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who wins?
discuss!

Short fight: SM wins.

this should get a few posts, but Spidey takes it he is superior in all physical ways, has precognitive sense and webs, Cap is fast for a human but moves in slow-mo compared to all-out-fighting-Spidey

I am gonna go against the grain here and say Cap.
My argument here is experience, patience, intel(Cap has intel on SM because Shield and the Avengers keep a file on him).
Here comes the insults and death threats...........
I have learned in this forum to never go against SM fans/lol

I'm going with Captain America after a long fight on this one.

Even though Spiderman is physically dominant to Captain America just about every area....Captain America is a better hand to hand fighter.

They've fought before, even though it was a mere misunderstanding, and Captain America proved he is capable of hitting Spiderman.

Spidersense really won't play as big of a factor as in other Spidey fights because everything they do to eachother is going to right up front and personal, no sneak attacking, no double teaming. Spidey will see exactly what his Spider-sense would normally tell him.

The most important factor in this fight isn't Spiderman's physical ability, it's Captain America's knowledge of Spiderman. As LordFear eluded to, Cap has the information needed to take Spiderman out.

Originally posted by Linkalicious
I'm going with Captain America after a long fight on this one.

Even though Spiderman is physically dominant to Captain America just about every area....Captain America is a better hand to hand fighter.

They've fought before, even though it was a mere misunderstanding, and Captain America proved he is capable of hitting Spiderman.

Oh I don't think it will be a problem for the good Cap to hit Spider-Man, not because he's that fast, just because he's a brilliant fighter.

The big problem is:

1. Is Captain America strong enough to knock down Spider-Man ? The answer is yes, but he needs A LOT of punching and kicking, and I just don't see that happening.

2. Can Captain America take a full hit of Spider-Man ? Of course not.

Captain can definitely kick Spider-Mans butt, but not in a straight fight.

Spiderman is 165lbs.

If Captain America decked him full bore....he'd send Spidey flying (not far by any means) but he most certainly is capable of taking him off his feet with a punch.

Spidey, theoretically, could punch Captain America's head right off his shoulders.


Of course, when written in a comic, Spiderman will never get a punch off like that, and Captain America will land numerous blows like that....because Spiderman can easily take the abuse.

This isn't going to be won by fists, there's going to be an achilles heel that Captain America goes for....

Out of curiosity, what information on Spiderman is gonna help him
in an open fight? What knowledge can possibly counter-act Spidey's
speed, strength, agility, spider-sense....?

This would be a cool fight, but I don't see what "info" will be useful for
Cap to use. It's not like Spidey gets weak from kryptonite or something....

Originally posted by Linkalicious
Of course, when written in a comic, Spiderman will never get a punch off like that, and Captain America will land numerous blows like that....because Spiderman can easily take the abuse.
True.

Oh boy... I hate to sound like some desperate fanboy (which I am by the way lol), but I don't think Spider-Man has some kind of weakness Captain America can use against him.

I said exactly the same thing in the SM vs Batman thread ("Batman will kick his ass, he will find SM's weakness and defeat him !" . Yeah right. Every time I asked which weakness we were talking about, I only heard the sound of silence...

Random fight : Spider-Man
Prep-time fight : probably Captain America, but Spider-Man can take it too.

Every bit of information about Spiderman is going to help Captain America in a fight.

How fast he is. How strong he is. What his tendencies are. What his web is made out of and how it can be destroyed. Generally anything you could imagine.

If you knew Spiderman was prone to throwing upper cuts, wouldn't you find a way to adequately counter any uppercuts thrown at him?

Captain America isn't great because he "knows a lot about different people." He's great because using that information he is able to calculate counter measures to ensure victory.

To be honest, I think that the fight could go either way. Im pretty sure that Spiderman can take whatever Captain America gives him. I cant really say the same for CA though. We all know that writers wouldnt have Spidey hit Cap with half his power, or that would be the end of it for Cap. Captain is trained in many different forms of fighting and hes also an intellegent fighter and that works to his advantage. Know your opponent. Yet Spidey doesnt really have a style, and that works to his advantage as well. Both have great reflexes and should be able do dodge alot of blows. I think it depends on the stipulation on who wins. I say stalemate. Just my opinion though.

Originally posted by Linkalicious
Every bit of information about Spiderman is going to help Captain America in a fight.

How fast he is. How strong he is. What his tendencies are. What his web is made out of and how it can be destroyed. Generally anything you could imagine.

If you knew Spiderman was prone to throwing upper cuts, wouldn't you find a way to adequately counter any uppercuts thrown at him?

the trouble is, Spider-Man doesn't have a set "style" for fighting, he often goes moment by moment with the openings he sees and lets his spider-sense tell him when to duck or move....... in a straight up fight he will be able to dodge at least 90% of Cap's punches/kicks and, with his vastly superior reflexes, land at least 50% of his own attacks...... that's taking into account Cap's own reflexes..... if it were someone like Hawkeye i'd say Spidey would land 90-100% of his attacks

i don't see how any info on the webbing could help Cap here as he has no resources other than the shield to cut it and not enough strength to break it...... if he takes the time to try and cut the web with his shield edge he leaves himself open to a much faster and stronger opponent....... Spidey should win 9 out of 10 fights...... if not more

And let's not forget Spiderman's superhuman ability to crack bad puns
and worse jokes. This alone will make Cap beg for mercy....

The intel that Cap has is enormous.
As Link stated everything you can think of from strength, web composition, tendencies while fighting, endurance, speed and agility.
Cap uses this info very well even in a inpromptu fight.
Furthermore I once read that during a debriefing by Fury to Cap and IM, Fury mentioned how he has files on every metahuman he is aware of on the planet and have contigency plans for them all. What you guys gotta remember is that Cap has access to Shield info and if Cap has read up on SM, then it's a good chance that Spidey is in a world of hurt!!!!
A little bit of intel goes a long way, my friends

Originally posted by LordFear
The intel that Cap has is enormous.
As Link stated everything you can think of from strength, web composition, tendencies while fighting, endurance, speed and agility.
Cap uses this info very well even in a inpromptu fight.
Furthermore I once read that during a debriefing by Fury to Cap and IM, Fury mentioned how he has files on every metahuman he is aware of on the planet and have contigency plans for them all. What you guys gotta remember is that Cap has access to Shield info and if Cap has read up on SM, then it's a good chance that Spidey is in a world of hurt!!!!
A little bit of intel goes a long way, my friends

Spidey has also stated that he has a contingincy plan for every hero he knows........ so they both have plans...... but i think Spidey will still win in an unplanned fight in the park with no prep

i still don't get how cap knowing about spidey's web composition can help him in the middle of a fight....... more likely it'll just let him realise he can't escape when he's webbed up

Jeepers Freaking Cripes...Okay...it's Official now...Cap has now become Omniscient...lol..damb..I thought Batman was the only Human level hero who had this God like ability ability.....

no I didn't say that intel alone could defeat SM. Merely pointed out that this dude(Cap) knowing how his web works and what's it made of would tell him not to get hit by it and also let him know that if his shield could cut the web if needed.

Originally posted by LordFear
no I didn't say that intel alone could defeat SM. Merely pointed out that this dude(Cap) knowing how his web works and what's it made of would tell him not to get hit by it and also let him know that if his shield could cut the web if needed.

if it got to the point where Cap needed to cut the web then it'd be over for him..... and two weblines coming at you fast are hard to avoid.... especially if they only come from a few feet away........ the webbing can also be blanket sprayed to completely tangle him up...... it is really effective against anyone who isn't uber-strong

spider whould kill cap all jhe has to do is web him up and thats it spidey can lift 10 tons and cap can lift 1500lb cap can fight but spidey has a spidersence and is more agil;able than cap and is more dirable than cap


spiderman is the best

Originally posted by Scoobless
the trouble is, Spider-Man doesn't have a set "style" for fighting, he often goes moment by moment with the openings he sees and lets his spider-sense tell him when to duck or move.......
True, he's a very unpredictable fighter. Sometimes a brilliant fighter, sometimes clumsy, but most of the times unpredictable. He relies almost entirely on his instinct and his reflexes.

Originally posted by LordFear
The intel that Cap has is enormous.
As Link stated everything you can think of from strength, web composition, tendencies while fighting, endurance, speed and agility.
Cap uses this info very well even in a inpromptu fight.
Furthermore I once read that during a debriefing by Fury to Cap and IM, Fury mentioned how he has files on every metahuman he is aware of on the planet and have contigency plans for them all. What you guys gotta remember is that Cap has access to Shield info and if Cap has read up on SM, then it's a good chance that Spidey is in a world of hurt!!!!
A little bit of intel goes a long way, my friends
I know how Kasparov plays chess. Can I beat him now ?

C'mon who kid can't bring that into play.
If you were a season, well versed chess player then I would say why not?
Study the man's behaviors, tendencies, game play and apply proper counter strategic moves and yes then I would say your chances increase drastically, otherwise no!!!
WIth the scenario here. Your analogy would presume that Cap has no kind of formal training, expertise, stategic counteroffense due to intel to best SM AT ALL!!! that I disagree wholeheartedly

Even if Cap knew what Spidey was gonna do, even if he could predict
what Spidey's actions, reactions, moves, webs, and everything.....
....what's he gonna do? Hit Spiderman? Punch him? Kick him?
Spidey can take hits from Cap all day.
Is it totally unrealistic to think Spidey won't get at least a few hits on Cap?
One good punch is all he will really need....

Originally posted by Scoobless
the trouble is, Spider-Man doesn't have a set "style" for fighting, he often goes moment by moment with the openings he sees and lets his spider-sense tell him when to duck or move....... in a straight up fight he will be able to dodge at least 90% of Cap's punches/kicks and, with his vastly superior reflexes, land at least 50% of his own attacks...... that's taking into account Cap's own reflexes..... if it were someone like Hawkeye i'd say Spidey would land 90-100% of his attacks

i don't see how any info on the webbing could help Cap here as he has no resources other than the shield to cut it and not enough strength to break it...... if he takes the time to try and cut the web with his shield edge he leaves himself open to a much faster and stronger opponent....... Spidey should win 9 out of 10 fights...... if not more

Spiderman's style is his own, but that does not mean his technique is flawless by any means. He throws punches and kicks that are just as counterable as any other punch or kick...specifically his uppercut which leaves a huge opening to the body and face.

By saying that Spiderman can dodge 90% of what Cap can throw at him, you've just turned Captain America into a run of the mill bank robber. Captain America might miss one or two times, but by then he'll start calculating movements and then coordinating counter measures.

The surface of Cap's shield resists the adhesion of Spiderman's webs and when thrown, the shield is fully capable of cutting a line of Spiderman's web.

Spiderman only thinks 1 or 2 steps ahead of his competition....usually "trying" different methods before he finds the optimal attack. Captain America regularly works several steps ahead of his opponent.

Captain America is Captain America because he doesn't lose to ANYONE 9 out of 10 times...

Originally posted by Zahit
Even if Cap knew what Spidey was gonna do, even if he could predict
what Spidey's actions, reactions, moves, webs, and everything.....
....what's he gonna do? Hit Spiderman? Punch him? Kick him?
Spidey can take hits from Cap all day.
Is it totally unrealistic to think Spidey won't get at least a few hits on Cap?
One good punch is all he will really need....

One horizontal shield swipe to the back of Spiderman's head and he's out cold.

Spidey's body could take the abuse all day....severe head trauma only takes a few good shots.

Theoretically...one hit is all Spiderman needs. But lets be realistic here....how many times have you seen Cap get thrown into a wall or was sent flying by a back hand only to get up? Just about everytime. He's a superhuman, not a regular one.

this one comes down to strength and endurance. Cap's sheild could buy him some time, but his shield would result only in a night of bruises for spiderman while he throws back a brew and kicks his feet up on the shield of the late captain america.

For once I would love to see Peter Parker literally kick back and join
Logan, Ben, Herc for a pint at a bar....that would be a fun issue.

Originally posted by Linkalicious
Theoretically...one hit is all Spiderman needs. But lets be realistic here....how many times have you seen Cap get thrown into a wall or was sent flying by a back hand only to get up? Just about everytime. He's a superhuman, not a regular one.

realism isn't what it used to be...... neither is nostalgia for that matter.......

Cap was created to be a "peak" human, in any bio it says "peak" human, not super-human..... that was the whole point of him......to show what a human can be capable of at "peak" level

Marvel continually writes Cap as the last man standing (not always, but close enough) i've always found this to be bull..... fair enough, he's a good tactician but against a foe like Spidey that only helps him for the first second before the fight begins

Originally posted by Linkalicious


this is exactly why he'll lose........ a ton of "bad guys" have tried to calculate and counter Spidey's movements, including the sentinels, the thing they can't understand is that anything they calculate doesn't matter........ they can say "he's moving this way so i strike.....NOW" but it wont help, even after Cap calculates, strategises and plans his next 5-7 steps, Spidey's spidey-sense says "i've got a better idea..... lets NOT get hit" and he outmaneuvers him on pure instinct

giving Cap 90% hit rate was fairly generous i'd say..... i'd give a bank robber 0-5% max...... and that's only if they have a few guys and some hostages..... i'd only give Iron Fist 50-75% hit rate....... but i think IF would beat Cap

When Stan Lee and Steve Ditko set out to create
"the most unique superhero ever," they didn't f*ck around....
They succeded beyond their wildest expectations with Spiderman.
To this day, there is NO hero in comics with the combination of
super: strength, agility, equilibrium, sixth-sense, etc.
That's why Spiderman is so difficult for anyone to fight.
It's not that people overestimate Spiderman, it's that people who
don't read a lot of Spiderman underestimate his combo of powers.
In fact, traditionally, Spiderman's strength is usually under-written.
He's rarely ever shown to demonstrate his FULL strength against people.

Originally posted by Zahit
When Stan Lee and Steve Ditko set out to create
"the most unique superhero ever," they didn't f*ck around....
They succeded beyond their wildest expectations with Spiderman.
To this day, there is NO hero in comics with the combination of
super: strength, agility, equilibrium, sixth-sense, etc.
That's why Spiderman is so difficult for anyone to fight.
It's not that people overestimate Spiderman, it's that people who
don't read a lot of Spiderman underestimate his combo of powers.
In fact, traditionally, Spiderman's strength is usually under-written.
He's rarely ever shown to demonstrate his FULL strength against people.
True. Except for the spider-sense, Spider-Man's powers really are nothing special.

It's the combination however that kicks as.

Originally posted by who?-kid
True. Except for the spider-sense, Spider-Man's powers really are nothing special.

It's the combination however that kicks as.

yeah....... i remeber one time Spidey was fighting the Beetle and the whole time he was kicking Abe's a$$ he was lecturing him on the advantages of having well rounded powers......then he threw him through an electric billboard........sweet!

SM is not such a unique character. Granted he is a great fighter and good character but to make him out like he is practically unstoppable is madness. The sentinels can't gauge SM or really anybody for that matter. Who or what can predict accurately someone's next move?
I argued in Cap's favor originally just to make things interesting. Despite all of that truly if my money was riding on it, SM would win. But people I just wanna mention that unlike this forum general belief of SM being able to vanquish pretty much everybody earthbound in MU, it's not the case. SM is great, ,really great but let's be clear that there are heroes way out of his league.

Originally posted by LordFear
SM is great, ,really great but let's be clear that there are heroes way out of his league.
SM has been defeated lots of times.

But at least he's not the boring "last man standing" like Cap was in for example Infinity Gauntlet, when Thanos beat everybody except Cap (who wasn't really fighting, only running around a bit and screaming "Attack !".

SM loses sometimes of secondraters, but in the next issue, he smashes a powerhouse. He's not Mr. perfect and makes mistakes, sometimes lots of them, but when he's impressive, he kicks ass like nobody else.

That's why I like him.

of course there are people out of his league...... lot's of them....... but Captain America is definitely not one of them

the main reason i like Spidey is because he's not invulnerable, invincible, doesn't have a power for every day of the year and can't warp time or space....... he's mortal, tries his hardest, gets his ass kicked on occasion and still makes it to work the next day

Originally posted by Scoobless
realism isn't what it used to be...... neither is nostalgia for that matter.......

Cap was created to be a "peak" human, in any bio it says "peak" human, not super-human..... that was the whole point of him......to show what a human can be capable of at "peak" level

Marvel continually writes Cap as the last man standing (not always, but close enough) i've always found this to be bull..... fair enough, he's a good tactician but against a foe like Spidey that only helps him for the first second before the fight begins



this is exactly why he'll lose........ a ton of "bad guys" have tried to calculate and counter Spidey's movements, including the sentinels, the thing they can't understand is that anything they calculate doesn't matter........ they can say "he's moving this way so i strike.....NOW" but it wont help, even after Cap calculates, strategises and plans his next 5-7 steps, Spidey's spidey-sense says "i've got a better idea..... lets NOT get hit" and he outmaneuvers him on pure instinct

giving Cap 90% hit rate was fairly generous i'd say..... i'd give a bank robber 0-5% max...... and that's only if they have a few guys and some hostages..... i'd only give Iron Fist 50-75% hit rate....... but i think IF would beat Cap

Super serum.....super soldier. Shit, it's all the same difference, call him peak human, then look at the list of accomplishments on his resume and tell me how non-super he is...

Fact...Spiderman WILL NOT knock Captain America out in one punch. It just won't happen. Could it? Theoretically yes, but will it? No.



A "ton of bad guys" try to calculate his moves? name one.

Once you do that...compare him to Captain America....then get back to me.

I wouldn't say giving Captain America a 90% hit rate is all that generous, because he won't just sit there aimlessly swinging at Spiderman in hopes of one day hitting him....he'll hit him, clean, and hard.

Originally posted by Scoobless
the main reason i like Spidey is because he's not invulnerable, invincible, doesn't have a power for every day of the year and can't warp time or space....
Yeah he isn't like Batman who, in that endless utility belt of him, has (according to the fanboys) a weapon for every hero/villain/crisis.

Like Spider-Man once said : "My idea of preptime is wearing clean underwear."

Originally posted by Linkalicious
Fact...Spiderman WILL NOT knock Captain America out in one punch. It just won't happen. Could it? Theoretically yes, but will it? No.


He COULD knock-out Captain America, but he WON'T?????

explain please.
cause really, if someone 20 times stronger than me punched me....
my ass is knocked-out.

name one?...... Chance.... not as physically tough as Cap but has a bunch of weapons controlled by computer that hit faster than Cap

sentinels (during Onslaught) attacked, followed, calculated, ganged up on and got beaten by Spidey....... multiple sentinels compared to Cap are a much bigger threat

Iron Man 2020.... used computer targeting and analysis..... got beat to a pulp by Spidey..... compared to Cap.... tougher and way better armed

sorry.......... got a little carries away........ you only wanted one.......

who kid I just wanna address one thing you mentioned and that's when to relate to a character, I don't think of Spidey, but I think of Bats. Here is a young boy who witnesses his parents death, never got over it or the grieving process, decides not to be a victim anymore nor let others be a victim. Instead of going off hiding and enjoying his millions as a playboy, he decides to do something about it, trains his mind and body into a lethal weapon and uses his state of the art access to techs to better his odds against foes he knows he might one day encounter who are immensely more powerful then him. Now THAT'S RESPECT, COURAGE AND LOVE FOR A CHARACTER. You just can't compare the both, in my opinion.

Scoobles I just wanna say that Arno Starks was a cheap version of the real mccoy. Granted the guy is related to Stark but he was no Stark neither thought or fought like Stark. Just cuz I would wear IM's armor doesn't make me worthy or experienced to go fight metahumans. It takes more than an armor to do the things Stark has!!!!

Originally posted by LordFear
who kid I just wanna address one thing you mentioned and that's when to relate to a character, I don't think of Spidey, but I think of Bats. Here is a young boy who witnesses his parents death, never got over it or the grieving process, decides not to be a victim anymore nor let others be a victim. Instead of going off hiding and enjoying his millions as a playboy, he decides to do something about it, trains his mind and body into a lethal weapon and uses his state of the art access to techs to better his odds against foes he knows he might one day encounter who are immensely more powerful then him. Now THAT'S RESPECT, COURAGE AND LOVE FOR A CHARACTER. You just can't compare the both, in my opinion.
I think there's a misunderstanding, I'm actually quite fond of Batman.

I'm not so fond however of the writers these days, who make him do stuff he, let's be honest, shouldn't be able to do, and make him fight villains that are just too big for him.

Batman is the best this, the best that, is always prepared, analyzes everything, knows 127 martial arts, has a butler, blueprints, an endless utility belt and without a doubt also a healing factor, because NO human being can take 5 % of the beatings Batman received.

I know it's only comics, and they always exaggerate in comics. Fine, no problem. But I don't like the fact that Batman is considered the best because he's "so human" because if he really was half as human as they claim, he should be dead or fighting guys like the Joker and Killer Croc, and not Judge Death or so.

Oops, way off topic. Spider-Man wins !

Not off topic just wanna see where you stood on the matter.
I do agree with you, but can't that be said of oh let's say Xmen???

Originally posted by Zahit
He COULD knock-out Captain America, but he WON'T?????

explain please.
cause really, if someone 20 times stronger than me punched me....
my ass is knocked-out.

Apparently you read the first sentence of my post and just jumped straight to writing your retort.

Read the part where I say "in one punch"


Now read every single Captain America comic, all the Avengers comics, and every team up or cross over comic Captain America has ever been.

Finally tell me how many times he's been knocked out in one punch.

I bet you can count the number of times that's happened on 1/2 of one hand.


Theoretically...it's extremely possible. Infact, Cap should be knocked out by one punch. But will it happen? No.

Originally posted by LordFear
Not off topic just wanna see where you stood on the matter.
I do agree with you, but can't that be said of oh let's say Xmen???
To be honest, it can be said of every hero or superteam. Spider-Man is no exception by the way.

But at least, the super powered people like the X-Men have some - lame - excuse for doing things they normally can't do : Oops, my power suddenly has increased... must be the training that Prof. Xavier gives me, or it will be another "unknown" power of me that hasn't been discovered yet."

It may sound stupid, but at least it's some kind of an excuse. Batman doesn't have those excuses but still pulls unknown talents out of his ass on a daily basis.

Originally posted by Scoobless
name one?...... Chance.... not as physically tough as Cap but has a bunch of weapons controlled by computer that hit faster than Cap

sentinels (during Onslaught) attacked, followed, calculated, ganged up on and got beaten by Spidey....... multiple sentinels compared to Cap are a much bigger threat

Iron Man 2020.... used computer targeting and analysis..... got beat to a pulp by Spidey..... compared to Cap.... tougher and way better armed

sorry.......... got a little carries away........ you only wanted one.......

you missed the part where I said compare them to Cap.

Chance - Not as touch as Cap. I'm willing to guarentee he's no where near the hand to hand fighter.

Sentinels - Cap's taken out numerous sentinals in the past. Infact, i'm quite sure that he took out atleast one or two during the Onslaught saga. Apparently their calculating isn't quite on Captain America's level.

Iron Man 2020 - Jesus you're digging deep to find someone who is tacticlally inferior to Captain America, has slower reflexes, and no where near the back ground information on Spidey.


I'm sorry....were you just listing a bunch of hacks or...well....what did you waste both of our time with here?

Originally posted by Linkalicious
Sentinels - Cap's taken out numerous sentinals in the past. Infact, i'm quite sure that he took out atleast one or two during the Onslaught saga. Apparently their calculating isn't quite on Captain America's level.

I'm not saying he didn't, but I don't remember it. I only remember him - during the Onslaught crisis in NYC - running around and shouting orders.

Originally posted by LordFear
Scoobles I just wanna say that Arno Starks was a cheap version of the real mccoy. Granted the guy is related to Stark but he was no Stark neither thought or fought like Stark. Just cuz I would wear IM's armor doesn't make me worthy or experienced to go fight metahumans. It takes more than an armor to do the things Stark has!!!!

maybe, but any IM armour is a ton more powerful than regular human and all he asked for was guys that calculated attacks.... IM 2020 was a merc who did that....... he may not be on a par with current IM but he wasn't exactly a p*ssy

Originally posted by Linkalicious
you missed the part where I said compare them to Cap.

Chance - Not as touch as Cap. I'm willing to guarentee he's no where near the hand to hand fighter.

Sentinels - Cap's taken out numerous sentinals in the past. Infact, i'm quite sure that he took out atleast one or two during the Onslaught saga. Apparently their calculating isn't quite on Captain America's level.

Iron Man 2020 - Jesus you're digging deep to find someone who is tacticlally inferior to Captain America, has slower reflexes, and no where near the back ground information on Spidey.


I'm sorry....were you just listing a bunch of hacks or...well....what did you waste both of our time with here?

i missed the compare to cap part? didn't you read the post? and all you asked for was villains that calculated and stratagised attacks...... that's what i gave you......no one said that chance was as good H2H as cap

and Spidey has taken out more than 1 or 2 sentinels solo....... if you're still doing comparisons you may want that info too

if you wanted something other than that then you should have asked for something other than that

Guys why are we Cap bashing here???
Some of us are not putting into light Cap's glorious career.
The dude stood in front of Thanos during the IG saga and when Thanos said" So Captain it would appear that all of your comrades have fallen and soon you will join them in Death"
what does Cap say?
"Thanos as long as there is one person to stand up in oppostion to your tyrany in this Universe, then you will never win"
That's balls, people!!!
F*&^%ing balls dudes!!

Originally posted by Zahit
traditionally, Spiderman's strength is usually under-written.
He's rarely ever shown to demonstrate his FULL strength against people.

How can writers underwrite SPidermans power? They are the people giving Spiderman his power. If they dont want spiderman to swing around from buildings like a prick anymore, then he is not going to. If spiderman appears in next months issues with t1ts, then guess what...Spiderman has t1ts no matter how much you dont want it to be true. I understand what your saying though, just not about the writers. The writers of the Incredible Hulk constantly under write his characters abilities from what other comics have told us. Hulk should be running the Earth, as should most any superhero or super villian. when you look at what comics has told us about each individual characters potential.

Comic writers know shit about whats going on and what has gone on. They only know what is going to happen next week to finish off there series, so they can get paid. Comics are chock full of contradictions and discrepancies.

it isn't that they under write his powers, it's that they write him as always holding back out of fear of severely hurting or killing anyone he fights..... he only goes all out against people he knows can take it like Rhino, one time he got mad at Scorpion for poisoning him (almost to death) and beat the crap out of him so bad it looked like he'd killed him for a sec...... but Scorp just poisoned himself to look like he was dead to escape...... Spidey had a 3 second guilt trip there...... he cares too much about his enemies

Captain America has never been seen to get knocked-out by a single
punch from anyone cause he never fights anyone as fast and good
as he is. To my knowledge, there has NEVER been a big-time
throw-down between Captain America & Spiderman.
And Spiderman is physically superior to Cap in every way.
When has Cap ever gone toe-to-toe with someone that
strong, fast, agile, etc.....

Originally posted by LordFear
Guys why are we Cap bashing here???
Some of us are not putting into light Cap's glorious career.
The dude stood in front of Thanos during the IG saga and when Thanos said" So Captain it would appear that all of your comrades have fallen and soon you will join them in Death"
what does Cap say?
"Thanos as long as there is one person to stand up in oppostion to your tyrany in this Universe, then you will never win"
That's balls, people!!!
F*&^%ing balls dudes!!

and you do remember what happened to Cap in the next panel right....lol...

Spidey outclasses Cap. in every physical aspect of every area.

Spidey-superhuman
Cap-human, look past the whole "perfect human" image, if you will, when reading this

Abilities:

Spidey-SUPERHUMAN strength, speed, agility, durability, reflexes, elasticity in the skeleton twice that of the average human, and pre-cog (not to mention his temper that fuels his already overbearing strength advantage in the fight)
Cap-PEAK strength, speed, agility, durability (note: he is STILL vulnerable to most if not all poisons, wounds, etc. that the average joe has to deal with), elasticity (debatable)

Experience:

Spidey-40+ years
Cap-60+ years

Weapons:

Spidey:webbing that's been known to hold the likes of Rogue the X-Man
Cap-near indestructable shield used for slinging at others and blocking attacks

So in short the score is:

Spidey-3
Cap-1 (on account of experience)

Cap's experience on the battlefield and HTH combat won't do much for a guy that made his OWN unique fighting style that's gone unmatched for as long as he's been in comics. And his shield won't fare well in the field of slinging and hitting Spidey on account of Spidey's pre-cog coupled in with his superior agility, reflexes, and speed.

lets make a list

spiderman
reflex wins
agility wins
strenghth wins
intel wins
dur. wins
fighting skill loses

Originally posted by StrawNilla

Cap-60+ years


Half of that is spend inside an ice cube.

Originally posted by Scoobless
i missed the compare to cap part? didn't you read the post? and all you asked for was villains that calculated and stratagised attacks...... that's what i gave you......no one said that chance was as good H2H as cap

and Spidey has taken out more than 1 or 2 sentinels solo....... if you're still doing comparisons you may want that info too

if you wanted something other than that then you should have asked for something other than that

Yah...you missed the Cap part. The question is....did YOU read the post. I said:

Originally posted by Linkalicious

A "ton of bad guys" try to calculate his moves? name one.

Once you do that...compare him to Captain America....then get back to me.



Yes, I read my post. Then I read your post. Then I typed this post. Interesting how we go from point A to point C.

Thanks for the "info" on Spiderman being able to kill multiple sentinals, but I don't see how it strengthens your arguement in a one-on-one fight Captain America.

What I do what to know...and I wouldn't expect you to provide this information....is what the outcomes have been in their previous confrontations. I know they got into a little bit of a mix in one comic, but later teamed up.

but there's got to be a comic where these two actually went at it.

This fight is interesting because we all know that Spider-Man own Cap in strength and speed. When it come th hand-to-hand Cap. will own spidey. in this fight I think spider-man would win if he keeps the figt at a distance and uses his webing wiselyi.e. tie up swing cap into things and use his webbing as a trap for captain america once he runs out of webbing then the real fight begins spidey could take him there too but a long fight before he does.

good point cherycola.spidey tops him in everything except h2h combat.
if spidey keeps his distance he will win this one,but if not cap takes this one.

cool debating though.I like that!

i've never seen a good fight between Cap and Spidey

and Link......

Originally posted by Scoobless
name one?...... Chance.... not as physically tough as Cap but has a bunch of weapons controlled by computer that hit faster than Cap

sentinels (during Onslaught) attacked, followed, calculated, ganged up on and got beaten by Spidey....... multiple sentinels compared to Cap are a much bigger threat

Iron Man 2020.... used computer targeting and analysis..... got beat to a pulp by Spidey..... compared to Cap.... tougher and way better armed


are you saying you don't see one reference that compares anyone to Cap in this post?

Originally posted by LordFear
Guys why are we Cap bashing here???
Some of us are not putting into light Cap's glorious career.
The dude stood in front of Thanos during the IG saga and when Thanos said" So Captain it would appear that all of your comrades have fallen and soon you will join them in Death"
what does Cap say?
"Thanos as long as there is one person to stand up in oppostion to your tyrany in this Universe, then you will never win"
That's balls, people!!!
F*&^%ing balls dudes!!
Balls my ass lol . What did you expect him to say :"No Thanos please I beg you !!". Of course he was going to say something heroic and predictable (and very untrue by the way).

Last but not least, I think Captain America was the only one who wasn't really fighting, he was just running around and bossing people around. If he had those balls you claim he has, why didn't he just fight with the rest of the team ?

I know the reason...

All I remember is what happened on the next page...


*Cap approaches Thanos*

Thanos: Surely you Jest...

Cap: Thanos as long as there is one person to lives in oppostion to your tyrany in this Universe, then you will never win...

Thanos: Then die you shall!!!!

*Thanos smashes shield*

Smacks Captain with a backhand..snapping his neck which instantly kills him.....

Anyway...that's essentially what would also happen to the good Captain's head if SM landed one full force punch on it...lol...

Originally posted by Linkalicious
Spiderman's style is his own, but that does not mean his technique is flawless by any means. He throws punches and kicks that are just as counterable as any other punch or kick...specifically his uppercut which leaves a huge opening to the body and face.
I think the statement: Spidey's attacks are just as dodgable as any other punch and kick, is a bit more rational, and even that statement is vastly exaggerated.

Somehow I don't think Cap has the speed required to dodge most if even a few of Spidey's aerial attacks, even on the ground it would be kinda pointless to try and wait it out with Spidey only to throw a punch here and there, Spidey reflex-wise is much too quick and, as far as his cunning goes, much too smart not to know to rush or close in on an opponent for the kill when standing in one spot can't get the job done.

I'm all for supporting Captain America - I think he deserves respect for being a classic World War II era hero. That having been said, I'd daresay that he's probably a little stronger, a lot more endurant, and a little faster in terms of explosive muscle, but a lot less reflexive or flexible. Spiderman has advantages in terms of manueverability and ranged attacks. Captain America's shield is the only thing that makes me say Cappy can win it 45 out of 100 times.

Originally posted by ArekExcelsior2
I'm all for supporting Captain America - I think he deserves respect for being a classic World War II era hero. That having been said, I'd daresay that he's probably a little stronger, a lot more endurant, and a little faster in terms of explosive muscle, but a lot less reflexive or flexible. Spiderman has advantages in terms of manueverability and ranged attacks. Captain America's shield is the only thing that makes me say Cappy can win it 45 out of 100 times.

you think Cap's stronger than Spider-Man??????? AND faster???????

have you ever read a Captain America or Spider-Man comic?

Spidey is faster, stronger, More flexible, more agile, more durable, has a sixth sense about danger and has webbing Cap cannot break.......


i'm not saying a fight is ever as straight forward as stats but when your opponant outclasses you in every physical way you are in trouble

Originally posted by ArekExcelsior2
I'm all for supporting Captain America - I think he deserves respect for being a classic World War II era hero. That having been said, I'd daresay that he's probably a little stronger, a lot more endurant, and a little faster in terms of explosive muscle, but a lot less reflexive or flexible. Spiderman has advantages in terms of manueverability and ranged attacks. Captain America's shield is the only thing that makes me say Cappy can win it 45 out of 100 times.
Cap. stronger, faster, and more endurant than Spidey?! That's just.....no. That's wrong.

To break it down:

Spidey-SUPERHUMAN
Cap-PEAK HUMAN

I can guarantee you that Cap won't be using armored cars for weapons anytime soon from a logical standpoint.....Spidey could do this, he has done it, and if a situation calls for it, he will do it again.

I mean, I guess I can level with you on the endurance thing, if this was some kind of triathalon, I'd bet that Spidey would be quite impressed with Cap's drive to keep going on....but I think he would tire a fair time before Spidey would. And this is a no-prep fight with two people being dropped into a stage of battle already aware that they're fighting to win by any means nessecary, and with the physical advantages Spidey has in GREAT abundance over Cap, I doubt the fight would be some one hour classic......

Actually, Spidey's superpowers don't give him an edge in endurance. Cappy's powers involve eliminating fatigue-causing chemicals. He's practically a living machine.

I know the canon says he operates at peak efficiency, but come on. Just check out the sort of stuff he does in the comics. He gets hit by Absorbing Man's super ball-and-chain and doesn't get eliminated. Spidey would have a hard time with that. I think Captain America's got a lot of hidden power that he doesn't regularly use. I just think Spiderman's got the edge in terms of creative use of his powers and speed.

I meant faster in terms of a track race: He'd probably beat Spidey, assuming no webslinging. But in terms of reflexes, reaction time, etc., Spidey has him beat. And I always tend to view the speedier person as more likely to win.

Originally posted by ArekExcelsior2
Actually, Spidey's superpowers don't give him an edge in endurance. Cappy's powers involve eliminating fatigue-causing chemicals. He's practically a living machine.

I know the canon says he operates at peak efficiency, but come on. Just check out the sort of stuff he does in the comics. He gets hit by Absorbing Man's super ball-and-chain and doesn't get eliminated. Spidey would have a hard time with that. I think Captain America's got a lot of hidden power that he doesn't regularly use. I just think Spiderman's got the edge in terms of creative use of his powers and speed.

I meant faster in terms of a track race: He'd probably beat Spidey, assuming no webslinging. But in terms of reflexes, reaction time, etc., Spidey has him beat. And I always tend to view the speedier person as more likely to win.
Cap's powers are highly exaggerated in just about every comic he's featured in.

Think about it: he was portrayed in comics first and foremost as the perfect HUMAN. Not SUPERHUMAN. I've heard this argument about Cap doing this and that and I find it all quite annoying, and even with all the EXAGGERATED (please note emphasis on the word exaggerated) feats Cap has pulled off in his crime-fighting career, none has equaled Spidey's speed or strength feats.

Listen please, it's been portrayed numerous times in both multiple bios and from comics themselves that Cap is everything a human is capable of coming or a human at his or her absolute, it would be pretty much inconcievable for ANY peak human to reach limits that exceed that of Spidey even through the most intensive training anyone in general has to offer, I just can't see it. Nor can I see Cap sharpen his relflexes to 15x that of the average human or developing pre-cog that heightens those reflexes to that of 30-40x faster than that of a human. Nor can I see him drink milk enough to produce calcium for his skeletal structure to dent steel when thrown into it or take bullets running, not to mention shaking off being thrown to a brick wall. What you've been exposed to in Cap's comics is just another example of overhyping a character's abilities.

And what's to say Cap's body can eliminate the fatigue causing chemicals fast enough when trying to keep up with Spidey once he kicks it into high gear and goes aerial or simply bounces around him as he did so many times with the Hulk? It's not impossible for Cap to become tired, especially when trying to exceed limits set for him that he simply cannot exceed when it comes to actually matching Spidey speed.

And Cap beating Spidey in an on-foot race? Nuh-uh. Let's look at the facts in terms of leg strength:

Cap-has a vertical leap that exceeds that of an Olympian
Spidey-has a vertical leap that exceeds that of a human, period (we're talking about a standing leap here, an area in which Spidey greatly outshines Cap)

To put in plainly, there's not enough adrenaline or steroids in the world as of now to boost a peak human's stats form peak levels to superhuman levels on a calibur of Spidey's without a devastating aftereffect such as death or...death.

it's been theorised that Spider-Man should be able to run 3-4 times peak human in a sprint over short range distances..... but webslinging uses less energy and is faster

Wait, Straw. So the canon is wrong, not the little blurb about Captain America on a website or a trading card. I think that's a little irresponsible. If the series shows that Cappy can do things that he shouldn't be able to, the series wins. That's the nature of the story. I'm going by my impression in the series, where he seems to be roughly proportional to Spiderman's power. I mean, both of them are created superhumans, except Spiderman was accidental and Cappy wasn't. Why the heck would Spidey be stronger in all respects?

That having been said, while Captain America can win some fights I think some people here think he can't, this isn't one of them. 55 times out of 45, Spidey's going to win it. And many of those other 45 times are ones where it's not in a city. It's a fact: Put Spidey in Chicago, let alone New York, and Captain America is dealing with someone who can be literally anywhere and can set up as many traps as necessary. Game over.

Originally posted by ArekExcelsior2
Wait, Straw. So the canon is wrong, not the little blurb about Captain America on a website or a trading card. I think that's a little irresponsible. If the series shows that Cappy can do things that he shouldn't be able to, the series wins. That's the nature of the story. I'm going by my impression in the series, where he seems to be roughly proportional to Spiderman's power. I mean, both of them are created superhumans, except Spiderman was accidental and Cappy wasn't. Why the heck would Spidey be stronger in all respects?

That having been said, while Captain America can win some fights I think some people here think he can't, this isn't one of them. 55 times out of 45, Spidey's going to win it. And many of those other 45 times are ones where it's not in a city. It's a fact: Put Spidey in Chicago, let alone New York, and Captain America is dealing with someone who can be literally anywhere and can set up as many traps as necessary. Game over.
The showings so rediculously beyond Cap's own limits written for him isn't fact. That means he can't use them for a fight, he comes as he is and lets the adrenaline he can draw for the moment carry him on through. And as I said before, there's no amount of adrenaline or steroids for a peak human out there that can boost them to a level of power such as Spidey's that wouldn't end up killing them within a couple days or so of using it. That's not to say that Cap takes any kind of performance enhancing drugs or anything like that, but I just can't concieve the idea of there being a trianing method out there that could possibly boost him physically to Spidey's level.

Take this as you will, I'm just saying. What with Spidey's pre cognitive abilties combined with an array of other superhuman abilties will make him near untouchable for any human, maybe Cap would have less difficulty in the area than your average joe but, that doesn't make the task easy. I'd still doubt that Cap would be able to land more than three maybe four punches, and even the possibilities of that happening are slim. I mean, even if Spidey were to stand there and let Cap wail on him for a day and a half it wouldn't do any damage, the possibility of the blows even hurting Spidey to the point where'd he say "Ow!" isn't a great one, considering the large amounts of punishment Spidey can take and has taken.

And Cap wasn't created to be a superhuman, he was created to be the perfect human or the very peak of human potential....everything a human is capable of becoming. That's not a superhuman. Spidey's a superhuman. Sure, he got his powers by accident, but let's face it, Spidey is the most relatable character of the two when compared becuase while Spidey would just as quickly put his life out there on the line for someone else as Cap would, he dwells more on the responsibility he bears and how it effects the lives of those around him. I mean, there are plenty of origins that you could've considered to have happened by accident. Take Batman, for example, do you think he planned on his parents being gunned down right in front of him? Somehow I don't think anyone in his posistion would've planned on it unless they had planned on doing it themselves.

Oh yeah, my predictions for the fight: Spidey 9/10 if not 10/10

Except that this is a comic book world where people get stronger because they got bitten by a spider. When I get bit a spider, it just hurts.

It wasn't called the "Pretty Good Soldier" serum, it was the Super Soldier serum, designed to make Cappy a living weapon against the Nazis. It shows by the feats he's able to perform in the comics. While I agree that Spidey is an Everyman character, Cappy is too. He's supposed to be the proof that America is great from World War II: he's just this really very good guy and a very moral soldier.

I mean, you're right, I think that Spidey, while maybe being a bit younger and a bit less experienced, will win if it's a city setting. But with the shield and with Captain America's other edges, I think he wins if it's flat plains or desert.

Originally posted by ArekExcelsior2
Except that this is a comic book world where people get stronger because they got bitten by a spider. When I get bit a spider, it just hurts.

It wasn't called the "Pretty Good Soldier" serum, it was the Super Soldier serum, designed to make Cappy a living weapon against the Nazis. It shows by the feats he's able to perform in the comics. While I agree that Spidey is an Everyman character, Cappy is too. He's supposed to be the proof that America is great from World War II: he's just this really very good guy and a very moral soldier.

I mean, you're right, I think that Spidey, while maybe being a bit younger and a bit less experienced, will win if it's a city setting. But with the shield and with Captain America's other edges, I think he wins if it's flat plains or desert.
Wait a minute,.I said that the two would come as they are no strings attached, a hero's origin is their origin. I mean, I think a couple of scientists dipping a guy into a pool of chemicals isn't the best origin but I don't dispute it's happening. I'm just saying, a character should be able to do what they do and only more when they're thrown into a rage of some sort or their adrenaline is really pumping.

And just becuase it was called the "super soldier serum" from which Cap got his powers doesn't mean that Cap is now superhuman. It doesn't. He was written to be the peak of human potential, to be everything that a human can become. There's a difference between that and a superhuman, a superhuman is more than human period in more ways than one.

And I don't that Cap's skills are enough to handle Spidey in a non-prep battle in just about any environment. Spidey outclasses him in every physical aspect by wide margins. And Spidey could get to Cap alot faster than Cap could get to him turnign the tables greatly in Spidey's favor. In flat plains or desert it only makes it harder for Spidey to FIND Cap, not defeat him. It's a "come as you are, no prep" battle, which means that even if Cap got the jump on Spidey the most he could do is throw sand in his face. I mean, again, when it comes boils down to it, what will trying to hit Spidey do to help Cap? Not much. Especially when Spidey takes it aerial and starts attacking overhead. And Cap throwing his shield at Spidey will only result in a momentarily lost weapon, becuase, honsetly, do you think that Spidey will just stand there and hope the shield misses him? Not likely. He's going to move. And once he's out of the way of the shield, Cap is alone and open for a blitz attack, and Spdey definitely knows how to take it to his opposition blitzing style.

And Spidey has 40+ years experience so I doubt Cap has much of an advantage even in that area.

Okay, but origin comes from canon. The canon to me is always right unless we see some really good reason to ignore it (like in the standard "X vs. Y" books that are typically pretty ridiculous). Captain America has been chemically altered to ignore lactic acid, for example: no reason he couldn't also be able to push his strength upwards with normally impossible levels of adrenal-like chemicals.

I'm just saying: Look at what Captain America can actually do in the comics. Look how he's rated holistically. You compare him to Spidey (he's typically all 7s) and I think he has a chance.

The flat plains and desert eliminate Spidey being able to sling everywhere. They get rid of the aerial combat: there's nothing for Spidey to grab onto but air. They just have to run. No guerilla combat, just straight up. Even if Cappy is weaker, I think he's enough of a better fighter to compensate.

All you guys must be smoking to think that Spiderman would lose to a mere human like Capt. A. Spiderman is stronger, faster, smarter, and hard to kill. C. A. doesnt stand a chance.

Normally, spider man shoud win. He is strongest, faster and has the spider sense and his webs.

But cap is a very hard rival for spiderman, because he is way a better fighter and his shield is very dangerous. Normally , spidey should win, but with a lot of troubles.

Spiderman is faster than Capt. shield is. He can dodge it all day and then web it up against an unreachable spot like the tip of a sky scraper. The rest is history. Nuff said.

To take cap shield isnt that easy.

Beast has taken his shield a few times............. and that was before his recent stupid upgrade

Originally posted by Scoobless
Beast has taken his shield a few times............. and that was before his recent stupid upgrade
So has Doom and Puma, and I think also Punisher and Quicksilver (not sure though).

Spider-Man dodges lasers and bullets (sometimes at the same time). Somehow I don't think that the shield of CA will give him much trouble.

Spiderman can land a punch onto the human Capt. America head and punch it off. Spiderman has Ssuper human strength and can lift 10 tons. What do you think any of his hits will do to a human, and Spiderman will catch him because he is faster than Capt.

Spider-Man's powers rends him more supersoldier than Cap can ever dream to be.Cap is out of his league.
Protocide give him major troubles, so Spidey can wipe him out.

Originally posted by ArekExcelsior2
Okay, but origin comes from canon. The canon to me is always right unless we see some really good reason to ignore it (like in the standard "X vs. Y" books that are typically pretty ridiculous). Captain America has been chemically altered to ignore lactic acid, for example: no reason he couldn't also be able to push his strength upwards with normally impossible levels of adrenal-like chemicals.

I'm just saying: Look at what Captain America can actually do in the comics. Look how he's rated holistically. You compare him to Spidey (he's typically all 7s) and I think he has a chance.

The flat plains and desert eliminate Spidey being able to sling everywhere. They get rid of the aerial combat: there's nothing for Spidey to grab onto but air. They just have to run. No guerilla combat, just straight up. Even if Cappy is weaker, I think he's enough of a better fighter to compensate.
That much adrenaline for Cao is definitely not healthy and, to be honest, I don't think Cap putting ALL of his adrenaline into play is enough to match Spidey. I just can't see the human body learning to deal with all that adrenaline much less reaching it in the first place. And it's like I said, Cap's body can't eliminate chemicals in the human body fast enough to deal with someone who has danced around the Hulk for hours on end like Spidey has, he'll probably tire after an hour or so assuming Spidey doesn't just kill him with a one punch finisher.

And you're second point has proven my own point: Cap is human, that's how he's been portrayed in comics, multiple bios, etc.....he CANNOT do the stuff in comics that he's been portrayed to do when challeneged to do so in the REAL world from a reasonable and realistic standpoint.

And no, flat plains and desert does not get rid of aerial combat for Spidey, again, Spidey has a 30 ft (maybe higher) vertical leap. Combine that with reflexes that'll utilize contortions to avoid a shield throw from Cap on demand, agility, and elasticity that'll allow Spidey to attack Cap from almost any angle in the air and the sudden elimination of use of webbing need not be an issue. And Spidey has a unique style of his own that's gone unmatched for as long as he's been in comics, okay, now couple that with superior reflexes to Cap combined with the spider sense, the obvious advantage Spidey has once he goes aerial, and the staggering strength advantage Spidey could put into play at any time for an instant win and I'd say Spidey could take himn in HTH combat, simply becuase he's already got a leg or so up on any of the moves Cap could dish out.

Spidey

i like the contrast of answers between StrawNilla and Darth_Nefarus......... lol......... both making the same point, one with no argument and the other with too much.........lol

Originally posted by Scoobless
i like the contrast of answers between StrawNilla and Darth_Nefarus......... lol......... both making the same point, one with no argument and the other with too much.........lol
Hardy har har.....

In an all-out, hand to hand combat between these two, 'Im gonna go with Spiderman %100, man. I'm talking about a fist fight using no powers or weapns. Spiderman hands down and if anyone disagress with that then they must not know anything.

This post is ridiculous. Spider-man wins easily. Technically, Spider-man is never suposed to get hit. Marvel says that Spider-man's spidersense jerks him outer of danger (even before the attack happens) without his knowledge. Writers have Spidey getting hit because they cannot think of a way for him to have adversity (this is the truth). Have you ever wondered why Doc Ock doesn't die instantly from getting punched by Spidey (in some cases he doesn't even suffer a scratch). Doc is human for crying out loud. His face bones should be shattered in a million pieces (since Spidey can shatter stone, wood, steel, with one punch). Spidey simply cannot be hit. Technically, Spider-man is superior to most super powered beings. He is able to lift over 50 tons (his actual max strength goes into unchartered territory) when under stress. He can move at speeds as fast as sound under stress (becoming a blur, invisible, or multiples of himself). He can endure tremendous amounts of concussive force (bombs, hits by Hulk, etc.). Technically, there is zero way for Cap to hit Spidey. Also it is IMPOSSIBLE for Cap not to get hit by Spidey. Common sense should tell anyone that " One cannot defend that is which too fast for him/her to react to." Captain America has no defense (he has only peak human reflexes). Heck I even seed slow moving enemies hit Cap. There is no amount of fighting ability to combat this. It is a supreme fallacy to say that since Cap has great fighting ability he can win. This is utter nonsense.

note: Technically means, "Consistent with exact power descriptions."

Originally posted by h1a8
Spider-man is superior to most super powered beings. He is able to lift over 50 tons (his actual max strength goes into unchartered territory) when under stress.

i know that Spidey's bios always say 10 tons but that was at first, most would agree he's gotten a bit stronger over the years but 50 tons may be pushing it.... i'm not arguing that under extreme stress situations that he has gone well beyond 10 tons...... to maybe weight approaching 30-40... but i think 50 is too much

It's posts like the 2 above Scoobles that makes cement my stance on Cap taking Spidey. Who-Kid, Scooble, and Straw make me teeder-totter between the two.

Captain America is a much, much better hand to hand fighter than Spiderman. Spiderman has enough durability to take almost anything Captain America can throw at him. The only acception would be a direct blow with his shield to the back of the neck, head, or a shot to the temple

Spiderman has never proven himself able to lift 50 tons. He has, on numerous occasions, lifted more than 10 tons, but that is because marvel statistics state he can "press" 10 tons. He is able to support or squat significantly more because it's a fact....legs are stronger than arms.

One big factor I don't think people have really argued about that I feel needs attention.....will Spidey's web stick to the surface of Cap's shield?

If it does, then Spidey can yank the shield right out of his hands. If it doesn't, I'm quite sure Cap is fully capable of blocking almost any web based attack.

i think his webs can't stick to vibranium, so it may not be able to adhere to the surface of caps shield, however, the webs do tend to wrap around things on impact and could stick to the back of the shield or one of the straps cap uses to hold it
but if Cap gets webbing on himself then he's pretty much screwed

Let's just say we don't have a reason to assume why his web wouldn't be able to stick on his shield. It isn't vibranium, but an alloy made of vibranium and adamantium.

If Luke Cage can't rip the webs (see New Avengers #4), then Cap
certainly won't be able to break them. Cap will give Spiderman a
good fight. That's a lot of credit to Cap, but he's just TOO overmatched.
Spiderman could theoretically just walk up to Cap, take a bunch of hits,
and bear-hug him to death. Not that this would ever happen, but the
point is that the power-level between these two is so lop-sided.

spiderman vs captain america? you mean the same Cap who beat giant man and the hulk?(even kicked hulk in the nuts after he was down to boot?)

you guys make me laff. when have you ever seen any writer making cap lose to ant body?

Originally posted by manjaro
spiderman vs captain america? you mean the same Cap who beat giant man and the hulk?(even kicked hulk in the nuts after he was down to boot?)
you guys make me laff. when have you ever seen any writer making cap lose to ant body?
Who said anything about Ultimates?

not I.

oh and his webs dont stick to vibranium cuz it vibrates at millions of ______per sec.(whatever the designated measurer is) octaves i think?or maybe ocillates(i may have made that on up)according to that new villain with the vibranium suit

Originally posted by Zahit
Who said anything about Ultimates? same thing as far as im concerned. its just the same seemingly invincible cap in a different suit and using more mature language

No.
No it's not.

Originally posted by h1a8
This post is ridiculous. Marvel says that Spider-man's spidersense jerks him outer of danger (even before the attack happens) without his knowledge. He is able to lift over 50 tons (his actual max strength goes into unchartered territory) when under stress. He can move at speeds as fast as sound under stress (becoming a blur, invisible, or multiples of himself). He can endure tremendous amounts of concussive force (bombs, hits by Hulk, etc.). Technically, there is zero way for Cap to hit Spidey. Captain America has no defense (he has only peak human reflexes). It is a supreme fallacy to say that since Cap has great fighting ability he can win. This is utter nonsense.

I do agree with you when you say that spiderman can beat Capt. America. But I dont think this post is ridiculous at all. This battle can actually can be a worthy enough fight to witness.

When you wrote "Marvel says that Spider-man's spidersense jerks him outer of danger" I thought well how can that be. Spiderman jerks himself out of danger with the help of his spideysense. It doesn't control his actions. It act as an aid/warning or red-flag not as a bodily reflex.

Spiderman can only lift 10 tons not 50. Look it up.

And when you wrote "Technically, there is zero way for Cap to hit Spidey. Captain America has no defense" I thought your were wrong there too. First of all, Capt. is not a lousy fighter as he has been in several major wars and has come out decorated. He's had more training and experience in the art of fighting/war than Spiderman has. And his shield is just one of many defences he can use as powerful as it is. I've seen that shield protect Capt. in ways i've never seen any force field in Marvel do.

Although, again, I still think Spiderman can win I dont think pitting Capt. up against the web crawler is nonsense. Its far from it. Or maybe you either hate Capt. America or love Spiderman extremely because you write with the attitude of a Spidey fanboy. You look at spiderman as a demigod while I look at him as a worthy super. Your understanding and underestimation of Capt. America and ablilties show your lack of knowledge. Spiderman still wins though lol.

Originally posted by manjaro
oh and his webs dont stick to vibranium cuz it vibrates at millions of ______per sec.(whatever the designated measurer is) octaves i think?or maybe ocillates(i may have made that on up)according to that new villain with the vibranium suit
What has vibranium to do with this fight ? Shield: vibranium + adamantium, and I never heard a thing that could convince me that the web can't stick to the shield.

Surface is slick on that shield. How slick? idk....

It's too tough to tell without witnessing what would happen first hand in a comic, but I'd like to point out that the thing doesn't chip paint when it blocks bullets......it must have some surface over the paint...

or do they make metals that are bright red white and blue?

spidey can lift 10 tons and cap can lift like 1500lbs spider is more agilable than cap spideris faster than cap and smater so really do u hos realy think cap can win

Originally posted by who?-kid
What has vibranium to do with this fight ?.

absolutley nothing i just trying to provide you with some FYI. cuz that new guy in the suit was monologuing something to that effect when spidey tried to subdue him with the webs.

it was thrown out there and i just responded accrodingly. nothing more nothing less

Originally posted by Linkalicious
It's posts like the 2 above Scoobles that makes cement my stance on Cap taking Spidey. Who-Kid, Scooble, and Straw make me teeder-totter between the two.

Captain America is a much, much better hand to hand fighter than Spiderman. Spiderman has enough durability to take almost anything Captain America can throw at him. The only acception would be a direct blow with his shield to the back of the neck, head, or a shot to the temple

Spiderman has never proven himself able to lift 50 tons. He has, on numerous occasions, lifted more than 10 tons, but that is because marvel statistics state he can "press" 10 tons. He is able to support or squat significantly more because it's a fact....legs are stronger than arms.

One big factor I don't think people have really argued about that I feel needs attention.....will Spidey's web stick to the surface of Cap's shield?


If it does, then Spidey can yank the shield right out of his hands. If it doesn't, I'm quite sure Cap is fully capable of blocking almost any web based attack.

You sure don't know much comic book history to say that spiderman has never proven to lift 50 tons. A more accurate estimate would be he can lift hundreds of tons. He has lifted incredible massive objects such as multistory buildings before under tremendous emotional stress. This information didn't come from my head but one of Marvel encyclopedias.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
I do agree with you when you say that spiderman can beat Capt. America. But I dont think this post is ridiculous at all. This battle can actually can be a worthy enough fight to witness.

When you wrote "Marvel says that Spider-man's spidersense jerks him outer of danger" I thought well how can that be. Spiderman jerks himself out of danger with the help of his spideysense. It doesn't control his actions. It act as an aid/warning or red-flag not as a bodily reflex.

Spiderman can only lift 10 tons not 50. Look it up.

And when you wrote "Technically, there is zero way for Cap to hit Spidey. Captain America has no defense" I thought your were wrong there too. First of all, Capt. is not a lousy fighter as he has been in several major wars and has come out decorated. He's had more training and experience in the art of fighting/war than Spiderman has. And his shield is just one of many defences he can use as powerful as it is. I've seen that shield protect Capt. in ways i've never seen any force field in Marvel do.

Although, again, I still think Spiderman can win I dont think pitting Capt. up against the web crawler is nonsense. Its far from it. Or maybe you either hate Capt. America or love Spiderman extremely because you write with the attitude of a Spidey fanboy. You look at spiderman as a demigod while I look at him as a worthy super. Your understanding and underestimation of Capt. America and ablilties show your lack of knowledge. Spiderman still wins though lol.

You make decent points. But the truth is Spidey can potential lift hundreds of tons. He has lifted extremely massive objects such as multistory buildings while under intense emotional stress. It doesn't matter how good of a fighter Cap is. To exaggerate my point imagine Cap fighting Doomsday. Just because Cap gets killed by Doomsday doesn't mean he is a lousy fighter. There are limits to what fighting ability can take you. It is Impossible to to react to something beyond human peak ability. How can Cap defend against any of Spidey's physical attacks. Spidey moves too irregularly and too fast (a blur or invisible).There is no way for Spidey to get hit as well as there is no way for Cap to not get hit. Any disagreement is not logical.

Most people who say that Cap will win is using the implication that superior fighting abilility can cause one to defend against something that is too fast for his/her reflexes. Impossible!

spidey wins

Originally posted by h1a8
You make decent points. But the truth is Spidey can potential lift hundreds of tons.
I hope you are joking ? (I agree with the rest of your post though).

Not way that spidey could lift hundred of tons. He isnt the hulk, come on.

Originally posted by h1a8
You sure don't know much comic book history to say that spiderman has never proven to lift 50 tons. A more accurate estimate would be he can lift hundreds of tons. He has lifted incredible massive objects such as multistory buildings before under tremendous emotional stress. This information didn't come from my head but one of Marvel encyclopedias.

Prove that he can...

You're going to tell me I'm the one that doesn't know much...then actually prove that Spiderman is capable of lifting 100,000 lbs...better yet 200,000 lbs.

Lifted multi-story buildings? Give me a comic book to reference.

Hell....give me a Marvel Encyclopedia edition to reference.



If you're going to come in here and tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about...then you best be able to back up your claims.

maybe he's getting Spider-Man mixed up with Thor...... you can see the similarities in the two in any Fantastic Five comic where they star along side Buffy, The Green Hornet and Dexter (from Dexter's lab)

Originally posted by h1a8
You make decent points. But the truth is Spidey can potential lift hundreds of tons. He has lifted extremely massive objects such as multistory buildings while under intense emotional stress. It doesn't matter how good of a fighter Cap is. To exaggerate my point imagine Cap fighting Doomsday. Just because Cap gets killed by Doomsday doesn't mean he is a lousy fighter. There are limits to what fighting ability can take you. It is Impossible to to react to something beyond human peak ability. How can Cap defend against any of Spidey's physical attacks. Spidey moves too irregularly and too fast (a blur or invisible).There is no way for Spidey to get hit as well as there is no way for Cap to not get hit. Any disagreement is not logical.

Most people who say that Cap will win is using the implication that superior fighting abilility can cause one to defend against something that is too fast for his/her reflexes. Impossible!

He might be referring to the issue below..regarding the 100 ton reference...

That was not the best Spider-Man comic ever...

i bought that one from the back issue bin ....... it wasn't great

lol...yeah I think that one got thrown in the recycle bin shortly after I bought it...

Oh yeah I was joking btw..regarding the reference...just in case you peeps didn't know...

http://jerome.galica.free.fr/marvel/Spiderman/SpideyAnimation.gif vs http://jerome.galica.free.fr/marvel/Avengers/cap/CaptianAnimation.gif

It is a close fight, but I believe that Spider-Man would win due to his Spider-sense and incredible agility.

Spiderman would win period.

Wow I didn't know this thread existed. Batman vs Captain America would be a fairer thread.............


oh and Spiderman wins.........

I agree. Batman vs. Captain America would make much more sense.

But, I will also admit that Cap is no slouch at all. I'm sure he'll be able to get some hits in. However, they'll be hits that won't do any damage to someone of Spiderman's magnitude.

Spiderman will eventually stomp him.

yep yep.

Originally posted by Linkalicious
Prove that he can...

You're going to tell me I'm the one that doesn't know much...then actually prove that Spiderman is capable of lifting 100,000 lbs...better yet 200,000 lbs.

Lifted multi-story buildings? Give me a comic book to reference.

Hell....give me a Marvel Encyclopedia edition to reference.



If you're going to come in here and tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about...then you best be able to back up your claims.

look in dk spiderman encyclopedia. They mention that his stress factor affects his strength and that in a certain comic book (I forgot if they said which one) he lifted a multistory building (weighing 100's of tons) while under intense stress.

I see Captain America throwing his shield at Spider-Man, who webs onto it and swings it around like a bull-roarer into Cap's head embedding the shield in his skull and crushing his brain into mush. But that's just imo.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I see Captain America throwing his shield at Spider-Man, who webs onto it and swings it around like a bull-roarer into Cap's head embedding the shield in his skull and crushing his brain into mush. But that's just imo.

Sounds about right to me.

As I understand it, Captain America is at peak human strength, which means he presses what, about 800 pounds? 1000?

Spiderman lifts 10 tens: 20,000 pounds. That makes him at least 20 times stronger than Cap (not to mention his superior speed and agility).

20 times is a HUGE difference. It's like the difference between a child and a champion weightlifter. To Spiderman, Cap weighs like 12 pounds. Go over and pick up a 10-pound dumbell and think: This is how Cap's weight feels to Spiderman's strength.

IMO, Captain America could win, but mostly I give this to Spidey.

Originally posted by Mindship

IMO, Captain America could win, but mostly I give this to Spidey.

how? please explain how can cap win! explain how it is possible please!
He can't even win in a million tries (unless he resorts to some other weapons or technology.)

Spider sense, speed, and super agility beats Cap always.

Whatever Cap is rated in speed or strength or agility, multiply it by 10 or 20 to Spidey.

Spidey wins 100 out of 100.

Originally posted by Scoobless
name one?...... Chance.... not as physically tough as Cap but has a bunch of weapons controlled by computer that hit faster than Cap

sentinels (during Onslaught) attacked, followed, calculated, ganged up on and got beaten by Spidey....... multiple sentinels compared to Cap are a much bigger threat

Iron Man 2020.... used computer targeting and analysis..... got beat to a pulp by Spidey..... compared to Cap.... tougher and way better armed

sorry.......... got a little carries away........ you only wanted one.......

Good examples.

Cap is more respected than any hero in the Marvel world, much like Batman is in the DC world.

Respect is one thing, the ability to beat Spidey in a battle, a completely different thing.

i love spidey but cap could beat most heros in marvel like bats can beat ANY hero anywhere
cap would find a way but it could go either way

Spiderman easily. The guy has beaten the hulk and the juggernaut. And yes, he can lift 100,000 pounds. He did so during that classic doctor octupus storyline where he had to lift this gigantic metal wall to save Aunt May. And that took place while he was in highschool(Back at his weakest). It was awesome. In a recent Spiderman storyline, Spiderman was under that illness that later affected him greatly during the other storyline, yet he was able to carry two cars with one hand, while web swinging. Again, he wasn't even at his best.

In terms of fighting, Spiderman. Sure, during issue 60(or somewhere close), Spiderman lost to Captain America, but that was when he was still in highschool. Over the years, he has gotten much better. In another recent storyline, Spiderman found himself face to face with four avenger clones. Thor, Captain America, Hawk Eye, and Iron man. He took all of them on at once, and was beating them, until the other avengers showed up to fight them. Take note: If a man can take on Captain America and three other heroes at the same time, do you really think the winner of this thread will not be Spiderman? Another thing, Spiderman has even beaten his entire rogue gallery at once, single handedly.

Last but certainly not least, Spiderman has even beaten doctor doom single handedly. Something the friggin fantastic four can barely accomplish. Captain America would be a push over.

lol

spidey 9/10

i was thinking though

if it were ultimate cap, how much would it change? He is really adept at using his environment and, well, kicks ass, such as giant man...

vs ult cap id say spidey 6.5/10ish...

Originally posted by inamilist
if it were ultimate cap, how much would it change? He is really adept at using his environment and, well, kicks ass, such as giant man...
The fight between Utimate CA and Giant Man was a load of crap, plot device victory all the way.

Originally posted by who?-kid
The fight between Utimate CA and Giant Man was a load of crap, plot device victory all the way. Like the way Cap plot deviced Hulk?


But hey the Ultimate's Captain America's Cap-kick is impressive, not quite as wickedly useful as the Bat-kick though.

Cap is great and all and deserves a lot of respect but whatever he can do Spider-Man can do many times better. Spidey 9/10

It seems to me that everyone agree that spidey wins. So why you still discussing this fight?

Originally posted by samishe
It seems to me that everyone agree that spidey wins. So why you still discussing this fight?

Because of an overwhelming need to have my voice heard?

someone start a new topic this is getting old

Originally posted by AJ4LIFE
i love spidey but cap could beat most heros in marvel like bats can beat ANY hero anywhere


Spidey wins.

Originally posted by Juntai
Like the way Cap plot deviced Hulk?
You mean Ultimate Cap vs Ultimate Hulk ?

No, no plot device there. Only bad writing.

With Spiderman's recent biological metamorphoses, I doubt Captain America would be able to beat defeat Spiderman with the majority, added with Spiderman's Ironman like suit I doubt even more so that Captain America could defeat spider man with the majority.

Originally posted by AJ4LIFE
i love spidey but cap could beat most heros in marvel like bats can beat ANY hero anywhere
cap would find a way but it could go either way

Cap hasn't been known to "find a way" to beat any hero. That is definitely Batman's moniker only.

It is what Batman does, with his vast scientific knowledge, gadgets, paranoia, and conspiracy theories.

Back to topic...

Still Spidey. When he is focused, his spider sense makes him practically unhitable.

without his recent upgrades, spidey still wins 9/10

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=311846&perpage=20&highlight=captain+america+spider+man&pagenumber=5






http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/8848/spideycap1ri.jpg

hahaha... at first I'd say cap, but that picture says alot!

Originally posted by LordFear
I am gonna go against the grain here and say Cap.
My argument here is experience, patience, intel(Cap has intel on SM because Shield and the Avengers keep a file on him).
Here comes the insults and death threats...........
I have learned in this forum to never go against SM fans/lol

I'll give Cap a fighting chance. Even though Caps fighting ability is one of his strong-points, he wouldn't be able to just outfight Spidey. Spidey's stronger, faster, and has unbelievable reflexes. The thing that makes this not so completely devastating to his chances, is of course his shield which would be able to stop a few of Spidey's blows if he got in close, but the fact remains that he couldn't stop a 2 minute continuous flurry of Spidey's. Spidey would eventually land one, which would put Cap out of commission. The only advantage that Cap has over Spidey is his combat savy. If Cap is to win, he'll be using his surroundings, and forcing Spiderman to beat himself. If Cap is smart and a little lucky, he'll be able to use Spidey's spider-sense against him, maybe with his sheild and an attack at the same time, or something. Cap is the best at what he does, and what he does is win. He's got a better winning edge than even a Spiderman, who's got a good one himself.

I'll go ahead and just say it'd be dead even 5/10 because I have lots of faith in Cap. By all means, that could be giving him too much credit, but I'm sure that Cap would be able to pull at least a few wins out of 10, and just on a hunch, I'll go for giving him an even shot.

Originally posted by superman41082
I'll give Cap a fighting chance. Even though Caps fighting ability is one of his strong-points, he wouldn't be able to just outfight Spidey. Spidey's stronger, faster, and has unbelievable reflexes. The thing that makes this not so completely devastating to his chances, is of course his shield which would be able to stop a few of Spidey's blows if he got in close, but the fact remains that he couldn't stop a 2 minute continuous flurry of Spidey's. Spidey would eventually land one, which would put Cap out of commission. The only advantage that Cap has over Spidey is his combat savy. If Cap is to win, he'll be using his surroundings, and forcing Spiderman to beat himself. If Cap is smart and a little lucky, he'll be able to use Spidey's spider-sense against him, maybe with his sheild and an attack at the same time, or something. Cap is the best at what he does, and what he does is win. He's got a better winning edge than even a Spiderman, who's got a good one himself.

I'll go ahead and just say it'd be dead even 5/10 because I have lots of faith in Cap. By all means, that could be giving him too much credit, but I'm sure that Cap would be able to pull at least a few wins out of 10, and just on a hunch, I'll go for giving him an even shot. cap wins....spidey aint got it in him

Originally posted by willRules
without his recent upgrades, spidey still wins 9/10
Indeed.

Originally posted by StyleTime
Indeed. shiiiiiii