Natakus's (=D) Amalgam Tournament [Phase 3] {ROUND 2} (Vote now!) Scoob vs Digi

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Nataku8188
Battle is set ontop of Whirlysplat's ego (i.e. China)
Both fighters start with their fingers trapped in a a chinese finger trap.


Scoobless

Flash Thordon

Quasar: Mind/Quantum Bands
Flash: Power
Thor: Body/Hammer/Power

Flash (Wally West)
http://www.hyperborea.org/flash/wally.html

Quasar
http://www.quantumzone.org/behind_t...ntum-bands.html

Thor
http://www.avengersforever.org/char.../Characters.asp

vs

DigiMark007

General Kinky!
General Zod - powers/outer armor
Apollo - body/powers
Loki - mind/powers

ZOD
http://spider-bob.com/villains/dc/GeneralZod.htm

Loki
http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/l/loki.htm

Apollo...from The Authority
http://members.tripod.com/rikmertens/image/apollo.html

DigiMark007
Well for one, Scoob will drop Mjolnir because of the finger-trap, but mine will just burn up from my sun-power. Whirly's ego also favors me because he like The Authority (Apollo) and thinks that Quasar is stupid.

...i'll be right back with a write-up...

DigiMark007

long pig
Di Di Di
Digmon Digimon

Di Di Di
Digmon Digimon

Di Di Di
Digmon Digital Monsters
Digimon are the Champions....

whirlysplat
Gotta say and I meant to say this last time great names for both characterssmile

Scoobless

CorderaMitchell
I thought my post was long...

Scoobless
told you so... stick out tongue

Kuntz
I vote Digismile

Keep the faithbig grin

Stay Kuntz rock

DigiMark007
And so the fight begins in earnest (but please, voters, feel free to refer to my initial write-up for my over-arching strategies).



Not quite. The boost went back to normal. She didn't specify "any benefits" but merely that the boost ends after the fight....and I didn't argue against that. I'm in a unique position, though, that one of my characters could store the boost through to the next fight. So the boost remains in full. Even without it, I'd be as strong as you, since I'm a high-level Supes clone who's being boosted...and for the purposes of this match, so are you. Trying to quantify the boosts is rather hard, but mine makes me continually stronger - meaning every minute of the fight I get harder to beat.



Quasar isn't nearly as experienced as Thor at shrugging off magical telepathy. And, despite having Thor's powers, you're still using Quasar's mind. No, I wouldn't be "controlling" you, but there's no way you'll be able to avoid being hindered by the telepathy. Apollo has fought and damaged a Quicksilver-esque opponent before. All I need to do is slow you down and the rest will take care of itself.

And I am practiced using telepathic influence...your character, on the other hand, still is a new-comer to the Speed Force and Thor's abilities. Draining my speed and effortlessly using Thor's powers won't be happening.



But Loki's never had Class Million+ (possibly Billion) strength, has he??



Fair enough, but I can cut through your Quantum constructs like toilet paper, and Mjolnir can't get to all of it. And beyond that, I have the extra layer of armor...so if you manage to get past the magic, you're still not there. After your constructs, though, I'm hitting you.

Oh, and as for my "living sun" tactic (which is still in full use), If you come near me you'll be taking damage. While you're in the fight of your life, you won't have time to decide to start trying to absorb my sun energy. And even if you tried, it's coming from everywhere within me...simply trying to absorb it will result in a catastrophic failure.

And if you try to absorb energy from within me (since that's where it's coming from) Loki has more than ample control over his internal molecules (and energy, since matter is nothing but condensed energy). He won't be allowing such an intrusion. So draining me isn't an option.

Oh, and Quasar has fought Surfer before and wasn't able to merely absorb anything thrown at him. If I remember correctly, he got his ass handed to him. With my uber-charge, I'll be producing at least as much energy, and I'll be many times stronger than Surfer (or you).



Speed draining won't be happeneing (as I explained earlier) and my magical telepathic influence (which you said yourself can effect Quasar) will bring you down to my level. At that point, I'm holding all the cards.

-DM cool

DigiMark007
Originally posted by Kuntz
Gotta say and I meant to say this last time great names for both characterssmile

I'd agree (and thanks) but they're not at the level of, say, Pat Kuntz big grin

But yeah...the "sweet-name people" get to fight here (and a big stick out tongue to 'Big Sexy' while I'm thinking about it). A friend of mine, upon hearing the name Flash Thordon, said I was screwed because of the name alone. Peronally, I think the whole Kinky/Apollo's-sexual-preference thing gives my character a psychological edge, but to each his own.

-DM

stormfront13
my vote goes to digi

long pig
When's the last time Thor has absorbed ambient magical energy?

The power boost is questionable.....erm

I think we all basically agreed that magical and quantum bolts would just cancel each other out instead of hitting each other, otherwise it'd be impossible to tell.

I can't vote yet.

Scoob needs to post more. :P

Both of you need to stop delaying the inevitable. evil face

DigiMark007
I blame the time zone difference. We haven't been on yet at the same time to have a continuous debate.

Other stuff...

Either the quantum bolts and magic just negate each other, or they're both getting through to hit the other person. Either way, it's about equal, and no real advantage is conferred.

The boost...hehe...ok, I conceed the "bonus round" boost. But you have to admit it was a sneaky little tactic while it lasted. In any case, I'm still just as strong as him, probably stronger. It just makes that advantage less profound.

-DM

Scoobless
Originally posted by long pig
When's the last time Thor has absorbed ambient magical energy?

i was talking about Quasar absorbing ambient radient and electromagnetic energy

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Not quite. The boost went back to normal. She didn't specify "any benefits" but merely that the boost ends after the fight....
Originally posted by DigiMark007
The boost...hehe...ok, I conceed the "bonus round" boost.

that takes care of that... smile
Originally posted by DigiMark007
there's no way you'll be able to avoid being hindered by the telepathy.

maybe slightly hindered.... but my speed advantage is so vast to begin with that any hindrance to my overall performance speeds still leaves me with that advantage
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Apollo has fought and damaged a Quicksilver-esque opponent before.

i think we all realise that Quicksilver (or Quicksilver-esque) is still almost human compared to Wally West speeds... and Apollo couldn't even fully keep up with him..... the strength difference between us is debatable... my speed advantage is not
Originally posted by DigiMark007
And I am practiced using telepathic influence...your character, on the other hand, still is a new-comer to the Speed Force and Thor's abilities. Draining my speed and effortlessly using Thor's powers won't be happening.

Quasar has known and fought beside Thor for years... and my prep write up for my first match showed how he learned to use Thor's abilities

the speed force he is newer too.... the Speed force is much newer to him, and he wont have complete mastery.... but with the battles he's fought and the prep time usage for these matches, he's been completely focused on mastery of these new abilities... the going very fast came easily, the reaction times are a natural part of the power... the speed draining he is new at... and may only have the most basic concept of.... but as he already has the speed advantage even the slightest draining of your momentum will have a massive impact on the battle.... in fact it probably balances out any slowing of my character you may accomplish through mental attacks
Originally posted by DigiMark007
But Loki's never had Class Million+ (possibly Billion) strength, has he??

cowards are cowards... even if they get strong
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Fair enough, but I can cut through your Quantum constructs like toilet paper

ok, but i'm not using that many and they can be recreated at the speed of a Flash though
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Oh, and as for my "living sun" tactic (which is still in full use), If you come near me you'll be taking damage. While you're in the fight of your life, you won't have time to decide to start trying to absorb my sun energy. And even if you tried, it's coming from everywhere within me...simply trying to absorb it will result in a catastrophic failure.

i disagree... Quasar has complete control over the electromagnetic spectrum... any radiant energy you emit falls into that catagory.... and if he did have trouble absorbing (which he wont) he can continue the process with Mjolnir, block with Mjolnir or create quantum shielding... your heat blasts will be innefective here
Originally posted by DigiMark007
And if you try to absorb energy from within me (since that's where it's coming from) Loki has more than ample control over his internal molecules (and energy, since matter is nothing but condensed energy). He won't be allowing such an intrusion. So draining me isn't an option.

i wasn't going to attempt that... though it might still work.... but i can absorb your magical shield's energy as well as your armour's power
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Oh, and Quasar has fought Surfer before and wasn't able to merely absorb anything thrown at him.

but Mjolnir can
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Speed draining won't be happeneing

it will.... amybe not at expert levels... but it will effect you.... if only at a small percentage of Flash's draining speed

as i've said... the strength contest is close.... the speed is not, can dodge/block/absorb any energy you throw at me... if you phase your body you leave your armour behind... your shields cannot stand up to my blasts... your armour will be drained..... your "influence abilities may slow me to 80% of my max.... which is still far above your ability to combat.... Quasar has shield tactical training and martial arts training meaning he is Loki's superior in H2H combat.... any sword or axe i decide to create during the fight will slice through your shielding.... Mjolnir, thrown with boosted strength and vastly boosted speed will shred your armour (as it shredded the Destroyer armour in Thor)

your are left with only physical combat to battle me, your strength becomes meaningless next to my superior speed and H2H ability

Kinky cannot defeat Thordon

evil face

DigiMark007
...



As I see it, Quasar isn't nearly as good as Thor at combatting magical influence. Your 80% is probably about what I'd do to Thor, and Quasar is more susceptible to my influence. Add in Quasar's task of learning new abilities (and, more importantly, using them in combat), and you're ripe for influencing. Speculating on percentages is worthless, but if all I do is make you groggy and slow for a couple seconds (but it would be more than that), a few massive punches while you're dazed will either knock you out or increase the groggy feeling. I'll also have laser vision, magical bolts, etc. at my disposal, so I have no lack of attacking options.



....but it is, as I've explained above.



At this point, I'm beginning to realize that no one's there to explain the speed force to Quasar, and the only reference he has is probably a guy like Quicksilver. That said, how is Q going to know that he has the ability to "drain speed" at all, let alone actually do it? The reactions are built in, and he'll know he can go really fast, but draining seems like something extra that would take even a real Flash in the DC universe time to uncover. Long story short, maybe he'll be practiced with the speed force, but draining ain't happening (and the speed difference is dealt with above).



Never said Loki's a Superman-esque boyscout, but he's fought the likes of Surfer, Thor, Odin!, etc...he's no stranger to battle. So maybe he's not the bravest knife in the drawer, but by this point in the tourney he knows he's fighting for his life. He won't be turning into a fleeing coward.



Last I checked, Loki still stalemated Surfer and Quasar survived but lost to him. Maybe you're a bit better fighter, but Loki (as previously stated) isn't a stranger to combat...he's no pushover. The difference is negligible.



Uh-huh roll eyes (sarcastic) ...and all while you're fighting for your life and trying to get rid of that pesky mind-messing.

-DM

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
As I see it, Quasar isn't nearly as good as Thor at combatting magical influence. Your 80% is probably about what I'd do to Thor, and Quasar is more susceptible to my influence.

I was being generous with 80% considering that Thordon is totally focused on battle your influence may have no effect whatsoever
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Add in Quasar's task of learning new abilities (and, more importantly, using them in combat), and you're ripe for influencing. Speculating on percentages is worthless, but if all I do is make you groggy and slow for a couple seconds (but it would be more than that), a few massive punches while you're dazed will either knock you out or increase the groggy feeling. I'll also have laser vision, magical bolts, etc. at my disposal, so I have no lack of attacking options.

Quasar already fights at class 100 levels... the strength will be much less of a difference to him than yours would be to Loki

the new speed ability that accelerates his cognitive response times is automatic... whenever he moves fast he thinks fast... an automatic response doesn't need a lot of concentration

Laser vision? the Q-bands are pre-programmed to protect the wearer from energy attacks... laser vision is useless to you here, magical bolts? Thors durability can handle most of those IF they get past Mjolnir.... when Mjolnir is spinning nothing gets past it
Originally posted by DigiMark007
At this point, I'm beginning to realize that no one's there to explain the speed force to Quasar, and the only reference he has is probably a guy like Quicksilver. That said, how is Q going to know that he has the ability to "drain speed" at all, let alone actually do it?

his bands detected that the energy he is now empowered by has fields around all objects in motion.... Flash did not have this advantage.... he quickly discovers that he can manipulate these fields through mental effort
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Never said Loki's a Superman-esque boyscout, but he's fought the likes of Surfer, Thor, Odin!, etc...he's no stranger to battle. So maybe he's not the bravest knife in the drawer, but by this point in the tourney he knows he's fighting for his life. He won't be turning into a fleeing coward.

perhaps... but a natural non-combatant fighting for his life is not going to be focused enough to use his abilities to their best advantage... plus when it comes to H2H he will be at a tremendous disadvantage
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Last I checked, Loki still stalemated Surfer and Quasar survived but lost to him.

and yet a chained Sif caused him to beg for help.....

Scoobless
still begging.... smile

Scoobless
now Sif is no class 100, doesn't have magical abilities, was unarmed, was chained, and had been held prisoner for quite a while........ Loki is clearly in a life or death situation....

does he use mind tricks? no
does he use magical bolts? no
does he attempt to fight her off with his fists? no

as Loki is being choked to death his panic causes him to do the only thing he knows how.... he begs for help

This guy is no fighter.... he cracks under pressure and he panics when his life is in danger....... no way is this mind capable of casting complex spells or mind tricks when he's fighting for his life

Scoobless
ok.... one last thing before i log off for the night...(damn work)

as we both start at the same time no mental influence has been attempted from the get-go.... Thordon harnesses his two main weapons... he gives Mjolnir a quantum covering (during the prep time) so that when the fight starts he uses his FTL speed and quantum-boosted-Thor strength to throw the hammer at Kinky (this all happens virtually instantaneously using my vastly superior speed) if Loki manages a shield (or comes to the battle with one already in place) then the Quantum covering will rip through this, at top speed it tears through the armour...... and if you're lucky it only breaks all your ribs..... after this initial assault you are severely injured and your armour is mangled

you stored charge may allow you to begin healing... but you'll get no more charge from the destroyed armour, as the hammer returns and the power draining has begun (as per usual) i focus all the energy i drain, as well as all the regular energies Thor and Quasar command through Mjolnir and start a continual blast..... armour completely destroyed, body extremely damaged, in great pain, unable to focus mind.... one or two uber-strength Mjolnir cracks to the head will finish you off

total battle time... 0.0043 seconds

evil face

black robb
uh....Gambit wins

DigiMark007
...



We're both fighting well above our regular strength levels, but whereas I only have to learn to be stronger and fly faster, you're still trying to master Thor's abilities, Mjolnir, the speed force, etc. I'll be more than used to being an uber-badass...and while I'm not saying you wouldn't use your prep wisely, it still takes more than a few hours to master (or even begin to understand) speed draining and the full usage of Thor's abilities.



...and this refers to your movement, right? Sure, that's how the speed force works. But this is what will be hindered once my magic goes completely unhindered through your constructs, directly to your mind. You have no defense against it, and you even edmitted Quasar is affected by this sort of magical influence. Mjolnir and the speed force can't save you there.



This assumes I'll be in a position where I'm so close to death I'll panic. You'll never have as much of an advantage over me as that sif had strangling Loki (which, admittedly, was kinda stupid of Loki, but with her being chained/weaponless/etc. it was probably somewhat of a surprise). It'll be a good fight, but I'll never be so desperate that I'll turn tail.



Hoo boy. I don't think I'll be winning quite this fast, but thanks.

Anyway, the only time Zod ever lost to Superman was when he was out of his armor. It's far from indestructible, but it'll take more than a Mjolnir blow or two to get through it. And as previously stated, I'll slow you down, muddle your mind, hit you with radiation eminating from me (which you won't be able to absorb since you'd have to absorb it from my body...and Loki has control over his internal molecules, so that's out), and generally will just be beating the crap out of you all while getting stronger and more invulnerable thanks to my armor.

-DM

long pig
Although I did enjoy seeing Loki whining and begging for mercy, I'm leaning oh so slightly to Demi....erm

The reasons are Thor took a few hundred years(Asgardian time) to actually become skilled enough JUST to wield the Mjolnir, then spent a few more hundred years(Asgardian Time) figuring out how to work it.
In human time, you've only had the hammer for like 4 minutes.


Not voting yet.

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
We're both fighting well above our regular strength levels, but whereas I only have to learn to be stronger and fly faster, you're still trying to master Thor's abilities, Mjolnir, the speed force, etc. I'll be more than used to being an uber-badass...

you think making heat beams come out of your eyes.... or even flying.... comes naturally? Superman never learned to fly until he was almost 20 years old... the heat beams took years as well... Loki will also be completely taken aback by his newfound speed... he'll overshoot everything as, unlike a Flash character, his mind doesn't work at varying speeds depending on body motion... the armour? Kryptonian technology... how would an Asgardian... who uses virtually zero electronic devices..... figure out how to use an advanced suit of battle armour?

at least Quasar knows Mjolnir responds to mental commands as he's fought alongside Thor for years, he's seen what Mjolnir and Thor are capable of many times... he isn't forced to learn from scratch like Loki will be... he's just mimicking actions he already knows he can perform

and, again, as the speedforce reaction times are completely automatic there's not much to learn for Thordon in the "moving really fast" stakes
Originally posted by DigiMark007
and while I'm not saying you wouldn't use your prep wisely, it still takes more than a few hours to master (or even begin to understand) speed draining and the full usage of Thor's abilities.

Thor's abilities are already known to Quasar (unlike Apollo's and Zod's to Loki)

speed draining is not the power i'm relying upon here... i realise it'll probably be the hardest aspect to fully understand, so i focused my attacks so far on the other, easier to grasp, factors
Originally posted by DigiMark007
and this refers to your movement, right? Sure, that's how the speed force works. But this is what will be hindered once my magic goes completely unhindered through your constructs, directly to your mind.

any magical energies can be (at least partially) absorbed through Mjolnir, as for going through my constructs..... well.... you'll have to locate, aim and fire at me first..... which to a noob with speedpowers would be difficult... but against someone who can fly as fast as Quasar and dodge as fast as Flash it will be virtually, if not completely, impossible
Originally posted by DigiMark007
It'll be a good fight, but I'll never be so desperate that I'll turn tail.

i wasn't suggesting that you'd run away.... just panic and make really bad decisions..... probably even forget about your new abilities.... as well as some of the old ones (referring back to the pic)
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Anyway, the only time Zod ever lost to Superman was when he was out of his armor. It's far from indestructible, but it'll take more than a Mjolnir blow or two to get through it

funny... because the Asgardian Destroyer armour IS said to be indestructible.... and Mjolnir (thrown with enough force) tore through that in one shot..... ripped the head clean off of it... and that's when it was powered by Desak
Originally posted by DigiMark007
And as previously stated, I'll slow you down, muddle your mind, hit you with radiation eminating from me (which you won't be able to absorb since you'd have to absorb it from my body...and Loki has control over his internal molecules, so that's out), and generally will just be beating the crap out of you all while getting stronger and more invulnerable thanks to my armor.

i don't think you understand Quasar's abilities... if it's radiation... he can absorb it.... as soon as it comes out of you it's going to start powering me... i cannot be harmed by any of your projected energy attacks

Quasar has preprogrammed them (the Quantum bands) to be sensitive to incoming energy fluctuations of sufficient power to do him harm and automatically absorb that energy. Quasar also programmed his quantum-bands to automatically whip up a forcefield when it senses an incoming energy source that may be harmful to his form..... and Quasar's body is not as durable as Thor's...... so nothing is getting through that has a remote chance of hurting Quasar.... let alone Thordon

the only non-physical attack you have that could possibly work is magical bolts... which can easily be blocked/absorbed through Mjolnir... or just dodged

you basically are left with no other option but to fight H2H..... which is not Loki's speciality.... he'll be so focused on defending himself that any time he spends diverting his attention into attempting magical mind tricks will leave him wide open for hundreds/thousands of Flash speed Mjolnir strikes

your armour cannot withstand this much abuse, nor can your body

this isn't a guess, you HAVE to resort to a fist fight here!.... it's the only possible chance you have to physically injure me..... Quasar has extensive H2H training through SHIELD and has a martial arts background.... while Loki ... doesn't... and i can still blast all day long with my unlimited energy reserves and enchanted hammer


you can throw mind tricks all you want at the start of the fight (if i don't get the first strike in.... which is very likely due to my speed)..... but as soon as it's about to get physical, your concentration has to be on the fight..... which leaves my mind perfectly clear (if you were given any time to "influence" it in the first place)

Scoobless
Originally posted by long pig
Although I did enjoy seeing Loki whining and begging for mercy, I'm leaning oh so slightly to Demi....erm

The reasons are Thor took a few hundred years(Asgardian time) to actually become skilled enough JUST to wield the Mjolnir, then spent a few more hundred years(Asgardian Time) figuring out how to work it.
In human time, you've only had the hammer for like 4 minutes.

it's more like 4 hours... at Flash speeds learning to use something he's seen used hundreds of times

it's not like he got shoved into an advanced suit of armour that he has no idea how to control (and doesn't understand the language any controls may be written in) and pushed into a battle.... without knowing how to fly.... roll eyes (sarcastic)

DigiMark007
...



But, um, Loki has flown already. It's just learning to fly faster. And as for the armor, there's nothing to figure out. Our amalgams come "pre-assembled" and it emits sun radiation. Loki's a smart guy and will know he's strong and eventually realize he's getting progressively stronger. There's no commands or technology to figure out. Hop in...become a badass. Either way, learning to punch harder and fly faster is a helluva lot easier than what your tasked with, regardless of your Flash-speed.

And the heat beams and laser vision...don't really need them. If I don't manage to learn to use them, it's not a big deal.



Ok...so speed draining is out, as I originally stated. So that just leaves the speed and reaction times, which, of course, will be getting meddled with from the moment the fight starts. At this point we'd be fairly used to having to fight these uber-badass amalgams, so anything less than having any and all preparations taken care of (shielding, telepathy, etc.) from the moment the fight starts would be a grievous error...one Loki won't make. Refer to my first post on page 1 if you need to, but Scoob himself has stated that this sort of influence can directly affect Quasar. He's defenseless against it, and even if Mjolnir can 'detect' the telepathy (doubtful since Quasar is controlling it) he has no way of stopping it.



Lucky for me, then, that I have a simple strategy. Slow you down with telepathy then beat the crap out of you. For someone with Loki's experience, even given his lack of bravery, it would be hard to screw that up.



Then we're in agreement here. At these levels, regardless of fighting skill, it's a brawl. Once I slow you down we'll be pretty much on a level playing field. We'll both be getting our hits in, and while your constructs will soon be gone (and you'll have to focus on just fighting so you won't be able to make more) Apollo is just as durable as Thor (especially with my charge) and I'm still wearing my armor. At this point, I'll be much stronger and probably more durable, and even if you have a 2-1 hit ratio (but you won't) it won't matter. The hits will add up and you'll be the first to fall.

And despite his use of magic over strength most times, Loki's been in enough fights that some SHIELD training won't totally confound him.



Geez! I know Demigawd is respected around here, lp, but getting votes when he's not even in the fight...I can't compete with that kind of credibility. I conceed (to demi, not scoob). stick out tongue

-DM cool

kgkg
Loki can't beat Quasar.

newjak86
Originally posted by kgkg
Loki can't beat Quasar. That changes my mind right there laughing

DigiMark007
Originally posted by kgkg
Loki can't beat Quasar.

Um, ok?

Is this a vote?

And in any case, magic and Q-energy work on different fields of energy. If it was just Loki vs. Quasar, my magical attacks would go straight to Q's body. And whereas Loki is a Class 30, and can control the molecules within himself, it'll be a lot harder to kill him than the rather mundane body of Quasar.

But this isn't Loki vs. Quasar. It's Quasar in Thor's body vs. Loki in Apollo's body (with random other enhancements for each). The dynamic of the entire fight is changed by this, and makes it nothing like Loki vs. Quasar.

-DM

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
There's no commands or technology to figure out. Hop in...become a badass.

and when the first system is damaged you wont have a clue how to repair/bypass it and the armour will soon fail with continued assault
Originally posted by DigiMark007
that just leaves the speed and reaction times, which, of course, will be getting meddled with from the moment the fight starts.

but AT the moment the fight starts i am vastly superior in terms of speed and thought.... i can attack you before you finish completing the thought process that activates your magical mind abilities..... quantum-hammer assault straight through your shields... jarring you and causing you to lose focus, followed in by Thordon (covering the distance in as close to no time as is possible) immediately retrieving his hammer and pounding the crap out of your armor.... your physical durability may be boosted but your armour is still at its base Kryptonian level.... Mjolnir will crack it open with a few solid hits (at top speed 100 solid hits should take only a fraction of a second)

straight away i've nullified your psychic assaults and brought the match to close quarter combat ..... you may think that hand to hand training wont be useful and it'll turn into a brawl, but anyone who's studied martial arts for a while will tell you how instinctive the movements will become..... a brawler will lose to a trained fighter.... especially a government trained fighter
Originally posted by DigiMark007
but Scoob himself has stated that this sort of influence can directly affect Quasar.

Scoob also realises that at Flash speeds Thordon can attack many, many times in the space it takes a non-speedster to complete a thought or activate any powers.... and Scoob knows his stuff..... stick out tongue
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Lucky for me, then, that I have a simple strategy. Slow you down with telepathy then beat the crap out of you.

which will be ineffective as i've assaulted you heavily before you can complete any telepathic messages

and even if it could get to FT in time.... a slowed down Flash Thordon is still hundreds of times faster than a non-speedster's mind (such as Loki)
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Then we're in agreement here. At these levels, regardless of fighting skill, it's a brawl.

i don't agree with that at all ... i said H2H combat.... not a brawl... big difference if one combatant has extensive training
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Once I slow you down we'll be pretty much on a level playing field.

sort of.... if you consider Nick Fury V's J Jonah Jameson a level match.... combat training makes a huge difference when you get down to fist fighting
Originally posted by DigiMark007
And despite his use of magic over strength most times, Loki's been in enough fights that some SHIELD training won't totally confound him.

it may not confound him, but it will allow Flash Thordon to soundly kick his ass

you mention taking out my quantum constructs (such as armour) throughout the battle... and this is a possibility...... i've already mentioned how Quasar has programmed specific commands into his quantum bands (instant absorption of hostile energy fields... instant shield creation when Quasar is threatened) .... during prep, with his newfound speed, he adds a new programme.... instant armour replacement when a piece or the whole is damaged/destroyed...... so if you do manage to knock a few pieces off of it, it'll fix itself

Khellendros
I'm going with Digi here. His character simply has less to learn. Meanwhile, look at how long it took Flash to learn things like speed draining and some of his other speed force tricks. And then you look at what Long Pig said about the hammer... Yeah, FT's most reliable and well known weapon is his quantum bands, which Loki can just scythe through.

Scoobless
Originally posted by Khellendros
I'm going with Digi here. His character simply has less to learn. Meanwhile, look at how long it took Flash to learn things like speed draining and some of his other speed force tricks. And then you look at what Long Pig said about the hammer... Yeah, FT's most reliable and well known weapon is his quantum bands, which Loki can just scythe through.

we've already dismissed speed draining... and most other speedforce tricks..... in fact the only aspect of flash i'm really using is the basic "go-fastness"

the hammer... Quasar has seen it used for years, knows pretty much exactly what it can do and knows it responds to mental commands... i don't get the problem everyone finds with that

Scoobless
new tactic...... Thordon does the throw of the quantum boosted hammer, follows it in, slams Kinky to the ground before he realises what's going on and slams the hammer down on top of him.... and leaves it there...... Kinky is effectively immobilised (much like Hyperion was in Avengers during the Imus Champion story) with Kinky pinned and unable to right himself Thordon can fly around him at speeds that make it impossible for Loki's mind to aim at, all the while blasting away and firing Quantum constructs..... they may not have quite the same impact as Mjolnir but they are still very powerful hits.... as i can keep this up indefinitely at super fast speeds i don't see how Kinky has a moments time to concentrate to even attempt an "influence" attack... full power blasts that have hurt and damaged cosmic beings should only take moments to wreck Kryptonian armour.... and after that's gone i can retrieve the hammer and use it to cave Kinky's skull in

DigiMark007
...



IF the armor is damaged, Apollo retains his charge. I won't be losing it instantaneously...I just won't be getting any stronger. And by this point, I'm stronger than you and probably more invulnerable, so the armor malfunctioning won't hinder me much.



Last tourney (if you'll recal...many voters weren't around though) Scoob started every fight with Gravitron coming into the fight with his gravity shields up and around the whole team...as he entered the fight this was happening, leaving no time for the proverbial "speed blitz". Just ditto that with Loki's telepathy, and I think you'll see how I'm planning to shoot down Thordon's speed blitz. If this were a "Ready? Go!" scenario it would be different, but with my prep, this tactic is completely legitimate.



Point taken, but there's a bigger gap between those two than our amalgams. Loki's lived for thousands of years, and despite not being the greatest H2H combatant, the difference between him and Quasar isn't enough that you'll overcome my strength/invulnerability advantage.



Yes, we have already dismissed it, though Khell's points about learning powers are still valid. Yes you'll be moving fast, but that's what the telepathy is for. And you'll have a good idea of how Thor operates, but will hardly be a master at what he can do. All points against you. Small points, perhaps, but points nonetheless.

-DM

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Last tourney (if you'll recal...many voters weren't around though) Scoob started every fight with Gravitron coming into the fight with his gravity shields up and around the whole team...as he entered the fight this was happening, leaving no time for the proverbial "speed blitz". Just ditto that with Loki's telepathy, and I think you'll see how I'm planning to shoot down Thordon's speed blitz. If this were a "Ready? Go!" scenario it would be different, but with my prep, this tactic is completely legitimate.

actually that's because defensive preperations are permitted during prep eg. shields, armour, creating dragons (but not using them yet)... offensive moves are banned until the match starts... as in a "Ready? Go!"... and those are the same rules this tourny goes by.... so you are allowed to have your shields up (as i assume you would) but you cannot attempt any attack of any kind against your opponent before the "bell"... so no... your "entering while already using mind powers" tactic is not legitimate and my speed blitz at the "bell" is perfectly legal

Scoobless
after i've shredded your magical shields and damaged your armour i can send huge amounts of electricity through your body via magical lightning, regular lightning and Quasar's control over the entire electromagnetic spectrum.... Apollo has already proven to have a vulnerablility to this.... even if it doesn't completely take you out it will severely deplete your power reserves.... any amount of lightspeed hammer smacks after this should knock you out / kill you

Scoobless
3 - 0 against me just now....... sad

where's the love people?

look who you could be voting for

Flash Thordon..... Saviour of the Universe!

don't let Kinky's evil ways win the day against your hero!

pr1983
From what i've read i'm gonna have to go with Scoob...

Not that it'll help him much... stick out tongue

demigawd
Scoobs's amalgam definitely has the greatest potential power, but Digi's amalgam probably has the greater realized power, which will make the difference in this fight.

So I'm voting for Demi. stick out tongue

Scoobless
Originally posted by demigawd
Scoobs's amalgam definitely has the greatest potential power, but Digi's amalgam probably has the greater realized power, which will make the difference in this fight.

So I'm voting for Demi. stick out tongue

um.... confused

DigiMark007
Originally posted by demigawd
Scoobs's amalgam definitely has the greatest potential power, but Digi's amalgam probably has the greater realized power, which will make the difference in this fight.

So I'm voting for Demi. stick out tongue

Thanks demi, but this is really a vote for me, right?? I'm sure Scoob will protest unless it gets clarified.

I'd also like to point out that Scoob is beginning to resort to his character's name to try and win over voters. His NAME! If that doesn't reek of desperation, I don't know what does.

4-1 (or 3-1 if demi's vote is in question) in favor of me right now. Keep them coming voters!

-DM

demigawd
Yes, I'm voting for Digi, lol.

long pig
I vote for Scoob.

DigiMark007
The Kinkster compels you.....Bwahaha!

DigiMark007
And again, with energy blasts from the eyes!

CorderaMitchell
I'm going for scoob by what I read.

If I can vote, anyway...

DigiMark007
You were here in May, CM, so you're cool. Your vote counts. Right now it's 4-3, I'm in the lead.

Since this page is devoid of any strategy so far, let me get the ball rolling again...I'll refrain from quoting Scoob and arguing back right now and will just summarize my points thus far.

I think Demi said it well when he wrote (and this is a paraphrase) "Thordon may have more potential power, but Kinky has more realized power." I would even refute the first half of that statement, but I heartily agree with the second part. My over-arching strategy is actually ridiculously simple. Slow him down with magical telepathy, then beat the holy hell out of him.

I'll start by reiterating that it took Thor centuries to master his powers (thanks to longpig for that tidbit), and with only a few hours prep, even someone who has seen Thor in action won't have mastery over his powers. And he won't have time to learn anything except "go fast" with the speed force (which would be an advantage, but I'll deal with that next paragraph).

Quasar has no control over magical influence. It will go directly to his mind...he has no defense against it. The best Mjolnir could hope to do is detect it, not stop it. And running around won't avoid telepathy. It will affect Thordon and slow him the heck down.

His Q-constructs will blast my magical shields, but my magic will rip into his constructs as well. In my sun-energy-emitting armor, Apollo has been charging for a long time now, and once the quantum-boost to Thor's strength is gone because of my magic, I'll be much stronger than Thor. I'll also be harder to take out because I'll have an extra layer of armor on, and my body is just as durable as Thor's to begin with (if not more) and the armor will only enhance that.

He'll be groggy from the telepathy, and my strength and durability will far exceed any slight advantage Quasar has in H2H combat. At this point it'll turn into a beatdown.

Scoobless has tried to 'avoid' the telepathy numerous ways. He can't.
He's tried to say he could drain me of my charge. He can't (First he'd have to get through all of my shielding and armor, and even then Loki can control his own internal molecules to an extent that it would make it too hard for Quasar to try and drain Apollo's body of its charge).
He's tried to play up his fighting skill. It's a valid point, but one that does little to make up for Thordon's other shortcomings.

That's the plan in a nutshell. There's little Thordon can do to reverse that many advantages.

-DM

CorderaMitchell
It was almost a tie, but then he brought some promising points.

Whirlysplatt
Originally posted by Nataku8188
Battle is set ontop of Whirlysplat's ego (i.e. China)
Both fighters start with their fingers trapped in a a chinese finger trap.
http://members.tripod.com/rikmertens/image/apollo.html

homer Its funny cause its true yes

newjak86
I gonna go with Scoob.
reason I belivve it comes down to his speed. You have said so yourself Digi that you could only hamper him and in the end it will become a fist fight where Scoob's guy has a chance of landing 2 punches for your 1.
Also I believe that his Hammer idea works where he places the hammer on you and leaves it there. I belive he is fast enough and strong enough to knock you over from the begining and place the hammer on you. No matter how strong you get you'll never be able to lift that hammer so Scoob's guy can pick you off as he wants.

But as always it's not over I will change my vote if you convince me toherwise.

long pig
Eh....but again....his hammer takes too long to figure out...

Blah...I don't know...

I retake my vote!!

I will vote again later tonight.

newjak86
Originally posted by long pig
Eh....but again....his hammer takes too long to figure out...

Blah...I don't know...

I retake my vote!!

I will vote again later tonight. Yeah but it doesn't take much knowledge to simply place it on him. The hammers own power then will come into effect.

Khellendros
Originally posted by newjak86
Yeah but it doesn't take much knowledge to simply place it on him. The hammers own power then will come into effect.
Arguing with someone else's points comes off like you're debating with them. We're all allowed to have our own opinions.

newjak86
Originally posted by Khellendros
Arguing with someone else's points comes off like you're debating with them. We're all allowed to have our own opinions. I know I'm sorry.

DigiMark007
It's tied? Or does it mean I'm winning 4-3 because LP "re-took" his??

Anyway, the 2:1 hit ratio was a best case scenario for Thordon, and even then his quantum-strength-boost would be gone, and my strength and durability would be far beyond his. And all this is still assuming he'd retain a speed advantage after my telepathic influence, which is unlikely at best, and wrong at worst. A telepathically messed-up Quasar, who is already wielding Mjolnir with very little skill, won't be hurting me as much as my hits will hurt him. At that point, a hit or two should just knock Thor out...and even if it carries on, he has no real advantage to help him win out.

-DM

Nataku8188
Closing tonight.

long pig
Eh, sorry, I gotta stick with voting for scoob.

Tome zone differences suck.

Sentry
This is tough...Voting for.....Digi

Creshosk
Originally posted by long pig
Eh, sorry, I gotta stick with voting for scoob.

Tome zone differences suck. Yeah they do. . If I can vote and if it counts I vote for scoob. . .

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
I'll start by reiterating that it took Thor centuries to master his powers

Eric Masterson, Beta Ray Bill, Magni, the daughter in the "what if...? Secret wars 25 years on", Thor Girl, Wonderman.......

all these people (and others) have found themselves with Mjolnir (or something incredibly similar) and have learned to use it's abilities in far less time than Thor.... Magni hadn't even seen it used before and was teleporting within 5 minutes, throwing/recalling it, Beta Ray uses Stormbreaker all the time (which is basically a copy of Mjolnir) Masterson, with no training, fooled the Avengers into believing he WAS Thor

i can understand that it took Thor a while to learn it as he had no frame of reference for it's abilities.... but everyone since him who even had the slightest idea how to use it was up and flying straight away

there are too many examples of it being used successfully by novices for you to continue with your "he wont know how to use it" argument.... at least with any credibility

Scoobless
Originally posted by Nataku8188
Closing tonight.

what time zone are you in? what was the local time you were in when you made this post... it was 6:14am to me (GMT)

Scoobless
Ok..... summary

Kinky may have a the strength advantage (it's hard to say how strong a Quantum boosted Thor would be.... or a sun drenched Apollo)

Thordon definitely has the speed advantage.... which always means he gets to act first..... maybe two or three move (or more) before his opponent can finish his first thought

The hammer is not that difficult to learn once you know what it does (and Quasar has extensive experience fighting alongside Thor) i gave examples above... Beta Ray Bill, Magni, Eric Masterson, etc....

My two main assault strategies only require basic hammer usage.... throwing and placing.... (both of which can be put into effect before Kinky can move)

Magical telepathy may still slow Thordon down.... but by the time the first "influence" is attempted, Kinky will have his armour crippled, probable internal injuries and he'll be immobilised under Mjolnir

After immobilisation (which could be counted as a win in itself) Thordon has all the time in the world to take Kinky apart.. and even if he's slowed down mentally, his mental faculties, enhanced through the speed force, will still be firing at superhuman (or super-godly) speeds

Kinky, with Loki's mind, will not be capable of connecting with a ranged attack blast at an uber-fast opponent and the only ones that could possibly effect Thordon are magical.... so he'll either be splitting his power/concentration between that and his "influence" .... or he'll have to stop one altogether to perform the other.... either way, Kinky is possessed of only a finite amount of magical power.... keeping up either attack over an extended period will cause him to deplete his reserves.... if the battle lasts to that point he will be completely helpless

DigiMark007
...



Kinky DOES have the strength advantage, and once my magic cuts through your quantum boost, there won't be any more doubt.



Telepathy coming into the battle will ensure that the speed advantage will never be a factor. Quasar has no defense against it, and it will go directly to his mind. He'll be slowed down and probably considerably messed up, making my advantage more than just speed but overall concentration as well.



I'll have the strength and durability advantage and will have you slowed down and groggy. And Loki definitely doesn't have a finite amount of magical energy. There isn'y some magical reserve he's pulling from...it's internally based, and as long as he's alive he can continue to use whatever he has at his disposal.

Slow him down...whale the heck out of him. Simple as that. there's nothing he can do to combat either of those, and the one advantage he has (speed) will be taken away before he can use it.

-DM

P.S. I count 5-5. Helluva match Scoob, regardless of how it turns out.

Whirlysplatt
I still vote Digimark smile

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Kinky DOES have the strength advantage, and once my magic cuts through your quantum boost, there won't be any more doubt.

the quantum boost isn't a construct.... not everything Quasar produces is something that can be externally effected... his own strength boosting is internal.... you can't just cut it off by hitting him with magic
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Telepathy coming into the battle will ensure that the speed advantage will never be a factor.

Kinky's thought processes are considerably slower than Thordon's i've already explained that by the time you activate your mental abilities i'll have made two or three moves... minimum
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Loki definitely doesn't have a finite amount of magical energy.

yes he does.... his power is from himself, as you have stated, it will eventually run out... Loki could not keep up a magical force blast forever
Originally posted by DigiMark007
Slow him down...whale the heck out of him. Simple as that. there's nothing he can do to combat either of those

apart from acting first, ripping your shields and armour, pinning you under the hammer, continually assaulting you so as to not let you concentrate on telepathy.......

but the point is, even if you could effect Thordon's speed..... it is so far ahead of Kinky's speed that he would still have that advantage at a reduced rate

but as i'll be attacking first you don't need to worry about that.... evil face

5 - 5 ... wow .... i hadn't counted, but damn......

nice fight

DigiMark007
It'll take more than a few hits, even from a boosted Thor, to take out Uber-Apollo in Zod's armor. And as soon as I slow you down I'm in complete control (which, if it isn't instantaneous, will still be quick enough to prevent you from ruining me quickly...and I don't see why I can't enter the fight with a burst of telepathic force. In the time it'll take you see where I am this will happen).

And once this happens, even if Loki's energy is finite (which I would still refute...he could keep up the telepathy all day if needed) I'll make short work of you with my superior strength and durability.

-DM

P.S. Whirly had me confused for a second (and excited). But he voted on Pg. 1 already so it's still 5-5.

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
It'll take more than a few hits, even from a boosted Thor, to take out Uber-Apollo in Zod's armor. And as soon as I slow you down I'm in complete control which, if it isn't instantaneous, will still be quick enough to prevent you from ruining me quickly

quickly? the size of the battlefield is ...well ... China ... China is around 4,700 kilometres from east to west

Thordon can move at lightspeed with Flash's abilities... faster when using the Quantum bands for flight

light travels 300,000 kmh.. so Thordon could easily cover the distance to the farthest place you could possibly be in 0.0156 seconds smartass

now that's only through entire body movement... the relative speed of the hammer would be about double that .... so within less than one hundredth of a second Thordon can tear down your shields and have already begun a brutal physical assault

your telepathy cannot be instantaneous as you are not permitted to enter the match having already began an offensive move.... only defensive preparations are permitted (such as shields... Evangel went over all this in one of the earlier rounds) at best you have to wait until the start whistle before you can begin any telepathic thought processes... by the time you've decided which image to send Mjolnir will have cracked open your armour

after that i only have to place Mjolnir on your chest and you are effectively immobilised... after that slowing me down slightly wont make the slightest bit of difference
Originally posted by DigiMark007
even if Loki's energy is finite (which I would still refute...he could keep up the telepathy all day if needed)

of course it's finite... even Odin doesn't have infinite power reserves (hence the Odin sleep)... Loki isn't a patch on Odin... he'll wear down quickly (magically speaking) if he attempts continual magical output
Originally posted by DigiMark007
P.S. Whirly had me confused for a second (and excited).

embarrasment

suit you sir...oooh...oooooh... likes it does he sir?... oooh ...... enjoys the Kinky stuff does he?.... ooooh .......

stick out tongue

(anyone here ever seen the Fast Show?)

big grin

long pig
lol....
let's all hate me now.

I vote now for Digi.....yes yes...stfu. I know.

Scoobless
Originally posted by long pig
lol....
let's all hate me now.

I vote now for Digi.....yes yes...stfu. I know.

wtf... what changed?

confused

DarkCrawler
I vote Scoobless.

Blair Wind
ok I would vote....but dont the voters have to have registered in may? I dont remeber when I registered...but I will vote for Scoobs if I can.....

GalacticStorm
At first i thought Digi because on the surface it seems like his amalgam would win however ive changed my mind. Its gotta be Scoob

Scoobless
you were march.... it says it there under your avatar

tx for the vote

Nataku8188
Originally posted by Scoobless
what time zone are you in? what was the local time you were in when you made this post... it was 6:14am to me (GMT)

I'm East Coast, U.S. Cause I rule.

Scoobless
well.... i've been getting up at rediculously early times all week because of my stupid job...... so i gotta call it a night......

i'll check in on the final scores tomorrow to see how it went....(damn time zones.... i always miss the end of these matches)

kgkg
i vote Scoobless

DigiMark007
Damn. 4 in a row. 6-4 to 8-6 just like that (scoob has the 2-vote advantage by the way).

If we're on something the size of China and the fight starts, it'll take longer than a fraction of a second for Thordon to find me and hit me. China's a big place, and he won't be able to see me right away. In that time my telepathy will be up and running, and the rest of my plan is laid out in my previous posts. I'm still stronger, more durable, and I'll get just as many hits in once he's slowed down from the magical telepathy. It won't matter how long Loki can hold his telepathy because it will be a short fight by this point.

-DM

P.S. Thanks longpig...you going back and forth was pretty funny, and I was up 6-4 when you switched, but things have soured since then.

DigiMark007
Damn...that's right. I'm a MOD now.

Vote for me, you worthless fools, or you'll be banned until you pay me in hard cash or sexual favors!

Er...wait...I can't do that...grrr...(*jumps to his secret Moderator lair to form a new plan*)

-DM

Scoobless
Originally posted by DigiMark007
China's a big place, and he won't be able to see me right away.

China is quite big.... but your various energy signatures will make you stand out like Giant Man at a midget convention

stick out tongue

Whirlysplatt
Originally posted by Scoobless

suit you sir...oooh...oooooh... likes it does he sir?... oooh ...... enjoys the Kinky stuff does he?.... ooooh .......

stick out tongue

(anyone here ever seen the Fast Show?)

big grin

I used to like the farmer "Old Dan" was it?

DigiMark007
So, um, this thread hasn't been closed by Nat yet, and I still think I have the better amalgam/argument. Feel free to vote if you haven't already (for whoever, if you feel like padding Scoob's lead that's fine too). Otherwise, I'm done posting strategies (too busy getting used to Mod-dom). And good match Scoob.

-DM

Scoobless
lol..... i also feel that i have the better amalgam/argument..... the fact that i get to act first regardless of whom i face is the reason i made sure i chose Wally West in the first round of the draft....... almost everyone else is a power/magic character .... and that's fine.... but with The fastest Flash character it doesn't matter who you face... you get the first 2-10 moves (depending on the speed of the other character)

Nataku8188
8-4 scoob. Close it mod man. :: Mumbles about when he's going to get his mod powers ::

DigiMark007
Closing...

But 8-4??? It's 8-6 damnit. I lose either way, but 8-6 sounds much more dignified....

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