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i thought i'd look at the topic from a different angle...many people seem intent on criticising the mainstream media in the US and the UK from both sides of the political divide

on the one hand you have the lefties attacking the mainstream media for covering up or not holding their governments to account enough over things such as the war in iraq

one such person being Michael Moore

Moore takes it upon himself to denounce Bush as evil and his films and interviews, while interesting, aren't really bastions of journalistic integrity

but rather than criticise moore for the subjects he chooses to attack...what gets me annoyed is that his subjects are relatively easy to attack

its easy to focus on a government you believe to be corrupt when the investigations you carry out are done so in relative safety

why doesn't moore do a film about the corruption and scandals of say the Sudanese government or Robert Mugabe of Zimbabwe?

could it be that these kind of investigations are simply to difficult to focus on...

it is in situations like these that the only people who seem willing to put themselves in harms way to get the story out is the journalists from the mainstream media

a prime example beign Frank Gardner of the BBC who went unescorted into an area of Saudi Arabia where it was rumoured to be a stronghold for al queda operatives...he was dragged from the car and shot 6 times at point blank range and left to die...fortunately he survived

Moore has heavily criticised the war in iraq yet i dont recall him ever doing any frontline investigations in the pursuit of his story

its easy to find failings and criticisms of the mainstream media when we have access to the internet and other sources

but lets try and keep some perspective on the fact that in 2004 , 129 journalists were killed trying to get the stories we all "have a right to know" about

its very easy to criticise while sitting at a computer

this brings to my mind that event when moore was interviewing those congress members outside asking them if they would enroll their son to go to Iraq........

makes you want to interview moore and ask him:

"Would you go and bring your allegations IN saudi arabia if you want to know the truth ?"

Well Moore has never said that his docs were nonbiased, he doent claim to be an objective journalist, rather an entertainer with a political edge. And he chooses subjects that for whatever reason strike a note with him..

I really liked Moore`s Bowling in Columbine. What do you think of this document?

Liberals are ****ing retarded, it's that simple. Let me show you the fallacy in thier ENTIRE system they fail to recongnize..

They complain that Bush is policing the world and hindering our freedoms.

HOWEVER, Republicans believe in SMALLER goverment. Which is why even though libertarians whipe thier ass with the republic agenda on morality, ussualy tend to vote republican. (Alot of my friends are libertarian.)

Liberals (The U.S. version anyway.) or more appropiately "democrats", don't want smaller goverment. They WANT a big brother goverment. Because they have no will of thier own and expect the goverment to hold thier hand and deal with every little problem they have. A utopian goverment sounds great, but it could never work. Many countries have proven that.

So thier statements against Bush is just stupid, if what he was what they say he is true, they'd be giddy and gay, but no. They hate Bush BECAUSE he's taking power away from powerful coporations and giving us more jobs and more social security. (Both in funding of older chaps, and the figure of speech term..)

THAT's why liberals can't stand George W. because Americans are starting to see that sucking on the goverment teet gets you nowhere. And their jealous cause it was a big gun-toting hick who managed to show them that.. But then again, who better? Sure Bush has money do to his father, but he was raised in Texas on a ****ing ranch. If anyone knows blue collar work, it's that man. Texas being the capital of rednecks EVERYWHERE.

And I am proud to say I voted for Bush too, cause as a socialist I want to give power back to the people and stick it to the coporations. Not by ranting on a soapbox about the dangers of smoking, or making shitty jokes on Saturday Night Live. But by making progress in this country in taking out funds to stupid projects no-one gives a crap about, putting them into helping PEOPLE out, and finnaly solving the energy crisis. I bet it was democrats who thought of the brilliant idea of getting oil from the Middle-East in the first place. You're right dumbass, they do hate us. So why the **** do we lick thier ass so much? This is why the republicans are FINNALY listining to my emails and looking into nuclear power..

Originally posted by Big Evil


They hate Bush BECAUSE he's taking power away from powerful coporations and giving us more jobs and more social security. (Both in funding of older chaps, and the figure of speech term..)

.

OMG that friggin hilarious!! Do you even know who we mean when we talk about Bush?? I suggest you read up my dear lest you sound even more like a .. (insert insult of choice here)

Innacurate knowledge is his crutch.

before you guys decend into petty bickering again i suggest you dont f**king bother

I just wish there were a smiley that expressed just how much thatcracked me up !!

Originally posted by Big Evil
Liberals are ****ing retarded, it's that simple. Let me show you the fallacy in thier ENTIRE system they fail to recongnize..

They complain that Bush is policing the world and hindering our freedoms.

HOWEVER, Republicans believe in SMALLER goverment. Which is why even though libertarians whipe thier ass with the republic agenda on morality, ussualy tend to vote republican. (Alot of my friends are libertarian.)

Liberals (The U.S. version anyway.) or more appropiately "democrats", don't want smaller goverment. They WANT a big brother goverment. Because they have no will of thier own and expect the goverment to hold thier hand and deal with every little problem they have. A utopian goverment sounds great, but it could never work. Many countries have proven that.

So thier statements against Bush is just stupid, if what he was what they say he is true, they'd be giddy and gay, but no. They hate Bush BECAUSE he's taking power away from powerful coporations and giving us more jobs and more social security. (Both in funding of older chaps, and the figure of speech term..)

THAT's why liberals can't stand George W. because Americans are starting to see that sucking on the goverment teet gets you nowhere. And their jealous cause it was a big gun-toting hick who managed to show them that.. But then again, who better? Sure Bush has money do to his father, but he was raised in Texas on a ****ing ranch. If anyone knows blue collar work, it's that man. Texas being the capital of rednecks EVERYWHERE.

And I am proud to say I voted for Bush too, cause as a socialist I want to give power back to the people and stick it to the coporations. Not by ranting on a soapbox about the dangers of smoking, or making shitty jokes on Saturday Night Live. But by making progress in this country in taking out funds to stupid projects no-one gives a crap about, putting them into helping PEOPLE out, and finnaly solving the energy crisis. I bet it was democrats who thought of the brilliant idea of getting oil from the Middle-East in the first place. You're right dumbass, they do hate us. So why the **** do we lick thier ass so much? This is why the republicans are FINNALY listining to my emails and looking into nuclear power..

Wow, read up on politics a bit.
Republicans (as the general idealogical connection) Believe in a smaller more powerful government, where the individuals in the governement hold more power than those outside fo governement. the extreme version of this is a monarchy, where one person holds all the power, (really small governement.) Small government is not working towards the abolition of it. They also believe that tax reductions are the best way to stimulate and economy. Among other things.

Democrats believe the opposite, They believe in a larger governement, where there is less personal power, it is instead invested in the overall system. The extreme example of this would be a pure communist state. Where everyone was part of the government and made decisions as a group. They also believe that tax increases will stimulate an economy, (more FDR like economics pumping more governmental money into the economy.)

Now, Bush, A former corperation boardmember, is a extreme (for todays US standards) Republican, and hence the term Neo-con. You should read up on Bush too....

Oh and Moore is not the only person writing political stuff. Ann Coulter is a Conservative whatever like Moore. (IMO way worse)

Real journalists, I really respect them. Does anyone watch/listen to "Democracy Now" ? Thats a good example of a very good, non-mainstream, non-partistan news sourse. Amy Goodman (The host) accually cares about all the stuff you say Moore doesn't care about. Go read her book (forgot the title) She is a Democrat, but read it just for her storys of the places she's been and things she's seen.
She's been to the Oil fields in Nigeria, and been in the middle of a shootout in the middle east and stuff, Its amazing and incredible respectable.

preach it brother!!

Moore is a fat, stupid, hypocrite who should burn in hell. His films are so one sided and leave out important facts. He's a ****ing nazi:

maybe you should try living in a country that have had a socialist government first. And as a socialist how the hell could you vote republican?

Media, as long as you get a media that aint political situated we will be fine. Many media groups have turned into political propaganda machines though so..........

Originally posted by finti
maybe you should try living in a country that have had a socialist government first. And as a socialist how the hell could you vote republican?


I do so love a good oxymoron

Originally posted by bilb
I do so love a good oxymoron

Lately this forum has been filled with morons.

Originally posted by ShotgunWes
Moore is a fat, stupid, hypocrite who should burn in hell. His films are so one sided and leave out important facts. He's a ****ing nazi:

is this like the 5th time you called someone a nazi and posted that flag?

wow, frikin genious debating tactic. all this time i've been going about it wrong. i've been wasting my time using facts and applying those facts to the way i view things, and arguing points based on such...what a waste of time!

all i had to do this whole time is just say "_______ is a f***ing nazi!!!",
post a picture of a swastika, and be done with it!!! damn...i feel like such
a fool for wasting all that time. thank you for opening my eyes

Originally posted by finti
maybe you should try living in a country that have had a socialist government first. And as a socialist how the hell could you vote republican?

Media, as long as you get a media that aint political situated we will be fine. Many media groups have turned into political propaganda machines though so..........

Very true, I doubt he even knows what socialism is about

Originally posted by Fire
Very true, I doubt he even knows what socialism is about

Being as he says that he's a socialist yet votes Republican....I think you're very right.

PVS it was a joke. You can sit around here and debate your little politics, and talk aout what's wrong with the world. But what are you going to do about it? NOTHING! It's easy to talk and run your mouth, but all I see on this board are people who watch too much CNN and think they know what they are talking about. And trust me I do know a little about politics and the way the world works. I grew up in Bogota Columbia, so its hard for me to trust politicians. And I can tell you I wouldn't trust a liberal with my pet monkey. I don't like most Democrats, but there are a few that I like such as Al Gore.

Originally posted by ShotgunWes
You can sit around here and debate your little politics, and talk aout what's wrong with the world. But what are you going to do about it? NOTHING! It's easy to talk and run your mouth, but all I see on this board are people who watch too much CNN and think they know what they are talking about. And trust me I do know a little about politics and the way the world works. I grew up in Bogota Columbia, so its hard for me to trust politicians. And I can tell you I wouldn't trust a liberal with my pet monkey. I don't like most Democrats, but there are a few that I like such as Al Gore.

al gore is a dumb shit who lost his own state in the 2000 elections.
who the hell loses their own state?
bush has gore's stupidity to thank for his position.

He lost TN because TN is largely a republican state. And Gore was a DEM. I live in TN so I know what I am talking about. I'm sure if you had it your way Ralph Nader would be leading this country.

and that would be a bad thing why???

Ralph Nader has mental illnesses and he's crazy. That's why. He once sued his secretary because he thought that the russian government was paying her to spy on him. How much crazier can you get?

invade a country looking for ghosts?

Originally posted by ShotgunWes
Ralph Nader has mental illnesses and he's crazy. That's why. He once sued his secretary because he thought that the russian government was paying her to spy on him. How much crazier can you get?

I'm not saying he's intelligent or not, but many intelligent people have mental disease. Paranoia.

so we can leave mental disease out for Dubyas condition then

dubya isnt crazy at all
dubya is severely retarded and thus its not nice to make fun of him.

"there but for the grace of god!" thats what i say

LIberals are not the only ones who put out aggresively biased movies. I'm a moderate, but there was a film that came out i think during Clintons early presidency or while he was campaigning... it was called The Clinton Chronicles. It dealt with him looking the other way during one of the biggest cocaine smuggling rings in our nations history, which was based out of Mena, Arkansas during his time as governor.
Most of it was rumor that couldnt be backed up. But then again the CIA and FBI protected these people and were involved in the cover up of their affiliation with them, so they refused to release any information or files regarding any case related to it, as well as shut down any attempted investigation.

"The Boys on the Tracks".... good book... it explains how the deaths of two teenage boys opened up a world of corruption in a good 'ol boys community.