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"Jesus in the age period 14-29

What are these many things that have not been recorded? One record that is glaringly missing is the period 14-29 years in the life of Jesus. One theory is that he went to India to be trained as a Buddhist.

The story of the Wise Men is surprisingly similar to the traditions of Buddhism, a religion 500 years older than Christianity. When a great Buddhist holy man (lama) died, wise men consult the stars and go on a long trek to find his incarnation. When he is found, he is taken from his parents when old enough and trained in the Buddhist faith. Could Jesus have been identified as an incarnation and taken to India?



The Russian explorer, Nicolai Natovich travelled to northern India in the 19th century and found a manuscript in a Tibetan monastery which he translated as 'The Unknown Life of Jesus Christ'. It tells of a divine child called Issa born to a poor family in Israel. he learnt the teachings of Buddhism before returning to Israel at 29. The later teachings and miracles of Jesus have an uncanny parallel with the Buddhist counterpart. For example, the injunction to love your enemies and the promise that the meek will inherit the earth have no precedent in Judaism but they are found in Buddhism.



Examples:

1. Mark 6:48: he went out to them walking on the lake.

Anguttara Nikaya 3:60: He walks upon the water without parting it, as if it were solid ground.

2. Mark 10:25: it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the

kingdom of heaven.

Jatakamala 5:5 & 15: Riches make a man greedy and so are like a caravan lurching down the road to hell.

3. Matthew 6:20: Lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven where moth and rust do not destroy and where

thieves do not break in and steal.

Kuddakaptha 8:9 Let the wise man do righteousness; a treasure that others cannot share, which no thief

can steal, a treasure which does not pass away.
"
http://www.goacom.com/overseas-dige...-in-kashmir.htm


How cool!

nope, in the bible Jesus clearly said he learned hid wisdom from God and only even in the lost years. when he was 12 he use to stay and talk with the teachers of the law and they were amazed by his wisdom at his age. many people have theories of this, but Jesus clearly says he is from heaven and learned it from the father of heaven. people will make theories about it because they aren't satisfied with what Jesus says and don't believe what he says, so they make theories about him that don't make any sense. Jesus was not an ordinary man, he is the greatest man every lived and will come back some day to restore his kingdom. many people will try and copy information and try and twist it around to sound like Jesus heard from Buddhists, Jesus even said false teachers will have false information and doctrines of him and don't be deceived by these. How can people say that Jesus learned from Buddhist when he clearly says that he learned things from the father above. doesn't make sense. the bible says as Jesus got older he wisdom was greater only because god gave him that sort of wisdom that is greater than Solomon who is regarded as the wisest man of all time. Jesus is god almighty in the flesh, he knows what the world is around him and knows about all the religions also since he created it.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Check this out

"Jesus in the age period 14-29

What are these many things that have not been recorded? One record that is glaringly missing is the period 14-29 years in the life of Jesus. One theory is that he went to India to be trained as a Buddhist.

The story of the Wise Men is surprisingly similar to the traditions of Buddhism, a religion 500 years older than Christianity. When a great Buddhist holy man (lama) died, wise men consult the stars and go on a long trek to find his incarnation. When he is found, he is taken from his parents when old enough and trained in the Buddhist faith. Could Jesus have been identified as an incarnation and taken to India?



The Russian explorer, Nicolai Natovich travelled to northern India in the 19th century and found a manuscript in a Tibetan monastery which he translated as 'The Unknown Life of Jesus Christ'. It tells of a divine child called Issa born to a poor family in Israel. he learnt the teachings of Buddhism before returning to Israel at 29. The later teachings and miracles of Jesus have an uncanny parallel with the Buddhist counterpart. For example, the injunction to love your enemies and the promise that the meek will inherit the earth have no precedent in Judaism but they are found in Buddhism.



Examples:

1. Mark 6:48: he went out to them walking on the lake.

Anguttara Nikaya 3:60: He walks upon the water without parting it, as if it were solid ground.

2. Mark 10:25: it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the

kingdom of heaven.

Jatakamala 5:5 & 15: Riches make a man greedy and so are like a caravan lurching down the road to hell.

3. Matthew 6:20: Lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven where moth and rust do not destroy and where

thieves do not break in and steal.

Kuddakaptha 8:9 Let the wise man do righteousness; a treasure that others cannot share, which no thief

can steal, a treasure which does not pass away.
"
http://www.goacom.com/overseas-dige...-in-kashmir.htm


How cool!

I agree with this!

lil bitchiness, I see you caught on to this interesting theory as well. For the past three years this is a huge controversy over christianity.

Check out my thread "Jesus lived in India", I, as well as a few others, have posted some intriguing websites for you to look at if you like. Those of us that are open minded should discuss more about this topic. Feel free to post anything to my thread. I'd like to hear what everyone thinks about this theory.

I've also herd the story of the woman throwing her last piece of money into the little tray also happenend in Buddhism.Buddha lived five hundred years before Christ so I'm inclined to belive one of two things.

1.Christianity borrows from the Buddhist tradition which predates Christianity.

2.These teachings are universal and show an absolute truth when it comes to morals and ways of living.

in what ways?

In what ways?

Well, if I understand your question...many religions have overlapping teachings. There is a similar, if not nearly identical rule, for almost all of the Ten Commandments in the teachings of the Buddha. Other religions follow suit very often. Once you learn enough about many religions, you can begin to see that they all teach many of the same core beliefs...they simply focus their teachings around different traditions or figures (Moses, Jesus, Mohammad, Buddha, etc.). What mr. smiley was saying is that maybe the teachings are similar to Buddhism because they represent an overlapping between religions, and thus an underlying truth of humanity and existence.

I like the theory by the way...I'd need more evidence, but with the numerous layers of interpretation the accepted Bible has gone through, it's no more valid in my mind than any other credible-sounding story. The underlying truths are sound enough, perhaps, but the exactities of any of it is a bit suspect.

almost but still different. if you read the Hebrew bible about the red sea, it was really the reed sea instead. but still the discovery channel could lie, but still the Hebrew bible is very accurate.Christianity originally came from Judaism, but many people people went to the wrong countries and heard many things that weren't suppose to be taught by the church. I would like to get the Hebrew bible and compare it to today's bible and see what the difference is. the Torah is the most accurate because the Jews never change it. I would like to have one but it would be hard to get one and get a person to interpret it for me.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
In what ways?

Well, if I understand your question...many religions have overlapping teachings. There is a similar, if not nearly identical rule, for almost all of the Ten Commandments in the teachings of the Buddha. Other religions follow suit very often. Once you learn enough about many religions, you can begin to see that they all teach many of the same core beliefs...they simply focus their teachings around different traditions or figures (Moses, Jesus, Mohammad, Buddha, etc.). What mr. smiley was saying is that maybe the teachings are similar to Buddhism because they represent an overlapping between religions, and thus an underlying truth of humanity and existence.

I like the theory by the way...I'd need more evidence, but with the numerous layers of interpretation the accepted Bible has gone through, it's no more valid in my mind than any other credible-sounding story. The underlying truths are sound enough, perhaps, but the exactities of any of it is a bit suspect.


Exactly.I;m going to start researching this more and see what I kind find.Anyone who studies the origins of Christianity knows the eerie simularities between Jesus,Osiris,Mythra,etc.But I would also like to find underlined moral princapals that are the same in every religon.Jesus performing the same miracles as Osiris doesn't suprise me anymore,but the simularties between Jesus and Buddha is very strong in the Gospel of Thomas.

Originally posted by cking
almost but still different. if you read the Hebrew bible about the red sea, it was really the reed sea instead. but still the discovery channel could lie, but still the Hebrew bible is very accurate.Christianity originally came from Judaism, but many people people went to the wrong countries and heard many things that weren't suppose to be taught by the church. I would like to get the Hebrew bible and compare it to today's bible and see what the difference is. the Torah is the most accurate because the Jews never change it. I would like to have one but it would be hard to get one and get a person to interpret it for me.


Well I can tell you the name Joseph in Hebrew is the same name as Jesus.Joseph ben Nun of Exodus translates as Jesus son of the Fish.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
In what ways?

Well, if I understand your question...many religions have overlapping teachings. There is a similar, if not nearly identical rule, for almost all of the Ten Commandments in the teachings of the Buddha. Other religions follow suit very often. Once you learn enough about many religions, you can begin to see that they all teach many of the same core beliefs...they simply focus their teachings around different traditions or figures (Moses, Jesus, Mohammad, Buddha, etc.). What mr. smiley was saying is that maybe the teachings are similar to Buddhism because they represent an overlapping between religions, and thus an underlying truth of humanity and existence.

I like the theory by the way...I'd need more evidence, but with the numerous layers of interpretation the accepted Bible has gone through, it's no more valid in my mind than any other credible-sounding story. The underlying truths are sound enough, perhaps, but the exactities of any of it is a bit suspect.

I recommend reading "The Power of Myth".

Actually, I've read parts of "The Power of Myth". Good stuff.

Also, mr. smiley, you might be interested to know that early depictions of Orpheus (the Greek mythological character) eventually evolved from him simply playing his lyre, to him standing with the lyre, to him surrounded by animals while playing...which, at a certain point after the life of Jesus, morphed into an image of Jesus surrounded by animals. The lyre becomes a staff, but otherwise the similarities are amazing. There's even an early (pre-christ) picture of Orpheus on a crucifix, since his story was one of suffering...and though it is faded badly, it is still clear enough to make out.

I wish I could cite books or websites, but I heard it in a presentation once of a man who provided the sources, but was talking too fast for me to write them all down. In any case, thought you might find that intriguing.

-DM

I think they mention him in the Jesus Mysteries.If not,I know i've herd that name from somewhere.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Actually, I've read parts of "The Power of Myth". Good stuff.


I read it years ago and it helped start me down a path that lead from being a Christan to being a Buddhist.

Well I guess, I had already been on the path by that time, however, it did give me a lot to think about.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
What mr. smiley was saying is that maybe the teachings are similar to Buddhism because they represent an overlapping between religions, and thus an underlying truth of humanity and existence.


Thats what I think too. Not only Buddhism that shares common teachings, and stories with christianity. But we can find analogies in many other religions, even hinduism, and the sumerian religion seem to have their share.

has anyone ever read the Torah but had someone translate it for you?

Originally posted by Atlantis001
Thats what I think too. Not only Buddhism that shares common teachings, and stories with christianity. But we can find analogies in many other religions, even hinduism, and the sumerian religion seem to have their share.


I also read a book on Asia mythology that had a story of a great flood and a man that made a ship to stay alive.Don't have any sources on it though,but it was pretty interesting.

Although this theory is fascinating and I would love to believe this to be true, but......

Keep in mind, that their core philosophies differ. Buddha emphasized rebirth of the mindstream. It's questionable whether Jesus believed in reincarnation. Buddha taught that each there was no soul; Jesus did not. And Buddha never affirmed the one God, personal and supernatural, who according to Christian belief was at the heart of Jesus' teachings and of his very being.

Yes, Jesus and Buddha had some similarities in their philosophies, but some of their other views are diametrically opposed at the core of their philosophies than anything else.

Anyone here care to discuss this?

Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
Yes, Jesus and Buddha had some similarities in their philosophies, but some of their other views are diametrically opposed at the core of their philosophies than anything else.

Anyone here care to discuss this?

Most people can't agree on anything in religion. Jesus was a very smart man, and had his our ideas. To say that he couldn't have learned Buddhism because he didn't lock-step with the teaching of Buddhism is ignorants. He had his our past, he knew the religion of his home land; he blended the two teachings together.

You know I just thought of something here.....

Didn't what Jesus taught fit right in with the true intent of the two greatest laws handed down by Moses? Love your God with your whole heart, soul, mind and body, and love your neighbor as yourself. Being pure in spirit before God.

very true! even his enemies agreed about this.

if a person follow these two then they would follow the rest also.

A little off topic here but....

Has anyone read the Hebrew Bible? How accurate is it?

Accurate as to what? Most of these holy books have one source whose credibility relies on faith. Define accurate for me under those conditions.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Accurate as to what? Most of these holy books have one source whose credibility relies on faith. Define accurate for me under those conditions.

Good point.

My definition of 'accurate' is without the influence of any pagan beliefs added in. The gospels were written with first-generation accounts; same goes for most of the epistles. a few, like revelations came from a 2nd or 3rd generation source. this is what all christians call primary sources. Most christians count on this to any historical research. Are the gospels and the epistles authentic in the Hebrew Bible? Were they raw accountable information written by the apostles and the disciples themselves without having any outside beliefs mixed in later on?

I personally don't have that answer for you, but I would be suspicious of anyone who does... Honestly? Few if anyone in this day and age can verify any information that dates back two thousand plus years...

few would even care.

Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
Good point.

My definition of 'accurate' is without the influence of any pagan beliefs added in. The gospels were written with first-generation accounts; same goes for most of the epistles. a few, like revelations came from a 2nd or 3rd generation source. this is what all christians call primary sources. Most christians count on this to any historical research. Are the gospels and the epistles authentic in the Hebrew Bible? Were they raw accountable information written by the apostles and the disciples themselves without having any outside beliefs mixed in later on?

The earliest recorded gospel was written 80 years after the death of Jesus, and two of the subsequent gospels were based off of this account. How are these first generation accounts?

Furthermore, the Christian bible shares its first five books with the Hebrew bible, and pagan influences are present from the first chapter; There are two creation accounts in Genesis, one is of the Yahwest tradition, the other is borrowed from the Babylonians.

Originally posted by Atlantis001
Thats what I think too. Not only Buddhism that shares common teachings, and stories with christianity. But we can find analogies in many other religions, even hinduism, and the sumerian religion seem to have their share.

I've read the same thing.

Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
Although this theory is fascinating and I would love to believe this to be true, but......

Keep in mind, that their core philosophies differ. Buddha emphasized rebirth of the mindstream. It's questionable whether Jesus believed in reincarnation. Buddha taught that each there was no soul; Jesus did not.

Many many Gnostic writings described Jesus as believing in reincarnation. Of course the Roman church would have no control over the people if they were allowed to believe this....No way, that's why "Hell" was put into it's place....better control over the people.....The Church tried to burn all the Gnostic texts....Ever wonder why.....

Originally posted by mr.smiley
I also read a book on Asia mythology that had a story of a great flood and a man that made a ship to stay alive.Don't have any sources on it though,but it was pretty interesting.

Almost every religion has a story like that come to think of it. Greece did, Babylon did, etc.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I've read the same thing.



Many many Gnostic writings described Jesus as believing in reincarnation. Of course the Roman church would have no control over the people if they were allowed to believe this....No way, that's why "Hell" was put into it's place....better control over the people.....The Church tried to burn all the Gnostic texts....Ever wonder why.....


Yeah.The goal for Gnostics was to reach gnosis (enlightment) and become a Christ (like a Buddha).Almost identical.

almost

Originally posted by debbiejo

Many many Gnostic writings described Jesus as believing in reincarnation. Of course the Roman church would have no control over the people if they were allowed to believe this....No way, that's why "Hell" was put into it's place....better control over the people.....The Church tried to burn all the Gnostic texts....Ever wonder why.....

Do you think Gnosticism is more reliable than the New Testament? I believe the majority of the christians rejected it anyway. I don't think the church had anything to do with it unless you can prove it to me otherwise.

Why do you believe that Jesus was gnostic? As I mentioned before in another thread, the New Testament predated the gnostic gospels.

Dan Brown's best selling novel, The Da Vinci Code was based on Gnostic scriptures. And yet the novel is entirely fiction. Brown's basings were proven false by 20/20 on the ABC network.

Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
Do you think Gnosticism is more reliable than the New Testament? I believe the majority of the christians rejected it anyway. I don't think the church had anything to do with it unless you can prove it to me otherwise.

Why do you believe that Jesus was gnostic? As I mentioned before in another thread, the New Testament predated the gnostic gospels.

Dan Brown's best selling novel, The Da Vinci Code was based on Gnostic scriptures. And yet the novel is entirely fiction. Brown's basings were proven false by 20/20 on the ABC network.

Well I believe that Jesus could of possibly been an Essene which I thought was a sect of the Gnostic's....I've read all the Gnostic's and felt that what Jesus taught was closer to what the Essenes taught...I think he was enlightened to many things that medicine and science has confirmed like diet for one...Here's a quick link I just looked up.

http://www.british-israel.us/12.html

I also read that is mother Mary and Grandmother Anna and John the Baptist were also.

I just found out that the Indians were not the only ones to believe in reincarnation. It turns out that the ancient Egyptians and Greeks believed in it as well.

Here's an article about it:

http://members.aol.com/wwssgrhll/Andrew2.html

According to this the Gnostics, Cabalists, and the Manichaeans were among the few sects of Judaism and Christianity to adopt this belief.

Good article...I've heard of Dr. Ian Stevenson..Read some of his stuff, and there are some interesting recounts indeed....Yep the Gnostics, and Cabalists were part of the Christian movement and was thought of as heretics and persecuted for it.....It would of been interesting to see how differently things would of been if the controlling part of the Christian church (the one we have today)...would not have grown, but died out instead...Hmmmmm.....Probably would of been a much better world today.

I heard of this on a semi-recent Jesus biography. Sounds interesting.

I think it's safe to say that Jesus possibly adopting reincarnation brings no evidence that he went to India since there are regions far closer to Palestine that believes in it.

However there are some other close evidences of the 'Jesus in India theory.' The reincarntion bit is no longer evidence of him going to India anymore.

Ah, Ian Stephenson found his way into this thread as well. Awesome guy for anyone interested in reincarnation. His findings are fairly bullet-proof, about the only way to explain them away is simply to ignore it or to use some sort of false logic.

I really have to read the Gnostics...been reading up on Buddhism recently, and a lot of this stuff fascinates me.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Ah, Ian Stephenson found his way into this thread as well. Awesome guy for anyone interested in reincarnation. His findings are fairly bullet-proof, about the only way to explain them away is simply to ignore it or to use some sort of false logic.

I really have to read the Gnostics...been reading up on Buddhism recently, and a lot of this stuff fascinates me.

What kind of Buddhism are you reading about?

Indeed. There are many branches.

Also, the idea that Tibetian Buddhism is the representative or the mainstream of buddhism is not a correct assumption (even though I tend to lean more towards it)

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What kind of Buddhism are you reading about?

Hmmm...not sure if it's specific which denomination it is. I've just been trying to read up on the basic tenets of Buddhism, and what exactly the Buddha taught. I've also gotten a hold of some translated sermons and talks given by the Buddha for further reference.

I think it's safe to say that Notovich's "Issa Scrolls" are a fraud. For the obvious reason that the name "Issa" is Arabic and used in the Koran. We all know that Islam was founded by Muhammed 600 years after Jesus's death. If these scrolls were made 2000 years ago, the name "Issa" would never be used. His real name was either Yeshua, Yeshu, Yehoshua or somewhere along those lines. So the "Issa" scrolls were more likely a forgery started by the Muslims who invaded India. And from that point on the Buddhists add their own twist to this myth.

I started off in life as a Christian, so I know the doctrine well. I changed later in life to become a Buddhist, and I've done a lot of reading on the subject. What I think is really interesting is the similarities between the teachings of Jesus and the Lotus sutra. I believe Jesus read the Lotus sutra at sometime in his life. Or there is another possibility, the truth is the truth, and Jesus, if he was god, spoke the truth which is also found in the Lotus sutra.

Though being a devout Jew and learning the ways of his people, Jesus also realized something relatively few people--of any faith--realize, or certainly don't wanna admit: that there are common threads which run through all religious/spiritual perspectives (so much for MGIBTYG).

Judaism has at times been described as a religion of ethics. But Jesus, noting how true ethical behavior was falling to the wayside by many of those in power, likely sought to return to the Source. Kabbalah was still centuries away; it would not be surprising if Jesus sought masters of other faiths for the inspiration he felt he wasn't getting from Jewish leaders at that time.

I always think, the easiest way to understand the guy is 1) just as so many of us today regard organized religion as a "false god," so he must've felt that way with how Judaism was being practiced then, at least by its so-called "leaders." 2) Learning techniques in meditation, Jesus was able to, in effect, become "lucid" to the dream that is reality. It was then a matter of tranliterating what he learned from Eastern masters into a language more suitable for his people.

However, once St Paul started getting rejected by his fellow Jews ("No, he is Not the Messiah: where do you see peace??", and later after Constantine put his 2-cents in...MGIBTYG became the reigning premise.

I don't believe Jesus wanted to be worshipped, if infact he was a real person. I believe he came to tell us some truths on how we can all be closer to what we would call god and how to treat other people. He knew the Pharisees were evil, like he said a clean cup on the outside, but filthy on the inside. No wonder he had such followers to listen to him and his parables. The parables were good lessons.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I don't believe Jesus wanted to be worshipped, if infact he was a real person. I believe he came to tell us some truths on how we can all be closer to what we would call god and how to treat other people. He knew the Pharisees were evil, like he said a clean cup on the outside, but filthy on the inside. No wonder he had such followers to listen to him and his parables. The parables were good lessons.

I agree with you.

Does anyone here actually believe the Issa scrolls? I finally understand why Nicolas Notovich is disregarded with his findings.

Originally posted by CosmicSurfer
Does anyone here actually believe the Issa scrolls? I finally understand why Nicolas Notovich is disregarded with his findings. Issa scrolls? Can you give a link?

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Check this out

"Jesus in the age period 14-29

What are these many things that have not been recorded? One record that is glaringly missing is the period 14-29 years in the life of Jesus. One theory is that he went to India to be trained as a Buddhist.

The story of the Wise Men is surprisingly similar to the traditions of Buddhism, a religion 500 years older than Christianity. When a great Buddhist holy man (lama) died, wise men consult the stars and go on a long trek to find his incarnation. When he is found, he is taken from his parents when old enough and trained in the Buddhist faith. Could Jesus have been identified as an incarnation and taken to India?



The Russian explorer, Nicolai Natovich travelled to northern India in the 19th century and found a manuscript in a Tibetan monastery which he translated as 'The Unknown Life of Jesus Christ'. It tells of a divine child called Issa born to a poor family in Israel. he learnt the teachings of Buddhism before returning to Israel at 29. The later teachings and miracles of Jesus have an uncanny parallel with the Buddhist counterpart. For example, the injunction to love your enemies and the promise that the meek will inherit the earth have no precedent in Judaism but they are found in Buddhism.



Examples:

1. Mark 6:48: he went out to them walking on the lake.

Anguttara Nikaya 3:60: He walks upon the water without parting it, as if it were solid ground.

2. Mark 10:25: it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the

kingdom of heaven.

Jatakamala 5:5 & 15: Riches make a man greedy and so are like a caravan lurching down the road to hell.

3. Matthew 6:20: Lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven where moth and rust do not destroy and where

thieves do not break in and steal.

Kuddakaptha 8:9 Let the wise man do righteousness; a treasure that others cannot share, which no thief

can steal, a treasure which does not pass away.
"
http://www.goacom.com/overseas-dige...-in-kashmir.htm


How cool! IIf you're talking about the so called lost years of jesus christ he didn't go to india http://www.essene.com/Issa.htm I think the muslims started that teaching and even thee essene church considers it apocrapha.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I don't believe Jesus wanted to be worshipped, if infact he was a real person. I believe he came to tell us some truths on how we can all be closer to what we would call god and how to treat other people. He knew the Pharisees were evil, like he said a clean cup on the outside, but filthy on the inside. No wonder he had such followers to listen to him and his parables. The parables were good lessons. They were gnostic legends I think that were told by muslims. http://essenes.net/lifeissa0.html

Originally posted by debbiejo
I don't believe Jesus wanted to be worshipped, if infact he was a real person. I believe he came to tell us some truths on how we can all be closer to what we would call god and how to treat other people. He knew the Pharisees were evil, like he said a clean cup on the outside, but filthy on the inside. No wonder he had such followers to listen to him and his parables. The parables were good lessons. The essenes are buddhists http://essenes.net/new/subbible.html

Interesting.........I've heard simular..that he went to India.

http://www.tombofjesus.com/news/FAQ/#qu4

Originally posted by debbiejo
Interesting.........I've heard simular..that he went to India.

http://www.tombofjesus.com/news/FAQ/#qu4

If you read the Lotus sutra and then the words of Jesus, you will see a similarity. Some of the names of things are different but the meaning is similar. That means ether, the truth is the truth and there is no connection, or Jesus read or heard about the Lotus sutra.

as it is with a lot of mythologies they got something in common, buddism, christianity, islam, judaism, shintoism, hinduism they all got it from somewhere, and that somewhere is mans mind. Man made it all up

Originally posted by finti
as it is with a lot of mythologies they got something in common, buddism, christianity, islam, judaism, shintoism, hinduism they all got it from somewhere, and that somewhere is mans mind. Man made it all up

Thank god.

or illusion

Originally posted by finti
or illusion

For illusion.

yes or mytholigy as we also can call it

Originally posted by finti
yes or mytholigy as we also can call it

We wouldn't want to see reality,
we might have to take responsibility.

yeah the fright of the those clinging to a mythology

They are in a cage with an unlocked door. All they need to do, is deside were they want to be, and go there in life. Some people feel safe in a case and maybe they like the door unlocked.

There are two types of people, thoso who live in dilusion, and thoso who know they live in dilusion.

And those who smoke Salvia.

But I do agree, people like to cling to illusions......Their afraid to look outside them for fear of the truth...

I'm really interested in reading books about Buddhism, anyone bother to recommend any?

Originally posted by Eis
I'm really interested in reading books about Buddhism, anyone bother to recommend any?

This is a really good book on Buddhism.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0967469783/102-4297092-7116938?v=glance&n=283155

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
This is a really good book on Buddhism.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0967469783/102-4297092-7116938?v=glance&n=283155
I'll check it out, thanks.

Don't go there.......you'll become a buddhist....

This whole board is becoming buddhist.....Be like me..

soo...would that make Jesus a bodhisattva? He became enlightened...and then chose to help others reach enlightenment before he moved on to nirvana?

Originally posted by debbiejo
Don't go there.......you'll become a buddhist....

This whole board is becoming buddhist.....Be like me..

Well, there is the best reason to become a Buddhist, so you will not be like Deb. jk


Originally posted by Morgoths_Wrath
soo...would that make Jesus a bodhisattva? He became enlightened...and then chose to help others reach enlightenment before he moved on to nirvana?

I guess so.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Well, there is the best reason to become a Buddhist, so you will not be like Deb. jk



Just because I don't what to call myself doesn't mean I'm not special..

Originally posted by Shakyamunison


I guess so.

that's very interesting.

Jesus went to India to learn Buddhism, and when he came back, he taught what he learned to the Jewish people in Israel.

Christianity can actually be considered a combination of Judaism and Buddhism. You can look at Jesus as savior in both religions; one he is the Son of God, and in another he is a bodhisattva. Jesus had to preach in a way that the Jews would accept and understand, and so that's how God gets incorporated into the whole deal.

This all seems plausible, right?

Originally posted by debbiejo
Just because I don't what to call myself doesn't mean I'm not special..

You are SPECIAL...doh

Originally posted by Morgoths_Wrath
that's very interesting.

Jesus went to India to learn Buddhism, and when he came back, he taught what he learned to the Jewish people in Israel.

Christianity can actually be considered a combination of Judaism and Buddhism. You can look at Jesus as savior in both religions; one he is the Son of God, and in another he is a bodhisattva. Jesus had to preach in a way that the Jews would accept and understand, and so that's how God gets incorporated into the whole deal.

This all seems plausible, right?

That is how I see it. Just like me, I use the term God all the time, cause if I talked about the Buddha that was enlightened in the remote past no one would understand me. Not like they understand me right now.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
You are SPECIAL...doh I know...kinda obvious...huh..


And to the above...why do people feel a need to be part of a religion anyway....Can't people think for themselves?

Originally posted by debbiejo
I know...kinda obvious...huh..


And to the above...why do people feel a need to be part of a religion anyway....Can't people think for themselves?

yes, they should be encouraged to! but, at the same time, social interaction is imbedded in our human psyche. people feel the need to be a part of some group.

Homo sapiens are very social creatures

Originally posted by Morgoths_Wrath
yes, they should be encouraged to! but, at the same time, social interaction is imbedded in our human psyche. people feel the need to be a part of some group.

Homo sapiens are very social creatures There are other churches and groups that do not hold to strict doctrine or try to convert others. But people like to be alike...herd mentality...Unfortunately when you get a group together and especially with a leader, things seem to go array with judgment.

Originally posted by debbiejo
There are other churches and groups that do not hold to strict doctrine or try to convert others. But people like to be alike...herd mentality...Unfortunately when you get a group together and especially with a leader, things seem to go array with judgment.

yes, it's all very confusing

Religion causes division, spirituality does not. Religious people try to be spiritual, and some really do well, but all in all, there is the judgement of others for the most part. I see religion as a real problem.

Not he I'm right, and youre wrong, and so you're going to hell poor lost soul judgments though....It's almost some kind of elitist view.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Don't go there.......you'll become a buddhist....

This whole board is becoming buddhist.....Be like me..

Remember the days when Lil Bitchiness and I were the only Buddhists on the board?

Originally posted by debbiejo
Not he I'm right, and youre wrong, and so you're going to hell poor lost soul judgments though....It's almost some kind of elitist view.

oh yeah definitely. There is that kind-of elitist view that some Christians have, and they love it. They love to think that they're right, and you're wrong, and that they'll be rewarded and you'll be punished. This idea became so big through years of corruption and I think that today the real message of the Bible is lost for the most part.

eOriginally posted by Adam_PoE
Remember the days when Lil Bitchiness and I were the only Buddhists on the board?



I feel like a minority.......What ever shall I do...



I hear ya...

I am minority, so bendover cause I go for blank to total control

Many say that Jesus stayed for about 6 years in Puri district of Orissa state in India to learn the culture of Hindus who have strong faith on Lord Jagannath. There is a lot of mystery in the visibility picture of Lord Jagannath (The Holy Cross where Jesus was crucified, may look like that it is the Lord Jagannath who is holding his child) , which need to be realised. The person who understand the mystery (through strong devotion only), gets the ultimate spiritual power.

After getting the blessings of Lord Jagannath to spread HIS divine words for the benefit of the whole humanity, Jesus taught the whole world in the languages by which people can understand.

Though it was not revealed by Jesus the source of HIS wisdom befor death, but HE has provided indications for the people to search the source by crucifying himself.

If any one meditating on the crucified picture of Jesus and have seen some other pictutre, then please compare that picture with the available picture of Lord Jagannath to know the answer.

Originally posted by Jagannath
Many say that Jesus stayed for about 6 years in Puri district of Orissa state in India to learn the culture of Hindus who have strong faith on Lord Jagannath. There is a lot of mystery in the visibility picture of Lord Jagannath (The Holy Cross where Jesus was crucified, may look like that it is the Lord Jagannath who is holding his child) , which need to be realised. The person who understand the mystery (through strong devotion only), gets the ultimate spiritual power.

After getting the blessings of Lord Jagannath to spread HIS divine words for the benefit of the whole humanity, Jesus taught the whole world in the languages by which people can understand.

Though it was not revealed by Jesus the source of HIS wisdom befor death, but HE has provided indications for the people to search the source by crucifying himself.

If any one meditating on the crucified picture of Jesus and have seen some other pictutre, then please compare that picture with the available picture of Lord Jagannath to know the answer.

Wow! it really does look like a man on a cross.
http://img2.travelblog.org/Photos/8257/59828/f/352953-Lord-Jagannath-2.jpg

for me, the only source to believe for Jesus's history is only bible. unless the bible tells me Jesus come to India and learn something from India, I won't believe anything about these rumors.

Originally posted by Kirikaze Fuuma
for me, the only source to believe for Jesus's history is only bible. unless the bible tells me Jesus come to India and learn something from India, I won't believe anything about these rumors.

What if someone had taken it out of the bible years ago?

Originally posted by Kirikaze Fuuma
for me, the only source to believe for Jesus's history is only bible. unless the bible tells me Jesus come to India and learn something from India, I won't believe anything about these rumors.

Interestingly, the only source of the historicity of Jesus is The Bible, and it says nothing about his life between the ages of 12 and 33.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What if someone had taken it out of the bible years ago?

That's silly. It's like suggesting that Constantine put together a council somewhere in Bithynia, let's say Nicaea and then hammered out Christian doctrine to work out of number of issues that people thought needed to be resolved and in doing so removed huge amounts of writing that had previously been part of various Christian sects.

Can you imagine how silly that would look?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dd/THE_FIRST_COUNCIL_OF_NICEA.jpg


Oh, shit!

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
That's silly. It's like suggesting that Constantine put together a council somewhere in Bithynia, let's say Nicaea and then hammered out Christian doctrine to work out of number of issues that people thought needed to be resolved and in doing so removed huge amounts of writing that had previously been part of various Christian sects.

Can you imagine how silly that would look?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dd/THE_FIRST_COUNCIL_OF_NICEA.jpg


Oh, shit!

Originally posted by cking
nope, in the bible Jesus clearly said he learned hid wisdom from God and only even in the lost years. when he was 12 he use to stay and talk with the teachers of the law and they were amazed by his wisdom at his age. many people have theories of this, but Jesus clearly says he is from heaven and learned it from the father of heaven. people will make theories about it because they aren't satisfied with what Jesus says and don't believe what he says, so they make theories about him that don't make any sense. Jesus was not an ordinary man, he is the greatest man every lived and will come back some day to restore his kingdom. many people will try and copy information and try and twist it around to sound like Jesus heard from Buddhists, Jesus even said false teachers will have false information and doctrines of him and don't be deceived by these. How can people say that Jesus learned from Buddhist when he clearly says that he learned things from the father above. doesn't make sense. the bible says as Jesus got older he wisdom was greater only because god gave him that sort of wisdom that is greater than Solomon who is regarded as the wisest man of all time. Jesus is god almighty in the flesh, he knows what the world is around him and knows about all the religions also since he created it.

I JesusIsAlive approve of your response cking

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
I JesusIsAlive approve of your response cking



However, there is nothing in the to support what he had to say.

Nah, Jesus is the sun.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness

1. Mark 6:48: he went out to them walking on the lake.

Anguttara Nikaya 3:60: He walks upon the water without parting it, as if it were solid ground.
The sun shines on lakes.

Originally posted by lord xyz
Nah, Jesus is the sun.

The sun shines on lakes.

Is that what you think they were really saying?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Is that what you think they were really saying?

No I think they're saying that good optometry didn't exist back then.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
No I think they're saying that good optometry didn't exist back then.

That is true, but I think you will find that walking on water is a much older icon for a god. I personally believe that stories like Jesus walking on water were added later to give evidence for the divinity of Jesus. I don not believe that they are true stories.

How is it possible to teach the wisest man there even was, anything?

Jesus was schooling scholars as a preteen. You cannot teach a God. That's ridiculous. And arrogant.

So this thread is invalid. And ridiculous and arrogant.

And clearly anti-christian, really..

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
How is it possible to teach the wisest man there even was, anything?

Jesus was schooling scholars as a preteen. You cannot teach a God. That's ridiculous. And arrogant.

So this thread is invalid. And ridiculous and arrogant.

And clearly anti-christian, really..

No, saying that Jesus could not learn anything is ridiculous and arrogant.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
And clearly anti-christian, really..

Not even close. There are more than their share of anti-christian threads here but this isn't one of them.

The idea that Jesus may have been taught by Buddhist monks is not an invention of LB's and it raises perfectly reasonable points (as long as one accepts Jesus may have been human).

However I disagree with the premise. Travel to needed places would have been extremely difficult at the time an not something I imagine a person without great wealth being capable of. Many religions have similar teachings because many of them were founded on what are essentially humanist concepts. The best example I can think of his letting a stranger sit with you to eat, many many religions have a story, koan or fable of that exact or a very similar form. The presence of nearly identical symbols does not mean the presence of identical symbolism or of any contact between the writers.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Not even close. There are more than their share of anti-christian threads here but this isn't one of them.

The idea that Jesus may have been taught by Buddhist monks is not an invention of LB's and it raises perfectly reasonable points (as long as one accepts Jesus may have been human).

However I disagree with the premise. Travel to needed places would have been extremely difficult at the time an not something I imagine a person without great wealth being capable of. Many religions have similar teachings because many of them were founded on what are essentially humanist concepts. The best example I can think of his letting a stranger sit with you to eat, many many religions have a story, koan or fable of that exact or a very similar form. The presence of nearly identical symbols does not mean the presence of identical symbolism or of any contact between the writers.

I agree. Jesus didn't need to go anywhere. There was trade with the east and the Roman Empire, and with trade comes ideas.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
No, saying that Jesus could not learn anything is ridiculous and arrogant.

No, admitting so would be illogical.

A God is all knowing. Jesus was God on earth.

There wasn't anything he didn't know. He was the wisest man that ever lived.

His only source whom he took knowledge from was God in heaven.

For what can man teach a deity?

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
No, admitting so would be illogical.

A God is all knowing. Jesus was God on earth.

There wasn't anything he didn't know. He was the wisest man that ever lived.

His only source whom he took knowledge from was God in heaven.

For what can man teach a deity?

I believe that Jesus was just a human, and not a deity. Therefore, it make absolute sense to talk about were Jesus got his ideas. If your belief prevents you from talking about this topic, then I suggest you do not read anything from this thread.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I believe that Jesus was just a human, and not a deity. Therefore, it make absolute sense to talk about were Jesus got his ideas. If your belief prevents you from talking about this topic, then I suggest you do not read anything from this thread.

I could say the same thing to you. Thing is, my beliefs don't prevent me from talking about the topic otherwise i would've not have read anything in here. Or commented. So i'll continue on.

According to the Bible Jesus was a Deity. And to be a Deity means to be:

1. a god
2. a divine character that of the Supreme Being; divinity.
3. the estate or rank of a god

dic.com

And a God is all knowing.

Someone whom is all knowing doesn't need anyone to teach him anything. It'd be futile wouldn't you think so. But then again you believe that Jesus was human which he was. But he was a God on earth in human flesh.

He was human in flesh but He was perfect.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
I could say the same thing to you. Thing is, my beliefs don't prevent me from talking about the topic otherwise i would've not have read anything in here. Or commented. So i'll continue on.

According to the Bible Jesus was a Deity. And to be a Deity means to be:

1. a god
2. a divine character that of the Supreme Being; divinity.
3. the estate or rank of a god

dic.com

And a God is all knowing.

Someone whom is all knowing doesn't need anyone to teach him anything. It'd be futile wouldn't you think so. But then again you believe that Jesus was human which he was. But he was a God on earth in human flesh.

He was human in flesh but He was perfect.

Suffer if you wish.

The only people, that I know, who cannot learn from another human are retarded. So, are you saying that Jesus was retarded?

Now, can we get back on topic?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Suffer if you wish.

The only people, that I know, who cannot learn from another human are retarded. So, are you saying that Jesus was retarded?

Now, can we get back on topic?

Firstly, I'm not suffering. Just posting. Secondly a deity or in your case a demi-god, like Jesus, was all knowing. Which meant he knew it all. Which meant there was nothing he didn't know. Which meant teaching his would've been futile.

He was The Teacher whom learned all wisdom from God up above.

And thirdly we've been on topic, Einstein. How have we not been.

But fourthly, and most importantly, it's (just about) 5 p.m. And it's time to head home. Alas.

Thank you, Jesus.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
Firstly, I'm not suffering. Just posting. Secondly a deity or in your case a demi-god, like Jesus, was all knowing. Which meant he knew it all. Which meant there was nothing he didn't know. Which meant teaching his would've been futile.

He was The Teacher whom learned all wisdom from God up above.

And thirdly we've been on topic, Einstein. How have we not been.

But fourthly, and most importantly, it's (just about) 5 p.m. And it's time to head home. Alas.

Thank you, Jesus.



Please provide proof.

Fisty,

Don't you find it odd that the Bible doesn't have a single account of Jesus (it's head figure) for almost 20 years of his life.

He's born, he does some prodigy-style shit as a kid, disappears for nearly 20 years and then comes back with "I am God I am the way, here, let me die for you." That doesn't strike you as being a bit strange?

WTF could God have been doing for 20 years that no one wrote about, considering he made himself standout as a child? To me, it sounds like one of those train-wreak child star stories you see on VH1.

Christianity rips off stories from Buddhism and other religions as well as adopting themes from greek/roman/egyptian and norse mythology.

Back in the day when a travel heard a good yarn, they'd make it apply to their own religion.

Doesn't anyone question all the similar stories that you find in various religions?

I did and then I was horrified.

Originally posted by Robtard
Fisty,

Don't you find it odd that the Bible doesn't have a single account of Jesus (it's head figure) for almost 20 years of his life.

He's born, he does some prodigy-style shit as a kid, disappears for nearly 20 years and then comes back with "I am God I am the way, here, let me die for you." That doesn't strike you as being a bit strange?

WTF could God have been doing for 20 years that no one wrote about, considering he made himself standout as a child? To me, it sounds like one of those train-wreak child star stories you see on VH1.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Interestingly, the only source of the historicity of Jesus is The Bible, and it says nothing about his life between the ages of 12 and 33.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I believe that Jesus was just a human, and not a deity. Therefore, it make absolute sense to talk about were Jesus got his ideas. If your belief prevents you from talking about this topic, then I suggest you do not read anything from this thread.

Ich kann nicht anders.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
Just like with the dinosaurs. They are mentioned in Genesis 1:20-21 by the way . . .21-"And God proceeded to create the great sea monsters"

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
Firstly, I'm not suffering. Just posting. Secondly a deity or in your case a demi-god, like Jesus, was all knowing. Which meant he knew it all. Which meant there was nothing he didn't know. Which meant teaching his would've been futile.

Hercules wasn't all-knowing . . .

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
No. I don't find it odd at all. Everything that's in the Bible is all that's necessary to know.

I'm not sure if it makes me more sad or frightened that people like you exist.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
Just like with the dinosaurs. They are mentioned in Genesis 1:20-21 by the way . . .21-"And God proceeded to create the great sea monsters"

All dinosaurs are, by definition, land dwelling creatures.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Hercules wasn't all-knowing . . .

That's cause he came from a fantastical and mythological pagan god from Greece whom was only the God of thunder. (and the God of Gods) but still...

Athena was smarter that Zeus was. She was the God(dess) of wisdom

Then you had Metis whom was the Goddess of and thought. She was smarter than Zeus was too. So Zeus wasn't all knowing if others knew more than he did. And therefore, and much less, Hercules.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
That's cause he came from a fantastical and mythological pagan god

There is NO way of knowing that "your" god is not mythological. Your belief in god and the bible is an act of faith, not fact. You might be right, you might be wrong, it can not be proven either way.

But, as I asked before, do you not find it perplexing at all that many religions and myths that existed before christianity have the same stories?

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
That's cause he came from a fantastical and mythological pagan god from Greece whom was only the God of thunder. (and the God of Gods) but still...

Athena was smarter that Zeus was. She was the God(dess) of wisdom

Then you had Metis whom was the Goddess of and thought. She was smarter than Zeus was too. So Zeus wasn't all knowing if others knew more than he did. And therefore, and much less, Hercules.

Your argument that Jesus was all knowing is:

a) Jesus is a god or demi-god
b) a god or demi-god is all knowing

I gave you Hercules (a demi-god) who wasn't all knowing which throws some doubt on the legitimacy of your argument. And yeah, Zeus was the God of all Gods, thunder and lightening were symbolic of his power just as Miracles were symbolic of Yahweh's power.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I'm not sure if it makes me more sad or frightened that people like you exist.

All dinosaurs are, by definition, land dwelling creatures.

minor pc lapse there..

Do not be sad or scared cause of my existence or beliefs. I'm not sad or scared of you and you beliefs..

And dinosaurs were land dwelling creatures in the same way the massive sea creatures that coexisted with dinosaurs were sea dwellers.

By the way, Jesus was not a diety, the whole point of the story is that he was a man, subject to man's temptations and desires.

Originally posted by FistOfThe North
The problem is, is that your comparing mere mortal teachers and teachings and earthly thought to those of a demi-god. There is no comparison.

And of course i meant the OT. But i should'a specified that. My bad. And he learned it (the OT) well? He didn't have learn it. He is the Word.

And i've never heard of Jesus killing a child so i can't comment on that.

And no, i wouldn't worship you if you said you were "I AM" because "you're not". Jesus is. And He's proved it time and time again. And that's my belief. And you have your non-beliefs.

And what i said does make sense. Jesus is a heavenly being. He was a demi-God. The King of kings.

You have proved nothing. All you have done is stated your belief.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Your argument that Jesus was all knowing is:

a) Jesus is a god or demi-god
b) a god or demi-god is all knowing

I gave you Hercules (a demi-god) who wasn't all knowing which throws some doubt on the legitimacy of your argument. And yeah, Zeus was the God of all Gods, thunder and lightening were symbolic of his power just as Miracles were symbolic of Yahweh's power.

That's right, a god or a demi-god is all knowing if He comes from an all knowing source.

Would you consider yourself all knowing if you came from Nike the goddess of strength, speed, and victory. You'd be a demi-god yes, and most likely supreme in those areas maybe, but all knowing?, no.

And it's (about) 5 pm.

peace..

Here is more information on the topic:

http://wisdomquarterly.blogspot.com/2008/08/jesus-in-mahayana-india.html

Originally posted by KharmaDog
Christianity rips off stories from Buddhism and other religions as well as adopting themes from greek/roman/egyptian and norse mythology.

Back in the day when a travel heard a good yarn, they'd make it apply to their own religion.

Doesn't anyone question all the similar stories that you find in various religions?

Anyone?

Originally posted by KharmaDog
Anyone?

Collective Unconscious- Carl Jung

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Collective Unconscious- Carl Jung

Or God has made more then one path to salvation.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Or God has made more then one path to salvation.

Why the wink? I didn't rule that out. It doesn't go against my beliefs....

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Why the wink? I didn't rule that out. It doesn't go against my beliefs....

That's very Buddhist of you.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
That's very Buddhist of you.

Well, Jesus did learn from them didn't he

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Well, Jesus did learn from them didn't he

Are you asking me?

Don't answer him. He'll start chanting again.

I personally believe Jesus and Buddha are one and the same, just pretending to be one of us to steer us in the right direction

Originally posted by parvati120
I personally believe Jesus and Buddha are one and the same, just pretending to be one of us to steer us in the right direction

A common belief in some parts...

Originally posted by parvati120
I personally believe Jesus and Buddha are one and the same, just pretending to be one of us to steer us in the right direction I believe all religions are like that. It teaches ways to make life better.

The thing about spirituality is that because we're scared of it, we cling to the supernatural stories in religion rather than looking at the truth and seeing how precise nature acts. It's quite ironic really.

Originally posted by lord xyz
The thing about spirituality is that because we're scared of it, we cling to the supernatural stories in religion rather than looking at the truth and seeing how precise nature acts. It's quite ironic really.

so, you think that people are religious out of fear although they know other things to be factually true?

Originally posted by lord xyz
I believe all religions are like that. It teaches ways to make life better.

The thing about spirituality is that because we're scared of it, we cling to the supernatural stories in religion rather than looking at the truth and seeing how precise nature acts. It's quite ironic really.

Even just having spirituality requires the belief in something supernatural too.

I dont think its out of fear that we have beliefs or religeon, its because we have souls and and we are a part of the "collective conscious" Nothing happens by accident. We dont wake up with our hair combed and a made bed. Some one mentioned "They way Nature acts" Nature decays and falls appart it dosent come to order. We are not just Stardust that happened after billions of years to become cohesive and conscious. Most beliefs are the same from all eras and all parts of the world because we know there is something more, we just havent been made aware. Even science is discovering that evolution isnt possible. They dont want to give credit to Yah-Weh or what ever name for the Omnicient being you want to use so they call it intelligent design. This is my 2cents of course this intire discussion is about belief so no one can be write or wrong. If you read All ancient Mythos of All peoples there is a Being or Beings (Sumarians have Anninaki, India has Krishna,Egypt Osiris, MesoAmerica Verachocha , Hebrew Yah-Weh etc) that give us the ideas of Civilization. I find it facinating that for millions of years we were saying "ugh" and wearing animal furs using stone tools and then within the last 6 to 10,000 years we have Politics,War,commerce,science,Physics,Math,Medicin
e,art,music landed probes on other planets. It seems to me there was a catalyst that sparked this.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
Even science is discovering that evolution isnt possible. They dont want to give credit to Yah-Weh or what ever name for the Omnicient being you want to use so they call it intelligent design.

Scientists don't believe in ID, mainly because ID isn't science. Also where did you get the idea that "evolution isn't possible"?

To answer your question...For evolution to be possible there has to be a single celled organism. Made up of Proteins ,amino acids, a multitude of components. These are complex systems in them selves. How did they come to fruition? As your name states "Chaos" is the law. Has there ever been a case of a 747 jet assembling itself? yet something infinitely more complex like a cell just amalgamated? I have to admit Intelligent design isn't science . My intention was to point out that certain people who where evolutionary scientist have abandoned the idea of evolution because it doesn't work. Science cant explain the advent of the protein anymore than someone can prove God. Science is as much a belief as Religion.

Please let me rephrase ...Evolution, not science, is as much belief as Religion.

Someone watched Expelled.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
To answer your question...For evolution to be possible there has to be a single celled organism. Made up of Proteins ,amino acids, a multitude of components. These are complex systems in them selves. How did they come to fruition? As your name states "Chaos" is the law. Has there ever been a case of a 747 jet assembling itself? yet something infinitely more complex like a cell just amalgamated? I have to admit Intelligent design isn't science . My intention was to point out that certain people who where evolutionary scientist have abandoned the idea of evolution because it doesn't work. Science cant explain the advent of the protein anymore than someone can prove God.

Chaos is the law but Chaos (by its very nature) does not preclude the production of Order. No one thinks that cells "just amalgamated" it's a long series of events that become probable when you note that the entire planet was a breeding ground.

Also, abiogenesis is not evolution. In fact it has nothing remotely to do with evolution.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
Science is as much a belief as Religion.

No, science (and one of it's products, evolution) is testable, falsifiable and determined by evidence mountains. Atheism has become the equal of faith for some people but science and evolution don't have anything in common with religion unless you're so dim that you can't understand either Reason or Faith.

"Chaos doesn't preclude the production of order?" WOW!! And i amended my quote. Evolution , not science,is a leap of faith. If you are saying that Evolution has been impirically proved you are misinformed. And biogenisis has nothing to do with evolution? I am very interested on what your references are that you came up with these concepts. Truly i am always interested in learning and hearing someone out before i resort to insults. I am no scholar but i have taken College level Biology and the complexities of a cell are truly staggering. So please explain how the cell came to existence if not through evolving because my professor could not even explain it. Just the thought of a dim unreasoning student of truth.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
"Chaos doesn't preclude the production of order?" WOW!!

Chaos theory. Emergence. Random action leading to order is part of nature. A box of ropes will tie knots if you shake it ten or more times. Particles floating in space will clump together at random until they have enough mass to make a planet. Fractals provide a number of other examples.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
And i amended my quote. Evolution , not science,is a leap of faith.

And I noted that evolution is not a leap of faith. It has mountains of evidence, if you think it takes faith to believe in evolution it would be awfully hard to believe anything.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
And biogenisis has nothing to do with evolution?

They're two different things. Saying that abiogeneis is a leap of faith is reasonable but it's not an argument against evolution in any way shape or form. The fact that sodium will kill you (or at least hurt you) if you eat it doesn't mean water isn't a liquid.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
Truly i am always interested in learning and hearing someone out before i resort to insults.

I have no such failing.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
I am no scholar but i have taken College level Biology and the complexities of a cell are truly staggering. So please explain how the cell came to existence if not through evolving because my professor could not even explain it.

No one knows how cells formed. Various postulates exist but all of them require a certain leap of faith. Fortunately for evolution does not deal with how cells formed.

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
Just the thought of a dim unreasoning student of truth.

And yet we have "Christian Science".