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that sounds awesome, is this your own thought or did you get this from somewhere?

Wait, do you mean that Sidious could have influenced the midichlorians in such a way that Anikin was born?

Hmmmmm. I pondered this myself initially. It would certainly make sense though that if Anakin isn't the creation of Plagueis, that he is bound to identify with this anecdote and maybe wonder this himself and be thinking-"Maybe I have a natural affiliation/destiny with the Darth lineage....('Cause of the 'midichlorian origin' thing)" and that could influence his decision along with the ambition-to-help-Padme.

But if he IS the creation of Plagueis then wouldn't it make it seem that was always born to be evil, thus detracting from GL's "It was circumstance that drove Anakin to the darkside,and it could happen to the best of us" direction taken over TPM and AOTC...?

The info is from MF.
I think Palp was the apprentice from Plagueis and he killed him.

Yup... I reckon.

there is another thread about this. Plagueis isnt Anakins father!

please merge

Well, I don't know about the whole Dark Lord creating life through midichlorians thing, but if it was like that with Anakin and he was suppose to be destined to join the Dark Side, which he eventually did, he really didn't have to.... because there's always that problem........... choice.

I think that it's to be interpreted as Darth Plagueis can "extend" life, not "create" life. Think of Anakin saying "I will find a way to keep people from dying". Most people in the GFFA have a way of "creating" life... they just don't do it with midichlorians!

anakin has no father, hasnt lucas confirmed this himself?

Very interesting indeed not sure if this is true star wars history or not. But it is obivious that Sidious murdered Plagueis but I'm not sure that Anakin was created by Plagueis. Because if he was why didn't Sidious after killing Plagueis go ahead and train Anakin himself instead of taking the chance that he would turn to the dark side, because nothing is certain. Remember Sidious was certain that Vader couldn't be turned from the dark side in ROTJ and Vader did. Maybe if Yoda trained Anakin then he would have never turned to the dark side, if Sidious trained Anakin himself then Anakin would have been pure evil without any conflict or good in him like he had ROTJ.

NOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!

seriously I thought there was NOTHING Lucas could do that would ruin this for me but THAT would definitely do it.

i dont know if i share your level of dismay JP, but i do agree that this new(supposed) plot point is stupid and really not necessary.

indeed

This has the potential for being a MAJOR point of conflict among fans.

Entire religious denominations have split over less than this.


cornponious

To me, Anakin MUST be a product of pure force, without anyone's help. To be anything else ruins his mystique for me.

i agree
may as well just explain where the force came from...why not throw in the big bang theory just to wrap it all up...what a crock

well i remember hearing a LOOOONG time ago that GL didnt like the flack he was catching for the "immaculate conception" idea, and was thinking about making an old rouge jedi (sidious...who would then not be palpls) go and more or less rape Shmi, resulting in Anakin, and she was too embarrassed to admit that to Qui-Gon....Obviously he changed that being that Palps is Sidious, but maybe this load of crap is his way of sticking to it but still in a way stick to his guns.....but jp is right.....crap on a stick.

O Plz!? that theory is so lame! everyone knows that Anakin was conceived from the force with no father. Its just like the story of Jesus, the chosen one was born with no father, i thought u people knew this!?

btw, all this is CONFIRMED by Lucas in a documentary i saw, so out the window with that theory!

i wasnt implying that what i said was written in stone, i said i HEARD that a long time ago, and that new thing theyre talking about may be a way to get around that. I think it should stay the way it was...Anakin with no dad.

"This infamous Dark Lord of the Sith supposedly gained such an insight into the Force that he was actually able to influence the midichlorians to create life."

I just thought about something everyone is assuming that this means Anakin wasn't born by the force but was influenced by Sidious or Plaguei, I think Sidious does in fact know how to do this but I also think Anakin wasn't created by him and has no father end of story. But it also got my attention on something else. Could this be the key to Anakin cheating death in EP. 3? What I mean is that , maybe Anakin is dieing in EP. 3 after falling into the lava and Sidious influences the midichlorians to create life back into Anakin keeping him alive and placing him into the vader suit. Just a thought

This won't be the case I can assure you. Anakin's mother confirmed in Episode 1 that there was no father. Now with all do respect, she would know wouldn't she?

In Episode IV Obi-Wan says Vader killed Luke's father. Now with all due respect, he would know wouldn't he?


I do believe Anakin has no father however. This may be how Anakin survives the molten hot MAGMA or maybe Sidious is just trying to trick Anakin into believing that Sidious is his father.

If this spoiler is true, then I don't see any point in having palpatine relate this story of Plagueis being able to manipulate the midichlorians into being able to create life except to show that Sidious created Anakin using this power (that he learned from Plagueis as his apprentice).

I mean, otherwise, what's the point of this even being in the film?


corn

Corn quit it!! It could be explaining the whole force ghost thing too.

Till we hear more on this, it could go either way as far as Sids being Ani's 'father'... But I really do NOT think Palg is Ani's father.

Hmm interesting.

JP I don't think its the force ghost theory because the Sith do not know how to return after death no Sith has ever returned as a ghost after they died so there's no way Sidious would know about this info.

I think that Palpatine is saying this because he knows how Anakin wants to save lives and such. This is classic Sidious, feeding his future apprentice the information he needs to get drawn in to the dark side. Palpatine may have been the apprentice that killed Plagueis, that'd be a cool little tidbit of info, but I very highly doubt that Palpatine is supposed to be Anakin's father.

I'm sorry, but I don't see anything in this spoiler that implies in the slightest that Palptine is Ani's father.

It is addressing a difference in Jedi and Sith Philosopy.

Ternian at MF.COM has confirmed in the related Forum topic that the idea of Palps "creating" Ani is not even broached in ROTS, and that we should be concentrating on the opening quote.

It is about Palpatine luring Ani into choosing the Sith over the Jedi - the promise of power.

As a Jedi, Ani will never have limitless power.
So he will never understand how to save Padme.
A Sith's power is not limited by their understanding - with them, the quest for power is paramount, and understanding comes with the acquisition of power.

It is Yoda who works out the "Force ghost" thing.
Something he learns through Ani.
Quite how Ani passes on what Palpatine has told him without alarm bells ringing - I don't know.

Palpatine is talking about extending Earthly life.
Yoda realises somehting that has been thus far been missing in Jedi philosophy through what Ani tells him - but this new method of tapping into the midis is used to extend Jedi's spiritual life.

IMO, it will have something to do with the realisation that midichlorians are all around - they are eternal.
Thus far the Jedi are preoccupied with the midis within.
Where does a Jedi's midis go when they die?
Would a Jedi purge make more midis available to the Sith?
Can one's identity be impressed upon the midis without as well as those within?

Of course, and it was appropriate for him to lie. I just don't see where Anakin's mother trying to hide the truth would come in to play, but I guess you never know.

i still totally think palps is anakins father. then at the end of rotj, it would be like 3 generations fight eachother. it would make way more sense... and dont give me all the crap about how he was born like "jesus". schmi only said that there was no father because he was like never around. she gave birth... she raised him.. she never said anything about .. "just one say i became prgnant"

well, if the rumor is true, it does lead to sidious being the catalyst for the creation of anakin. but i really dont believe that he consciously impregnated shmi. i think if its true than it is just what it says.

sidious knows how to manipulate the will of the force, but in the end the force created anakin, and not palps.

most likely palps had no idea of shmi and anakin...just that somewhere in the galaxy was the one conceived by the force. when he met anakin in episode 1, he knew he found him. for all we know, finding the chosen one was far overdue in his plans, since anakin was raised on a non-republic planet where the jedi just barely discovered him.

IF its true, this is the only way i can see it working. that would mean that palps was not only seeking to fulfil his conquest and revenge against the jedi, but also searching for the ultimate apprentice.

so the jedi elders left out in the prophecy of the chosen one that the chosen one happened to be created thanks to a sith and not the lone force??

If this is true it will be the equivalent to 10 pounds of monkey crap in a 5 pound bag.

but is the monkey crap being sold at the same price??!

Think people should relax a little with the negative criticsms on this topic. Just cause midichlorians are manipulated doesnt make Palps or Plags Anikans father, they are of no relation other than using a force to create a life. I always thought the chosen one idea where Anikan is basically Jesus was always a cheap story line, along with the whole introduction of the term midiclorians. This revelation of manipulation actually makes the story better, more dramatic and makes Ep 1 a better movie aswell. Think about it, Anikan has an extrodinary midiclorian count becuase he is Palps future weapon of destruction. I hope this spoiler is true because the whole prophecy story where someone just is what the are because their the chosen one has been played to death (eg. Neo from the Matrix)

Ummmm, I dont think anyone thing thinks Ani is Jesus, what with the mass destruction & force choking & all...LOL! I know what you mean though, the immaculate conception thing is a bit strange, even for George. But I always liked the midi's, once I heard Geroge's explanation (that they are based on the mitochondria in our own DNA). i would like to hear them addressed in this movie since they were totally ignored in Ep 2. But whether Sids or Plag are the 'Father' of Anakin really doesn't matter. Fact is, he WAS born and all the events of the saga unfolded after that. So to hear more about his origin might be interesting but is not necessary to move the plot along.

The way i see it is that Sideous planned to train Ani from the start but the plan went wrong when the jedi discovered him first, therfore installing into Ani the little bit of good and compassion that eventually saved luke in ROTJ.

first i wpuld like to say who the hell is Darth Plagueis ?????

and even papy can make a someone have more midichlorians. if so y not do it in maul? or a boy he made more direst control over at a young age to train like he did maul. not make the boy have so much power and send him to tatoonie. and Anakin didnt have a father.

NIce thought Brendy!!!

what you people are not seeming to grasp is that you need to think of this issue in a storytellers mind-sight. what would make a better story palp somehow creating ani, of just saying its a mystery? it just gives the story more depth. if it was truly a mystery then that would make Lucas a very bad storyteller in my opinion. you people are taking what palp is saying to literally, you need to pay more attention to facial expressions and such. when when he is talking about plag, what i get from his expression is a sense of remembrance (maby loss??) when he mentioned that his apprentace killed his master in his sleep. and about the way shumi got impregnated, we dont know how the "force" works maby from naboo of wherever palp was he senced what female would produce the best chosen one. to contradict what PVS said,

"most likely palps had no idea of shmi and anakin...just that somewhere in the galaxy was the one conceived by the force. when he met anakin in episode 1, he knew he found him. for all we know, finding the chosen one was far overdue in his plans, since anakin was raised on a non-republic planet where the jedi just barely discovered him."

cant some jedi/sith see the future? there is no argument that palp had total control of everything in the clone wars why not anikens birth? and to impose that the finding aniken was a fluke directly goes against star wars lore, didnt yoda say something like "there is no coincidences just the will of the force". palp could have saw that qui gon and company would land at that section of tatooine and planned the rest from there... who knows?

anyway sorry to have ranted so long i just hate it when people get in the way of creativity

ok ive read what every one has wrote, some are close and some are lost lol. first in part one we find out Ani has no father. but nothing else is said, part one we also find out he has a very hi force count in his blood even higher than Yotta. , now lets not forget the bigg picture. ANI was a slave not by chance ethier it was over a lost bet. and it was also said in part one that if he live closer to the jedi that they would have noticed his powers sooner. ( this brings the question was ANI being hid, somthing like the clones, and by chance or faith a JEDI found him. a boy with more powers then Yotta growing up in a part of the univers were good can not be found. YOTTA even said in part one that he found fear in Ani and traites that were already groomed in him to go twords evil. part 2 shows us a lil taste of what YOTTA saw. now part 2 did any one notice that ANI kept his mom alive?? he wanted her not to die and as a YOUNG PADIWON learner he had enough power to keep her alive because he felt her and cared for her, a whole month of tourture and rape, look how she was tide down. she stayed alive till he saw her. he new she was still alive threw the force ( remeber this because i will go back to it once i get to part 3) OBI askes YATTA ' isn't ANI the chosin one? YATTA states for the first time the profesy mite have been miss read. all the proficy states is there will be a JEDI who will bring Balance to the force. before i go any further i want to remind or inform you all 6 movies are about ANI/ darth vader, know one else!!! unles you learn this the rest will loose you. the only think this movie does not exsplain is the dark side, because it would be a whole new 6 part movie. so i will ask a question to get you on track just incase i lost you. what if?? the dark side had a proficy too. did you notice that the dark side had an advantage in every movvie? yup it was the facted that ever Sith new the force and the arts of a JEDI as well as the dark side, JEDI's only new the force, Darth mall was discribed in part 1 as a thing that new the arts of the JEDI. the DOOK was discribed in part 2 as a man who once was a JEDI. part 3 PaPATIEN says he knows both. so what if, the great wise sith did creat ANI threw the powers of the dark side with out sex say they hid him, so the JEDI would not find him, say he told Papatien about what he did, in conjuction with the proficy. Palpatien KILLs the wise and there after the secrite of ANI is lost, just like the clones when the DUKE dide in part 3 by ANI untill found by a JEDI. remeber the dark side ruled before and was trying to rule again, as Papatien exspained in part 3, so the siths were banking on ANI just like the JEDI was
and why not let the JEDI train ANI every other SITH wass traind by a JEDI even that 4 armed robot beast thing lol. now back befor i get back to the facts i just wanted to give you an idea of the story that was not told, wich was the dark story, now in part 4 BIN canobi states ANI was killed and in part 5 he tells luke the truth that ANI is dead and what is left is more machine then man. in part 3 when ANI was burning he was pritty much dead but thats when the Sith lord felt him went to get him or was that the case? see the Sith new the prificy but still wanted to rule as emire, so he had to make sure ANI could not reach 100% even the SITH new when he told YOTTA in battle that ANI would be stronger. AND Papatien new better then any Sith to get to the top you must kill your master. even Ani new that, thats what he told his wife in a promise to over threw the chanceler and rule, in part 3. Paputine also new that he could never tell ANI everything like the WISE sith before PAPATIEN. DARTH SIDIUSE never had it in mind to tell ANI how to save his wife, cus if he did ANI would not need him. , back toANI burning the darth SITH had to makes sure ANI did not reach 100% so he gave him an imposible mission for a big headed young pupli who would do anything to save his wife. KILL ALL THE JEDI straite suicide. when the clones were doing a good job, and if the two of them would have stuck together there would have been no part 4 but no Sith want a partner. lol he new ANI would FALL but right befor ANI could die the SITh rushed to him like ANI did his mom. but this time with full knowlege or the dark side the SITh kept ANI alive and told him his WIFE was dead, now why is that? dark vader yelled how i felt her, but then lost hope and fell for the lie, sence he gave up his conection with his wife was lost and his power was unable to keep her alive cus in his mind she was dead. this lie was told for 3 resones one if she lived ANI would CHOOSE her over the SITH, 2 she was the last bit of good left in him till part 6 when his\ son comes to remind him of his past. and 3 with her dead he is now 100% darth vader. who can not betray his new master because with out the SITH loard VADER new he would die. thats why when VADER killed the SITH in part 6 he told luke he could not go with him he new his life saveing force was gone thats how PAPATIEN wanted it, because of his ordeal with the one who started this DARTH p THE WISE. back to the proficy darth vader compleated it by killing the SITH and his self bringing balance to the force and returning to the light!!! somthing the Dark side and the jedi did not see haping from the PROFICY but yet in all even though miss read was still forfealed

both miss inturpeted the direct profecy. jedi looking for a quick fix, and the sith looking for an absaulute victory, notice duruing the movies every one had there own vision, part 3 the sith said" the dark side will rule again and there will be peace" in his eyes he was bringing peace ANI realy thought the JEDI was evil and was over throughing the seniet all on perseption, and perseption had every one see what they wanted to see what they needed to see aBOUT THE PROFICY. some might even say luke brought balasnce to the force.. but that would contridict the proficy and luke didnt kill anyone to bring the balance back, last but not lease the story is and was only about ANI

Who's Yotta?

And paragraphs are your friend.

Omg m8!!!!! Please oh please, at least try to get the characters names right. And use paragraphs like Sir Mist stated above. I read the whole thing and it doesn't make sense because its very hard to read, maybe i'l re-read it and then perhaps make some conclusions.

Btw What kind of a prophecy are you talking about from the view of the dark side? That Vader will destroy the jedis?

And whats concerning this thread's title that would make Plagueis his maker, not father

Anyone with any knowledge knows that Anakin's father is a Beef Burrito. Simply because we all know that Beef Burritos have the power to generate Midichlorians.... And they have tasty, Beefy goodness!


Jesus, Darth Plageius the Wise did not create Anakin Skywalker....





Count Dooku did. He decided he would steer away from his life as a potentially busy Jedi Master and go screw some random slave girl. DON'T Y'ALL KNOW?

You're absolutely right about The Force creating Anakin. Not only did GL say it in an interview, it's also on the net as an interview in one of the magazines. I've read it, myself. I linked to it from a thread on the official site and read it, myself. If I can find it, which I sort of doubt because it was a month ago, then I'll post the link back here.

Originally posted by Stunrun
O Plz!? that theory is so lame! everyone knows that Anakin was conceived from the force with no father. Its just like the story of Jesus, the chosen one was born with no father, i thought u people knew this!?

btw, all this is CONFIRMED by Lucas in a documentary i saw, so out the window with that theory!

I doubt it would be Darth Plagueis, some what of a time issue.

It was all a lie to get Anakin over to the Dark Side. A trick. Palps didn't have a clue as to how to create life, let alone stop someone from dying. He used that as a way to get Anakin to the Dark Side, plain and simple. He played on Anakin's emotions about the impending doom of Padme dying and led him to believe he could show him (Ani) how to save her.

Note that at the end, Palps tells Anakin that "Perhaps, together, we can find the way" AFTER it was too late. After Anakin killed Windu. He never knew if it could or could not be done, himself!

Originally posted by cornponious
If this spoiler is true, then I don't see any point in having palpatine relate this story of Plagueis being able to manipulate the midichlorians into being able to create life except to show that Sidious created Anakin using this power (that he learned from Plagueis as his apprentice).

I mean, otherwise, what's the point of this even being in the film?


corn

Originally posted by Nactous
I doubt it would be Darth Plagueis, some what of a time issue.

THANK YOU!

About time someone said something to close the issue

Anakin was what....9 in TPM?
So Plagueis had to create Anakin 9 yrs beforehand, then get killed by Palpatine, then Palpatine had to find a new apprentice.
No chance.

Since we dont know how old Palpatine was, or when he killed off Plagueis, or ANYTHING for that matter, there is no argument here. Anakin was born from the Force, clear and simple.

Found this interesting theory at starwars.com blog dated Jul 26, 2005..........
My theory is that Darth Plagueis can create life, and that, hidding away on Naboo, used his power to create a new being, a twisted creature of darkness that would help him overthow the Republic. This creature was named Darth Sidious.
The way his voice changes, the way he moves, his maniacal laughter and even his animal like roar he unleashes when attacking Mace and his fellow Jedi, all indicates to me that Sidious is not completly human, as if he is a creature created by the Sith. He can easily impersonate a human, as we see in Palpatine, and is incredibly intelligent, but when he is out of control, and in battle, we see the true Sidious.
With this creature of darkness now in the galaxy, the Force has only one option, and that is to create the Chosen One, Anakin. He will be the only one strong enough to stop the galaxy from being destroyed by Plagueis's creation.
Plagueis created a monster, one way or another. If Plagueis created Sidious to take over the galaxy, then Plagueis' monster resulted in his own death at the hands of his evil creation. If Sidious created Anakin, then Sidious brought about his own destruction. Whatever the history is, Sidious did create Vader, which set Anakin up to do his thing with Luke's help of course. There's just something about the idea that evil creates its own demise.

Your welcome.

...

This thread was from last December.

So.

So, why bother bumping it up?

Cause they can.

But it's been dead 7 months, usually it's kinda stupid to even bother bumping it if all the views have changed in the past 7 to 8 months.

What happened to your Moderator status.

I still have it.

If some tag or whatnot disappeared, doesn't mean squat.

Oh..

GL said in May's rolling stone (the one with vader on the cover) that there was no answer for who created anakin. Basically a maybe, maybe not kind of thing.

Word.

Originally posted by Jedi Priestess
NOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!

seriously I thought there was NOTHING Lucas could do that would ruin this for me but THAT would definitely do it.

I thought Priestess was mocking Vader's much-debated "Nooooooo" scene - but then I realized her above reply was back in 2004. Ironic foreshadowing!

I doubt he's his father, like Sir Mist and Nactous pointed out, there's a time gap.

there is no gap. we all that plaugiest tought his sith follower everything
so is it not possible that is follower made ANI?

No, if anyone made Anakin, it was Revan, btw, thanks Exile.

Mace Windu would strike this theory down "with great vengeance and furious anger."

then bust a cap in it.

Revan? Sheesh...

That's odd. Somewhere else in another magazine, he said The Force created him.

Originally posted by viking12344
GL said in May's rolling stone (the one with vader on the cover) that there was no answer for who created anakin. Basically a maybe, maybe not kind of thing.

The Force and no answer, sounds best to me. Rather than Plagueis, which was not included in the movie, or Revan, which has nothing to do with the movie.

And who is Plagueis, anyway? Has anyone other than Palps ever said anything about him? Did he even exist or was that just a story made up by Palps?

A couple things to notice about Palpatine and evil masterminds in general --although they'll hurt anyone to get what they want, they tell very few 'direct' lies. The reason in general, is that its easier to catch a lie rather than detect 'truth'. So I guess it adds to the whole obscurity thing.

But this is probably deeper then GL wanted to go. Its just left there to drive us insane.

My bad, I meantPalpatine. Whew, i dont see why have that sig and avatar. You know, after all this time I am really starting to know why I loved KotOR so much. It had nothing to do with the movies, as Vandar put it"It's just another tale to reeve into the grand tapestry of the order."

You already have a thread on that topic, Padawan.

Not exactly. After reading this thread, I created a thread asking who Plagueis is, not if Palps or Plagueis is Anakin's father.

Originally posted by bobcrickett
You already have a thread on that topic, Padawan.

that im possebel why would plagues create something to destroy the sith basically hes screwing him self over and i got the offical guide it syas nothing of the sort all it says is just belife what you want to cuz thats the way gorge is.

were do you guys come up with this stuff. Anakin just came into Shmi's womb, she didnt say how or WHO! DARTH PLAGUSIS WAS KILLED BY PALPATINE READ THE BOOK DAMMIT

Wow, this is silly.

Sidious said that Plageuis taught his apprentiece all he knew and Sidious didnt knew how to cheat death this is little bit confysing ,any1 care to xplain

People think he influenced the midichlorians to create anakin, i still say jabba the hut tapped that ass

Quote:

"Supreme Chancellor Palpatine claims that a Sith Lord, Darth Plagueis, had the ability to use the Dark Side to influence midi-clorians to create life, and so prevent people from dying. The truth of this claim is not established, although it has led some to theorize that Palpatine was behind the creation of Anakin Skywalker. However, this is never stated in the narrative and is pure speculation. Indeed, the official Star Wars website reveals that creating life and preventing death arise from the same ability, and since Palpatine openly admits that he cannot stop death, it seems highly unlikely that he has the ability to create life.

Plagueis's abilities create an interesting thematic development: the Sith attempt to gain immortality by unnaturally holding back death with the Dark Side and manipulating life, while the Jedi accept physical death as a natural part of life but learn how to retain their consciousness and physical spirits in the greater netherworld of the Force."

I hope that helps.


Originally posted by Kun-ni Habeo
Sidious said that Plageuis taught his apprentiece all he knew and Sidious didnt knew how to cheat death this is little bit confysing ,any1 care to xplain