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Im growing sick of hearing people bash christians for there beliefs. Why cant the people here just leave them alone

im no church person but christians drive me nutz cause all they tell me is how god will do this for me.


my aunt is a nut with this shit.

not all christians, im a catholic and we do no such thing, ppl confuse all of christianity with mormons and jehovahs witness' along with some others here and there, but you must understand these ppl belive that their purpose is to spread the word of God. But ppl dont generalize christianity with its few instead of its many.

Basically is freedom of speech. A person can criticize any religion as long as that person has valid arguments. All you can do is just rebuttle an argument or say "I don't agree with that".

Of course there are times in which it becomes gang mentality, and they get a kick out of picking on a religion, so is just better to stay off and let them get their jollies. God only knows why they do it (yes that was a pun)

also could be the same reason that ppl dont like lebron james or kobe bryant, christianity is the top religion, and as long as your on top ppl will hate you

Nah. Kobe's a self-righteous rapist, and that's why I hate him.

Keep in mind he officially never raped her. He was acquitted of the charges because the case against him was extremely weak, which suggests that whore was full of shit.

I do agree that Kobe is self righteous, along with selfish and an *******. But it's kinda tactless to call him a rapist when he technically isn't.

innocent until proven guilty anyone?

Legally innocent until proven guilty. It doesn't mean that people aren't allowed to have their own opinions.

damn, quickest way to get off topic award of the month goes too.........us

That's what happens when there are numerous topics on basically the same topic (Christianity/religion.)

Yep...

On the topic, Christians (as a whole) probably wouldn't get criticized so much if the more outspoken members of the religion wouldn't always criticize those of other beliefs. What goes around comes around.

NOTE: I'm not saying that all Christians are like this, as I know that's not true...but a good deal are that way.

the general public no, but the media usually condemn these guys, and the public follow suit...

I have no problem with Christians and their belief, what ticks me off is when they bash EVERY other religion. And then say they do it bacause their religion says so.

I'll leave them alone...When they stop trying to shove their archaic, preposterously ridiculous, scientifically disproved, prejudiced, homophobic, sexist religious beliefs down my throat.

Christians have become increasingly aggressive when it comes to domestic and foreign policy. They are influencing the bans on gay marriage, gay adoption, stem cell research and their support of the Iraq war (a war that will feel will protect Israel) is absolutely deplorable!

Christians are a greater threat to America's future than middle eastern terrorists!

Not all who claim they are Christians are true Christians.
Not all who call to Jesus 'Lord, Lord' are real followers.

The true Christians are in the Bible. The ones who do God's will.

Christians, indeed, are criticized, bashed, whatsoever... as what Jesus Christ Himself proclaimed: "You will be persecuted, and many will criticize you (His followers) becasue of Me." (I'm not saying that was His actual words, it's something like that since I don't have my Bible with me right now) ...

And, He is right.

...Its people like you that make people hate us, Napalm and Jury.

We are not all homophobic, anti-abortion, Iraq-supporting, bible-thumping, other-religion-bashing threats, Tex. Many of us are just regular people, who just want to do what they think is right.

Napalm, shut the hell up and get on with your life, and thank yourself we arent living back in the Roman Empire.

Jury, put down the non-sensical thing called the Bible and read a novel for a change.

And dont say that I'm bashing you, because I'm the son of two pastors, and trust me, I would never insult my own parents, unless they pissed me off, which is hard to do...

Those that are homophobic, anti-abortion, ect., you'll find are mostly Mormons, J.W.s, or Catholics. Us Protestants(except for maybe the Anglicans), on the other hand, I find are much more willing to listen to reason.

Why do people bash us? I'll tell you why. Because our entire theology is based on the teachings of a book written by unknown people, claiming that a one holy supreme being who lords over all the earth is speaking through them. If I didnt have two pastors for parents, I'd have resigned to Buddism a long, long time ago. It is hard for people that were not brought up in a Christian family to accept....let alone believe. And the people that have "bashed", in your eyes, Christianity have had some pretty damn good points! Did you even read the posts? Its not just "cristions r so stoopid", they type out why they think our religion is wrong, and invite for rebuttle.

And WindDancer, I wouldnt preach the 1st Amendment to him. He's a Bush supporter, I doubt he knows what the Constitution is. But then again, nor does Bush.

well if you dont like it I guess the religion forum is a place you should stay out of then.

oh plenty of conservatives protestants beside the angelican that are anti abortion.

Ok this is my view of things, I changed my church cuz they wanted the gay marriage thing. I am not against gays I just beleive that I cannot be gay because of my beliefs. I am against abortion but I won't hate people for it it is personally something I wouldn't do and there are circumstances in which I do accept abortions like in my case I have epilepsy it's very mild so I don't have to do this-but my aunt had it too hers though was very advanced she got pregnant and had an abortion because if she hadn't of the baby would have died anyways and she would have probably gone insane. I don't tell my gay friends I'm against gay marriage- if they call it something else like a unity or something I'm all for it

not much of a friend if you are against something that would make them happu

Words of wisdom...

I do not criticize Christians for their beliefs. I do not agree with them......but beliefs are good. If the Ten Commandments are the only thing that is keeping some of these nutjobs from killing and stealing.......go Christianity!

I have a problem with religion in general. I do believe that people having their own personal beliefs to be a good thing........but I despise organized religion as it has nothing to do with a person's own beliefs. A person will have the same beliefs whether they are a member of a church or not. The function of the church is for people who believe the same to get together to reassure one another that their beliefs are right. If a person truly believes in something......why do they need to be reassured by others? When these people get together and reassure one another their beliefs are right.......they automatically assume all others are wrong by process of elimination. If your belief is right then all beliefs that are different must be wrong. This leads to superiority complexes (which many Christians suffer from....the phrase "he thinks he's holier than thou" didn't just pop out of nowhere without reason)....and in many situations, violence. So much violence in history would have been avoided if there was no such thing as religion........if people just believed what they want to believe and be content in their beliefs without having to form a gang with others who share the same beliefs.

I do not have a problem with Christians in general. My parents are Christians. I have a problem with SOME Christians........those who proclaim their beliefs to be fact and speak of them as so. You know, the kind of people that when a subject comes up they're like, "the bible says this so this is how it is" instead of "i believe that ______".

Beliefs.....good. Ideas....good. Religion....bad, no need for it and resultes in conflict and/or violence.

You hit the nail on the head.

Thats about the most low brow idiotic thing Ive hered.

Come again?

I believe the conflict lies in the nature of humanity. I do not believe it is a matter of Christian and non Christian. Humanity at its very base nature has the need to form a belief system, when other people disagree with that belief system, you will find a back and forth dispute or bashing system will take place. It happens with everyone, in many different areas. It is not limited to Christianity.

the christian faith is full of flaws and hypocrisies thats why lol

No one should do that any faith.Just because we don't understand something does not mean we have to say something bad about that faith.
That is why we ask questions guys.So we can understand it better.How would you like to be made fun because of what you believe in?The more we understand each others faith the better!JM

agreed

Thanks!JM

yea... for some ppl most in KMC like tex, finti, etc. think that every single christian person in earth are the same like "satan has blinded you with homosexuality" or "abortion is against god's law" i mean **** it literaly **** it if they think they're so smart saying that we are against scient or somthing, i mean r they trying to b WISE? cuz yes there's some ppl like JM (no offense) that do say, homosexuality is wrong, abortion's wrong, etc. but me, yes i do believe in god, but i 200% support gay marriage, and i dun give a tiny litte rat's ass wether woman abort their babies... so its like saying from now on all the atheist are the same... they all hate christianity and burn bibles and beat up christian kids.... would u ppl like us to treat u that way?? ...think about it

None taken.And you had given me something to think about.JM

oh i feel wise lol!

Yes you should.You are one wise man!LOL!JM

Why do you want queers to marry

cuz they're ppl, they have the right to get married!

tohugh lets not go off topic with gay marriage

Don't you think that marriaged should be only between a man and a woman?JM

not really, i dont thinkmarriage is about a man and a woman i think is about love.
if two ppl any gender want to stand up and compromise to foreever lasting love, i think we should let them...
...but as i said this topic is about ppl picking of christians dammit

So it is.Sorry!JM

If you believe that Adam and Eve stuff, you must be high.

just shut up come on, i dun believe n that butmayb some ppl do... i mean if ure just gonna say bad things about christianity that is not...considered a good argument just keep it to yourself

I just wish you Christian people would stop turning America into Jesusland.

America is culturally, educationally, medically behind most of Europe and Asia because of Christian doctrines forced into our childrens textbooks and state laws.

You know tex if you hate america so much move to europe if not stop
b!tchin about it

You should thank Jesus that theres still worldly, open minded people like me in America to counter balance the religious wackos.

I make America great and better its future.

If things get too bad theres always San Francisco and NYC.
I'll live happily ever after with the fabulous gays!

After you go to queer land maybe you stop complaing

Name one example of Christian doctrines forced into children's textbooks or state laws. Oh wait, you can't because there isn't. Get a clue about what you are talking about before you go running your mouth off bashing Christianity. America is not behind medically, don't know where you get that from, and how the hell is it behind culturally when it is the most diverse country in the world. Somehow I think you are coming up with these statements trying boost your confidence by bashing other people's beliefs. Good luck in life with that.

You should come with me! winkiss

Shut the up

Um. . . how about not being alowed to learn about evolution in some states? Because it disagreed with the bible? But then what would i know, I live in Europe.

Your kidding right?

Wow, you people really need to educate yourselves.

Take notes doll:

Evolution is being removed from many textbooks in America, in School Health Books information about contraception, condom use and birth control pills are being removed - abstinence is the only safe-sex method being discussed.

In those same health books when discussing marriage the lines were changed from "Marriage is a between two loving people" to "Marriage is between a man and a woman".

Culturally? Gay marriage, gay adoption and abortion are all common place and widely accepted in Europe. America is way behind.

Medically? - Are you not aware of the recent stem cell research controversy? Bush refuses to support it. Because of pressure from Christians.

America is way behind.
There are many countries in the world that are safer, have more freedom, cleaner, higher standards of living, better education and health systems, superior technology and infrastructure.

America is a dump compared to most of Europe and Asia.

Chrisitans are just making things worse.

gay marriage is only allowed in two countries and one state so no your wrong AGAIN

Legal gay marriage is quickly spreading in Europe, Spain announced yesterday that they are working to allow it. Most of Europe will also.

Gay couples have more rights in Europe than they have in America.

We should start giving gay Americans more rights and start taking away the rights of fanatical Christian terrorists!

Terrorist hate us because were too free what do you think will happen if we do crap like that!

actually tex is right, on all points, europe is more open minded and seems to have more plain common sense than america. while there are plenty of decent american people the government is f*cked up...

I know tex its those evil christians there trying to scew up everything

NOTE SARCASM

Terrorists dont hate us becasue we're free, they hate us becasue of our foreign policy.

As Osama said, if he wanted to attack us for our freedom, he would've attacked Sweden, a country that offers its citizens more freedom.

But there you go thinking America is the most free country on earth.
Educate yourself, many countries offer their citizens more freedoms.

To make things worse, America has been taking freedoms away since 9/11.

Trying and succeeding!

if u seriously beleive that ur stupid
terrorists dont hate us because of our freedom's, terrorists hate us because we're trying to force our ideals and morals onto them, which they see as a breach of their freedom to run their country how they like, live by their morals and worship their gods.

Christianity sadly spreads like wildfire. because of religious fanatics and 'crusades'

Terrorist hate america because of the gays,abortionist,and all those things you stand for

that is the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard...

you sir, are a dumbass
they hate us for none of those things, the reasons were just layed down on a plate for u but ur too ignorant to see them

Wow, you sound like the Germans blaming the Jews for all their problems before WWII. They are taking evolution out of textbooks because it isn't a fact, it is only a theory. I have yet to see a history textbook have a section on how Jesus died for the sins of all people, it is only mentioned that, that is what Christians believe. In terms of culturally, are Gays all that matter to you? America is much more tolerant of other cultures and is much more diverse than Europe or Asia are, but I guess according to you, Gays are all that matter. Same thing medically. Is stem cell research all that matters to you? It is not just Christians that are opposed to it, but people who have moral values against it. While America may be behind in terms of stem cell research, it is ahead in almost every other aspect. So please, keep the "Christians are making it worse" comments to yourself.

so people in favor of stem cell research have no morals?



like?

the only thing america is ahead of the rest of the world for medically...is treating gunshot wounds... i wonder why

See what happens when your educated on Christian textbooks!

Please educate yourself cal31, before you start comparing people to Nazi's.

Evolution is being removed because its a theory? Shouldn't children be exposed to all theories? Why shun them from anything that doesn't agree with Christian doctrine?

Absolutely preposterous!

America is more culturally accepting? HA! America the most racist, prejudiced, sexist country in the developed world! Why? Christians!

I'd love to keep showing you how your wrong but I got places to be and people to do!

Later dolls! winkiss

So you believe terrorists hate us for abortion and homosexuals, and that backs your point up how? What are you saying we should do everything the terrorists feel we should do?

I honestly must ask...how stupid and ignorant can one be?

You need to grow up and realize that the real world may not always be what you want it to be.

Terrorists hate America because of our shitty foreign policy, as has been said already. So shut up or get a clue. I am SO sick of your retarded and ignorant comments. You clearly don't know what you're talking about, so stop.

It was good god fearing American Christians that dragged the slaves out of Africa, initiated segregation, locked good Japanese/American citizens into prison camps during WWII, butchered Native Americans, limited the rights of women and are now greatly eroding the rights of homosexuals.

As far as world Christians go, dont even get me started on the Spanish Inquisition and crusades.

Jesus would be so proud!

Really if you think about it...after the Nazi's, Christians are responsible for most suffering.

B/c they have single-handedly CAUSED 90% of all problems in history. They are bigoted, fear-and-hate mongering whelps. They oppose civil rights. They promote sentiments of love and compassion, but only for fellow Christians. Instead of beliving in heaven for ALL people, it's only for Christians. Not even for Muslims or Jews, who believe in God. I hate them all

thx dude, way to generalise...

i was born a christian, i believe in god and such, but i'm open-minded enough to support gay rights, abortion and stem cell research.

Wow, you sound like the Germans blaming the Jews for all their problems before WWII. They are taking evolution out of textbooks because it isn't a fact, it is only a theory.

WRONG!
Evolution has been proven buts its been called a theroy because there are still gaps, NOT becuase it hasen't been proven.
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evolution-fact.html

I have yet to see a history textbook have a section on how Jesus died for the sins of all people, it is only mentioned that, that is what Christians believe.
A) Because that it too blatent and all of the Islamic/Jewish/athiest parents would have a cow, for good reasons too. I don't wanna be told what to think in school, I wanna learn facts, not opinions or beliefs.

In terms of culturally, are Gays all that matter to you? America is much more tolerant of other cultures and is much more diverse than Europe or Asia are, but I guess according to you, Gays are all that matter. Same thing medically. Is stem cell research all that matters to you?
There were EXAMPLES! not all that matters to him, he was asked for examples and Tex provided them.

It is not just Christians that are opposed to it, but people who have moral values against it
Good, Im glad, Don't support it, Don't donate money, and if it panns out you can doe from canser or parkensons Disease because you don't believe in it. Me on the other hand, I wanna live. I don't want your radical Christian beliefs to affect me in any way shape or form, so you can believe whatever the hell you want, just don't make it affect me, caphich?

Ironically, what you tried to say sarcastically is actually very very true.

.....Wait wait wait, hold up.........Are you actually saying these things with a streight face?

I myself, am gay? Sooooo America got attacked because of me?

Now wait, I've been thinking about that and have come to the following conclusion.

After you hit yourself in the head about 45 times with a hammer, stand on your head untill you faint, put your head in a microwave for 3 hours to kill numerous brain cells, and then get your head run over by a diesel truck...what napalm is saying kinda makes sense.

I am part native american I can say I dont care about what happend If it wasent for that no one this would be here

Muslims, Jews and many other reliegions are against gays and abortionists I dont see anybody bashing them.

You don't seem to care about anything that doesn't directly affect you.

Because they beliefs are wrong

Their not trying to outlaw gay marrage!
I have no problem with people disliking it. its just when they try to affect others with their opinions (something christians do REALLY REALLY well)) that I get pissed off.

Jews and Muslims are (as a whole adn historicly) very accepting people.

Which is probably because they have been persecuted all through history (by, oh, lemme think here....Christians), so they know what it's like and instead accept others.

Your right I dont

Muslims and Jews are accepting? Wow I guss the taliban didnt get that bit of info And jews are even worse there section of the bible tells them to stone gays. All christians wanna do is convert them

1. Not Angelicans. Angelicans are not Protestant, as they did not branch off from the Lutheran church. Angelicans are plain crazy. Anglicans, notice the absence of the "e", are the Church of England, or "Angland", as its old name was, since they were ruled by the Angles. Anglicans, or Episciples as you might know them, are extremely like the Catholics, except the fact that they can divorce (Thank you Henry Tutor).

2. Did my original point not make it through your thick head, Tex?

Alright, here it is again


NOT ALL CHRISTIANS THINK THE SAME!!!!

For all your apparent righteousness, you fail to differenentiate between denominations.

I support gays and their persuit of happiness.
I am pro-choice.
I condemn the merging of church and state by Bush.
I hate Bush all together.
I am not a Creationist, and believe in Evolution.
I am the typical Pryesbyterian/Methodist/(north) Baptist/Congregational/Recreational Christian.

So do not generalize.



Everyone was good god fearing Christians back then, first off. Second off, although I know that it was wrong and condemn slavery, you must be objective, and look at it from the point of view of the Americans. It was a good way of making money. A very good way. Also, they saw it as liberating the slaves, not enslaving them. We were ignorant back then, but back then, everyone, besides the Africans, thought that they were all cannibals and that Africans were starving to death there, sinces it was "all desert land". Many of the people who owned/caught slaves were just trying to make a living, and they thought they were actually doing the slaves somewhat of a favor, and they thought it was Social Darwinism in the making.

When you watch Roots, dont just focus on the plight of the blacks, listen to what the whites say. That movie was not made to depict white people as evil people, and say "look at what they did! Isnt that horrible!!"(Which it was). It was meant to educate.

The southerners initiated segregation, and need I remind you that Protestants mostly reside in the north?

F.D.R. made that law, and he was hardly Christian. He was pressured, and when you think of the times, look at how the Japanese won battles before Pearl Harbour, you might understand that, although it was a rather harsh desicion, it was one that seemed necessary.

Tex, you cannot be bias when it comes to history. And you are probably the most bias person, besides JM and Napalm, that I have ever met. Be objective.

And for Spanish Inquisition, need I remind you that it was initiated by the most fanatical Catholic probably of all time? It was not just Jews and Muslims that suffered. Many so-called "good God-fearing" Christians were killed as well. The same was apparent in the Salem Witch Trials, and the Red Scare.

As for the Crusades, I will agree with you there. But again, religous fanaticals.

The rights of women had always been that way, and they had failed to question it until that era. Does that mean that I think women should be back in the kitchen making me pies? No. But again. Objectiveness. You must look at history through the prespective of a person in that historic time period.


Now. Although I dont know about Muslims, it states in the Torah that, until the Messiah(dunno how you spell it) comes, no one can be admicible to heaven. That is why, although this is left out in the Bible and mostly forgotten, Jesus decended into Hell. He did it to free the good souls of the Jewish people who had died up until that point. It is included in the Nostic, an ancient, almost dead branch of Christianity, Bibles, but the Catholics of old, whom I can confidently say were bastards, edited it out of their Bible, and then prosecuted the Nostics, for other reasons, however. But I accept this idea.

Evolution is only being removed from certain states. But its not just Creationist Christians who have a problem with it. You forget Jews, whom also believe in the Creation, and Muslims.



And what do you say to Iraq? Afganistan? China? India? Pakistan? Rwanda? Zimbabwae (or however you spell it)? The P.D.R. of the Congo? All of the Baltic countries?

Agreed, compared to most countries that are supposed allies, we are racist and sexist country. But we are most certainatly not the worst.

And don't get me started on atheists. You guys complain just as much as Catholics do.

And Napalm. Dont think that I'm on your side. All of your points are complete and utter bullshit.

That goes for you too, cal31.

"I support gays and their persuit of happiness.
I am pro-choice.
I condemn the merging of church and state by Bush.
I hate Bush all together.
I am not a Creationist, and believe in Evolution.
I am the typical Pryesbyterian/Methodist/(north) Baptist/Congregational/Recreational Christian."

Oh My ****ing God me too. No, really.

Thats okey the only people that like me are on my buddy list. Everybody else thinks Im a douche bag

Wow, from what I've read this place seems to be a breeding ground for the ignorant and imbecilic. I am Christian, although I doubt I'll ever be able to say what I am more specifically. I'm Native American but raised Anglican. Although I don't practise. I go to a Catholic School. It's a strange way to grow up but I can safely say I'm Christian.

Some of the things people are saying here are so...well, let's just say there's no point in fighting against it because it's a waste of time and energy. They say you can't teach an old dog new tricks, I believe this is the same for idiots. I'm not saying you should all convert or anything, I'm just saying if people can't be accepting of others they don't deserve to be accepted into society.

I mean, I may not agree with homosexuality but I don't hate them. In fact, I know a few people who are. I don't despise sinners or anything, I tolerate them. I hope they change their ways. I don't ever force my beliefs onto others, or talk about them to those who don't ask about them.

Whatever, I feel like I've already wasted enough time here as this probably won't reach those who won't let it in.

I finally found someone that agrees with me

Dwarfdude, you're a Christian but you aren't a creationist? How does that work.. I thought Christians were supposed to follow the bible.

It does seem like a major contradiction

glad to see you fit in then

what so safe about it? :

*Balkan, not Baltic, my bad.

As for your question, I dont think I've met one Christian who does believe in the Creation.

Why dont I? Because I simply cant bring myself to believe that fact.

How does it work? Perhaps now would be a good time to say that I'm not Confimed, and that I do not consider myself fully Christian, but rather a New Age Christian. A Christian with a Buddist mentology, some Nostic beliefs and a questioning/scientific mind. But my basis is in Christian Theology.

And why does this matter? I still dont see the problem with me defending Christians, even if I'm not one. Tex's argument is just like saying all Jews are wealthy buisness peop,e who care for nothing but money.

I'm not picking at your argument... I was just curious about you're logic. A Christian who doesn't believe that God is their creator just doesn't make sense to me. Or do you believe God created us in some sort of parallel with science, like he caused the big bang and evolution and all that?

Actually, I wasnt going to explain it because I'm tired, but yes, that is my basic belief when it comes to Creation, Evolution, and God, Afro. That is, that he caused Evolution, ect. to happen, he indeed made the world, but let it figure itself out, edging it along every so often.

Wow, that's why we have Muslim terrorists killing Christians in the belief they will be rewarded in Heaven for it. You must have a different definition of accepting than I do.

^Get your facts straight, cal, before making your argument.

Yes, they attack us. But those are just a small faction. I have various muslim, hindu, and even some shintoist freinds, and they are very accpting, kind people. I met my Muslim friend's, erm, not sure what his proper name is, but a minister type guy, and he was extremely nice.

You, again, are why people hate Christians and America.

Indeed. There are quite a few people on this thread generalizing Christians into one group. Yes there are some radical Christians out there, but there will be radical people in any group. Don't generalize all Christians into one group saying they are all against gays. It is against God's will, but no sin is unforgivable except damning the Holy Ghost. The people who bash Christianity can continue doing it to make themselves feel better about their beliefs, but us Christians can read it right in the Bible that we will be persecuted. So bring all you got at us, cause nothing you say will make me doubt the truth.

Did I say all Muslims? NO!!!! Once again a double standard. Oh it is alright if we group all Christians into one group and say they hate gays or hate stem cell research, but if someone says there are Muslims who are killing Christians because they think they will be rewarded, oh no, why are you saying these lies about such wonderful people. Ignorance is a very funny thing.

SAY WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?!

Read the bottom of my last post, thats all I have to say.

But I'm gunna say more.

WHERE in the bible, does it say that homosexuality is against God's will?
Book, chapter, and verse please.

Marriage is only meant for a man and a woman as it says in the Bible. I don't know the exact verse right now, but once I find it I'll post it.

You said, and I quote



You make it sound like all of the billion Muslim population is out to get Christians.

And should I say, its not because we're Christian.

*Le gasp**Rest of the class*Its not?



Its because we're American imperialists and colonists.

It's in the bible.. I've seen it posted by other Christians before. "if a man lay with another man they shall both be put to death.." Or something like that.

And they are delusional nutjobs.

I suggest Dwarfdude look at this:http://www.danielpipes.org/article/990
or this:http://search.netscape.com/ns/boomframe.jsp?query=Jihad+against+Christians&page=1&offset=0& amp;result_url=redir%3Fsrc%3Dwebsearch%26requestId
%3D1ce11d92ea5c9386%26clickedItemRank%3D8%26userQu
ery%3DJihad%2Bagainst%2BChristians%26clickedItemUR
N%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.mensnewsdaily.com%252Farchive%252Fyz%252Fz-misc%252Fzieve%252F2004%252Fzieve121604.htm%26invocationType%3D-%26fromPage%3DNSCPResults%26amp%3BampTest%3D1&remove_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mensnewsdaily.com%2Farchive%2Fyz%2Fz-misc%2Fzieve%2F2004%2Fzieve121604.htm

Genesis, 3:16.

Tell me, does that mean that all the women in the world should bow down to us men, and do whatever we say?

In Levitivus it gives the admonitions of the Jewish leaders to their people who were *ahem* at it all the time and probably decreasing their birthrates!

The fanatics? I wont deny that.

Yeah I don't mean all of them. Just like when you said they hate us cause we're imperialistic colonists I assume you didn't mean all of us..

Chapter and verse, please?

As for your article, Cal, it only further proves my point that Muslims are after Americans and not Christians.

"Jihad did have two variant meanings through the centuries, one more radical, one less so. The first holds that Muslims who interpret their faith differently are infidels and therefore legitimate targets of jihad. (This is why Algerians, Egyptians and Afghans have found themselves, like Americans and Israelis, so often the victims of jihadist aggression.)"

Never says anything about Christians there.

"The purpose of jihad, in other words, is not directly to spread the Islamic faith but to extend sovereign Muslim power (faith, of course, often follows the flag)."

Not there.

Those are the only two comments remotely related to our discussion.

No, no, no, not all of us. Half of Americans dont know what Imperialism is. Common answer is "Does that have to do with Star Wars?"

No, not all of us. The Government, namely Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Bush Senior (hes still pulling strings and everyone knows it).

Come on down to Bradford Or go to Oldham! http://smilies.crowd9.com/otn/evil/bgbiggrin.gif

Did you miss the part about the Islamic group that killed 10,000 Christians in Indonesia? And here's the second link again since it didn't work the first time:http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/yz/z-misc/zieve/2004/zieve121604.htm

If you notice, and not many people, I said as a whole and historicly.
This means that if one little fraction is radical I don't count them.
But most Chritians are unaccepting and bigots.

Yes, I am generalizing. You are a rare breed, my friend: an open-minded Christian

I do read The Da Vinci Code... very nice.

Im a Christian

but Im not a Catholic
Im not a Protestant, a Baptist, an Adventist, a Methodist, Jehovah's Witness, a Mormon...

My Church is in the Bible... we call it the Church of Christ.

never liked that one too much

Hmmm. Well, in the big picture, historically, the Christian faith has been responsible for a lot of bad things. And it is to a degree true that for a time Muslims and Jews were kind of accepting (the Jews have rarely been in the position to oppress people, but then their was the founding of Israel... and early Islam didn't force conversions, but terrible things have happened since)....

Generally I don't criticise any religion, I understand their are bad eggs in all, and I don't mind people having faith, whether it is similar or different from my own. However, there is room for making observations, and really Christianity has had a lot to answer for, which makes criticism understandable. Equally so, it is pretty much the worlds top religion, and many on this forum come from "Christian" countries. As such, it is what people know, and experience, and therefore know the most about...

But everyone criticise it? I don't think so, and if thats true, it is usually constructive criticism.

of course, you don't.

thats not of course, I just found the stuff in it based on unreliable things taken for facts.

It started of pretty cool but never could keep the momentum of the start and ended rather poorly

just so things r clear, i do agree with u, yes there r sme jesus freaks, but we're not all like that the only thing that i am saying is that fopr some ppl christians are all the same, and we're realy really not, so thats wut i am saying...

PS: most european countrys are FAR more christians or believers than the US. italy, spain, greece, germany, ireland, croatia, etc.

lol u byotch u mkae me laug, oh btw i do agree with u, there r many jesus freaks in america HOWEVER there is some ppl like me dammit! cry

thats only 6 countries out 44

Thanks doll! winkiss
Many smaller European countries are very religious (Catholic mostly), but unlike the US, they do not try to shove their beliefs into their government and legal systems.

On Thursday Spain (Very Catholic religious country) announced that they are planning to legalise gay marriage.

That's my biggest problem with American Christians, they impose their beliefs on everyone in America through their political influence.
...and then they wonder why everyone criticizes them so much.

Oh, just for the record, I'm not an atheist; I'm a deist.

wuz a deist???

and yes i do agree that most european catholic countries mind their own buisness if they dont like gay mariage well then they dont marry gay ppl but the gov should allow it, togwther with abortion, etc.
and also i think its retarded that evolution is banned in some catholic schools... thats sorta retarded

and also how some schools dont decorate for christmas cuz some kids might b offended is likem WTF ??? i dun think a jew would b 'offended' by a christmas tree

or mayb they would... wel i dunno really

Abortion is legal in th US Tex.. in fact it's more legal than it is in some European countries. And I don't think Christians are the terrible people you say they are. Sure the important ones might be.. and the extremists and all that but almost everyone I know is a Christian.. most of them really aren't bad people. The overall views of Christianity can be classified as homophobic/racist/whatever but most modern Christians aren't bible freaks. They believe in God but nobody I know goes around quoting the bible and I know a lot of Christians who are for gay marriage and abortion. You can condemn them and say they are ruining America all you want but the bottom line is most Christians are good people. Same with Jews and Muslims and any other religion I've come into contact with. You always get a few freaks that take it overboard.

Ok I am sorry but just because someone is labeled christian or calls himself that doesn'rt mean he actually is. I mean like everyone calls himself christian nowadays and does belpive in the most different shit that is just stupid. You have to define christianity on overall beliefs not aboot reading a book. Just by beliveing in god you are not a christian already that is just plain stupid.

what smaller countries would that be?

Smaller as in not super power. (Spain, Poland etc)
Norway is mostly Lutheran? I believe, but just look at your country. It's a liberals dream!

Its a shame all the cool people always go to Sweden, no one ever goes to Norway! tongue10

Norway New Years Parade:

http://cache.corbis.com/CorbisImage/thumb/12/93/30/12933093/BIR-03CJ087-004.jpg

Your right.. believing in the Christian God doesn't make you Christian.. otherwise Jews would be considered Christian too. Believing that Jesus Christ is the son of God and your savior makes you a Christian.. and everyone I know who claims to be a Christian believes in this.

All you care about are gay equal rights well I got somethin for ya . Equal rights equal shit. Its gonna scew up the ecomony with the insucance benifits

Please explain how a very minute majority of the US population will ruin the economy via insurance benefits.

Deist - The belief, based solely on reason, in a God who created the universe and then abandoned it, assuming no control over life, exerting no influence on natural phenomena, and giving no supernatural revelation

..........You dont even know what a novel is, do you?

A novel is a story, not an overly-typed essay, like the Da Vinci Code. I novel is something like To Kill a Mockingbird, Night, or Animal Farm. And by the Church of Christ, you mean one of two things. Mormon or Evangelist.



...................................................
Need I say more?

Yes.

You homophobic bastard. YOU, Napalm, are why everyone else hates our country. You dont even know your own Constitution, nor the American Declaration of Independence. And if you deny these documents, you commit treason.

And you just did. The most quoted line in American History, perhaps. "We hold these truths to be self-evident. All men are created equal..." ect. Ok, then, no equal rights. You know what that means? I can beat the sh*t out of you whenever I want.

Its going to screw up the economy? Too late, Bush kindly provided us with that.

By the way, Tex, nice pic.

.....Penguins are cool.

ok cause they are rather big countries in Europe population way

state church Lutheran, in a survey under 30 % says they are religious so I guess we are pagen bunch

Only Pagans should dislike a Christmas Tree (druidy, human sacrifice pagan) as they are the only group that are ever dissed at any time during the Christmas Tree's history.

ok in order to critisize christianity you would first have to critisize the teacher that layed down the rules for this belief system correct? In a christian perspective that would be jesus. well lets see what jesus had to say.
"But i say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them that hate you"
"Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful"
Ok those are two things jesus said. Do those condone hate or bigotry?
wether you agree with jesus is a different topic, the question is did jesus promote hatred?
remember when a whore was to be stoned jesus said let the person who has no sin cast the first stone?
Jesus stood against hate and judgement and promoted forgiveness and mercy.
I could list several more but i think you get the point.
Now there are "christians" that don't follow the practices of jesus, that is not a revelation i think.

The Da Vinci Code is not a novel?

Then why is it entitled:

The Da Vinci Code... A Novel... by Dan Brown

Da vinchi code IS a Novel, by definition.
It tells a story, Robert Landon (or whatever) does not exist and all his expoits are fictional
and its longer than a short story, (50 pages=short story??)

oh ok, and i also believe that god doesnt interefere with our lives much... i guess he just wants to fight fr our lives ourselves... mayb he does interefere sometimes... but mosty of the time i think not

and to those ppl who say that equal rights would ruin the economy are stupid! go democracy dammit! gay ppl should b able to marry!

The Da Vinci Code might be labeled a novel but what he meant when he said novel was more like Catcher in the Rye, The Hitchhikers Guide or Lord of the flies.
Something like that you know.

The issue was between me and Dwarfdude... this is off-topic, but he raised it first.

It remains the fact that "The Da Vinci Code" is a novel.

A novel according to the author himself.
A novel according to San Francisco Chronicle...

That's why I consider it a novel.

So why ask me? Why not ask the ones originally considered it a novel.

Maybe Dan Brown was wrong.. maybe the SF Chronicle was wrong.... maybe the publishers were wrong. I dunno.

It says it's a novel. So, it's a novel.

Yes but that is beside the point. He used the wrong word he didn'T mean that kind of a novel but more something that is considered a "classic" novel.

Yes, maybe they were wrong. The author himself maybe wrong when he considered it a novel. The critics were wrong when they consider Brown's book as novel... The publisher maybe wrong when it entried the book as a novel.

It's not me who say it's a novel. That's what I've learned from the author, the critics and the publisher themselves.