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Marka Ragnos vs. NJO Luke Skywalker

Which is the more powerful one? I know Luke kicks butt, but Marka wasn't even challenged when he was on his death bed and a guy who could have challenged him threw stars at people for a living. Luke did kill an estimated 1000 Vong in one fight. He also killed like eight salyers. Kyp Durron, his most powerful, or atleast one of the top, had a very hard time with one. He also showed the ability to control gravity with his mind to a certain degree by this time.

If Jaden can take out Marka Ragnos, I think Luke can defeat him as well.

Luke by faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar

Agreed.

That was a spirit of Marka Ragnos

Meh. Marka Ragnos wielded more knowledge and power then Luke, and wasn't even challenged on his death bed, like was said by Glentract, by Naga Sadow, who could pwn almost anyone after him easily. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to prove up, man.

You really think any Sith lord, ancient or present could defeat Luke? The forces greatest tool of evil destroying?!
You're daffy! lol

Yes. Yes, I do. NJO Luke has amazing potential. But until he chucks one star at the Vong, he remains inferior.

dude, luke could chuck a star

Naga Sadow threw those things for a living....

A star throwing idiot would not even challenge a Dark Lord who he hates... The Dark Lord dies and then he tries to take over, he was a coward when it came to Marka Ragnos, the Dark Lord just died peacefully a half blood died peacefully when all around him people hated him.. Come on, seriously his apprentices threw stars at others for fun...

NJO Luke would have a hard time with Naga Sadow, let alone stand that he can beat Marka Ragnos

I'm not saying it would be easy for luke, it never is, but he would win

Very much doubt it

NJO Luke is the best.
like Nefarus once said he is what anakin shuld've become

Exactly! he's Anakin v. 2.badass

yes!

Tobad Marka Ragnos is only like the only person who was never challanged not even by a guy who threw stars for fun.... Ragnos is incredibly powerful. This isn't as simple as Luke wins this is going to be an incredible fight

i cant believe ppl actually think that lil pussy would have a chance to even blink be4 he gets slain by ragnos. there is no way luke could oppose him. ragnos wielded a power that will never be reached again. and in the game it was a 5000 year old ghost. and it would be stupid if jaden would lose, its all commercialized. ragnos was unbeatable at the golden age of the sith, when the most powerfull of them lived. unopposed. not even by sadow. and then ppl say luke would kill him. what f*cking ever. all ragnos would have to do, is move a finger, and luke would be dead.

Oh really Naga, tell me then, who all did he kill? When did he show HIS power?

Absence of proof is not proof of absence.

Proof of his power lets look at it like this

* He died peacefully
* His Apprentice was a Sith
* He was a half blood, people hated half bloods back then
* Naga Sadow threw Stars at people, STARS!!!!
* Marka was not challanged by Naga Sadow, a guy who threw stars for fun
* in the game Jaden may beat Ragnos but (s)he gets its ass kicked by Kyle Katarn
* You can not possibly wish to say that Kyle could beat Ragnos
* Marka Ragnos was weaker back then, then before

Oh yeah did i mention the star throwing apprentice that hasn't killed him yet?

You forgot to mention his apprentice threw stars (Note plural) for fun.

Yes, yes, yes, his apprentice threw stars some people said. Now where did they get that information? From a Lucas site? Now its probably true, but your whole argument had 2 things to back it up. Wow. Lets see, reasons why they wouldn't have challenged him: 1. The Sith didn't fight back then because Marka didn't want it so none of them had really any combat experience. 2. Had Naga killed him on his death bed, all the other Sith would've rebelled against him and killed him. Why not wait? 3. Naga was very cowardly, and preferred to trick people's minds.

Now lets look at all of the things that Marka did. He..., oh yeah his apprentice probably threw stars at people. Now, that may have been a rare power like battle meditation or something, but who really needed to throw a star after him? Not many. So every Force power Naga uses is on a planet scale type ratio, like Bastila's battle meditation that probably can't be used in a single fight (unless he really wants a stalemate.) And who did Naga defeat in lightsaber combat? Not even Kressh.

But let's get back on subject to the guy who did even less things then Naga. Marka never used Force powers, never fought in combat, and never killed anyone (to my knowledge) so yes he was probably powerful and I'm not denying it but there's hardly proof that he was as powerful as NJO Luke.

Your thinking of it the wrong way...

Naga never challanged Marka, okay when Marka was dying kill him wouldn't be a real statement, but before that he didn't challange him either. Naga Sadow never made a move against somebody when his force powers were incredible, and no he did not defeat Kressh because Marka Ragnos came between them and told them to stop.

The two would have fought to death if it wasn't for Ragnos coming along, meaning that even in his dead he was still seen as a powerful and respected ruler. Even then Naga Sadow did not challange him, he let himself be ruled by a dead half blood Sith Lord. Seriously why would he do that unless he really feared Ragnos.

Perhaps we don't know anything about who Ragnos fought at least i don't, but the evidence speaks for itself. If somebody that is as powerful as Naga Sadow won't stand up against Marka Ragnos then surely Naga Sadow is powerful, also lets not forget what Kreia said about those Sith Lords. They make Exar Kun and Revan look like children, children. Now this may be overboard but you can at least assume Kreia has a ring of truth in what she says. And Revan alone could make it hard for NJO Luke if not kill him.

Again, Revan33.... You must research to counter argue.... Lightsabers were not available in the times of either of those Sith lords.

And you keep citing lack of knowledge on your part as reasons why these Sith can't win. I must ask... You can not see oxygen, but you know it is there, right? You have not met the Dalai Lama, but you know he lives in Tibet? You haven't actually measured the height of Mount Everrest, but you know it's the highest? Yes?

NJO Luke isn't supported by GL either doesn't make it less true...

And apparently Ragnos made people fight against him to prevent them from expanding. He actually made himself hated by the Sith so that they would not attack the Republic which he feared, probably without reason but still... Meaning that even though he was a half blood and hated by that, even though he had a guy that hated him that could throw stars, even though a lot Sith wanted to see him dead, all of that doesn't matter he stilled ruled for more then a century.

Now there are no official records about Scipius Africanus taking Cordoba, but the city was taken by Romans and he was in the neighbourhood and he did fight Carthaginians, and he was a brilliant General and he was the only one with power enough to take the city.

The only reports of him taking the city are from a few diaries. Same situation as Marka Ragnos no we don't know if he took the city for sure, we don't know if his forces faced impossible odds and prevailed. We just know somehow the city was conquered and he was the only able to do it. Just like we know nobody successfully challenged Ragnos and he ruled until he died peacefully.

It implies that he was all powerful in that time and could not be matched, does that mean he was all powerful? No we are not sure but everything just seems to shout out YES HE WAS!!!

Like I said, I judge power differently than others. I still think Marka would lose, but you can't change my mind just as I can't change yours.

I don't know if he would lose or not, I don't think you can honestly tell.

True.

Well, these guys lived like thousands of years apart, it is almost impossible to tell who will win. Both Ragnos and Luke have awesome powers and indeed both have accomplishments that support them winning this fight. All I can say is that we are looking at a sweet fight here.

I wouldn't want to be around when this fight starts, thats for sure...

When I was reading about Naga Sadow on the official timeline, it says that Naga caused the stars to go supernova (or detonated them) but he never threw stars. So I have to question the truth of the matter since I haven't found any other official source to contradict it.

The way he made the stars go supernova was by ripping out the cores and throwing them at enemies. This made the star go boom!

So he threw the core and the hottest part of the star... Actually making it more powerful, not necessarily more impressive but more powerful

marka ragnos by FAR. how so? well according to star wars revised core rule book and the dark side source book, both from lucas.

luke's abilities in NJO:
affect mind: 11
battelmind: 8
empathy: 10
enhance ability: 10
enhance senses: 6
farseeing: 9
force defense: 6
heal self: 6
move object: 10
see force: 10
telepathy: 7

force feats: alter, attuned, control, force mastery, knight defense, lightsaber defense, sense.

feats: acrobatic, combat reflexes, exotic weapon proficiency lightsaber, force sensitive, weapon focus light saber.

now for marka ragnos

force skills:
affect mind: 8
alchemy 22
battlemind 17
control mind 19
enhance ability 19
force defense 18!! even stronger than yoda's force defence!
move object 10
see force 12
telepathy 9

force feats:
alter, control, drain force, force lightning, force mastery, force mind, rage, sense, sith sorcery, sith sword defense, sith sword expertise, sith sword mastery.

feats:
armor proficiency, light and medium. exotic weapon proficiency sith sword, exotic weapon proficiency sith lanvarok, force sensitive, great fortitude, power attack, weapon focus sith sword.

not to mention marka's sword being able to reflect blaster bolts an light sabers no doubt.

marka also being physically stronger, hell sidious would be terrified of him.

i'm also sure that you all know, that marka lived in a time where sith treachery, deceit, guile, subterfuge, lying and betrayal was at its highest. only the strong lived and the weak died and no one even dared to touch marka while he was on his death bed. many sith displeased with his lack of expansion but he was a dangerous type of killer waiting for the right moment to strike its enemy. just like a sniper.

luke is great don't get me wrong, but again'st ragnos he's just a boy.

I agree with many of you on the many different aspects of each others character's ability, especially about not being around for such a large and most likely destructive fight, think they could petition for HBO boxing like events back in those days? LOL. Anyways the stats from the card game are a nice addition, but they fail to weigh in certain aspects such as a heart or a sort of will to win in my worthless opinion. Over time Luke has been able to survive many deadly battles and find a way through the Force, I guess I could say, to survive sometimes against all odds even when extremely close to dying, several times. Since they were also so far apart in time it is hard to comprehend how each one would fare in each others timely environment. Now since no one really challenged Ragnos effectively, it would be interesting to see how he reacted to an able opponent. Yet I believe Luke would take this fight, at first I thought by far but then realized i was pretty naive and came to a better of conclusion of him barely beating Marka. Just my worthless .02 cents, and by my post count I'm sure many will disagree with me. Meh oh well, one hell of a fight, thats for sure.

Chad

chad you have some good points

but i'm sure ragnos had to survive many ordeals, perhaps more so than luke. he wasn't born into power and he had to take it!

as far as ages apart from each other, i don't think it would be a case here, since they're both relying on the force. if it was a battle of technology, then luke no question.

naga sadow no doubt is a very formidable an fearsome opponent, but look he was just scared of marka. and i think naga vs luke would be a fearsome battle alone.

Emperor Revan, I noticed that you said that the sith at that time never fought, actually they fought over everything. The apprentice was always challenging the master if the apprentice thought they had even a tiny chance of victory. Yet nobody challenged Marka. And Marka made himself even more hated, making the sith focus their attacks on him so that the sith empire did not crash. So he either survived hundreds of attacks, or nobody wanted to challenge him

I also noticed that you said that if Naga killed him on his deathbed Naga would be hated, actually no he wouldn't halfbloods like Marka here hated, they wanted to kill them all the time. Yet they allowed him to live and rule them. It would be like a jew ruling germany during world war two, back then nobody in germany would have cared how the person died, just kill him. Double team, poison, bombs etc. Yet either those failed on Marka, or nobody wanted to try them for fear of his wrath.

Don't get me wrong, it would be an awesome fight, but Luke would barely loose.

This is a fight between the most powerful Jedi and the most powerful Sith, in my opinion. It is what I believe is the ULTIMATE one-on-one fight. Let's just agree that, despite the fact that Ragnos seems much more intimidating and seems to have powers on a greater level according to some of the information we have, that this fight is just too controversial to call, one way or the other.

yub, agreed darth dipsit.

No. Luke would win. He's the son of Vader, the most powerful Sith ever. And Luke's the most powerful Jedi as you said. Ragnos is barely a footnote.

Originally posted by Revan Darkstar
Emperor Revan, I noticed that you said that the sith at that time never fought, actually they fought over everything. The apprentice was always challenging the master if the apprentice thought they had even a tiny chance of victory. Yet nobody challenged Marka. And Marka made himself even more hated, making the sith focus their attacks on him so that the sith empire did not crash. So he either survived hundreds of attacks, or nobody wanted to challenge him

I also noticed that you said that if Naga killed him on his deathbed Naga would be hated, actually no he wouldn't halfbloods like Marka here hated, they wanted to kill them all the time. Yet they allowed him to live and rule them. It would be like a jew ruling germany during world war two, back then nobody in germany would have cared how the person died, just kill him. Double team, poison, bombs etc. Yet either those failed on Marka, or nobody wanted to try them for fear of his wrath.

Don't get me wrong, it would be an awesome fight, but Luke would barely loose.

err, I was sort of assuming since they never went off planet and what not. As for the Naga wouldn't kill him, I'm sure Marka would've had some supporters that would'nt have liked Naga killing Marka on his death bed plus there wasn't much reason for him to anyway, I mean he's already dying...

Sure the fight could probably go either way, I'm saying I would like to know more about him because when you only know a few sentences then the rest is all assumption which tends to be very one-sided. That's why I never use Marka, Tulak, or Ajunta in my posts cuz imo there isn't enough info on them.

And to Darth Crazo: Vader the most powerful Sith ever? Yeah right. Here are many stronger Sith than Vader excluding the three I previously mentioned.

1) Lord Revan
2) Exar Kun
3) Darth Traya
4) Naga Sadow
5) Darth Sidious
6) Darth Tyrannus
7) Darth Nihilus
8) Darth Maul
9) Darth Sion
10) Darth Bane

SO???
What is the point?That makes him god or something?

I guess. lol

I would say Luke will win or they both would get killed.

You can argue that but I would not like to discuss this based on arguments like "Come on...Magna Ragnos could throw planets on people". Yeah. He could. NJO Luke can't ? Why can't he ? Because he did not ? Well...throwing planets at other people is not what a Jedi should do and Luke had students that can tear entire mountains down or throw them around with less experience than he has. He can walk over lava. He can throw an entire fleet out of a star system so why should he not be able to destroy planets as Sadow did (Ragnos did not) ?

And what I read here about Magna Ragnos is in certain ways misunderstood I think. Ragnos was only able to keep control over the Sith Empire by pitting his detractors against one another or assasinate them (what you won't have to do if you can give them a head to head fight). And he just encouraged the people to focus on him because he feared that the Sith Empire would get destroyed by the Republic when there would have been more expansion done during his times as Dark Lord.

Like Dipsit said. This would be the ultimate one-on-one fight. According to revised core rule book/dark side sorce book NJO Luke is outclassed on force powers here BUT...
You should keep in mind that a Siths power ultimately comes from try to control the force while a Jedis (like Luke) power come from letting the force control and guide them. So what does comparing some abilities count here ? One of the opponents would be (maybe) the greatest force controller in history but the other one would be the force greatest "tool" in history.

And this is head to head fighting. Ragnos did avoid that in some circumstances - we don't know his reasons. I would say Luke will (giving into the force) kill Ragnos or maybe they both get killed but I say this would be hell of a fight and I surely don't want to be around somewhere (at least I would like to be at the other end of the galaxy) when this one starts.

you bring up great points nai fohl, whomever would be the winner, it would be a confrontation of epic proportions!!

Marka Ragnos vs. NJO Luke Skywalker would be one of the best lightsaber battles is the history of Star Wars (just my opinion)! Luke and Marka look striahgt into each others eyes. They draw their weapons..."EVERYBODY RUN FOR COVER" I would shout.

When they start their comfontation they both might just fall over and die because the Force is over working itself so hard just to give the two fighters their power to fight, it would diminish to nothing and the Star Wars galaxy would come to its end (just a thought)

Nah, Marka would swing his cortosis blade around really fast looking all impressive like and Luke would pull out his blaster and shoot him Indiana Jones style. lol, just kidding but that would be hilarious.

I doubt that would work... If you could kill ancient Sith that easily they would have been killed a long time ago

WTF?

Do you really consider it to be a fight? Because Ragnos was having 20/10 ego and playing boss and "hurr i am the supreme ancient grandfather of all sith durr" as a ghost?

LMAO

This is like Sidious vs. Maul.

Originally posted by Darth Plagues
Marka Ragnos vs. NJO Luke Skywalker would be one of the best lightsaber battles is the history of Star Wars (just my opinion)! Luke and Marka look striahgt into each others eyes. They draw their weapons..."EVERYBODY RUN FOR COVER" I would shout.

When they start their comfontation they both might just fall over and die because the Force is over working itself so hard just to give the two fighters their power to fight, it would diminish to nothing and the Star Wars galaxy would come to its end (just a thought)

ROFLMAO

And to Darth Crazo: Vader the most powerful Sith ever? Yeah right. Here are many stronger Sith than Vader excluding the three I previously mentioned.
(...)
8) Darth Maul
9) Darth Sion


LMFAO

These were legit sub-movie versus forum debaters.

my ass they were

Originally posted by JKBart


And to Darth Crazo: Vader the most powerful Sith ever? Yeah right. Here are many stronger Sith than Vader excluding the three I previously mentioned.
(...)
8) Darth Maul
9) Darth Sion


LMFAO
The fact that these are the only two names you picked out means that you need to kill yourself.

These are just the worst

This thread is gross.

I wonder why people back then acted like Sadow threw stars under his own power.

Originally posted by Fishy
I doubt that would work... If you could kill ancient Sith that easily they would have been killed a long time ago

But...they were.

Wow this is hilarious

In all fairness, I forget the exact statement, but IIRC it is stated that if Marka Ragnos was to return to power then the Jedi Order would get roflstomped, including Luke Skywalker.

Nope. Luke just said that if Ragnos was revived, there's no telling what he'd be able to do. Even if that craziness were implied, Luke didn't actually know anything about Ragnos specifically--in context, he was using Exar Kun as the basis for the dangers of an ancient Sith wraith.

Luke wins with mid-difficulty.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Nope. Luke just said that if Ragnos was revived, there's no telling what he'd be able to do. Even if that craziness were implied, Luke didn't actually know anything about Ragnos specifically--in context, he was using Exar Kun as the basis for the dangers of an ancient Sith wraith.

This, and Kun's more powerful than Ragnos as well.

Originally posted by SunRazer
This, and Kun's more powerful than Ragnos as well.

Lolno. Vitiate considered Ragnos a legitimate threat, Sadow and Ludo Kressh were both
scared of him even when he was a force ghost.

He's already confirmed to be most powerful Sith of his lineage.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Lolno. Vitiate considered Ragnos a legitimate threat, Sadow and Ludo Kressh were both
scared of him even when he was a force ghost.

That has nothing to do with my point... considering that Kun's canonically more powerful than Ragnos, Sadow and Kressh.

Originally posted by Darth Plagues
Marka Ragnos vs. NJO Luke Skywalker would be one of the best lightsaber battles is the history of Star Wars (just my opinion)! Luke and Marka look striahgt into each others eyes. They draw their weapons..."EVERYBODY RUN FOR COVER" I would shout.

When they start their comfontation they both might just fall over and die because the Force is over working itself so hard just to give the two fighters their power to fight, it would diminish to nothing and the Star Wars galaxy would come to its end (just a thought)

Originally posted by Nai
"Come on...Magna Ragnos could throw planets on people". Yeah. He could. NJO Luke can't ? Why can't he ? Because he did not ?

Originally posted by SunRazer
That has nothing to do with my point... considering that Kun's canonically more powerful than Ragnos, Sadow and Kressh. Based on what?

Based on a statement that says he was the most powerful Sith Lord in history up to his time, which would include Marka. Also the fact that Vitiate considered all ancient Sith spirits as threats -- Exar Kun included.

Originally posted by MythLord
Based on a statement that says he was the most powerful Sith Lord in history up to his time, which would include Marka. Also the fact that Vitiate considered all ancient Sith spirits as threats -- Exar Kun included. Vitiate specifically brings up Ragnos in particular, more then once.

But it wasn't the type with the dark council where he was like "Better eliminate them for doing so-and-so".

With Ragnos it was like "Better stay out of his way".

He definitely saw Ragnos as more of a threat then any of the other Sith Lords.

Janus was a retard.

@Jmanghan - Based on The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia, which claims that Kun was the most powerful Sith Lord up to his time.

Originally posted by Rebel95
Wow this is hilarious

It's a thread over ten years old. A -lot- has changed since then, so of course this all looks utterly stupid.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Nope. Luke just said that if Ragnos was revived, there's no telling what he'd be able to do. Even if that craziness were implied, Luke didn't actually know anything about Ragnos specifically--in context, he was using Exar Kun as the basis for the dangers of an ancient Sith wraith.

Considering Ragnos' sceptre alone was like a pocket Nihilus and Kun, his inferior, was OP even as a 4000+ year old wraith, I'd say Luke had every right to be terrified.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Vitiate specifically brings up Ragnos in particular, more then once.

But it wasn't the type with the dark council where he was like "Better eliminate them for doing so-and-so".

With Ragnos it was like "Better stay out of his way".

He definitely saw Ragnos as more of a threat then any of the other Sith Lords.

^

Vitiate does not seem like the kind of Sith to take shit from anyone, and Ragnos basically makes him a vassal.

Originally posted by Trocity
Janus was a retard.

Lol.

I thought you were dead. ^

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Vitiate specifically brings up Ragnos in particular, more then once.

But it wasn't the type with the dark council where he was like "Better eliminate them for doing so-and-so".

With Ragnos it was like "Better stay out of his way".

He definitely saw Ragnos as more of a threat then any of the other Sith Lords.
Provide evidence.

Are u this Janus guy who claimed this thread is legit and Marka is a good opponent?

kill self

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
It's a thread over ten years old. A -lot- has changed since then, so of course this all looks utterly stupid.
Yeah I know lol. I wonder how stupid our posts now will look in 10 years...

Originally posted by Rebel95
Yeah I know lol. I wonder how stupid our posts now will look in 10 years...
Your posts are generally retarded from the get-go. You don't need to wait ten years.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I thought you were dead. ^

No, just busy. KMC is what I do when waiting for Game of Thrones episodes, or when I'm too lazy to change DVDs.

Originally posted by JKBart
Are u this Janus guy who claimed this thread is legit and Marka is a good opponent?

kill self

http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/polish-remover-works-since-1939.jpg

Originally posted by Rebel95
Yeah I know lol. I wonder how stupid our posts now will look in 10 years...

Some of these necro'd threads are pre-RotS.

Moose, how is Kun inferior to Ragnos when Kun is the most powerful Sith Lord of his lineage?

Originally posted by AncientPower
Moose, how is Kun inferior to Ragnos when Kun is the most powerful Sith Lord of his lineage?

Where are you getting that quote from? The source material explicitly indicates that Ragnos is the strongest of the strongest (Golden Age of the Sith) and this is material which is written by Kun's own creator. Kun handily wipes the floor with just about everyone in his own day, but aside from Freedan Nadd's ghost (who is shit-scared of Ragnos) he doesn't master any ancient Sith, just oodles of Jedi.

In The Official Fact File 1 among the Sith presented in the Dark Lords of the Sith section, including Freedon Nadd, Naga Sadow and Ulic Qel-Droma, Exar Kun is stated to be the most powerful of all. This is repeated in The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia which states Exar Kun was 'once the most powerful and dangerous of the Dark Lords of the Sith'. Marka Ragnos' accolade of being 'the most powerful of the most powerful' is referring to his (lengthy) time as Dark Lord of the Sith Empire.

Originally posted by AncientPower
In The Official Fact File 1 among the Sith presented in the Dark Lords of the Sith section, including Freedon Nadd, Naga Sadow and Ulic Qel-Droma, Exar Kun is stated to be the most powerful of all. This is repeated in The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia which states Exar Kun was 'once the most powerful and dangerous of the Dark Lords of the Sith'. Marka Ragnos' accolade of being 'the most powerful of the most powerful' is referring to his (lengthy) time as Dark Lord of the Sith Empire.

So, Kun's claim means powerful in terms of combative abilities, but Ragnos' claim translates to his reign as a Sith Lord?

Originally posted by AncientPower
In The Official Fact File 1 among the Sith presented in the Dark Lords of the Sith section, including Freedon Nadd, Naga Sadow and Ulic Qel-Droma, Exar Kun is stated to be the most powerful of all.


And does it also include Ragnos? No?
I do remember an Official Fact File that contains Sidious and proclaims Exar Kun is the most powerful and dangerous of the Sith, though. That one is also commonly ignored here.



And why, pray tell, do you assume that the "once" in the statement regarding Kun doesn't limit that statement to the time when Kun was alive?

I may help out: Kevin J. Anderson himself did put Kun above Ragnos and the other Ancient Sith (on one level with DE Sidious, as a matter of fact). Point being: Various sources have expanded our knowledge about the Ancient Sith, while leaving Ragnos entirely uncontested in his position as the most powerful member of that peer group, reigning supreme in the Golden Age of the Sith.

That means Ragnos is above such illustrious beings like Sadow, Kressh, Hord, Muur, Nadd, two of whom have conquered planets one-man-army style. He is above pre-Nathema Vitiate and if you take the list of those people, there is a rather huge lot of people inferior to Ragnos for all we know.

And then, there is this nice quote from Luke, that you've mentioned yourself (if I'm not mistaken). The quote said, to be precise, that it would need the entire Jedi Academy to try challenge a completely resurrected Ragnos. Which means that post-DE, post-Kun-encounter Luke Skywalker was not sure that the entirety of the Academy, including himself, would be capable of defeating a living Ragnos. And given the list of inferiors to Ragnos, and the knowledge what Ragnos sceptre - a single tool left behind by him - was capable off, he had ample reasons for his doubts in that regard. Makes one wonder, why nobody here has some...

So, actually, this thread still makes more sense than most people who did post in it post necromancing...

Well... Damn...

Nai, there were no other Dark Lords in Kun's time, Ulic was his apprentice, he'd already replaced Nadd as a 'great power'. Logically it infers he was the most powerful Sith up until his time.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Nai, there were no other Dark Lords in Kun's time, Ulic was his apprentice, he'd already replaced Nadd as a 'great power'. Logically it infers he was the most powerful Sith up until his time.

Last time I checked, the comics are called "Dark Lords of the Sith", which implies that Ulic is to be counted among them. And also, there was an entire freaking Sith Empire filled with Dark Lords including Vitiate in Kun's time. So Kun > post-Nathema Vitiate? And since there is no "once" in the Official Star Wars Fact File, is it logically to infer that Kun > DE Sidious and Kun > Valkorion?

Isn't it nice how the sources can backfire in every possible direction? I love it.