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I'm a bit of a noob to this forum,alright,I'm a complete noob so I don't know if this has been done before, but what about Dark Revanarguably the most powerful sith ever (and I say arguably because Ragnos and sadow were both pretty powerful) against three very powerful sith lords.

Well although i'm sure he could beat both Sion and Kreia he can not beat Nihilus because Nihilus isn't really something anybody can beat. Nihilus will just eat Revan like he will eat everybody, he will draw Revan his power until Revan is a nothing. There is only one that can beat Nihilus and that is the Exile because he does not have the force so he can't be drawn from.

Revan will lose this because of Nihilus

Fishy's right. Bring it on depaters!

Originally posted by Fishy
Well although i'm sure he could beat both Sion and Kreia he can not beat Nihilus because Nihilus isn't really something anybody can beat. Nihilus will just eat Revan like he will eat everybody, he will draw Revan his power until Revan is a nothing. There is only one that can beat Nihilus and that is the Exile because he does not have the force so he can't be drawn from.

Revan will lose this because of Nihilus

Nihilus isn't invincible, if he does this why didn't he do it to Visas? They never said anything like "no force user can beat him because he'll suck their power out." Even, let's say if it is true (and it might, i've just never heard anything like that besides this site) it's not necessarily instantaneous. It probably takes time for him to do that and Revan would only need a few seconds. Also there's the high possibility that he can't do it to anyone stronger than him. Why didn't he do it to Traya? or Sion for that matter?

Your only saying that because your devoted to Revan judging by your name

If it were possible for Nhilous to be killed, wouldn't it work along the lines of the longer the fight lasts the weaker revan becomes and the more powerful nhilous becomes, and if the exile does not have the force how could he use it or not die like other life forms dissconnected from the force?

yes thats a good point revan. it kind of annoys me that nihilus is pretty much invincible. fishy, how does the exile not use the force? i know he was totally cut off from it when he was exiled, but as the game went on he became a jedi again and was pretty strong with the force by the time he faced nihilus. i didnt play the game that thoroughly though, because i found it quite boring compared to KOTOR 1. but anyways is there something i missed?


besides that i still think revan would lose. sure any of those three, perhaps with the exception of nihilus, would be easily defeated by revan one on one, but three on one might prove too much for him to handle

good freakin question

The reason is quite simple guys. Plot Hole. Anyway, I see the hugeass team take this.

Your right

Originally posted by Bobafetty
Your only saying that because your devoted to Revan judging by your name

You sure sound like an ignorant fool there. Judging someone on their username? I don't go around saying you think Boba Fett could win in any fight no matter what. Yes, I think Revan is powerful and I have a page full of reasons backing it up. There's also really no reasons against Revan either. I don't post my opinions on popularity EVER! I hate Count Dooku and Maul is one of my favorite characters but unfortunately Dooku would dominate against Maul. Don't ever tell me that I'm only saying that because... since you don't know. I would've argued the same thing about Nihilus if it were Sidious instead of Revan.

And I do agree with Human Vader, Revan might lose against the three of them anyway, but I think he would barely win.

Revan would be annihilated by this triple threat...

He would. Although he would bring up a good fight

He would put up a good fight, but Revan knew he couldn't defeat the abomination that is Nihilus. Hence why he had Kreia train teh Exile to defeat him.

Originally posted by Human Vader
yes thats a good point revan. it kind of annoys me that nihilus is pretty much invincible. fishy, how does the exile not use the force? i know he was totally cut off from it when he was exiled, but as the game went on he became a jedi again and was pretty strong with the force by the time he faced nihilus. i didnt play the game that thoroughly though, because i found it quite boring compared to KOTOR 1. but anyways is there something i missed?


besides that i still think revan would lose. sure any of those three, perhaps with the exception of nihilus, would be easily defeated by revan one on one, but three on one might prove too much for him to handle

Janus, we should get that Nihilus thread pinned

Anyways why didn't the Exile get killed by Nihilus? Good question because he didn't have the force, but how can that be you ask, well again good question.

He draws from his friends, Visas literally says so. Kreia does everybody does, you become more powerful because of your friends and they because of you. You first regain your connection with the force when Kreia is with you. A really powerful Sith no less. There is a thread on the second or third page of the EU about Darth Nihilus I would recommend all of you to read it, because it explains pretty much everything.

And it isn't just mentioned on this site, there are other forums that mention it probably becuase its true.

Ah, you didn't answer my questions in my first post. I'd check out the Nihilus thread in a link but I'm too lazy to try and find it myself.

Why didn't he drain Visas you mean? That one...

Well for one thing he probably did, second thing the exile was also drawing from Visas and probably more becuase their connection was stronger basically meaning that Nihilus had less to draw from then the Exile did, making the Exile more powerful

I'm simply saying, you make it seem like he can kill anyone in the blink of an eye if he wants. If he does drain the Force, it would probably take time for him to feed enough power off of Revan for Nihilus to win is what I think.

As for the fight, Lord Revan could take out Nihilus before he has time to use his power, and he would be constantly talking to Sion, making him doubt his abilities (Revan was even the one to tell HK that, who then told the Exile). After the death of Sion, he might be able to finish off Traya. This would be a very close fight, and if Revan wasn't such a genius when it comes to combat then he would surely lose.

Originally posted by Emperor Revan
I'm simply saying, you make it seem like he can kill anyone in the blink of an eye if he wants. If he does drain the Force, it would probably take time for him to feed enough power off of Revan for Nihilus to win is what I think.

As for the fight, Lord Revan could take out Nihilus before he has time to use his power, and he would be constantly talking to Sion, making him doubt his abilities (Revan was even the one to tell HK that, who then told the Exile). After the death of Sion, he might be able to finish off Traya. This would be a very close fight, and if Revan wasn't such a genius when it comes to combat then he would surely lose.

For Nihilus to use it power could take long but we don't know that. What I do know however is that Kreia and Sion aren't weak either and could surely hold Revan off for a little while, probably enough for Nihilus to drain him dry...

I'm sorry but with Nihilus in your team you can not lose, he will draw the enemy dry, eat them whole and use their own power against them.

Originally posted by Fishy
For Nihilus to use it power could take long but we don't know that. What I do know however is that Kreia and Sion aren't weak either and could surely hold Revan off for a little while, probably enough for Nihilus to drain him dry...

I'm sorry but with Nihilus in your team you can not lose, he will draw the enemy dry, eat them whole and use their own power against them.

True, they could probably hold him off long enough for Nihilus to suck enough of his power. Now if Revan could fight Nihilus first and then against the other two he could probably win. Nihilus would most likely have trouble concentrating on draining the other's life force while fighting them in a duel, especially against a guy like Lord Revan.

I would also like to know who says this about Nihilus and when (i believe you) because I can't remember hearing about it. And one last thing, how do you pronounce Nihilus? I've been saying it like Nye ihh (it without the t) less.

There is a thread in the normal EU section, on the second or third page I'd recommend you do a search for it... Its pretty much all explained threw quotes and examples

Originally posted by Fishy
There is a thread in the normal EU section, on the second or third page I'd recommend you do a search for it... Its pretty much all explained threw quotes and examples

Ok, I read through the whole thing and there's nothing in there to make me believe that Nihilus can instantly drain the Force out of anyone except the Exile. The thing about Revan fearing him was speculation, it was interesting speculation and I enjoyed reading it but it's quite simply not a fact... yet. It might become one, it might not. I agree that Nihilus and the Exile are probably like one being, but if that's true than they should have equal power and Revan would be almost undoubtedly stronger.

Never in the game did I hear anything about Nihilus sucking the Force out of anyone who opposed him even if they were far stronger than him. To my knowledge nothing at all points to that ever happening except speculation.

Originally posted by Emperor Revan
Ok, I read through the whole thing and there's nothing in there to make me believe that Nihilus can instantly drain the Force out of anyone except the Exile. The thing about Revan fearing him was speculation, it was interesting speculation and I enjoyed reading it but it's quite simply not a fact... yet. It might become one, it might not. I agree that Nihilus and the Exile are probably like one being, but if that's true than they should have equal power and Revan would be almost undoubtedly stronger.

Never in the game did I hear anything about Nihilus sucking the Force out of anyone who opposed him even if they were far stronger than him. To my knowledge nothing at all points to that ever happening except speculation.

How about him blowing up that planet? How about kreia luring him to Telos to feed on Jedi. Its pretty clear he feeds on the force, there is nothing that makes me believe he can do it in seconds but the game probably says it.

And yes the Revan meeting thing is speculation at best, it just explains a few things. That does not have to be true, but it would explain a lot which makes me believe it is true. Not to mention that you should face Revan at the end of Kotor II... There has to be something that ties him in all of that. But I admit the Revan thing is speculation. The rest of it is pretty much just drawing conclusions based on the few facts the game has given us.

Yes, he did manage to basically destroy that planet but they were very vague on that to say the least. Yes, that was the reason that he went to Telos, but in both instances he is feeding on them while they are on the planet below and can't do anything to stop him. I'm not sure if he killed them or not by this, I would assume he killed them.

Now I have 3 reasons to counter your argument that Nihilus can suck the Force out of anyone and defeat them.

1) He never does it when someone's close to them, I imagine it takes time and it would be hard to concentrate on doing that while dueling with them at the same time.

2) He never does it to anyone more powerful than himself.

3) He only does it to JEDI. He didn't do it to Kreia, Sion, or even Visas so perhaps he only feeds on the light side of the Force.

The Revan speculation does explain some things, but there could be a hundred explanations if the original ending was in tact. Maybe he just finished defeating the Sith Empire and he came back to Malachor V because he sensed his old master there, he found the Exile who is a threat to him and the Force and decided to kill him. Like I said before, it's very interesting speculation and quite possibly true but since the original ending isn't in the game anyway, it's still just speculation.

Okay the Revan thing is indeed speculation now for your other points

1.) He probably did, the Jedi Council in Kotor II does say they hunted him down but nobody ever returned... And he always left a wound in the force after he did that. Doesn't make us know anything about how long it took him, but at least that he did it.

2.) Actually he does it all the time, because without it he wouldn't have any power.

3.) Hmm he does use it to defeat Kreia "Their are techniques within the force against which there is no defense" - Kreia...

Well she says something like that, Kreia was dark he did use it. He never did it against Sion because he could use him they worked together.. Don't ask me why probably because he was an idiot. And he needed Visas to see for him through the force

Originally posted by Fishy
Okay the Revan thing is indeed speculation now for your other points

1.) He probably did, the Jedi Council in Kotor II does say they hunted him down but nobody ever returned... And he always left a wound in the force after he did that. Doesn't make us know anything about how long it took him, but at least that he did it.

2.) Actually he does it all the time, because without it he wouldn't have any power.

3.) Hmm he does use it to defeat Kreia "Their are techniques within the force against which there is no defense" - Kreia...

Well she says something like that, Kreia was dark he did use it. He never did it against Sion because he could use him they worked together.. Don't ask me why probably because he was an idiot. And he needed Visas to see for him through the force

1.) true

2.) well, I meant that if he didn't have that power to suck people's force energy, there are several people that would defeat him. Nihilus never does it to any of those people that would defeat him.

3.) Good counter, I suppose Nihilus may have been using that technique when Sion beat her up but I don't know if she was referring to Nihilus or not when she said that. I always thought Kreia let herself get beaten up though and stripped of her power because she could see what would happen in the future.

I meant why didn't he use it against Visas when she was with the Exile? It's easier to defeat two opponents then three which leads me back to reasons one through three.

Originally posted by Emperor Revan
1.) true

2.) well, I meant that if he didn't have that power to suck people's force energy, there are several people that would defeat him. Nihilus never does it to any of those people that would defeat him.

3.) Good counter, I suppose Nihilus may have been using that technique when Sion beat her up but I don't know if she was referring to Nihilus or not when she said that. I always thought Kreia let herself get beaten up though and stripped of her power because she could see what would happen in the future.

I meant why didn't he use it against Visas when she was with the Exile? It's easier to defeat two opponents then three which leads me back to reasons one through three.

2.) True, he is without any doubt the weakest sith lord ever... If he couldn't draw from other people he would probably just die...


3.) That movie that shows, you see Kreia being pushed away by Nihilus she says the no technique thing exactly when you see that. I always thought he used her own power against her then and drained her dry, which made it so easy for Sion to beat the crap out of her.

It didn't seem to me like she just wanted to surrender her power to Nihilus and Sion.

And the Visas thing, well the Exile at that time was still drawing from her. He probably drew from her which would make your statement about it taking time true..

On the other hand Nihilus would logically draw from the most powerful one of the group, The Exile the leader. He would want to take his power instead of that of others. He couldn't do that... He drew from others but not as much as he wanted to drain from the Exile. At least thats what I think.

But why would Kreia train someone who she hated that could defeat her? It doesn't make sense unless without Sion, Nihilus couldn't have defeated her. Which again comes back to where he never does it when he's fighting, just when he's not in the line of fire...

Hopefully KOTOR 3 will clear some things up on this stuff.

You've already agreed with me on the fact that he does it in the line of fire...

Why would Kreia train him? I don't know... I really don't know, maybe she hoped he would destroy the Exile and Revan, maybe she hoped that he would just follow her. Maybe she never trained him and just became his master without telling him what to do. Or maybe she found him weak and saw potential and the Death of the force in him. Something she was searching for.

Something that could have given her what she wanted. This can be explained by the Revan contacted her theory however. He told her that Nihilus could destroy the force it self and asked her if she could find something to destroy it.

She found Nihilus worked something out with him and instead of fighting she made him join her probably offering something in return like training. Then Nihilus decided to stop her and end her life, so she ran away and found the Exile...

God I don't know, to many guesses to many theory's involved

Originally posted by Fishy
You've already agreed with me on the fact that he does it in the line of fire...

Why would Kreia train him? I don't know... I really don't know, maybe she hoped he would destroy the Exile and Revan, maybe she hoped that he would just follow her. Maybe she never trained him and just became his master without telling him what to do. Or maybe she found him weak and saw potential and the Death of the force in him. Something she was searching for.

Something that could have given her what she wanted. This can be explained by the Revan contacted her theory however. He told her that Nihilus could destroy the force it self and asked her if she could find something to destroy it.

She found Nihilus worked something out with him and instead of fighting she made him join her probably offering something in return like training. Then Nihilus decided to stop her and end her life, so she ran away and found the Exile...

God I don't know, to many guesses to many theory's involved

I don't recall him doing the drain thing when he was fighting...

If Revan wanted Nihilus destroyed, why did he ask Kreia instead of doing it himself? He was in the Mandalorian wars so he would remember the Exile, and it doesn't seem like Revan would ask for help, not to mention if Kreia was trying to destroy Nihilus she wouldn't be training it.

I think that ONLY with Nihilus AND Sion could they defeat Traya.

Because Revan didn't have to know about the Exile...

Not that strange really, I don't think Revan really kept track of every Jedi at that battle just for kicks.

To quote myself from a few posts up

"He probably did, the Jedi Council in Kotor II does say they hunted him down but nobody ever returned... And he always left a wound in the force after he did that. Doesn't make us know anything about how long it took him, but at least that he did it."

You agreed with that so we know he ate people...

And you never know with Kreia, what she wants to with Revan... she does not seem to really follow other people their plans

Originally posted by Fishy
For Nihilus to use it power could take long but we don't know that. What I do know however is that Kreia and Sion aren't weak either and could surely hold Revan off for a little while, probably enough for Nihilus to drain him dry...

I'm sorry but with Nihilus in your team you can not lose, he will draw the enemy dry, eat them whole and use their own power against them.

I would say that Nihilus power needs some time till it works (maybe some kind of meditation is needed or something like that) so that he won't be able to use that "in combat". There is no other explanation for me except my favourite one that programing a computer game where the player can't win is senseless.

So...
Considering that Nihilus needs time to use his special ability, Revan will manage to kill him and Sion and then move on to Kreia. Well it might be hard fighting 3 Sith Lords at once even for Revan (well...Sion and Nihilus - without using his special ability - are the two weakest Sith Lords for me in the entire history of the SW universe). That would be mainly Revan vs Kreia. I'd say Revan wins this close.

Originally posted by Nai Fohl
I would say that Nihilus power needs some time till it works (maybe some kind of meditation is needed or something like that) so that he won't be able to use that "in combat". There is no other explanation for me except my favourite one that programing a computer game where the player can't win is senseless.

So...
Considering that Nihilus needs time to use his special ability, Revan will manage to kill him and Sion and then move on to Kreia. Well it might be hard fighting 3 Sith Lords at once even for Revan (well...Sion and Nihilus - without using his special ability - are the two weakest Sith Lords for me in the entire history of the SW universe). That would be mainly Revan vs Kreia. I'd say Revan wins this close.

Ah but he can't drain from the Exile and Nihilus has beaten masters before... Jedi went to confront him and never returned the masters said that all the threat left at the place they thought was a wound in the force.

So he can do it, or maybe he just meditates before they ever reach him.. Kinda sucks because we don't know... But if Nihilus can't use his ability then Revan will win.

Yes he will. I think this one will go to Revan.

Originally posted by Fishy
Ah but he can't drain from the Exile and Nihilus has beaten masters before... Jedi went to confront him and never returned the masters said that all the threat left at the place they thought was a wound in the force.

So he can do it, or maybe he just meditates before they ever reach him.. Kinda sucks because we don't know... But if Nihilus can't use his ability then Revan will win.

Sure masters died to him, but I think your right that he was draining the Force energy before they got to him. Masters aren't much compared to Lord Revan though. The Exile kills masters without even coming anywhere close to breaking a sweat and The Exile wouldn't be too much of a challenge for Revan.

So I guess he can do it, but not while he's in combat. It's like Bastila's battle meditation. It's nice we've all agreed on something.