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Ok. In a Surfer vs Superman debate, it's usually brought up that Surfer can just absorb the solar energy stored in the Man on Steel. But how would Surfer fare against someone whose energies he can't absorb? Who wins?

very close it like thor vs SS -

Yup, SS. Even CM cant be directly truned into glass and has no weaknesses to exploit he'll still be put down

cap marvel wins

SS ftw.

Hmm, gee I don't know. A herald to Galactus or a guy that has gotten his powers from a wizard who at best is a skyfather? Gotta go with the herald.

i think SS can beat Supes without having to exploit any weakness..so..he'll beat Cap too..

Norrin wins, though Marvel gives him a hell of a fight, IMO.

That's one helluva bump. 2004. lol


Surfer wins.

Norrin.

Originally posted by TheTyrant
Hmm, gee I don't know. A herald to Galactus or a guy that has gotten his powers from a wizard who at best is a skyfather? Gotta go with the herald. .. that make no sence, Juggy could brake SS's neck and he is an avatar of a Skyfather level guy....

cap marvel

Cowabunga!

norin

Surfer

Cap Marvel

Originally posted by TheTyrant
Hmm, gee I don't know. A herald to Galactus or a guy that has gotten his powers from a wizard who at best is a skyfather? Gotta go with the herald.

Silver Surfer. But Cap Marvel would do much better against him than Supes. Its gonna be very close.

CM would fare much better than Supes against Thor.
I can't see why he'd do better against SS

maybe he's talking about Supes weakness that Capt doesn't have..like red sun radiation or kryptonite

Originally posted by Slaanesh
maybe he's talking about Supes weakness that Capt doesn't have..like red sun radiation or kryptonite
True. But Supes also has more offensive options than Captain Marvel has to combat SS with.

Originally posted by Slaanesh
maybe he's talking about Supes weakness that Capt doesn't have..like red sun radiation or kryptonite

hmmm yest that's true...or even yellow sunlight siphoning could be a an option against supes

Originally posted by Enyalus
True. But Supes also has more offensive options than Captain Marvel has to combat SS with.

really??i think in term of offensive power..they are about equal..strength, speed and durability is about equal..Supes got HV..Capt got lighting..freeze breath won't do anything..what other offensive option does Supes has??

Originally posted by Slaanesh
really??i think in term of offensive power..they are about equal..strength, speed and durability is about equal..Supes got HV..Capt got lighting..freeze breath won't do anything..what other offensive option does Supes has??
He's also got a combination of X-Ray and Heat vision, vibrate to intangible (I don't think CM can do that?), and yeah, freeze breath was what I was talking about. Also, Superman speedblitzes more frequently than CM does.

I think CM, despite his lack of versatility in comparison to Superman, would fare better against Surfer than Supes. Firstly, Marvel has no real weaknesses to be exploited. Secondly, in a way, his durability is better than Superman simply due to the fact that his body is a magical construct. Anyone who can literally be turned inside out and heals pretty instantly right after is no joke. Also, Superman's versatility won't really help him against Surfer in the first place (Heat Vision? You really wanna trade energy based attacks with Surfer? Ice breath? The dude roams around in space).

I'd say Surfer takes a majority, but he earns every fight he wins and Marvel can def beat him, Herald to Galactus or no.

Originally posted by Enyalus
He's also got a combination of X-Ray and Heat vision, vibrate to intangible (I don't think CM can do that?), and yeah, freeze breath was what I was talking about. Also, Superman speedblitzes more frequently than CM does.

what is the result of combining X-Ray and Heat vision??i think i read it somewhere..but i can't remember..and turning intangible is not an offensive move..

Originally posted by Slaanesh
what is the result of combining X-Ray and Heat vision??i think i read it somewhere..but i can't remember
HV through objects.
Originally posted by Slaanesh
..and turning intangible is not an offensive move..
It is for Reverse-Flash and Zoom.

Originally posted by Enyalus

HV through objects.

It is for Reverse-Flash and Zoom.

that is just ridiculous..but hey..it's Supes..he can do anything..

u forgot Wally uhuh

IMO Superman would take 5/10 against Surfer or against CM.

CM however would beat SS 6/10 times. The surfer has problems with magic beings, Thor beat him more often then not and CM (with the speed of Mercury) is arguably the faster fighter and with charged punches and his greater durability he will take the Surfer down.

Silver Surfer wins.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
IMO Superman would take 5/10 against Surfer or against CM.

CM however would beat SS 6/10 times. The surfer has problems with magic beings, Thor beat him more often then not and CM (with the speed of Mercury) is arguably the faster fighter and with charged punches and his greater durability he will take the Surfer down.

Thor doesn't do so well against the Surfer because his origins is mystical in nature. He beats him because his flat out more powerful. Magic hinders Norrin just like it would anyone else. It doesn't affect him to any greater degree. The extent of Thor being magical that is brought up in their fights is him being a god. That's it.

Greater durability? Debatable.

Charged punches is something Norrin is capable off as well.

Faster fighter? Debatable.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Silver Surfer wins.



Thor doesn't do so well against the Surfer because his origins is mystical in nature. He beats him because his flat out more powerful. Magic hinders Norrin just like it would anyone else. It doesn't affect him to any greater degree. The extent of Thor being magical that is brought up in their fights is him being a god. That's it.

Greater durability? Debatable.

Charged punches is something Norrin is capable off as well.

Faster fighter? Debatable.

Thor is more powerful then Surfer? Debatable. Surfer's power source is even above Thor's.

Faster, stronger and more durable. He also doesn't need a device to fly. SS without his board has to spend a lot of his energy just to fly.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Thor is more powerful then Surfer? Debatable. Surfer's power source is even above Thor's.

Faster, stronger and more durable. He also doesn't need a device to fly. SS without his board has to spend a lot of his energy just to fly.



It's been made explicitly clear that Thor is above Norrin based on their fights.

Going by your previous post, are you trying to somehow pin Thor's beat downs on Norrin on his mystical origins? If you are, it's baseless.

Galactus is above Thor. How does that reflect on Silver Surfer vs. Thor? Galactus granted Norrin a fraction of his power is all.

Faster? Debatable. And I have not seen any speed feats from Marvel to match Norrin's in flight.

I'll give you that. Captain Marvel would have the strength edge on Norrin.

Durable? Easily debatable.

Outside of a few occasions, him relying on his board for the majority of his transportation hasn't really hindered him.

Norrin is more versatile and more powerful than Marvel. He takes it.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


It's been made explicitly clear that Thor is above Norrin based on their fights.

Going by your previous post, are you trying to somehow pin Thor's beat downs on Norrin on his mystical origins? If you are, it's baseless.

Galactus is above Thor. How does that reflect on Silver Surfer vs. Thor? Galactus granted Norrin a fraction of his power is all.

Faster? Debatable. And I have not seen any speed feats from Marvel to match Norrin's in flight.

I'll give you that. Captain Marvel would have the strength edge on Norrin.

Durable? Easily debatable.

Outside of a few occasions, him relying on his board for the majority of his transportation hasn't really hindered him.

Norrin is more versatile and more powerful than Marvel. He takes it.

Maybe because Thors mystical nature is nothing that SS could suck out of Thor? Maybe because Thor is the better fighter, the stronger one? You know SS is more powerful, raw power, but he isn't the better fighter or has more strength.

Travel speed =/= combat speed.

Your opinion.

Not when he flys from point a to point b, but in fights?

More powerful then someone who has the power of Zeus? Well I agree on the more powerful part, SS is more powerful then either Thor or CM, he has more raw power to unleash. But I also think that CM can tank this power easier then Thor and it won't have the effect you hope it would. CM took worse. SS is more versatile, but this versatily won't give him anything in a fight against an mystical opponent (whose source of power is unaccessable for Surfer) that lacks certain weaknesses.

CM is apparently resistant against direct transmutation, changes right back. But seen as he can't phase, turning the air arround him into adamantium will do the trick.

Also, SS can go intangible so that CM cant do a thing to him while he can still blast and transmute.

SM's HV, ice breath and x rays wont even trickle SS, even if he doesnt want to absorb or redirect them, he goes trhough stars and lives in the cold vacuum of space.

Without, pis, cis or cip, bricks have no chance in hell. GL is the justice league's member that would prove the most challenging for the SS. WW, if she can get the lasso in, has some chances.

I think SS is above Thor too, but I don't really care for debating it here. Thor would far a lot better than either CM and SM though.

^I honestly don't get why someone who has read their fights would consider Norrin more powerful than Thor.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Maybe because Thors mystical nature is nothing that SS could suck out of Thor? Maybe because Thor is the better fighter, the stronger one? You know SS is more powerful, raw power, but he isn't the better fighter or has more strength.

Travel speed =/= combat speed.

Your opinion.

Not when he flys from point a to point b, but in fights?

More powerful then someone who has the power of Zeus? Well I agree on the more powerful part, SS is more powerful then either Thor or CM, he has more raw power to unleash. But I also think that CM can tank this power easier then Thor and it won't have the effect you hope it would. CM took worse. SS is more versatile, but this versatily won't give him anything in a fight against an mystical opponent (whose source of power is unaccessable for Surfer) that lacks certain weaknesses.

Suck out of Thor? You mean drain him? He doesn't do so because it would be pointless as a result of Thor's own impressive energy manipulating abilities and the fact that his inherent energies are above Norrin and are tied to himself.

What? Thor has the raw power advantage against Norrin. His feats trump what I've seen Norrin do. Especially when you take into account shit like the God Blast.

How exactly do we know that Silver Surfer has more raw power? Prove it to me.

I never said they were the same. Norrin has nanosecond reaction time etc. under his belt apparently. Even in that regard, it should be pretty close.

The entire God hierarchy in DC is blurred from what I understand currently. There are multiple gods who have the name of Zeus according to the Power of Shazam each occupying different positions. They retconned shit to an extent I believe. Automatically putting Zeus in front of it, doesn't impress me anymore. To be honest, Ares has always seemed the more impressive Olympian from the Greek Gods we are usually associated with and even he was recently killed by Diana.

Again with the Norrin is more powerful than Thor thing. You act as if it's some sort of cemented fact, when their really isn't any proof of it.

Norrin's versatility offer's options like offensive energy attacks, intangibility, force field creation, etc. which would all be useful in a fight. Also Norrin's matter manipulation would be useful in attempting to contain Marvel. It's Silver Surfer's fight to loose.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
^I honestly don't get why someone who has read their fights would consider Norrin more powerful than Thor.

Going by their overall performances and power displays against the rest of the world. More power does not necessarily translate into combat victory however, which is what a I attribute SS's poor showings against thor to. SM for instance is nowhere near as powerfull as thor, he cant do 1/10 of what thor can, but most people think he'd tie or take a majority agains him.

If SS went all out, which he never does, few would manage to stand against him.

Originally posted by 753
CM is apparently resistant against direct transmutation, changes right back. But seen as he can't phase, turning the air arround him into adamantium will do the trick.

Also, SS can go intangible so that CM cant do a thing to him while he can still blast and transmute.

SM's HV, ice breath and x rays wont even trickle SS, even if he doesnt want to absorb or redirect them, he goes trhough stars and lives in the cold vacuum of space.

Without, pis, cis or cip, bricks have no chance in hell. GL is the justice league's member that would prove the most challenging for the SS. WW, if she can get the lasso in, has some chances.

I think SS is above Thor too, but I don't really care for debating it here. Thor would far a lot better than either CM and SM though.

SS turned Air into Adamantium? I'm not familiar with all of Surfers appearances, you might enlighten me, when did he do this?

CM can do what Supes can do and an magically charged fist should still have some effect on intangible or incorporeal beings.

SM goes through stars and becomes more powerful, he flys through an red star that depowers him, is surrounded by tons of Kryptonite and has still enough fighting spirit in him left.

Originally posted by Avlon
A weakened Superman is able to stalemate and start to overpower Amalak who had the strength of a planetful of superstrong beings. This is after exposure to red sunlight, kryptonite, and other anti-kryptonian weaponry.

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/1192/29ii8.th.jpghttp://img166.imageshack.us/img166/8990/32xr2.th.jpghttp://img295.imageshack.us/img295/9708/33xs3.th.jpg

Superman and CM are not just mere bricks, they faced worse then the Surfer and prevailed. As said, Supes should take 5/10 against the Surfer, though CM would win more do to his lack of weaknesses. IMHO.

Originally posted by 753
Going by their overall performances and power displays against the rest of the world. More power does not necessarily translate into combat victory however, which is what a I attribute SS's poor showings against thor to. SM for instance is nowhere near as powerfull as thor, he cant do 1/10 of what thor can, but most people think he'd tie or take a majority agains him.

If SS went all out, which he never does, few would manage to stand against him.

Name some instances then and I'll break them down.

That's because Thor's inclined to fight like a brick and so is Clark. They are basically physical equals and would most likely engage in a brawl and split.

Thor would be part of the few. A pissed off Thor has owned a non holding back Norrin.

Specifically, I don't think he ever turned air into adamantium, but we've seen him transmute all kinds of things with no limitation on it. There is no reason to assume he cant do it. check his respect thread out:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=459252&highlight=silver+surfer+forumid%3A98

There is a big section dedicated to his transmutation feats

CM can phase? I've never seen him do it, but I'll take your word for it.

Has CM's magically charged punch ever been used to hit an intangible foe?

What different stars do to SM is irrelevant here.

They prevail because they are the heroes of their books, just like the hulk prevails against all odds and enemies who should blink him out of existence.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Name some instances then and I'll break them down.

That's because Thor's inclined to fight like a brick and so is Clark. They are basically physical equals and would most likely engage in a brawl and split.

Thor would be part of the few. A pissed off Thor has owned a non holding back Norrin.

Restoring a biosphere (and all it organisms) and accelerating evolutive time for the organisms on the planet until millions of years worth of biological process go by in seconds. I'm a biologist so this is just massive to me

Healing thousands of beings in the molecular level

Absorbing a star, jumpstarting a star, creating a black hole.

Destroying planets and, more impressively, recreating and keeping planets toghether.

Chasing a grain of dust across the universe. Cosmic awareness and just knowing things are going wrong in the other corner of the universe with great detail.

Fixing a starfleet of thousands of ships with a thought without even looking at them. Creating a starfleet from debris just as easily.

Creating matter in vacuum - this is probably converting his own energies into matter

Shrinking to the microverse, seeing the future and the past, freely travelling through time, crossing a gazillion light years in seconds.

I know thor can macth some of these and I do know less about him than about the SS, but from what I've seen he's more limited and has more destructive powers than anything else. It's easier to think about Surfer in a matter of what few powers he doesnt have and what few things he cant do.

silversurfer

Surfer wins.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
^I honestly don't get why someone who has read their fights would consider Norrin more powerful than Thor.

They're probably like most and believe that Blood and Thunder was the result of either an amp or just poor writing all around...

Originally posted by 753
Restoring a biosphere (and all it organisms) and accelerating evolutive time for the organisms on the planet until millions of years worth of biological process go by in seconds. I'm a biologist so this is just massive to me


Billions of years. I know you weren't trying to short change him or anything, I just thought I'd point that out.

Originally posted by thanos-prime
Surfer That's a hot sig buddy.