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who takes this fight?

Cap.

'Cuz when he swings his mighty shield, all who oppose his shield must yield.

r u crazy veryfew people can beat cap andno normal person can lay a hand on him and i think a blind guy can beat him ur crazy

Originally posted by Piedmon
Cap.

'Cuz when he swings his mighty shield, all who oppose his shield must yield.

It's when he throws his mighty shield dummy!

DAMNIT SCOOB!

Daredevil should win.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Daredevil should win.

Hey man are you looking for a fight?

Marvel.com Daredevil's bio

Daredevil possesses the strength, speed, agility, and endurance, not to mention acrobatic and gymnastic skills, of an Olympic-level athlete.

Captain America's bio

Captain America has a very high intelligence as well as agility, strength, speed, endurance, and reaction time superior to any Olympic athlete who ever competed.

The only thing is I think DD has superhuman reflexes. So DD is only slightly faster than Cap. Cap is also a better fighter, not by a greadt deal but still greater.

Captain wins.

daredevil. he would stab cap though his stomach with his spear

Originally posted by The-Judge
daredevil. he would stab cap though his stomach with his spear


bann

Captain Wins the majority, but not without a good fight, Cap 6/10.

DD is more agile, faster, with better reaction time, Cap is stronger with better stamina, they are not that much farther apart. Cap's saving grace is his shield, which allows him to take more risks.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master


DD is more agile, faster, with better reaction time,


Well his bio says he is slower, but the comics show that he is faster.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master

Cap is stronger with better stamina, they are not that much farther apart. Cap's saving grace is his shield, which allows him to take more risks.

I think Cap could beat him without his shield, he is a better fighter but not by a great deal. It would not be an easy fight.

this is a good fight, and i used to think DD would win due to his super senses, but Cap IMO would take it now, cuz he has enhanced reflexes and that shield, and would be countering some pretty good blows IMO. Cap 6/10

I say Daredevil. For the most part physical stats are pretty close, Cap stronger, DD more agile. Cap has the advantage that he doesn't tire and has his shield but DD has his senses. Couple that with his fighting style and billi clubs I say Matt takes him down after a tough match. DD 6/10

close call but cap wins 6/10

Originally posted by marvelprince
but DD has his senses.

and what exactly are they going to do, its not like cap is going to sneak up on him is it?

Originally posted by marvelprince

Couple that with his fighting style and billi clubs I say Matt takes him down after a tough match. DD 6/10

Im sorry this makes no sense. He has a billy club? Cap has a shield and its indestructible, the fact that DD has a club is redundant, its almost like saying that Matt has two arms. His fighting style.....I thought Cap was one of the best fighters on the planet. DD is a MA expert but hes not as good as Cap, but not far off.

Originally posted by Alfheim
and what exactly are they going to do, its not like cap is going to sneak up on him is it?

His senses allow him to predict and opponent's moves and effective counter them before an attack is even launched. He can also pinpoint weak points to attack and is an expert in nerve strikes.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Im sorry this makes no sense. He has a billy club? Cap has a shield and its indestructible, the fact that DD has a club is redundant, its almost like saying that Matt has two arms. His fighting style.....I thought Cap was one of the best fighters on the planet. DD is a MA expert but hes not as good as Cap, but not far off.

Billy clubs. Plural. Which are also indestructible. And the way he richochet's his clubs is even more precise than Cap with his shield. In pure fighting ability (ie. overall knowledge of different martial arts) Cap is superior but DD focuses on his own blend of asian styles and american boxing. That coupled with his senses make him potential one of the greatest combatants on the planet. Its why the Hand is relentless in their attempts to get him. DD's own signature style and his senses couple together to make him one hell of a fighter

Originally posted by marvelprince
richochet's his clubs is even more precise than Cap with his shield.


How did you come to that conclusion?

Originally posted by marvelprince

In pure fighting ability (ie. overall knowledge of different martial arts) Cap is superior but DD focuses on his own blend of asian styles and american boxing. That coupled with his senses make him potential one of the greatest combatants on the planet.


First of all no one has ever said that DD is one of the greatest martials arts. Wolverine talked about all different martial artists he did not mention Matt, but when he spoke about Cap he used the word "even". Even when DD fought him he said Cap was one of the greatest martial artists, if he was equal or better he probably would have said so.

Originally posted by marvelprince

DD's own signature style and his senses couple together to make him one hell of a fighter

The only thing DD is superior to Cap is in agility his senses are not going to help him because Cap is not trying to suprise him.


Originally posted by marvelprince
Cap is superior but DD focuses on his own blend of asian styles and american boxing.

One more thing that is redundant. Cap knows boxing and both ninjuitus and ju-jitsu are Japanese martial arts. I dont know if Cap knows ninjuitsu but ju -jitsu is japanese and from what I know the fighting styles are similar. So that point is irrelevant too.

Furthermore when have his billy clubs been indestructble...marvel.com doesnt say a damn thing.

Cap 6/10.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well his bio says he is slower, but the comics show that he is faster.
But none of this is by a great deal, it's a very mild difference, hence why I said the "slightly beyond Olympic" *waits for flaming* was because DD was Olympic, and Cap and him are quite comparable.


Originally posted by Alfheim
I think Cap could beat him without his shield, he is a better fighter but not by a great deal. It would not be an easy fight.

DD still has his clubs, so in that situation the fight would not favor Cap.

Originally posted by Alfheim
How did you come to that conclusion?

Cause of his senses he also has superhuman accuracy cause of his ability to pinpoint. Under accuracy there's Bulleye, Gambit, Hawkeye and Matt.

Originally posted by Alfheim
First of all no one has ever said that DD is one of the greatest martials arts. Wolverine talked about all different martial artists he did not mention Matt, but when he spoke about Cap he used the word "even". Even when DD fought him he said Cap was one of the greatest martial artists, if he was equal or better he probably would have said so.

Again elludes to my point about Matt not knowing much MA's but with his own styles and senses he's excellent. Wolverine should know that as Matt has taken him down before

Originally posted by Alfheim
The only thing DD is superior to Cap is in agility his senses are not going to help him because Cap is not trying to suprise him.

Its like you are not reading anything I post. The senses do not only help with surprise. He can hear quickening of heartbeat, tightening of muscles and pulse acceleration in order to tell if someone is planning a punch or kick or even a feint. It also allows him to pinpoint weak points. Cap's gonna have a hell of time just hitting him

Originally posted by Alfheim
and what exactly are they going to do, its not like cap is going to sneak up on him is it?
As MP points out, they allow Daredevil to sense and predict his opponent's movements by listening to their muscles and detecting such indicators as their heartbeats when they are about to do something.

This makes it much easier for DD to avoid punches and such.

Originally posted by marvelprince
Its like you are not reading anything I post. The senses do not only help with surprise. He can hear quickening of heartbeat, tightening of muscles and pulse acceleration in order to tell if someone is planning a punch or kick or even a feint. It also allows him to pinpoint weak points. Cap's gonna have a hell of time just hitting him


Well that maybe the case but it obvoulsy isnt going to be good enough. Like I said, whose the one of the greatest martial artists in the world Cap not DD. Wolverine never mentioned him in a list and DD even said Cap was.

Originally posted by Accel
As MP points out, they allow Daredevil to sense and predict his opponent's movements by listening to their muscles and detecting such indicators as their heartbeats when they are about to do something.

This makes it much easier for DD to avoid punches and such.


I see so since DD can predict when Cap is going to throw a punch that means hes going to be able to stop it? It doesn't and thats why Cap is still a better fighter.

Like I asked you as well where did you come to the conclusion that DD has indestructible batons his bio does not say so.

Obviously nothing. Elektra has beaten Wolverine and Daredevil has beaten Elektra. By inference that makes Daredevil one bad mo'fo. Seriously we can't just take one instance where Wolverine makes an offhand remark against established abilities and feats shown by characters

Originally posted by marvelprince
Obviously nothing. Elektra has beaten Wolverine and Daredevil has beaten Elektra. By inference that makes Daredevil one bad mo'fo. Seriously we can't just take one instance where Wolverine makes an offhand remark against established abilities and feats shown by characters

Ok fair enough but what about what DD said? Ahem!!! Where does it say that DD has indestructible batons??

Originally posted by Alfheim
I see so since DD can predict when Cap is going to throw a punch that means hes going to be able to stop it? It doesn't and thats why Cap is still a better fighter.

Nope. Means he can move out of the way or if its too fast he can roll with it to reduce the effectiveness.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Like I asked you as well where did you come to the conclusion that DD has indestructible batons his bio does not say so.

In Bendis and Millar(Frank) interviews

Originally posted by marvelprince
Nope. Means he can move out of the way or if its too fast he can roll with it to reduce the effectiveness.

Well yeah he can do that, but its not like it gievs him a huge advantage is it?


Originally posted by marvelprince

In Bendis and Millar(Frank) interviews

Well when was this, because Marvel.com says different. Oh yes DD also said that Cap was one of the worlds greatest fighters and DD has been beaten by Cap has never beaten Cap, you know what that means.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well yeah he can do that, but its not like it gievs him a huge advantage is it?

Uh, yeah. You mean if you knew exactly where and with how much force a person was gonna strike with plus where their weak spots are you wouldn't have an advantage?


Originally posted by Alfheim
Well when was this, because Marvel.com says different.

A few months back. Think it was in the Wolverine takes on the world segment.

Originally posted by marvelprince
Its like you are not reading anything I post. The senses do not only help with surprise. He can hear quickening of heartbeat, tightening of muscles and pulse acceleration in order to tell if someone is planning a punch or kick or even a feint. It also allows him to pinpoint weak points. Cap's gonna have a hell of time just hitting him

Not going to work on Cap as per Daredevil himself the SSS makes it impossible for him to read Cap that way.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Not going to work on Cap as per Daredevil himself the SSS makes it impossible for him to read Cap that way.

When was this? Scans?

Every fight they have had Cap has been the one on top so Cap takes it 7/10.

Originally posted by marvelprince
When was this? Scans?

It was brought up in a Cap vs DD topic on another board and was verified by a DD fan by the name of Visitor Q who posted the quote, I'd have to pm him for the issue# as I didn't save the thread.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Not going to work on Cap as per Daredevil himself the SSS makes it impossible for him to read Cap that way.

Right thats the end of that.

Ok, the guy pm'd me back, the quote is from Captain America #375.

Though he did mention that DD was able to read him in another encounter so there seems to be some inconsistency.

Done a billion times. And for the last time. Daredevil isnt MORE agile nor faster than Cap, Cap is superior to DD in everyway possible, except for blindness, and blindness only wins fights in who's more blind fights...which this isnt.

He does utilize his agility better. DD has better senses all around, and he has aspects of him that are superior to Cap that others have no problems seeing.

cap is always the best so he takes it 10/10

Originally posted by newavenger13
cap is always the best so he takes it 10/10

i have to disargee with that. caps is strong but not that strong. caps wins it 7/10

cap will take the majority here.. while daredevil MAY have his radar sense cap is still so superior to him in endurance it's not even funny...

and to be quite frank if cap doesn't have a problem hitting spiderman (which he doesn't) hitting daredevil is going to be a trifle... which it HAS been...

and elektra has only been able to beat wolverine when he either 1) was recovering from death and got attacked from behind or 2) fought wolverine while he was in his beastly state... neither show what a capible wolverine would do to her in a head to head..

so the inference on daredevil is worthless...

even taking into account that daredevil has put up showings against wolverine himself...

we have to understand first that the EOTS event, wolverine was brainwashed, wolverine had a mission that didn't have anything to do with daredevil past using him as bait, and he was only stunned by daredevil's blow with the weight.. not beaten.. stunned... and then fell upon a plot device....

the only instance of daredevil taking it to wolverine completely mano y mano is a ennis feat... which I can't even begin to say what's wrong with ennis...

the other time they foguht dd was in a full nelson in 3 panels... so no.. he's not one bad motha.. sorry.

Cap takes the win here

Cap 7-8/10

* i think i tend to vouch on DD for the win...

* and i think Wolverine won't do any better...

Originally posted by jinzin
cap will take the majority here.. while daredevil MAY have his radar sense cap is still so superior to him in endurance it's not even funny...

and to be quite frank if cap doesn't have a problem hitting spiderman (which he doesn't) hitting daredevil is going to be a trifle... which it HAS been...
The thing is, Daredevil has been able to not only tag Spider-Man, but also dodge and roll with his punches. Using that logic, he should be able to avoid Cap's punches much easier.
Originally posted by jinzin
the other time they foguht dd was in a full nelson in 3 panels... so no.. he's not one bad motha.. sorry.
Considering he's been able to do hold his own against Wolverine every time they met, as well as Spider-Man and Captain America, I have to disagree.

Originally posted by Accel
The thing is, Daredevil has been able to not only tag Spider-Man, but also dodge and roll with his punches. Using that logic, he should be able to avoid Cap's punches much easier.
Cap has done the same to Spider-Man and was more impressive doing it.

Daredevil is good but Cap is better than him at just about everything.

Originally posted by Accel
The thing is, Daredevil has been able to not only tag Spider-Man, but also dodge and roll with his punches. Using that logic, he should be able to avoid Cap's punches much easier. spiderman's a meat and potatoes fighter.. by all rights he probably telegraphs every hit.
this is most likely the reason he has SERIOUS issues when stacked up against superior skilled foes without superpowers of any sort...
The REAL thing is, because of spiderman's spider sense daredevil is only able to really consistently punch spiderman through plot devices (for lack of a better term) daredevil can tag and avoid spidey all day when spiderman's too angry to think straight, brainwashed, or sprayed by a special spider-sense killing spray.. sure.. but there are very few times AT ALL where he's been able to land punches on spiderman while avoiding being creamed without help of SOME SORT. Infact there's a moment in amazing spiderman 396 where dd attacks a level headed spidey without any of his usual handicaps (no pun intended) and spiderman makes him look downright foolish.... And before that, in issue 287 spiderman goes at daredevil in a straight up h2h fight and nearly kills him. Daredevil wasn't easily avoiding anything there..

also.. another problem is the fact that spiderman's spider sense is better than dd's radar sense (well arguably at least)..YET spiderman's spider sense is tricked out by captain america's fluid movements... which is most likely another reason for why spiderman has trouble connecting with gifted fighters... he's yet to master the art of fluidity... he goes from hit to hit but no in one fluid move like cap does... you just can't compare the two in h2h combat.. especially when spiderman's claimed on several occasions that his SS isonly an equilizer for the pure skill of guys like iron fist, the cap, and steel dragon.

Originally posted by Accel
Considering he's been able to do hold his own against Wolverine every time they met, as well as Spider-Man and Captain America, I have to disagree. he's been able to hold his own against cap once when cap didn't know what he was up against.. after that? no.. cap has pummbled him...

spiderman=plot device

wolverine= plot device.. or worse... garth ennis...

and no he hasn't been able to hold his own every time they've all met...

again spiderman has humiliated him with ease, wolverine did it in 3 panels, cap has done it in 1 when he stopped holding back...


but I digress.. it was wrong of me to say that dd isn't a bad motha.. he is to be sure.. he's just not on par with guys like cap, wolvie, and spidey.

In born again, DD basically talks about how impressed he is with Caps speed and abilities. I think that Cap will take the majority here, but they won't be a curbstomp. Maybe cap 6/10 or 7/10.

Originally posted by jinzin
spiderman's a meat and potatoes fighter.. by all rights he probably telegraphs every hit.
this is most likely the reason he has SERIOUS issues when stacked up against superior skilled foes without superpowers of any sort...
The REAL thing is, because of spiderman's spider sense daredevil is only able to really consistently punch spiderman through plot devices (for lack of a better term) daredevil can tag and avoid spidey all day when spiderman's too angry to think straight, brainwashed, or sprayed by a special spider-sense killing spray.. sure.. but there are very few times AT ALL where he's been able to land punches on spiderman while avoiding being creamed without help of SOME SORT. Infact there's a moment in amazing spiderman 396 where dd attacks a level headed spidey without any of his usual handicaps (no pun intended) and spiderman makes him look downright foolish.... And before that, in issue 287 spiderman goes at daredevil in a straight up h2h fight and nearly kills him. Daredevil wasn't easily avoiding anything there..

also.. another problem is the fact that spiderman's spider sense is better than dd's radar sense (well arguably at least)..YET spiderman's spider sense is tricked out by captain america's fluid movements... which is most likely another reason for why spiderman has trouble connecting with gifted fighters... he's yet to master the art of fluidity... he goes from hit to hit but no in one fluid move like cap does... you just can't compare the two in h2h combat.. especially when spiderman's claimed on several occasions that his SS isonly an equilizer for the pure skill of guys like iron fist, the cap, and steel dragon.

he's been able to hold his own against cap once when cap didn't know what he was up against.. after that? no.. cap has pummbled him...

spiderman=plot device

wolverine= plot device.. or worse... garth ennis...

and no he hasn't been able to hold his own every time they've all met...

again spiderman has humiliated him with ease, wolverine did it in 3 panels, cap has done it in 1 when he stopped holding back...


but I digress.. it was wrong of me to say that dd isn't a bad motha.. he is to be sure.. he's just not on par with guys like cap, wolvie, and spidey.

Good Post* i agree, I have gained an incredible ammount of respect for DD as of late (mostly due to New Avengers), however

Ide have to give Cap 7/10 on this one.

Originally posted by The Fake Macoy
In born again, DD basically talks about how impressed he is with Caps speed and abilities. I think that Cap will take the majority here, but they won't be a curbstomp. Maybe cap 6/10 or 7/10. yup I definitely don't think it would be a curbstomp.. I mean if daredevil focuses just on his defensive game he could end up being one slippery sumumabitch to get ahold of.. but again.. cap's durability would win out in the end... Originally posted by ExtraMision5555
Good Post* i agree, I have gained an incredible ammount of respect for DD as of late (mostly due to New Avengers), however

Ide have to give Cap 7/10 on this one.
thank you

yeah i like dd a lot too.. I mean the guy is crazy skilled but cap is taking this for surez.

K, Looking it over I'd give Cap a 6/10 win. This is only cause of his endurance though, since this would be a tough fight and would probably last a while.

That Spiderman thing is merely a low showing for Spiderman, there's no reason that he can't clobber these guys without too much trouble (in this forum), DD admitted this himself that he only keeps up because of the senses. Wolverine lasts because of healing.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
That Spiderman thing is merely a low showing for Spiderman, there's no reason that he can't clobber these guys without too much trouble (in this forum), DD admitted this himself that he only keeps up because of the senses. Wolverine lasts because of healing.

Exactly. And even with DD's senses he still gets schooled a lot of time

And that was when he was hypnotized.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Hey man are you looking for a fight?

Well that seemed a bit unnecessary. I'm not trying to make this personal.

But in all honesty, Daredevil should win this fight. He's far more agile (Not taking ANYTHING away from Cap here) as well as probably a bit faster.

Plus, ya know, that whole radar-sense thing going on for DD. He'll be able to easily anticipate his moves, avoid them, or counter them to his liking.

So. Like I said. DD should win.

Will he win in the comics? Hell no.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Well that seemed a bit unnecessary. I'm not trying to make this personal.

But in all honesty, Daredevil should win this fight. He's far more agile (Not taking ANYTHING away from Cap here) as well as probably a bit faster.

Plus, ya know, that whole radar-sense thing going on for DD. He'll be able to easily anticipate his moves, avoid them, or counter them to his liking.

So. Like I said. DD should win.

Will he win in the comics? Hell no.

LOL im only joking. Im pissed but obvously not that pissed. By the way Cap's SSS serum screws up DD's radar sense.

P.S. You think thats uneccesary did you hear what King Kam said about the Storm vs Batman, Robin and Nightwing thread. I hope he's black.

Originally posted by Alfheim
LOL im only joking. Im pissed but obvously not that pissed. By the way Cap's SSS serum screws up DD's radar sense.

P.S. You think thats uneccesary did you hear what King Kam said about the Storm vs Batman, Robin and Nightwing thread. I hope he's black.

The thing with the SSS is debatable. It was only mentioned once and then apparently forgotten in all the other encounters (at least the ones I've seen)

Originally posted by marvelprince
The thing with the SSS is debatable. It was only mentioned once and then apparently forgotten in all the other encounters (at least the ones I've seen)

Oi look....did Cap have the SSS in the other encounters? Yes he did so we can assume that it had the same affect.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Oi look....did Cap have the SSS in the other encounters? Yes he did so we can assume that it had the same affect.

Well how come in the other encounters Daredevil is able anticipate his moves by hearing him tense up etc when thats what the SSS is supposed to prevent?

Originally posted by marvelprince
Well how come in the other encounters Daredevil is able anticipate his moves by hearing him tense up etc when thats what the SSS is supposed to prevent?

Ok fine. Like I said to you before just because he knows what hes going to do does not mean hes going to be able to stop his punches and kicks it will help but that alone wont be enough.

Wolverine stated the cap is one of the greatest fighters in the world did not mention Matt and we have just proved that the fights that Wolverine had with DD and Elecktra were not fair.

Cap is stronger not by a great deal but still stronger
Cap has more stamina probably quite a bit more
Cap is more durable not by a great deal but still has more durability
Cap has more experience and even if you dont think he can beat Spidey he can fool his spider sense so why cant he work against DDs sense
They both indestructible weapons
DD is slightly more agile.

but DD wins because of his radar sense........

Furthermore DD may know that Cap's going to punch but does he know where Cap's going to aim?

Originally posted by marvelprince
K, Looking it over I'd give Cap a 6/10 win. This is only cause of his endurance though, since this would be a tough fight and would probably last a while.

Didn't see this.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Furthermore DD may know that Cap's going to punch but does he know where Cap's going to aim?

Yes

Originally posted by marvelprince
Yes


Anyway like I said just because he knows its coming doesnt mean he will be able to stop it, like I said Cap has been able to fool Spiderman's sense


Originally posted by jinzin
cap will take the majority here.. while daredevil MAY have his radar and to be quite frank if cap doesn't have a problem hitting spiderman (which he doesn't) hitting daredevil is going to be a trifle... which it HAS been...

and elektra has only been able to beat wolverine when he either 1) was recovering from death and got attacked from behind or 2) fought wolverine while he was in his beastly state... neither show what a capible wolverine would do to her in a head to head..

so the inference on daredevil is worthless...

even taking into account that daredevil has put up showings against wolverine himself...

we have to understand first that the EOTS event, wolverine was brainwashed, wolverine had a mission that didn't have anything to do with daredevil past using him as bait, and he was only stunned by daredevil's blow with the weight.. not beaten.. stunned... and then fell upon a plot device....

the only instance of daredevil taking it to wolverine completely mano y mano is a ennis feat... which I can't even begin to say what's wrong with ennis...

the other time they foguht dd was in a full nelson in 3 panels... so no.. he's not one bad motha.. sorry.

Sorry he has his radar sense but it just aint good enough.

Originally posted by Alfheim
LOL im only joking. Im pissed but obvously not that pissed. By the way Cap's SSS serum screws up DD's radar sense.

P.S. You think thats uneccesary did you hear what King Kam said about the Storm vs Batman, Robin and Nightwing thread. I hope he's black.
Yes. Yes he is. KK posted his pic in the member pictures thread.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Furthermore DD may know that Cap's going to punch but does he know where Cap's going to aim?
He's able to tell where guys with guns are aiming so a punch should be simple in comparison.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Anyway like I said just because he knows its coming doesnt mean he will be able to stop it, like I said Cap has been able to fool Spiderman's sense




Sorry he has his radar sense but it just aint good enough.
DD's senses seem to outdo Spidey's spider-sense every time they get together.

Originally posted by Accel
Yes. Yes he is. KK posted his pic in the member pictures thread.

He's able to tell where guys with guns are aiming so a punch should be simple in comparison.

So you mean to say that Cap cant figure a way of beating it or making it diffiuclt for him.

Originally posted by Alfheim
So you mean to say that Cap cant figure a way of beating it or making it diffiuclt for him.
Depends. DD's ability to predict every punch combined with the fact that he's faster anmake Cap at least have a REALLY difficult time laying a hand on him.

Originally posted by Accel
Yes. Yes he is. KK posted his pic in the member pictures thread.



That would explain it I thought what he said was ****ing hilarious;

Originally posted by Accel
DD's senses seem to outdo Spidey's spider-sense every time they get together.

So does that enable him to beat the crap out of him...no. Because what you fail to understand is this they are just senses, his senses do not give him the speed of flash. He may know that a punch is coming but he may not be able to stop it and also one way of beating his senses are to do combinations he may be able to stop one punch but a combination of moves is another thing.

Originally posted by Accel
Depends. DD's ability to predict every punch combined with the fact that he's faster anmake Cap at least have a REALLY difficult time laying a hand on him.

Yeah every punch but he will have trouble stoping combinations because he may know that they are coming but DD's reflexes are only sligthly better than Cap's. DD is not the Flash!

Originally posted by Alfheim
So does that enable him to beat the crap out of him...no. Because what you fail to understand is this they are just senses, his senses do not give him the speed of flash. He may know that a punch is coming but he may not be able to stop it and also one way of beating his senses are to do combinations he may be able to stop one punch but a combination of moves is another thing.
He doesn't need Flash-like speed. He just needs the ability to predict every move Cap is about to make (which he has) and superior agility to dodge those moves (which he also has). If DD can roll with punches thrown by Spider-Man, Cap's punches won't be a problem.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah every punch but he will have trouble stoping combinations because he may know that they are coming but DD's reflexes are only sligthly better than Cap's. DD is not the Flash!
Refer to response above.

Originally posted by Accel
If DD can roll with punches thrown by Spider-Man, Cap's punches won't be a problem.

Refer to response above.

Thats not true did you see what Cap did to Spiderman? Cap is a far greater fighter than Spiderman and sometimes that makes up for reflexes, thats why Cap can fight spiderman for a bit.

Thats also why even the Punisher was able to hit DD a couple of times, sure he got his *** kicked but because hes such a good fighter he was able to tag DD while other normal people would not.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Thats not true did you see what Cap did to Spiderman? Cap is a far greater fighter than Spiderman and sometimes that makes up for reflexes, thats why Cap can fight spiderman for a bit.

Thats also why even the Punisher was able to hit DD a couple of times, sure he got his *** kicked but because hes such a good fighter he was able to tag DD while other normal people would not.
Even if DD gets tagged, as I just said, he can still roll with the punches for minimal damage.

Originally posted by Accel
Even if DD gets tagged, as I just said, he can still roll with the punches for minimal damage.

Yes I know and vice verse, but the point is Cap is a far greater fighther than Spiderman so it will be alot harder to do.

Stick can beat DD but I bet he can sense his heartbeat and evrything (maybe) but he will lose bigtime, cos stick is a better fighter.

Oh yeah DD's senses didnt help him against wolverine and Cap is probably a better fighter.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes I know and vice verse, but the point is Cap is a far greater fighther than Spiderman so it will be alot harder to do.
I'd find it harder to dodge the guy with far superior speed and agility. DD can sense both their movements so it then becomes a matter of using his own agility to dodge it.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Stick can beat DD but I bet he can sense his heartbeat and evrything (maybe) but he will lose bigtime, cos stick is a better fighter.
That doesn't mean any thing. Cap would also have difficulties with Stick and he doesn't possess Stick's abilities.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Oh yeah DD's senses didnt help him against wolverine and Cap is probably a better fighter.
They did help him against Iron Fist, Bullseye, Spider-Man, and Sabretooth.

Originally posted by Accel
They did help him against Iron Fist, Bullseye, Spider-Man, and Sabretooth.

Those guys rely on their powers and physical abilities More than H2H skill. And the opposite is true about Cap.

Originally posted by thedude1948
Those guys rely on their powers and physical abilities More than H2H skill. And the opposite is true about Cap.
You think Iron Fist and Bullseye rely more on their powers than martial arts?

Originally posted by Accel
I'd find it harder to dodge the guy with far superior speed and agility. DD can sense both their movements so it then becomes a matter of using his own agility to dodge it.

Were not talking about. Skill can compensate for speed, like I said Punisher is much slower than DD but was still able to tag him a couple of times. The Punisher has even punked Nightcrawler. Cap is slower than Spiderman but cos his fighting skills are so good he can tag Spiderman loads of times up close. In fact Cap is so good that Spdierman has said that he cannot take him in H2H, therefore DD would have more trouble with Cap...do the math.

Originally posted by Accel

That doesn't mean any thing. Cap would also have difficulties with Stick and he doesn't possess Stick's abilities.


Yes it does , the point is that Sticlk is such a good fighteer that DD'senses wont be enough

Originally posted by Accel

They did help him against Iron Fist, Bullseye, Spider-Man, and Sabretooth.

Ok...but they didnt help him against Wolverine and Cap is probably a better fighter than him and all of the above.

Originally posted by Accel
You think Iron Fist and Bullseye rely more on their powers than martial arts?

More than cap does yes. Iron Fist relies on his "Iron Fist", Bullseye on his perfect aim.

Originally posted by Alfheim
LOL im only joking. Im pissed but obvously not that pissed. By the way Cap's SSS serum screws up DD's radar sense.

P.S. You think thats uneccesary did you hear what King Kam said about the Storm vs Batman, Robin and Nightwing thread. I hope he's black.

...Wait...what?

How in the hell could Cap's Super Soldier Serum even begin to negate or screw up DD's radar sense?! That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Even for a comic book.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok fine. Like I said to you before just because he knows what hes going to do does not mean hes going to be able to stop his punches and kicks it will help but that alone wont be enough.

Wolverine stated the cap is one of the greatest fighters in the world did not mention Matt and we have just proved that the fights that Wolverine had with DD and Elecktra were not fair.

Cap is stronger not by a great deal but still stronger
Cap has more stamina probably quite a bit more
Cap is more durable not by a great deal but still has more durability
Cap has more experience and even if you dont think he can beat Spidey he can fool his spider sense so why cant he work against DDs sense
They both indestructible weapons
DD is slightly more agile.

but DD wins because of his radar sense........

DD is debately a better fighter/more skilled martial artist than Cap.

And yea, knowing what Cap will do will pretty much save DD of any harm. He's easily fast enough to avoid Cap's attacks when coupled with his radar sense.

Originally posted by Alfheim
That would explain it I thought what he said was ****ing hilarious;



So does that enable him to beat the crap out of him...no. Because what you fail to understand is this they are just senses, his senses do not give him the speed of flash. He may know that a punch is coming but he may not be able to stop it and also one way of beating his senses are to do combinations he may be able to stop one punch but a combination of moves is another thing.

He doesn't need the speed of Flash. He just needs his superior speed and agility, his super-enhanced reflexes, and his radar sense.

And he has all of those.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
DD is debately a better fighter/more skilled martial artist than Cap.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Were not talking about. Skill can compensate for speed, like I said Punisher is much slower than DD but was still able to tag him a couple of times. The Punisher has even punked Nightcrawler. Cap is slower than Spiderman but cos his fighting skills are so good he can tag Spiderman loads of times up close. In fact Cap is so good that Spdierman has said that he cannot take him in H2H, therefore DD would have more trouble with Cap...do the math.
And DD can roll with any punches that connect just fine. Whether they hit or not, the damage will be minimal.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes it does , the point is that Sticlk is such a good fighteer that DD'senses wont be enough
Stick has the same abilities DD does. Cap doesn't. Cap isn't Stick. Not to mention Cap would also have his problems in a fight against Stick. Saying Daredevil has problems with Stick means he would lose to Cap is flawed logic.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok...but they didnt help him against Wolverine and Cap is probably a better fighter than him and all of the above.
He did fine against Logan in one confrontation. It can be accused of Ennis bias, but it still happened.

Originally posted by thedude1948
More than cap does yes. Iron Fist relies on his "Iron Fist", Bullseye on his perfect aim.
Iron Fist doesn't go around powering up his fist in every single fight, as it drains him afterwards. He DID learn a thing or two living in K'un Lun. Then there's the fact that he's managed to hold his own against Cap on one occasion.

Bullseye has managed to hold his own against the best, including Deadpool, Cap, Elektra, etc.

Saying these guys aren't as skill because they have other abilities is like saying Cap doesn't rely too much on H2H due to the SSS.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
DD is debately a better fighter/more skilled martial artist than Cap.

And yea, knowing what Cap will do will pretty much save DD of any harm. He's easily fast enough to avoid Cap's attacks when coupled with his radar sense.


Oh.....my.....God... Well its like this

1.Cap's bio says he is one of the greatet fighters on the planet DD's bio does not

2. Wolverine mentioned a list of fighters and Cap came top on the list. Matt was not mentioned.

3. In a proper fight Wolverine beat DD.


Originally posted by Metalmanx
He doesn't need the speed of Flash. He just needs his superior speed and agility, his super-enhanced reflexes, and his radar sense.

And he has all of those.

Er excuse me DD is only sligthly more agile than Cap and thats the same in reflexes. Like I said Cap can beat Spiderman's sense he can give DD a problem and just because he knows its coming doesnt mean he will be able to stop it.



Originally posted by Accel
And DD can roll with any punches that connect just fine. Whether they hit or not, the damage will be minimal.

You missed the point Cap slays Spiderman in H2H. Spiderman has to use his webbings. Therefore DD who cannot force Spiderman to use his webbing is going to have a tough time with Cap radar or not.

Originally posted by Accel

Stick has the same abilities DD does. Cap doesn't. Cap isn't Stick. Not to mention Cap would also have his problems in a fight against Stick. Saying Daredevil has problems with Stick means he would lose to Cap is flawed logic.

Originally posted by Accel

He did fine against Logan in one confrontation. It can be accused of Ennis bias, but it still happened.

Thats absolute nonsense. Dont look at the fact that it happened, look at WHY it happened. Wolverine was at great disadvantage it does not count.

Ok lets put it this way cap's bio

Captain America is one of the finest human combatants Earth has ever known.

Shang Chi's bio


Shang-Chi is one of the world's most adept combatants, trained in all known martial arts.

DD's bio

Daredevil is a master of a unique martial art form, which is a hybridized form of American boxing and the Japanese arts of ninjutsu, judo and aiki-jujutsu.

Yes DD is a master of his style but if he was one of the best in the world they probably would have put it down.

As I have mentioned before Wolverine listed some fighters and put Cap at the top. DD is not mentioned, he is good but not one of the best.

DD is not such a good fighter he has to make Spiderman resort to hanging back and using his webbing.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Apparently he was mind controlled. Ok good points but I have never seen DD mentioned anywhere as being one of the best in the world.
He used his standard hack n' slash method. Considering that's his typical style, mind-controlled or not, I doubt his MA abilities were affected THAT much.

Originally posted by Accel
He used his standard hack n' slash method. Considering that's his typical style, mind-controlled or not, I doubt his MA abilities were affected THAT much.

Well I dunno. Anyway ive been loking at you're DD respect thread. Yeah DD is one of my fav characters I forgot what a badass he is.

Gotta take my hat off, that really was a RESPECT thread.

I appreciate the recognition, but jrodslam contributed most of the scans, including that one with DD taking down Wolverine. Without his help, the thread would have just been some fights between DD and Spider-Man.

Ok, people are makeing some outstanding points for Daredevil, but one thing

Lets be honest, Spiderman is definately not one of the greatest fighters, rather he relies on his acrobatics and OTHER powers (strength, webbing, and now alot of his new 'gadgets) to get by in fights. Which is still formitable, but i think it is a bit inaccurate to use a daredevil vs spiderman fight in contrast to one with Cap in regards to martial prowress. Perhaps only to analize his agility and ability to overcome a disadvantage be it spiderman having spidersense, but nothing else.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Oh.....my.....God... Well its like this

1.Cap's bio says he is one of the greatet fighters on the planet DD's bio does not

2. Wolverine mentioned a list of fighters and Cap came top on the list. Matt was not mentioned.

3. In a proper fight Wolverine beat DD.




Er excuse me DD is only sligthly more agile than Cap and thats the same in reflexes. Like I said Cap can beat Spiderman's sense he can give DD a problem and just because he knows its coming doesnt mean he will be able to stop it.





You missed the point Cap slays Spiderman in H2H. Spiderman has to use his webbings. Therefore DD who cannot force Spiderman to use his webbing is going to have a tough time with Cap radar or not.





Thats absolute nonsense. Dont look at the fact that it happened, look at WHY it happened. Wolverine was at great disadvantage it does not count.

My God, man.

Read a comic. Stop relying on "bios". Read a damn comic.

I don't care what the bios say, what Wolverine of all people says, nor your opinion on Wolverine vs. DD (since it's off-topic anyway, no offense).

I stick by what I said. DD is arguably a better fighter/more skilled martial artist than Cap.

And he is more agile. And basically has an early-warning system. And has enhanced reflexes. If anything, slightly better or at the LEAST, equivalent to Cap's. But, since he knows what'll happen beforehand, he moves BEFORE Cap. Thus, giving him an advantage.

Evidence?

-He batted away a God-Dammned bullet with his billy club.
-He caught a lethal card that was meant for Elektra's throat. Or order to kill, that card had to be going fast. And it was all in one panel, too. Elektra didn't even know it was coming. They were relaxing at the time.

Why do people keep saying "Cap beat Spidey's spider-sense"? Am I the only sane one around here?

First, Spidey underestimataed Cap's fighting and tactical skills. In no way or fashion did Cap "Negate" or even come close to "beating" his Spider-sense. Spidey was caught a bit unawares, having not really fought Cap before the way they were fighting (I know they fought before, but this was different, they both knew what had to happen).

Originally posted by Metalmanx

Why do people keep saying "Cap beat Spidey's spider-sense"? Am I the only sane one around here?

First, Spidey underestimataed Cap's fighting and tactical skills. In no way or fashion did Cap "Negate" or even come close to "beating" his Spider-sense. Spidey was caught a bit unawares, having not really fought Cap before the way they were fighting (I know they fought before, but this was different, they both knew what had to happen).

Good points in the first part of your post, im not going to argue that

However, I would have to disagree with that last part. Perhaps "beat" isint the proper word, but Cap did infact get around Spidermans spidersense

So:
http://x2a.xanga.com/a6ca853bc063576674433/m51886778.jpg
(And thereafter, spiderman was punched)

Judgeing by this scan, Spiderman admitted he was unable to completely avoid all of Captain americas assault due to the 'watery' method he was using. You could say it was as if he was able to perdict the initial movement, but once it got going it was sort of like spiderman was caught up in one long move and innevitabely his body was not going to be able to contort in a way that would allow him to dodge, as seen in the following panel. Which did infact force him to re-think his plan. Spiderman even admitted he could not keep the fight close or else he would be defeated

So IF we were to use this as a compairison to DD's radar sense, you could assume that Captain amercia may be able to 'get around' it as well, ALTHOUGH, DD is a FARRRRRRR better fighter than spiderman point being DD not only can naturally dodge, but has a sort of 'boost' that enables him to dodge more effectively than spiderman in a martial situation.

Originally posted by ExtraMision5555
Good points in the first part of your post, im not going to argue that

However, I would have to disagree with that last part. Perhaps "beat" isint the proper word, but Cap did infact get around Spidermans spidersense

So:
http://x2a.xanga.com/a6ca853bc063576674433/m51886778.jpg
(And thereafter, spiderman was punched)

Judgeing by this scan, Spiderman admitted he was unable to completely avoid all of Captain americas assault due to the 'watery' method he was using. You could say it was as if he was able to perdict the initial movement, but once it got going it was sort of like spiderman was caught up in one long move and innevitabely his body was not going to be able to contort in a way that would allow him to dodge, as seen in the following panel. Which did infact force him to re-think his plan. Spiderman even admitted he could not keep the fight close or else he would be defeated

So IF we were to use this as a compairison to DD's radar sense, you could assume that Captain amercia may be able to 'get around' it as well, ALTHOUGH, DD is a FARRRRRRR better fighter than spiderman point being DD not only can naturally dodge, but has a sort of 'boost' that enables him to dodge more effectively than spiderman in a martial situation.

I agree very much with the last part of your post.

See, my problem is that I'm still very much up-in-arms about that comic in the first place. Cap's superior fighting ability or not, Spidey has ALWAYS been able to sense and dodge MUCH FASTER THINGS/MORE THINGS/MORE FASTER THINGS. Spidey was retarding himself basically. Had he wanted to, considering all the NUMEROUS feats proving so, he could've ended the fight pretty much as quickly as he wanted.

So, yes. I know it happened. But does it make sense? No, not at all.

Now, if Spidey didn't have this extensive history of being the #1 dodger in comics...then yes, it would make A LOT more sense.

That being said, I think DD takes this 6/10.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I agree very much with the last part of your post.

See, my problem is that I'm still very much up-in-arms about that comic in the first place. Cap's superior fighting ability or not, Spidey has ALWAYS been able to sense and dodge MUCH FASTER THINGS/MORE THINGS/MORE FASTER THINGS. Spidey was retarding himself basically. Had he wanted to, considering all the NUMEROUS feats proving so, he could've ended the fight pretty much as quickly as he wanted.

So, yes. I know it happened. But does it make sense? No, not at all.

Now, if Spidey didn't have this extensive history of being the #1 dodger in comics...then yes, it would make A LOT more sense.

That being said, I think DD takes this 6/10.

Yes i agree, thier was a little bit of PIS in that section & i mean, its CAP, and going with the story i know they werent about to have cap get his anus beaten. In contrast with all of spideramans feats, i agree you could say theoreticly he should have been able to dodge that. Anyways, with taht said yes, I would actually say DD has a much better chance of dodgeing cap that perhaps spiderman, and the more i think about it, This may actually be in favor of daredevil

Agreed. DD takes the SLIGHT majority here.

infact, i may be overstepping myself a bit but you could perhaps DD may be what spiderman would be like (agility wise) if he decided to do some intense martial arts training. perhaps

Yeah, DD 6/10.

Cap wins.

Originally posted by ExtraMision5555
infact, i may be overstepping myself a bit but you could perhaps DD may be what spiderman would be like (agility wise) if he decided to do some intense martial arts training. perhaps

Are you saying DD is more agile than Spiderman?

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Are you saying DD is more agile than Spiderman?
Get him Dinal, get him!

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Are you saying DD is more agile than Spiderman?


Lol



I think you read it a bit out of context

which is why i tried to say "i may be overstepping myself"

perhaps i did, but in context with the rest of my posts, you would understand what i ment

or rather, was trying to illustrate

Originally posted by Validus
Get him Dinal, get him!

Innocent until proven guilty. But if he's guilty......

Originally posted by ExtraMision5555
Lol



I think you read it a bit out of context

which is why i tried to say "i may be overstepping myself"

perhaps i did, but in context with the rest of my posts, you would understand what i ment

or rather, was trying to illustrate

I know, but I got so raving mad pissed when I saw the "agilty wise", I couldn't stop myself

Originally posted by Dinalfos
I know, but I got so raving mad pissed when I saw the "agilty wise", I couldn't stop myself



but the eye of cyttorax makes daerdvl the most agaile more agi than even spiderman it boost him to i think 82 agiliaty + 31 wisdem too

prepare yourselves for jinzin's wrath is almost at hand....

soon. very soon...

the super-multi-battle-posts shall begin.... shifty

i think this is a good deabte for either side. ide like to see some more on cap's beahlf here. nappytime*** i hope thiers more posts later


nappynappynappykittykatsex

Well offhand I remember cap going 2 or 3 times with spiderman and holding his own...

I remember DD freaking out about how much better spiderman is...

I'd say Cap wins 5.5/10... a small majority.

Originally posted by Accel
Iron Fist doesn't go around powering up his fist in every single fight, as it drains him afterwards. He DID learn a thing or two living in K'un Lun. Then there's the fact that he's managed to hold his own against Cap on one occasion.

Bullseye has managed to hold his own against the best, including Deadpool, Cap, Elektra, etc.

Saying these guys aren't as skill because they have other abilities is like saying Cap doesn't rely too much on H2H due to the SSS. Thank you, I understand these people are skilled martial artists, but I hate when people neglect that almost none of them are just normal guys... they all have something extra.

Originally posted by ExtraMision5555
Yes i agree, thier was a little bit of PIS in that section & i mean, its CAP, and going with the story i know they werent about to have cap get his anus beaten. In contrast with all of spideramans feats, i agree you could say theoreticly he should have been able to dodge that. Anyways, with taht said yes, I would actually say DD has a much better chance of dodgeing cap that perhaps spiderman, and the more i think about it, This may actually be in favor of daredevil That's why they're called crossovers. I just read that match again today, people don't realize it's entertainment first. It's not meant to be an uber deathmatch, but to have a point and theme. No way was Spiderman going to kill Cap and move on, hell, that would be the end of the Civil War and he wouldn't be able to change sides later.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
That's why they're called crossovers. I just read that match again today, people don't realize it's entertainment first. It's not meant to be an uber deathmatch, but to have a point and theme. No way was Spiderman going to kill Cap and move on, hell, that would be the end of the Civil War and he wouldn't be able to change sides later.

yeah, if it werent like that nothing would sell. but even still, i do feel thier was a bit of logic in thier fight, and changed sides later?? lol wtf? spoiler !

This is a tough fight for either.

Daredevil has a special Radar with enhanced senses that he uses to hear when is someone going to attack before they do. Plus with his mystical ninja training from Stick and advanced pressure point fighting. Make him one tough mother.

Captain America is enhanced to the peak of human potential. He's a Super-Soilder who's one of the best hand to hand combatants on earth. Enhanced reflexes, speed, strength, down to his mind.

I'll probably go with Cap 6/10.

Originally posted by ExtraMision5555
yeah, if it werent like that nothing would sell. but even still, i do feel thier was a bit of logic in thier fight, and changed sides later?? lol wtf? spoiler ! The fight wasn't horrible, it just seemed to me that Spiderman was too intimidated to really go all out...he just kinda waded in the water knowing "it was Cap".

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
The fight wasn't horrible, it just seemed to me that Spiderman was too intimidated to really go all out...he just kinda waded in the water knowing "it was Cap".

yezzir

i thought it was a good comic

Originally posted by jinzin
prepare yourselves for jinzin's wrath is almost at hand....

soon. very soon...

the super-multi-battle-posts shall begin.... shifty

Im staying out of this one

Captain America is constantly facing threats like the hulk and Super beings superman lvl. He always seems to some how manage. I don't like how Iron man beat his ass in CW 3. But other than that, Cap America can beat DD. He's stronger and as faster. And he has that handy shield. One crack on that bad boy and DD is going to have broken Knuckels.

Cap holds his own because of his shield which absorbs impact against the likes of Hulk/Namor. But he really has never beat them, just stuns them and barely hurts them, which is still crazy impressive if you think about it.

Although I agree Cap is stronger and probably faster then Dardevil.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Captain America is constantly facing threats like the hulk and Super beings superman lvl. He always seems to some how manage. I don't like how Iron man beat his ass in CW 3. But other than that, Cap America can beat DD. He's stronger and as faster. And he has that handy shield. One crack on that bad boy and DD is going to have broken Knuckels.

The hell? Is Daredevil retarded now? Why would he, Daredevil, one of the best martial artists around, knowingly (or hell, even unknowlingly) punch Cap's shield? He'd have plenty of time to stop his fist if the shield was in the way.

And I'd say DD might be just a tad faster, too.

Anyway, I digress from my main point.

DD wins 6/10. By no means is this an easy fight.

Cap is stronger but certainly not faster or as fast. He's not as agile, either.

DD knows more styles of MA, but cap knows his judo/boxer style so good it's stupid.

It could go either way.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Anyway like I said just because he knows its coming doesnt mean he will be able to stop it, like I said Cap has been able to fool Spiderman's sense

Cap being able to fool Spider-Man's spider-sense really doesn't mean anything. DD's radar sense doesn't work the same way, besides DD has also fooled Spider-Man's spider-sense. And the whole skill argument doesn't really hold water here. You say Cap's skill make up lack of speed. Only works if the opponent he faces has no skills. You can use that Spider-Man example all you want but point is Spider-Man was not at full potential and he has punked Cap before so we know he can take him. Wolverine didn't mention his name in greatest martial artists? I wasn't aware what Wolverine said was law these days. Did Wolverine mention Stick or the Cat by any chance? I hope he at least mentioned Iron Fist in there.


Originally posted by Alfheim
Sorry he has his radar sense but it just aint good enough.

Its already been proven to be good enough

Cap owns daredevil and sends his blind ass to hell.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Were not talking about. Skill can compensate for speed, like I said Punisher is much slower than DD but was still able to tag him a couple of times. The Punisher has even punked Nightcrawler. Cap is slower than Spiderman but cos his fighting skills are so good he can tag Spiderman loads of times up close. In fact Cap is so good that Spdierman has said that he cannot take him in H2H, therefore DD would have more trouble with Cap...do the math.

Sure Punisher can touch him, he's a good fighter. Lets not act like he is. But I hope you read the Daredevil arc we he became kingpin and he took down Frank like he was an 11 yr old schoolgirl. All in the senses. Cap can tag SPider-Man loads of times up close? Maybe he can do it against a Spider-Man whose holding back, worships him and doubts he's made the right decision about what side he's on but against a Spider-man thats really trying. And how conveniently you forget Cap only landed one punch against Spider-Man in the background of CW 3 even though Spider-Man was taking on multiple opponents. Your math is also wrong. DD has fought Spider-Man before and Spider-Man has made the same remark about his skills ans senses making up for his powers yet later we see Spider-Man embarras him. By your math since Spider-Man says both of them can take him cause of their skills yet he's punked both of them shouldn't they be around the same level?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes it does , the point is that Sticlk is such a good fighter that DD'senses wont be enough

No, point is even though DD isn't the greatest in pure fighting his senses more than make up

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok...but they didnt help him against Wolverine and Cap is probably a better fighter than him and all of the above.

Actually they did help against Wolverine. He didn't beat Wolverine in enemy of the state but he did hold his own. Wolverine did have in a full nelson in one issue but he also beat Cap in Origins a while ago. Flawed logic on your part

Originally posted by marvelprince
And how conveniently you forget Cap only landed one punch against Spider-Man in the background of CW 3 even though Spider-Man was taking on multiple opponents.

I didn't coneniently forget anything if anything thats what you do im still reeling from that "apparently human intelligence is unlimited" from spidey vs cap thread. I can give you several other examples that negate that example but I cant be bothered.

Originally posted by marvelprince

Your math is also wrong. DD has fought Spider-Man before and Spider-Man has made the same remark about his skills ans senses making up for his powers yet later we see Spider-Man embarras him. By your math since Spider-Man says both of them can take him cause of their skills yet he's punked both of them shouldn't they be around the same level?


I think they are but Cap is slightly better. I looked at the DD respect thread very impressive.


Originally posted by marvelprince

No, point is even though DD isn't the greatest in pure fighting his senses more than make up


You could say that.

Originally posted by marvelprince

Actually they did help against Wolverine. He didn't beat Wolverine in enemy of the state but he did hold his own. Wolverine did have in a full nelson in one issue but he also beat Cap in Origins a while ago. Flawed logic on your part

To tell you the truth I would not have a problem with DD being a better martial artist than Wolverine, Wolverine gets on my nerves. I dont know how the **** he gets a fighting skill of 7. 200 years old my *** he still sux.

Well obvously you have read more comics than me, but the problem with pulling examples they always seem to contradict each other. I had a look at the DD thread and I can see where you coming from, Cap may still be a better fighter because he does seem to come up against tougher opponents, that is probably why DD was not in Secret Wars. There is an example of DD fighting Mr Hyde and DD takes him down, but the way Cap does it is more final.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
The hell? Is Daredevil retarded now? Why would he, Daredevil, one of the best martial artists around, knowingly (or hell, even unknowlingly) punch Cap's shield? He'd have plenty of time to stop his fist if the shield was in the way.

And I'd say DD might be just a tad faster, too.

Anyway, I digress from my main point.

DD wins 6/10. By no means is this an easy fight.

DD has punched Cap's shield before. Its not that DD is stupid its that Cap is good enough to do that to him.

Originally posted by Alfheim
I didn't coneniently forget anything if anything thats what you do im still reeling from that "apparently human intelligence is unlimited" from spidey vs cap thread. I can give you several other examples that negate that example but I cant be bothered.

Its still not a hard concept to grasp. In the MU the bar for human potential is set higher than in the real world. So it makes sense the way Tony, Doom and Reed are so much smarter than the other folk. Remember in the MU ordinary persons can build rocket skateboards and make suits that let them climb walls etc.

Originally posted by Alfheim
I think they are but Cap is slightly better. I looked at the DD respect thread very impressive.

I don't dispute that. In most physical aspects Cap is superior to Matt



Originally posted by Alfheim
To tell you the truth I would not have a problem with DD being a better martial artist than Wolverine, Wolverine gets on my nerves. I dont know how the **** he gets a fighting skill of 7. 200 years old my *** he still sux.

Agreed.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well obvously you have read more comics than me, but the problem with pulling examples they always seem to contradict each other. I had a look at the DD thread and I can see where you coming from, Cap may still be a better fighter because he does seem to come up against tougher opponents, that is probably why DD was not in Secret Wars. There is an example of DD fighting Mr Hyde and DD takes him down, but the way Cap does it is more final.

This is my point. We can't just take what characters say at face value. At practically every point in a characters history they're guarunteed at some point to say "I'm no match for (insert name here)" but then later beat said person in a fight. Couple that with the fact that when they actually do fight the fights are almost always inconclusive and their usually is some outside influences affecting ones performance. This is why we have to try and look at every in general and decide for ourselves how things are gonna happen. Its where the fun is.

And DD was in Bendis's Secret War (I know this isn't the one you meant but I felt I should plug it since it was great read)

Originally posted by Alfheim
DD has punched Cap's shield before. Its not that DD is stupid its that Cap is good enough to do that to him.

Agree here too, to an extent. DD goes for the punch and Cap can block. DD doesn't land all of his hits but he's certainly not gonna be punching shield most of the fight

Captain America more experience and superior fighting ability

Originally posted by Accel
He's able to tell where guys with guns are aiming so a punch should be simple in comparison. bullets when fired only go in one direction.. cap doesn't move in a straight line.... why would he be easier to determine?

Originally posted by jinzin
bullets when fired only go in one direction.. cap doesn't move in a straight line.... why would he be easier to determine?

* so, Cap's punch is more difficult to dodge or parry than a speeding bullet fired?

this is a very iffy fight. DD could be seen as winning because he has radar sense, and thus should be able to dodge all punchez n take on any street-leveler, but the Cap has enhanced reflexes, not to mention far superiority in strength, fighting skill and stamina. so caps punchez would be hittin alot harder. i say DD wears down while Caps barely even breakin a sweat, and eventually just drops em.

Originally posted by jinzin
bullets when fired only go in one direction.. cap doesn't move in a straight line.... why would he be easier to determine?

very sound point

Originally posted by peejayd
* so, Cap's punch is more difficult to dodge or parry than a speeding bullet fired? It's some kind of MA logic... they're so trained it makes them superbulletpowered guys or something that run 100 miles an hour and jump 50 ft high (not that this is all coming from jinzin).

In comics it probably is but thats beside the point, if you think about. Daredevil has swatted away bullets easily and dodged bullets easily. But then again Cap has feats like that as well just as much of dodging bullets without the aid of his shield. To even dodging lots of energy beams.


Does this mean Dardevil isn't going to touch Cap, since Cap can dodge beams? Of course not. Daredevil will be hitting him, but Cap probably takes a small majority like 6/10 thanks to the SSS.

Originally posted by braz
this is a very iffy fight. DD could be seen as winning because he has radar sense, and thus should be able to dodge all punchez n take on any street-leveler, but the Cap has enhanced reflexes, not to mention far superiority in strength, fighting skill and stamina. so caps punchez would be hittin alot harder. i say DD wears down while Caps barely even breakin a sweat, and eventually just drops em.

Again. DD is arguably a superior martial artist to Cap.

Cap is an all-around better fighter, only because of his shield AND SSS really.

DD wins 6/10.

Actually DD has stated Cap is one of earths best fighters. Even Zaran has stated Cap is a even greater fighter then Shang-Chi. Now in pressure point fighting I'd say DD is better. But in hand to hand Cap is just as good or even better.

Originally posted by marvelprince
Its still not a hard concept to grasp. In the MU the bar for human potential is set higher than in the real world. So it makes sense the way Tony, Doom and Reed are so much smarter than the other folk. Remember in the MU ordinary persons can build rocket skateboards and make suits that let them climb walls etc.

Well ok, but if you remember what I said. I said who is more intelligent The Leader or Dr Doom? To be quite honest with you alot of people without thinking would probably say Dr Doom. That shouldn't really happen but people take it for granted that Dr Doom is that smart. I just feel if there was not a Spidey vs Cap thread you would have probably said the same thing.


Originally posted by Daredevil1
Actually DD has stated Cap is one of earths best fighters.

Yeah and you would think if he was better he would have mentioned it.

Originally posted by peejayd
* so, Cap's punch is more difficult to dodge or parry than a speeding bullet fired?
yes... daredevil can feel the muscles of the finger tightening on the trigger before the bullet is fired.. once fired dd already knows the beginning and ending path of the bullet, he know what line he needs not to be at in order to avoid being hit.. with cap though, cap will keep compensating for missed hits move after move after move.... cap can lead a target AFTER he launches an attack.. bullets can't.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Again. DD is arguably a superior martial artist to Cap.

Cap is an all-around better fighter, only because of his shield AND SSS really.

DD wins 6/10.


wtf..?? no hes not..just look at their bios theres proof everywhere
Captain America's fighting skills-7 out of 7
Daredevils- 5 out of 7

im not saying DD sucks, its just that. Caps like the best h2h combatant in marvel comics, and has proved to do some amazing feats.

Originally posted by braz
wtf..?? no hes not..just look at their bios theres proof everywhere
Captain America's fighting skills-7 out of 7
Daredevils- 5 out of 7

im not saying DD sucks, its just that. Caps like the best h2h combatant in marvel comics, and has proved to do some amazing feats.

Read what I wrote there, man.

DD is a better martial artist.

Cap is an all-around better fighter due mostly to his superhuman enhancements, shield, and his training.

Originally posted by Metalmanx


Cap is an all-around better fighter due mostly to his superhuman enhancements, shield, and his training.

and thats y he wins

The bio rating says that 5 is a master of one style, and each level above is being a master of more styles. Being a master still makes you a great fighter. You don't need a million styles to win.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Again. DD is arguably a superior martial artist to Cap.

Cap is an all-around better fighter, only because of his shield AND SSS really.

DD wins 6/10.

Metal you need to look at what you just said. What do fighters do....they fight. What do martial artists do....they fight. They both fight, Cap is an all round better fighter.....and DD is going to win 6/10? You do realise what you said does not make any sense.

Also Cap has had alot more experience than DD, he can adapt his fighting. So basically if you look at it Cap has more advantages.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Metal you need to look at what you just said. What do fighters do....they fight. What do martial artists do....they fight. They both fight, Cap is an all round better fighter.....and DD is going to win 6/10? You do realise what you said does not make any sense.

Also Cap has had alot more experience than DD, he can adapt his fighting. So basically if you look at it Cap has more advantages.

Yes, but what I didn't mention was DD's superior senses. Ya know, those senses that allow him to hang with people that would normally outclass him. He can, for all intents and purposes, basically predict what Cap will do. And easily has fast enough reflexes to avoid/counter Cap's attacks. And then DD has the necessary skill to put Cap down in a fight.

That's why DD wins.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Metal you need to look at what you just said. What do fighters do....they fight. What do martial artists do....they fight. They both fight, Cap is an all round better fighter.....and DD is going to win 6/10? You do realise what you said does not make any sense.

Also Cap has had alot more experience than DD, he can adapt his fighting. So basically if you look at it Cap has more advantages.

Forgot bout those senses

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Yes, but what I didn't mention was DD's superior senses. Ya know, those senses that allow him to hang with people that would normally outclass him. He can, for all intents and purposes, basically predict what Cap will do. And easily has fast enough reflexes to avoid/counter Cap's attacks. And then DD has the necessary skill to put Cap down in a fight.

That's why DD wins.

Yeah but you still said that Cap is an all round better fighter....ok are you know saying you retract that statement?

1. His sense will help but just because DD has his senses doesnt mean he will be fast enough to dodge his blows.

2. Cap can change his style to help him fool his senses.

3.Cap is stronger, more durable and has more stamina

4. Cap has more experience.

5. Both Wolverine and DD said that Cap is one of the world's greatest fighters.

7. They both have indestructible weapons....apparently and Cap hs mor experience using his.

6. DD is only slightly faster.

DD is not going to win the majority.


P.S. Marvelprince I saw that fight in the cemetry between Spidey and Wolvie. Wolvie got owned.

Agree with most.

Originally posted by Alfheim
1. His sense will help but just because DD has his senses doesnt mean he will be fast enough to dodge his blows.

Agreed. Does mean that he can better roll with the blow to reduce effectiveness

Originally posted by Alfheim
2. Cap can change his style to help him fool his senses.

Won't work. Changing styles works on regular fighters who watch you. Won't make much difference to DD which style is being used since he Cap's heartbeat, pulse etc won't change with his styles

Originally posted by Alfheim
3.Cap is stronger, more durable and has more stamina

Without a doubt

Originally posted by Alfheim
4. Cap has more experience.

Yeah

Originally posted by Alfheim
5. Both Wolverine and DD said that Cap is one of the world's greatest fighters.

Don't think anyones disputing that

Originally posted by Alfheim
7. They both have indestructible weapons....apparently and Cap hs mor experience using his.

Yeah, Bendis has said that the clubs are indestructible but I've seen Wolverine cut through em. I'll just say they're pretty though

Originally posted by Alfheim
6. DD is only slightly faster.

But faster nonetheless

Originally posted by Alfheim
DD is not going to win the majority.

Cap wins a very slight majority (his not being able to tire sealed the deal for me

Originally posted by Alfheim
P.S. Marvelprince I saw that fight in the cemetry between Spidey and Wolvie. Wolvie got owned.

Thank you. I thought it was a great showing for both characters but I fail to see how anyone could have thought Wolverine won that fight

Originally posted by marvelprince


Won't work. Changing styles works on regular fighters who watch you. Won't make much difference to DD which style is being used since he Cap's heartbeat, pulse etc won't change with his styles


Well if he can give Spiderman's sense trouble he cant give DD trouble? If Cap can dodge computerised guns with targeting systems he cant give DD trouble? As you know he may his sense but he can only dodge so much, if Cap uses combinations on him there is only so much he can dodge.



Originally posted by marvelprince


Yeah, Bendis has said that the clubs are indestructible but I've seen Wolverine cut through em. I'll just say they're pretty though


So thats another advantage that Cap has.


Originally posted by marvelprince

Thank you. I thought it was a great showing for both characters but I fail to see how anyone could have thought Wolverine won that fight

No it wasnt Wolv did not even touch Spiderman, the only chance he got to touch him was when Spidey let him.....arghhhh!