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I saw this over at TFN, it is a very interesting thought, especially the way it is ellaborated on. This same could also be true for AOTC. Seeing as how many of us know most of what happens in ths movie we can probably think of more examples.

http://www.theforce.net/episode3/story/Will_Phantom_Menace_Improve_After_Sith_92244.asp




Will Phantom Menace Improve After Sith?

Posted By Joshua on May 11, 2005
A very legitimate question being asked in the forums these days is centered on how we will look at the earlier prequels once we view Revenge of the Sith. Will it make sense once you've seen the completed picture? Will it make it ... better? Whether you already like the films or not, it is an interesting discussion that in engaging much of the fan base.

Author posted this very question and some suggestions in the Jedicouncil spoiler forums and there's been some interesting responses so far. There are some great arguements, and I've clipped a few of them below to get your juices flowing.


It is very sad when the movie starts to know that by the end of the PT, Obi-Wan and Yoda will have gone into hiding, Qui-Gon will have become one with the Force, Palpatine will have begun his evil Empire, Anakin will have become a Sith lord who is half-man, half-machine, and Padme and Shmi will be dead and buried.

In that sense, TPM almost becomes like a flashback to a happier, simpler time. The scene where Ani gives Padme the japor snippet is almost enough to make you cry, because Ani says it'll bring her good luck yet you know she's going to end up buried with it. And the scene in Shmi's home, when Ani says "Nobody can kill a Jedi!" becomes so tragic, especially when you know he will some day lead the massacre at the Jedi Temple. And hearing Qui-Gon's reply, "If only that were so" becomes absolutely heart-wrenching, having seen all the Jedi get killed in ROTS.

The scene where Padme (then known as Queen Amidala) calls for a vote of no confidence in Chancellor Valorum's leadership is, well, infinitely depressing, because you know Palpatine knows exactly what he wants and how he's going to get it and Padme is so absolutely clueless about what her motion will mean for the galaxy 13 years later. "Now they will elect a *new* chancellor, a *strong* chancellor".... indeed!

All the scenes with Palpatine as Darth Sidious are also a reminder of how truly cruel this man was all along, despite his amicable facade when still known as Senator Palpatine.

His lines near the end of the movie are all filled with so much hidden meaning. "We are indebted to you for your bravery, Obi-Wan Kenobi... and you, young Skywalker, we'll be watching your career with great interest!" "It is you who should be congratulated, your highness. Together, we will bring peace and prosperity back to the Republic!". He was always so full of it!

And watching Boss Nass and Sio Bibble in any scene they appear in is also a reminder of the saddest scene in ROTS, when they and Jar Jar are walking in the funeral procession right behind Padme's body.

Hey I loved TPM and AOTC before ROTS was ever made.

I love all the episodes of the Star Wars saga.

...

episode I made me a star wars fan. I LOVE 1,2,3,5 and 6. episode IV is crap but its star wars so it should be treated with respect

lol-- so do I DarthLazious, but I still can't get over the fact that the BEST part of the Phantom Menace is still ruined by Jar-Jar. Oh my, I just wish he would have died in that battle. ugh.
A blast to the face would have been nice.


Yes, the Phantom Menace will most definitely looked upon differently; as will Attack of the Clones.

Originally posted by The Ones
episode I made me a star wars fan. I LOVE 1,2,3,5 and 6. episode IV is crap but its star wars so it should be treated with respect

How is Episode IV crap?

Originally posted by The Ones
episode I made me a star wars fan. I LOVE 1,2,3,5 and 6. episode IV is crap but its star wars so it should be treated with respect So in other word you love crap?

Originally posted by LandoSpeeder2
So in other word you love crap?

i dont love crap. i said it should be treated with respect

Strange, I do hope you meant "Epsiode I is crap but I treat it with respect..." At least that'd make sense.

Yeah; I don't see how you can not like the movie that started it all.

And which still stands the test of time, even despite the 70s hairdo's.

I would have to agree with Darth L. on this one. No matter what anyone says, I do like all of the movies. Sure there are ones that are better the the next, but I think we could say that about any multi-movie saga. TPM and AOTC are good movies in their own right. It is moving to look back, or forward, however you want to say it, and see how things play out in the OT and how events in the PT shape the OT. I still think there is more to the look that Vader gives the Emperor when he is zapping Luke with lightning. I kinda wonder if there will be something that plays out in "Sith" that will make that scene in "Jedi" more dramatic. I could be wrong, we shall see.

I still remember watching Alien with a friend of mine. My friend had only seen Aliens. When the scene of the guy dropping down into the nest of eggs came, my friend jumped up and started to scream "GET OUT OF THERE... GET OUT OF THERE". Of course I had no idea, but I soon found out.

Originally posted by DARTH DADDY
I still think there is more to the look that Vader gives the Emperor when he is zapping Luke with lightning. I kinda wonder if there will be something that plays out in "Sith" that will make that scene in "Jedi" more dramatic. I could be wrong, we shall see.


I think there is...

When Anakin is conflicted about Palps vs. Mace.

edit

srry bout that

Boss Nass is in ROTS?

Woah! learn sumpin new everyday.

Originally posted by queeq
Strange, I do hope you meant "Epsiode I is crap but I treat it with respect..." At least that'd make sense.


nope. i meant TPM rocks and ANH sucks

I too like all the SW movies, though the first two prequals less. Return of the Jedi has always been my favorite and Palpatine my favorite character. I find him way cooler than Vader which I know most people find wierd.

i dont

Okay. That's fine. Personally, while TPM and AOTC are not the best movies I have ever watched, they are not as bad as they are made out to be, and they are Star Wars.

Thanks you guys I'm glad that some people on here agree with me.

I also wish Jar Jar did die in that battle in TPM.

I don't mind him too much. He is a little annoying, but not horrible. Not deserving of all the hate.

When I watch ending of the music video "A Hero Falls" and there is this scene from Phantom Menace when Yoda says "Clouded This Boy Future Is " and I see this darken jedi council room and young Obi Wan looking at Qui Gon with this uncertainty in his eyes and then there is this shot that shows little Anakin looking at the council with that little spark of anger in his eyes . It's all different for me now . This movie is now showing its dark parts . For me watching it after ROTS will be much better .

Yes. There is subltlty in the first two PT movies that is not quite gotten until going back and looking for it. Especially with Palpatine.

thads true the first time i watched TPM i suspected Palpatine was a bad guy but never really knew until i found out the same actor played the emperor in VI

Good detective work sherlock

Originally posted by star22
I too like all the SW movies, though the first two prequals less. Return of the Jedi has always been my favorite and Palpatine my favorite character. I find him way cooler than Vader which I know most people find wierd.

Thats becuase he is the brains behind the evil vader is a small pawn in his plans =)

Originally posted by The Ones
episode I made me a star wars fan. I LOVE 1,2,3,5 and 6. episode IV is crap but its star wars so it should be treated with respect

i cant see how anyone would think epi. 4 is crap....one of the most exciting movies ever....just the trench run alone was amazing. i think most people think it sucks because its special FX werent breath taking. i for one like the FX and to me the story was much more important.

I think ROTS will make ALL the movies better. We will watch ANH, ESB, and ROTJ with a new perspective on Vader.

Originally posted by The Ones
nope. i meant TPM rocks and ANH sucks Dude, I REALLY hope you're kidding.

Sheesh there isnt anything wrong with Ep1 IMHO anyway.

ROTS won't make TPM any better because Episode 1 was a great film in my opinion with little room for improvement.

I always thought that about ROTS, that we'd see the whole prequel trilogy in a new view, and the whole saga in a new view, now that both are complete. Episode I was a bit drawn out at times, but as SMX said, not really any other way to do it.

TPM & AOTC are basically the calm before the storm.

3-5 is where the plot thickens

and 6 is basically just a final battle

I don't think ANH is "crap," but I definitely see the guy's point. I mean, it's just different. It's takes SO much time to get going, and it has SO much introductory stuff, even more than TPM.

Basically, I just look at it like a pilot.... Usually you have a really good tv show, and you see the pilot, you don't like it as much because there are so many things you are used to that are different.... ideas they tried but changed, principles that weren't introduced or developed yet.... I like it, but to me ANH comes across as the pilot to Empire and ROTJ.

Like, the underdeveloped lightsaber fight... Vader being almost a sidekick and not the main villian... the guy in the briefing room telling the pilots "May the force be with you," when Ep. V and VI (not to mention I II and III) make it abundantly clear that the Jedi alone have faith in and believe in the force... Luke's primary weapon is a blaster.... stuff like that that is just so different from the other two. Yes, introductory, but different.

Most (not all, but most) people say Empire is the best. When you get down to it, the "feel," the concept of Empire is just completely different from ANH.

I agree. I do love ANH like I love all the movies, but it is my fourth favorite after ROTJ, ESB, and ROTS. I do like it better than the first two prequals, I think, but they are pretty close.

I really love all the movies.

Totally Off Topic But Since ROTS is being RE-released GL need go back and update the CGI i was watching it it looks like SHIT!

Originally posted by The Ones
episode I made me a star wars fan. I LOVE 1,2,3,5 and 6. episode IV is crap but its star wars so it should be treated with respect


Finally someone knows that Episode IV is complete crap. It is SOOOOO boring.

I think it is funny to see all these people saying that ROTS is their favorite or that they love it when none of us have actually SEEN IT yet! I am looking forward to, I THINK it will be great and I have read all the spoilers but until you actually SEE it how can you say how much you love it?

Originally posted by macgeek2005
Finally someone knows that Episode IV is complete crap. It is SOOOOO boring.

I wouldn' t be here right now if it were not for Ep IV. I would have never watched any of the other films if I hadn't loved that one.
If Ep. 1 had been the first one I had seen I probably NEVER would have watched any of the others...
The only thing I can figure is the people who don't like Ep. IV are not the same people who sat in a theater in 1977 and saw something that was completely different than anything they had ever seen before - Star Wars, the original, now known as A New Hope.

Well, this is a whole new generation of fans. I don't care much for it, either. I watched the originals and loved them for what they were. Sure, ANH was rather slow in retrospect, but it was still a damn good movie and I'd watch it again and again. But agreeing with Waverly here, if TPM was the first movie ever (For a lot of you that's the case, and it's a scary thought that you saw TPM before anything... ) I can't say I'd be as avid a fan as I am now. The PT (ROTS aside, since it hasn't even been in theatres yet) doesn't have the magic of the originals. It's all flash and pizzazz and -kick- ass lightsaber duels. Plot material being ground up to make more special effects.

Originally posted by Lazerlike42
I don't think ANH is "crap," but I definitely see the guy's point. I mean, it's just different. It's takes SO much time to get going, and it has SO much introductory stuff, even more than TPM.



Exqueese me?? That is so odd. Introductory stuff isn't bad per se, but the WHOLE of TPM is introductory stuff. PLus you never get an idea what the heck is going on. In ANH what's at stake is clear: get the DS plans or the Rebllion will die. And Luke is going to play a vital part in that. Simple, clear and well worked out.
Now TPM: there's a trade dispute on taxes (yawn), there are Neimodians (I though the 60s Star Trek days were over), there are two Jedi and a whole council, there's a queen, a Chancellor and a contender, there's a mysterious Dark Lord with a demonic helper (now that was cool!), and there's a little boy. And they allr un around a mysterious unknown threat: a phantom menace... Now, THAT is nothing... all introductory. KNowing that Palpatine was to be the Emperor (as described in the 1977 introduction to the ANH novel), it was a bad move to keep that from the general audience.
AOTC basically has the same problem: what the heck is it about.

Now, I can live with these things because I can appreciate the subtleties, but what I cannot appreciate that it is all so subtle and hidden, as if that is adding anything to the suspense drive of the story. At least the OT had that, you know what's at stake - will they make it or not.
In TPM and AOTC it's more like: well, I know what's going to happen so I can dig it taht I hardly see it here.

To me there already great and I think Revenge Of The Sith will improve all of the movies because it will complete the missing elements of the story.

Well, I think the whole concept of ROTS "improving" TPM and AOTC is complete nonsense.

I dig all the star wars movies, but i dont think even ROTS will cure anakins crying bi*ch a*s in Episode 2... The LOve Crapola in the movie makes me sick, but the action is top notch...

My point exactly. What is bad, will still be bad.

I think it will make the movie better, whether it is good or bad.

I think it will improve them for many people. There are a lot of people that didn't like TPM because they didn't understand what was going on. The politics was too heavy for some people in other words. Once people see ROTS and understand the politics and Sidious' plan, they may not be so averse to TPM or parts of AOTC.

Originally posted by DarthLazious
Hey I loved TPM and AOTC before ROTS was ever made.

I love all the episodes of the Star Wars saga.

i agree with him

me too

me three.

Star Wars doesn't have the fallability like Star Trek, where the rule of thumb is to watch every even-numbered film (ST 2, ST4, etc...).

All the Star Wars films, even with their flaws, blemishes, etc. are still enjoyable to watch to the end.

Me four.

Me five.

Okay, there seems to be alot of "I loved TPM anyway" posts.

The point of the thread was to ask if you thought ROTS would magnify smaller details from TPM and make a great movie even greater.

I never said I hate TPM or anything, though I'm not exactly sure what the article I posted said(have to check again).

I love TPM, out of 5 great movies I place it as the 4th greatest.

i agree with the ones, eps 4 is the worst in the entire series...

but it deserves respect as it is the movie that started it all, the only scene thats really really good in 4 is when luke and ben are in the hut and there talking about the clone wars and anakin. other then that, its a horribly boring movie....to me anyways

oh and a few scenes with vader, ie. the meeting room scene with tarkin which has the best line in star wars ever i think "i find your lack of faith disturbing"..

in all honesty thats the best line with the best delivery of all 6 movies (well of the 5, since i have yet to see 3, but i doubt they will top it)

its absolutely awesome..

Originally posted by Lazerlike42
I think it will improve them for many people. There are a lot of people that didn't like TPM because they didn't understand what was going on. The politics was too heavy for some people in other words. Once people see ROTS and understand the politics and Sidious' plan, they may not be so averse to TPM or parts of AOTC.

That still doesn't make TPM and AOTC great films. It SHOULD have been clearer and the fact that one has to wait 6 years (or now almost 5 hours) to get what the heck is going on, is a demonstation of bad storytelling. ROTS will hopefully save face for the PT's. but it cannot possibly make TPM and AOTC better.

E3 will be more of a compliment to what TPM and AOTC laid out before, storywise.
ANH rules six ways to Tuesday! http://community.the-underdogs.org/smiley/celeb/starwars.gif

I agree.. Yoda talking about the force with luke before yoda lifts the x-wing is awesome.

ESB is awesome.

I am happy with four good films. I consider EpI and II as encyclopedic necessities, but they will never be great films.

(favourite quote: The Force is with you, young Skywalker... but you are not a Jedi yet. )

I would generally agree that ROTS improves somewhat the two earlier prequels. Anakin's final descent into the dark side is made more poignant when we remember what a precocious little kid he was (even if he was played by one of the most annoying child actors in history). Also, we can clearly see the line tracing back to the "Phantom Menace" to which the title refers (even though we really knew all along). But nothing can excuse all three films' stilted dialogue and awkward love scenes between Portman and Christiansen.

On a grander thematic level, considering the "PT" as a whole, I can see Lucas' larger point about politics. It is really that intrigue that leads to the downfall of the republic. The details of the intrigue, i.e. trade disputes and tax imbroglios, are largely irrelevant -- made especially clear in ROTS when the leaders of the trade federation are summarily laid to waste by Anakin. The emphasis on such Byzantine political detail is in marked contrast with Episodes IV-VI. It is interesting that the Emperor himself does not appear in Episode IV at all -- he was mentioned during the early scenes as I recall when it was announced that the emperor had dissolved the senate -- so in one throwaway line, Lucas almost completely discards the political issues of the prequels! Why did we not get to see a scene in the Senate with bizarre looking creatures from various exotic planets flying around in their little pods, protesting the Emperor's extreme measure??? Because politics has served its purpose and is no longer important to the story.

Moreover, when viewed together, the prequels show how the good side of the force has failed. Palpatine's shrewd seduction Anakin emphasizes in contrast the impracticality of all the mystical, ethereal non-sequiturs uttered by Yoda, et. al. throughout the prequels. In this way, it also ties in nicely with Episodes IV-VI in which Luke's more "down to earth" way of learning the Jedi arts (despite Yoda's esoteric ramblings to him) are really what defeat the Emperor. In the climactic duel between Luke and Vader, it is Luke's anger (as noticed by the Emperor) that defeats Vader. The original Jedi would never use this method. Despite his mixing of dark and light elements of the force, Luke will "never turn to the dark side." Obi Wan's response to Anakin that "only a Sith deals in absolutes" thus seems an ironic foreshadowing -- it is the Jedi's own failure to see beyond absolutes that leads to their inability to stop Anakin's downward spiral -- but it is Luke's ability to transcend Yoda's absolutist Jedi creed that ultimately brings Anakin back from the dark side.


Overall, even though ROTS is not the perfect movie, it has reinvigorated Star Wars as a cultural phenomenon beyond its core audience. I don't find it surprising that younger fans tend to dismiss the original Star Wars. To those who did not live during that time and have come of age with all the Sci-fi blockbusters that have come to proliferate the cineplexes, the original does look a bit dated and, of all the Star Wars movies, it was the most badly edited and schlocky looking (which also gives it a degree of charm). But speaking as someone who was a part of the initial craze in 1977, the movie was breathtaking for its time and created a true revolution -- for those of us who lived through those times, the final scenes of ROTS are quite emotional and do tend to complete the circle that started in our now dimly remembered childhoods. In this way, Lucas has truly succeeded.

I need to rewatch the first two having seen SITH, but I would have to agree that it improves them...