Toxin

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.



mr.marvel
hi,i have an unhealthy addiction to the Venom Carnage series.and i love the character of toxin.simply because instead of the host being a suicidal man with vengace for peter parker an insane murderer,it was giving to a cop.someone who lives an average life with his wife and new born baby.what i want is peoples opinions on toxin.and what is to become of him.

shaber
If they were going to expand on the series in that manner they should have allowed the alien to bond with someone worse than the Carnage host.

fever red
I disagree. Kasady is as bad as it gets- short of Hitler.
Having a vigilante, a killer, and an upstanding citizen is a lovely triangle of continous energy/exchange/conflict- a complete circuit, with so much power running through it, it could blow any minute.

FeceMan
He could have bonded to Vlad the Impaler smile.

hotsauce6548
I think it's hot how Toxin fought Venom and Carnage with Spider-Man. I think it would be cool to have a symbiote as a good guy for a change.

Nataku8188
Toxin is gay. I wish Carnage would just tear his head off and be done with it.

mr.marvel
i agree with hotsauce.sure carnage and venom are badasses but change is good.

FeceMan
If I had a symbiote, I would have him steal computer parts and build me a computer. If the symbiote was a she, I would have her cook me some dinner. And then we could go and destroy stuff.

fever red
It's like you've read my Big Mess fan fiction...but how?

shaber
Saddam Hussein is of that mould smile

VENOMfan
"i appologizre beforehand in drunk"

Toxin is a great character "visually" and a genuine good guy who is bonded too a symbiote has great potential, sort of like lethal protector but........actually protects people and dosent kill.

tho I disagree with his mopping the floor with Carnage in part 3 and 4, and since when does Black Cat EVER effect the oputcome of fights envuolving Venom and Spiderman. I remember him planting her like a shrub but this is all taken like a grain of salt. other wise Venom Carnage was a damn good story, and the art was spectacular

FeceMan
I hate Black Cat. She sucks. smile

fever red
About whipping Kasady- I have not read the story yet. However; it's my understanding that Kasady's current symbiote is not one that was gestated on earth. Shouldn't this mean Carnage is now stronger than Venom ONLY because of his insanity, and therefore, it's reasonable that Toxin might outclass him?
In this, it is supportable.
However, it's bad for drama. You want the hero to be the underdog, struggling, and achieving a significant victory. Now, a lot of set-up will be necessary to establish that kind of situation in future Toxin vs. Carnage clashes.

shaber
It would have made more sense for it to have been gestated on Earth messed

spider-venom
on marveldirectory.com it says nothing about toxin, i think hes not gonna be known like venom and carnage. after this i bet toxin wont ever be mentioned again.
although it was a great idea and i love the fact that hes a cop and just a normal guy ....

but i bet if the story goes on that the symbiote will start to take over this guys mind and wont be able to control the symbiote to use it for good.......when spider-man had venom's symbiote for that short while, it took over his mind and spider-man and hes not a bad person. so eventually this cop wont be able to control the symbiote and he even knows. he leaves his wife and child because he fears that it would take over his mind..my theory is that the symbiote takes control of this guys mind so far that he cant even control it anymore, so the symbiote eventually goes to venom and carnage and they tell them lies about spider-man and therefore toxin becomes one of spideys most toughest villain's ever.....on the other hand it could go like, the cop is able to control it and fights along side with spidey ....but it clearly shows that toxin could take spidey venom and carnage on by him self and win easily
it would be nice to see toxin some more...but i highly doubt it

Spidey Brock
At first I was looking forward to this miniseries. But now that I've read it. It sucks. You had Venom, the original, the Lethal Protector of the innocents. Then you got Carnage, maniac. Meh......I think it should have stopped there. But no, Venom names his grandson Toxin. A cop who could kill his family in an instant but still protects the innocents. What I see here is somewhat of a pattern. A Lethal Protector (Venom)who kills criminals, a maniac who slaughters innocent bystanders (Carnage) and now Toxin a protector of the people who doesn't kill anyone. That, for me, ruined the whole symbiote personality for me. That kinda breaks the mold. Toxin just kinda blows.

Prediction: If a writer has the balls to create a new symbiote, it will be named Mayhem. That's just an assumption.

CKayote
Toxin will be forgotten like some many other interesting characters over the years. Maybe if we're lucky we'll get an action figure.

[email protected]

mordamor22
Can I see any pics?

Next Venom_girl
I wonder what would happen if Toxin ran into some of the other members of the symbiote family such as Hybrid or even Scream.

Next Venom_girl
Here's the other pic I could find:

CKayote
I hope we get to find out.

I'll post some scans for VvsC this evening for Mordamor.

[email protected]

Next Venom_girl
Anyone else notice how Toxin colors Red and blue-black (besides the family resemblence to Venom and Carnage) looks like Spider-man.

Next Venom_girl
Here's another picture of Toxin.

Next Venom_girl
Here's another.

Next Venom_girl
And yet another...

CKayote
Here the promised scans:

1)

CKayote
2)

CKayote
3)

CKayote
4)

CKayote
5)

CKayote
*Looks at Next Venom Girl's last post*

Dang. Should have scrolled up before I posted. Or the hit the 'refresh' button. Or both.

[email protected]

mordamor22
ok wats his story?

Next Venom_girl
Pick up Venom vs. Carnage.


Spoilers Alert!
The alien part is Carnage's son, Venom's grandson
and according to Venom is in danger of a schizophrenic break. The human part is Pat Mulligan an upstanding Irish-American cop. He was pretty much a typical guy, he had a life, a wife and newborn son. Then he gets infected by Carnage's spawn. Venom who wanted to protect the child, named him Toxin.
But Pat decides to try and use it for good and use Spider-man as his rolemodel. Venom gets angry that he's doesn't want to go into the family biz of eating Spidey's brains and teams with Carnage (can you believe it!) to try and kill him. He, Spidey, and the Black Cat drive them away but Pat becomes afraid of the monster inside him and leaves his family so they would not be in danger of him or the alien in-laws.

Next Venom_girl
Here's another picture of Toxin. From the miniseries coming out in April!
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0501/21/toxin1.jpg

mordamor22
ok sweet thanks! but is he good now or we dont know where he is or what?

Next Venom_girl
It would seem so from the end of Venom vrs Carnage but the little splurge on the new Toxin series suggests the alien has other plans...

mordamor22
ok then thanks

MayhemSymbiote
i liked Toxin when he "inflated" himself up and got huge. He looked cool then.
I'd perfer no mouth though. Seems the mouth means madness or anger getting the best of them. So i perfer him with no mouth/tongue.

Toxin has Potenial though, but boy does the name suck for a hero.

i bought the Venom vs Carnage TPB the other day, and i was impressed by the art for a change.

Since when is the Symbiote in control ??
Where is Eddie btw, Spidy said something about "If *Venom* hadn't sucked up the soul of the Human that its Inhabiting".
Did the Symbiote eat eddie up for something ??

BTW
Thanks for posting those pics of Puffy Toxin.

Next Venom_girl
No, I think Eddie's still in there. It's just seems the alien is the controlling factor now.

Yeah, I thought Toxin doesn't really work for the name of a hero. But then, Venom (who named him) never planed for him to go that route...

MayhemSymbiote
thats cool.
i liked it how eddie and symbiote were a team to themselves in the old days.

Ironman
so toxin is a goody that is friggin awesome (hesh from sealab voice) but venom in that looked FIGGON AWESOME

orangepoindexte
I'll grant that Toxin's host has potential to make the character worthwhile...

But it should be noted, (and remembered), that the 5 initial spawns of Venom (after Carnage that is) that were forced from him by the Life Foundation all had their own little stories/personalities/backgrounds... and were promptly eliminated within a few years time.

Some of them, (most notably Leslie--the purple female one), even alluded to having other motives behind their linking with the creatures like they did during the books.

I realize that they all merged into "Hybrid" or whatever after the Symbiote Invasion... but I still think Marvel should have gone back to them instead of creating a new "uber" one.

There are so many good angles a good writer could explore with those aliens... this new symbiote shouldn't have been created. Instead, all of us "Symbiote Hungry" fans out there are gonna continually pump cash into Marvel, making them think that this is what we all wanted...

Of course it's all about cash0rz though in the end... sad

MayhemSymbiote
Well the other five symbiote kids of Venoms', did get the shaft.
my favs were the two women symbiotes of the five, and Lasher, who ended up becoming Hybrid.
But this time, its Carnage's baby symbiote. We get to see the thrid generation of symbiotes and how its evolved.
Soon, hybrid will be having a kid too maybe...oooo wonder how that will turn out.

wierddreamer213
Carnage was so easily beaten because he just reproduced. Apparently for symbiotes that takes a lot out of them (like humans) so his powers were weakened because he was still recovering form the birth pains. its the same reason why he didn't just kill Toxin when he was first born.

also the reason Toxin is good (for now) is because every 1000 generatons of the species there's a risk of genetic decay, where apparently the symbiote can loss its savage nature. however i think it would be interesting if as Toxin (the alien) grows it starts to take more control over its human host, possibly driving him insane or murderous.

on a seperate note, didn't Eddie Borck give up the venom persona? He auctioned it off and gave the money to charity, it got bought by a mob bosses son who the alien abandoned because he was a pansy. so is this venom a new host, hence why it dosn't seem to have the same (twisted, self-rightous) morality and restriant as Eddie/Venom?

wierddreamer213
hey what's with that venom plot line they have going with all the aliens and etc hunting the venom symbiote in the artic. anyone know what i'm taking to? what's up with that? the symbiote seems to act more like the monster from THE THING than the symbiotes from the rest of marvel. did i miss something here?

Next Venom_girl
That's in Marvel Knights that Eddie gives it up sells it to a loser and commits suicide.Thank the spider-gods it's out of continuity. stick out tongue

wierddreamer213
i thought he just up and died cause he couldn't live without the symbiote having been attached so long. so that story line's outa the loop there, dosn't count??

Next Venom_girl
Yep. So I heard. cool

wierddreamer213
ok so whats with the thing with venom being hunted all up in the artic in an extreamly confusing rip off of The THING?

wierddreamer213
so marvel knights is the one where Spidy gets his ass compleatly beaten to a bloody pulp by electro and vulture?

Next Venom_girl
The newest Venom series was very cool.

Spoilers: It's a homocidal Venom clone in the arctic.

wierddreamer213
ok there we go. i just didn't know where the heck it came from, or why it was all evil blob monster instead of symbiote like

Linkalicious
The new Venom series is a mockery of the character.

The artwork was less than impressive and the story was crap. The only thing that was good about it was the cameos

doctorstrongbad
Lets get back to the thread. This is suppose to be about Toxin. Okay so Toxin can be a good guy. That would be a nice surprise.

orangepoindexte
Toxin has 1/2 the character that the 5 "forgotten" symbiotes from Lethal Protector had.

I'm hoping he just goes away and is never mentioned again. Marvel should've done a "Scream" mini-series... Donna was helluva more interesting then this guy.

doctorstrongbad
I hoping they can make Toxin into a hero and maybe work with Spiderman?

wierddreamer213
see i'm hoping that with a Toxin series underway this will be an excuse marvel needs ot put the 5 'forgoten' symbotes back inot the picture.

wierddreamer213
Where is Eddie btw, Spidy said something about "If *Venom* hadn't sucked up the soul of the Human that its Inhabiting".
Did the Symbiote eat eddie up for something ??"

see that was my question, is this venom Eddie or did Eddie give it up and die and this Venom is one imposing itself on an unwilling host? you know this would actually make sense, since Eddie Venom was at lest sorta good or he saw himself that way at any rate while this Venom seems to lack any of the qualms Eddie venom had over killing inocents (save spiderman)

doctorstrongbad
No Eddie is still venom. How could there be a venom w/o Eddie? he he

thundercracker
isnt there a toxinmini series out now that pits him against razor fist (like a guy with knives could beat a symbiot) but personally i dont like toxins look and after new avengers 2 its not like well see as carnage toxin fight any time soon

Next Venom_girl
Isn't New Avengers Ultimate universe? / Diff continuity than Venom v. Carnage storyline?

thundercracker
um not 2 my knowlage (excuse my spelling) im pretty sure it well ...... the new avengers but hey i have been wrong once or twice

doctorstrongbad
Originally posted by Next Venom_girl
Isn't New Avengers Ultimate universe? / Diff continuity than Venom v. Carnage storyline?

I am pretty sure that they are not in the same continuity.

thundercracker
im not really sure i no that new avengers is pretty mainstream & in the write up about toxins series it says after the breakout on the raft so thats the same continuity but v vs c im not that sure on......

doctorstrongbad
Originally posted by thundercracker
im not really sure i no that new avengers is pretty mainstream & in the write up about toxins series it says after the breakout on the raft so thats the same continuity but v vs c im not that sure on......

I think its still a different story/ world.

Linkalicious
Venom vs. Carnage was pretty much in a world of their own...

There was no pre-text to explain why Venom was chasing Carnage. They never explained how that one cop ended up with the symbiote....and I'm not exactly sure, but I don't think they explain how the symbiote was created in the first place. I mean, which one gave birth to the new symbiote....Venom or Carnage?

thundercracker
carnage gave birth u see him do it .... sorta but yeah i think v vs c is on its own world

Next Venom_girl
heh heh
Toxin humor:
http://www.spiderfan.org/fun/20040809.jpg
http://www.spiderfan.org/fun/20040823.jpg
http://www.spiderfan.org/fun/20040830.jpg

Jimmy Buggs
lol that was great, did you make it?

Endenkton
Toxin mini in april will be awesome.

It can't come soon enough.

Next Venom_girl
Originally posted by Jimmy Buggs
lol that was great, did you make it?
Nope it's from the weekly strip at http://www.spiderfan.org/


Gah, gotta wait two more weeks! eek!

Linkalicious
So Toxin's getting his own series?

Next Venom_girl
Yep. stick out tongue

Linkalicious
He was a pathetic character...i hope he dies at the end of the series and the symbiote comes home to grand-pa.

Jimmy Buggs
can i get a BIO on toxin ?

doctorstrongbad
Toxin will be out soon.

Next Venom_girl

thundercracker

doctorstrongbad

Next Venom_girl
You'd think he wouldn't have so much trouble, w/ the sym wanting to eat people, w/ Pat being a cop and all. There was even that bit in V vs. C where they're stopping for donuts. A dozen chocoloate donuts ought to be enough for any sym. laughing out loud

doctorstrongbad
Originally posted by Next Venom_girl
You'd think he wouldn't have so much trouble, w/ the sym wanting to eat people, w/ Pat being a cop and all. There was even that bit in V vs. C where they're stopping for donuts. A dozen chocoloate donuts ought to be enough for any sym. laughing out loud

Yeah cops sure love donuts. hehe Maybe Toxin will have to take breaks between fights to hit up a dunkin donuts. That would be awesome. lol smile

dominic/wolf
so whats so special about toxin what can he do that venom or carnage

Next Venom_girl
Well... he 0wn3d Carnage in his first battle.

thundercracker
yeah but sum1 said thats because birthing takes it ou of a sym as carnages words were: venom never said birthing hurt this much make us feel thiss wasted ..... but he then proceeded in part 4 2 beat v&c

maniac_symbiote
I really like the idea of the new symbiote, and maybe with his sales, he could get his own monthly comic and ressurect some of the older symbiotes.

doctorstrongbad
Well lets wish the best to Toxin. Hopefully it can become a great seller and help Marvel to have some extra cash to help out Spiderman. The last issues seem like they might new some new people working on them.

CKayote
When is the comic coming out?

[email protected]

Cosmic_Beings
When are these toxin comics coming out?

Next Venom_girl
I read somewhere that the release date was pushed back to the 16th of April.

Cosmic_Beings
This year? So how come everyone has pics of the comics already then?

Next Venom_girl
Oh, I'm talking about the new limited miniseries coming out in a couple of weeks. Most of the pics posted in this forum are from his first appearances in Venom v. Carnage which has been out for a while now. It's now in TPB form as well. The others are previews of the covers found on the Internet for the new mini, such as this:

Newest pic was posted here:
http://www.marvel.com/catalog/showcomic.htm?id=2012&format=comic

CKayote
But when's it coming out? Or is marvel just doing another "it'll be out when it's out' rountine?

[email protected]

Doc Ock
Toxin is out next week.

I can't wait for it.

CKayote
Cool. Will have to hope my tax refund comes by then.

[email protected]

Cosmic_Beings
Would they have it at my local Barnes & Noble?

CKayote
I picked up the book today, here are some scans:

CKayote
another

CKayote
And another:

CKayote
And then a last one:

[email protected]

fever red
It seems OK, the theme...not really expanding on Venom's experiences too much.
__Hmm...Toxin has a more talkative "Other" than Venom, but he refers to himself in the singular. His sym is a mere spawn, but it's familiar with Western culture (enough to have pronounced ideas about what it wants to explore in literature), ...it's a god-damn prodigy! Pat IS a fantastic "parental" figure, then. So why'd he abandon his baby?
__I don't hate it, but it's just another, severe inconsistency in the presentation of symbiotes.
__Why was the Venom Symbiote so clueless about human social customs and moral values, if syms can absorb all this info so readily? Why did it always seem to find Eddie's explanations necessary? Why was Red passive and non-talkative, as a spawn, if they're born with such complete personas?
__I'll go pick it up and see what I think of the action, the villains. Most importantly, I'll see if there are any signs that the theme may distinguish itself from Jekyll and Hyde...otherwise, I'll just go check the book out at the librairy!

Doc Ock
The first issue of Toxin was awesome.

I recommend it to all.

Symbiotica
...Does the toxin symbiote ever stfu? Really, if the rest of the book is like this, one wonders.

Unfortunately the first word that springs to mind re this is "silly." And ditto about the new symbiote being familiar with pop culture etc.

Silly.

White Symbiote
Looks-wise, Toxin reminds me of the Alex Ross design of Spider-Man. Which I kind of dislike as I feel it doesn't suit Spidey. But Toxin's design is....acceptable I suppose. It could have turned out much worse.

Linkalicious
Toxin comic #1 sucked.

I'm going to stick with him because he's in the same continuity as The New Avengers...but I was horribly disappointed by his first comic.

VENOMfan
Im going to pick up the toxin series I also am reading new avengers, Venom is thankfully kicking in mainstream continuity and Im sure he will pop up in "toxin" somtime

as long as Venom dosent run into the Sentry.

Toxin actually has an impressive design, the midsection is a little much but the arms and face are well done IMO.

fever red
Which Venom is alive in mainstream continuity (the spider-titles, I assume?)? Brock Venom?
__If he shows up in Toxin, and he's Brock Venom, that would be...deranged. In V vs C there was no Brock presence; they implied as much. He acted in ways that would be out of charactor for Eddie... Would they make him (sigh) "Brockier" in Toxin? Like I said, that would be deranged...but nice...still deranged, however.

(now "Brockier" seems a necessary adjective... sigh...)

VENOMfan
at first I was positive Brock was alive in mainstream continuity, MK Spiderman is not part of the regular marvel U from what I knew, but apparently after V vs C Eddie might actually be dead after the events in MK spiderman.

perhaps they are really reinventing the characters....

Mac Gargan actually stated he wants to be called "Venom" but the character wont really be Venom IMO

Venom and Carnage are pretty much dead concerning mainstream continuity and Toxin may actually flurish. his story is tied directly with the new avengers arc tho he could be facing more interesting villians

If this is all true and its really Scorpion/Venom from now on the chances of the two facing off are far less and the fight wont have to much heart in it. a guy with a symbiote fights a guy with another symbiote becuase two symbiotes dont get along.

like Mac Gargan cares about Pat Mulligan, and unfortunatley there's really no chance Toxin can ever face off with his "dad"

a collective sigh

fever red
Well, they'll play it that way...because if Eddie was not the "Venom" in V vs C, then that was just the symbiote, OR it was (?!) Gargan. Either way, the "Venom" who welcomed Toxin to the world would be meeting him again.

VENOMfan
chances are Fever red

anyone seen anything on issue 2 of toxin? he faces "razorfist"? I belive

not only that but has anything Marvel stat wise stated how powerfull toxin is yet?

Yes he beat on Carnage but that dosent mean he was waaay stronger, I mean if Toxin is actually class 25+ in strength thats a little odd

and the green sizzle he used for a moment is he actually poisoness?

I usally reference www.Spiderfan.com but he isnt on it yet

freezedoom
Try www.milehighcomics.com
Go to Marvel, then the letter "T"
and find Toxin 2005

VENOMfan
I mean somthing like this for Toxin instead of Carnage

Appearance
Height: 6' 1"
Weight: 190 lbs
Eyes: Green
Hair: Red
Features: As Carnage, elongate jaw & "teeth", ever moving tendrils from various parts of his body, both of which are a part of the alien that is his costume.

Summary
Created By: David Michelinie, Mark Bagley, Randy Emberlin
Real Name: Cletus Kasady
Current Aliases: None
Former Aliases: None
Dual Identity: Publicly Known
Current Occupation: Prisoner/patient, Ravencroft
Former Occupation: Serial Killer
Citizenship: U.S.
Legal Status: Criminal record in U.S.
Place of Birth: Brooklyn, New York
Marital Status: Single
Known Relatives: Mother (killed by father), Venom (symbiote parent), Father (deceased), Grandmother (killed by Cletus)
Known Confidants: Shriek
Known Allies: Shriek, Doppelganger, DemoGoblin
Major Enemies: Spider-Man, Venom, Cloak & Dagger
Usual Bases: Ravencroft Institute
Former Bases: Former site of the St. Estes Home for Boys, Brookln, New York
Current Groups: None
Former Groups: None
Education: High School

Powers & Paraphenalia
Strength Level: Unknown, shown to be significantly stronger than both Venom and Spider-Man
Powers: Has a symbiote costume simalar to Venom, but seems to be more powerful, possibely due to it's incubation on Earth. Kasady's symbiote can, like Venom's, mimic any type of clothing, but unlike Venom, Carnage has not been seen useing the costume as camoflage. The symbiote has augmented all of Kasady's physical abilities to super-human levels apparently higher than that of Venom's.
Abilities: Carnage animates his costume to create snares, swing line, and most often bladed weapons. Carnage can hurl these "blades" from anywhere on his body. They disinetgrate after about thirty seconds after they are thrown. Carnage also posses wall-cralwing abilities similar to Venom's. In some unknown manner, the symbiote can dampen both Spider-Man's spider-sense, & the Venom symbiote's in born ability to track its spawn.
Equipment: None
Weapons: None
Limitations: The symbiote is vunerable to both sonics(to a much lesser degree than it's parent) & heat based attacks (to a much greater degree than its parent).


also i goofed that url

http://www.spiderfan.org/characters/carnage.html

freezedoom
Can't help you there, hombre.

VENOMfan
only time will tell i guess

fever red
__Nice sig, BTW.
__VENOMfan, are you back on regularly, now?

VENOMfan
pretty much took forever seem's like

fever red
Yeh, but it's good you're back.
__We were developing a bit of an imbalance- tilting to the Carnage side!
__Hmm, a LOT has happened. There's a yahoo group for adult, symbiote fan-fics now. That's just one of the better developments.
__Lots of new people in here (including me- I think we've barely met, briefly, in the past?).

Symbiotica
Originally posted by VENOMfan

If this is all true and its really Scorpion/Venom from now on the chances of the two facing off are far less and the fight wont have to much heart in it. a guy with a symbiote fights a guy with another symbiote becuase two symbiotes dont get along.

like Mac Gargan cares about Pat Mulligan, and unfortunatley there's really no chance Toxin can ever face off with his "dad"

a collective sigh

You are far from alone in this view, I assure you.

Marvel is run by a bunch of retards these days. They have no more foresight than the average 6-year-old.

Venom/Carnage = made from scratch Red Velvet cake

Toxin = one of those round dry, nasty rice-cakes that come six to a bag, you know what I mean.

Someone offers you a choice, do you want a dry rice-cake with nothing on it, or the slice of red velvet cake? I know what I would pick; excuse the crappy analogy.

fever red
Yes; there are some good things in Toxin's charactor, but they're severely undercut by all the nonsense going on with his "relatives." Symbiosis is about relationships- not just cool powers- so why isolate Toxin? He has no-one left on the "alien" side of his heritage, and he's abandoned his human family. They've reduced him tremendously from the raw material they began with...instead of elaborating on him!

VENOMfan
exactly, the event's in V vs C went buy so fast it almost as if they never happened. does Toxin even know if Carnage is dead? he should be able to sense somthing but I doubt it will be explored

I can foresee a Wolverine cameo ((shivers))

fever red
In my mind, Carnage is not dead- Carnage never dies! LOL, I don't care what they do for now- I know he'll be back.

Kontraz
i'm not entirely sold that was carnage... if it was, the artist really F*CKED up. I mean, he didnt have the black goop on top of his red goop, and he had TEETH! Carnage never had teeth! Venom did! Carnage just had a very jagged mouth... thing...

fever red
Yeh, there was NO attempt at accurate portrayal of the character, by writer or artist. SO dismissive of fans...
__Hey, let's segue into a shameless plug of my work! It's fan-fic, but its better in THAT respect than Marvel's current offerings. Go to Josh22's Symbiote2 group (if you're 18 or over) and join today!!!

Linkalicious
I just wish Spidey got the chance to see Sentry send him off. sad

fever red
__That's all? You didn't want a better death? Or better yet, no death and a GOOD story? I have to say, the promo art made it seem like he'd be taking on an "Alien" (the movie) role, stalking people in the dark, through-out the story. Instead, they...just...crumple the charactor up like a rejected story-line on paper, and toss him. Yeh...if you don't want to work with a charactor...do your thinking outside of the published work.
__He'll be back, but man, what a silly display that scene was, and so mis-placed.
__Bad author! Bad!
__You're angry that your first treatment of the charactor didn't go over? Especially given that you did that treatment "for the fans?" (the money) You want to say "Never again!" and declare it in a published scene?
__Like I said, bad author! Bad! Suck it up! Be professional! Keep your dialogue with fans re charactor treatment civil and separate from the published work.

doctorstrongbad
I'm sure Carnage won't be gone for long. They will bring him back and he will be back to his evil ways. smile

VenomCarnage21
Originally posted by doctorstrongbad
I'm sure Carnage won't be gone for long. They will bring him back and he will be back to his evil ways. smile

Remember when Silver Surfer "sealed/froze" Carnage in that Unbreakable, permanent cosmic shell? One year later, Marvel had him placed in prison with no explaination of how he got there, let alone how the "shell" broke. Then Venom ate his symbiote, and Marvel had Kassady transported to another world where he happened to find a brand new symbiote with the SAME appearance and powers as Carnage but no affiliation with the Venom symbiote! So likely someone at Marvel will just pretend Carnage never got ripped in half and he'll appear back in the comics with zero explaination!

White Symbiote
Do any of the writers ever make any attempt to see what fans want or are they just doing whatever they want regardless? I haven't picked up a comic in ages. As soon as I see something I think might be interesting, I open it up and become disgusted. Maybe they do visit sites or forums but just get responses like "WOOOO! venm rawks!!1! it wld b kool if eh fused With batman or magneto! that would RULE!!". To be such fans of certain characters, some people have no respect for them. Of course now it seem that ever the writers themselves have no respect. For both the characters themselves and previous writers that came before them.

CKayote
No, they're just making it up as they go along. I really don't think know enough about the characters and they just wing it. And then they invent newer (and often lame) characters so they don't have to read all the back issues.

[email protected]

doctorstrongbad
Originally posted by CKayote
No, they're just making it up as they go along. I really don't think know enough about the characters and they just wing it. And then they invent newer (and often lame) characters so they don't have to read all the back issues.

[email protected]

Well I wouldn't be that hard on them, but I really hate bad writing. I think they try their best but sometimes have really bad ideas. It would be cool if they cared more about what the fans wanted.

Toxin92
I don't know about anyone else, but I thick that Toxin is a very good character. Toxin hasn't barley started yet so I can't say much on his development, but I thick it's cool to see that a symbiote has a separate personality from his host. Some things might not add up, but I thick it's going good so far.

Doc Ock
When is issue 2 of Toxin out???

jango fatt
Toxin is supercool

Mrs Eddie Brock
True dat 8)

Spideys Sister
Originally posted by Doc Ock
When is issue 2 of Toxin out???

Hey Doc I have issue 2 It not that great but the art is awsome stick out tongue laughing

doctorstrongbad
Has anybody read Toxin issue 3? I was wondering if it was good or not?

Next Venom_girl
I just read #2, man it's funny. Reasons why you shouldn't piss off your symbiote.... stick out tongue

Spideys Sister
Originally posted by doctorstrongbad
Has anybody read Toxin issue 3? I was wondering if it was good or not?

The 3rd one is the best. I only read the 2nd and 3rd so I was a little confused but man is the art good.

fever red
Originally posted by Next Venom_girl
I just read #2, man it's funny. Reasons why you shouldn't piss off your symbiote.... stick out tongue

Would you "spoil" me with the specifics- here, or in PM?

Symbiotica
Yes, somebody Toxin-spoiler us because I keep hearing "oh this is great!" but I never hear WHY people thought it was great.

And until I do, I'm not buying.

I have to say, the promo art made it seem like be taking on an "Alien" (the movie) role, stalking people in the dark, through-out the story. Instead, they...just...crumple the charactor up like a rejected story-line on paper, and toss him.


Why was Carnage almost never used as he should really, really have been: as an almost Lovecraftian Haunter of the Dark? We have not seen that since "Mindbomb"! Both Venom and Carnage should have been portrayed in this fashion! THESE ARE SCARY PEOPLE. Make them scarier! How would it really be to see huge glowing eyes materializing out of the dark, and realizing you are face-to-face with this Herculean half-man, half-beast?!! S***! You'd have a coronary on the spot before they even had time to kill you themselves! WHHHYYYYYYYYYY NOT SEEEEEE THIS!!!!!!! for longer than one panel?

Sometimes I hate Marvel. I really, really do. A**holes just WASTED both characters. It makes me want to THROW stuff.

"There's no one here to help you It's dark. And the dark belongs to creatures like ME." - Carnage

fever red
Well, I thought your St. Estes fic did an excellent job and I vociferously inveigh against its removal. I'd really really like to see you repost it. I thought the Kathy scene attenuated the story. You should use that in another fic, maybe as a stand-alone, or part of a montage of victim's-eye-views of Max Carnage. It rocked; however, it did not advance the plot much. I've got a couple ideas how you might finish- if you want to hear them?

Symbiotica
Oh, I meant to repost that and just forgot all about it. I shall put that back up. Yahoo just... I tried about 3 times to edit, and the third time I was like, "OK, that is IT!!!!" and pulled it.

That really wasn't a plot-driven thing; I just like to write descriptive scenarios. So, that fic was heavy on those and light on serious action.

I like Carnage skulking around in the dark, stalking people. It's where he belongs.... naughty boy.

Sure, I am always open to ideas, send 'em on over. I'll credit you, too.

Gen-117
Originally posted by Symbiotica
I like Carnage skulking around in the dark, stalking people. It's where he belongs.... naughty boy.

Your right about that, remineded me of a Carnage qoute

"No-ones gonna save you, its dark, and the dark belongs to creautes like me"

Spideys Sister
Carnage freaks out to much. Hes always screaming in the cartoon.
We can hear you ya bastard!!!!!
Love the sig Gen. Did I tell ya?

Marcellus
Yikes......Well I recently did some checking and according to Spiderfan.org a VERY reliable site for Spiderman character bios......Toxin is the Uber-end of symbiotes, Im definetly swaying on this one. if this power increase is standard they cannot allow another symbiote to be born this is already a bit much. Ill post the bio and link. just check out his strength class.

Toxin
Appearance
Height: 6'2
Weight: 215 lbs
Eyes: Blue
Hair: Brown
Features: As symbiote, blood-red & blue skin, tentacled appendages.

Summary
Created By: Peter Milligan, Clayton Crain
Real Name: Patrick 'Paddy' Mulligan
Current Aliases: None
Former Aliases: None
Dual Identity: Known to local authorities
Current Occupation: Superhero crime fighter
Former Occupation: NYPD Officer
Citizenship: U.S.
Legal Status: No criminal record
Place of Birth: NYC
Marital Status: Married
Known Relatives: Gina Mulligan (wife), Edward Mulligan (son), Jimmy Mulligan (Farther -deceased), Mrs Mulligan (mother), Venom (symbiote grandparent) Carnage (symbiote parent)
Known Confidants: Officer Meadow's (ex partner NYPD), Spider-man, Black Cat
Known Allies: Spider-man, Black Cat
Major Enemies: Carnage (deceased), Venom (deceased), Razorfist
Usual Bases: New York, Manhattan
Former Bases: New York, Manhattan
Current Groups: None
Former Groups: NYPD
Education: Unknown

Powers & Paraphenalia
Strength Level: Greater than that of Venom and Carnage combined and able to lift a maximum of 75 tons.
Powers: In addition to the young symbiote's great strength in comparison to previous generations, Toxin can also manipulate his symbiote half to mimic any type of clothing or create other human disguises.
Abilities: Toxin like his predecessors possesses the ability to stick to walls, and like Carnage creates 'tendrils' rather than webbing from which to swing between buildings. Toxin can also project elongated claws or 'snares' from his costume in the same manner as Carnage.
Equipment: None.
Weapons: None.
Limitations: Interestingly Toxin did not inhabit the same ability to dampen Carnage's in- born symbiote ability to track it's own spawn in the same way that Carnage could to do Venom. It is presumed that Toxin is indebted to the same vulnerability to fire and sonic attacks from which all other symbiotes suffer.

http://www.spiderfan.org/characters/toxin.html

Marcus4600
Toxin = Beastly. I love having a symbiotic good guy

atharpina
Aw Venom and Carnage are both dead?

Where have all my symbiotes gone guys?

steverules
Toxin is the only one left and I think Venom is still around only it's not Eddie anymore.

Marcus4600
the True venom is dead. May Eddie Brock rest in peace. However, in Marvel, nobody stays dead.

steverules
I hope Eddie and Carnage return.

Spideys Sister
Originally posted by Marcellus
Yikes......Well I recently did some checking and according to Spiderfan.org a VERY reliable site for Spiderman character bios......Toxin is the Uber-end of symbiotes, Im definetly swaying on this one. if this power increase is standard they cannot allow another symbiote to be born this is already a bit much. Ill post the bio and link. just check out his strength class.

Toxin
Appearance
Height: 6'2
Weight: 215 lbs
Eyes: Blue
Hair: Brown
Features: As symbiote, blood-red & blue skin, tentacled appendages.

Summary
Created By: Peter Milligan, Clayton Crain
Real Name: Patrick 'Paddy' Mulligan
Current Aliases: None
Former Aliases: None
Dual Identity: Known to local authorities
Current Occupation: Superhero crime fighter
Former Occupation: NYPD Officer
Citizenship: U.S.
Legal Status: No criminal record
Place of Birth: NYC
Marital Status: Married
Known Relatives: Gina Mulligan (wife), Edward Mulligan (son), Jimmy Mulligan (Farther -deceased), Mrs Mulligan (mother), Venom (symbiote grandparent) Carnage (symbiote parent)
Known Confidants: Officer Meadow's (ex partner NYPD), Spider-man, Black Cat
Known Allies: Spider-man, Black Cat
Major Enemies: Carnage (deceased), Venom (deceased), Razorfist
Usual Bases: New York, Manhattan
Former Bases: New York, Manhattan
Current Groups: None
Former Groups: NYPD
Education: Unknown

Powers & Paraphenalia
Strength Level: Greater than that of Venom and Carnage combined and able to lift a maximum of 75 tons.
Powers: In addition to the young symbiote's great strength in comparison to previous generations, Toxin can also manipulate his symbiote half to mimic any type of clothing or create other human disguises.
Abilities: Toxin like his predecessors possesses the ability to stick to walls, and like Carnage creates 'tendrils' rather than webbing from which to swing between buildings. Toxin can also project elongated claws or 'snares' from his costume in the same manner as Carnage.
Equipment: None.
Weapons: None.
Limitations: Interestingly Toxin did not inhabit the same ability to dampen Carnage's in- born symbiote ability to track it's own spawn in the same way that Carnage could to do Venom. It is presumed that Toxin is indebted to the same vulnerability to fire and sonic attacks from which all other symbiotes suffer.

http://www.spiderfan.org/characters/toxin.html Who said Carnage and Venom are dead...And I'm talking about the symbiotes.

<< THERE IS MORE FROM THIS THREAD HERE >>