more platinum albums than most of his peers and has a thirty year career that he has been force fed to the public. Elton John sat down at the piano when he was four years old and started playing what he heard on the radio, by ear. Elton John didn't release his first album and shoot to super stardom. He released his second album and went to America, where he exploded into this huge sensation. Just like the Beatles and any number of other legendary artists. Now, I'm willing to admit he isn't really a god, but then again, no one is. I'm also willing to admit that he has released so shitty shitty albums. But, I also willing to bet that Jimi Hendrix would have to, if he hadn't died at such a young age.

Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa.

You can't sit there and say Jimi Hendrix would have released shit just because Elton has. The two shouldn't even be compared. I mentioned Hendrix coz you asked for my opinion on musical Gods.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
I'm also willing to admit that Elton John is no David Bowie. He hasn't spawned a whole new genre of music. What Elton does is take music in his genre to a new level. Even Billy Joel has stated that his music went in a different direction because he saw what Elton John was doing and said if he took his music to a whole new level, then it would be a sad immitation of Elton John.

Patton has spawned bands, genres, ways of making music.

Bands and genres exist because of Patton.

-AC

Of course Elton John can't create otherworldly music. He playing a piano. It's kinda hard to pull off a guitar rift on the piano. It's how he couples his piano with other instruments that give it other worldly sounds. And I've never heard backing vocals like his. Those alone are worthy of the highest praise.

Tool? Come on? Are YOU joking? There's nothing original about pissed off guys and 15 dueling guitars.

Tori Amos? Tori Amos would cream in her jeans to have Elton Johns talent.

And it's certainly possible that Jimi Hendrix would have released shit albums if had lived. Or, like so many other artists of his time, he would have dragged on and on, not releasing new music and playing the same songs of his five or six albums.(that's just an example, I don't know how many albums he released.) And I'm not saying that he could release shit becasue Elton has. I'm saying it's possible. You can't say for sure, can you?

And Elton has done a lot for music. He and his producer discovered that it was hard to get music from a piano to recor without pits in teh sound. So, they developed a double stack piano, that is still in use all over the world.

Basically, what the end result of you and I going back and forth is going to be that our opinions differ. We can go back and forth if you want, but at the end of it all, it's all going to be personal opinion. You can take that as me backing off, but it's isn't. I'm willing to go around and around.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Of course Elton John can't create otherworldly music. He playing a piano. It's kinda hard to pull off a guitar rift on the piano. It's how he couples his piano with other instruments that give it other worldly sounds. And I've never heard backing vocals like his. Those alone are worthy of the highest praise.

I've heard better backing vocals than his, miles better. I'm sure lots of people on this board can say the same thing. You had to Google Mike Patton and Rush so I'm not sure if you're coming to debate this with a limited view of music.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Tool? Come on? Are YOU joking? There's nothing original about pissed off guys and 15 dueling guitars.

I agree.

Say something about Tool though, that's the band I referenced.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Tori Amos? Tori Amos would cream in her jeans to have Elton Johns talent.

She wouldn't though would she? Lets be honest. Saying they're all lame compared to Elton doesn't work. Tori Amos is much more talented than Elton John. On the piano and as a songwriter.

You're just making blind jabs at anyone who isn't Elton without even knowing who they are or having listened to them in depth. Which is what you're doing and you've proven that.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
And it's certainly possible that Jimi Hendrix would have released shit albums if had lived. Or, like so many other artists of his time, he would have dragged on and on, not releasing new music and playing the same songs of his five or six albums.(that's just an example, I don't know how many albums he released.) And I'm not saying that he could release shit becasue Elton has. I'm saying it's possible. You can't say for sure, can you?

I'm not saying it isn't possible, I'm saying you've got a lot of nerve and gaul to assume he would just because Elton John has put out lots of it. If you release a hundred albums and 50 of them are good, it doesn't make you a good artist. Elton's shit has almost levelled his decent stuff, which is already way overrated.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
And Elton has done a lot for music. He and his producer discovered that it was hard to get music from a piano to recor without pits in teh sound. So, they developed a double stack piano, that is still in use all over the world.

Yeah, so they brought usage of an instrument about. Great.

Hardly the same as saying he's created genres, spawned bands and revolutionised genres. Coz he hasn't.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Basically, what the end result of you and I going back and forth is going to be that our opinions differ. We can go back and forth if you want, but at the end of it all, it's all going to be personal opinion. You can take that as me backing off, but it's isn't. I'm willing to go around and around.

Well, it's not. Because Elton isn't anywhere near worthy of Hendrix comparison, he's not worthy of Patton comparison, or any of those people I mentioned. The closest comparison is Tori Amos and if you wanna get technical she's better than him.

-AC

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic

Tool? Come on? Are YOU joking? There's nothing original about pissed off guys and 15 dueling guitars.


Little bit arrogant and ignorant to debate against an unknown opponent.

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Little bit arrogant and ignorant to debate against an unknown opponent.

In referrence to both of you. No, I have heard Tool. I have MTV. Nothing original about them, save their music videos from what I hear people say. I don't watch a lot of MTV.


Whisper: I told you I saw it somewhere. I hate to do it. Follow the link, and there is your review of Tumbleweed Connection

http://www.warr.org/elton.html#TumbleweedConnection

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
In referrence to both of you. No, I have heard Tool. I have MTV. Nothing original about them, save their music videos from what I hear people say. I don't watch a lot of MTV.

Like he said.

Arrogant to judge an unknown opponent. If all you know of Tool is what you've seen on MTV, you know next to nothing of them. Because to say they have no originality is absolutely preposterous.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I've heard better backing vocals than his, miles better. I'm sure lots of people on this board can say the same thing. You had to Google Mike Patton and Rush so I'm not sure if you're coming to debate this with a limited view of music.



I agree.

Say something about Tool though, that's the band I referenced.



She wouldn't though would she? Lets be honest. Saying they're all lame compared to Elton doesn't work. Tori Amos is much more talented than Elton John. On the piano and as a songwriter.

You're just making blind jabs at anyone who isn't Elton without even knowing who they are or having listened to them in depth. Which is what you're doing and you've proven that.



I'm not saying it isn't possible, I'm saying you've got a lot of nerve and gaul to assume he would just because Elton John has put out lots of it. If you release a hundred albums and 50 of them are good, it doesn't make you a good artist. Elton's shit has almost levelled his decent stuff, which is already way overrated.



Yeah, so they brought usage of an instrument about. Great.

Hardly the same as saying he's created genres, spawned bands and revolutionised genres. Coz he hasn't.



Well, it's not. Because Elton isn't anywhere near worthy of Hendrix comparison, he's not worthy of Patton comparison, or any of those people I mentioned. The closest comparison is Tori Amos and if you wanna get technical she's better than him.

-AC

Come on AC, you're full of shit. I also realize that we are not of the same opinion. Unlike yourself, I'm not trying to insult you for your opinion, am I? But, give me a few minutes and I'll show you how many bands and artist were influenced by Elton John.

As for my musical influences, I have a variety. I know I'm arguing for Elton in this thread, but I am not limited in my appreciation for other music.

By all means, feel free to tell me what musical genres this Patton fellow has created.

And I stand by my opinion that Tool is shit.

As for me making "blind jabs" at people who aren't Elton, I did no such thing. I admitted that I didn't know who this Mike Patton fellow was. So, I looked him up. And what I found was article after article about how Elton John was a major influence in his life. So, you could say that an indirect way, one of his contributions to music IS people like Mike Patton..from Pattons own mouth! Conversely, what do you know about Elton John's music? You wouldn't make ignorant statements like: "Elton John is just a reputation", not inspired music. Rush: I have heard of Rush, I just don't listen to theri music. You hear the names of bands on the radio, you can change the station without knowing what they look like.

And I'm fighting an uphill battle. I've mentioned one of my musical influences. You're using 4 or 5 of yours. But I have others. David Bowie, John Lennon, Gregg Alexander, The Beatles, Billy Joel, Sting, DJ Milky, Moby, Jerry Lee Lewis, Dirty Vegas, Eric Clapton. And I would take Elton over any of them.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Like he said.

Arrogant to judge an unknown opponent. If all you know of Tool is what you've seen on MTV, you know next to nothing of them. Because to say they have no originality is absolutely preposterous.

-AC

Originality doesn't denote musical greatness. Yoko Ono was original, what do you think of her?

Exactly.

Thanks for posting what I hoped you would.

We're not discussing originality are we? You brought it up.

If you think Elton John is a better musician than anyone of Tool, you obviously lack talent perception. He plays piano well. That's it.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Exactly.

Thanks for posting what I hoped you would.

We're not discussing originality are we? You brought it up.

If you think Elton John is a better musician than anyone of Tool, you obviously lack talent perception. He plays piano well. That's it.

-AC

Yes, I said original, but I was reffering to what people have said about them. Not what I think. I don't think much of them. In ten years, you look back and we'll see who is still around and who has been left on the pop rock pile of obscurity.
Speaking of which, is that tool in Doom's signature?

Talent perception? What makes yours more valid than mine?

Piano? And that's it? Go out there and find me some evidence from a known musical talent professional that says that Tool is more infulential or talented than any of the people I've mention.

You cannot compare musicians of different instruments, and especially of completely different genres. I love Tool, I find them fascinating and I think Danny is one of the greatest drummers ever. I would give anything for just a fraction of his talent. But you cannot compare them to Elton John because they are complete opposites. They are all great at what they do, however.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Yes, I said original, but I was reffering to what people have said about them. Not what I think. I don't think much of them. In ten years, you look back and we'll see who is still around and who has been left on the pop rock pile of obscurity.
Speaking of which, is that tool in Doom's signature?

Yeah, ironically Tool have been around since 92. *Tumbleweed*

Haha. No it's not. It's Mike Patton, Chris Cornell, Maynard James Keenan (of Tool) and Jeff Buckley. 4 of the greatest singers of all time. Rather uninformed aren't you?

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Talent perception? What makes yours more valid than mine?

Piano? And that's it? Go out there and find me some evidence from a known musical talent professional that says that Tool is more infulential or talented than any of the people I've mention.

Mine's more valid because I know and have listened to Tool. You have heard the odd song on MTV which is basically saying they're unknown to you. I said if you think Elton John is musically more gifted than Tool then you have no talent perception or a lack of.

Why do I need evidence from a known musical talent professional? It's still gonna be someone commenting. I know that no bands are scientifically provable to be better than another but Tool are more musically talented than Elton John.

It's just stupid to think otherwise. Not saying you are stupid, just a stupid opinion.

Tool have been hailed numerous times as the most important band in the world.

This isn't about who is more influencial, not that Elton would win because he isn't. It's about you calling him a God, he's not. Because he's just a legend. Yes, JUST a legend. He's rated for antiquity more than talent because as far as talent goes, he's not what you claim he is.

You googled pictures and write-ups of almost everyone I've mentioned thus far. I suggest you listen extensively to the albums before you debate on the artist.

You have no valid opinion on Tool because.....well.....you don't know who they are and frankly, I mean no offense, but I think you're being biased toward Elton John.

-AC

Elton has a couple good songs.. not a huge fan or anything.

Let it not be come across that I'm disrespecting the man.

I've repeatedly said that.

I do think it's near academic that putting him to Tool is just overrating though.

I respect that others don't agree AKA Capt, but I just think it's too obvious.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yeah, ironically Tool have been around since 92. *Tumbleweed*

Haha. No it's not. It's Mike Patton, Chris Cornell, Maynard James Keenan (of Tool) and Jeff Buckley. 4 of the greatest singers of all time. Rather uninformed aren't you?



Mine's more valid because I know and have listened to Tool. You have heard the odd song on MTV which is basically saying they're unknown to you. I said if you think Elton John is musically more gifted than Tool then you have no talent perception or a lack of.

Why do I need evidence from a known musical talent professional? It's still gonna be someone commenting. I know that no bands are scientifically provable to be better than another but Tool are more musically talented than Elton John.

It's just stupid to think otherwise. Not saying you are stupid, just a stupid opinion.

Tool have been hailed numerous times as the most important band in the world.

This isn't about who is more influencial, not that Elton would win because he isn't. It's about you calling him a God, he's not. Because he's just a legend. Yes, JUST a legend. He's rated for antiquity more than talent because as far as talent goes, he's not what you claim he is.

You googled pictures and write-ups of almost everyone I've mentioned thus far. I suggest you listen extensively to the albums before you debate on the artist.

You have no valid opinion on Tool because.....well.....you don't know who they are and frankly, I mean no offense, but I think you're being biased toward Elton John.

-AC

What's the "tumbleweed" comment about?

Oh no, I assumes at least the third guy in his sig was a member of tool, because you posted a picture of yourself in the same get up in the picture thread. You're right, I don't know what these people look like. But, my radio doesn't have a picture display. The music channels on cable only display a picture of the album cover in teh top left corner of the screen. Not the best way to know what someone looks like.

If there is no way to scientifically prove that one band is better than another, then you have no factual basis to say that Tool is better. Much less that I have a lack of talent perception, because that is only limited to the person listening to the music. As I said before, it's an opinion.

Elton John has been hailed as one of the most important rock atrists by numerous people and articles. In fact, he's been hailed as one of the most important artists in rock since his first american review, in 1970. When John Lennon met him, he fell on his knees at the bottom of the steps of the airplane.

I also suggest that you listen extensivly to Elton John. I have 54 of his albums. If you want me to burn you some copies, I'd be happy to. Because as little as I know about Tool, you know just as little about Elton.

And I'll never say I'm not biased towards Elton John. But, there is some basis to my biased. But when people say that he's a okay, I'll leave it at that. but when peole say that there's a better rock/pop/ballad piano player anywhere in the world, then that simply is not true. That is a stupid opinion. And I'm not the only one that would say that.

What it reminds me of is when I was in high school and people would ask "hey, who's your favorite artist?" And I'd say, "Elton John". They'd go: "What?! The Lion King Guy? Isn't he gay?" And it was their total lack of musical knowledge that gave them that opinion.

And if I'm being biased against Tool, because Elton John is my favorite, then Ac, you are guilty of the same with Tool. They're your favorite, and Elton is mine.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
If there is no way to scientifically prove that one band is better than another, then you have no factual basis to say that Tool is better. Much less that I have a lack of talent perception, because that is only limited to the person listening to the music. As I said before, it's an opinion.

I cannot prove Tool make better music no. Then again, you can't prove Elton John makes better music than Britney. He does though doesn't he? We just know that.

Tool are actually more instrumentally gifted than Elton though.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Elton John has been hailed as one of the most important rock atrists by numerous people and articles. In fact, he's been hailed as one of the most important artists in rock since his first american review, in 1970. When John Lennon met him, he fell on his knees at the bottom of the steps of the airplane.

Yeah but John Lennon, a musician I admire, respect and for the most part I love his music. There's another one who's overrated. Imagine wins best song ever almost everytime. It's just not, it's nowhere near. John Lennon loving him doesn't mean Elton John is any better than I claim he is.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
I also suggest that you listen extensivly to Elton John. I have 54 of his albums. If you want me to burn you some copies, I'd be happy to. Because as little as I know about Tool, you know just as little about Elton.

Whoa, major ignorance there.

I know more of Elton John and Tool than you know of the pair. You know more of Elton than I, I know more of Tool than you. At least I know of Elton fairly well though, you know nothing of Tool. Either way, knowing alot or not, Elton John isn't as instrumentally gifted as Tool. Nor is he, in my opinion (which I believe to be pretty academic) anywhere near as talented.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
And I'll never say I'm not biased towards Elton John. But, there is some basis to my biased. But when people say that he's a okay, I'll leave it at that. but when peole say that there's a better rock/pop/ballad piano player anywhere in the world, then that simply is not true. That is a stupid opinion. And I'm not the only one that would say that.

So? Your opinion that Elton John should be mentioned in the same vein as Hendrix, Tool and Patton is more stupid than someone saying "Elton John isn't the best" at whatever.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
What it reminds me of is when I was in high school and people would ask "hey, who's your favorite artist?" And I'd say, "Elton John". They'd go: "What?! The Lion King Guy? Isn't he gay?" And it was their total lack of musical knowledge that gave them that opinion.

And if I'm being biased against Tool, because Elton John is my favorite, then Ac, you are guilty of the same with Tool. They're your favorite, and Elton is mine.

I don't judge favourite though. Tool are my favourite band but there have been better bands as far as musicianship go. There aren't many, but there have been.

You're just cloudy visioning it.

-AC

A band can have all the instrumental talent in the world and still make bad, boring music. Songwriting ability is really just as important in the long run.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I cannot prove Tool make better music no. Then again, you can't prove Elton John makes better music than Britney. He does though doesn't he? We just know that.

No, YOU just know that. There are people out there who think that Britney makes better music than Elton. I'm gay, I've run into them before. That doesn't mean that they can't have their opinion. And it doesn't mean that they can't find someone out there who agrees with them.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Tool are actually more instrumentally gifted than Elton though.

Once again, this is your opinion. Just as Elton being better is mine. How many of the members of tool just sat down in front of the instrument they play and just started to play it? Elton was four when his mom was "hoovering" (as they say in your part of the world) she told him to get off the floor and sit on the piano bench until she was done. By the time she had fininshed vacuuming, she noticed he was playing the jingle that was on the radio.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yeah but John Lennon, a musician I admire, respect and for the most part I love his music. There's another one who's overrated. Imagine wins best song ever almost everytime. It's just not, it's nowhere near. John Lennon loving him doesn't mean Elton John is any better than I claim he is.

You're saying you are a better judge of musical talent than John Lennon? And don't sacrifice your opinion of Lennon to drive your point that Tool is the greatest EVER!

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Whoa, major ignorance there.

I know more of Elton John and Tool than you know of the pair. You know more of Elton than I, I know more of Tool than you. At least I know of Elton fairly well though, you know nothing of Tool. Either way, knowing alot or not, Elton John isn't as instrumentally gifted as Tool. Nor is he, in my opinion (which I believe to be pretty academic) anywhere near as talented.

You know more of the pair than I do? Please AC, get over yourself. What makes your opinion academic? Were you accepted to Royal Academy of music when you were 11, like Elton was? That's academic. I said originally, unclearly I know, that Elton John was a musical god...by this I meant he was one of MY musical gods. I never said that my opinion was academic. I'm sure there are a lot of music professors out there going: "Hey, you know, those Tool chaps have such dynamic and profound chords! Why, let's write them into musical history!" It's just not happening. Elton however, perfected his playing by studying with those kinds of people.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
So? Your opinion that Elton John should be mentioned in the same vein as Hendrix, Tool and Patton is more stupid than someone saying "Elton John isn't the best" at whatever.

Yes. I believe that Elton is as talented at his instrument as Hendrix was at his. I think you might need to re examine saying that Tool is as good as Elton John. And I don't know Patton. I said as much. I can't say he isn't as good as Elton. But, what I do know is that he himself has said that Elton John was one of his major influences and that he was one of the greatest singers. So, to argue that is like disagreeing with the musical talent you claim to be the pinnicle of your musical influence.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I don't judge favourite though. Tool are my favourite band but there have been better bands as far as musicianship go. There aren't many, but there have been.

So, you're saying that you don't judge by favorite, but Tool is your favorite and they just happen(suddenly) to only be ONE OF the greatest bands of all time, more gifted than ALMOST anyone who comes before or after?

What a lame argument...

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
No, YOU just know that. There are people out there who think that Britney makes better music than Elton. I'm gay, I've run into them before. That doesn't mean that they can't have their opinion. And it doesn't mean that they can't find someone out there who agrees with them.

They can have their opinion. There is such thing as a shit opinion though. There are something that are as close to fact as you'll get without them actually being facts. I'd say Britney being shit is one.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Once again, this is your opinion. Just as Elton being better is mine. How many of the members of tool just sat down in front of the instrument they play and just started to play it? Elton was four when his mom was "hoovering" (as they say in your part of the world) she told him to get off the floor and sit on the piano bench until she was done. By the time she had fininshed vacuuming, she noticed he was playing the jingle that was on the radio.

Yeah, he's a great pianist. I never said he wasn't, I am a pianist and I respect him greatly. There are better though, better musicians. Tool put out better music.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
You're saying you are a better judge of musical talent than John Lennon? And don't sacrifice your opinion of Lennon to drive your point that Tool is the greatest EVER!

I'm saying I'm a judge of musical talent, we all are. John Lennon loving the man doesn't make him any better. Britney Spears could buy a Tool CD, it doesn't mean she has great music taste. Just means she hit the one great band.

Just we both know, isn't proveable. Elton John being as great as you claim isn't one of those near-fact things though, because it's easily deniable when you compare him to others.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
You know more of the pair than I do? Please AC, get over yourself. What makes your opinion academic? Were you accepted to Royal Academy of music when you were 11, like Elton was? That's academic. I said originally, unclearly I know, that Elton John was a musical god...by this I meant he was one of MY musical gods. I never said that my opinion was academic. I'm sure there are a lot of music professors out there going: "Hey, you know, those Tool chaps have such dynamic and profound chords! Why, let's write them into musical history!" It's just not happening. Elton however, perfected his playing by studying with those kinds of people.

If he's one of yours, that's all well and good.

You know nothing of half of what we're debating. Essentially Elton John.......Vs Tool. I know about more about Elton than you know of Tool, and more of Tool than you know of Tool, which is nothing.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Yes. I believe that Elton is as talented at his instrument as Hendrix was at his. I think you might need to re examine saying that Tool is as good as Elton John. And I don't know Patton. I said as much. I can't say he isn't as good as Elton. But, what I do know is that he himself has said that Elton John was one of his major influences and that he was one of the greatest singers. So, to argue that is like disagreeing with the musical talent you claim to be the pinnicle of your musical influence.

No pianist can ever be as good as a guitarist like Hendrix. Purely coz of instruments involved. Elton John hasn't done stuff on a piano that has never been surpassed. Jimi Hendrix has.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
So, you're saying that you don't judge by favorite, but Tool is your favorite and they just happen(suddenly) to only be ONE OF the greatest bands of all time, more gifted than ALMOST anyone who comes before or after?

You wanna make the connection? You do that.

I love music enough to not be biased when it comes down to talent. If you wanna assume that's what I'm doing, do so.

-AC

how do you compare Tool and Elton John... those are 2 completely different musicians.. you cant compare

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
They can have their opinion. There is such thing as a shit opinion though. There are something that are as close to fact as you'll get without them actually being facts. I'd say Britney being shit is one.



Yeah, he's a great pianist. I never said he wasn't, I am a pianist and I respect him greatly. There are better though, better musicians. Tool put out better music.



I'm saying I'm a judge of musical talent, we all are. John Lennon loving the man doesn't make him any better. Britney Spears could buy a Tool CD, it doesn't mean she has great music taste. Just means she hit the one great band.

Just we both know, isn't proveable. Elton John being as great as you claim isn't one of those near-fact things though, because it's easily deniable when you compare him to others.



If he's one of yours, that's all well and good.

You know nothing of half of what we're debating. Essentially Elton John.......Vs Tool. I know about more about Elton than you know of Tool, and more of Tool than you know of Tool, which is nothing.



No pianist can ever be as good as a guitarist like Hendrix. Purely coz of instruments involved. Elton John hasn't done stuff on a piano that has never been surpassed. Jimi Hendrix has.



You wanna make the connection? You do that.

I love music enough to not be biased when it comes down to talent. If you wanna assume that's what I'm doing, do so.

-AC

Good argument AC, we'll get back to it tomorrow. I have to get in the shower. It's almost 6:30, I have to go out. I think we've been arguing all day. See you then. And I didn't make that connection, you did.

Never got why people did that.

Of course you can compare. American and England are two different countries, comparisons happen all the time.

-AC

i hate it when ppl have to tell us they are showering or they are going... uck!

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic

Yes. I believe that Elton is as talented at his instrument as Hendrix was at his.

Possibly the most laughable thing I have read on this forum.

Out of interest, could you post the links to these myriad articles where Mike Patton cites Reg as an influence? As far as I was aware, I had read most of the interviews the man has done, so this is something I'd like to read.

Sure they'll make interesting reading.

http://www.flashinghobo.com/patton_interview.htm

http://jimmartin.tarantella.net/articles/fnm/1995/950300SM.htm

http://www.digitaldreamdoor.com/pages/best_z-prev/ly_lyricists2.html

http://www.cv.org/index.php?page=4&subject=Mike%20Patton

http://jimmartin.tarantella.net/articles/solo/guitmag.htm

http://www.live-aid.info/rewind/bbc/pages/060eltonjohn.html

There are more if you want them.

Originally posted by Morning_Glory
i hate it when ppl have to tell us they are showering or they are going... uck!

It's okay, I don't mind if you picture me in the shower.

A) The first one (I've scanned it 3 times) doesn't show him citing Elton as a major major influence.

B) The second one states he was a big fan. Not that he cited him as a major major influence, because as he isn't. It's evident from the music.

C) Third is a list voted for by loads of yahoos. Have you bothered to read the other lists? Alot of their choices are by reputation. Rarely do they hit the mark. For the most part they don't have a clue. Have you seen the drummers, guitarist and bassist polls? Some of their decisions are terrible. Not to mention you posting that doesn't prove Elton John has been cited as a major major influence, as you claim. But let's continue...

D) Once again, it shows he's a fan. So what? Where is he saying that Elton John is a major influence to what he creates? Are you making a blind connection?

E) "Patton's favourite singers are Elton John..." Yeah? So? I have favourites. Favourite doesn't equal inspiration. 5 interviews of nothing as far as backing up your claims go. Can we make it a 6th?

F) Not too sure what you're trying to prove with this. Just see that there's a David Patton on bass. Let's hope I'm overlooking what you're trying to show me.

So once again I make a request, can you show me where it shows Mike Patton citing Elton John as this major, major influence that you claim he is?

Elton John would, to steal your phrase, cream his pants to have Mike Patton's talent. Ironically, all the interviews you posted show why. The man is world's more talented and varied.

-AC

The point of all of them is that Patton repeatedly states that he a big fan, then there are reviews by a number of people that state that he has released songs that sound like Elton John. I searcehed the net for reviews where anyone made a statement that "Elton seems to have been influence by former "faith No More frontman Mike Patton. (granted, I'm sure their opinions are less academic than your own) However, there are dozens of reviews in which people say "Patton seems to have been influenced by Elton John. Now, I know it's a huge leap here, but when an artist states that he's a big fan of someone, that he's one of his favorite singers, then has a review from several sources stating that some of his music sounds like that artist...it's a pretty safe bet that he has been influenced by that artist.

There was a cybertalk chat transcript with a group called Mr Bungle, in which Patton says that he was influenced by Elton John. I'm gonna keep looking for it. I think I saved that live aide url instead of that one. Clearly, I realize that David Patton isn't the same guy.

Yeah he is a big fan, so what?

A few people say a couple of songs sound akin to Elton John. Yeah? And?

Where does it show, in anything you've produced, that Elton John is a major influence to the bodies of music that Mike Patton creates? It doesn't because he's not. This coming from someone who knows more about Mike Patton and his music than you do, Mr. Had to Google him.

You're missing the point. Reviewers saying he SEEMS to be influenced by Elton John (and there aren't huge amounts) and him being a major influence over Patton's works (which was your claim) are two vastly different ball parks. Patton's a fan and the song Pink Cigarette by Mr. Bungle was said to sound vaguely like an Elton John song. He's not a major major influence and if you're gonna continue to be so deluded in claiming so, knock yourself out. But don't bring it up if you can't prove it.

Why is it a safe bet that he's influenced majorly, just because a few reviewers happened to say the ODD SONG sounds like an Elton John song? You're making a very blind and presumptuous, benefit of the doubt, biased connection.

-AC

Why don't you knock me out. Because I'm not going to stop. As soon as you admit that you think Mike Patton and Tool are th egreatest bands in the world because they're your favorites, then I'll admit that I am wrong.

I'm not asking you to stop.

You carry on all you want my friend. Your sheer pig ignorance in claiming that my respect and admiration for those artists is my reason for rating them so highly is your downfall.

You are biased toward Elton John, admittedly. Just because you can't get over your favouritism and see who is the more talented, regardless, doesn't mean I'm doing the same and if you're being so deluded in thinking so, then I pity you.

You've already admitted you're wrong, I've proven you wrong. Even with 6 or more interviews you couldn't prove shit. So what you think of my standpoint is irrelevant.

-AC

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
http://www.flashinghobo.com/patton_interview.htm

http://jimmartin.tarantella.net/articles/fnm/1995/950300SM.htm

http://www.digitaldreamdoor.com/pages/best_z-prev/ly_lyricists2.html

http://www.cv.org/index.php?page=4&subject=Mike%20Patton

http://jimmartin.tarantella.net/articles/solo/guitmag.htm

http://www.live-aid.info/rewind/bbc/pages/060eltonjohn.html

There are more if you want them.

Perhaps some that say he was an influence, as requested.

mmm...this certainly got heated...as expected

as i previously stated..there are only a couple of eltons songs that i like...rocketman and daniel being 2 and there are a couple more

as a musician he does have talent on the piano but i think that is overshadowed by his image...he is known more for his lairy costumes than having a musical skill

this image isnt neccessarily a bad thing however as it has given him a massive celebrity status that he has managed to use for good causes both in promoting new music and also helps him raise money for charity

i suppose through this he can be seen as sacrificing the art of the music for other aspects of fame and perhaps criticism can be levied at him for that...i know AC is very passionate about people who do not respect the art of music and use it only as an attempt to legitimise their self promotion and desperate fame seeking and as such make crap music

saying that...i dont think Elton is guilty of making crap music

as for Tool...i will admit to having heard little of them and what i have heard i havent really connected with as its not really my "type" of music

but as musicians they are indeed talented as many musicians of many genre's are

i dont think talent can be solely defined to how many techniques you know on your chosen instrument or how many instruments you play...these are superfluous to the debate

take a simple argument...who is the better guitarist...joe satriani or jimi hendrix

i have no doubt that satriani can play faster and has more techniques than hendrix (and i have many albums by both so i can say this pretty much for certain)...but i still think hendrix is a far more talented musician simply cause he could write an emotion into his music that satriani fails to touch

It shouldn't have even really come down to Elton John Vs Tool because it is and always will be a silly debate. Nobody is ever gonna accept that I'm saying that unbiasedly though, so won't dwell on it.

I know technique doesn't equate to quality, I found myself constantly reminding people on this forum of it a while back. However, Elton John has some great songs, some great albums. He's not what Capt is making him out to be. He's certainly no "major, major" influence of Mike Patton's music.

-AC