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I know he can create a force storm but does that really make him greater than Exar Kun, Naga Sadow, Revan etc..?

getting killed by Han Solo isnt a good start for getting a chair with the Ancient Lords

lmao

That wasn't Sids fault that was the authors fault.

Say that after reading "I,Jedi" or "Splinter of the Mind's Eye". Or better yet, let's drag that up everytime someone gripes about NJO Luke or Revan.

Splinter of the Minds Eye is down there with Crystal Star in crap factor.

Yeah, and anything with the Vong in it just sucks immediately, do not pass go.

I thought some of the NJO was good. I know you hate the whole concept of it not being light against dark, but I like it better than the clone wars.

Well, we don't know for certain. But he obviously was powerful. His Force Storms could consume entire fleets and ships at a time. Of course Janus or someone will come along and dismiss that talent as a common trait amongst Sith Lords, I'm sure...

I doubt he could take Ragnos on or Kun. But he's still powerful enough to deserve some respect. Which he apparently never gets.

Glentract, it wasn't actually Han Solo who killed Palpatine. He slayed his physical form by shooting him in the back with a pistol. Before that, he managed to slip past Luke's defenses with his mastery of the Dark Side.

The Jedi Order tried to confront him, and despite being on his damn deathbed, took them all out - killed one and incapacitated the other. When Han shot him, it is very possible that he could've lived on - through his subconscious - like he did after ROTJ. He'd just have no clone body. However, Empatojayos Brand - a trained and powerful Jedi - intercepted Palpatine's spirit - and they both became one with the Force.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Yeah, and anything with the Vong in it just sucks immediately, do not pass go.


Oh boo hoo, nobody could kill Chewie!

They went there. For 21 books, and several comic references. Get over it. And get back on topic.

Force storm was badass. Did we see anybody else ever do anything with that kinda power? Naga Sadow and his sun trick was on par.

Still, I'd put Sideous up there as deserving to be counted amongst the great sith lords.

Originally posted by InsaneNoodlyGuy
Oh boo hoo, nobody could kill Chewie!

They went there. For 21 books, and several comic references. Get over it. And get back on topic.

Force storm was badass. Did we see anybody else ever do anything with that kinda power? Naga Sadow and his sun trick was on par.

Still, I'd put Sideous up there as deserving to be counted amongst the great sith lords.

You do realize that a Supernova would engulf an area far greater than our solar system right? If you pack the area with a bunch of ships, that's a bit more than what that "force storm" that everyone talks about can do.

And since when is having one force ability (albeit a powerful one) make you among the greatest?

Originally posted by Illustrious
You do realize that a Supernova would engulf an area far greater than our solar system right? If you pack the area with a bunch of ships, that's a bit more than what that "force storm" that everyone talks about can do.

And since when is having one force ability (albeit a powerful one) make you among the greatest? Yeah, that's right Nobody. But I do agree with your 21 book comment, so true.

Oh, hey, it's spelled "Sidious" dude.

Why is it Exar Kun is always said to be more powerful than Sidious. I mean I highly doubt that he could beat Revan. Also in every Yoda vs. Revan they always come out in a near draw. Which I always thought it would be. Who has had approx. 900 years of training with both the force and a lightsaber. So if all this is true Yoda should at least be on par with Kun.

And we all know ROTS Sidious could defeat Yoda. So how would Yoda fair against DE Sidious? He would probably be anhilated by his force storm. So if Yoda would get defeated so easily then I doubt Revan and Kun would do much better.

Jeez. The Force Storm is not an ability you could use in a one-on-one battle. How could you sensibly think that? Neither is Naga and Kun's Star Destroying ability.

And you obviously don't know much about Kun or any of the Ancients if you think they could be stood still against by Yoda or Sidious. DE Sidious is good, but I wouldn't give him a chance against Ragnos, or Kun, or Revan, etc. We know not enough about the Ancients to make a verdict, but we know enough about Sidious.

And the Force Storm is not sheer power; it's a technique. Like breaking a cement block. You could take the strongest man in the world and tell him to break ten six-inch blocks of cement in one strike. He couldn't. But if you took someone who'd trained in such techniques for several years, yet was only a quarter of the "strong man's" strength, he'd pull it off.

Yoda is better than normal Sidious by a bit. DE Sidious is better than Yoda by a reasonable amount. But many say this only because of his Storm. Get over it. Naga and Kun could destroy planets, solar systems with their TECHNIQUE. No one here gives THEM enough credit.

DE Sidious is pretty good, but he's not in the league of the Ancients.

Then how is Revan in the league of the Ancients if he can barely beat Yoda who couldn't even dream of beating Sidious.

What? Yoda couldn't dream of beating Sidious? And Revan can barely beat Yoda? Yoda would out up a fight against either of them, sure. But so far, the only point the DE-supporters have come up with is his Force Storm. Big whup. Revan controlled a SUN. Emperor Revan has a thousand reasons, none of which I feel I need to type up. You HIGHLY underestimate Revan, and RIDICULOUSLY overestimate Sidious.

whatever you ****ing fanboy

Don't even make me go there Genises, with all your crap about OMG SIDS HAS FORCES STROM OMG! I don't agree with you. That's my opinion. I don't come to this forum to swear at retard noobs like you. If the only reason why Sidious is as powerfu as the Ancients is freakin Force Storm, then you van't even think about calling me a fanboy.

Who cares I'm going to lose this argument because nobody execept maybe Darth Somebody is giving this guy the Respect he deserves

And if the only way you can defend your arguments is by trying to piss the hell outta people who actually make sense, I got a thousand words for you.

Genises, try bringing up good points. If you can't defend Sidious without relying on Darth Somebody... Just shut up or admit you've lost.

Yes, do try to support your arguments.

Originally posted by DarthGenises
whatever you ****ing fanboy

That's not one. Mind your tongue.

Originally posted by Darth Windu
What? Yoda couldn't dream of beating Sidious? And Revan can barely beat Yoda? Yoda would out up a fight against either of them, sure. But so far, the only point the DE-supporters have come up with is his Force Storm. Big whup. Revan controlled a SUN. Emperor Revan has a thousand reasons, none of which I feel I need to type up. You HIGHLY underestimate Revan, and RIDICULOUSLY overestimate Sidious.

Since when did Revan control an f***ing SUN? He contorlled the Star Forge which is mot the same thing!

Besides, Sidious is not an Anchient Sith, they died with Naga Sadow, like how the Mandalorians died at Malachor V.

first off all i want to say something that i meght even start a new post for. big whoop revan controlled a star. you don't need great power to do that. all you need to do is steal rakatan technology and a couple credits and boom you got a machine that controls stars for you. secound of all i want to help darth somebody out with some statements. some people say that sidiuos is a bad dueler but only strong with the force. yet they got no facts. name one duel that sidiuos lost. stop thinking there is none. he beat yoda which is the highest ranked jedi at the time. there is no effedence that states that sidiuos dueling power is weak. in fact it is posible but unlikely that is dueling power is stronger then his force power. there is no evidence.

oh sorry i posted during the same time as darth koroni

According to the versus forums, Yoda could give Revan a run for his money. And it is my belief that Dark Empire Sidious is beyond Yoda by a mile. So if that were the case, he would probably be able to defeat Revan as well. But notice I said probably and Dark Empire Sidious. I doubt ROTS one could stop him.

I dont know a ton about DE Sidious, so I won't go into this too much. Is he only in comics or is he in any of the books. All I have about him is in the Essential Guides. I do know that he was killed by Han Solo. Seeing as that's all I know, I don't really have a lot of respect for him.

And on another note. Earlier, Koroni, you said that the Sith died with Naga Sadow and the Mandalorians died at Malacor V. Both are incorect. The Mandalorians were still around in the movie-era.

Originally posted by Darth Somebody
According to the versus forums, Yoda could give Revan a run for his money. And it is my belief that Dark Empire Sidious is beyond Yoda by a mile. So if that were the case, he would probably be able to defeat Revan as well. But notice I said probably and Dark Empire Sidious. I doubt ROTS one could stop him.

Two things:

- Since when is the general concensus of the versus forum basis for one's ability?

- How is DE Sidious better then ROTS Sidious besides the Force storm?

1. True. You have a point. In truth, I suppose your opinions - however stated - are like mine in the end. Not always right.

2. He's stronger, quicker, and I'd imagine able to perform talents such as the Force Storm and the use of his Force-powers seem to be stronger. Notice I said 'seem'.

Fair enough. Can we cite examples? I mean, is anyone familiar with every aspect of him enough to render a more effective judgment?

We already have effective judgement, DE sidious is sidious but younger and more powerful, he says this himself.

And Exar Kun as a Sith lord is older and more powerful then he was as a jedi. It's a vague, generl statement. I'm asking for something along the lines of his capabilities outside of his Force storm ability.

Originally posted by Darth Koroni
Since when did Revan control an f***ing SUN? He contorlled the Star Forge which is mot the same thing!

Besides, Sidious is not an Anchient Sith, they died with Naga Sadow, like how the Mandalorians died at Malachor V. Oh yeah! Fight the cause man!

But if ROTS or the OT Sidious isn't stronger than DE one, how come he never used this Force-Storm until DE?

Originally posted by Darth Koroni
Since when did Revan control an f***ing SUN? He contorlled the Star Forge which is mot the same thing!

Besides, Sidious is not an Anchient Sith, they died with Naga Sadow, like how the Mandalorians died at Malachor V.

Revan did control a sun because he was one of the few people powerful enough to master the Star Forge. The only other person that we know of who was able to do this was Malak. Sion and Nhilis(god this guy's name is a pain to spell) did not have the power to acomplish such a feat. Also, Revan could be considered an ancient Sith because he was around 4,000 years before the era of the movies.

Originally posted by darthrevan89
Revan did control a sun because he was one of the few people powerful enough to master the Star Forge. The only other person that we know of who was able to do this was Malak. Sion and Nhilis(god this guy's name is a pain to spell) did not have the power to acomplish such a feat. Also, Revan could be considered an ancient Sith because he was around 4,000 years before the era of the movies. But he didn't actually CONTROL the sun, like Sadow did, he just siphoned off energy. And 4000 years is a period of time in which one could be called Ancient, but I think he was referring to the Ancient RACE of Sith.

Originally posted by Tangible God
But he didn't actually CONTROL the sun, like Sadow did, he just siphoned off energy. And 4000 years is a period of time in which one could be called Ancient, but I think he was referring to the Ancient RACE of Sith.

You make a good point, I should have phrased myself better...Revan did not control a sun perhaps, but through the use of the Star Forge he gained access to the power of a sun. Yes, while he did it using the Star Forge it took an incredible amount of power to do so.

In terms of ancient Sith I agree with you there. Although I myself do not make a very large distinction between "True" Sith and "New" Sith; new as in those after Naga Sadow. They both hold on same set of beliefs. I have very little respect for the Sith from Darth Bane on since they all seem like cowards.

Originally posted by darthrevan89
You make a good point, I should have phrased myself better...Revan did not control a sun perhaps, but through the use of the Star Forge he gained access to the power of a sun. Yes, while he did it using the Star Forge it took an incredible amount of power to do so.

In terms of ancient Sith I agree with you there. Although I myself do not make a very large distinction between "True" Sith and "New" Sith; new as in those after Naga Sadow. They both hold on same set of beliefs. I have very little respect for the Sith from Darth Bane on since they all seem like cowards. That's true. I've only ever like Bane because of the theory of him being the first to use Darth, but other than that, most of his line were just pussies.

Originally posted by Darth Somebody
1. True. You have a point. In truth, I suppose your opinions - however stated - are like mine in the end. Not always right.

2. He's stronger, quicker, and I'd imagine able to perform talents such as the Force Storm and the use of his Force-powers seem to be stronger. Notice I said 'seem'.

That's EU for ya. The villains and heroes always seem stronger; you'd think that dying would make Palpatine less powerful but no, they ruin your image of the maniacal Palpatine of the movies...

Okay. . . let's get things straight here;

- I DON'T think that DE Sidious would get owned by Revan. I DO however, want to see some proof that he is indeed this uberly powerful Force-user, other than the fact that he can conjure up a Force Storm. I'm not underestimating him, or denying him credit, but I don't want to make him the most powerful Sith based on one ability.

- In the DE series, the combined power of Luke and Leia wasn't all that powerful. It was definetely stronger than Yoda or the original Sids, but not all that mighty. A good Sith, like Revan, could pull that off.

- Since Revan seems to be the "Ancient" coming up here, and Genises said that Yoda would barely lose to Revan, meaning it would be like Yoda vs. Sids, that is saying that Sidious in ROTS is on par with Revan. I know that's probably not what you meant; just saying. Now, I don't think Revan could oown Yoda with despicable ease, but Yoda has characteristics other than his raw power that make him hard to beat in a fight. His small stature for example. However, if the battle escalated, or even began in a Force battle, I think Yoda would fall.

I'm not deducting that DE Sidious would get owned by Revan or someone. Just that when you compare him to the ANCIENT, ANCIENT Sith, like Naga, or Marka, it just doesn't seem that he's all powerful. My main point here is that one cannot judge power based on a single ability alone; is that unfair for me to say?

No, it makes perfect sense. People here tend to find a person, like Revan, NJo Luke, and now DE Sidious, and that person becomes their god despite all evidence contrary. Oddly enough, we don't have Exar Kun fanboys in here, which is odd because he could mess up most everyone.

Exar rules, but fanboys are annoying(or else i might be one)

Fanboys in general are annoying. I'm not a fanboy probably because I like most everyone for one reason or another.

Except for NJO Luke. He just sucks.

Lol.

That's what, your third sig in the past two days?

I'm gonna make another one... I'm just not content until I will have mastered the art of sig making.

Originally posted by Darth Windu
Okay. . . let's get things straight here;

- I DON'T think that DE Sidious would get owned by Revan. I DO however, want to see some proof that he is indeed this uberly powerful Force-user, other than the fact that he can conjure up a Force Storm. I'm not underestimating him, or denying him credit, but I don't want to make him the most powerful Sith based on one ability.

- In the DE series, the combined power of Luke and Leia wasn't all that powerful. It was definetely stronger than Yoda or the original Sids, but not all that mighty. A good Sith, like Revan, could pull that off.

- Since Revan seems to be the "Ancient" coming up here, and Genises said that Yoda would barely lose to Revan, meaning it would be like Yoda vs. Sids, that is saying that Sidious in ROTS is on par with Revan. I know that's probably not what you meant; just saying. Now, I don't think Revan could oown Yoda with despicable ease, but Yoda has characteristics other than his raw power that make him hard to beat in a fight. His small stature for example. However, if the battle escalated, or even began in a Force battle, I think Yoda would fall.

I'm not deducting that DE Sidious would get owned by Revan or someone. Just that when you compare him to the ANCIENT, ANCIENT Sith, like Naga, or Marka, it just doesn't seem that he's all powerful. My main point here is that one cannot judge power based on a single ability alone; is that unfair for me to say?

You are also forgetting that all of DE Sidious's other powers most likely increased in power. I do think you are being a little bit unfair to him I mean he can create a "FORCE" Storm! And by no means did I ever try and make it sound like ROTS Sidious is on par with Revan.

Originally posted by Darth Windu
Okay. . . let's get things straight here;

- I DON'T think that DE Sidious would get owned by Revan. I DO however, want to see some proof that he is indeed this uberly powerful Force-user, other than the fact that he can conjure up a Force Storm. I'm not underestimating him, or denying him credit, but I don't want to make him the most powerful Sith based on one ability.

- In the DE series, the combined power of Luke and Leia wasn't all that powerful. It was definetely stronger than Yoda or the original Sids, but not all that mighty. A good Sith, like Revan, could pull that off.

- Since Revan seems to be the "Ancient" coming up here, and Genises said that Yoda would barely lose to Revan, meaning it would be like Yoda vs. Sids, that is saying that Sidious in ROTS is on par with Revan. I know that's probably not what you meant; just saying. Now, I don't think Revan could oown Yoda with despicable ease, but Yoda has characteristics other than his raw power that make him hard to beat in a fight. His small stature for example. However, if the battle escalated, or even began in a Force battle, I think Yoda would fall.

I'm not deducting that DE Sidious would get owned by Revan or someone. Just that when you compare him to the ANCIENT, ANCIENT Sith, like Naga, or Marka, it just doesn't seem that he's all powerful. My main point here is that one cannot judge power based on a single ability alone; is that unfair for me to say? It's spelled MARKO actually, with an O at the end.

Um. No. Its Marka Ragnos.

And Genises, I'm not trying to be unfair, as I said four times in the post. But there is nothing saying that his overall power increased. So far, the only thing you have said in his defense is his Force Storm. His power may have increased slightly, but not to the levels you say. And you say that with no other support. I just don't think he's on par with Kun or Revan or someone.

Marka Ragnos, not Marko.

And really, the difference would not happen between ROTJ and DE; the difference would be between ROTS and ROTJ, since Palpatine gets his hands on all the Jedi and Sith lore in the Jedi Temple.

Originally posted by Captain REX
Marka Ragnos, not Marko.

And really, the difference would not happen between ROTJ and DE; the difference would be between ROTS and ROTJ, since Palpatine gets his hands on all the Jedi and Sith lore in the Jedi Temple.

Excellent point. But then, his old ass kinda got weak in some respects... Notice how he walks in the OT. Also, wasn't there something in an Eu novel about his body being ravaged by the dark side powers he has?

Apparently, his lightning was too powerful for his aged mortal body, I think. That was in a Guide I got some nine years ago.

Well, next time don't wear bracelets when you use Sith lightning... duh.

Man, I need glasses..........................................and some LSD.............................................and some dignity......................................................and a Royale With Cheese.