So Carnage is

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Ock
Killed off in issue 2 of the New Avengers.Bendis certainly has a MAJOR grudge against the symbiote folk

pr1983
dude... a spoiler woulda been nice...

Ock
Um this issue has been out ages confused

pr1983
much appreciated...

Ock
It's sorted wink

fever red
No.
Bad Ock.
No.
Bad, bad Ock.
No.
(sob)

Symbiotica
.... Is he really dead?

We have not seen his body.

Nor will we, I have a feeling evil face

Red Superfly
Why would they kill off Carnage in the New Avengers? He's a Spidey villain they could at least kill him off in Spideys line.

ScarletSpider
Actually you do.

Spoilers:














In fact, you see both portions of it, as he was forcefully ripped in half and both pieces tossed into space.

VENOMfan
really? three symbiotes was more than enuf anyway.


I was expecting him to die in VENOM/Carnage

I havent read new avengers, which one ripped him in half? had to been either sentinal or Ironman. none of the rest can do that to someone like carnage

ScarletSpider
More spoilers....

Carnage was attacking a few people, they called out for help. Sentry came onto the scene, grabbed Carnage and rocketed up into space in a manner of seconds. He then proceeded to rip in half, discard of him, and was on his way back down to earth when the issue ended.

Usually I don't like useless deaths, but in Carnage's case, I didn't find myself too affected. His 15 minutes were up years ago.

Red Superfly
There's no way ripping Carnage in two will kill him.

Just you see, he'll re-form and heal just fine.

Nobody dies in comics.

The Inkeeper
What about that chick spidermand liked first?
She died

Red Superfly
Edit

Red Superfly
Did she really?

We saw her neck snap, we all know she IS dead, but in comics, that means diddly-squat.

The Inkeeper
so the fact she fell from that height, landed, died, and hasnt been seen since doesnt mean shit?

What, is peter going to wake up one comic and see herin the shower, realise it was all a dream?

fever red
I think his point is that they've found ways to revisit her charactor; like her clone, and now her daughter who is the perfect image of her. Who knows; they might just have it all be "faked" and reveal that it was a look-alike who died. They do play pretty fast and loose with "death" in the comics. Sometimes to the point of it being ludacrous; but it's the comics, so it usually flies.

wuTa
noone is 100% dead in the comicworld (except if your the parent of a superhero) but gwen stacy is probly the closest to it....as for carnage he has way to big of a fanbase to be killed off...he may be dead but his death wont last any longer than supermans

Symbiotica
Scarlet: "In fact, you see both portions of it, as he was forcefully ripped in half and both pieces tossed into space."

Means little. As hardly needs repeating, symbiotes and the people bonded to 'em are very, very difficult to kill. The two halves were not far enough apart to prevent a re-bonding.

Carnage is not exactly a stranger to pain; he could come through this. evil face

"Usually I don't like useless deaths, but in Carnage's case, I didn't find myself too affected. His 15 minutes were up years ago."

......aaaaand so were Scarlet Spider's, if you get my drift. Now you want to talk "useless," Scarlet Spider just epitomizes "useless" IMO. evil face

Ironman
can you post a pic of the ripped carnage i goto my comic shop tomarrow i wanna see the ripped carny

thundercracker
maybe kletus died but the symbiot could still come back ...... with a vengance ...& bacon

shaber
wow. Are they inventing new characters or something?

doctorstrongbad
Carnage is still alive. I have heard rumors that venom or eddie brock have died. The only villains that are know to be dead are the original Kraven the hunter and Mysterio if you have read the Kevin Smith daredevil story.

dami wilson
carnage is far better than you my moron friend! If you dont like it go go fly away from that cliff I told you about. Anyway who are you to talk? Dr oak huh? At least I dont hide behind some fictional name. You got the nerves? Spill out your name! Come on mi boyo! Spill it out and be a man!

Ock
Aaaaaand another post to report to the moderators.Keep em coming wink

Endenkton
Originally posted by dami wilson
carnage is far better than you my moron friend! If you dont like it go go fly away from that cliff I told you about. Anyway who are you to talk? Dr oak huh? At least I dont hide behind some fictional name. You got the nerves? Spill out your name! Come on mi boyo! Spill it out and be a man!

Wow you seem stupid laughing

doctorstrongbad
So much love on the forum.

Endenkton
Originally posted by doctorstrongbad
So much love on the forum.

Yep but none of it is for you laughing out loud

Anyway Carnage will be back.Something that evil never dies smokin'

thundercracker
well no one in comics seems to really die so yeah he will be back not sure how theyll pull that one off......

Ock
Doc Ock had his neck snapped and they brought him back.

Norman Osborn was impaled by his own glider and they brought him back too.

Carnage is no different.He will return somehow.There are ways,there are ways...... evil face

thundercracker
2 true but sometimes i wish people would just stay dead its like come on its death the end but not for you cause your a cash cow

doctorstrongbad
Originally posted by thundercracker
2 true but sometimes i wish people would just stay dead its like come on its death the end but not for you cause your a cash cow

Yeah that is true. How many times have they brought back jean grey? ugh Okay back to the post, I think that they will back Carnage. They may have to make it a different human but the symibiote will return. Now what about Toxin? I know a lot of fans that wish he would die and stay dead. smile

Spiderman_RJ
NOOOOOOOOOO they killed carnage:? BASTARGES!!!!
and how the heck he got out of silver surfer prison anyway? he was suposed to be there alive forever.

kiekan
OK, people... people. Lets me point this out: there is no way Carnage died in that episode. If Marvel actually regards Carnage as dead, then they've screwed up with their own physics and what not. Let me explain...


To anyone who read the comic, notice when Carnage was wripped in half, that Kasady was no where to be seen.... meaning that it was just the Symbiote going around. Think of the symbiotes shown in that old Spider-man Unlimited tv series (as lame as it was).

On top of that, we've seen symbiotes get wripped apart before, even when their bonded with a host. Take for example in The Exile Returns arc, where Venom begins shredding Donna's symbiote, terring it right off her face. Also, look at the Maximum Carnage arc (As in the comics, not the game).... here Venom completly wripps apart the Carnage symbiote, tearing it right off of Kasady.

Also, you can't say he's gonna die from lack of air or something, because its been shown that Symbiotes don't breath air.

Doc Ock
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/24/Sentrycarnage.jpg

It looks like the symbiote is hollow inside......meaning no Cletus.

dubefan
i just love watching ock work thats why im here

Nataku8188
Originally posted by kiekan
OK, people... people. Lets me point this out: there is no way Carnage died in that episode. If Marvel actually regards Carnage as dead, then they've screwed up with their own physics and what not. Let me explain...


To anyone who read the comic, notice when Carnage was wripped in half, that Kasady was no where to be seen.... meaning that it was just the Symbiote going around. Think of the symbiotes shown in that old Spider-man Unlimited tv series (as lame as it was).

On top of that, we've seen symbiotes get wripped apart before, even when their bonded with a host. Take for example in The Exile Returns arc, where Venom begins shredding Donna's symbiote, terring it right off her face. Also, look at the Maximum Carnage arc (As in the comics, not the game).... here Venom completly wripps apart the Carnage symbiote, tearing it right off of Kasady.

Also, you can't say he's gonna die from lack of air or something, because its been shown that Symbiotes don't breath air.

Add that to the fact that he wasn't in Rykers. Notice in V/C carnage is a free sym, yet suddenly he's imprisoned in Rykers? I wasn't aware the NYPD could take him down.

DrDoom
Cassidy isn't dead, because if you noticed Sentry created like four sonic booms before he took him into space.

I'm sure the soundwaves separated Cassidy from the symbiote like Ock said. He ripped the symbiote apart in space--but the symbiote can survive up there. So Carnage the character is officially dead--but the door has been left open for the symbiote to return and find another host.

In the MK universe Eddie Brock is now dead, and Mac Gargan is the new Venom. I rather like this.

Next Venom_girl
Originally posted by DrDoom
In the MK universe Eddie Brock is now dead, and Mac Gargan is the new Venom. I rather like this.
I think it sucks. sad

Spideys Sister
They shouldn't kill carnage off he's funny
in a sic demented evil symbiote kinda way laughing laughing

dubefan
carnege isnt funny, he just says the stuff that most villians never did, his mind is completely screwed up

Spiderman_RJ
mac gargan? isnt him the scorpion? so does the venom looks like scorpion or he just have the suit?

dubefan
scorpion has a green suit, venom is blakc and its not a suit, the venom is aliving thing that takes over eddie brock

Spiderman_RJ
i know that, he said mac gargan has the simbiote, so im asking if gargan wit the suiit looke like a black scorpion or simple a black suit....
venom is a suit, a very poor,ugl suit..that should never haver shipped in......

Mainstream
he looks like a skinny verison of Eddie Venom.

dubefan
ya sorta

Mainstream
sorta yeah

Spideys Sister
WTF!? A SKINNY eddie?

dubefan
have you never seen scorpion ???? he not that big

Spideys Sister
I like scorpion. I'm not trilled but hes okay..

dubefan
ya he looks like askinny eddie brock

Spideys Sister
okay.. I just can't picture a skinny eddie is all
anerexic... laughing

DrDoom
Originally posted by Next Venom_girl
I think it sucks. sad

Brock/Venom, as a character has been raped beyond recognition over the years. You can't even really properly define what he was about (besides killing). Was he:

1) A victim of the symbiote that became a "lethal protector" of the innocent?
2)A psycho who wants to eat Spider-Man's brain?
3)A suit that needs to feed off of peoples adrenaline?
4)A reporter who was "screwed over" by Spider-Man and just happens to have an alien living inside his body?
5)All of the above?

He was cool as Spidey's opposite number, but he was too cool--so they diluted him into an anti-hero and made Carnage to fill the role he previously had. BIG MISTAKE.

At least now, Mac Gargan who actually had a clear direction to his character has the suit. Still, I wish they would've let him manifest a tail...

Doc Ock
Scorpem is awful sick

Stupid Millar.

Spideys Sister
And he complains about MY spelling...
S-C-O-R-P-I-O-N!

Doc Ock
No no no you misunderstand.

Scorpion + Venom symbiote = Scorpem wink

Spiderman_RJ
what? brock died of cancer and gargan got the suit?
can u explain that? its spiderman fault gargan is scorpion again, spiderman was furius with harry as goblin and beted up a unarmed mac gargan without the suit, when gargan had left the crime and was beggining to start a new life, im pity for him......

Spiderman_RJ
it should been scorpom then (EEK)

Spiderman_RJ
or scorpiom ,lol

Spideys Sister
OMG! Veniom eek! eek!

Doc Ock
Originally posted by Spiderman_RJ
what? brock died of cancer and gargan got the suit?
can u explain that? its spiderman fault gargan is scorpion again, spiderman was furius with harry as goblin and beted up a unarmed mac gargan without the suit, when gargan had left the crime and was beggining to start a new life, im pity for him......

No Brock didn't die of cancer.He committed suicide.He slit his wrists.

Before that he auctioned off the symbiote to a bunch of criminals and super villains.Some rich gangster bought it and gave it to his loser son who died fighting Spider-Man.

Then the Venom symbiote made its way to Mac Gargan and Scorpem was born sick

DrDoom
lol...Scorpem.

Like Mac said "I'm the new Venom."

Yeah, MK Spider-Man was hit-and-miss. Millar could've written two very,very good year-long arcs instead of cramming everything into 13 issues.
The Sinister 12 fight was cut waaaay short, and we only saw snippets of him throwing down with Sandman,Lizard, etc.
It's like he had so many ideas but only a limited time, so instead of choosing the best ones he jammed them all into the arc.

Doc Ock
Not to mention what he did to Ock mad

And the art.Ock looked like a neanderthal man or a gorilla nono

DrDoom
Lol yeah, they drugged and brainwashed him. It was sad, I'd rather they have done it to Rhino or Conners.

Plus, the bridge fight was the first time I've actually said bulls*** out loud when reading a Spider-Man comic since the Spider-Clone and Stacey twins mess. The people on the train thought I had gone crazy.

I was like "If there is a lightning bolt that hits the bridge or Ock's tentacles I'm going to be soooo pissed."

Doc Ock
Yeah we could of had a Doc Ock Vs Green Goblin fight sad

Ock would of whupped his green ass wink

Spideys Sister
Classic

dubefan
clasic indeed but very accurate

Spideys Sister
Doc ock and goblin team up? Bad idea?

dubefan
and whsy that? cus spiderman would get OWNED?

Spideys Sister
hey doc just said they should whup each others asses, sooooo....

dubefan
ock would kill himend of convo

Spiderman_RJ
brock is dead? UHUUUUUU
but hey is this another of the plenty marvel alternative universe or the real one? and the simbiote joining mac gargan is stupid........this means gargan know peter is spiderman, and ooops? spiderman is now a murder? what the heck are they doing?

Spideys Sister
Spidey a murderer! eek!
Thats good.

dubefan
didnt brock die when the symbiote was blasted by the sound waves of that space ship taking off or something?

Spideys Sister
No I think he just fainted

dubefan
well than thats goods

Spideys Sister
Eddie sucks without venom but cassidy rocks even without carnage.

dubefan
wel thats becasue cassidy is a mental patient and a homicidal maniac eddie was just pissed off

Spideys Sister
LOL

dubefan
ya

Spideys Sister
Eddie hasnt killed anyone has he?

dubefan
i dont think so

Spiderman_RJ
u didnt answer me is brock dead in REAL world or just another pararel world form marvel?

Spiderman_RJ
and eddie killed at least a dozen of people, he murdered a office to scape his prison , a couple o people on the stree and a bunch of thugs and terrorrists.

doctorstrongbad
Yeah Eddie brock is a bad guy who has murdered before, in one comic he talks about it and actually feels bad.

Next Venom_girl
MK is non-standard continuity, so his "death" in it is not canon for the rest of the Marvel Universe.

Doc Ock
Really??

You positive about that??

Next Venom_girl
I heard it from someone else, but I'm pretty sure, since for one Pete and MJ's ages are different then in other mags. Not to mention that it doesn't match up at all with stories in Amazing (such as Sins Past)

DrDoom
Yeah, the MK universe is separate from 616.

So Carnage is gone in 616, but Venom is not. And the old Venom is gone in MK, but Carnage is not (IDK if he's even made his MK debut yet).

Another example is how MK FF differs from the 616 FF.

Doc Ock
I'm pretty sure they are not seperate.All events that happened in 616 Spidey were acknowledged in Marvel Knights Spidey.

Eddie is dead.Or at the very least very severly injured.

Spiderman_RJ
Mk dont follow amazing cronology but its event are real,so it mean uhuuuu the witch is dead, the witch is dead!!!!!!

i want a life of my own,venom no more.!!!!!!!!

Spiderman_RJ
severely injured? he said he suicided!!!! u liar

Doc Ock
I said or severly injured.

He was never proclaimed dead in Marvel Knights.

Just like Ock was never proclaimed dead in SM-2 wink

Spiderman_RJ
STOP IT! would u.........(grunchs to himself) he disapears........humfpt. drowned he is.

and im not talking about u, the other guy said he cut his wrislters, u call that severelly wounded?

also ock had his neck broke and then came back, what is ridiculou, he should never should been killed anyway, nor the strong woman he dated. kane should had killed venom instead, if he wanted to relief spiderman from his pain.

Spideys Sister
We saw him drown in the river... hes gone bye bye

dubefan
ya he only sank to the bottom of the hudson i think hes dead ock

Next Venom_girl
Comic book characters NEVER die (except for when they do) blink
At any rate Eddie and Ock live.

Spideys Sister
For now...

Spiderman_RJ
hope for-E-V-E-R

Doc Ock
Don't make me whip out the proof that Ock is still alive again.I'll take the word of Sam Raimi and Alfred Molina over you lot any day.

Doc Ock
Ah what the hell I'll whip it out anyway:http://www.nicklogic.com/batbrain2.jpg

How much credibility does the opinion of you guys have?? ZERO

How much credibility does Sam Raimi and Alfred Molina have?? 100%

You can whine and b1tch and stomp your feet all you like.But the proof is there.Ock is alive.

The sooner you accept it the better wink

Spiderman_RJ
like u said im a idiot that should be banned for my stupidty so i dont believe that.....

Doc Ock
Nice to see you're staying true to form wink

P.S. Carnage will be back.That is what this thread is about.....

dubefan
ya carage was cool

Next Venom_girl
Still is.

dubefan
unless something cooler comes along

Doc Ock
One man's trash is another man's treasure....

dubefan
wait there is a villianc ooler than carnage and venom combined, THE JOKER ya he was boss and completely menacing, the symbiotes got nothing on the joker

Spideys Sister
Originally posted by Next Venom_girl
Still is.

Always has been always will be!
Happy Dance laughing Happy Dance laughing Happy Dance

dubefan
what always has been and always will be?

Spideys Sister
Cool carnage you said it yourself! eek!

dubefan
no i emant the joker is cooler than the symbiots, now excuse me something more interesting than people who dont know how to read

somebody told me you had a boyfriend who looked like a girlfriend i had in february
thats right my hurendous singing is better then litening to spideys sister who doesnt know how to read

fever red
Singing trolls? *shudders*

Doc Ock
Hey Fever dubefan is not a troll.

He's harmless deep down wink

DrDoom
MK picks and chooses which 616 events they want to make canon, IDK if it's vice versa, but I doubt it. If it is something major, then they put it in--like how Aunt May's house was destroyed in the 616, so they moved to Avengers' Tower.

And yes, Ock is still alive and kicking in the 616. I'm like 90% positive Brock is dead in the MK verse. Spidey even said that he opened up his wrists on a streetcorner, and I'm pretty sure they had a pic of him dead. My memory is fuzzy, so I'll have to flip thru my collection a little later to confirm it.

Next Venom_girl
He was bloody and slumped over. The quote was along the lines of "I don't know if he'll last the night." and they never mention it again. But I'd check his pulse before we declare him dead. stick out tongue

Symbiotica
Originally posted by DrDoom


I always enjoy stomping on this rumor every time I see it. I'm 90% positive he's not.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL17/812957/5809649/91138885.jpg

I don't see "He's dead" anywheres on this. If I thought someone was going to shove me into my grave on the basis of "It doesn't look liks she's going to make it through the night," I'd damn well pack a lunch.

"Never count a human dead until you have seen his body. And even then do not be too sure." - Bene Gesserit proverb

....nowheres is that more true than in comics. Nowhere.

Symbiotica
And is Carnage dead....? Hah.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL17/812957/5809649/88589768.jpg

Carnage never dies. So saith I.

thundercracker
man that was hard 2 read ..... when was that?

dubefan
thanx for grabbin my back ock, joker was the ultimate bad guy, the symbiotes are cool and all but dont hold a candle to the joker

Spiderman_RJ
WT heck?spidey said he was lock on silver surfer cage ( i have that issue, where carnage even bond with SS) how did the simbiote got away. and to say brock survived , only if his simbiote goes back to him otherwise , bye bye........eddie, not much of a loss i might say

Doc Ock
Originally posted by DrDoom


And yes, Ock is still alive and kicking in the 616.

We know that.We're talking about movie Ock confused

And Sym you can show these guys all the evidence you like.They still sit there and stomp their feet saying "No no NO he's dead cos I said so" roll eyes (sarcastic)

Spideys Sister
I have a movie book " The Daily Bugle storys" It said Docs arms weighed him down and he died...

Doc Ock
Originally posted by Spideys Sister
I have a movie book " The Daily Bugle storys" It said Docs arms weighed him down and he died...

Oh well then it MUST be true.

Ignore Alfred Molina and Sam Raimi.The movie book is right roll eyes (sarcastic)

Next Venom_girl
I have the DVD.
The Ockumentary.
They say Doc Ock Lives. "All these comic book movies where they kill off the villain. I rarely ever did that. I was more greedy with good villain, wanted to save them"--Stan Lee comentary. "How many times in a story does the bad guy fall off a cliff, oh, he must be dead, only to return later? It's a classic element of storytelling." --More from DVD comentary.
(Oh and they mention Venom and Carnage too. *drools*)

Spideys Sister
Doc ock staus: Unknown
OK?

DrDoom
Originally posted by Symbiotica
I always enjoy stomping on this rumor every time I see it. I'm 90% positive he's not.

I don't see "He's dead" anywheres on this. If I thought someone was going to shove me into my grave on the basis of "It doesn't look liks she's going to make it through the night," I'd damn well pack a lunch.

"Never count a human dead until you have seen his body. And even then do not be too sure." - Bene Gesserit proverb

....nowheres is that more true than in comics. Nowhere.

Which is why I said my memory was fuzzy and why I said 90%. Like I said, I only remembered the pic of him laid out and the quote about him opening up his wrists. I went and checked to see if I was correct and I wasn't (so far).

Jeez, cut a guy some slack eh? It's kind of hard to remember details of a comic after you haven't read it in months.

doctorstrongbad
I think Doc Ock is still alive. I'm sure they will being back the green goblin also, it only makes sense since Spidey has fought them both so many times.

dubefan
OCKS DEAD HE DROWNS AFTER BEING ELECTIRCUTED AND POSSIBLY CRUSHED BY THAT BIG BALL THINGY sorry to say it, but hes dead and at the bottom of the hudson

Doc Ock
Originally posted by dubefan
OCKS DEAD HE DROWNS AFTER BEING ELECTIRCUTED AND POSSIBLY CRUSHED BY THAT BIG BALL THINGY sorry to say it, but hes dead and at the bottom of the hudson

Sorry to say it but you're wrong.

Spideys Sister
Big Ball thingie? Fusoin Reactor w/ trinium core. Get it right or roll out! rolling on floor laughing rolling on floor laughing rolling on floor laughing rolling on floor laughing

dubefan
i got it now but sorry to say it ock, hes dead, i mean he drownds, if he comes back ill be happpy but unfortunately hes not

Spiderman_RJ
he doesnt drowns, he is BOILED!!!!!!!!! after all theres a giant mini sun behind him in the water.......... the tentacles dies, so means he is also dead, he is the link to keep the tentacles alives, get over it dude, u are being as boring as mr parker with his man spider thingies, and the idiot girl who loves venoms.

Doc Ock
You guys are stupid.Seriously I mean what kind of idiots ignore the facts from the movie makers???

Pretty damn stupid ones.

Doc Ock
http://www.nicklogic.com/batbrain2.jpg

So dubefan and spiderman rj say Ock is dead.

Sam Raimi and Alfred Molina say he's alive.

Geez who shall I believe??? So hard to choose.........yeah I think I'll go with Sam and Alfred.

Goldenskull777
praypimpWorship the pimp.

Goldenskull777
cokepepsi

Goldenskull777
wheelchair whip

Doc Ock
Stop spamming!!!!!

Spiderman_RJ
go ahead i dont give it a dam, just cos they talked to each other dont mean its oficial u STUPID FANBOY!!!!!!!!!

Doc Ock
Of course it's official.

He said it in a public interview.

I'm a stupid fan boy?? I'm not the one going against the facts stated by the damn director and actor in the SM-2 movie lol.

Jimmy Buggs
dude you are a total fan boy . lmfao@ u

Doc Ock
Proud of it too big grin

dubefan
well until i see ock and his tenticles crawly out of the bay im gonn assume hes dead

Endenkton
Originally posted by Jimmy Buggs
dude you are a total fan boy . lmfao@ u

And someone like you who comes and posts on a Spider-Man message board isn't?? roll eyes (sarcastic)

Idiot.

You're all fan boys and fan girls.Including myself.

Deal with it.It's not a bad thing Happy Dance

Spiderman_RJ
no fan boy is meant to designate someone who is blind they their love to their hero/villan/anti hero, and dont listen to reason, im a fan merely not a fan boy.

Endenkton
Thats the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

And Doc Ock is reasonable.He has proof there.The Alfred Molina/Sam Raimi thing.

It's unreasonable of anybody to doubt proof like that.

What we need proof of now is what villains are in SM-3 mad

Doc Ock
Originally posted by Spiderman_RJ
no fan boy is meant to designate someone who is blind they their love to their hero/villan/anti hero, and dont listen to reason, im a fan merely not a fan boy.

Look dude if I had not read that interview I'd agreeing with you that Ock is dead.

But Sam Raimi and Alfred Molina said he isn't.

Thats more than good enough for me.

You don't want to believe it then fine.Your choice.

But by your reasoning we shouldn't believe anything Sam Raimi says.

Jimmy Buggs
Movie ock is 100% dead. Even if he is alive if they put him in another movie it would be lame. The only villian that should come back in a movie is Joker.

Doc Ock
Oh I see your logic now.

You personally like the Joker so it's ok for him to return.

LOL! Damn am I glad I have my proof big grin

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