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who is the evilist? if there is another thread like this sorry! there most likley is but o well..

MOOOOOOORGOTH!


HE IS JUST THE LORD OF EVIL !!

lol i know but i was looking at another thread (cant think of the name off hand0 but everyone was saying saurumon instead of sauron and i wanted to see who most peeps liked lol i personally think morgoth as well lol:P

Morgoth hands down. We're talking about Evil for Manwe's sake! Morgoth was not corrupted or a servant of the Shadow, but he IS the Shadow itself. He's the Evil personified, (or Valarified ). He was the source of all Dark and Evil in Arda (actually technically it's Eru since Morgoth came from him but I'll just shut up now). At least Sauron and Saruman wasn't really Evil at the beginning, they were just corrupted by power and might.

When it comes to Evil, nothing surpasses the First Dark Lord.

Nothing is evillllller than Morgoth... yey... but since we're talking bout LoTR I think the better answer would be Sauron

Yeah, it's kinda confusing. The question was referring to LOTR, but the option includes Morgoth.

Gollum though is very evil. He pretends to be nice, but betrays Frodo and Sam. Can't get more eviler than that. He has a evil sounding voice, looks and personality. True Morgoth is the source of all evil, but Gollum is the most corrupted by it. He can no longer control his own mind. So sad.

Why'd she put Morgoth?


Well in the trilogy it mentions Morgoth so nyah!

Mentions, yes, but he isnt a great villain there - just some long-forgotten guy who maybe was the lord of the Balrogs... no villain.

Denethor was not a villain....a slightly insane bad parent, yes...but no villain

he didnt exactly try to kill pippin of anything......

saruman, well....no.....he was very secretive, which is a brownie point for him, but he just didnt have the well....availabilities sauron did

Morgoth is evil itself. Followed by Sauron.

morgoth wasnt IN lotr though

sure, he was watching form his own private box...but he wasnt actually there!

yes Morgoth ruled.......especially when he wasnt in LOTR

yeah i mean that bit where they were battlig, and he didnt turn up...and gandalf was like 'whoah im glad melkors not here'


i was like WOW

In LotR Sauron, but generally in ME, Morgoth.

saruman is beter in LOTR
otherwise morgoth
then sauron.....

Who is the greatest or who is the most evil? Be more specific.

Morgoth is greatly weakened since he was Melkor. In fact, Sauron in the Second Age was greater than Morgoth in the First Age (Morgoth had really gone down a LONG way!)

no he wasnt shaber

morgoth in the second age had defeated the peoples of middle earth, and had won the wars all of them, he was victorious

until the valar came...if they hadnt he would have ruled for a loooooong time


sauron, never won.....ever, apart from bringing about the sinking of numenor

Morgoth's just trapped that's all...eventually he'll become strong...and kill all of us.

Morgoth is still the greatest. Whether if we're talking about power or evilness.

Sauron in the Second and the Third Age tried to dominate Middle-earth, and he almost did in the Second Age, if not for Isildur. But Morgoth? He didn't. He didn't just try..he did. You remember "Arda Marred"? This was due to Morgoth's control over Arda. He had complete control over all the world. That is, until the War of Wrath when he was finally defeated and cast into the Void.

Frodo is the biggest villain... he pretends all the way through that he's going to destroy the Ring, but has no intention of doing so... also it is his actions, under the guidance of Gandalf, that leadsto the end of magic and legend, ushering in a new age of mills, factories and corruption....

no it is not i would not settle till i had every man woman and child under my domain


although i owuld leave the dwarves alone, because you cant tell the men and women apart......lol




and frodo DID want to destroy the ring, it just took over him in mt doom, as it was AMAZINGLY powerful there

lol ok then you should wait until Morgoth returns ... and help him a little

what, become a servant yet again! never

Then make him become Saurons servant

would that work lol??

Sauron is the superior Morgoth was just milking the Melkor franchise!

ah, OK..so I guess Sauron is the Vala and and Morgoth is the Maia now?

finally, you all understand!

Not necessarily,

but the greatest is he who knows the borders of his might... which is definitely not Morgoth

Yeah, but I was referring to shaber's post saying that Sauron is the superior one and all. I myself is more intimidated by Sauron for some reasons that are oblivious even to me, but when it comes to power alone, I will still say that Melkor is more powerful.

The poll saud Morgoth and not Melkor

Morgoth and Melkor are the same... Melkor is his original name and Morgoth the one Feanor first gave to him and the only one he was named in Middleearth...

Sad to say I am not as traversed in the Middle Earth universe as all of you guys so this might sound annoying. Sauron is a Necromancer, correct... and basically similar to Lich in his physical form... Was he one of the wizards of the past? corrupted by time? I take it that he alone is not pure evil because he gave an ultimative to sceed rule rather then slaughter everyone to the kingdoms of middle earth, therefore i take it that Morgoth by your posts would probably enslave everyone. Truly neither were crazy madmen but rather quite cunning, keeping them for manual labor and to watch them suffer. Thanks for any answers and your time.

Sauron is an evil angel. The wizards were good angels, trapped in mortal flesh since 2000 years previously, so are greatly weakened. Four of them did succumb to temptations, but to varying degrees. Sauron is in his purely spiritual form throughout so unhandicapped by physicality; and he is altogether evil, no ambiguity on that point whatsoever.

well sauron he was quite cocky i thought

declaring himself openly in mordor again before he had the ring...was wuite funny

but a big mistake

Well Sauron does have a body in LoTR. Gollum mentions his four fingers on the black hand, how would Sauron wear the ring if he had none? How will Aragorn have a spirit come forth from the black gate... How will he do justice upon a spirit? Tolkien confirms this in letter #246.

I'm sad to see that Denethor is on the list of villians. If this is the impression that the movie gives to non-book readers, I will say that PJ made some VERY bad choices.

Agreed.

I'd have to go with Morgoth. He is evil personified. Denethor is up there. Sauron did a good job corrupting him. Not to mention he's too bad of a parent to be a hero. Saruman was more successful as a good guy and wasn't a bad guy long enough to be really evil. You have to like Sauron's accomplishments, but he's just a lietenant of Morgoth's. I'd have put Sauron two or three with Denethor being up there. Gollum isn't really evil at all. At least Smeagal isn't. Gollum is just the ring's influence. You also have to take into account that Gollum is the hero of ME. He destroys the ring (granted by accident). That is something Frodo, the main hero, couldn't do. Now if the ring was put up there, it might have gotten my vote. The ring is evil enough to turn anyone evil. That's pretty bad. I'd have put the ring right behind Morgoth.

I don't think Denethor is up there in league with Morgoth and Sauron. Sure he's not the best parent in the world, but he's not that evil either when it comes to his character overall. Actually, there's much more to the man's character to even allow us to sympathasize with him. He watched his beloved wife Finduilas waste away to an early death and has been reminded of her presence every moment her likeness (in Faramir) walks into the room. He's also lost his firstborn son, Boromir, who symbolizes the bravery and strength of the kingdom of Gondor. And, to top it all off, he's about to lose his throne--whether to the rightful king, Aragorn, or to Sauron in defeat.

Sauron indeed did a good job of twisting his mind to insanity, but it obviously wasn't Denethor's choice. If he was that evil, he wouldn't have experienced such grief when Boromir died. He shouldn't have cared that much.

If he was that evil, he should have been in league with Sauron, just like Saruman. He shouldn't have even bothered to defend Minas Tirith. If he was that evil, he should have sought for complete power and total domination. He should have ordered the killing of thousands of people already.

He was a villain to some extent just so we could have a variety of different characters with their own internal struggles, and also so that the LOTR books and movies could have some twist and more dramatic impact. But being a villain to some extent doesn't necessarily mean that you have to be totally evil. Denethor wasn't at all...he was just a psychologically and emotionally challenged character.

I can't believe that Saruman could be considered as more of a good guy than Denethor.

Denethor is no way a vilan....he is just a depresed old man who has had his most beloved things robed from him one by one....

s-b^wife son gondor...

Try to look at it from his point of view....
You are the head of a kingdom, your hapily maried and have 2 beutifull sons who love you very much and can't wait to grow up and fight and ride horsieys....as time goes on your wife dies an untimely death....that alone is enough to push a guy of the edge, you mourn her death...and are somewhat comforted that you still have your two sons with you...especialy your firstborn
your still upset about ur wife and start tinkering with your toys in the tower.....and it begins....you send ur first born, ur beloved, on a quest to bring this elvish weapon, isildur's bane...you tell him not to fail....not to let this thing to be handed over to elves...little do you know you are sending him to his death....YOU are now responsible...YOU have killed your son...YOU have now had two deaths in your family.......*more tinkering with palantir*......you find out this ranger....this stranger(hey that rymes) from the north has been found and people are saying he is the heir to the thrown....which would mean you would then be unemployed.....some time later your son has come back from battle 95% dead....a battle YOU sent him too...so once again....YOU are responsible....its seems like all you do goes wrong...and you don't care anymore....what is left anyway?....why go on....there is nothing for myself here...orcs are taking my city....i hate the world and they hate me...nothing can save me now....except...hmmm...yes, the thought had entered Your mind before...but you never realy thought you'd go thru with it....but now...now its a reality....you walk stagering to the tombs not caring how you look shouting out orders...ripping your clothes and hair...your son is brought to you and you hesitate....just for a moment and for the first time wonder if this is what you should do...the thought leaves you instantly....and what once was wisdom, now seems like folly...how could you go back, WHY would you want too....this world is full of death death death....and now death will take YOU and you will have peace once again....like you vaguly remember so long ago....

you can't take it anymore....your drenched in oil

in a flash of pain you are consumed by the fire and you tumble thru the air as life leaves you slowly, and you leave this world forever



(at least thats how i think I would feel if i was denathor)