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I don't care if it's been done before or not but I thought it would be a good matchup because they both use the basic same form and this is the first thread i've done that I think will work out

hi

uhhhh... hi

lmao i think windu would win on account of the ownage of the several forms he uses...and corect me if im wrong but iv'e had people tell me that he uses form VII i don't think its true but people have told me so...newayz i think windu would win like i said b4 he would utilize w/e form was need for this duel.. replies...ne1? (no hateful 1s)

this threads sucks. done before and you spreading misinformation. Tulak Hord has never been said to use Mace's form. In fact he cant because Mace's form was invented over 4000 years after Tulak died. I have no choice but to report this to the mods.

lol i like the confused face

Glentract don't be so hasty its his firs thread..give him sum slack *whispers* (even though he doesn't deserve it after how he reacted in other first threads)

dammit glentract I said basic same form. mace uses a modification of form 7 the Juyo which was a form tulak invented

this isnt his first thread, he made like three last night. and glentracts right

will you read what I said to glentract

give me proof! if you dont have any, you lost any trust from me.

HV i see we share the same piont of view then

wikipedia you either search Tulak Hord or Mace Windu

point* ... i hate using english ( im only doing this because i have been critisized on my enslish before) and i probably spelled that wrong too

How the hell did Tulak Hord, whom we know next to nothing about, CREATE Juyo, a form that the Jedi taught to their students in the time of the Sith Wars? This reeks of bum information.

Wait a second I was told that Tulak created the juyo I'm the one who's been misinformed but who cares about that who does everybody think would win

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulak_Hord

nothing about Juyo. dont try and cover it up.

what are you talking about

Yup Glentract is the winner of this argument

yea you win the arguement big deal now who do you think wins.

"In the fictional Star Wars universe, Tulak Hord was one of the Dark Lords of the Sith buried in the Valley of the Dark Lords on the planet Korriban. First featured in the video game Knights of the Old Republic, Tulak Hord was claimed by Kreia in the sequel game to be the greatest lightsaber duelist the Sith have ever known (at that time) and thus possibly the Sith's greatest lightsaber duelist ever. It is unknown what stance of lightsaber dueling Hord practiced, but the only other speculated successor in dueling skill would be Darth Tyranus or Luke Skywalker.

It has been rumoured the the Lightsaber form Hord used was a Pre-version of Form VII used by Mace Windu, a credit to his prowess as a saber duelist. Kreia also had mention that he had made a holocron of his fighting technique, something that Windu and other might have discovered."

That's not what I saw. Did you add that last paragraph?

thank yor that's what I heard

oops wrong spelling thank you

well i cant make my choice because we dont know much bout tulak but if he was said to be the greatest lightsaber duelist ever and its rumored that he fights with a pre-version of form 7 then............ im guessin he would win

windu

this is strange. I swear that that last paragraph wasnt there when I last went on wikipedia only a few minutes ago.

i saw that last paragraph somewhere dont remember if it was wikipedia but i saw it.............

(Now, with JanusEdit)

In the fictional Star Wars universe, Tulak Hord was one of the Dark Lords of the Sith buried in the Valley of the Dark Lords on the planet Korriban. (Fact)

First featured in the video game Knights of the Old Republic, Tulak Hord was claimed by Kreia in the sequel game to be the greatest lightsaber duelist the Sith have ever known (at that time) and thus possibly the Sith's greatest lightsaber duelist ever. (1st part-Fact; 2nd part- reasonable assessment)

It is unknown what stance of lightsaber dueling Hord practiced, but the only other speculated successor in dueling skill would be Darth Tyranus or Luke Skywalker.(Wild assumptions)

It has been rumoured the the Lightsaber form Hord used was a Pre-version of Form VII used by Mace Windu, a credit to his prowess as a saber duelist. (Where do these rumors arise from? Sounds suspicious)

Kreia also had mention that he had made a holocron of his fighting technique, something that Windu and other might have discovered." (So Windu found Tulak Hord's holocron? Did Revan just come back to known space and drop it?)

Nope. DIdn't add it.

Anyone else notice that that particular Wikipedia section was 1.5 parts fact and 3.5 parts speculation? For a grand total of 30% fact?

ya. I still think its better than nothing.

well, if I can get my story published and reconised by GL, you'll have a good deal better on Tulak Hord.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
(Now, with JanusEdit)

In the fictional Star Wars universe, Tulak Hord was one of the Dark Lords of the Sith buried in the Valley of the Dark Lords on the planet Korriban. (Fact)

First featured in the video game Knights of the Old Republic, Tulak Hord was claimed by Kreia in the sequel game to be the greatest lightsaber duelist the Sith have ever known (at that time) and thus possibly the Sith's greatest lightsaber duelist ever. (1st part-Fact; 2nd part- reasonable assessment)

It is unknown what stance of lightsaber dueling Hord practiced, but the only other speculated successor in dueling skill would be Darth Tyranus or Luke Skywalker.(Wild assumptions)

It has been rumoured the the Lightsaber form Hord used was a Pre-version of Form VII used by Mace Windu, a credit to his prowess as a saber duelist. (Where do these rumors arise from? Sounds suspicious)

Kreia also had mention that he had made a holocron of his fighting technique, something that Windu and other might have discovered." (So Windu found Tulak Hord's holocron? Did Revan just come back to known space and drop it?)

This is a very solid assessment.

It is of my opinion that Tulak Hord is the superior duelist, if not because he was considered the best during a time when duelists were so common, you could probably bump into three of them on the way to the thrift store.

I am of the philosophical opinion that competition spurns development, and lack of it causes regression. Since Tulak existed in a time where lightsabers were more common than during the era of Mace Windu, I would have to give the match to the individual that could be mentioned as one of the greatest duelists ever.

right, when most of the sith used swords, there was more lightsabers

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
right, when most of the sith used swords, there was more lightsabers

Eh, swords charged with lightning, close enough.

Personally, it would seem to be a lot easier to wield an actual sword instead of the just the hilt, at least the counterbalance would be there.

ya, best lightsaber duelist, not best swords charged with lightning duelist

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
ya, best lightsaber duelist, not best swords charged with lightning duelist

Your objective is still to land a blow on your enemy, and use your weapon so to prevent them from landing a blow on you. The overall forms and methods wouldn't have changed all that much.

then why didnt Kreia say "best sword fighter"

Good question. She also says that Tulak Hord lived in a time of "Many great lightsaber duellists". Clearly he is after Sadow and the others... .right? Or is that possible?

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Good question. She also says that Tulak Hord lived in a time of "Many great lightsaber duellists". Clearly he is after Sadow and the others... .right? Or is that possible?

That's why I made the assumption that "lightsaber" and "swords" are not of different molds. We have very few accounts of an individual fighting swords against lightsabers; and the only one that comes into mind is Ragnavion with Ragnos' sith sword against Jaden Korr and his lightsaber in JK:A.

We know that they are at least comparable in style. It is of my opinion, based upon competition, that Tulak Hord would be the winner. However, I will certainly not pass this for fact.

I did a lot of fighting with swords against lightsabers in both KOTOR's

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
I did a lot of fighting with swords against lightsabers in both KOTOR's

Ah good point; I can't believe I overlooked that.

Still, my point remains, the two are at least comparable in style and effectiveness.

form one actually is based off of tradiotinal swordplay from before the times of lightsabers.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
form one actually is based off of tradiotinal swordplay from before the times of lightsabers.

Exactly, and since it seems we are in agreement here, perhaps we can express our opinions as to the outcome of the Tulak vs. Windu match.

Tulak kicks his face in!

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Tulak kicks his face in!

Agreed .

Moah...some people here realy get me angry with their wild assumptions. I actualy would like some pumpgun to hunt down some noobs here.

Seriously...

A)
Form VII is not "completed" in the times of the PT. There is still a working process on it. Form VII is called Juyo and is basically a blend of form IV (Ataru) movements, form II (Makashi) precission and form V (Djem So) powerful strikes. If you want to see a "normal" form VII praticioner take a look at Darth Maul.

Mace created his own form (Vaapad) out of form VII. It more relies on precise and fast hits with less powerful strikes and faster movements. Also he added the ability to channel dark side feelings and make them a weapon for the light side and he included his unique Shatterpoint ability.

B)
In Tulak Hords time the lightsabers were pretty new to the Sith. Their first contact with it was during the times of the Great Hyperspace War (5,000 years before ANH). The Sith Lords before used blades enchanted with Sith magic (Ragnos, Sadow). So Tulak Hord was around somewhere in the times between the Great Hyperspace War and the events in KOTOR I (3,956 years before ANH).

If he used ANY known form or something that got close to one of the known forms it's form II. Form II is the lightsaber duel form and nearly all great lightsaber duelist known used it. Tulak Hord wouldn't have used a form that is still in development 4,000 years past his time.

C)
Hell...Tulak Hord would waste ANYBODY else in terms of sheer lightsaber combat (except Yoda maybe) so Mace pretty much dies in that fight as I don't give him a chance against somebody that is an ancient Sith Lord and the best Sith swordsman ever.

D)
One last point: Lightsabers and normal sabers are not combareable. A normal saber has a blade that - at least - posesses 50 % of the entire sabers weight. Now...a lightsaber "blade" has a weight of 0. You simply can't use the same forms with a saber that you can use with a lightsaber because something that makes wield a blade made out of light (with no weight) will pretty much kill you if you try to do the same with a "normal" saber and vice versa.

That's the reason why people who aren't familar with a lightsaber would pretty likely hurt themselves with that weapon while most people can handle a normal saber without injuring theirselves.

I did make a mention as to the counterbalance.

In most swords, the point of balance is a few inches above the hilt. Yes, I do realize that a lightsaber will have ALL its weight in the hilt. However, the general form does not change. Tulak Hord did not use Form VII. However, you do wield both Sith swords and a lightsaber in similar methods. There are swords with extremely light blades in human history (e.g. rapiers). The difference then becomes instead of focusing on power, you would focus on speed.

But that's because a hit from a broadsword would be far more dangerous than a prick with a rapier. In this scenario, both Sith magic imbued swords AND lightsabers would both be VERY potent when struck.

Nice points all around. Just like to add here and there:

1- I've always thought Tulak Hord was a Makashi master simply because the form itself is among one of the earliest. Juyo is actually made later in the game, and is something taught by masters (As in KOTOR II), which MIGHT mean that it was hardly commonplace in that time, let alone in Tulak earlier time.

2- Cortosis weaves, I believe they are. There are some things that can deflect lightsaber strikes or resist them. Now, sith blades are heavily enchanted, for lack of a better term, and can resist most anything, including the effect of time. Vibroblades and swords, however, are mass produced using an Echani weave pattern that helps protect the blade during sparring, especially with a lightsaber. I've also heard of Mandalorian iron being resistant, but where you would find an iron like that I could only guess. And if the Mandalorians had a monopoly on an iron that was resistant to lightsabers, the Jedi would have been hard pressed in the Mandalorian Wars.