Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

The consumption of what has now been labeled "Class-A Drugs"
must have started at some point in time. All the evidence if you look and pay... any attention to these religious nuts is right in front of you

All these mass conventions in arenas that could host a Rock show, and it's also Vanity to force other people to like your religion. For example...

Jesus said he was the son of god, we only have his word on that one, so remember he was out in the desert and it was either the heat from the sun giving him weird visions, or he was stoned or on acid...
(Pink Elephants & Walking Hammers).

The Bible, is a great novel, though I don't really read fiction.

And Moses, god didn't speak to him or give him 13 or 10 stone tablets, he was ingesting tablets of his own making, at which point he got some really selfish and crazy ideas about, no sex with someone else, no graven images which was his plan to prevented the birth of Heavy Metal much to his failure THE KINKS invented guitar distortion
before they recorded their first album in 1963, so don't give up your day job Moses.
And this garbage about honoring your parents, well if your parents are wankers, ballocks to them.

Finally... I've down loaded two complete albums of the same band that have been deleted and may not be remastered or released again, it's OK my friend knows the copyright owner. Plus I have them on Vinyl and scanned the covers and edited up sleeves and made labels for the discs and they look like they came fresh from the local record store.

In conclusion nothing is ever written in stone, not even this.

"So remember, lie, cheat, steal and listen to Heavy Metal music"

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/hot_knight/bigcountry_banner.jpg

I've never seen you
look like this without a reason
Another promise fallen through,
another season passes by you

I never took the smile
away from anybody's face
And that's a desperate way
to look for someone who is still a child

In a big country
dreams stay with you
Like a lover's voice
far as the mountainside
Stay alive ----- BC

Originally posted by knight
The consumption of what has now been labeled "Class-A Drugs"
must have started at some point in time. All the evidence if you look and pay... any attention to these religious nuts is right in front of you

All these mass conventions in arenas that could host a Rock show, and it's also Vanity to force other people to like your religion. For example...

Jesus said he was the son of god, we only have his word on that one, so remember he was out in the desert and it was either the heat from the sun giving him weird visions, or he was stoned or on acid...
(Pink Elephants & Walking Hammers).

The Bible, is a great novel, though I don't really read fiction.

And Moses, god didn't speak to him or give him 13 or 10 stone tablets, he was ingesting tablets of his own making, at which point he got some really selfish and crazy ideas about, no sex with someone else, no graven images which was his plan to prevented the birth of Heavy Metal much to his failure THE KINKS invented guitar distortion
before they recorded their first album in 1963, so don't give up your day job Moses.
And this garbage about honoring your parents, well if your parents are wankers, ballocks to them.

Finally... I've down loaded two complete albums of the same band that have been deleted and may not be remastered or released again, it's OK my friend knows the copyright owner. Plus I have them on Vinyl and scanned the covers and edited up sleeves and made labels for the discs and they look like they came fresh from the local record store.

In conclusion nothing is ever written in stone, not even this.

"So remember, lie, cheat, steal and listen to Heavy Metal music"

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/hot_knight/bigcountry_banner.jpg


It doesn't take class -A drugs. Regular drugs are fine. Pot is cool.

BIG COUNTRY!!! What a band eh???

Originally posted by knight
The consumption of what has now been labeled "Class-A Drugs"
must have started at some point in time. All the evidence if you look and pay... any attention to these religious nuts is right in front of you

All these mass conventions in arenas that could host a Rock show, and it's also Vanity to force other people to like your religion. For example...

Jesus said he was the son of god, we only have his word on that one, so remember he was out in the desert and it was either the heat from the sun giving him weird visions, or he was stoned or on acid...
(Pink Elephants & Walking Hammers).

The Bible, is a great novel, though I don't really read fiction.

And Moses, god didn't speak to him or give him 13 or 10 stone tablets, he was ingesting tablets of his own making, at which point he got some really selfish and crazy ideas about, no sex with someone else, no graven images which was his plan to prevented the birth of Heavy Metal much to his failure THE KINKS invented guitar distortion
before they recorded their first album in 1963, so don't give up your day job Moses.
And this garbage about honoring your parents, well if your parents are wankers, ballocks to them.

Finally... I've down loaded two complete albums of the same band that have been deleted and may not be remastered or released again, it's OK my friend knows the copyright owner. Plus I have them on Vinyl and scanned the covers and edited up sleeves and made labels for the discs and they look like they came fresh from the local record store.

In conclusion nothing is ever written in stone, not even this.

"So remember, lie, cheat, steal and listen to Heavy Metal music"

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/hot_knight/bigcountry_banner.jpg

Ok I have yet to know what we are talking about?jm

yeah as that came like lightning from a clear sky

Originally posted by Jackie Malfoy
Ok I have yet to know what we are talking about?jm

Oh....Jackie....your so cute when your confused......

None of those people were on drugs - they knew what they were doing - it had a purpose.

Besides, Jesus said we are all God's children, yet I am still to figure out then, what was so special about Jesus in that case

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
None of those people were on drugs - they knew what they were doing - it had a purpose.

Besides, Jesus said we are all God's children, yet I am still to figure out then, what was so special about Jesus in that case

The thing that made Jesus so special was that He was the only one that supposedly raised from the dead...I think that if he didn't do that, He wouldn't be as special....though Mithra and others also raised from the dead...Hummm..supposedly the Jesus story and the Mithra story are the same person. Along with Dionysus..etc.

Originally posted by Jackie Malfoy
Ok I have yet to know what we are talking about?jm drugs man....drugggzzz.

yes and yet the christian disregard these other stories as bogus but their version nah thats the real deal...........

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/hot_knight/dd_banner.jpg

Originally posted by debbiejo
The thing that made Jesus so special was that He was the only one that supposedly raised from the dead...I think that if he didn't do that, He wouldn't be as special....though Mithra and others also raised from the dead...Hummm..supposedly the Jesus story and the Mithra story are the same person. Along with Dionysus..etc.
That, and he is part of the Trinity. Angels are the sons of God; Jesus is the Son of God.

Originally posted by FeceMan
That, and he is part of the Trinity. Angels are the sons of God; Jesus is the Son of God.

Don't you think WE, are also the "Sons of God"?? There is an older text that describes what Jesus was saying when he said he was the son of man meant that He was part of humanity, as we are, and that He is a son of God, means that he is from god, just as we are...God made us all.

Infact all of creation belongs to God...

Some people even believe that "Jesus" was a code for a hallucinogenic mushroom.....

Finti... I'm back! How have you been?

Most people are unaware of the proof contained in the Holy Bible. Popular media tends to present general opinion, incorporating uninformed viewpoints. Realizing the incredible evidence of the Holy Bible requires more depth than popular opinion.

A rather common accusation sharply aimed at the Christian goes like this: "You Christians are pitiful! All you have is blind faith." This would surely indicate that the accuser seems to think that to become a Christian, one has to commit intellectual suicide. Personally, my heart cannot rejoice in what my mind rejects. The Christian faith is faith in Christ. It's value of worth is NOT in the one believing, but in the one believed, not in the one trusting, but in the one trusted.

QUESTIONS TO PONDER:

The Gospel accounts were circulated in the lifetimes of eyewitnesses. Would a lie stand the test of time? For 2,000 years?

Eleven of the 12 apostles who knew the truth were executed (over a number of years) for their beliefs. Why would they die for a known lie?

Many other people died in support of the truth, some in the lifetime of eyewitnesses (seven million catacomb graves verify this). Why?

Paul, a prominent persecutor of Christians, gave up wealth and status, and later died to tell the story after seeing the risen Jesus. Why?

In 56 A.D. Paul wrote that over 500 people had seen the risen Jesus and that most of them were still alive (1 Corinthians 15:6). It passes the bounds of credibility that the early Christians could have manufactured such a tale and then preached it among those who might easily have refuted it simply by producing the body of Jesus.

why didnt more scriptures pop up to support these gospels then?
the gospels doesnt even agree on the names of the 12

2000 years later 100 of people say and have written about that they have been abducted by aliens

finti

Please elaborate. Submit a response containing substance that can be obtained from material printed on paper through a publisher and has all it's rights reserved. Something that an author has made possible through rigorous study and hard work.

You've made statements and presented questions that have virtually no back bone or weight in light of my original message. No pun intended. I can't take your response seriously being void of strong revalations.

Sorry.

No work as survived and spread as the Gospel has. SOMETHING MAJOR HAPPENDED. There were no printing presses, no photocopiers, no quick ways to copy manuscripts. Nevertheless, the Gospel quickly expanded throughout the Roman Empire. Comprehending the scale of this vast explosion of hand-copied documents is only possible by comparing the number of extant New Testament manuscripts with those of other abundant documents.

Of historical works, PLINY THE YOUNGER has 7 original manuscripts, THUCYDIDES 8, HERODOTUS 8, GALLIC WARS 10, LLIAD 643 and the NEW TESTAMENT 24,970.

Having more surviving early manuscripts means having more cross-checks to verify accuracy. Today's Holy Bible is verified to a textual accuracy of 99.5 percent. Some biblical copies are old enough to show eyewitnesses' confirmation (made within 25 years of events). That's flash news in ancient times.

Earliest copies of other manuscripts don't even beign to compare. PLINY THE YOUNGER 750 years, THUCYDIDES 1,300 years, HERODOTUS 1,300 years, GALLIC WARS 1,000 years, and LLIAD 500 years. Why do some doubt biblical acccuracy, yet readily accept other, less reliable history?

Until this century, the earliest Old Testament copies were from about A.D. 1,000 (simular to typical historical works). Skeptics argued textual corruption was possible. Others argued miracles of prophecy, especially concering Jesus; were recorded centuries after Christ and were changed to fit the outcome of history.

Modern Archaeological discoveries soundly refute such claims. Thousands of much earlier documents now verify biblical accuracy.

Perhaps the most important Archaeological find in history is the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls in 1947-48. Discovered accidently by a Bedouin shepard searching a cave in the Qumran region near the Dead Sea, the scrolls have been hidden by the Essenes (a Jewish sect similar to the Pharisees and Sadducees) just prior to the fall of Jerusalem in A.D. 70. It took almost 20 years to uncover all the scrolls and bring them together in one location.

The discorvery includes thousands of fragments and some complete scolls found in 11 caves. In total, about 800 scrolls have been identified, which include copies of every book of the Old Testament (except Esther), along with a number of other scrolls relevant to history and to the Essene community. Several scrolls exist in multiple copies. Many of the oldest scrolls (including the remarkably intact scroll of Isaiah) were written more than 200 years before Christ (long before the fulfillment of prophecies they contain about the coming Messiah).

In addition to the Dead Sea Scrolls, some of the most important biblical writings, of the thousands available, are the following:

Rylans Papyrus (A.D. 115 - A.D. 125), Bodmer Papyri (A.D. 150 - A.D. 200), Chester Beatty Papyri (A.D. 100 - A.D. 300), Codex Vaticanus (Early 300s) Codex Sinaiticus (Early 300s), and The Vulgate (A.D. 400)

now I dont post other peoples work, I dont need them to think for me. what statement are you refering to?

finti

Stop with the ridiculous attempts to degrade my intelligence. I don't deserve that. I have been cutting and pasting material from papers that I wrote using resources that I have at home. It saves time.

And just a couple nights ago, I purchased 150 dollars of DVD type research material regarding Noah's Ark and studies backing the creation event mentioned in the book of Genesis. All these things are backed by science, secular history and archeology. I figured, I'd better listen to the subject matter experts and not sift through bar talk.

For the sake of a productive debate, tell me about your views. And, in doing so, be as specific as possible. I'm not trying to argue. There is a reason I join forums of this caliber. I'm trying to learn as much as possible about Christianity and learn of possible contradictions the Bible, or anything involving Christianity I may NOT know about to be thorough.

Most (not all) people I run into have no idea how much effort must be exercised to study Christianity. It's takes hours of study. Some People read a few magazine articles and watch the Sci-Fi channel and think they are wizards when it comes to Religion. I'll never understand that.

What is your truth?

still use your own words not others, I dont attempt to degrade your intelligence you do a good job of that without my interference. so for the sake of argument answer the questions asked dont squirm away with the words of the people of your newly purchased dvds, You dont gain my respect by buying a load of stuff, the main goal of research is to understand it as well as just to know hte words behind it. To buy stuff to back your beliefs gets you nowhere . Biased info is the work of ignorance, try purchasing dvds of an opposite view instead .......... broadened your horizon


I have been to both camps, and the religous camp loose out big time

Originally posted by finti
why didnt more scriptures pop up to support these gospels then?
the gospels doesnt even agree on the names of the 12

2000 years later 100 of people say and have written about that they have been abducted by aliens
Except that the culprit of this phenomenon has to do with REM sleep.

Originally posted by finti
still use your own words not others, I dont attempt to degrade your intelligence you do a good job of that without my interference. so for the sake of argument answer the questions asked dont squirm away with the words of the people of your newly purchased dvds, You dont gain my respect by buying a load of stuff, the main goal of research is to understand it as well as just to know hte words behind it. To buy stuff to back your beliefs gets you nowhere . Biased info is the work of ignorance, try purchasing dvds of an opposite view instead .......... broadened your horizon


I have been to both camps, and the religous camp loose out big time
Nice job, Finti. You continue to avoid what ush says and, though he is trying to have an actual debate, you insist on acting like an ass and insulting him.

(By the way, I would not be too quick to accuse anyone of being stupid, especially not if I were to type it with your grammar.)

FeceMan

You hit the nail on the head. I'm pleased that you recognized my attempts in debating over Christianity, which is proving to be a waist of time.

Thank you for your kind words buddy. I simply post material that I have learned at home, and challenge anyone to rebuke it. And yet, time after time, all I receive is rhetoric, cheap shots and deep seeded questions they don't even know the answers to.

I am in the developmental stages of my Christian faith, and welcome constructive arguments. It helps me research material that I simply overlook, and sharpens other aspects of contention.

I have yet to be troubled in my faith. I've had a few minor set backs, but nothing that hasn't been verified or confirmed with a few days a research. It's amazing how much information is available in support of the Christian God. It's intoxicating.

When I first began my journey in search of the truth, I was compelled to be open minded and research other religions as well. I was even curious enough to embark on Atheist websites. Otherwise, what's the point? During my course of study, it became abundantly clear that all religions are not the same, even down to reference material and evidence.

The facts that I have come to learn is that, only a hand full of religions support the implication of a God, and some, communities of Gods large enough to fill a shopping mall. The rest are philosophies about life.

I was displeased, and yet relieved at the same time. I learned a very important lesson. Compiling all evidence, the obvious choice was the Christian God. Because it contained the most amount of evidence to support it's claims on various topics and so forth. NOT BECAUSE I DESPERATELY WANTED IT TO BE THE RIGHT RELIGION! What part of having faith in something and not being able to confirm it's claims sounds inviting to you?

Remember... even at that time, I was convinced that Christianity was foolish, but it was the obvious choice for study. And I was prepared to ripe the Holy Bible apart. But the complete opposite happened. The Holy Bible tore me apart. Slowly but surely, during all the research, I started realizing my arrogance and foolishness. I still had major doubts nonetheless, but I took the Holy Bible more seriously. My mind opened.

And today, my faith is strong. An intellectual faith based on facts, not blind faith or heart felt convictions of sincerity. That is for foolish people if I may say. My studies continue today, and have purchased 150 dollars of research material involving science, history and archeology that you CAN'T find for other religions. It's simply not there, not in the abundance Christianity is anyway. It doesn't compare.

It's natural to question. In fact, it shows intelligence on ones part. But to trash and downgrade Christianity and all is vast amounts evidence, over a few philosophical issues or troubling questions, reflects poor judgement in my opinion.

I have them too, your not the only one. You think your the only person brilliant enough to question things? Please. Be fair and honest with yourself. You simply must study the Holy Bible to learn anything about it. And I excepted that fact, and took action. And so far, it has proved to be a very very cool experience.

YOU CANNOT RELY ON YOUR OWN PHILOSOPHY!

yeah well when since english isnt my native language I dont give a rats ass about your opinion about grammar, when you start to debate thing in a different language than your native one maybe then we can come back and discuss grammar. So until that day...............


guess I have to buy a book or some dvds that I can nick arguments from to continue this discussion cause using my own words would be stupid now wouldnt it.

who said I havent studied the bible? be fair and honest with myself? since this is coming from the one who copy paste other peoples argument I find that as a laughable request

finti

Your a moron.

The Trees Of Religion

Matthew 21:19 tells us Jesus cursed a fig tree: "Let there be no more fruit from you forever. And the fig tree immediately dried up."

The fig tree Jesus cursed represented the jewish' religious system of the time. Trees in the bible often represent religious systems created by men. They appear as truth and as the way to God, but in effect are damaging to man's relationship with God. The battle for the heart of mankind is with religion. Religion was what Jesus attacked during his ministry here on earth. He attacked religious ideas and religious leaders. His message was to forsake religion and look for the truth of who God is (and who you are) within your own being - for God speaks to the hearts of mankind. The spirit of God is who we should follow, for the spirit is truth. Yet, men create church doctrines, church denominations, church services and church programs to supposedly save mankind and bring us to God. However, religion is creating a greater chasm between God and mankind which must be healed:

"But of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof, thou shalt surely die." (Genesis 2:17)

Religion "kills" the relationship between God and mankind, creating separation in the minds of those who buy into its doctrines. Separation between God and mankind has occurred in the mind of man, but is not truth. Religion, the manmade ideas of how we can "get right with God," is the root cause of this separation which has been passed down from generation to generation; making a relationship with God by His spirit almost completely void. Therefore, the trees of religion must be hewn down, and will be:

"Every good tree brings forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree brings forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth good fruit; neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. "Every tree that brings not forth good fruit is hewn down and cast into the fire." (Matthew 7)

We have been taught, traditionally speaking by religion, that the tree to be hewn down is "us," individually; but that is not the hidden truth in this passage. The tree to be hewn down is religion. But, what can one do, who is trapped in religion? Leave it now and come to your freedom! The time for you to hear what the spirit of God is saying is now:

Revelation 18:4 cries, "Come out of her my people, that you be not partakers in her sins (incorrect thinking and ideas), and that you receive not of her plagues (fear, condemnation, guilt, separation from God and others)."

"To him that overcomes (religion), I will give to eat of the tree of life (the spirit of God who is life), which is in the midst of the paradise of God (within you!)." (Revelation 2:17)

II Thessalonians chapter two, speaks about a "falling away" that must first come before the son of perdition may be revealed. The son of perdition, we are told...

"who is opposing and raising himself up above all called God or is worshipped, so that he in the sanctuary of God, as God, has sat down, showing himself off that he is God." (II Thessalonians 2:4)

This son of perdition is religion. You will notice that this son of perdition already sits in the sanctuary now, which is the hearts and minds of mankind. (You are this sanctuary: "You are the temple of God, and the spirit of God dwells in you" I Corinthians 3:16) But what is the "falling away" that must occur before the "son of perdition" or "religion" can be revealed? It is the "falling away" from religion. As people flee the bonds of religion and the traditions of men, their eyes will be opened to see the apostasy already created and currently in power (and falsely in Jesus' name) by religious leaders.

I write this to confirm to many that religion is your enemy...your adversary. Leave it now, and cease to give it power over you; then you will "see." Listen to your heart, as the spirit of God will lead you unto all truth. Then, you will be "born-again." Your time for freedom is now...

"God did choose you from the beginning for salvation, in purification of the spirit, and belief of the truth." (II Thessalonians 2:13)

I am well aware of your native language. However, I suspect that your spelling and grammar issues freely commute between the two.

dont have to translate between the two if thats what you are asking

Originally posted by FeceMan
Nice job, Finti. You continue to avoid what ush says and, though he is trying to have an actual debate, you insist on acting like an ass and insulting him.

(By the way, I would not be too quick to accuse anyone of being stupid, especially not if I were to type it with your grammar.)

Nice going!!!

Like it was said, religions kill the relationship between man and God. God makes it easy to communicate and man doesn't

Originally posted by finti



Well, Finti, all off your remarks about Christianity and the insults and the so called evidence of the contents of the Bible being fabricated over ages are all old and been said by other people before. So much for using existing arguments.

there is a big difference about having the same idea of an argument and copy the exact thing word for word

Originally posted by finti
dont have to translate between the two if thats what you are asking
Due to the lack of a question mark, it is obvious that I was not asking anything. And nowhere in my writing did I mention translation.

Who cares of periods after a sentence. Its not like it is an essay thats up for grading.
But for all if you want to overestimate your own skill by playing a college English professor go ahead

not quite ignorant though, try ignore

Originally posted by finti
Who cares of periods after a sentence. Its not like it is an essay thats up for grading.
But for all if you want to overestimate your own skill by playing a college English professor go ahead
You are debating your grammatical prowess with me and I pointed out a flaw in your grammatical structure; that's all we are talking about. And does this really matter in the great scheme of the debate?

The Bible is the Word of God......

How do I know?

Because the Bible tells me so.......

David Icke is God's son...

How do I know?

Because David Icke tells me so......

The Bible is right.... because lots of people belive it is....

Gravity sucks things to the ground... because lots of people believe it does....

personally, I'm with Finti..... I would never state that my truth is the only truth... I believe in the existence of the Christian god, but don't believe him to be all powerful... but it is just a belief... I would never ever state the existence of any god as being fact.....especially on the shaky evidence available....

well look at my reply you quoted and read the first part, there you have your answer

Originally posted by finti


Dont take things so personal guys. We are suppose to be adults here.