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I wish both marvel/Dc had the same strength Meter. It really posses a problem when debating on who is stronger. Dc glorifies there characters 2 much, marvel not so much, and people automatically think Dc's characters are stronger when, infact marvels characters are more than able to do the same. i personally think all these characters are pretty much in the same strength league.


Doomsday
Hulk
Juggernaut
Superman
Thor
Captain marvel
Gladiator
Hercules

no particular order. All these characters have never shown a limit to what they can lift.

With these:

Gladiator (at full confidence)
Doomsday
Superman
Hulk/Juggernaut
Captain Marvel
Thor
Hercules (For some blasted reason Marvel Hercules is weaker than DC Hercules)

<<Hercules (For some blasted reason Marvel Hercules is weaker than DC Hercules)>>

ha! i knew you wuld bring that up. if we only looked at what they could lift according to stats, all those marvel heroes would only be a fraction of what the dc guys are. clearly that is NOT the case. which is why i said we need a broader view - x-overs suck, but they remain our truest measuring sticks. well, that and common sense!

i agree with the above lists and would add wonder woman, though i would put doomsday in a higher class than any of them

Originally posted by savagerampage
I wish both marvel/Dc had the same strength Meter. It really posses a problem when debating on who is stronger. Dc glorifies there characters 2 much, marvel not so much, and people automatically think Dc's characters are stronger when, infact marvels characters are more than able to do the same. i personally think all these characters are pretty much in the same strength league.


Doomsday
Hulk
Juggernaut
Superman
Thor
Captain marvel
Gladiator
Hercules

no particular order. All these characters have never shown a limit to what they can lift.

This list gets the Founding Father Seal of Approval

~wickerman~

Well superman has apparently lifted 1 million tons.. But hercules has lifted the entire island of manhattan. Think of the billions of tons that island weighs? He has lifted much more then superman dont u think? if supes has lifted 1 million tons. Herc gets his ass handed 2 him by Hulk, juggernaut, sometimes thor, in the strength department, makes u wonder.

And i know superman has moved a planet, but he pushed it. Pushing is easier then lifting. Im sure we can all push a car, But how many of us can lift a car over our heads? If any of those other characters had flight, they would be able 2 do the same.

Like i said those characters i have listed are all in the same league. although, i see Hulk, doomsday, juggernaut ontop of that list. The fact is that those 3 characters are suppose 2 represent strength. Just look at how they are drawn. those 3 have out muscled most characters in both universes.

Doomsday has beaten superman, to death
Hulk is stronger than pretty much everyone
Juggernaut, has beaten alot of the marvel heavyweights, and him and hulk go to stand stills

Those 3 are ontop of my list in strength

Hulk
Doomsday
Juggernaut

Superman
Thor
Hercules

Gladiator
Captain marvel

It's a good analysis. Except for one problem: Wonder Woman lifted her entire island home (Themyscira) for more than a day. Themyscira is about the size of Japan. So by that logic Wonder Woman is stronger than Superman, no?

If tht was the case. i was just using it as an example. because in another thread, u said superman, can lift 1million tons. Hercules has lifted billions upon billions of tons, and herc gets his ass kicked by juggernaut, in strength. Juggernaut is stronger.

The point i was trying 2 say is that All of those characters would be in the same level. Each of those characters are able to do the same as the other would. Although the 3 massive guys, are drawn to represent, strength, and when have u ever seen, Doomsday, Hulk or Juggernaut out muscled by anyone? They have been beaten, yes but out muscled u rarely see them being matched in that department.

Superman can lift one million tons without much exertion. However that's just the creme of his power. He's lifted mountains, pushed planets, destroyed moons, and even contained black holes.

With the above Wonder Woman is clearly stronger than Hercules, right? So if WW is stronger than Hercules she MUST be stronger than Superman, no? She's not. She's second in strength to Superman. Which proves that Juggs, Hulk and Herc are beneath him in strength.


Hulk has been beaten by Namor. Doomsday lasted about five minutes against Superman just recently. He got his ass kicked. And Juggernaut has been outmuscled by Hulk.

Draco, im not saying, doomsday hulk, and juggernaut cant lose a fight. they can be outfought. alot of people have better fighting skills than them. However in fights in terms of using there strength, i have yet to see anyone, out muscle them. When superman is fighting doomsday doomsday is the stronger of the 2. when hulk is fighting thor he is the stronger of the 2, when juggernaut is fighting hercules he is stronger of the 2.

if superman was fighting hulk, hulk would be the stronger of the 2, same would apply to juggernaut.

They are drawn to be powerful, Guys like superman are like the underdog in a fight against a big guy, but he always comes out on top, doesnt mean he is stronger.

Isnt captian marvel suppose 2 be stronger than wonderwoman.
Gladiator all his strength is self boasted he says he can do all that, the only think i have seen him do is lift the baxter building

Hulk is initially weaker than Superman. Through anger he'll eventually (after a long time) be stronger than Superman. Juggernaut is weaker (by far) than Superman. Until I see him lift up a spaceship the size of Coast City I think not.

Captain Marvel is weaker than Wonder Woman. He has the Strength of Hercules. She has the "strength of Gaea greater than that of Hercules."

You're dodging the question. If Wonder Woman is stronger than Hercules. And you say Hercules is stronger than Superman. So by logic Wonder Woman is stronger than Superman. But we both know this simply isn't true. So how can you explain this?

Im not saying hercules is stronger then superman. in another thread u mentioned that superman can lift 1 million tons, i simply said hercules lifted billions of tons, and juggernaut beats him in strength.

Hercules is stronger than wonderwoman, well the old school herc not the new one, thor is also stronger then ww. superman is stronger than hercules, But i honestly think him and thor are equal strength. Hulk does start off weaker,but he will surpass superman in strength. Juggernaut is more than capable of lifting anything. to this date classic juggernaut has never had trouble lifting any thing. He has out muscled thor and hercules, and as i mentioned i think thor and superman are even in strength.

<<But hercules has lifted the entire island of manhattan>>

no he didn't savage. he pulled it across the water. happened in marvel team up - one of the early ones - #28, maybe? the last page of that book is awesome as he's chained to the island dragging it. dragging across water is a LOT different than lifting it. still not sure why you say juggs is stronger than supes - near as i can tell neither one really has many limits so they should at least be considered equals if nothing else. and draco's right - a starting hulk is much weaker than supes - hulk needs to be VERY angry to reach supes level.

Originally posted by savagerampage
I wish both marvel/Dc had the same strength Meter. It really posses a problem when debating on who is stronger. Dc glorifies there characters 2 much, marvel not so much, and people automatically think Dc's characters are stronger when, infact marvels characters are more than able to do the same. i personally think all these characters are pretty much in the same strength league.


Doomsday
Hulk
Juggernaut
Superman
Thor
Captain marvel
Gladiator
Hercules

no particular order. All these characters have never shown a limit to what they can lift.
Doomsday can resurrect stronger than the opponent that killed him, so he hasn't got a limit actually, but after he was transformed into a less primordial and more sentient being, he can feel pain so he'll prefer to escape instead of dying.Anyway he's in Post Crisis Superman's league, a top rank Class 100 able to lift over 300'000 tons

Hulk's strenght hasn't got a limit it depends on his anger, but maybe eccessive stress caused from the increase of adrenaline to unbelievable levels maybe fatal to him who knows.

Juggernaut's strenght hasn't showed a limit, he was still brawling with War Hulk, but not able to contain him, so it must be certainly over 100'000 Tons.

Superman in Post Crisis version can lift around 1000'000 tons, and more after a sunbath that will give him addictional power.

Thor with Mjolnir at his side, it means in the belt or in his hands is certainly in Superman's league, certainly equal to him.
Without Mjolnir empowering him he's around 90% of Supes strenght.

Captain Marvel<---D.C. Version or Marvel Version?

Gladiator's strenght depend on his confidence

Hercules in half god form is equal to Thor without the hammer, full god, uh, he's the big daddy

Hercules lifted the island in another issue. im referring to dc's captain marvel

full powered hercules wouldnt he be more powerful then superman.
when juggernaut fought war hulk, he was already beginning 2 get weakened happened after onslaught.

all these characters i say are pretty much equal in strength, but i feel the 3 big massive guys have a slight advantage in strength

Hercules isn't stronger than WW. She has "the strength of Gaea greater than that of Hercules" (which is from the mouth of Zeus himself) WW also kicked her world's Hercules' ass. Not demi-god Hercules. Olympian God Hercules. The same Hercules who bore the weight of the entire world.

<<Hercules lifted the island in another issue.>.

ohhhhhh, i know the one!! you're talking about the one where he was speaking to . . . was it a kid? jarvis? i think is WAS jarvis. it was a thor issue. i can find it if you need me to, it wasn't that old. and as much as i love herc, he absolutely did NOT lift the island in that issue! HAHAH! that whole issue was a joke! hercules was telling one of his patented 'whoppers'. in that same issue, he literally CREAMED thor - the whole issue was hilarious! true herc. but he DID NOT lift the island. he was joking/exaggerating - just like he was exaggerating his battle against thor. the issue was actually funny as hell . . .

Hercules' jokes aside, we're dealing with such wildly varying levels of strength (around 100 tons all the way up to millions of tons for some of them) that it's hard to pinpoint all of them for sure.

Generally speaking I'd put Gladiator at the top of this list (he's a pre-crisis Supes clone). Next would be Superman, Doomsday, Hulk. The third group I'd have Thor, Cpt. Marvel, Herc, and Juggs. Juggernaut might be the most invulnerable of any of them, but some sources wouldn't even have him at 100 Tons.

But depending on the writer and/or story needs, any of that could change wildly.

-DM

<<Generally speaking I'd put Gladiator at the top of this list (he's a pre-crisis Supes clone). Next would be Superman, Doomsday, Hulk. The third group I'd have Thor, Cpt. Marvel, Herc, and Juggs. Juggernaut might be the most invulnerable of any of them, but some sources wouldn't even have him at 100 Tons.>>

i'll disagree with you on glads. he's lost too many fights -- i mean been knocked out -- too many times (by thor, hulk, he clearly didn't seem near as powerful as surfer when they took on tyrant) for me to put him at the top. juggs has given thor a harder time - in fact - thor's never beaten juggs and been beaten up pretty badly a couple times.

so call me a slappy, but i still say supes is number one with everyone else second. i'd have put doomsday #1 until you said he was beaten badly by supes recently. never saw that, but i'll take your word for it.
but you're right - all depends on who's writing.

But Gladiator is also the guy who has ripped stars in half, almost destroyed Ego the Living Planet, and can supposedly fly 100x the speed of light. Yeah, he's had some bad showings...but his best showings are arguably better than anyone elses on that list. Comic-to-comic things may change, but I'd stick by my "groupings" for the most part.

-DM

Juggernaut is well over 100 tons and everything gladiator has done, has been self boasted, he says he has done all those things. doesnt mean they are true. he did fight ego, but ripping stars in half lolol i have never read any comic where that happens

True. I know Juggs is over 100 Tons, but probably not by a lot...I was pointing out that some sources wouldn't even have him at 100 to show that he isn't as far over 100 as a lot of the others on the list.

And Glads is a braggart, and the star thing is only a rumor. But the Ego fight happened, and during it even Thanos was impressed by Gladiator. I'd keep him at #1

i doubt hercules is above wonder woman. imo she is way stronger than him. and saying herc is stronger than ww is saying that she-hulk is stronger than ww, and i doubt that also

I'd add Agamemnon, Ikaris, Orion, Martian Manhunter, Beta Ray Bill, Hyperion, Wonderwoman and Valor from the two respective companiesOriginally posted by savagerampage
I wish both marvel/Dc had the same strength Meter. It really posses a problem when debating on who is stronger. Dc glorifies there characters 2 much, marvel not so much, and people automatically think Dc's characters are stronger when, infact marvels characters are more than able to do the same. i personally think all these characters are pretty much in the same strength league.


Doomsday
Hulk
Juggernaut
Superman
Thor
Captain marvel
Gladiator
Hercules

no particular order. All these characters have never shown a limit to what they can lift.

Juggernaut can easily lift over 100,000 tons with ease, he took out a one of the world trade centers by ramming his shoulder into it.

wonderwoman is stronger than current hercules yes, but she is not stronger than full god hercules marvel. she was made outta clay by the gods, herc is a god, nuff said. but she should be on this list as well, along with the others whirlyspat mentioned

Originally posted by savagerampage

wonderwoman is stronger than current hercules yes, but she is not stronger than full god hercules marvel. she was made outta clay by the gods, herc is a god, nuff said. but she should be on this list as well, along with the others whirlyspat mentioned

You never learn. DC Hercules lifted the entire friggin world. In a contest of strength Diana beat him. As an Olympian god no less.

And yes WW should be on the list.

marvel herc is stronger. and how on earth can he lift the planet? unless he can fly and breathe in space, its impossible

Originally posted by savagerampage
marvel herc is stronger. and how on earth can he lift the planet? unless he can fly and breathe in space, its impossible

It's called Greek Mythology. And no Marvel Hercules and DC Hercules are pretty much (at full-power) equal in strength.

Which is why Diana is stronger.

So translation herc never lifted anything lol thus being a myth. i dont think any of those characters can lift a planet, its physically impossible. im sure they can push planets like superman has.

Originally posted by savagerampage
So translation herc never lifted anything lol thus being a myth. i dont think any of those characters can lift a planet, its physically impossible. im sure they can push planets like superman has.

*sigh* Shall I mention Thor? He's myth. DC Hercules AND Marvel Hercules lifted the Earth for Atlas.

It's called magic.

A mythical character never lifted the world because it's myth?

I know thor is a myth as well. But if hercules can lift planets, and he gets his ass smoked by hulk, Juggernaut etc, and they are clearly stronger than herc, why cant Hulk and Juggs lift as much as superman

Originally posted by savagerampage
I know thor is a myth as well. But if hercules can lift planets, and he gets his ass smoked by hulk, Juggernaut etc, and they are clearly stronger than herc, why cant Hulk and Juggs lift as much as superman

Because Zeus depowered him.

You overestimating Juggernaut. Juggernaut is incredibly strong however he's not as strong as Hulk or Hercules or Superman. Wanna know why Hercules is largely ineffective against Juggernaut? Because of his impenetrable forcefield. Which NULLIFIES any physical attacks. No matter how strong you are, the forcefield nullifies it. Which is why Hercules always loses.

But when they fight, and are tossing things, juggernaut always over powers him, forcefeild or not.

Originally posted by savagerampage
But when they fight, and are tossing things, juggernaut always over powers him, forcefeild or not.

As I said before, Hercules is DEPOWERED. And even if he were at full strength I doubt his blows would have ANY effect.

i know that draco. But alot of people underestimate juggernaut, he is easily superior to thor etc in strength, as there battles have shown. a fully powered juggernaut, would easily be above, superman, and all those, example trion juggernaut

Originally posted by savagerampage
i know that draco. But alot of people underestimate juggernaut, he is easily superior to thor etc in strength, as there battles have shown. a fully powered juggernaut, would easily be above, superman, and all those, example trion juggernaut

His not his strength that overpowers Thor. It's his forcefield. Everything you throw at him is completely ineffective. Godforce blasts don't even dent him.

Draco im talking about, when they are fighting, in terms of ripping and lifting things during a fight, juggernaut has always been able to outlift whoever he is fighting/

BECAUSE of his forcefield. When you're completely indestructible and completely invulnerable to all attacks then of course you're going to "outfight" anyone you come across.


And let's not forget he got stuck in things like mountains and cement pits. He took MONTHS to get out of there. You say he's stronger than Superman. Superman(without his flight and speed) would get out in seconds.

Originally posted by K3VIL
Doomsday can resurrect stronger than the opponent that killed him, so he hasn't got a limit actually

he regenerates more durable than his previous incarnation.... not necessarily stronger

<<But if hercules can lift planets, and he gets his ass smoked by hulk, Juggernaut etc,>>

eh? ass smoked by hulk?? only time that ever happened was when he was depowered. in the book from which i so proudly take my quote, herc was doing just fine, and in a much older book (i want to say tales to astonish but it don't think that was it) herc was getting the better of hulk. course, neither fight ended conclusively. they were close enough to say herc did not get smoked however. are dc's gods stronger/weaker than marvel's? can't really say. since i'm a marvel herc fan, i'll say he's the stronger version, hence he may be stronger than diana. c'mon, look at the quote!! hehe. and he didn't simply hold the 'earth' for atlas. he held the 'heavens' - that is all the sky (translated in places as the universe!) atlas is said to be the reason the sky doesn't fall. damn i love herc . . . .

i still say it will boil down to who's writing and what the situation is. in a given issue, any of the aforementioned guys could win against the other - and most HAVE. oh, and i'd add supreme (the original) to this list and perhaps at the top of it. he was beating glads pretty badly for much of that x-over.

Everyone forgot Thanos

<<Everyone forgot Thanos>>

i don't think he was forgotten, rather not included because i think he's a bit too 'cosmic' for this discussion.

What do you mean by cosmic?

<<What do you mean by cosmic?>>

i think we were sort of limiting the discussion (could be wrong) to the 'regulars' - ie - the . . . non-cosmics . . .??? you know, no galactus's and such. just the normal heroes/villains. guess thanos could still be included in the list, just i think he's probably a good step beyond anyone else on this here list. but then again, if doomsday wrecked darkseid so badly, maybe thanos ISN'T so far beyond (strength-wise i mean) the others.

Originally posted by leonidas
<<What do you mean by cosmic?>>

i think we were sort of limiting the discussion (could be wrong) to the 'regulars' - ie - the . . . non-cosmics . . .??? you know, no galactus's and such. just the normal heroes/villains. guess thanos could still be included in the list, just i think he's probably a good step beyond anyone else on this here list. but then again, if doomsday wrecked darkseid so badly, maybe thanos ISN'T so far beyond (strength-wise i mean) the others.

Yeah, he is stronger than most. Then again if Darkseid got snuffed by Doomsday so bad he isn't to far from the others(strength-wise). But do remember the five jems on his fist are one of the most powerful things in the marvel universe.
whistling1

<<Yeah, he is stronger than most. Then again if Darkseid got snuffed by Doomsday so bad he isn't to far from the others(strength-wise). But do remember the five jems on his fist are one of the most powerful things in the marvel universe.>>

when he had them. thankfully he lost them. now he's just plain old thanos. and that plenty!

His class is over still over 70 tons. And use quotes next time
whistling1

<<His class is over still over 70 tons. And use quotes next time>>

its WAYYYY over cl70. he's way above cl100. and use quotes for what?

Yeah, so he stronger than Hulk, Jugg and Superman.

Use quotes so you that have to use the two triangles thingies

<<Use quotes so you that have to use the two triangles thingies>>

but i kinda like my triangle thingies . . .

and i never disagreed with you. just said i thought the reason he wasn't mentioned was because he was too tough to be considered in our discussion. but apparently we've been discussing him, so . . .

The only two that fall into the same class are SuperMan and Thor. Superman is just shy of being a god, and thats assuming that he isn't a god. Thor (marvel version) is probably the only one who could truly fight Superman to a standstill. I rather doubt that either of them would win, they would probably kill each other first. Wonder Woman would be next, for no other reason than she could and would kick everyone else's ass.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
True. I know Juggs is over 100 Tons, but probably not by a lot...I was pointing out that some sources wouldn't even have him at 100 to show that he isn't as far over 100 as a lot of the others on the list.

And Glads is a braggart, and the star thing is only a rumor. But the Ego fight happened, and during it even Thanos was impressed by Gladiator. I'd keep him at #1
Juggernaut is a top rank Class 100 with a high limit to his strenght.

Thanos thanks to the ability to tap into the dark version of Cosmic Power is a top rank Class 100 possessor, and in his appearences he showed to be a hella enemy, when he fought Odin, he was showing his own, but the highfather outmatched him on the blasting sector and strenght sector, so Odin Force>Cosmic Power, there's obviously a limit to the amount of Cosmic Power a being can tap into, there will be a feedback for his body, if Thanos was above Odin in raw and physical power, he'll beat him.His major power next to his mind it's his durability, since he was enhanced from Death he's nearly undestructible and he can't die.

..

according to LT TOAA is a dumbass fanboy..... lol...



jk

where are you topping out the strength catagory? because the likes of Surtur, Galactus, an Infinite, etc.... would crush these guys in a lifting contest

Originally posted by Scoobless
according to LT TOAA is a dumbass fanboy..... lol...



jk

where are you topping out the strength catagory? because the likes of Surtur, Galactus, an Infinite, etc.... would crush these guys in a lifting contest
lol

Doomsday
Hulk
Juggernaut
Superman
Thor
Captain marvel
Gladiator
Hercules

Only them , no Galactus, surtur etc

no cosmic beings lolol

Originally posted by leonidas
<<Use quotes so you that have to use the two triangles thingies>>

but i kinda like my triangle thingies . . .

and i never disagreed with you. just said i thought the reason he wasn't mentioned was because he was too tough to be considered in our discussion. but apparently we've been discussing him, so . . .

What ever you say

Okay, and I notice no one mentioned Aquaman even though he picked up Manhattan

But the list from kgkg proves me wrong

in the newest hercules issue.

he goes all rodeo with a giant chain and captures one of the mole man's giant monsters.

he then uses the monster and chain as if it was a mace and knocks the other monsters miles away.(he does this as if it's weightless)

then he uses the monster as a bowling ball to stop mole man from invading hawaii (im not making this up).

now i know that people like thor or superman could do this as well , but not as easily as hercules.

he also knocked out the abomination with a lamppost.

and pulled a shield heli-carrier(while it was in the air) as if it was nothing.
shield couldn't do anything to stop him from taking them to another destination.

Herc mini series was cool. Didn't Herc mop the floor with 4 of those Monsters at once? Where it took the FF4 to defeat one?

yes the shield heli carriers are the same ones in the ultimates

No one is stronger than a pissed off Hulk. using a numbers scale, as ive used before
Maestro has an 11
Hulk has a 10 but gets madder as time goes on so he could get up to 18 most likely
Supes got a 10
Juggz has a 9 but when rinnging he has about double
Herc has a 10
Wonderwoman has a 9 but like a 12 when using Heras strength
Doomsday is relally high iunno his true power
Soloman Grundy pops all aaround so hes left as random for now
and....................




POPEYE THE SAILOR MAN HAS A 11 IF HE HAS SPINACHE!