Eight Killed in Student Rampage in Minn.

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manny321
6 were people at school, while the other two was his grandparents.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=519&e=5&u=/ap/school_shooting

RED LAKE, Minn. - A student went on a shooting spree Monday, killing his grandparents and five people at his high school on an Indian reservation. The gunman himself was later found shot to death, authorities said. It was the nation's worst school shooting since the Columbine massacre in 1999.
Before the shootings at the school, the suspect's grandparents were shot in their home and died later.
Six people died in the mid-afternoon shooting at Red Lake High School in far northern Minnesota, including four students. Also killed were a teacher and a security guard, FBI (news - web sites) spokesman Paul McCabe said at a news conference in Minneapolis.
He declined to talk about a possible connection between the suspect and the couple killed at the home, but Red Lake Fire Director Roman Stately said they were the grandparents of the shooter. Stately told several media outlets that the grandfather was a police officer whose guns may have been used in the shootings.
All of the dead students were found in one room. One of them was a boy believed to be the shooter, McCabe said. He would not comment on reports that the boy shot himself and said it was too early to speculate on a motive.


Quite sad i say.

BackFire
All teh more reason not to go too school.

LanİeWindu™
Homeschooling is gonna become quite popular.

manny321
I don't see how a student could get so unstable to do such a thing. I just don't understand how young people can do it. Older adults i see because they can unstable easily bet high school students i don't understand.

Hmm is this getting major headlines down south. I think the news will cover it full out tomorrow.

SlipknoT
Originally posted by BackFire
All teh more reason not to go too school. thumb up

tabby999
most answers to why can be found in Bowling for Columbine.
and now my shirt needs to be updated dammit!

SlipknoT
lol

tabby999
god i love my shirt, i wore it school on a casual and nearly copped a suspension...dunno why

Mist
i hate hearing about school shootings......too many innocent people with too much to live for.....gone.....

Imaginary
weep

botankus
Originally posted by tabby999
most answers to why can be found in Bowling for Columbine.
and now my shirt needs to be updated dammit!


I feel a Bowling for Columbine II coming on. wink

shockimebones
Are you a student?

KharmaDog
Originally posted by manny321
I don't see how a student could get so unstable to do such a thing. I just don't understand how young people can do it. Older adults i see because they can unstable easily bet high school students i don't understand.

Hmm is this getting major headlines down south. I think the news will cover it full out tomorrow.

Are you kidding me? High school is the worst environments to be in! The way kids treat each other is even more brutal than the way adults do. To be quite honest, I am surprised that this doesn't happen more often given the accessibility to guns nowadays.

As for receiving nationwide coverage, I doubt it will for a couple of reasons. Congress is taking up the news with trying to keep that woman alive. The current story of the young girl being abducted and killed in Florida is hot and tugging at the heart strings of America. And this happened on a Native Reserve, and for the most part the American public could care less what happens there.

Jackie Malfoy
Not to point fingers but where were his parents when he bought the gun.If they had payed any attention to him they would know that he was going to do this.JM2guns

KharmaDog
Originally posted by Jackie Malfoy
Not to point fingers but where were his parents when he bought the gun.If they had payed any attention to him they would know that he was going to do this.JM2guns

Oh how I missed the simple and lucid thoughts of JM. His father didn't stop him because he had committed suicide four years ago. His mother didn't stop him because she lives in a Minneapolis nursing home after suffering brain injuries in a car accident. I believe that he lived with his Grandparents, and they did not stop him because he shot them first! Before you make a simple comment, or any comment at all, perhaps you should read about what you are commenting on, just a thought.

So this kid had no parents, no friends, live on one of the poorest reservations in the state and all the other kids picked on him often...why are people surprised this happened?

By the way, the innocent placing of your shooting smiley is actually kind of insensitive and tacky.

Imperial_Samura
Apparently, according to the news here his grandfather was a retired police officer. He stole the gun from his house after killing them. I don't even know if he has parents. But it is terrible what the world is coming to. I can only be thankful it hasn't started in Australia, but I fear its only a matter of time.

Cosmic_Beings
I wonder what music he listened to roffel

KharmaDog
Originally posted by Cosmic_Beings
I wonder what music he listened to roffel

I would think that the fact the he had no parents, had no friends, lived in a hopeless situation, and was taunted and made fun of everyday played a larger part in this than the music he listened to.

Imperial_Samura
But its amazing how easily in these cases the real reasons and problems are glossed over and its blamed on a video game or music.

PVS
im sure that someway...somehow...this will be blamed on music and video games

edit: wow, just saw imperials post before mine. its amazing how saddly preditable our society is. we should just be a couple of cynics making some smartass comments...but we aren't...this is exactly what will happen.

grand theft auto 3, and marilyn manson...yep....their fault...not ours

shockimebones
Why will this be blamed on music and video games? What music do you listen to? What video games do you play?

PVS
this is not up for debate shickim, since i highly doubt anyone here would blame video games and music. we are saying that they WILL be blamed, get it?

Imperial_Samura
Got to agree with you PVS, and as long as society makes scape goats instead of finding real solutions, things like this will keep happening.

botankus
Originally posted by Cosmic_Beings
I wonder what music he listened to roffel

I do too. That way all the bands whose CD's he owned can be sued and everything will be all better.

Cosmic_Beings
Originally posted by botankus
I do too. That way all the bands whose CD's he owned can be sued and everything will be all better.



I hope he listened to Green Day or something

Imperial_Samura
Or Britney Spears.

LondonTown
I heard it was 10 people not 8. Bill Clinton wanted to ban guns but the Republicans wouldn't let him. no

PVS
well, he at least put a ban on certain assault rifles...which dubya promised to renew which was a lie.

bilb
Well there's a real shock.. Dubya going back on his word..

ragesRemorse
Originally posted by PVS
this is not up for debate shickim, since i highly doubt anyone here would blame video games and music. we are saying that they WILL be blamed, get it?

8 dead people is low by any video game stadards. People we are slacking here. If your going to do somthing, you may as well do it right, even if it is taking out a class of kids, but atleast get them all. I mean the kids in Columbine had automatics, and your telling me they couldnt get anymore than 9. Seems like kids arent studying there video games ENOUGH,i mean old people are only worth minor points

bilb
Rage I really hope you are just trying to stir things up and dont really feel this way..

ragesRemorse
Originally posted by bilb
Rage I really hope you are just trying to stir things up and dont really feel this way..

Why, whats so wrong with that statment? the goverment and society think that i think this way, so why fight it. Atleast when the thought cops (fcc) sensor my freedoms i will have principles they created.

SlipknoT
Originally posted by Cosmic_Beings
I hope he listened to Green Day or something Or Simple Plan

Draco69
This had nothing to do with video games or music. The kid was a Native American Neo-Nazi. If there is such a thing. He believed in the purity of his dying (dead?) race. He also admired Hitler. Loser!

ragesRemorse
atleast he had a goal and accomplished it. That probably what will be onhis tombstone. cant exactly say a good friend and and an even better grandson.

Draco69
A goal? What goal? The kid had no goals. He was a completely disillusioned kid with serious issues.

The Inkeeper
He did have a goal, kill all the ingrates in his class who he convinced himself are stopping aryan supremecy and blocking Hitlers resurection yes


Dont you pay attention>

Darth_Big_Boy
Didn't see anything about the answer about his parents.

His father commited suicide 4 years ago and his mother is in a nursing home.

As of a few minutes ago...according to the radio, there's 9 dead now ( including the grandfather and the grandfather's GF ) and 14 injuried, 2 critically.

SlipknoT
Originally posted by ragesRemorse
atleast he had a goal and accomplished it. That probably what will be onhis tombstone. cant exactly say a good friend and and an even better grandson. Its good to see the kids acomplishing things these days smile

The Inkeeper
Those beautiful people < omg, manson strikes again

Draco69
Originally posted by The Inkeeper
He did have a goal, kill all the ingrates in his class who he convinced himself are stopping aryan supremecy and blocking Hitlers resurection yes


Dont you pay attention>


I pay attention. The kid was a NATIVE AMERICAN. He wanted TRIBE SUPERMACY. Not Aryan supremacy. He idolized Hitler's ideals and incorporated into his own twisted life philosophy.

The Inkeeper
Well change aryan to tribal no expression

ragesRemorse
Originally posted by SlipknoT
Its good to see the kids acomplishing things these days smile

thats what im sayin, might not be tomorrows leader, but atleast tehre out there doing somthing productive and setting standards for youngsters up and comming in their field of classroom slaughter.I like how he threw a curveball and involved people outside the school, definently somthing to be learned form this psycho.

Draco69
The only thing productive that came out of this is....uh

I find it incredibly hard to believe that the students, teachers and administrators didn't think the kid was gonna be a threat. The kid sprout his Tribal-Nazism everywhere. He even got into class debates with the teachers. It doesn't take a genius to realize that a Hitler-wannabe may wanna kill a lot of people.

The Inkeeper
So your already blaming this on Hitler?

Wow, good ol' Adolf is still sticking it to Uncle Sam over half a century after dying!



How do you think America would react if the kid was kicked out of school for sprouting his tribal nazism? I meant whatever happened to free speech shock


You cant please America. You kick out a killer, they complain, you leave him in school, they complain when he shoots people.

Draco69
Of course I'm not blaming Hitler. I never said that. I blame the kid. He's to blame. He killed people. There's noone else to blame.

I said that a teenager spreading a violent message of tribal supremacy and who often spoke of acts of violence was OBVIOUSLY going to be a threat. The school was stupid. They should have recommended counseling or some other method to recuperate him. But they did nothing.

KharmaDog
Originally posted by Draco69
I pay attention. The kid was a NATIVE AMERICAN. He wanted TRIBE SUPERMACY. Not Aryan supremacy. He idolized Hitler's ideals and incorporated into his own twisted life philosophy.

Hey Draco, before you accept all this information as fact, read what has been reported:



Students say he posted on a neo nazi website, no information has been confirmed, actually the FBI and police haven't let out too much info so far. Most of what has been reported is hearsay and testimonials by teenagers.

Whatever the case if people believed that he did this because he believed that his race was "impure" then they firmly have their head planted deep inside their ass.

KharmaDog
Originally posted by Draco69
Of course I'm not blaming Hitler. I never said that. I blame the kid. He's to blame. He killed people. There's noone else to blame.


Actually, you're wrong there. Not only is the child to blame for his actions, but his father is to blame for the abandonment, his grandparents are to blame for obviously not knowing what was going on in his life, school officials were to blame for not flagging a kid who "apparently" had alot of problems, and all the little sh*ts from his school who picked on him and drove him around the bend all share a part in this.

It makes me shake my head when people try to package incidents like this or columbine in a neat and tidy box and say it's all one person's fault.

That's also why this is gonna keep on happening.

Draco69
Originally posted by KharmaDog
Hey Draco, before you accept all this information as fact, read what has been reported:



Students say he posted on a neo nazi website, no information has been confirmed, actually the FBI and police haven't let out too much info so far. Most of what has been reported is hearsay and testimonials by teenagers.

Whatever the case if people believed that he did this because he believed that his race was "impure" then they firmly have their head planted deep inside their ass.

The information IS confirmed:

Weise was also found by the St. Paul Pioneer Press newspaper to have posted several comments last year on an online forum frequented by neo-Nazis. He used the pen names Todesengel, German for "angel of death," and "NativeNazi."

"I guess I've always carried a natural admiration for Hitler and his ideals, and his courage to take on larger nations," Weise wrote in one session.

shared the Nazi goal of racial purity, saying that when he talked in school about that for his own Chippewa tribe, "I get the same old argument which seems to be so common around here. 'We need to mix all the races, to combine all the strengths.'"

"They (teachers) don't openly say that racial purity is wrong," he added, "yet when you speak your mind on the subject you get 'silenced' real quick by the teachers and likeminded school officials."

"When I was growing up, I was taught (like others) that Nazi's were evil and that Hitler was a very evil man," he said in another posting. "Of course, not for a second did I believe this. ... They truly were doing it for the better."

He also wrote that he planned to recruit high school students to join a neo-Nazi movement he hoped to start on his reservation.

"The only ones who oppose my views are the teachers at the high school, and a large portion of the student body who think a Nazi is a Klansman, or a White Supremacist thug," he wrote. "Most of the Natives I know have been poisoned by what they were taught in school."

Your newspaper is kinda floozy. My sources said completely different things.

The Inkeeper
Perhaps your sources are floozy.

Draco69
Originally posted by KharmaDog
Actually, you're wrong there. Not only is the child to blame for his actions, but his father is to blame for the abandonment, his grandparents are to blame for obviously not knowing what was going on in his life, school officials were to blame for not flagging a kid who "apparently" had alot of problems, and all the little sh*ts from his school who picked on him and drove him around the bend all share a part in this.

It makes me shake my head when people try to package incidents like this or columbine in a neat and tidy box and say it's all one person's fault.

That's also why this is gonna keep on happening.

I agree that the school officials could have used their heads. They obviously had some predilection that the kids may have been a threat.

However, I don't buy the "grandparents and fathers" sob story. I don't care that his father committed suicide or that his mother supposedly abandoned him. Tough sh$%. We all have problems in our lives. However we don't go around shooting people because we can't deal with it. The kid is to blame. A loser, a murderer, a crackpot. I have no sympathy for him. I save it for the students who got shot.

Draco69
Originally posted by The Inkeeper
Perhaps your sources are floozy.

I don't consider CNN "floozy"

KharmaDog
Originally posted by Draco69
I agree that the school officials could have used their heads. They obviously had some predilection that the kids may have been a threat.

However, I don't buy the "grandparents and fathers" sob story. I don't care that his father committed suicide or that his mother supposedly abandoned him. Tough sh$%. We all have problems in our lives. However we don't go around shooting people because we can't deal with it. The kid is to blame. A loser, a murderer, a crackpot. I have no sympathy for him. I save it for the students who got shot.

And that sort of mentality is what will allow this stuff to continue to happen. Keep looking at things on a small scale level, sure your own world might make a little bit more sense, and you might be a little more comfortable in it, but you aren't contributing to solving any problems.

Originally posted by Draco69
I don't consider CNN "floozy"

Funny, that's where I got my info from also.

Draco69
The only way to prevent school shootings is for the school officials to use their heads and keep tabs on their students.

Your bleeding heart doesn't contribute anything either. We can't prevent child abandonment, we can't prevent children from getting warped ideologies in their brains, and we certainly can't prevent teenagers from getting teased. This is what happens in life. Sh$% happens. Either deal with it or move on. I don't have sympathy for the kid. He got teased. So what? That happens in school. It's never going to change. The best we can do is to help the kids cope. Liberality is all the same. "Let's talk, have a discussion, make peace with our feelings." It doesn't accomplish anything. This situation could have been prevented by the school officials.

PVS
the problem is not in the kids who picked on him, but the school employees who turned a blind eye (and you know they did).
when kids are left unchecked...well just read lord of the flies.

Draco69
Exactly. The school officials knew the kid was a threat. Blaming the problem on bullying is nondefunct. The kid is also to blame. He's 17 years old. He was completely aware of what he was doing.

KidRock
that sucks

KharmaDog
Originally posted by Draco69
The only way to prevent school shootings is for the school officials to use their heads and keep tabs on their students.

Your bleeding heart doesn't contribute anything either. We can't prevent child abandonment, we can't prevent children from getting warped ideologies in their brains, and we certainly can't prevent teenagers from getting teased. This is what happens in life. Sh$% happens. Either deal with it or move on. I don't have sympathy for the kid. He got teased. So what? That happens in school. It's never going to change. The best we can do is to help the kids cope. Liberality is all the same. "Let's talk, have a discussion, make peace with our feelings." It doesn't accomplish anything. This situation could have been prevented by the school officials.

First of all the fact that you point out my comments as being one from a "bleeding heart" is telling of how you look at things. I am looking at this situation as a cause and effect incident, without emotion.

There were causes and circumstances that resulted in this incident and I would think it's a little more deeper than, "the kid was just psycho".

You state, "The best we can do is to help the kids cope" I am really eager to listen as to how you suggest people do this or how the school officials could have prevented this rather than listen to your sympathy (or lack thereof) for those involved.

Draco69
The school officials were fully aware of the teenager's danger to the school. He frequently got into debates with teachers and students about Hitler, neoNazism, and repeatedly address several students with comments of violence. The guidance counselor also was aware of the teenager's psychological problems. The teenager even once announced during a class movie that " That would be cool if I shot up the school" The teachers were present during this incident. The school officials are partly to blame.

How could they have prevented this incident? By informing the local authorities and suggesting psychological counseling. The teenager made several threats of violence towards the school before the shooting. This is equivalent to a bomb scare at a local mall. It is criminally expiable.

It seems to me that you symphathize with the teenager. Not the victims.

Draco69
If you respond KharmaDog, I'll respond to your response later. My school has the shortest meal hours in the country..

PVS
i think you're both correct. EVERYONE who contributed to this with their own apathy and/or abusiveness is partially responsible, as well as the kid who did it.

manny321
The problem i noticed in high school, was that the school does not check up on students of all kinds. They don't try to see and figure who are the kids with problems. There should be more interaction between those two groups. No amount of security will stop this. Also maybe some real gun laws would help. I remember from bowling for columbine "open a bank account and get a free rifle"

Stupid idiotic bank people.

gls
... i dont know what to say. i've actually wanted to do things at my school. but i never acted on them

gls
..hope i didn't freak anybody out or somethin..that was a long time ago when i felt like that. now my life is sooo much better

amity75
Ban guns. Ban guns. Ban guns.

Cosmic_Beings
He listened to Marilyn Manson and Korn, and made a flash movie about someone shooting a bunch of people dead, adn then commiting suicide, and submitted it to newgrounds!

http://newgrounds.com/portal/view/195194

Ketchuptome
Originally posted by KharmaDog
Oh how I missed the simple and lucid thoughts of JM. His father didn't stop him because he had committed suicide four years ago. His mother didn't stop him because she lives in a Minneapolis nursing home after suffering brain injuries in a car accident. I believe that he lived with his Grandparents, and they did not stop him because he shot them first! Before you make a simple comment, or any comment at all, perhaps you should read about what you are commenting on, just a thought.

So this kid had no parents, no friends, live on one of the poorest reservations in the state and all the other kids picked on him often...why are people surprised this happened?

By the way, the innocent placing of your shooting smiley is actually kind of insensitive and tacky.

Just cuzz ppl pick on u and u hardly got no family doesnt mean u go on a killin' spree... JM is sort of rite..If his grandparents did pay more attention to their weird ass grand son they could have prevented all of this.

PVS
here is his review of another flash animation:

"A country founded on the deaths of millions of Native Americans, a country built on the deaths of innocents. A country forged from a holocaust greater then that of the Jews. Adolf Hitler supposedly killed 6 million innocent Jews in it's death camps and ghettos, Christopher Columbus is responsible for the deaths of over 8 million Native Americans. Which one has his own holiday? On the subject of guns, one day I'll gladly buy my sons (once I have them) assault rifles, pistols, shotguns, rifles, whatever. It's my right as an "American." God bless America, for killing billions of people world wide. Love it or leave it, you've got no choice. smile "

and here is his other flash movie: http://newgrounds.com/portal/view.php?id=199857

notice the song by evanescence...huh...evanescence....we found the culprit.

but yeah, you wont hear about that on the news. we will just have to watch them point their fingers at marylin manson...this will turn into yet another thought-police witchhunt against him, since his cd existed in his catalog.

Ketchuptome
That kid is sick.

ms_erupt
I'm not going to get into the debate on who or what is to blame. All I can say is that while I certainly don't condone his actions, I can understand them. Being Native is hard enough. But, with all of the extra shit heaped on you that he had in his life. Now, like I said, I'm not saying what he did was right, but it's important to try and understand why he felt he had to do this, where his mind was at so things like this can be prevent in the future.

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