Midnighter Versus Wolverine

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DarkCrawler
Can he defeat Wolverine?

WOLVERINEFAN
what are midnighter's powers

DarkCrawler
http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/m/mdnghtr.jpg

WOLVERINEFAN
thanks. it looks like a draw to me. i dont see any way midnighter could actually KO the wolverine.

DarkCrawler
Yeah, I have an hard time of deciding the winner too...

long pig
Good fight. But majestic, like Slade, can visualize the fight a thousand times in his head until he finds a perfect plan of attack. This is in a few nanoseconds.

He'd beat wolverine some how.

DarkCrawler
http://img54.echo.cx/img54/9200/jennysparks02p065lj.th.jpg

long pig
Yup, Slade does the same thing.
How else do you explain the one sided fights against whole teams?

DarkCrawler
So who would win, Slade or Midnighter? smile

And the fight is happening on featureless evroniment. Nidnighter his the weapons he usually carries around (shown on the picture, I suppose). What way could he use to take down Wolverine?

nngo2k
uh .... MN looks like he's into torture or S&M with those medieval weapons and costume ... HAHA j/k

DarkCrawler
Yeah...he even has an bat with spikes on it...creepy.

Scoobless
lol.... i love the idea of a "hero" carrying around a bat with nails in it....

i suppose he could stick weapons through Wolverines back where he can't reach them to pull them out.... shouldn't be too hard for him..... if left in long enough through vital organs it should kill him

unless you believe Wolverine can survive a nuke or being thrown into the sun...*cough*loser*cough*

Khellendros
This was done a while ago, and I said the same thing then as I am now. Midnighter is faster than Wolverine, and possibly an all around better fighter, but Wolverine has a huge advantage with his healing factor and unbreakable bones. Midnighter might land four or five blows to every one Wolverine lands, but each of those one will do longer lasting damage than anything Midnighter could do to Wolverine. Wolvie takes it after a long and bloody fight.

whirlysplat
Yup it was my thread preiously. Midnighter takes it big grin

srankmissingnin
Midnighter playes out a million combat sernarios in his head... then books it when he gets gutted like a fish in every single one.

His only superhuman stat is durability and Wolverine's is much higher. In a standard area fight Midnighter doesn't have much of a chance to win.

Khellendros
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Midnighter playes out a million combat sernarios in his head... then books it when he gets gutted like a fish in every single one.

His only superhuman stat is durability and Wolverine's is much higher. In a standard area fight Midnighter doesn't have much of a chance to win.
Actually, he has enhanced speed and his strength is at LEAST peak human. Wolverine is not winning this fight before taking a savage beating first.

whirlysplat
Midnighter also has the ability to see the fight from every angle before it happens. This fight is over before its started.

srankmissingnin
Originally posted by Khellendros
Actually, he has enhanced speed and his strength is at LEAST peak human. Wolverine is not winning this fight before taking a savage beating first.

Peak-human strength isn't even going to slow Wolverine, the only thing he can hope for is to use his strength and leverage to throw Wolverine around a couple of times; he isn't putting Wolverine down, or even coming close to it. I dare say that since Wolverine acts solely on instinct Midnighters abilities might not even be that help full to him, hell even Betsy can't figure out what Wolverine will do in battle and she is a psychic. Midnighter can't but Wolverine down with out prep you can say all you want about his ability, it wont change the fact that he can't win.

whirlysplat
Midnighters strength is enhanced not peak humaq, his a lot stronger than wolvie.

C1nd3r
Midnighter would see himself getting clawed through the stomach in every one of those scenarios, and in the end he would just say choose not to get his ass whipped and retreat.

RayIsGay
Wolverine has a fighting style all his own...kinda... there is no telling what he will do. MidNighter would look at him analyze the situation, then throw up everwhere because he cant figure out how to kill him! HAH!

DarkCrawler
Up.

DarkCrawler
What about nerve points?

jinzin
nerve points will work but it will take a ton of em to down logan...because of his healing factor the bloodflow that slows down, and the nerves that become immobile by such blows are only effected shortly if at all.....for instance, shingin was bashing the crap out of nerve points and nerve clusters in order to slow wolverine down enough to knock him out and even then wolverine was injected with enough poision to kill any normal human being, AND EVEN THEN he was doing it with a wooden sword!.....so while midnighter COULD down him with pressure points it would take a very very long time to do it...to effectively slow down the healing factor....it's much more likely that wolverine would gut him before that happened...thing is like everyone said wolverine's an unpredictable fighter at times....for instance: Mr. X he could literally read one's mind to anticipate what his opponent's next move would be before they made it....when using this technique nobody could touch him....he humiliated taskmaser with ease....but when he pissed off wolvie and wolverine went into a rage, there was nothing he could do to defend himself....the same exact thing could very well happen to midnighter....there's no contingency plans for a warrior that unpredictable...

DarkCrawler
Okay.

But what if Wolverine would not be pissed of here? I see no reason that he would...

jinzin
point taken....

the problem with midnighter vs. wolverine is that wolverine isn't a character that can be taken at face value..he's small and looks old but he's incredibly strong and fast.... he looks like a human but he's got a superb healing factor... he wears no armor on the outside, but he has the harderst armor in the world on the inside....he's completely unarmed, yet he houses six of the sharpest most deadly weapons in the mu.....


assuming midnighter knows all about these factors....and assuming wolverine keeps his cool...I want to say midnighter will most likely win....(mind you, I'm not entirly sure how...projectiles won't work too well and midnighter will only hold up to logan in h2h for so long since logan can afford to make numerous mistakes while midnighter can't....but i'm sure he can think of a 100 other ways to take it to logan that I can't.)

if he doesn't he'll be surprised by one of these hidden factors and it will lead to his demise..

if wolverine DID get pissed off for some reason..than he'd right out run through midnighter...

DarkCrawler
Midnighter is quite fast...and apparently, he can see what abilities his enemies have...

http://img244.echo.cx/img244/5892/authority02102yy.th.jpghttp://img244.echo.cx/img244/7175/authority02114pb.th.jpg

And in this pic, he is breaking swords by hitting them with his bare hands, so he is also quite strong...

http://img254.echo.cx/img254/4643/midnighter16lv.gif

So, I think he is at least stronger and faster then Wolverine...more intelligent too.

I think he can take it. But he needs to make it quick.

jinzin
is midnighter homosexual? I'm just curious.....

but anyways...okay he can see logans powers then...now I would say it comes down to berserker rage or not..if wolvie's got it...midnighter goes down...if wolvie don't.....midnighter's okay and will probably win this.....if midnighter fights the battle in his head a million times and a berserker logan is in half of those fights...he runs away....like i said though midnighter better stay away from logan in h2h...

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by jinzin
is midnighter homosexual? I'm just curious.....



Yes, he is married to Apollo.

jinzin
k i thought so....just couldn't remember if that was him or not...

srankmissingnin
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Midnighter is quite fast...and apparently, he can see what abilities his enemies have...

http://img244.echo.cx/img244/5892/authority02102yy.th.jpghttp://img244.echo.cx/img244/7175/authority02114pb.th.jpg

And in this pic, he is breaking swords by hitting them with his bare hands, so he is also quite strong...

http://img254.echo.cx/img254/4643/midnighter16lv.gif

So, I think he is at least stronger and faster then Wolverine...more intelligent too.

I think he can take it. But he needs to make it quick.

For all we know the Doctor broke those swords with his magic, the picture isn't very conclussive. Did he hit the swords? Did he block the swords and the broke off of him? His arms aren't even with in range of the swords and from the picture it looks like they are getting thrown back.

The Midnighter hasn't done much of anything. He beat up a guard who had superhuman strength, he caught and arrow and he once side stepped a bullet. He doesn't have the stats to hang around with Logan. Strenght? Don't make me laugh! He doesn't have a single strength feat. He makes mush out of human skulls with his club but I would imagine you don't even need to be in the one ton area to do that.

Regis beat the Midnighter down, so Wolverine will be landing hits on him and having an extra heart didn't stop him from almost dieing when Seth ripped it out (he would have died if it wasn't for the Doctor). The Midnighter can't when this fight.

Khellendros
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
For all we know the Doctor broke those swords with his magic, the picture isn't very conclussive. Did he hit the swords? Did he block the swords and the broke off of him? His arms aren't even with in range of the swords and from the picture it looks like they are getting thrown back.
What are you, kidding? It's obvious he just crossed his arms, taking the swords out. Look at the motion lines. And the Doctor is busy ducking out of the way.

Anyways, having had reason to reread a lot of Authority, I've changed my mind. Midnighter is way more vicious than people think. Add that, plus his speed and strength, and after he finds out jsut cutting Wolvering up isn't working, I be we'll see him tearing out whole organs. Once Wolvering has lost a liver, a lung or two, his kidneys, etc. even Wolvie's healing factor won't help him. Besides, it's entirely possible he could just tear Wolverin'es head off, since his spinal cord and neck muscles aren't unbreakable.

brainchild81
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Yes, he is married to Apollo. It's a bit of a parody of Batman & Superman.

long pig
I don't care how cool or yada yada....I can't see myself reading about a gay superhero. point blank can't do it.

jinzin
yeah it would be.......wierd, huh?

DarkCrawler
They don't really seem gay, though...

DigiMark007
I'll vote MN'er. Referring to the pic posted recently, the Doctor even makes a comment later on the page about needing to clean his pants (jokingly) before he can magic them. MN'er breaks those swords, and is stronger than Wolverine.

He's faster too, and is often drawn multiple times in the same panel to demonstrate how fast he's moving (they do a similar technique with Spider-man a lot). Add these things to his ability to analyze a fight numerous different ways and it equals a win for MN'er (and yes, he has an implant that allows him to see upgrades and such...he would know Wolverine could heal and has a metal skeleton...he wouldn't be able to know Wolvie's fighting ability, but would be able to see that Wolvie is in great physical condition). Eventually MN'er would hurt Logan enough to be able to kill him (the healing isn't instantaneous). Logan might get lucky every now and then, but 9/10 MN'er wins.

-DM

whirlysplat
Read the Authority guys its better than JLA or the Avengers trust mebig grin but start at the begining.

srankmissingnin
Originally posted by DigiMark007

He's faster too, and is often drawn multiple times in the same panel to demonstrate how fast he's moving (they do a similar technique with Spider-man a lot). Add these things to his ability to analyze a fight numerous different ways and it equals a win for MN'er (and yes, he has an implant that allows him to see upgrades and such...he would know Wolverine could heal and has a metal skeleton...he wouldn't be able to know Wolvie's fighting ability, but would be able to see that Wolvie is in great physical condition). Eventually MN'er would hurt Logan enough to be able to kill him (the healing isn't instantaneous). Logan might get lucky every now and then, but 9/10 MN'er wins.

-DM

I dont every recall seeing the Midnighter drawn more then once in the same frame and I own almost every issue of the Authority (Including the seceret history, Kev, and Stormwatch apperances). Care to give me an issue number?

Midnighter would never hit Wolverine hard enough to kill him. Wolverine's healing factor heals bullet woundes before the bullet exits his body and almost 90% of the people Wolverine has fought with are leagues stronger then Midnighter.

Edit:... I found one example Authority v2 #9

supremthor
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Yes, he is married to Apollo.

For real I didnt no that confused

DigiMark007
That's the one I was referring to srank...the fight with the Wolverine/werewolf wannabe. I probably shouldn't have said "often drawn" like that, but I remembered that one incident and figured there was others. Apparently there isn't (I own them all too, but am too lazy to go back and make sure), but he's still quite fast.

My opinion stands though. MN'er too fast, and he's displayed feats of strength beyond what Wolverine has (around 800 pounds, give or take). He's too good of a fighter to be taken out, and I think eventually he'd get enough hits in (he always has a bunch of deadly goodies with him too) to slow and eventually kill Wolverine. The healing would make it a long fight, but it isn't instantaneous.

-DM

srankmissingnin
I still don't think MD has the showings to support that his stats are on Wolverine's level. He doesn't have a single strength feat (aside from bashing in skulls) and he only has a hand full of speed feats and Wolverine has topped thim both (one of the short comings of being in a few comics). Most of the time we don't even see what MD does in his fights, he acts cocky and he boasts then we see him again on the next page and he has won some how. MD is skilled, he is strong and he is fast but it isn't enough for him to beat Wolverine with out prep with his standard equipment.

If guys like Seth, Regis and Jack can land hits on MD (Seth was hella powerfull but he never showed much in the way of speed) then Wolverine will be landing hits also and despite his durability I don't think MD will be able to hold up to that.

DigiMark007
K...gotta respect that thinking...some good points.

Regis hitting him so easily seemed kinda iffy to me for a guy who is supposed to be able to work through literally thousands of combinations of a fight before it even begins (and has basic knowledge of his opponents skills and powers just by looking at them). I also saw MN'er take out a 'speedster' named Amaze in a stand-alone issue that's right after the Earth Inferno series in the collection I have...don't think it has a number. The guy is probably Quicksilver level or slower, but MN'er gets angry and tears him in half...so he's had some otehr impressive speed feats.

So yeah, maybe Wolvie gets a hit in, and then it's downhill for MN'er. I still think he has the skill to pull it off, but I'd be willing to say Wolverine would win 6/10.

-DM

DigiMark007
...sorry double post

jinzin
wolverine's nailed speed demon and "tagged" quicksilver...

Khellendros
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I still don't think MD has the showings to support that his stats are on Wolverine's level. He doesn't have a single strength feat (aside from bashing in skulls) and he only has a hand full of speed feats and Wolverine has topped thim both (one of the short comings of being in a few comics). Most of the time we don't even see what MD does in his fights, he acts cocky and he boasts then we see him again on the next page and he has won some how. MD is skilled, he is strong and he is fast but it isn't enough for him to beat Wolverine with out prep with his standard equipment.

If guys like Seth, Regis and Jack can land hits on MD (Seth was hella powerfull but he never showed much in the way of speed) then Wolverine will be landing hits also and despite his durability I don't think MD will be able to hold up to that.
Strength feats: Viciously beats and kills super powered beings who can fly at high speeds through skyscrapers and into streets, tearing up whole blocks: he snaps two of those bad guys necks with one hand each, smashes the teeth out of the mouth of another while hitting him hard enough to kill him, seems to be taking more of them out with single punches and kicks.

Shatters two swords made of what one may assume are good quality metal, once again seems to be with one hand each.

Punches through the skin/carpaces of alien things durable enough to survive the plunge from space through Earth's atmosphere, land with explosive force on the ground and survive and fly through cars and the resulting explosions unharmed.

Punches through the upper back of a resurrected super hero who was beating the hell out of Apollo and was about to kill him. He basically tore the guy's head and an arm off.

Caves in the skull of a Collosus rip-off who is in metal form. No matter what kind of metal she was made of, that's still showing some good strength.

Speed feats: Seems to be able to move faster than an enemy super powered soldier can see. Dodges another Gamorran soldier's punch with speed that the man finds impossible. Catches an arrow out of the air at near point-blank range. Dodges the blasts of a being who seems to control light. Wades into a barrage of gunfire/energy blasts when taking on a group of super powered enemies, while at the same time throwing at least two shuriken into the group with fatal results.

Regis beat him because he was hideously strong and was a telepath. Seth was friggin BUILT to beat the Authority. Jack is at LEAST at Spider man level in strength and agility and is nearly as skilled a fighter as 'nighter himself. All in all, taking hits from those three isn't exactly a huge embarassment. The guy in the trenchcoat definitely has what it takes to put down Wolverine.

manjaro
the planning thing isnt something midnighter does consciously its his cybernetic implants that do the work and his body acts accordingly, like an amped up spidey sense. slade is only simlar becuase of the whole he uses 90% of his brain thing, but in my opinion only a slight competition for him. anyone who just jumps up and says wolverine wins obviously havent read any Authority or Stormwatch comics. i wont say that logan wouldnt put up a good fight, but wolverine is dust, and you mofo'kers know it laughing

DigiMark007
Heh. Good points, Khell and manjaro. I have read all of Authority (no Stormwatch yet though) but had forgotten many of MN'ers displays of fighting prowess and strength. I was a bit torn, and initially said MN'er only to switch to Wolvie briefly. I'm back in the Wildstorm camp now...permanently this time.

-DM

manjaro
also whenever he says he went over a battle a million times in his head he's not exaggerating. laughing

Wanderer259
I didn't know too much about the Midnighter, but geezus, after reading all of this, I'll have to go with him.

DigiMark007
Yeah, MN'er would give even the best street-level types a go at it (I'm thinking about guys like Spider-Man, Deathstroke, etc.). He's hardcore.

-DM

Khellendros
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Heh. Good points, Khell and manjaro. I have read all of Authority (no Stormwatch yet though) but had forgotten many of MN'ers displays of fighting prowess and strength. I was a bit torn, and initially said MN'er only to switch to Wolvie briefly. I'm back in the Wildstorm camp now...permanently this time.

-DM
Yeah, I was the same way. I said Wolvie at first too, but then I really started thinking about it, and I had just picked up that one shot again with the revived heroes, and decided to go back through volume one and pick out some of his feats. All in all, you seriously have to be around Spider Man's level at his best or have an ability that specifically counteracts Midnighter's anylitic abilities to take him on.

whirlysplat
Originally posted by Khellendros
Yeah, I was the same way. I said Wolvie at first too, but then I really started thinking about it, and I had just picked up that one shot again with the revived heroes, and decided to go back through volume one and pick out some of his feats. All in all, you seriously have to be around Spider Man's level at his best or have an ability that specifically counteracts Midnighter's anylitic abilities to take him on.

glad you guys agreesmile

Keep the faith smile

Scoobless
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I still don't think MD has the showings to support that his stats are on Wolverine's level. He doesn't have a single strength feat

when he and Apollo were looking at a house to buy he threw a guy about 40+ feet (he went over Apollo and Jenny's heads into the river) ..... that's a superhuman strength feat

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