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I have a question for all you KMCers. In the book "1984," the character Big Brother is a mysterious man who rules his country with an iron fist, but keeps his people under the illusion that they are free. Note that he is the leader who is actually in power at the moment. Now, this is just a quick question. The two main contenders in the 2004 presidential election are President George W Bush, and Senator John Kerry.

So the question is... If we were to pretend for just a moment that we lived in Oceania (the country from 1984), which of the aforementioned contenders do you think would be most accurately called "Big Brother"? Pretend also that you know nothing about either candidate except their current position in the federal government. Note I am not taking sides politically, I do not necessarily think either Bush or Kerry are like Big Brother. I am just curious which you think could be most accurately called Big Brother right now.

What do you all think?

iron fist...well its obvious MF DOOM is the next president...or the guy with the harmonica

Dammit I can't say Bush AND partisan bastard!

the answer is obvious PRESIDENT george bush

seeing as he has the higher rank people would trust him more knowing nothing about him of course

Or Tom Morello

Tpt>

Bush sucks. Kerry sucks. The American government and society sucks. I dont want to sound like an anarchist because im not, but our government today sucks ass dude.

ehh... I think people are missing the point of the thread... I'm not saying "who's better, Bush or Kerry".

I think it's obvious lol.

Tom Morello for president!!!

(he actually grew up right by where I live )

Really? There are no good rockstars from where I am

Wow, that's the most valid reason I've seen so far.



Not.

CandyKorn, it's a JOKE.

Nivek -- yep, he grew up in Libertyville, IL, which is about an hour-hour and a half from where I live. Living near Chicago means there's lots of musicians from the area

Shame. If only you could pick up Sarcasm from text.

Sometimes people use "sarcasm tags"... Like they say

"I love Britney Spears soooooo much"

heehee

Too much sugar fruits_apple

OOO OOOO DEFTONES ARE FROM WERE I LIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!droolio

and tesla

o wow! i have chumbawumba! and black sabbath about 40 miles away

you tricky blah blah blah nono

*regrets putting last option in poll*

I don't trust either if them!

id like bush whether he was in bold or not.

*smacks forehead*

That's not the point. Pretend that you know nothing about either candidate except their current positions in the federal government. Which one then, paying very close attention to the above rule, could be more accurately called "Big Brother"?

i can't answer that because you smaked my head so hard i have a mild concussion... cant...talk...

I was smacking my own forehead, silly tongue

Yea well Zack was born in my city! so PHHHT

No fair cry

Random bumpage. turned

I actually have this theory that "Big Brother" doesn't exist, he's just a fake character (a figurehead, if you will) the government in Oceania created...but that's not particularly relevant to this conversation.

Well, using your definitions, Kevin...isn't Bush the only one who fits those qualifications?

This is my point

Actually, yes, I've thought about Big Brother being a made up character myself, but it's kinda irrelevant to this topic

YOU ROCK BIG TIME!

I don't know wtf you are talking about. You simply cannot call Kerry "Big Brother," I don't give a shit how much you hate him, because he's not the president! Plus, Bush has done many more Big Brother-ish things than any Democratic president. Like the Patriot Act. And going off to war for no reason.

War is peace--Bush sent us to two wars, in Iraq and in Afghanistan.
Freedom is slavery--The Patriot Act... Need I say more?
Ignorance is strength--(which you have conveniently omitted) Bush has destroyed our school system with No Child Left Behind.

Hence, even if you like the two wars, the Patriot Act, and No Child Left Behind, there is no way you can within reason call Kerry "Big Brother".

The poll said or inleast the topis is about which one do we think is like big brother.And I said Kerry!Belive me I don't hate him but I think if he had the change (or for that matter)if any of the dems had a change they would turn the states into commentist just like the book.j
Why because there are so many thngs the dems like they like haveing control over the people telling them to do this and that.
Read the book and you will see what I am talking about.Anyway Bush may have war(that you guys kept saying because you can't think of anything else to hate him for)
But that ha nothering to do with him being like big brother.The Republicans for not for themselves!They are for all of us and there was no way they would control us just like the book.
Because in fact Kerry would!If you had not read the book I would not suggust you answear this thread.JM

Ehh? You are rather uninformed, aren't you?

First of all, will you please tell me what a "commentist" is?

Second, if you meant "communist", you are also wrong, because the government in Oceania is not a communist state, it is an authoritarian dictatorship. There is a HUGE difference.

Third, if you have ever heard a single argument between two reasonably intelligent people of differing opinions on Bush, you would know that you are absolutely wrong about saying liberals only hate him because of the war. We hate him because he trashed the economy, education, the environment, our standing with the rest of the world, he pretty much completely voided the Bill of Rights with our buddy the Patriot Act... I could go on much longer.

Fourth, I have read the book, and I am perfectly aware who Big Brother is. Moreso than you are, apparently.

Fifth, your argument about Democrats wanting control over the people is completely inane... It was a Republican president who, as I have said before, signed the Patriot Act. You probably don't know what it does, do you? Well, basically, it lets the cops come into your house, search it without a warrant, arrest you without a warrant, and drag you off to some prison. They don't have to tell you where you are, or what you're there for, you can't call anybody, and probably worst of all, they can keep you there for however long they want. Theoretically they could keep you in prison for the rest of your life without anybody even knowing you were there... And they have been arresting people for completely retarded reasons. At least a few nonviolent protests (freedom of speech) have turned into free-for-alls where the police have arrested whoever they wanted to. Oh, and the democrats are generally in opposition of the death penalty, which the republicans are generally in favor of. (in the book, they shoot you in the back of the neck if you do anything wrong) So good job making an idiot of yourself

EDIT: One more thing... How you could have possibly missed my point in the original post, what with "in power" and "President" being in bold is beyond me.

Jackie, why do you choose to stay ignorant? You have completely missed the entire point of Orwell's novel. If you had to choose between Bush or Kerry as to which was more like Big Brother, you should either pick Kerry, or you should go find someone who can read to tell you what happens.

Its a lot easier not to question things like your government... they are big and strong and its hard to try change anything. Does that mean its right? You need to be able to question everything that you know. You need to be able to accept that everything you've been taught is wrong. This does not mean that everything you know is wrong, or what you've been taught is all false... but you need to be able to challenge these beliefs and learn. There is honestly no reason that anyone who understands the book 1984 should confuse John Kerry with Big Brother, especially if choosing George Bush is the other option. You obviously are not familiar with the Patriot Act and the abuses that it has allowed and are not seeing what is really happening. I can understand people supporting Bush if they arent bull shitting around. I know people who are bush supporters that are as well informed as I am about the kind of shit he has been pulling... they dont care, thats why they like the guy. You are not like those guys Jackie. You dont have your undergraduate degree in Political Science and you dont know what is going on. Learn some more, read some good books... but keep your mind open. Its fine if you perfer Bush, I dont agree with you there politically, but thats fine. Its just really a sad day when there is some one out there who is young and has potential, but is blind because they believe everything their government tells them. If you didnt get the book the first time, thats cool... I've read that book about a half dozen times and something new sticks out at me each time I read it. I suggest you read it again, even if you think you got the point the first time... and read some more good books that should get you thinking politically.