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This a real toughie but I have to give this one to the Punisher unless someone can convince me otherwise.

Dr. Doom hands down. I really don't appreciate "super heroes" without any powers

How is this a toughie? How does Punisher even...begin to win?

What the hell?!

That's why I call them heroes instead of superheroes since they don't have any superpowers.

Originally posted by long pig
How is this a toughie? How does Punisher even...begin to win?

What the hell?!


It's my own opinion.

punisher?

How does a "hero" have a chance against a SUPER villain that can take on four SUPER heroes!!!

I.....I just...don't....Punisher?? really?

thank you long pig

Does Doom have powers or is it all in the suit?

It's in his suit. And he has magical powers and super intelligence. He could beat frank in a h2h fight too if he wanted.

Punisher has 0% chance.

Well,that's the only reason why Doom would win which is because he's a supergenius.

Doom is an exceptional fighter...he fought and killed a Lion when a Celestial stripped him naked and banished him to another dimension

That's more than I needed to know.......

Ill just PM u all the details of that...hot naked battle

pm them to everyone!!!

Don't!It'll burn my eyes from reading it!

Who says you HAVE to read it?

Right.

Originally posted by Zod4Life
It's my own opinion.

Duely noted for later arguments. (To make sure we're clear, you believe Punisher can defeat Dr. Doom)

What can punished do to Dr doom, Doom took a shot from the infinity gauntlet and survived.

This match is a joke...Dr. Doom kills the punisher in a minute if he wants to.

doom just looks at punisher and he explodes

Originally posted by Zod4Life
It's my own opinion.

Which is wrong.

Punisher would win, if Dr. Doom was in coma...and I am not sure if he could win even then.

Punisher should go look for Deathstroke or someone where he has a chance in winning against...not Dr. Doom...it's just not the same league.

Originally posted by Nataku8188
Duely noted for later arguments. (To make sure we're clear, you believe Punisher can defeat Dr. Doom)

That most likely won't happen.

The guy that said Punisher would win. Please explain. We've all said why Dr. Doom could take Frank. Now explain why you think otherwise.

Originally posted by Zod4Life
It's my own opinion. Which is fine and dandy...but it'd be nice if you would share what fact you base this opinion on. Come on, build a case for the Punisher for us.

On a side note, I do believe these two have met before, in the 'Acts of Vengeance' crossover...I don't know what the outcome was, but I have a pretty good idea.

That being said, this thread absolutely sucks.

The only possible way Punisher could win is if Doom deems him so insignificant and unworthy of his time that he simply walks away from him. Ring out.

"The King of Latveria is no common murderer. If I cannot magnificently win a victory . . . it affords me no pleasure to merely slay a foe."

I know a way Punisher could win. IF they made a new Marvel Ages Punisher comic and there he fought Dr. Doom, the creators would make it so that the hero always wins to make the little kids happy. That's the only possible way Punisher would win!!!

If the Punisher wins against Dr. Doom I will stop buying marvel comics.

Originally posted by WAF3001
I know a way Punisher could win. IF they made a new Marvel Ages Punisher comic and there he fought Dr. Doom, the creators would make it so that the hero always wins to make the little kids happy. That's the only possible way Punisher would win!!!

Since when has Punisher been an "hero"...

since he'd have a Marvel Age comicKids can't understand anti-heroes

Originally posted by long pig
It's in his suit. And he has magical powers and super intelligence. He could beat frank in a h2h fight too if he wanted.

Punisher has 0% chance.
I disagree. In a simple h2h fight, Dooms goes down hard and fast.

geez...i didn't know the punisher is a god now.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Since when has Punisher been an "hero"...
He's not. He's an anti-hero.

Originally posted by Nataku8188
Duely noted for later arguments. (To make sure we're clear, you believe Punisher can defeat Dr. Doom)

No,I changed my mind.I think that Dr.Doom will beat the Punisher.

Dr.Doom will kill the Punisher in 2 seconds!

Punisher will win by default.
Doom would never lower himself to even show up for this fight. That would dignify it as an actual challenge. That would imply Doom thinks Frank is significant enough for him to even care, which he is not. That would imply Doom think's there's even a chance he could lose.
No man is Doom's equal!

Such is DOOM.

The F4 are Doom's equal.Look at how many times they have defeated him.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Punisher will win by default.
Doom would never lower himself to even show up for this fight. That would dignify it as an actual challenge. That would imply Doom thinks Frank is significant enough for him to even care, which he is not. That would imply Doom think's there's even a chance he could lose.
No man is Doom's equal!
You're wrong. Even though Punisher is just a man with some heavy weaponry (so is Doom by the way), Punisher definitely has made a name in the Marvel Universe. I see no reason why Doom wouldn't care.

And Doom isn't known for not daring to face a challenge, even if it's a not so honourable or exciting one.

I'm a devout Punisher fan, and I accept that Frank would get murked something ugly up against Dr. Doom.

But Batman is getting capped!!!

You need to have an open mind....open your mind quaid! OPEN YOUR MIND!

Originally posted by shaolin9976
You need to have an open mind....open your mind quaid! OPEN YOUR MIND! But not to the point where your brain falls out.

You show me Batman catching 300+ rounds of hollow tips and I'll accept him beating Frank.

But anyway, I shouldn't have let the other debate drag into this one. I apologize.

Doom in a 1st round by KO in 20-30 seconds if the battle begins in close quarters. If Frank fights from a good position, he gets off a few rounds until Doom zeroes in on him and fires some energy beam in his direction.

If Frank could get some SHIELD tech he'd last maybe 10 minutes longer.

Doom will kill Punisher without even trying.

Originally posted by who?-kid
I disagree. In a simple h2h fight, Dooms goes down hard and fast.

Doom is one badass mother****er. He beat a full grown lion, while he was naked, and was still pretty disoriented.

Who still thinks frank can win? Next he can face the FF or the avengers alone...

Originally posted by illadelph12
You show me Batman catching 300+ rounds of hollow tips and I'll accept him beating Frank.

But anyway, I shouldn't have let the other debate drag into this one. I apologize.

Doom in a 1st round by KO in 20-30 seconds if the battle begins in close quarters. If Frank fights from a good position, he gets off a few rounds until Doom zeroes in on him and fires some energy beam in his direction.

If Frank could get some SHIELD tech he'd last maybe 10 minutes longer.

You crazy! Frank wouldn't survive a minute against Doom, unless incase of bad wriing.

Dr. Doom wins.
I still don't see Frank winning.....

Dr.Doom would kill the Punisher without even paying attention to him.He could be playing a card game and still kill the Punisher while not paying attention.

During the Damage Control series. Punisher ran in fear just from seeing Doom appear (and it was only a doombot)

He probably peed his pants too!

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
During the Damage Control series. Punisher ran in fear just from seeing Doom appear (and it was only a doombot)



HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I think the punisher could pull of a win

Originally posted by The Russian
I think the punisher could pull of a win

The Punisher would pee his pants when he sees Doom.

Doom is a genius.. hardly anyone can take him out... especially Punisher. Dont f*uck with Doom

The F4 can take him on.

I like this Leather Face guy!

Doom is pretty horribly overrated. We've been through this before - Doom has few impressive battle feats. His most impressive battle feat was blasting Warlock, and given that SPIDER-MAN has done it before, I ain't all that impressed. Doom is good for coming up with ways of stealing powers or manipulating people, but I wouldn't pick him in a straight up fight against damn near anybody.

That said, he destroys Punisher with extreme prejudice. *shrug*

My inner fanboy is at you for saying anything bad about the allmighty Doom!

But, yeah, he's over.......overra.....He's not as powerf.......DOOM OWNS YOU!! BAH!

lol. I've argued for 20 pages with Alpha Centuri over this....to this day, no one has produced enough GOOD battle feats by Doom (Warlock, Hulk - sorta) to offset his BAD battle feats (Squirrel Girl, Luke Cage, Hawkeye, Thing, etc). That makes his average pretty lousy. And before anyone thinks of it...no, they weren't Doombots. This was the pre-Doombot era. The Squirrel Girl thing was temporarily retonned, then retconned back to it being the real Doom she punked.

But like i said, if you need powers stolen in a pinch, Doom is your man. But if you need someone to go to war with you, there's another armored cat who you should run to first.

Dude, you're right, perfectly right. But, Doom is basically....I dunno what the facination is we have with him. Maybe it's his massive balls to go up against anything or anyone, and deem them "lower" than him.

I swear, Doom would look at Living Tribuanal and say "Bah! You look foolish, you 3 faced swine!".

Also, he's pretty smart.

Doom IS a fine character, and a master at prep, but the bottom line is, this is a battle board, not a nefarious plot board. Battle scenarios like what's found on this board don't play to Doom's strengths, and therefore, Doom shouldn't be getting nearly the win percentage he does on this board. A lot of it is due to misinformation - Doom never actually beat Terrax (Terrax fused Doom's armor in one panel) and he never beat Silver Surfer (he built a special power-transfer room, then talked Surfer into entering it...ho hum), but people constantly reference these two as proof of Doom's might. Iron Man has conclusively beaten Surfer and Terrax in actual combat. People also tend to use Doom's taking a shot from Galactus as proof of his might. Magneto shielded himself AND the X-men from a Galactus blast. Quasar took a shot from Galactus too and was just fine. I don't know on what planet the act of not getting totally owned equates to a victory, lol.

Perhaps Doom's greatest feat is tricking everybody into thinking he's greater than he is.

Mayhaps you are right, therefore, he really IS awesome. Right?

I don't necessarily agree with it, but here it is....

Doom thrashes Castle, bending his weapon with his armor's strength while talking trash only the way Doom can. He picks up Castle by the throat, continues to talk trash, charges his gauntlet, and then gets stuck with an electromagnetic mine. The explosion knocks Doom unconscious and Castle spends forever and a day hammering through Doom's armor before getting to the squishy human parts inside.

Happened in The Punisher Kills the Marvel Universe. I'd post the scans if I could figure out how.

How has Punisher vs Doom gone on so long when everyone pretty much agrees that Doom wins unless Frank comes up with a super ingenious plan involving an electromagnetic mine (he just carries one round all the time cos you never know when you're gonna need an EM mine? ) and times it's detonation exactly right so Doom is close but doesn't have time to snap his neck with a flick of his armour-plated wrist?

Just giving a situation in which the Punisher has gone up against Doom and won. The thread, afterall, never stated that Frank had no prep. As for Doom snapping his neck, he was surprised when Castle suddenly slapped a mine to his face, which let Frank wriggle away before the thing detonated.

Like I said, I don't exactly agree that it's something that would happen often or easily, but it's still circumstantially feasible.

Circumstance would definitley be the only way to a Punisher win.

Originally posted by long pig
My inner fanboy is at you for saying anything bad about the allmighty Doom!

But, yeah, he's over.......overra.....He's not as powerf.......DOOM OWNS YOU!! BAH!

BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAAHAAAAAAAAAAAA!!
!!

i agree with demigawd that doom tends to be more of a planner than a fighter. doom is a master trash talker f he is anything. his ego would make him lose to the punisher because he would think the punisher is nothing and be taken by surprise

Originally posted by long pig
My inner fanboy is at you for saying anything bad about the allmighty Doom!

But, yeah, he's over.......overra.....He's not as powerf.......DOOM OWNS YOU!! BAH!



Doom doesn't own the GODLY ZOD!

Originally posted by demigawd
People also tend to use Doom's taking a shot from Galactus as proof of his might. Magneto shielded himself AND the X-men from a Galactus blast. Ahh back and already fellating Magneto, are we? Actually I wouldn't call it a 'blast'...it was more like psychic feedback on steroids. Remember, Xavier and Magneto were attempting to communicate with Galactus, but they couldn't penetrate his psychic defenses, so Magneto, (whose pride couldn't handle being treated like a mere insect), decided to batter his way through and that resulted in some kind of overload.

Back to Doom...if you want to talk about the strength of his armour, then remember it withstood a DIRECT blast from Thanos with the IG...ok ok I'm exaggerating a bit, considering 5/6 of the Gauntlet was powered down...it's still Thanos with the Power gem, and I'd love to see Magneto's vaunted shield try to stand up to that.

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
During the Damage Control series. Punisher ran in fear just from seeing Doom appear (and it was only a doombot)
1. Damage Control... is that even in continuity ?

2. Punisher did not ran in fear in Damage Control, where do you get that idea ? He said to himself "I have no chance against Doom" and took a hostage or so, but he did not run in fear.

Back and already getting you on my case for making a valid reference, are we? It wasn't psychic feedback, otherwise a magnetic shield couldn't stop it since it's mental energy. Galactus noticed some annoyance and casually blasted at it. Magneto blocked it and showed no signs of exertion.

You don't think Thanos could have hit Doom hard enough to kill him if he wanted to? Terrax did it and Terrax is nothing compared to Thanos. It's great that Doom survived it, a real feat...but like I said, on what planet does not getting TOTALLY owned somehow equate great power? On top of that, Thanos never blasted anyone else, so we don't know how powerful the blast is supposed to be. I'd be more impressed if Thanos blasted and disintegrated the Surfer, then used the same blast on Doom and Doom survived. Thanos never used an energy blast on anyone else during that fight, so we have no point of reference.

Given that Magneto's shield has never been cracked, I don't see why he couldn't take that same shot.

Doom is still overrated, and you're still jumping down my throat for mentioning Magneto along with SEVERAL other characters. It's great to be back, lol.

Originally posted by Lord S
Back to Doom...if you want to talk about the strength of his armour, then remember it withstood a DIRECT blast from Thanos with the IG...ok ok I'm exaggerating a bit, considering 5/6 of the Gauntlet was powered down...it's still Thanos with the Power gem, and I'd love to see Magneto's vaunted shield try to stand up to that.
It was just a blast, but it's not like that blast had the combined power of the six gems.

Just a blast. You have absolutely no way to prove how powerful that blast was. And yes, if Thanos wanted, he could have killed Doom rather easily.

I agree that doom is generally overrated, he is a crime genious and a good wizard and a great planemaster, but is overrated as a fighter.

But in this case, punisher couldnt do anything to doom, doom armor is too much for punisher. Doom could win easily.

Originally posted by demigawd
You don't think Thanos could have hit Doom hard enough to kill him if he wanted to? Terrax did it and Terrax is nothing compared to Thanos. It's great that Doom survived it, a real feat...but like I said, on what planet does not getting TOTALLY owned somehow equate great power? On top of that, Thanos never blasted anyone else, so we don't know how powerful the blast is supposed to be. I'd be more impressed if Thanos blasted and disintegrated the Surfer, then used the same blast on Doom and Doom survived. Thanos never used an energy blast on anyone else during that fight, so we have no point of reference. Please. I never said that not getting totally pwn3d equalled having great power...I was only demonstrating the sheer toughness of Doom's armour, as opposed to Iron Man's, whose name you dropped, and who was swiftly beheaded by Thanos' little girlfriend, IIRC. Could Thanos blast Doom off the face of existence if he wanted? Of course, but that was a moment of panic for him cause Doom was trying to grab his gauntlet while he was down, and just quickly blasted him away to safe distance. No one around here is putting Doom's power at cosmic levels, but standing up to someone like Thanos is a feat in itself.

Cyclops, anyone?

Originally posted by who?-kid
It was just a blast, but it's not like that blast had the combined power of the six gems.

Just a blast. You have absolutely no way to prove how powerful that blast was. And yes, if Thanos wanted, he could have killed Doom rather easily. Perhaps you misread what I wrote...I know it wasn't the full brunt of all six gems...it was only the Power gem, cause the other ones were turned off.

While it wasn't the most powerful blast Thanos could have dished out, it did have some authority behind it...and it's a testament to Doom's armour that it was durable enough to keep him from getting fried.

Originally posted by demigawd
But like i said, if you need powers stolen in a pinch, Doom is your man. But if you need someone to go to war with you, there's another armored cat who you should run to first.

Iron Man? Nah, Doom has a time machine.
Apocalypse? Nah, he's a b!tch.
Ultron? Hmm, he's on speed dial.
Nimrod? I'll call him too.



Yes, "casual" blast like Thanos gave Doom. If Galactus wanted to kill Magneto as Thanos wanted to kill Doom, neither Magneto nor Doom would stand a chance.

Magneto survived a blast from Galactus? Doom survived a blast from the IG? IG > Galactus. See, I can play your game too.



Tell the whole story demigawd:
- K.O.ed Warlock in one shot.
- Killed Kang the Conquerer in one shot after Kang got beat up by Magus.
- Blasted Magus and forced him to hand the IG.

And please, your overrating Magneto so don't even start with Doom. In the world of comics, Doom is the true villain. Magneto's just a b!tch borned with powers. Doom earned everything he has; fought and defeated gods and cosmics using his tech and wit.

And no, not every fight is a NONPREP fight. Even without prep Doom ain't overrated. Where you get this I don't even know.

This is quite possibly the stoopidest thread ever. Dr.Doom took on SPIDERMAN and whipped his ass!

Originally posted by black robb
This is quite possibly the stoopidest thread ever.

I think I have to agree.

A paranoid vigilante with hth and fireweapons mastery, werfare and guerrilla techniques knowledge, master tactician VS a Monarch, former god, former ruler of another universe, etc.
This thread is even crappier than Wolverine beating Godzilla.

Godzilla may TELL you he wasn't ready, but we all know that nobody's ever ready for 5' 3" of clawed canuck buried in their knee.

Originally posted by Lord S
Please. I never said that not getting totally pwn3d equalled having great power...I was only demonstrating the sheer toughness of Doom's armour, as opposed to Iron Man's, whose name you dropped, and who was swiftly beheaded by Thanos' little girlfriend, IIRC.


You're comparing two types of attacks - one was a blast, the other was a bladed weapon. If the LT came to me and said, "let's replay the scene, except Thanos' girlfriend tries to behead Doom instead of Iron Man, how much do you wanna bet that she could NOT do it", I wouldn't bet a damn dime. I'm certain that if Thanos blasted Iron Man and Thanos' girl chopped at Doom, the results would be reversed - headless Doom and hurt Iron Man.

Either way, that says nothing about whose armor is tougher. But IM has proven himself in combat. Doom has not.



I agree, but when people name feats for other characters, it's usually stuff like, "lift mountains" and "move planets", not "not die".



I challenge you to name when Cyclops has ever broken Magneto's shield.

Originally posted by Beyonder
Iron Man? Nah, Doom has a time machine.
Apocalypse? Nah, he's a b!tch.
Ultron? Hmm, he's on speed dial.
Nimrod? I'll call him too.


The funny thing is, I'd take ANY of those guys in a fight over Doom. Any day of the week.



Uh huh. So they've both got pretty good defenses. I just think it's silly to use Doom's ability to survive an uncommitted attack as proof that he can beat somebody in a fight.

Besides, Magneto was able to hold off a sustained attack by the Phoenix, and as GalacticStorm will tell you, PF > IG > Galactus. I still play the game!



Yawn. Warlock has crap durability and gets knocked out all the time.



The same Kang the Conquerer who Thor refused to fight because he was a better opponent for Captain America and SAID so? WOOOWWEEE



You wanna get into a good fighting feats/bad fighting feats contest with Doom? It won't end well for you.



Magneto, despite being a younger character, has FAR more combat feats than Doom. Doom's just an overreaching leech who plots to piggyback on people far more powerful than he is. When left to his own personal power, he gets crushed by the likes of Luke Cage.



S'called history.

Originally posted by demigawd
The funny thing is, I'd take ANY of those guys in a fight over Doom. Any day of the week.

In a fight? You said in a war. You never said in a fight. And even in a fight, Doom would be a better partner than any of them. Try mystical knowledge, Ovoid mind trick, and stragetic mind.

You think Doom saved his mother's soul by directly fighting Mephsito in his own realm? Power ain't everything. He outsmarted Mephisto and won. Magneto's nothing but arrogant brute. Mephisto, Galactus, Surfer, Beyonder, and Watcher would eat him alive.

In a war? Doom is the guy to call, not some terrorist mutant who has yet to realize his dream.



You say that it's silly than why in the same post did you bring up Galactus?



Phoenix? Phoenix and Phoenix force are two different things. And no, I trust GS IMO as much as I trust your's on Magneto - which is less than a thread of string. The IG is more powerful than the Phoenix.

And what are you referring to? Which event? The Rachael Summer's thing?




? The same Warlock who traveled through the realm of Choas and Order being twisted and shredded yet survived? He's weak?




Of course it won't, luckily for Doom he was never turned into a vegetable. Getting defeated is one thing, getting turned into a vegetable is another. Poor poor Magneto's, a sitting vegetable while his Avalon fell apart. And ironically who saves him but Colossus, a former X-Men. Oh the irony.



Yeah, like Luke Cage wouldn't do the same to Magnus if Magnus lost his powers.

More combat feats means what now? That he's better than Doom? How funny is it not that Magneto fights more than Doom yet still not realized his dreams.

Doom:
- Dictator of a small nation, has diplomatic amunity, a voice in the U.N.
- Conquered the world.
- Became godly: Surfer, Galactus, Watcher, Beyonder (even a Cube Being qualifies as godly)
- Is qualified as a cosmic threat
- Thanos has acknowledged Doom as someone he'd keep an eye on.



And in said history Doom has realized most of his dreams while Magneto is nothing but a mutant terrorist with influences on a global level at best.

If Magneto is so powerful, why didn't Warlock enlist him during the battle for the Infinity Gauntlet?

Originally posted by Beyonder
In a fight? You said in a war. You never said in a fight. And even in a fight, Doom would be a better partner than any of them. Try mystical knowledge, Ovoid mind trick, and stragetic mind.


Doom's mystical knowledge is garbage - absolutely useless. He has NO mystical combat feats under his own power. His only mystical combat feats ever were when he had limbo armor and when he sold his soul to demons. He's got nothing on his own, so mysticism is useless. I'll take a guy in armor with CL100 strength over a guy in armor with CL2 strength any day.

And I find few things more useless than the Ovoid mind trick.



No, he did it by begging Dr. Strange (a real mystic) for help. Brilliant strategem.



Uh huh, but they're nothing before the might of Doom, huh? LOL. If any of those people wanted him dead this instant, guess what? He'd be dead this instant and there'd be absolutely nothing he can do about it. Leeching the powers off of someone who doesn't even notice you're alive is impressive in its own way, but it doesn't mean jack in a VS. battle.



Right, and all Doom's genius got him was a front row seat in Hell. Looks like someone's life worked out a bit better than the other in the end, huh?



I brought it up because Doom fanboys always use that as proof of his might...it's nonsense.




GS would take issue with that. Besides, this is the same Phoenix who took down Galactus.



The Volcano storyline.



Spider-Man took him out. Bad durability. Besides, his "good" feat of beating Warlock gets trumped by his bad feat of getting owned by Luke Cage.



That's a good point. being defeated > getting turned into a vegetable.

Unfortunately for Doom, getting turned into a vegetable >>>> having your body destroyed and being dragged into Hell by demons for eternity.



Except Doom had his powers when he got beaten up by Luke Cage. Lot of good that did him, huh?



It means...



You answered your own question!



True, and Doom's fondest dream was being humiliated by the Fantastic Four and ending up in Hell. Looks like he achieved it, huh?


- Lost his body, ended up in Hell.

Doom is a fine character. Like I said, he can leech better than any comic character in history. But there's no reason why anyone should pick him in a fight against anybody (except, of course, Punisher)



Someone hasn't been reading House of M.

Besides, why would Magneto even aspire to anything beyond a global level...he's a political terrorist, with no interest in galactic conquering. Magneto doesn't WANT to be an all-powerful cosmic leech...he wants equal or greater rights for mutants. Just because Doom is the only person who stole power from gods doesn't mean he's the only person capable of it...he's just the only person who wants to do it.



You're implying that Warlock overlooked him because he's too weak. But Wolverine was on that team. So obviously it had nothing to do with power...unless you're trying to say Wolverine is more powerful than Magneto.

You know whats funny this thread was supposed to be about DOOM AND PUNISHER and yet somehow it has turned into Doom versus Magneto

That's usually what happens when Beyonder and I are on the same thread, lol. I've missed you Beyonder.

Originally posted by demigawd
That's usually what happens when Beyonder and I are on the same thread, lol. I've missed you Beyonder.

No, no. You came in here raging about people giving credit for Doom. Then not only that, you interjected Magneto into it when Magneto had nothing to do with this thread. Boy, are you a fanboy. Don't bring me into this. You attacked Doom, then you bs it by throwing your favorite villain into this - trying to shove your love for Magneto down everyones throat.

It's not just cause of Magneto, it's the fact that you try to put Doom down so you can bring up Magneto. Lord S is right, you are fellating Magneto.

Originally posted by demigawd
Doom's mystical knowledge is garbage - absolutely useless. He has NO mystical combat feats under his own power. His only mystical combat feats ever were when he had limbo armor and when he sold his soul to demons. He's got nothing on his own, so mysticism is useless. I'll take a guy in armor with CL100 strength over a guy in armor with CL2 strength any day.

And I find few things more useless than the Ovoid mind trick.

Okay right. The same garbage as Doom being only Class 2. Yeah, useless mind trick yet save Doom's life from the Beyonder.




Begging? See now your just b.s.ing things. Doom never begs. Asking or demanding sure but not begging. Doom saved his mothers soul and outwitted Mephisto.



And the same could be said of Magneto. Except between Doom and Magneto, Doom has beaten these beings. Magneto would rush in spouting homo superior messages and get stomped.

LOL.



What's wrong with hell? He's escape death more than once. So he died, what about it? That takes away from his many other accomplishments?



Take issue with what? Phoenix & PF are two different things. And GS has yet proven that the PF is greater than the IG.

It ain't the same Phoenix. The Phoenix that fought Galactus was more experienced and was tapping into life yet born.



How does that help? Are you refering to when Magneto used the Earth's polarity to give Rachael a stroke?



For the rest of eternity? Please, it ain't for eternity. And no, dying and having demons drag you into hell isn't as bad as becoming drooling vegetable while your citadel gets destroyed and a former X-Men drags you to safety.



Except you said "when he left his personal powers, he gets crushed by the likes of Luke Cage." So which is it?




So atleast we agree on this.




Sort of like him taking over counter Earth huh. Or owning his own country and having a voice in the U.N. Having Thanos taking notice of him.



And? When you die and your a bad person where but hell do you go? It's still not like being turned into a drooling vegetable.



Um, yeah there's something called prep. Heck this thread has him fighting the Punisher and you come in here flaming about how Doom's overrated and that he has few battle feats.

Then you follow up with this:
That said, he destroys Punisher with extreme prejudice. *shrug*

You "shrugged" at the idea that Doom would beat Punisher with extreme prejudice? And please don't try to say it's because of the "extreme prejuidice" part. Truth is, it sickens you that you can't say Punisher would beat Doom.



OMG. And that helps every here how? Be more detailed please.



Mr. Mutant terrorist runs about ranting on and on about Homo Superiors. He can't take anybodies powers even if he wanted to.



Wolverine wasn't on the team that was resurrected by Warlock. Wolverine was just the first wave to be sacrificed. Warlock had Strange bring back Doom.

And again, when has Magneto shown up for a big event? He's mostly a no show. Thanos would laugh at Magneto, not bother with him.

Originally posted by Beyonder
Okay right. The same garbage as Doom being only Class 2. Yeah, useless mind trick yet save Doom's life from the Beyonder.


He knew he couldn't save his mother on his own...he didn't outwit Mephisto, he got Strange to come do it for him. Without Strange, Doom spent year after year with INFINITE prep trying to save his mother, and he got owned by minor demons of Mephisto every time. It took Strange...a REAL magician to do in one try what Doom could not year after year. Doom gets NO credit for that.



Doom hasn't beaten these beings...he stole their power. They weren't fights. Doom is a cosmic-scale leech, but not a fighter. That's my point. Stealing powers from people who don't acknolwedge your existence and thus won't fight you isn't impressive. Make these characters angry and have them come after Doom, then we'll see how he responds. Something tells me that "running" and "screaming" would be part of his brilliant strategy.







:laughing:



Look at it this way. He started his Marvel career as ruler of Latveria. He ended it dead with his worst enemies controlling his beloved country. He apparently did himself more harm than good considering he ended up with less than he started out with.




It was Jean, and no, I'm referring to when Magneto kidnapped the X-men, brought them under a volcano and proceeded to beat the Hell out of them...including Jean/Phoenix.



Luckily for Doom, he's a comic character.



I can't possibly see how you'd believe that, especially when Magneto willed himself back to a completely normal state, more powerful than before...and ended up with his own country in the process.



What I meant by that was without leeching off anybody's godly powers, with just his suit and all the powers inside the suit, he got owned by Luke Cage.




Wow. Barren self-destroying wasteland. there was nothing to take over...he just came in and said, "I'm in control! Yaaay!". *I* could have made that declaration. Where's the feat there?



Magneto did it with Genosha - owned his own country, had a voice in the UN. So what?



lol...some feat! Someone else noticed him!!!



Which is true. Doom is overrated. You came here and turned it into another Doom vs. Magneto thread.



Maybe you get emotional about that stuff, but I don't, lol. I just call it like it is...Doom beats Punisher. I think Doom could beat Spider-Man too, or Captain America. Daredevil, even. I wouldn't go much further than that, though without going into power leech mode.



Magneto restructured the entire planet so that he's in control. Doom, Strange, Apocalypse, etc. are all powerless lackeys.



Magneto could easily destroy the planet if he wants to...that's not his aim. He could easily boost his powers if he wants to, but his goal isn't about becoming a god, it's about mutant rights, so it's not even something he ever considered. So you couldn't possibly say he can't take anybodies powers even if he wanted to.



Magneto wasn't in any wave....he just didn't participate. Neither did lots of extremely powerful heroes and villains. Blame the writers, don't try to make it out to be some conscious decision by the characters to exclude Magneto. That's silly.



He was there for Secret Wars I and II, he CAUSED Onslaught, he IS House of M. He not only participated in all the big events, he was the instrumental force BEHIND a number of them. What big crossovers has Doom engineered?

is this doom vs magneto ?

Are we forgetting Dr. Doom took over the world like three times and gave it back?

I think a few guns wouldnt make a difference.

Dr. Doom obliterates Punisher with his heat rays and instant death rays.

And if were talking Magneto, Dr. Doom has anti-magnetized metal, thats what his armor is made out of. Im sure he can make some machines like that too that Magneto would run from because he cant do crap to them.

Is this still going on??

Iron Man has anti-magnetized metal too. Fat lot of good that did against Magneto, who just switched up frequencies until IM couldn't keep up. Fat lot of good that did against ceramic sentinels too, who weren't even made out of metal, but couldn't save themselves from Magneto controlling the circuitry inside. Remember, Mags controls electricity too. Unless Doom powers his suit with something other than electricity (he doesn't), he's still vulnerable.

But you guys are right, this is Punisher vs. Doom. So I won't mention any more on the Magneto/Doom subject.

none of us know what Doom's present armor is powered by.

Yes we do. mini-nuke reactor, standard circuitry. That's what his own one shot says.

his own shot? u mean thats what a directory from the eighties says. Doom's armor has changed a lot since then...the true Doom... FF#350

Nah, someone on here posted a long time ago technical information from a Marvel Science Guide that specialized in Doom's tech, and it explained the whole thing. I think it was dated in the 1990s.

no it wasnt. It was from the old directory. And FF#350 disproved just about everything we assumed about Doom before then.

Regardless, why are people only exploring the ways Punisher could potentially harm Doom, why not consider the ways Doom could harm Castle? Isnt Castle clearly, vastly more vulnerable than Doom? And why assume Castle would some how get ahead of Doom in strategy? Punisher out strategizes crooks and thugs on the street...Doom outsmarts the Surfer, Watcher, Galactus, and the Beyonder...anything Castle can throw at him, Im sure Doom has already planned for contingency like he says, ie FF#375.

Originally posted by demigawd
He knew he couldn't save his mother on his own...he didn't outwit Mephisto, he got Strange to come do it for him. Without Strange, Doom spent year after year with INFINITE prep trying to save his mother, and he got owned by minor demons of Mephisto every time. It took Strange...a REAL magician to do in one try what Doom could not year after year. Doom gets NO credit for that.

His whole plan was to betray Strange in the end. He did so which caused his mother not to love him anymore after the betrayal. After that change of heart by his mother, though Doom lost his mother's love - her soul was set free from Mephisto's grip. Doom and Strange escape. Doom won that one. Strange was dooped the whole time.




He stole Galactus' powers to fight the Beyonder. They fought, he then stole the Beyonder's powers and left Beyonder weakened. Stole Galactus powers and Odin had to show up to stop Doom.



But he accomplished all that by himself. He wasn't born into royalty nor with powers. His suit and everything is by him. I'm not talking about what appearance here. Throughout the course of their lives Doom earned everything.




And you said Magneto withstood an attack right? We both know Phoenix is capable of wiping out Magneto. Magneto beating the hell out of the Phoenix ain't the same Phoenix that battled Galactus. If your going to argue that it is to show Magneto beat the Phoenix Galactus didn't, then you've got to be kidding me. Cause than you'd have Magneto > Phoenix > Galactus.



And too true of Magneto. Who came back to life as well.



And when those Sentinels attacked and leveled Genosha, where was his country then?



Barren wasteland? The Heroes Reborn Universe wasn't barren was it? Hell, it had it's own S.H.I.E.L.D,Inhumans, etc.



And how long did he get to keep it?



Someone named Thanos...The Mad Titan...Champion of Mistress Death...Former Wielder of the IG & GOD of the Universe...Former Wielder of HOTU & GOD of the Multiverse.

Magneto's been acknowledge by who...? Apocalypse? The jobber of the X-Men...The Much Hyped Nobody Villain? And no, Apocalypse isn't Thanos lite.



You insulted Doom being overrated when his match is with the Punisher. Later you insulted Doom again and brought up Magneto. Don't blame anybody but yourself.



Then why *shrug*? You came in here blasting Doom and you say you don't get emotional?



Like Doom hasn't conquered the world. One accomplishment and Magneto's all that? SW I: killed Kang, took control of Ultron & the villains, broke into Galactus' World ship & defenses, stole Galactus' powers, fought Beyonder & stole his power, controlled that world as well, killed the heroes including Magneto. The were only brought back by Beyonder's trickery.

Make's Magneto's feat look like small potatoes.



Now he can destroy the planet. His goal is for his race to rule. With more power, he can take control of things easier. Don't tell me Magneto is the diplomatic type, he's mostly attain his goals through fighting. He ain't Xavier.



If any villain would join in, it'd be Magneto. He's a reasonable person for the most part. A mad man like Thanos aiming to kill most of the universe including innocent mutants isn't exactly something he'd ignore.




He was there to follow Captain America's orders. He didn't cause Onslaught. You make it sound like he planned the whole thing - as if becoming a vegetable and helping spawn a psycho like Onslaught was all part of his brillant planning. He wasn't even there for the Onslaught Saga, heck Xavier was the host. Doom was involved however. Then he later conquered the Heroes Reborn Universe.

House of M? One event and Magneto's all that? Where was Magneto during IG, IW, The End? Cosmic scaled events that affects Earth and all of existence? Doom 2099 anyone?

Doom isn't overrated.

People just don't like the fact that he's actually as good as intelligent comic fans say he is. That's all there is to it.

Morons on this board overrating people doesn't actually mean that we all are. I've never overrated Doom a single bit, nor has any other established poster on this board from what I've seen (and I've seen quite a bit).

You only went 20 pages with me because you kept weaseling out of things but bringing precise science into the fray.

In closing, Doom is overrated? I think you better take a look at Punisher, Rogue, Storm, Gambit and all the other people who have been viewed as challengers for Dr. Doom.

If anything Doom is getting underrated purposefully because you can't handle the fact that he's the man.

-AC

Wow!!! This thread went 6 pages? What the--

Doctor Doom will win trust me on this.

Doctor Doom is one of the most overrated characters in these boards as a fighter, that is a fact. He is a cool character, but he has never been as good as a fighter as too much people in these boards are trying to post.

Originally posted by bakerboy
Doctor Doom is one of the most overrated characters in these boards as a fighter, that is a fact. He is a cool character, but he has never been as good as a fighter as too much people in these boards are trying to post.
I kinda agree... a bit lol.

Fighting wise, he's nothing special, and don't give me the "The man fought a freaking lion !" So ? Nothing special in comic land lol.

Now, when we are talking about Power, then Doom is a force to be reckoned with. Punisher can not handle Doom. Easy as pie.

But Doom isn't always as clever or cunning as people seem to think. Just like anybody else, he makes mistakes, mostly the same ones : he overestimates himself and underestimates his opponent.

Originally posted by who?-kid
I kinda agree... a bit lol.

Fighting wise, he's nothing special, and don't give me the "The man fought a freaking lion !" So ? Nothing special in comic land lol.

Now, when we are talking about Power, then Doom is a force to be reckoned with. Punisher can not handle Doom. Easy as pie.

But Doom isn't always as clever or cunning as people seem to think. Just like anybody else, he makes mistakes, mostly the same ones : he overestimates himself and underestimates his opponent.

Well he underestimates his opponents when it's someone like Richards but I don't think he'd be overestimating himself if he thought, "Frank Castle you are an insignificant gnat and DOOM shall destroy you!"

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Well he underestimates his opponents when it's someone like Richards
That's a bit stupid of Doom, don't you think ?

Hm, same here lol, also a bit stupid.

I don't want to sound like a third rate fortune cookie, but a true warrior and wise man doesn't underestimate a living soul. And not trying to make a God of War of Punisher, but he can be quite dangerous and unpredictable when he wants to be.

If Doom really is stupid enough to mock Punisher and turn his back to him, he could be very well be making himself a new armor the next day. Because the old one will have a few dents in it (thanks to Punishers trusty rocket launcher )

Realistically though. It's The Punisher Vs Dr. Doom.

There's one outcome and one outcome only. Love, like, dislike or hate. Doom wins this fight.

I'm a huge fan of The Punisher. He's one of my very top characters story-wise. I just don't see what the point is of coming in and saying "But if Punisher did this....".

No, he's not winning.

-AC

I was just kidding.
Besides:
Fanboy Doom = has contingency plan for everything and wrestles lions for fun
Fanboy Batman = stops all with his mighty martial arts and bottomless utility belt
Fanboy Spidey = dodges everything and anything that gets thrown at him
Fanboy Wolvie = can regenerate from a single molecule of DNA unaided in a matter of minutes

Which of the above is proven to be more true?

Yeah.

-AC

All Doom would have to do is steal his powers.

I'm glad to hear that people on this board nowadays are taking a far more rational view of Doom than they have in the past. Nothing to add!

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I was just kidding.
Besides:
Fanboy Doom = has contingency plan for everything and wrestles lions for fun
Fanboy Batman = stops all with his mighty martial arts and bottomless utility belt
Fanboy Spidey = dodges everything and anything that gets thrown at him
Fanboy Wolvie = can regenerate from a single molecule of DNA unaided in a matter of minutes

You forgot Fanboy Thanos, Fanboy Superman and Fanboy Hulk.

Oh, and since he's pretty hot the last few weeks (and also invincible I have the impression) Fanboy Deathstroke.

Did I forget anybody ?

you forget fanboy captain america: best figher ever, most perfect human ever and greatest patriotic ever. Doestn matter than his oponent could lift more than 100 tons or have a lot of superpowers, one of two fighting movements from the best fighter ever and end of battle.

Originally posted by bakerboy
you forget fanboy captain america: best figher ever, most perfect human ever and greatest patriotic ever.
Damn damn damn, I should have known that one

Originally posted by demigawd
You're comparing two types of attacks - one was a blast, the other was a bladed weapon. If the LT came to me and said, "let's replay the scene, except Thanos' girlfriend tries to behead Doom instead of Iron Man, how much do you wanna bet that she could NOT do it", I wouldn't bet a damn dime. I'm certain that if Thanos blasted Iron Man and Thanos' girl chopped at Doom, the results would be reversed - headless Doom and hurt Iron Man.

Either way, that says nothing about whose armor is tougher. But IM has proven himself in combat. Doom has not. Then you, sir, are lost.

I disagree...surviving and enduring, when everyone else around you is getting pwn3d, is an enormous feat, especially when against an enemy as powerful as Thanos was at the time.

If you remember during 'Cosmic Powers', Thanos didn't actually beat Tyrant...he stood up to him when everybody else got their asses handed to them. That was the feat and a lot of people recognize it and give him respect for it. Don't you?

Oh wait, let me guess...no, because Magneto can probably do it too, right?

X-Men #1.

BTW, you still haven't explained why Magneto wasn't involved in the IG saga...let me guess, cause he was too good for it, right? Like Phoenix supposedly was, too?

You X-fans, ugh...

That isn't actually Fanboy Captain America that everyone described.

Just regular Captain America.

-AC

neat.........

Originally posted by who?-kid
You forgot Fanboy Thanos, Fanboy Superman and Fanboy Hulk.

Oh, and since he's pretty hot the last few weeks (and also invincible I have the impression) Fanboy Deathstroke.

Did I forget anybody ?

Phoenix Fanboy: PF=Source>Lucifer, Michael, LT, IG

Magneto Fanboy: Ironblood trick, nerve shut down...OMG Gladiator's dead, BB's dead

During Marvel Universe:THE END, Akenathon sayed he kept an eye on Doom cause he was one the major threats to his celestial might.
Doom has almost always a contigency plan for most situations, he's one of the greatest minds in the MU, and his armor is sufficiently advanced he was able to knock unconscious Adam Warlock and to kill Kang, who's armor is high-tech from the future.
The Punisher has nothing he can use on Doom.
Bullets, explosives, grenades, rocket launchers, are useless.
Frank Castle only chance is to call some high caliber guy if he wants to win or survive.

Originally posted by Lord S
Then you, sir, are lost.


You trying to say that Thanos' cosmically-powered girlfriend would have been incapable of beheading Doom???



It's only a feat if you stood up to the same attack everybody else fell to. Thanos only blasted Doom...he took far more direct and fatal action against everybody else. So while it may be an impressive feat, we don't know just how impressive it is because Thanos didn't energy blast anybody else. Maybe Iron Man could have survived the same blast? Hell, maybe Cap with his shield could have. We really have no basis for comparison, so it's not as impressive as you Doom fanboys make it out to be.



No, I don't. I don't think it's impressive at all, and would never add that to a Thanos respect thread. Thanos powered himself up and still fell short. I think it's accurate given Thanos' place, but not impressive.



A Magneto "fanboy", or someone who sees Magneto as being a lot more powerful than he is would have Magneto beating the likes of Silver Surfer, Terrax and Morg. I think Magneto loses virtually every time to Surfer and Morg and a solid majority to Terrax. But Magneto also obliterates the likes of Thor, Gladiator, Hulk, Doom or Blackbolt. Nothing fanboyish about it.



Bullshit. If you're referring to X-men #1 from 1992, Magneto doesn't even fight the X-men in it. If you're referring to X-men #1 from 1963, he put up a passive field, not a forcefield. Passive fields are unreinforced by his will and power and are disruptable - the Defenders did it too. It's not the same as a forcefield, which hasn't been broken. To compare the two, compare the case of Scott breaking Magneto's passive field in X-men #1 to all subsequent attempts by Scott to get through Magneto's actual forcefields.



I did explain it...it has nothing to do with the characters themselves. The writers decide participants. Magneto's goals and committments are to mutants rights. IG has nothing to do with him, as far as he's concerned. I'm not sure what point you and Beyonder are trying to make with that. That Magneto didn't participate because he wasn't powerful enough? Captain America participated. You're trying to say that Cap is more powerful than Magneto? Of course you're not. So...what are you trying to say?



Not Fanboy Magneto, actual Magneto. Why? Because he's done both...many times. Sorry!

Thanos staying against Tyrant isn't impressive?
demigawd you should retire.
Jack Of Hearts, Morg, SS, cosmic guys with sufficient power to level planets were beat down from JOH.
Thanos is a force to reckon with, powered up or not, he's in a league of his own.

The fact that he's a force to be reckoned with and in a league of his own is precisely what makes simply surviving against Tyrant unimpressive...it's what's expected of him. Thanos is so good that you can fill a respect thread with nothing but combat victories. That's not the case with Doom. That's my point.

I think that the stuff about "doom was blasted by thanos with infinity gaunlet and he survived" is an old bullshit. For me, if i remember well, the only impressive individual figthing thanos was thor, who give serious troubles to thanos even with the infinity gaunlet.

It's not bullshit, Doom went to grab the gauntlet, and Thanos quickly blasted him away. So it happened, but it's not nearly as impressive as it was made out to be by the fanboys. It was an instinctive, quick shot designed to prevent the gauntlet from being taken. It wasn't committed at all.

Why is this Magneto vs Doom? It should be Punisher vs Doom in which case I thought there was consensus that Doom is likely to win.

Im agree with you, demigawd. What i was trying to say is that thing happened, its true, but it wasnt that impressive at all. Yourself has explained it very well.

Well, I'm not talking about Magneto anymore, lol. Now we're just discussing the validity of Doom feats. But yeah, while how high up Doom is on the food chain is subject to debate, the fact that he's higher up than Punisher is not.

And what is more, a lot of people, as demigawd has said before, could stand that blast that doom recieved. Cap with his shield could, thor could, hulk could, iron man could, etc.

May I just highlight that the Thanos quickly blasting Doom doesn't demean the power of the blast any. He just reacted quickly. He didn't focus on Doom.

He DID blast him with a fully willed power though. So lets not demean what's there.

Cap could have stood the blast? Have you read the IG, Baker? His shield got shattered by Thanos' fists. Let alone the gauntlet.

Hulk has taken much worse, so yeah. Thor, yeah I'd imagine so.

Iron-Man? Hahaaaahahaha. Good one. I'm sure he would have if Terraxia hadn't beheaded hi....oh wait.

Why is this detrimental to Doom? So Hulk and Thor could take it also. So? Two of Marvel's top flight. What are you trying to prove?

What's the etc? Name these additional people. Coz half of the ones you just named couldn't take the blast.

Moreover, why is this relevant? It's The Punisher Vs Doom.

Don't understand why everyone felches the debaters on here. You need to go 80 miles off topic to get anywhere.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Moreover, why is this relevant? It's The Punisher Vs Doom.

Don't understand why everyone felches the debaters on here. You need to go 80 miles off topic to get anywhere.

-AC I think demi was the first one to derail this thread with his name-dropping antics of a few days ago. The thread simply lost focus since then. I've only tried to make the point about the durability of Doom's armour...which demi continues to ignore.

Anyway, keeping in the spirit of off-topic...

Originally posted by demigawd
You trying to say that Thanos' cosmically-powered girlfriend would have been incapable of beheading Doom??? Where in the world did you read that?

You were trying to tell me that Iron Man was beheaded with a 'bladed weapon'...your glasses must have been foggy when you were reading that, cause I didn't see any bladed weapon on her. It looked like she just pulled his head off. Plus you tried to demean Doom, even though he withstood a blast that would have shattered IM to a million pieces. There's no basis to make that assumption, you say? Didn't Stark himself at one time admit to himself that Doom's armour was on a whole 'nother level compared to his? I believe so. You do the math from there.

Let's examine a contradiction of yours for a second...

It's only a feat if you stood up to the same attack everybody else fell to.

Did Thanos not stand up to the same attack as Terrax, Morg, SS, Gladiator, BRB, Jack, and that girl (can't remember her name) when he fought Tyrant? Yes. Oh wait...now you're saying you're not impressed cause it was 'expected' of him cause he powered himself up...well was it 'expected' of Doom to survive a blast from the IG? Did he power himself up? No. Did he face the same Thanos that everyone else faced, in terms of power and tenacity? Yes.

Contradiction in your belief? Yes.

So while it may be an impressive feat,

So you acknowledge that the feat was impressive, right?

we don't know just how impressive it is because Thanos didn't energy blast anybody else. Maybe Iron Man could have survived the same blast? Hell, maybe Cap with his shield could have. We really have no basis for comparison, so it's not as impressive as you Doom fanboys make it out to be.

Fanboy? FANBOY?

Whenever Thanos attacked someone, he meant it...and it was probably at least tenfold from what he was capable of without the IG...and it's rather ridiculous to think that he let up when blasting Doom.

Put yourself in that position...you're fighting a legion of heroes, you get nailed by Mjolnir and drop to the ground...the Gauntlet is vulnerable...someone comes to grab it, is your first instinct not to blow that motherf*cker away as far as possible?

Hopefully you'll understand now.

--

As for bakerboy and his illinformed half-truths...your opinions don't count around here anymore, cause you were considered null and void quite some time ago. You are an exceedingly simple individual to figure out. You have decided to take up a position on this debate, just to be on a side, any side, and yet you lack even the simplest faculties to be a useful part of it. Your logic is deficient, at best. Continue waving the flag, though...it's amusing. You and Mider should hook up with stormfront and create your own little clique...we'll call you the Axis of Idiocy, cause it suits your personas to a tee.

Originally posted by Lord S
I think demi was the first one to derail this thread with his name-dropping antics of a few days ago. The thread simply lost focus since then. I've only tried to make the point about the durability of Doom's armour...which demi continues to ignore.


That's right, blame me. I just said Doom is overrated and did things other people have done, which is on-topic. Beyonder blew up one little example I used and made it the focus of the rest of the discussion. Wasn't MY fault.

I'm not ignoring anything. Doom took a shot from Thanos. Bully for him. He got wasted by Terrax in one attack. Oops.



Your quote that "then you'd lose", when I said, "If some cosmic wanted to make a bet with me that Doom wouldn't get his head taken off by Thanos' chick, I wouldn't take him up on it". You're implying by your response that I'd lose the bet because Doom couldn't get his head taken off by her. He can...he would.



just re-reviewed it. You're correct. She could *pull* Doom's head off too.



Heroes always say things to make themselves appear to be the underdog. Look at how often Superman says, "Wow, he's even stronger than I am!" two seconds before completely owning his opponent, then he says afterwards, "I was lucky to have pulled that off!". I care about feats, not statements. For example:

A LESS powerful Terrax completely fused and incapaciated Doom's armor in one shot.

A FULL POWERED Terrax was beaten fair and square in combat by Iron Man, and Iron Man took multiple shots from Terrax.

Doom admitted that he needed trickery to lure Surfer into the room and he had to take care not to agitate the Surfer for his own safety.

Iron Man beat Surfer...TWICE.

THAT is what we call a basis for comparison. Saying that Thanos' blast would shatter IM into a million pieces is pure speculation.



I'm not impressed because I expect Thanos to have the power to do that, especially with the orb. Ditto with him beating up Surfer...it's something I'd expect.



You're misunderstanding me. I said Thanos can fill a book with battle victories. There's no need to throw in survival feats the way people do with Doom. Doom didn't survive the same attack that killed everybody else. He survived an energy blast that was unused on anybody else. And given how Terrax manhandled Doom, I don't believe for a second that it was a full-powered blast from Thanos. Let's put Doom in the path of the same Thanos fist that destroyed Cap's shield and see if he survives. If he does...then it's a feat.



I acknowledged that he MAY be an impressive feat.



And I qualified it here by saying we don't know HOW impressive, because Thanos didn't use that attack against anybody else. It's entirely possible that Thanos intentionally let Doom and others survive, given how he taunted Doom later instead of simply killing him.



Not really...he bitchslapped Doom away with a power blast. I think a lot of characters could have survived that attack, given how Doom's armor was defeated by the likes of Terrax, Thing and Luke Cage.



Sure, but my fastest attack isn't going to be my most committed or powerful. If someone jumps on me, my first instinct is to turn and get them away from me as quickly as possible. Then deal with them when I identify them.



Guess I was away for a long while...where'd all this animosity with him come from?

I know I've missed a few things, but last I checked, I thought this thread was about whether or not Punisher stood a chance against Doom, not any of the other jibber-jabber that's been brought up. Maybe it's just me though.

its you.....no wait u r a mod * goes to armored form * and jumps to a different thread....

Originally posted by demigawd
That's right, blame me. I just said Doom is overrated and did things other people have done, which is on-topic. Beyonder blew up one little example I used and made it the focus of the rest of the discussion. Wasn't MY fault.

"Doom is overrated blah blah blah"

If there's war, there's "another armored cat you should run to first."

Nah, course you didn't go off topic... What you said was a page before I posted. Don't blame me. Your the Magneto fanboy going off topic.



Something you expected and therefore your not impressed? Then what level would you rank Thanos if you didn't use examples of his fights with Thor, Surfer, Tyrant, Odin, etc. as feats?

How the hell do you even know what to expect of the character without looking at their fights?

Not impressive because you expected it? I guess we should throw out Thanos's fights with Odin, Tyrant, Beyonder, Walker, and Galactus as unimpressive because you expected his powers to be around this level right? And this expectation is based on...

Look Dr Doom is in a another class. Take Spiderman, Wolverine, Punisher and daredevil (with both sides having prep time) - Dr Doom would stomp the holy mess out of them - Do not make thread comparing Dr Doom to infadels.

Originally posted by Nataku8188
Doom is one badass mother****er. He beat a full grown lion, while he was naked, and was still pretty disoriented.

I'm sure this already came up, but I didn't feel like reading all 8 pages of this mess.

Didn't the Punisher kill a full grown BEAR with his bare hands, however? The defeat of vicious, ferocious animals doesn't really say too much honestly. And if you think it does well... A Bear is larger, stronger, and just plain better than a Lion.

I can only recall Frank punching a polar bear in the face and then running away, getting it all riled up so that it'd eat the gangsters chasing him. Then he threw the mob boss wench in with it and watched it maul her.

I love Frank.

First of all, to my dear friend lord s, guy, relax, we are only talking about comic characters, you neednt to insult anybody. The personal offenses are out of place here. If you cant post your arguments without insults, you are just acting childish.

Lets go with the anwsers:

Cap could have stood the blast? Have you read the IG, Baker? His shield got shattered by Thanos' fists. Let alone the gauntlet.


Yeah, i read it but a long time ago, about 10 years or more. So, excuses if i cant remember some of the things that happened in tha comic. But surely that he shattered cap's shield first because he knowed that it was one of the most powerful weapons there, he concentrate in it before because he knows that it could stand his regular blasts, like doom recieved.

iron-Man? Hahaaaahahaha. Good one. I'm sure he would have if Terraxia hadn't beheaded hi....oh wait.

Yeah, iron man could stand that blast because his armor is mor powerful than dooms and could stand what doom could and more. And about terraxia, she could had behead doom too, so what?. Iron man did beat thanos, terrax, silver surfer, hulk, thor, etc. and the first three in a power vs power fight, not any trick like dooms used against surfer. Could you say the same about doom? Id say not. And what is more, doom armor has been damaged by the likes or luke cage, the thing or the beast.



What's the etc? Name these additional people. Coz half of the ones you just named couldn't take the blast.

Beasides cap with his shield, hulk, thor and iron man, and if i remember well the people who was there, lets see who are the etc: Vision, thing, invisible woman. And that is for the people who i think that i can remember well, but surely im forgetting more people. Maybe some of those people wasnt there, because as i have said , i read that comic 10 years ago or more.

Don't understand why everyone felches the debaters on here. You need to go 80 miles off topic to get anywhere.

If you dont understand it, dont go with the same argument. Stop on talk about it.

In the etc group you could include scarlet witch, drax, warlock, silver surfer, namor, she hulk, doctor strange, quasar. And for not talk about cosmic people like galactus and others.