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SETUP

Batman had some method of subdual prepared for every member of the JLA should the need have arisen to take them down.
At the time, Martian Manhunter was still vulnerable to fire, and the method Batman concocted for him was to have nanites attached to his skin that burst into flame upon contact with air, effectively turning him into a living torch.

Now that J'onn has overcome his previous fear of and vulnerability to fire, what would Batman come up with for his new contingency?

Essentially, this is Batman with six months of prep time vs. an unprepared (and potentially insane) Martian Manhunter.

Keep in mind that "unprepared" doesn't mean passive or foolish in this case. Assume Martian Manhunter is hostile to everyone, but not necessarily hunting for Batman specifically. When he does encounter Batman, he would approach him with full knowledge of what Batman is capable of, but he is unaware of whatever particular plan Batman has prepared.


RULES

1. Bringing in other members of the JLA is not an option.

2. Bringing any other beings into it is extremely unlikely, as they could introduce a level of unreliability that Batman would prefer not to deal with.

3. Technology
a) Any technology used must be constructed by Batman himself. No borrowing existing weapons from others. Secrecy is key.

b) Size/Portability is an issue. Weapons or machines should be able to be used or accessed under practically any circumstance and should not require the target to be standing on a big X in order for them to work.

c) Stupidly generic technology shouldn't be used. Examples are "an anti-martian ray", "a helmet that blocks all telepathy", or "something that prevents intangibility". You don't have to be a scientific expert (although it's certainly a plus if you are), but at least make an attempt to intelligently explain how and why something works.

d) No magic.

4. Unless absolutely necessary, excessively destructive forces are off limits. The idea is to protect the earth from the threat of Martian Manhunter gone bad, not take half of it out in the process.

5. Lethal means of bringing down Martian Manhunter are acceptable, but only as a last resort. Subduing him is far preferrable.

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NOTE: I am going to assume that most responses would include something about Batman exploiting the whole emotional flame vulnerability thing. While this can be a legitimate tactic, describe how it will be executed to best effect.
Something like, "Batman burns an orphanage in front of MM. End of story." doesn't cut it.

Well, I appreciate the fact that you really thought about this thread, and put a lot of effort in it, but there can be only one winner, and that's MM.

what are MM's powers besides telepathy and phasing

I think he also has super strength.

people were saying he was 2nd to superman and was almost faster

i've herd that too.

MM wins.

I hate to say considering im a huge Batman mark, but......MM beats him. MM is probably the most powerful memeber of JLA. He is just as fast, strong, and durable as the Big S AND he is a POWERFUL telapath.
Batman would probably know that MM's is vulnerable to fire, but before Bats can act on that thought, MM enters Bat's mind and simply turns the "off" switch. Game over.....leaving one question....
Who is know heir to the Wayne fortune???

He can be as strong/fast as superman, but for only a few minutes before his body breaks down.

He isn't over his fear of fire hardly at all, it's cultural.

Still, I can't see Bats winning without help.
The telepathy is a *****....

In Justice League Season 1, "Injustice For All part 1&2," Batman was bitten by Copperhead and had to be escorted back to the watchtower.


As soon as Bats woke up, he was ready to leave and track the injustice gang by himself.



Batman: "I'm going to find them."



Martian Manhunter: You don't have to do this.

Batman: Do you want to try to stop me?

What does that have to do with anything?
MM could have just broke his neck, but MM respects him.

Originally posted by MrHeavySilence
In Justice League Season 1, "Injustice For All part 1&2," Batman was bitten by Copperhead and had to be escorted back to the watchtower.


As soon as Bats woke up, he was ready to leave and track the injustice gang by himself.



Batman: "I'm going to find them."



Martian Manhunter: You don't have to do this.

Batman: Do you want to try to stop me?


They really up play Batman being goth, a ninja, and an ******* on the cartoon.

Originally posted by long pig
What does that have to do with anything?
MM could have just broke his neck, but MM respects him.

Just saying that if someone like Martian saw him as a threat, Batman stands a chance. God knows if that was Hawk Girl he woulda just b****slapped her with the back of his extraterrestrial hand.

The thing with Batman is, he will find a weakness. And it will be exploited to the max with new and innovative ways.


I never read the issue 'cause noone will tell me which one it is, but Batman defeated 4 white martians. 4 White Martians equates than at LEAST 1 1/2 Martian Manhunters. Batman is not one to be underestimated.

Okay, so for those of you who think Martian Manhunter is just too much for Batman, explain what would happen. And try to add at least a little detail.

For those of you who think Batman does have a chance, how do you think he might do it? What kind of trap/weapon/plan would he come up with?

Originally posted by MrHeavySilence
Just saying that if someone like Martian saw him as a threat, Batman stands a chance. God knows if that was Hawk Girl he woulda just b****slapped her with the back of his extraterrestrial hand.

a) its a cartoon
b) youre drawing wild conclusions from it. How does it prove MM sees Batman as a threat?

Batman fans can explain him winning through scenarios. But all logic says that Batman should lose a fight like this :P.

And scenarios are the worst thing ever to cite as evidence, just because of the fact that they are made up.

I know J'onn would take this in a one on one, but this isn't supposed to be an arena battle or anything like that.
This isn't intended to be a straight up fight at all. The main question here is "what is Batman's new contingency plan for Martian Manhunter should he ever get out of control and be a danger to others?" His first contingency already worked, but now that J'onn isn't quite as susceptible to fire, I'm guessing he would have to use something else next time. At the very least, he would have to execute it differently.

I'm not looking for "evidence". I just want to know what people think he might come up with.

Originally posted by MrHeavySilence
The thing with Batman is, he will find a weakness. And it will be exploited to the max with new and innovative ways.


I never read the issue 'cause noone will tell me which one it is, but Batman defeated 4 white martians. 4 White Martians equates than at LEAST 1 1/2 Martian Manhunters. Batman is not one to be underestimated. I'm not sure what issue, but it's really not all that impressive. They were idiots & Batman had their easily exploitable weakness on him. This would no longer work on MM. The 4 he beat(you see 3 because he'd already taken care of 1) = about 10% MM.

.......

there is no way that batman can combat telepathy. Atleast not to the ability of MM

If batman can build something to hide himself from superman and I think this happen during the white martian fiasco. Couldn't he already have something to prevent MM from looking inside his head?

I guess if MM is virtually insnae then batman would win.

I don't think I could give specifics - I'm not as smart as Batman.

But given that amount of Prep-time - I'm positive he could come up with something to take down MM.

Now obviously, if it was an impromptu battle, Bats would get creamed.

But it's not.

Hmm... pondering....

One on One, MM has this hands down. But, if its Batman searching for MM and MM going on a rampage, Batman takes the cake. Too much at his disposal and whatnot.

whistling

MM ftw. He is the most diverse of the JLA.

Spite?

First page of this thread is hilarious.

Originally posted by MrHeavySilence
In Justice League Season 1, "Injustice For All part 1&2," Batman was bitten by Copperhead and had to be escorted back to the watchtower.


As soon as Bats woke up, he was ready to leave and track the injustice gang by himself.



Batman: "I'm going to find them."



Martian Manhunter: You don't have to do this.

Batman: Do you want to try to stop me?


That says it all. Batman FTW.

Originally posted by MrHeavySilence
In Justice League Season 1, "Injustice For All part 1&2," Batman was bitten by Copperhead and had to be escorted back to the watchtower.


As soon as Bats woke up, he was ready to leave and track the injustice gang by himself.



Batman: "I'm going to find them."



Martian Manhunter: You don't have to do this.

Batman: Do you want to try to stop me?


Exactly how it should happen.

this i s going to be hard because im a big MM fan but respectively Batman has trained himself long ago to be able to conceal his true thoughts from telepaths at will. able to summon important information at will by using pneumonic triggers.
So by doing this batman can easily hide whatever weapon or counter measure he has on his person with out being detected.

Now its time to think outside the box.......every one keeps putting to much emphasis on fire, when its been shown on JLU tas that MM can be stopped by if being frozen in ice. i.e. a liquid nitrogen grenade

Now for the idiots who aren't happy enough with that, who think " MM can just phase through the ice".

Well its also bin shown that while in his intangible phasing mode J'onn becomes vulnerable to electromagnetic tuning disruption. Because all hes doing when hes making himself intangible is vibrating his molecules at a different frequency just like the flash does. And this item I speak of has already bin used by the Ultra Humanite right in front of batman in " Injustice for All".

And besides the device bringing him back to his tangible state it also delivers
thousands of whats right into the Martian nervous system.

this will probably only slow J'onn down for a moment but this will give batman enough time to place one of the mad hatters reversed engineered mind crowns on J'onns head rendering MM helpless because all of Jonn powers stems from his telepathy. His strength, speed, morphing, and flight, abilities come from his telepathy and his awsome ability to control every molecule of his body.

And once this is put in check Batman can finish it up with a well placed judo chop......or whatever.

The winner is Batman

powers= Genius

Originally posted by JRW
what are MM's powers besides telepathy and phasing

In terms of scope of powers the Martian Manhunter basically has nearly any power you can think of apart from teleportation and magic. Furthermore, the powers that he has are at a very high level.

An example of the powers he has would include very high level super-strength (together with Superman and Wonderwoman he was pulling the Earth), very high level superspeed, very high level shapeshifting (it is said the only person better than him is Plastic Man), the ability to absorb mass from the Earth and become very large, the ability to change the constituency of his skin (e.g. giving himself metallic armor ....in one case becoming like a giant gundam robot), the ability to phase, the ability to turn invisible, high-level heat vision (called martian vision), in some portrayals martian breath (think hurricane breath for Superman), a whole number of senses (for instance microscopic vision, in one case he said he constantly scans himself on a microscopic level), very high level telepathy (e.g. reading all the minds on earth at the same time, and in terms of offensive capability very high ....he took down ultraman, a Superman version, so easily and said that the moment Ultraman decided to engage him the fight was already over), the ability to become elastic, and some other powers that have not yet been fully explored (e.g. shooting forth energy from his hands). He is also largely invulnerable, and for the most part immortal (he can even regenerate a head). Many years into the future the Martian Manhunter is still alive .....he had actually bonded with the planet Mars (or was it the Moon ....I have the comic, set in the 853rd century ....we are currently in the 21st ....and he had bonded with the soil of either Mars or the Moon). He is also a tech whiz (planting thoughts in Green Lanterns to have them construct highly sophisticated martian technology), and a strategic genius (like Batman, he had come up with ways of taking down the entire JLA ....this was before Bruce came up with his own version).

In essence, the Martian Manhunter is quite powerful. According to Superman and Green Lantern John, the Martian Manhunter is the most powerful being on Earth.

Now, he does have some weakness to flames of 'psychic significance.' However, the reason there is a weakness to flame is due to genetic manipulation by the Guardians (the guys who oversee the Green Lantern corps). They realized that the Martians were too dangerous, so they subdued them and genetically manipulated them into Green and White Martians (before they were all Burning Martians), and made them afraid of fire (because it is through fire and suffering that the Burning Martians used to procreate).

In the graphic novel JLA: Trial by Fire (a very good graphic novel) it shows what happens when the Martian Manhunter overcomes his fear of fire, and by doing so becomes a Burning Martian. Let's just say that he almost destroys the world (a good trick he did was to plant thoughts into the people who control nuclear missiles and make them launch missiles).

Anyways, that in a nutshell is the Martian Manhunter. Basically Superman, with the shapeshifting abilities of Plastic Man, the psychic abilities of Despero, the healing factor of the Hulk, the invisibility powers of the Invisible Woman, the ability to create weapons from his body like Carnage or Clayface, the absorption powers of the Absorbing Man (for inorganics), tech whiz, and the strategic mind of Batman.

In DC they state that in the Southern Hemisphere (in the comic version of Earth) he is actually more famous than Superman (who on DC Earth is more famous in the Northern hemisphere).

I hope that answers most of your questions on the Martian Manhunter. He is actually one dangerous hombre, but is not used much.

To get a handle on this, we'll have to think like Batman - or, at least, come as close to it as we can.

First, Bruce is not quite sane: his will is intensely, unbelievably strong due to Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and he's honed that and other, similar flaws until they became strengths.

He and J'onn are friends; I'd say, with the exception of Dick Grayson (who is now estranged to some degree), J'onn is Bruce's only friend that's a peer... although Clark Kent might be in there, to some degree. Depending on the writer, heh.

At any rate, Bruce knows J'onn very, very well; he has a grip on J'onn's personality, for lack of a better term. Bruce is also one of the greatest strategic minds that ever lived, the greatest living detective and one of the greatest combatants of any type in the world.

He's a master, if not The Master, at hunting, ambushes and pragmatic solutions.

Now, for a bit of comparative info: in one of the Despero storylines, it was shown that Blue Beetle resisted Despero's mental power; Despero commented on it, then prepared to physically tear BB apart.

Bruce has a far, far more powerful mind than Ted Kord did; Martian Manhunter and Despero are (or is that were, now?) about even.

Emulating Bruce's knack for ambush, I would say he'd plant a trap for J'onn in his own mind. As Ray Palmer would say, "Remove the fuel, the fire goes out." If your mind is strong enough, it can be a potent trap and weapon against a Telepath; I'm sure Bruce would have a less elegant back-up, in case J'onn didn't attack or contact him psychically, first...

Superman, leading a contingent of heroes in full flight to the 'Rescue':
"Batman? Is...."

Batman, quickly standing and bracing himself to appear unshaken, despite a nosebleed: "Hnn. I'm... uninjured."

Superman, landing beside him: "No, I meant... I mean... you didn't have to use lethal force, did you?"

Contingency plan:

Call plastic man.

We've seen this one before.

Originally posted by Cavalier
Contingency plan:

Call plastic man.

We've seen this one before.

I thought it involved nanites and a whole lot of magnesium.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I thought it involved nanites and a whole lot of magnesium. Not the one Batman put into practice against a berserk martian.

Though I guess it would be obvious why that plan wouldn't work so good against Fernus...

Batman would know that going Toe to toe with the Martian would be suicide. Even with his awesome martial arts skills MM is a shape-shifter with no nerve endings to exploit or bones to break and that's before we talk about his massively powerful invulnerability.

But here's the thing you see Batman always has a plan the "Flaming Nanites" plan may be nullified but that would only mean he made another plan.

So here's the scenario as I see it: Manhunter is going nuts smashing people through buildings and turning into dragons and generally just being aggressive. MM see's Batman and fly's straight for him. Batman would use his skills to dodge the onslaught of attacks as best he can, for as long as he could. Perhaps he would even wear his mech suit until it was smashed to pieces but all the while he would be baiting the martian into invading his mind.

Now Batman is smarter than me so I'm not sure what he could say to do that and it would almost certainly have to be story centric. He'd probably use the source of MM's anger or perhaps claim to have information on the whereabouts of whoever it was that betrayed J'onn so badly that he's fighting against Batman/the Justice League (since at this point I'm sure the JL would have gotten involved) in the first place.

Batman's real skill is turning peoples strengths against them, and we all know the depths of Batman's mind. He has an entire "backup" personality (the Batman of zur-en-arrh). Telepathy might get J'onn in but no ones going to let him out again. It's an incredibly high risk strategy since as MM could just snap Batman's kneck and sadly even if it works Bruce would effectively become J'onn's prison sacrificing himself for the good of the world. But its the sort of thing we've come to expect of him. Remember when he killed Darksied?

Of course after all this goes down the rest of the JLA will jump on board to help both of them and although I know you said he cant have help it's simply not possible for one of the heaviest hitters in the DC universe not to attract the attention of anyone but Batman so if nothing else my "Mind Trap" plan would work to slow him down until backup arrived.

Well, there's the dart that Prometheus used against MM when he came onto the Watchtower, and seeing as Batman took apart P's tech after he was captured, and has a habit of reverse engineering villains' tech, I can't see why he wouldn't just use that.

Batman knows his weakness. batman wears tinfoil and throws fire bombs...the end!

Batkick to the ass FTW.

Batman wins so bad this is almost spite. I think that everyone is over thinking this. If Batman can build something as advanced as the OMAC's then I don't see why he can't devote all of his resources and talents into building his own personal Nimrod.

Strictly according to stips i would say a hostile MM would take it.

Originally posted by Brockalizer
Batman wins so bad this is almost spite. I think that everyone is over thinking this. If Batman can build something as advanced as the OMAC's then I don't see why he can't devote all of his resources and talents into building his own personal Nimrod.
Batman didn't built OMACs, Alexander luthor did via checkmate IIRC.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Batkick to the ass FTW. Originally posted by Brockalizer
Batman wins so bad this is almost spite. I think that everyone is over thinking this. If Batman can build something as advanced as the OMAC's then I don't see why he can't devote all of his resources and talents into building his own personal Nimrod. like x 2