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The confusion about the strenght levels of characters in various topics lead me to do this.

Class 100 Strenght
It means, the character can lift at least or at max 100 Tons.
Pick up Maestro Hulk for example.
He has a base level strenght which grants him to lift 200 tons, without being mad or enraged.
It means he possess Class 100 Strenght, altough, of a low level, compared to that of powerhouses like Gladiator, Thor, Hercules, Namor, Superman, Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel, Genis Vell.
Those characters starts out with being able to lift huge weights.
Gladiator has a strenght which grants him to destroy planets with his bare hands or lift the FF4 building.
Thor can lift huge buildings too, smash asteroids, or even lift a part of the Jormungand Serpent.
Hercules was able to lift Manhattan.
Namor lifted submarines and huge ships.
Superman has moved Warworld, and lifted huge starships.
Captain Marvel has strenght of Superman's magnitude altough I don't know feats of strenght he has showed in terms of lifting or pushing, altough he K.O.ed the Man Of Steel with two fists.
WW can throw down with CM or Supes too, and has lifted a huge starship of city size.
Genis Vell was able to beat down King Thor with both physical and energy attacks, but here we are talking of physical force.Genis has throw down with Maestro Hulk, who was getting considerable pissed off, and showed his own.

Now, the guys mentioned above are ranked like this:

Incalculable Rank Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
Here are those who possess powers which grant them to reach strenght levels potentially unlimited, or who possess a strenght who hasn't showed actually a limit.
Gladiator, Hulk, Magni(Son of Thor), Thanos, Tyrant, Morg any GL with sufficient will power, Juggernaut, in order of feats: Trion version, 8th Day Version, Classical Version, Drax with power gem, Ravage, Odin, Zeus.
(THE CHARACTERS ARE NOT LISTED FOR LEVEL OF STRENGHT)

High Rank Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
Here are those who can lift huge weights of even hundred thousands of tons or more:
Thor, Superman, Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel, Hercules in half-god version, Namor in water or very recently exited from water, Count Nefaria full power, Drax without pg, Maxam, Wonder Man.
(THE CHARACTERS ARE NOT LISTED FOR LEVEL OF STRENGHT)

Mid Rank Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
Here are those who can lift not hundred thousands of tons but "just" thousands of tons.
She-Hulk, Namor outta water from not dangerous time period.


Low Rank Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
Here are those who can lift weights that don't reach the 1000 tons of weight.
Colossus, Abomination, Spikey Thing, Iron Man powered by sufficient energy source, Namor outta water from considerable time period, Hulk with in a low level of rage.

Under Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
THING, Namor outta water from prolonged period, Wonder Man, Hulk in a totally calm state, Grey Hulk.

excellent post

not all class 100 are created equal

Exactly theyr all in the same class but some are lower in that class and others are higher. And all have a chance to go toe to toe to others in that very same class.

Very good, K3.

ahhhmmmmmm superman and wonder woman should be up there with the incalculable class 100


supes moved warworld for petes sakes


and ww stopped asmodels chariot from falling onto earth. and the touch of it made her burn.

they are definitely up there

"supes moved warworld for petes sakes"

Regular Supes or Sundiped?

"and ww stopped asmodels chariot from falling onto earth. and the touch of it made her burn."

Out of exceptional ones she doesnt have regular feats of that level to be incalculable.

In the end they would never be in the same level of the class than Zeus and the like. My opinion.

Originally posted by Solidus Snake
ahhhmmmmmm superman and wonder woman should be up there with the incalculable class 100


supes moved warworld for petes sakes


and ww stopped asmodels chariot from falling onto earth. and the touch of it made her burn.

they are definitely up there
Odin or Zeus can do the same tapping in Odin Force and Olympian power, they can even do things above that.
Superman has a limit, high but it's there.
Thor lifted a part of Jormungand which weight is sayed to be unlimited, but I insert him in High Rank section cause lifting a part means he's around Supes and the others league, but not above, not above.
WW has some great feats but it doesn't mean she has no strenght limits.

So where does that leave the likes of Genis, Quasar, Surfer etc...I know Surfer can augment his Strength through the power cosmic, but to what limit? And as for Genis in the Marvel Directory it says he can only lift about 15 tons, now im guessing he can also augment that using the Nega Bands, but again to what limit?

Originally posted by K3VIL
Odin or Zeus can do the same tapping in Odin Force and Olympian power, they can even do things above that.
Superman has a limit, high but it's there.
Thor lifted a part of Jormungand which weight is sayed to be unlimited, but I insert him in High Rank section cause lifting a part means he's around Supes and the others league, but not above, not above.
WW has some great feats but it doesn't mean she has no strenght limits.

What would happen if someone with unlimited strength were to try and lift something with unlimited weight?

On a planet that's indestructible?

"What would happen if someone with unlimited strength were to try and lift something with unlimited weight?"

Thats the very essence of the cosmic truth

"So where does that leave the likes of Genis, Quasar, Surfer etc...I know Surfer can augment his Strength through the power cosmic, but to what limit?"

Below skyfathers like Zeus and odin.

superman can also augnment his strength. w/o sundipping (although that helps)


if supes doesnt belong in that category, neither does gladiator

Supes without Sundipped doesnt usually augments his strenght. And surely not for the levels above.

as far as i could tell supes has no real upper limit. especially in the sun.

Originally posted by olympian
"What would happen if someone with unlimited strength were to try and lift something with unlimited weight?"

Thats the very essence of the cosmic truth

"So where does that leave the likes of Genis, Quasar, Surfer etc...I know Surfer can augment his Strength through the power cosmic, but to what limit?"

Below skyfathers like Zeus and odin.

Thanx... but then why does Marvel Directory say that Genis can only lift 15 tons (I know the Directory is very innacurrate, but thats a huge jump from 15 tons to incaculable god like strength.)

that list isn't bad. i disagree with glads though. he shouldn't be above thor. he has said himself that thor is his equal in strength. (ff #339) count nefaria has always shown himself to be far stronger than thor. abomination would be higher than he is ranked - takes hulk getting pretty pissed to take him out. (abomination almost KILLED hulk recently until hulk got really pissed)

it also doesn't make sense including cosmics in the list. tyrant? odin? zeus? they're too powerful to use physical might anyway, so why bother trying to put them on a list?

Silver Surfer is a cosmic and ive seen him use Physical force, but yea your right they usually stay away from engaging in physical force.

There is no actual 'class' system, it was created by people who were trying to categorize character's strength into brackets. On that note, we have no idea if Thor could lift 100 tons, or maybe just 97, or maybe he's having a bad day and he can only lift 90, maybe he got lucky, and he's feeling great and lifts 110.

Class 100 is meant to label a character as being able to lift (press) an amount of weight equal to, or greater than, something in the 100 tons range. 100 tons is two hundered thousand (200,000) pounds.

That being said, you classification system is useless. Writers have no sense of weight, characters like Superman have shown the ability to move planets in some writers, and I've seen him have trouble breaking metals before. A classification system is useless when no writer is always on a character. A character like Azrael for example, had the same writer for 100 issues. At no point in the series did his power fluxtuate without explanation, whereas if you read all of Wolverine's comics, his healing factor, speed and strength all range greatly based on the writer and the situation. This isn't bad writing, rather, it's just one writer's ideas compared to another. You may agree with one writer and not another, but someone else might feel the opposite way. Generally, a character's abilities are best gauged when displayed in their original story with their creator. Deadpool, for example, was much different, mentally and physically, with Liefield and Nicieza writing him then someone like, Priest, or Hardling.

If you MUST classify someone, it has to be EXTREMELY precise, or EXTREMELY vague, such as Marvel's current system. Ranking from 1-7 is really, really bad for comparing characters, whereas if you use the superhero rpg game (www.classicmarvel.com) their gaming system is much more complex, yet accurate. The strength class system is, in theory, very good, except that class 100 is an extremely vague point in an otherwise precise system. 'Class 100' characters regularly do things above and beyond their 'normal' strength, unlike characters like, say Daredevil, who may have had an instance or two where he displayed superhuman strength, while we all know he does not have this. Hulk, in Secret War, held up an entire mountain while calm, Wolverine, in Venom's monthly, took a direct hit from a very powerful missile, events like these are why classification is difficult and often inaccurate.

Sorry K3vil, you worked awful hard to do this, but it was all sort of a waste. If you REALLY want to do a good 'class 100' system, build a list of a characters USUAL strength levels, compared to some of their highest and lowest showings, to give a general range of their strength.

good post, nak. i agree completely.

Yeah I use Classic Marvel's 'Universal Table' as well...it's extremely accurate, that's why I really don't buy much of what GS says about the power of the Phoenix...cause they only have the Phoenix Force rated as a Class 1000 in all aspects of power, (with the exceptions of Flight and Gateway, which are 3000 and 5000).

Of course if GS is right, that means they have some updating to do.

Originally posted by olympian
"What would happen if someone with unlimited strength were to try and lift something with unlimited weight?"

Thats the very essence of the cosmic truth

"So where does that leave the likes of Genis, Quasar, Surfer etc...I know Surfer can augment his Strength through the power cosmic, but to what limit?"

Below skyfathers like Zeus and odin.
Genis absorb photonic energy and other kinds of energy through nega-bands and he can absorb on his own solar energy, he has mastered his powers, he walked on King Thor, no reason why he should lose to Odin or Zeus, maybe he can stalemate them.
Quasar stalemated with Silver Surfer, I think it say all.

From Solidus Snake

superman can also augnment his strength. w/o sundipping (although that helps)


if supes doesnt belong in that category, neither does gladiator

Gladiator fought Ego, and with success.
Thanos sayed his powers dwarf his own.
Thanos his above Superman, and so his a full confident Gladiator, his powers comes from his psicokinetic ability to enhance his abilities to the level he need.
Originally posted by leonidas
that list isn't bad. i disagree with glads though. he shouldn't be above thor. he has said himself that thor is his equal in strength. (ff #339) count nefaria has always shown himself to be far stronger than thor. abomination would be higher than he is ranked - takes hulk getting pretty pissed to take him out. (abomination almost KILLED hulk recently until hulk got really pissed)

it also doesn't make sense including cosmics in the list. tyrant? odin? zeus? they're too powerful to use physical might anyway, so why bother trying to put them on a list?
Count Nefaria isn't stronger than Thor, he can stalemate him for a while and gain upper hand, but he's not above.Lifting a mountain or a building is nothing Thor can't do.Nefaria's power also depends on ionic nrg sources at his disposal.Without them, he can be stomped from Captain America alone, like it happened before.
Abomination didn't almost killed Hulk, he stalemate with a sort of "Professor Hulk" cause Banner was here, controlling the Hulk body and strenght, yeah getting stronger, but slow than usual, Abom was having the upper hand at first, then get stomped, also for his stupidity.
He mentioned how he killed Betty.Now it's not smart saying to one of the guys with the major physical force ever known how you killed his wife and smile to him.You should be someone with suicidal tendencies.
Gladiator sayed Thor is too strong for him.It's questionable.
Thor beat him after catching him off guard in a sort of speedblitz blasting him with Mjolnir and pummeling his face, then the Designate blasted him to near unconsciouness, but in the first fight of that story, Gladiator throwed away Mjolnir and speed blitzed Thor with ease.
Gladiator's confidence is sometimes his major weakness, cause if it's not sufficient or it fluctuates he gets stomped.

Nataku your post is useless cause the number ranking of Marvel isn't more accurate than the Class ranking.
People can have a more decent idea of the strenght of characters with the class system that with a number system.
If Thor has a 7 and so has Gladiator are they equal?No.
Is Hulk equal to them?No, he can surpass Thor, and match Glad.
Namor has a 6, Thing as a 6, to made an example, are they equal?No.

Originally posted by Lord S
Yeah I use Classic Marvel's 'Universal Table' as well...it's extremely accurate, that's why I really don't buy much of what GS says about the power of the Phoenix...cause they only have the Phoenix Force rated as a Class 1000 in all aspects of power, (with the exceptions of Flight and Gateway, which are 3000 and 5000).

Of course if GS is right, that means they have some updating to do. Wouldn't that make them not classic anymore?

Originally posted by K3VIL
The confusion about the strenght levels of characters in various topics lead me to do this.

Class 100 Strenght
It means, the character can lift at least or at max 100 Tons.
Pick up Maestro Hulk for example.
He has a base level strenght which grants him to lift 200 tons, without being mad or enraged.
It means he possess Class 100 Strenght, altough, of a low level, compared to that of powerhouses like Gladiator, Thor, Hercules, Namor, Superman, Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel, Genis Vell.
Those characters starts out with being able to lift huge weights.
Gladiator has a strenght which grants him to destroy planets with his bare hands or lift the FF4 building.
Thor can lift huge buildings too, smash asteroids, or even lift a part of the Jormungand Serpent.
Hercules was able to lift Manhattan.
Namor lifted submarines and huge ships.
Superman has moved Warworld, and lifted huge starships.
Captain Marvel has strenght of Superman's magnitude altough I don't know feats of strenght he has showed in terms of lifting or pushing, altough he K.O.ed the Man Of Steel with two fists.
WW can throw down with CM or Supes too, and has lifted a huge starship of city size.
Genis Vell was able to beat down King Thor with both physical and energy attacks, but here we are talking of physical force.Genis has throw down with Maestro Hulk, who was getting considerable pissed off, and showed his own.

Now, the guys mentioned above are ranked like this:

Incalculable Rank Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
Here are those who possess powers which grant them to reach strenght levels potentially unlimited, or who possess a strenght who hasn't showed actually a limit.
Gladiator, Hulk, Magni(Son of Thor), Thanos, Tyrant, Morg any GL with sufficient will power, Juggernaut, in order of feats: Trion version, 8th Day Version, Classical Version, Drax with power gem, Ravage, Odin, Zeus.
(THE CHARACTERS ARE NOT LISTED FOR LEVEL OF STRENGHT)

High Rank Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
Here are those who can lift huge weights of even hundred thousands of tons or more:
Thor, Superman, Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel, Hercules in half-god version, Namor in water or very recently exited from water, Count Nefaria full power, Drax without pg, Maxam, Wonder Man.
(THE CHARACTERS ARE NOT LISTED FOR LEVEL OF STRENGHT)

Mid Rank Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
Here are those who can lift not hundred thousands of tons but "just" thousands of tons.
She-Hulk, Namor outta water from not dangerous time period.


Low Rank Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
Here are those who can lift weights that don't reach the 1000 tons of weight.
Colossus, Abomination, Spikey Thing, Iron Man powered by sufficient energy source, Namor outta water from considerable time period, Hulk with in a low level of rage.

Under Class 100 Strenght Possessors:
THING, Namor outta water from prolonged period, Wonder Man, Hulk in a totally calm state, Grey Hulk.





Spikey THING is in the Incalculable Rank Class 100 Strength.

Ultimate THING is in the High Rank Class 100 Strength.

616 and MK THING is in the Low Rank Class 100 Strength

Ironman is Low level Class 100 (normal armor)

High Rank Class 100 Strength (w/ THORBUSTER).

Namor out of the water for more than a couple hours is 40 tons.

Grey HULK is 70 tons.

Wonderman is Low Rank Class 100 Strength.

Most everybody else is correct.

Originally posted by Tony Stark

Spikey THING is in the Incalculable Rank Class 100 Strength.

Ultimate THING is in the High Rank Class 100 Strength.

616 and MK THING is in the Low Rank Class 100 Strength

Ironman is Low level Class 100 (normal armor)

High Rank Class 100 Strength (w/ THORBUSTER).

Namor out of the water for more than a couple hours is 40 tons.

Grey HULK is 70 tons.

Wonderman is Low Rank Class 100 Strength.

Most everybody else is correct.
You are a worst fanboy, your affermations are wrong and are also withou any importance.
Spikey Thing was a Mid Rank Class 100 guy.
He throwed down with Grey Hulk, and wasn't able to close the fight quickly, he lifted a starship, that's all, nothing that puts him in High Rank, dear fanboy double account user.
PUT HERE, NOW, PROOFS OF normal Thing being a low level class 100, not assumptions, PROOFS.
Namor out of water after a couple hours is still a high rank Class 100 member.Check the images of his fight with Dark Hulk, check also what he did with half-god Hercules on a island, the scans are posted on the topic Captain Marvel VS Namor, he was stalemating Hercules.
Wonder Man starts out at Class 95, then he becomes a high rank Class 100 if focused or enraged, like when he fought with Thor.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Wouldn't that make them not classic anymore? Good point...heh, I never actually bothered to look deeper into the word 'classic'...but I don't think the ranking systems are ancient or anything.

I am far to p!ssed to read your posts, but i am really jealous i didn't get the respect you did.

Seriously i am. But what can you do about it. Ill get over it. Eventually!!!!!!!!

Any way what do you think of the class 100 magic list :

Borderline Level:
Vision
Rhino
Doctor Samson
Sandman
Ultron (Biatch)
Goliath (Full height)
She Hulk (originally)
Ulik
War bird (After the absorption of a lot of energy)

Low Level:
Iron Man (Normal Armour)
Super Skrull
Current Juggernaught
Colossus
Thing
Current Sasquatch
Power Man
Ultimate Iron man
Wendigo
Abomination

Mid Level:
Wonderman
Hercules (Mortal Form)
Orca
Hulk Buster Iron man
Black Bolt
Thor (When holding back with the avengers)
Nimrod
Ultimate Thing
Tri Sentinel
Magini
Classic Juggernaught (migth change positions if someone makes a decent arguement !!!!!!!!!!!!)
Ultimate Colossus
Namor (In water)

High Level:
Morg
Silver Surfer
Binary
Hyperion
Beta Ray Bill
Thanos(migth change positions if someone makes a decent arguement !!!!!!!!!!!!)
Gladiator
Thor (Classic) Full Power
Current She Hulk
Kurse with his 1st power up
Herc (Immortal Form)
Count Nefaria

I know im ivading your property but i just wat some attention. Any way im off to more drunk.

Oh Yeah death 2 the Thanos juggernaught FANBOYS. You know who u r.

yeah, i agree more with yahman more than k3vil(sorry)

Originally posted by K3VIL
Nataku your post is useless cause the number ranking of Marvel isn't more accurate than the Class ranking.
People can have a more decent idea of the strenght of characters with the class system that with a number system.
If Thor has a 7 and so has Gladiator are they equal?No.
Is Hulk equal to them?No, he can surpass Thor, and match Glad.
Namor has a 6, Thing as a 6, to made an example, are they equal?No.

That's exactly what I said. Why don't you try to read my post again, and if it still doesn't make sense, enroll yourself in some highschool english classes.

Originally posted by yahman
I am far to p!ssed to read your posts, but i am really jealous i didn't get the respect you did.

Seriously i am. But what can you do about it. Ill get over it. Eventually!!!!!!!!

Any way what do you think of the class 100 magic list :

Borderline Level:
Vision
Rhino
Doctor Samson
Sandman
Ultron (Biatch)
Goliath (Full height)
She Hulk (originally)
Ulik
War bird (After the absorption of a lot of energy)

Low Level:
Iron Man (Normal Armour)
Super Skrull
Current Juggernaught
Colossus
Thing
Current Sasquatch
Power Man
Ultimate Iron man
Wendigo
Abomination

Mid Level:
Wonderman
Hercules (Mortal Form)
Orca
Hulk Buster Iron man
Black Bolt
Thor (When holding back with the avengers)
Nimrod
Ultimate Thing
Tri Sentinel
Magini
Classic Juggernaught (migth change positions if someone makes a decent arguement !!!!!!!!!!!!)
Ultimate Colossus
Namor (In water)

High Level:
Morg
Silver Surfer
Binary
Hyperion
Beta Ray Bill
Thanos(migth change positions if someone makes a decent arguement !!!!!!!!!!!!)
Gladiator
Thor (Classic) Full Power
Current She Hulk
Kurse with his 1st power up
Herc (Immortal Form)
Count Nefaria

I know im ivading your property but i just wat some attention. Any way im off to more drunk.

Oh Yeah death 2 the Thanos juggernaught FANBOYS. You know who u r.

You forgot High levels

Drax, Ironman (THORBUSTER), Spikey THING

I don't think that Black Bolt is on the list.

if black bolt concentrates...he can be.

he focussed his 'chi'

Yeah thsi dude is my ne best friend:
yeah, i agree more with yahman more than k3vil(sorry)

'Drax, Ironman (THORBUSTER), Spikey THING'

Yeh Drax is probably in the High level as is Thor Buster Iron man,

Spiky thing cant be more than MID cause Grey Hulk is a pusssy. But Good point anyway.

Death to the Juggernaught Thanos Fanboys !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Let us turn this into a yahman vs k3vil thread. Cum'on my lis is wy better than his explanation . Although even ill admit his explanaitio kick ass. Oh well until he admits the thread was based on mine i will not be happy.

Nah only joking. UMMMMMMMMMM im quite drunk so go k3vil. I love you mann, atleast sum 1 else gives a shit about strength aswell as me . Oh yeh Olympian aswell he is sound and Colossus 17 he's well funnny. and that well complicated name guy who begins with c and has a Ryu Sig. And Whyrlysplat, he's funny aswell.

Right idea, wrong forum.

Moving

Where is Apocalypse.

Originally posted by Tony Stark

Namor out of the water for more than a couple hours is 40 tons.



Does that mean that he is Class 40?

No.

DC don't pay attention to Tony Stark he's a poor fanboy, he doesn't use logic.
Nataku I'm apologize I didn't read all of your answer, but the list of strenght feats would result in making the ranks not clear.
I mean, there are issues where strong characters are having problems with enemies that aren't a threat, then there are issues where they are the ultimate Deus Ex Machine.
I think that my ranking is almost optimal, I've based it on concrete feats and analisys of characters powers, Yahman your ranks are not clear, cause with my ranking It's possible to know how much the characters can lift at least, or at max when we talk about the less strong.
Xplosive Apocalypse is using prep time somewhere to prepare a real feat of strenght, I've picked up decent examples of physical strenght for each rank, and Apocalypse with his "unlimited power" is just a pussy.

K3vil, I agree exceptionally more with your list than Yahman's. Hell, he still has Rhino in the Borderline level class. What the hell is that?

Your list, K3vil, makes so much more sense and I pretty much fully agree with it. I think Yahman's just upset because your list actually makes a lot more sense than his.

i don't agree with k3vil on she-hulk, she is stronger than a lot of the high-class people and i think a few people above the high-class, but i don't remember the list

i touched on this briefly before but the class rating system was done in the 80's when the first OHOMU was published. its been the same info since then. it was until the late 90's that they started working from 1-7. so the best place to see character's str. and such is in any number of the marvel encyclopedias, though some charcters are in the same number class that doesnt mean they have the same strentgh. for example they list Agent X, wolverine, sabretooth and Spiderman at class 4, and we all know who is stronger in what order, so i guess instead of coming out and saying anything definitavley they leave it up to fans to figure it out

i dont remeber it all verbatum and will have to check to make any necesarry corrections but from what i remeber off the top:

class1: normal---athlete(100--350lbs)
class2: athlete---peak human(350--800lbs)
class3: peak--enhanced human(800--1500lbs or 3/4 of a ton)
class4: enchanced---10 tons
class5: 25--70 tons
class6: 75--90 or an absolute max of the late 90s
class7: 100--to incalculable with no given upper limit.

so wolverine, and sabretooth being class4 makes sense since thier in the "enhanced human" portion of it. but it is correct when ppl say that writers just do thier own thing cuz marvel will officially label a character as one thing, then some johnny come latley writer will do something completely different, or wont reflect that charcters true potential, sometimes they'll even hype them up out of character as well, but marvel them selves make errors too cuz they have dare devil at 3 but black falcon at 2 when both matt and sam are in peak physical condition, so its a catch 22 really.

Originally posted by stormfront13
i don't agree with k3vil on she-hulk, she is stronger than a lot of the high-class people and i think a few people above the high-class, but i don't remember the list
she-hulk is just not a good example to me.She's inconsistent.
When she faced a Juggernaut copy with the original one at her side, the now "Jobbernaut" Cain Marko, she sayed to Cain they need to seek help.
While Cain sayed he got the strategy, he'll kick the ass of the impostor from there to Westchester.
Then in her own series she becomes a sort of Deus Ex Machine, then against Iron Man during Chaos saga, she got K.O.ed with a single punch from the Golden Avenger.

Originally posted by K3VIL
s she becomes a sort of Deus Ex Machine,

I think you meant Deus Ex Machina.

well according to slott her writer as of now he said that after consulting with a few other writers they have become to the conclusion that she is stronger than many people on the high-level list and i think even a few on the titan-level

Originally posted by Solidus Snake
ahhhmmmmmm superman and wonder woman should be up there with the incalculable class 100


supes moved warworld for petes sakes


and ww stopped asmodels chariot from falling onto earth. and the touch of it made her burn.

they are definitely up there

also,i see Wonder Man on 2 lists,why?..and i think Nefaria should be in the top class..just ask the Avengers....lol

Originally posted by Ex11B
also,i see Wonder Man on 2 lists,why?..and i think Nefaria should be in the top class..just ask the Avengers....lol

hahaha i remeber this thread, i believe i was a vry drunk poster !

What I personally like about K3VIL's clarification is that it Does attempt some precision, which I don't think should necessarily be avoided just because writers are not consistent. In that vein, while this inconsistency may not be "bad" writing, per se, it does represent IMO either lazy research on a character or a who-cares-I'm-gonna-do-what-I-want attitude on the part of writers, especially when one-upmanship enters the competitive-market fray.

Of course, what writers do--for better or worse--is the "reality" behind comic-book characters; in this regard, Fishy 500's approach is more "realistic."

Well, allow me to complicate matters by suggesting there may have to be Specific Strength Systems: one which reflects a character's usual or defined level, and one which reflects their peak/under-stress level; one which reflects what the writers show, one which reflects Our understanding of what a character should be able to do. Perhaps there is a ways of integrating some/all of this into a single system.

Originally posted by Mindship
What I personally like about K3VIL's clarification is that it Does attempt some precision, which I don't think should necessarily be avoided just because writers are not consistent. In that vein, while this inconsistency may not be "bad" writing, per se, it does represent IMO either lazy research on a character or a who-cares-I'm-gonna-do-what-I-want attitude on the part of writers, especially when one-upmanship enters the competitive-market fray.

Of course, what writers do--for better or worse--is the "reality" behind comic-book characters; in this regard, Fishy 500's approach is more "realistic."

Well, allow me to complicate matters by suggesting there may have to be Specific Strength Systems: one which reflects a character's usual or defined level, and one which reflects their peak/under-stress level; one which reflects what the writers show, one which reflects Our understanding of what a character should be able to do. Perhaps there is a ways of integrating some/all of this into a single system.

Dude don't call me Fishy ... its weird, I would prefer to be referred to as the artist formerly known as Yahman, or just Yahman. NE way my system has a subtle numerical levels associated with it. These can be used as a guildline for writers.

For example Level 6 compares characters to modern age lifting devices. The strongest one i ve heard of can lift jut under a kilo ton. Level 7 compares characters to the most power machines. The strongest one I've heard of is in the region of 100 kilo tons. They are no more than guild lines though. If the writers want to make characters stronger/weaker than these bases they are free to do so.

Originally posted by Fishy 500
Dude don't call me Fishy ... its weird, I would prefer to be referred to as the artist formerly known as Yahman, or just Yahman.

A.F.K.A.Y., I was just being respectful. After all, you did choose the name. confused1
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"NE way my system has a subtle numerical levels associated with it. These can be used as a guildline for writers.
For example Level 6 compares characters to modern age lifting devices. The strongest one i ve heard of can lift jut under a kilo ton. Level 7 compares characters to the most power machines. The strongest one I've heard of is in the region of 100 kilo tons. They are no more than guild lines though. If the writers want to make characters stronger/weaker than these bases they are free to do so."
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K3VIL's approach also shows flexibility but is a little more tangible. Not all KMCers know what today's biggest cranes can hoist.

As for what the writers will go by: I say submit it to Marvel, it is a good system, the worst they can tell ya is No thanks. But what a feather in your cap it would be if they said Yes! clapping

Originally posted by Mindship
A.F.K.A.Y., I was just being respectful. After all, you did choose the name. confused1
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"NE way my system has a subtle numerical levels associated with it. These can be used as a guildline for writers.
For example Level 6 compares characters to modern age lifting devices. The strongest one i ve heard of can lift jut under a kilo ton. Level 7 compares characters to the most power machines. The strongest one I've heard of is in the region of 100 kilo tons. They are no more than guild lines though. If the writers want to make characters stronger/weaker than these bases they are free to do so."
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K3VIL's approach also shows flexibility but is a little more tangible. Not all KMCers know what today's biggest cranes can hoist.

As for what the writers will go by: I say submit it to Marvel, it is a good system, the worst they can tell ya is No thanks. But what a feather in your cap it would be if they said Yes! clapping

Mate i really appreciate that ! (it brings tears to my eyes) but its not going to happen!

Kevil's is pretty good. I didn't realise at the time, but its very similar to the boundaries i have used !

Mindsip, i want you to create your own DIY one ! Its only fair, your stuff on reflexes is great (far better than my speed one) !

Originally posted by Fishy 500
Mate i really appreciate that ! (it brings tears to my eyes) but its not going to happen!

Mindsip, i want you to create your own DIY one ! Its only fair, your stuff on reflexes is great (far better than my speed one) !

Listen, I know what it's like to get letters of rejection...hurts like hell. Often I've called it, The Little Death. On the other hand, when someone says, "We like this," you feel like, well, you got a touch of Phoenix Force running through you.

"...it's not going to happen!" Why not? Don't close out the option (unless you've plaigarized or you're in a Witness Protection Program disguise). Just roll the idea round in your head for a while.

My own DIY? First of all (pardon my ignorance), what is a "DIY"? If you mean a strength system, I say again: yours, and K3vil's, are tough acts to follow. But to be fair, I will give it some thought.

Originally posted by Mindship
Listen, I know what it's like to get letters of rejection...hurts like hell. Often I've called it, The Little Death. On the other hand, when someone says, "We like this," you feel like, well, you got a touch of Phoenix Force running through you.

"...it's not going to happen!" Why not? Don't close out the option (unless you've plaigarized or you're in a Witness Protection Program disguise). Just roll the idea round in your head for a while.

My own DIY? First of all (pardon my ignorance), what is a "DIY"? If you mean a strength system, I say again: yours, and K3vil's, are tough acts to follow. But to be fair, I will give it some thought.

DIY = Do it yourself ... its a term we use a lot in england !

Originally posted by K3VIL
Genis absorb photonic energy and other kinds of energy through nega-bands and he can absorb on his own solar energy, he has mastered his powers, he walked on King Thor, no reason why he should lose to Odin or Zeus, maybe he can stalemate them.
Quasar stalemated with Silver Surfer, I think it say all.

Dude i posted scans of Genis "beating" King Thor. I proved wrong, go ask armadovalles.

ive used this example so much i feel like the cows are on their way home...but to show you that 100 tons means absolutley nothing, the heaviest tank in the US army weighs 78 tons...throw 3 or 4 humvees on top of that and you have 100tons right there, both recently and back in the day we've seen superman lift a cruise ship, and and oil tanker ship respectively: when lex luthor was trying to guage his strentgh, and get him to work for him by settin up a fake terrorist attack on his cruise liner, plus recently when eclipso possessed him and he picked up that oil tanker and tossed it at captain marvel like it was nothing, who caught it BTW. plus we've seen superman lending his strength to move the freakin moon out of orbit


even in marvel the type of smashing and lifting we've seen hulk and thing and juggernaut and all those guys lift far out strips that of a tank..we've seen Namor lift things that are significantly heavier than a tank. so not unless 100tons is some super holy Grail as far as marvel is concerned but if you wanna translate it to the real world weights its nothing at all

Originally posted by manjaro
ive used this example so much i feel like the cows are on their way home...but to show you that 100 tons means absolutley nothing, the heaviest tank in the US army weighs 78 tons...throw 3 or 4 humvees on top of that and you have 100tons right there, both recently and back in the day we've seen superman lift a cruise ship, and and oil tanker ship respectively: when lex luthor was trying to guage his strentgh, and get him to work for him by settin up a fake terrorist attack on his cruise liner, plus recently when eclipso possessed him and he picked up that oil tanker and tossed it at captain marvel like it was nothing, who caught it BTW. plus we've seen superman lending his strength to move the freakin moon out of orbit


even in marvel the type of smashing and lifting we've seen hulk and thing and juggernaut and all those guys lift far out strips that of a tank..we've seen Namor lift things that are significantly heavier than a tank. so not unless 100tons is some super holy Grail as far as marvel is concerned but if you wanna translate it to the real world weights its nothing at all

Agreed ! Marvel Superhumn strength isn't that 'super', usually !