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clarify this for me please.

I'm sure you all know that your religion and god is based on Judiism and their sacred text, The Torah. You decided to form your own religion ....keeping the basis of Judiism and the Torah.....but ammending it by adding the "sacred" teachings of a minister, Jesus...............Christ.

Please, intelligently, explain to me why it is not blasphemy to your god to call your religion "Christianity"............named litteraly after the minister who taught your god's word. I believe the first two commandments go something like this (it's been a while)....

Thou Shalt have no other god's before me
Thou Shalt commit unto thee any graven images

the name of your religion is not named after your god, merely a flesh and blood human being who you worship as a part of god.........is not putting his name first in your religion in direct contradiction to the first commandment? Also.......Moses destroyed the Golden Calf.....because it was not an image of god. Why then is it acceptable for your religious symbol to be a cross.....or a man on a cross? It is not an image of god, it is worshipped but is only one of your god's creations. Surely god would take as much offense to you worshipping his creation (jesus) as he would to worshipping another of his creations (the calf). Of all the things you attribute to your god creating.......wouldn't symbols representing the universe and all contained therein in all it's ever expanding glory be more flattering to your all mighty than a symbol representing but one man......who you use to represent all men. Sure, man is quite impressive but pales in comparison to the entire universe and all that it contains (including man).

What do you believe in ?

that has nothing to do with this topic. Either PM me any questions you have directly or post a general question on the board which I will be more than happy to reply to. This is not the place.

yea i pretty much asked the same thing to my religion teacher in 9th grade. i didn't get a good answer back

krs-one (mc) said the same thing about the cross.

we (my family) as christians never really followed much of the OT. i was raised by just the NT and Jesus' teachings. thats all i can say for my part.

I don't know how deep you are into your religion.......so don't take offense to this..............but the new testament is directly based on the teachings of the old testament. Jesus lived to spread the word of god. The words of god most important are the ten commandments.........which is where the apparent contradiction lies.

I'm not expecting you to explain this to me or anything......just pointing this out for others who may view this thread who have the same beliefs.

yea i understand that, and the contradiction is clearly there. i understand that the bible itself isn't complete and has tons of stuff missing in it. so i dont really take everything too seriously. i dont go to church every sunday (cuz i honestly dont see a point in that). not saying we dont go to church, but we dont go every sunday.

I'm just wondering how many Christians see this apparent contradiction..........because according to their religion, by taking part they are breaking the first two commandments.......sentencing themselves to eternal damnation in hell.

conservative christians will be really upset cuz of this thread.

that may very well be..........but I still think it's a question they should be able to answer and share with everybody. Hopefully one of them can intelligently explain this apparent contradiction to me.........it is a pretty big one.

this is what i always thought...but i never asked this to my 9th grade teacher because she scared the shit out of all of us.

since God spoke to these prophets and told them what to write about...what if these prophets went against God and wrote whatever the hell they wanted.

ok, ok..........it's a bit off topic but I get what you're saying. I always liked how Christians claim the greatest tool of Satan is deception..........but propose to one of them that they have been decieved and the beliefs they base their religion upon were handed down from Satan, decieving man into believing he was god. After all, it was god who created the universe, our planets, our earth, our nature.........yet animals kill animals in nature all the time. Doesn't the commandment "thou shalt not kill" directly contradict the actions of all of his creations around us?.......the creations that were not given free will and kill because god created them to kill. Talk about some red faced Christians when you get done............

seriously though.........back on topic........

Catholics say that animals do not have souls. Then what about the Blessings of Animals each fall (i think the saint was St. Francis of Assisi). i never really understood that.

Originally posted by hh?
Catholics say that animals do not have souls. Then what about the Blessings of Animals each fall (i think the saint was St. Francis of Assisi). i never really understood that.

Yes, why would you bless something without a soul. Humans like to think we are better than everything else. I believe that we are all the same, so, if I have a soul, so does my cat.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Yes, why would you bless something without a soul. Humans like to think we are better than everything else. I believe that we are all the same, so, if I have a soul, so does my cat.

thats how i see it also.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Yes, why would you bless something without a soul. Humans like to think we are better than everything else. I believe that we are all the same, so, if I have a soul, so does my cat.

One question. If a person and a cat was drowning, witch would you save if you could only save one ?

Originally posted by Superman 24
One question. If a person and a cat was drowning, witch would you save if you could only save one ?

The person...

But, my cat would save the other cat.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
The person...

But, my cat would save the other cat.

Originally posted by Superman 24
One question. If a person and a cat was drowning, witch would you save if you could only save one ?

That could easily be taken to another level...

If a person you knew and a person you didn't were drowning....
If a child and an adult were drowning....
If a person you didn't know, and a person you hated so much you wish they were dead were drowning....
If your child and some other unknown child were drowning....

Ultimately in such a situation one rarely thinks about aspect of souls, they would save who they instinctively wanted to save. There are people in the world who would save the cat. There are people in the world who would let both drown. Both the cat and the human can have a soul, even though we might do more for the human.

If a person you hated so much you wish they were dead and a cat were drowning.......

It's all subjective to the individual. It's not down to souls.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
That could easily be taken to another level...

If a person you knew and a person you didn't were drowning....
If a child and an adult were drowning....
If a person you didn't know, and a person you hated so much you wish they were dead were drowning....
If your child and some other unknown child were drowning....

Ultimately in such a situation one rarely thinks about aspect of souls, they would save who they instinctively wanted to save. There are people in the world who would save the cat. There are people in the world who would let both drown. Both the cat and the human can have a soul, even though we might do more for the human.

If a person you hated so much you wish they were dead and a cat were drowning.......

It's all subjective to the individual. It's not down to souls.


So what you're saying is, that if there was a person you hates, and you're fav cat, you would save the cat ?

depends on how much you hate. if its the person that killed one of my family members or friends, i wouldn't give a damn. It's not being a good christian, its understanding whats right and whats wrong...or something like that

and if the person is 900 pounds...i dont think i would able to save him...but i might try.

Originally posted by Superman 24
So what you're saying is, that if there was a person you hates, and you're fav cat, you would save the cat ?

Ok Osama Bin laden and a little cat are drowning, which do you save?

What does this have to do with this thread?

No, I'm not saying that. However there are people in the world who would, people in the world would be tempted even. I don't think I would, though it would depend on why I hated them, and hated them enough that I wished they weren't there, who knows... perhaps it's Hitler, perhaps it some serial killer. The thing I was getting to is when a person is in that situation, souls are the last thing on a persons mind, it's more of an instinctual thing, you you go for first. If there is only time to save one, then your not going to ponder. The last one is deceptive, but the others show it well. Especially when it deals with two people, after all, you not suggesting the person you save is better then the other, or has a soul and they don't, it's just the way people do things.

And I will say it again, there are people who would save the cat.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Yes, why would you bless something without a soul. Humans like to think we are better than everything else. I believe that we are all the same, so, if I have a soul, so does my cat.
I come to the same conclusion but don't believe in souls.....rather odd now isn't it....

Originally posted by Evil Dead
clarify this for me please.

I'm sure you all know that your religion and god is based on Judiism and their sacred text, The Torah. You decided to form your own religion ....keeping the basis of Judiism and the Torah.....but ammending it by adding the "sacred" teachings of a minister, Jesus...............Christ.

Please, intelligently, explain to me why it is not blasphemy to your god to call your religion "Christianity"............named litteraly after the minister who taught your god's word. I believe the first two commandments go something like this (it's been a while)....

Thou Shalt have no other god's before me
Thou Shalt commit unto thee any graven images

the name of your religion is not named after your god, merely a flesh and blood human being who you worship as a part of god.........is not putting his name first in your religion in direct contradiction to the first commandment? Also.......Moses destroyed the Golden Calf.....because it was not an image of god. Why then is it acceptable for your religious symbol to be a cross.....or a man on a cross? It is not an image of god, it is worshipped but is only one of your god's creations. Surely god would take as much offense to you worshipping his creation (jesus) as he would to worshipping another of his creations (the calf). Of all the things you attribute to your god creating.......wouldn't symbols representing the universe and all contained therein in all it's ever expanding glory be more flattering to your all mighty than a symbol representing but one man......who you use to represent all men. Sure, man is quite impressive but pales in comparison to the entire universe and all that it contains (including man).

First and foremost, it is called 'Christianity' simply because the followers believe in Jesus Christ being the Son of God. I would like to emphasize my contention that I don't believe that Jesus Christ is God... as how He introduce Himself while He was still here on earth.

So why Jesus Christ?

At first, since the beginning of time, God, when created humankind, used to CHOOSE His own people who are worthy to serve Him. That was a part of His plan in creating the world. That's why He chose Abel over Cain. After Abel, there was Seth. God call the descendants of Cain as "the sons of man" (meaning, the worldly ones)... and Seth's descendants were called "the sons of God" (meaning, the heirs of God's promise).

He also chose Noah's family over the sinners. Punished those sinners and blessed Noah to have his own descendants considered as "sons of God".

He also chose Abraham... then Isaac... then Jacob... until Abraham's descendants became a one nation.

And this nation became the Israel. The land with a promise. This is God's first nation.

They have the covenant. They have the promise.

But the history of Israel was a repetition of falling away from God. They chose to be sinners other than to become faithful to God's commandments. Until God cursed them and forsaken them.

But, since the beginning of time, God has already a plan. And this regarding His Son - the Messiah - the Christ. And this will come from the house of David - a seed to Abraham.

And this was fulfilled to Jesus Christ.

Jesus, having the NAME which is above every name, was given by God the authority over the earth, in heavens, and in everything.

And this is the start of Christianity - God's second nation. Not the Israel, however... but the one which Christ has built... and that is the Church.

The Church of Christ - which He purchased with His own blood.
Christ didn't die literally for the whole world. But only for His Church.

But the Church as prophesied, will fall away again from God.

And you already have witnessed it.

Everyone today becomes a witness to that fall.

I think the most simple answer is that there is no difference between god and Jesus. Jesus IS god. Jesus is god made flesh. So, the question of blasphemy is moot.

Thou shalt have no other Gods before me. Yes, and there was none. Christ was not saying He was.

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven images... Yes, we shouldn't. and Christ didn't commanded us to make one for Him.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
clarify this for me please.

I'm sure you all know that your religion and god is based on Judaism and their sacred text, The Torah. You decided to form your own religion ....keeping the basis of Judaism and the Torah.....but ammending it by adding the "sacred" teachings of a minister, Jesus...............Christ.
Please, intelligently, explain to me why it is not blasphemy to your god to call your religion "Christianity"............named litteraly after the minister who taught your god's word. I believe the first two commandments go something like this (it's been a while)....
Thou Shalt have no other god's before me
Thou Shalt commit unto thee any graven images

You poor soul, you do not know what you are talking about. There are many "denominations" that started even shortly after the death of Jesus ( Christ, Jesus Christ, the Christ, the Messiah- they all are one and the same), because even then men thought they knew better than God, or the disciples and apostles that lived with Jesus. Men rebelled even then again the strict sacrifice they have to make to follow Jesus.
Judaism is exactly that. Christianity is the following of Jesus, the son of God whom was sent by God to bring hope and salvation to the world. The Bible who is the inspired word of God teaches that in John 1 :1 the Word became flesh and came to live with us, meaning that Jesus literally became the fulfilment of God's word by being born of a human and then lived among us. That is why Jesus many times were called the son of man. Jesus is also God as he is part of the Trinity, God the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. So by following Jesus whom God sent (literally God himself in the flesh) we are not sinning but obeying God as He said in the Bible that there are no other saviour on earth or above earth but Jesus, whom He sent. Yes God also said that we are not allowed to worship any idols or images not even of God or Jesus and many Christians are sinning therefor. But for any one to really understand you have to believe in God's word and from your question it is clear that you do not.

Osama.........he wouldnt get off that easily

Originally posted by finti
Osama.........he wouldnt get off that easily

Yes he should live......with the knowledge that just because of him a poor little cat died....now thats revenge...mwuhahahahahahah

um........yes I do know what I'm talking about.....so you can dismiss all that "poor soul" shit. Christianity is a bastardized form of Judiism. Open your Christian bible. You see that section labeled The Old Testament? Those first 5 books........those are called the Torah. Christianity came about by taking the Jewish god, the god Jesus spoke of.......the god of Abraham......then ammending the religion by adding a son of god.

I'm still waiting for an intelligent answer. Jury's post was intelligent, but did not answer my question. Capt Fantastic's post attempts to answer the question but is not intelligent. Jesus Christ was not god and never claimed to be. Not one place in the bible does he refer to himself as such. Sonnet's post only furthers my point. Jesus was not god......sent by god.....saviour to on earth.......okay.....but not god. Christians still insist on putting Christ before god and even putting his name in the name of their religion, yet leaving god out of the name completely. This is still breaking the first commandment no matter how one tries to justify it for fear if they don't they will be sinning. Putting Christs name......the only name in their religion CHRISTianity.....yet ommitting god altogether is clearly putting him before god. The first commandment does not say Thou shalt have no other gods before me, except for those sent by god, saviors on earth or sons of god. Same for the second commandment. There is no exception at the end allowing for images of those sent by god, saviors on earth or sons of god.

The truth hurts, doesn't it?

Originally posted by Evil Dead
Not one place in the bible does he refer to himself as such. Sonnet's post only furthers my point. Jesus was not god......sent by god.....saviour to on earth.......okay.....but not god. Christians still insist on putting Christ before god and even putting his name in the name of their religion, yet leaving god out of the name completely. This is still breaking the first commandment no matter how one tries to justify it for fear if they don't they will be sinning. Putting Christs name......the only name in their religion.

I agree with you...though many use the verse "I and the Father are One."

"I and the father are one" means what though? Twelve men playing basketball in Chicago are one.........the are the Chicago Bulls. What book/verse by the way..........I want to check the context real quick.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I agree with you...though many use the verse "I and the Father are One."

Yes, but if you look at this statement thought the eyes of a Buddhist, it means something quite different, we are connected to the Buddha that was enlightened in the remote past.

and the Father are one"
And Other Verses Commonly Misunderstood to Mean
That Jesus is God

"I and the Father are one"

John 10:30 is often quoted to show that Jesus is equal to God. But when you read the verse in its context you will find that the passage taken as a whole proves the opposite.

People are often content to quote the verse in isolation to show that Jesus said "I and the Father are one" and then the Jews picked up stones to stone him because they understood him to mean that he is claiming to be God. It is only when you read the passage to see what comes before and after this verse that you will realise that the Jews misunderstood what Jesus was saying. In fact, Jesus tried to explain what he meant, and the explanation he gave is still in the Bible for everyone to see. It is surprising that so many people who say they love Jesus ignore his explanation and repeat the mistake which was made by the enemies of Jesus. Here is the passage as it appears in the New International Version of the Bible:

People take it out of content....and when Jesus is saying I am the son of god or I am the son of man....It was the way they used language then...I could say, I am the daughter of man, or the daugher of god....that I am part of the human race, or that I belong to god.

thanks........

but damn you for stopping your copy/paste right before it actually lists the verse. Now I'll have to grab my bible and look it up myself .

Jesus saying that "I and the Father are one"...probably means...One in the since of thinking...Not that He is god exactly.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Jesus saying that "I and the Father are one"...probably means...One in the since of thinking...Not that He is god exactly.

There is a concept in Buddhism that goes like this, all Buddhas think the same thing. So, if Jesus said that his mind was the same as god's mind (thinking), where would he have gotten that idea?

We are made in gods image...I guess you're saying enlightenment?...We are all capable of it...and that's what Jesus was talking about.?

Originally posted by debbiejo
Jesus saying that "I and the Father are one"...probably means...One in the since of thinking...Not that He is god exactly.

Yup, and back then those were very controversial comments. That's why a bunch of Jewish Rabbies had the man crucified. It was an insult to their beliefs! How times never change.

"I and my Father are one". In what sense?

Read the preceding verses. You'll see what He meant by that.
They are one in taking care of the flock. Not by being GOD.

After Jesus said that, those who were listening at that time didn't understand what Jesus simply meant by that. They thought that Jesus was claiming to be God by saying "I and my Father are one". They thought that Jesus is saying that "I and my Father are one God".

But, did Jesus rebuke them? Yes, actually He did. He told them that He came not to claim what people think He was... but to proclaim that He is the Son of God.

Meaning - He is distinguished from God. Not what most Christians nowadays think that He is one of God's three persons. Well, that's true - at least according to the Apostolic Fathers... but not according to the Bible.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
um........yes I do know what I'm talking about.....so you can dismiss all that "poor soul" shit.
I'm still waiting for an intelligent answer. Jury's post was intelligent, but did not answer my question. Capt Fantastic's post attempts to answer the question but is not intelligent. Jesus Christ was not god and never claimed to be. Not one place in the bible does he refer to himself as such.
No, you do not know......John 10:30 Jesus said : I and the Father are one. On many other occasions he said : If you know Me, then you know the Father; If you do not honour the Son you do not honour the Father/God; He also refered to himself as "I am", the same name God used when He spoke to Moses. Read the Book of John!

Okay, with respect to Evil Dead, I'll try to answer the question and this would be still based from what I have posted earlier.

Here's your question:
Branding the Christian religion as "Christianity" doesn't necessarily mean that we, or I (as a Christian) worship the minister (that is Christ Jesus) as God.

Christianity is used not because it is what Jesus suggested... it was used for the sake of Philosophy. Christianity is not really the name of the Christian religion. Christianity is the belief, as well as the practice of Christian religion. People like Philosophers, Lexicons, Grammarians, Scholars, etc... call it Christianity as a general term to describe the people who believe in Jesus Christ, follow Jesus Christ, and obey Jesus Christ.

Yes. Christians believe so. Christ believed that so. The apostles held on to that commandment.... as well as the followers of Christ in the first century.

Jesus Christ is not claiming to be God... or to be the God who created all things. According to Him, there's only one true God... and that is the Father. His Father. Our Father. Not the Son. Not the Holy Spirit.

So why we don't call our religion after the name of God?

Earlier I posted that the Israel was God's first nation. But since God has chosen them and become one nation, given them a land called Israel, and the law and the covenant - they were worthy of God's promise.

But this nation didn't continue to be faithful in the sight of God. He forsaken them and they lost their right to worship the true God.

Then the time that God's plan (the Word) from the very beginning (which was with God) - a plan powerful as God (Word was God) that no one can stand against - was fulfilled (was made flesh) in the person of Christ.

God gave Him all authorities in heaven and on earth.

God gave Him the name above every name.

God commanded His people to worship this Man.
Yes. We, Christians worship Christ Jesus NOT because He is God... it's because it is what God has commanded us to do. As written by apostle Paul to the Philippians.

Thus whatever belongs to God, also belongs to Christ.
Whatever belongs to Christ also belongs to God.

Since the first nation of God ceased to exist and the covenant didn't continue - there must be a solution. The people of God in the last days (days before Judgment Day) must be saved - this is also a part of God's plan in the beginning.

How can these people be saved when all men have sinned?
Answer: God's will must be done.

What will? Revealed in the letter of Paul to the Ephesians.

Christ created a "one new man" from two - the Head and the Body - from two which become one in the sight of God.

Christ built His own Church - the Body. And Christ became the Head of it.

The Head and the Body.
The Christ and the Church.
The "one new man".

Part of God's will is that: In order to save this people from punishment on Judgment Day - the Body must be purchased with own blood of the Head.

So, Christ died for His own Church - not for all humankind.

This Church was God's new nation. And since God gave its Head a Name above every name - this Church must be called after this Name. This Church must be called after Christ.

That's why Christ call His body as "My Church". And the apostles call it the "Church of Christ".

This Church also belongs to God. That's why apostle Paul also call it as the "Church of God".

Thus, the Christian religion must be named after God's Name (not God's personall Name). This Name which God has given to His chosen ones - a Name which is above every name - this Name is none other than - the "Christ".

so do the jews

Yes they do. And so do Muslims.

Well.....it's been a year.......still nobody can answer.

While Jury's post three posts up is great........it's not entirely true. Christianity is not simply an idea that has been labeled as Christianity. There are numerous chruches across this great country with actual names like, "the church of christ"........printed in big bold letters.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
I don't know how deep you are into your religion.......so don't take offense to this..............but the new testament is directly based on the teachings of the old testament. Jesus lived to spread the word of god. The words of god most important are the ten commandments.........which is where the apparent contradiction lies.

I'm not expecting you to explain this to me or anything......just pointing this out for others who may view this thread who have the same beliefs.

Jesus came to serve, he came to heal, he came to forgive, but above all he came to save. There is no way to the Father expect through the Son. Before Jesus there was no hope for man. When he died on the cross he gave us a trade: our sin for his salvation.

while this may or may not be true.......just as Jesus may or may not have even existed......just like Mary may have been a virgin or may have been a $2 whore.........doesn't explain the hypocrisy discussed in this thread.

The only laws given to man, supposed by the Christian and Jewish faith alike, were the ten commandments. The first two commandments are being broken daily by any person walking this earth calling themselves Christians..........

Originally posted by Evil Dead
while this may or may not be true.......just as Jesus may or may not have even existed......just like Mary may have been a virgin or may have been a $2 whore.........doesn't explain the hypocrisy discussed in this thread.

The only laws given to man, supposed by the Christian and Jewish faith alike, were the ten commandments. The first two commandments are being broken daily by any person walking this earth calling themselves Christians..........

And that is why Jesus died for us. So that the sins we comment can be cleansed.

somebody must not be too good at reading as you again fail to answer the question posed...........

Originally posted by Evil Dead
while this may or may not be true.......just as Jesus may or may not have even existed......just like Mary may have been a virgin or may have been a $2 whore.........doesn't explain the hypocrisy discussed in this thread.

The only laws given to man, supposed by the Christian and Jewish faith alike, were the ten commandments. The first two commandments are being broken daily by any person walking this earth calling themselves Christians..........

The laws given to Christians are the Ten Commandments and the Word of God which is the Bible

again......you fail to answer the question.

You're a good debater...........Wish I was....

ME TOO! I must study closely and learn!

I'm just a good communicator in life...............and it shows on these threads....................I seem to derail them

There needs to be a smiliey on a train that is falling off the tracks.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
clarify this for me please.

Please, intelligently, explain to me why it is not blasphemy to your god to call your religion "Christianity"............named litteraly after the minister who taught your god's word.

the name of your religion is not named after your god, merely a flesh and blood human being who you worship as a part of god.........

is not putting his name first in your religion in direct contradiction to the first commandment? Also.......Moses destroyed the Golden Calf.....because it was not an image of god. Why then is it acceptable for your religious symbol to be a cross.....or a man on a cross? It is not an image of god, it is worshipped but is only one of your god's creations.

Q1. Why Christianity?
A1. Jesus last name wasn't actually Christ, you do know that right? Jews aren't called Godists, and Greek Religion wasn't exactly named after Zeus. The name Christ means the anointed one, it was just a title, and christianity is named after him because he is the son of the god we do worship, and we believe in what the anointed one(Jesus) said, unlike Jews. Anyways, we don't actually KNOW gods name
ANSWERED!

Q2. Why Cross?
A2. We don't worship the cross, and we don't worship Jesus. We worship GOD. The Cross is a symbol that Jesus dyed for us, and for us to remember that god cares so much he would send his only son to dye on the cross, a most horrible death.
ANSWERED!

Many chirstians do worship Jesus as god and the cross as the symbol of jesus.

ANSWERED!

Originally posted by Alliance
Many chirstians do worship Jesus as god and the cross as the symbol of jesus.

ANSWERED!

Yeah, but not all!

ANSWERED!

Anyways, if Jesus is god, which infact he probably is, he obviously would allow it cause it's him being Jesus duh, lol

DUH!

No. And you cant make two posts without contradicting yourself.

not answered. I know why the religion is called Christianity.....although I'm surprised you do after admitting last year that you have never read the bible in your life. The question is how Christians do not recognize it as a sin. The religion is named after the diefied "son" of god....not god himself. This clearly breaks the first commandment, "thou shalt have no other gods before me". Being the church of christ as opposed to the church of god is the greatest sin, breaking the very first law given to man by god.



again, not answered. You don't need to worship the cross for it to be a sin. Pagan's didn't worship idles......they made idles to represent the gods they worshiped......just as Christians use the cross to represent Jesus in all it's blasphemy. This is ofcourse breaking the second commandment. If you ever read the bible chibi boy you'll see this.


why are you back? didn't I run your 13 year old ass out of this forum last year via point by point dissection of your posts and lack of any knowledge pertaining to religion, christianity specificly, physics, just about anything in general contained therein?

I'm a Christian and I don't have a clue... hell I never thought of it before, but then I haven't touched my Bible... in like forever.

http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/6797/sign7bz.png

Evil Dead, I have asked the similar questions and when it comes down to it, Christians believe the Jesus & God are one in the same, so worshipping Jesus is the exact same as worshipping God. I believe the book of John and even some other passages on the NT state this(I'll get back to you on the exacts). I often debate with a die hard Republican Christian that has an encyclopedic knowledge of the Bible, if you like I can pose your question verbatim to him or?

Originally posted by Evil Dead
clarify this for me please.

I'm sure you all know that your religion and god is based on Judiism and their sacred text, The Torah. You decided to form your own religion ....keeping the basis of Judiism and the Torah.....but ammending it by adding the "sacred" teachings of a minister, Jesus...............Christ.

Please, intelligently, explain to me why it is not blasphemy to your god to call your religion "Christianity"............named litteraly after the minister who taught your god's word. I believe the first two commandments go something like this (it's been a while)....

Thou Shalt have no other god's before me
Thou Shalt commit unto thee any graven images

the name of your religion is not named after your god, merely a flesh and blood human being who you worship as a part of god.........is not putting his name first in your religion in direct contradiction to the first commandment? Also.......Moses destroyed the Golden Calf.....because it was not an image of god. Why then is it acceptable for your religious symbol to be a cross.....or a man on a cross? It is not an image of god, it is worshipped but is only one of your god's creations. Surely god would take as much offense to you worshipping his creation (jesus) as he would to worshipping another of his creations (the calf). Of all the things you attribute to your god creating.......wouldn't symbols representing the universe and all contained therein in all it's ever expanding glory be more flattering to your all mighty than a symbol representing but one man......who you use to represent all men. Sure, man is quite impressive but pales in comparison to the entire universe and all that it contains (including man).

Jesus=God.

no sir. Jesus = flesh and blood man, born of this earth some 2000 years ago........supposed sun of god, result of some heeby-jeeby union between god and a mortal woman......a half-breed........hercules.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
no sir. Jesus = flesh and blood man, born of this earth some 2000 years ago........supposed sun of god, result of some heeby-jeeby union between god and a mortal woman......a half-breed........hercules.

no2 Jesus=100% God, but also 100% man. It makes no sense. But that's how it goes.

can't be. According to the bible, god existed before man........therefore a man cannot be god.........if the Christians have it printed in their book it must be true!

Well, most Christians believe in the Trinity...The Father, the Son, and The Holy Spirit. As in, all parts of the Trinity are God, just in different forms. It's like water. You can have ice, vapor, or just plain water. It's still the same substance, with the same chemical makeup; H2O, just with different apperances and properties. With the Holy Trinity; God is like liquid water, providing life, a basis for survival, and a universal purpose. Jesus is like ice, a solid thing that can easily be seen, felt. and understood. He was a human, but he is still a part of God. Finally, the holy spirit is like water vapor; unseen, but still there, all around you.

That's what most Christians believe...so to them, believing in Jesus is believing in God. It's just a central part of their religion.

I will neither conform nor deny that I share the belief.

well that still doesn't make sense.......

as you put it.....water changes form. When water turns to ice, it ceases being liquid.

so when Jesus walked the earth there was no god in heaven? why were his miracles so mundane then? He can create life from dirt.......why walk on water?

Originally posted by Evil Dead
can't be. According to the bible, god existed before man........therefore a man cannot be god.........if the Christians have it printed in their book it must be true!

Thats the point, I am not agreeing with it, but that is what is written. Jesus is God made flesh. If you're a Christian and you believe God created the universe in 6 days, then as a Christian you would have no reason to believe God could make 'himself' into a human man.

Think about it, if you are a person that believes the Bible to be 100% die hard facts, then an act like this would be easy for God. That's what makes all acts of the Bible, no matter how outrageous plausible.

but it never states anywhere in the bible that Jesus was god........he never proclaimed to be god.......

so wherever these folks are getting their blasphemos ideas, they'd better stop if they wish to enter heaven.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
well that still doesn't make sense.......

as you put it.....water changes form. When water turns to ice, it ceases being liquid.

so when Jesus walked the earth there was no god in heaven? why were his miracles so mundane then? He can create life from dirt.......why walk on water?

Ever hear the analogy St. Patrick made? with the clover?
The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are the three leaves of the clover, but they are still part of the one clover. They all exist independently, but are collectivly cosidered "God".

they cannot exist independently and be the same being if one existed before the others............

by that logic, Jesus would have had to be created.......but according to Christians god was not created, he always was........if Jesus is part of god, jesus too would have always been......not born of man only 2000 years ago.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
but it never states anywhere in the bible that Jesus was god........he never proclaimed to be god.......

so wherever these folks are getting their blasphemos ideas, they'd better stop if they wish to enter heaven.

I'm fairly certain it does in the NT, like I said, I'll get back to you with the exact passages.

This is one of the reasons for the religious heads of the day for condemning Jesus to be crucified. If as a Jew, you are following the Old Testament at it fundamental points, a common man saying "I am God, I am the way." would be blasphemy. Remember, were talking way back in the day when stoning your wife was considered OK if she offended you.

You might get the same reaction today if you were to walk into a evangelical church in the most backs woods part of Alabama and proclaim to be Jesus come back to earth with the goal of sodomizing all you see.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
they cannot exist independently and be the same being if one existed before the others............

by that logic, Jesus would have had to be created.......but according to Christians god was not created, he always was........if Jesus is part of god, jesus too would have always been......not born of man only 2000 years ago.

None existed before any. All of them always existed. Jesus always existed, same with the Holy Spirit. He only took a particular form.

sorry Rob.....nowhere does Jesus say the words, "I am god". Many christians have tried to put the words into his mouth by taking other words.......reciting them out of context then telling us it means "I am god".......but those three little words are nowhere to be found in the Holy Bible.



impossible. The bible states god existed before man......therefore Jesus (the human form of god as you put it) could not have existed at the same time as the other. This means that Jesus had to be created after man........which means god had to be created (atleast part, Jesus).

is it me or are we going in circles? There's my major problem with Christianity..........they never try to give answers. It's alway A=B because B=A. Why? Well....because B=A and A=B.......that's why!

Jesus, as told of in the NT, was born 2000 years ago. This leaves only two conclusions. Jesus was god, which means god was born 2000 years ago........after humans so the entire old testament is a work of fiction or that Jesus was indeed not god and therefore the very name and symbol of Christianity are blaspehmous.

Originally posted by Evil Dead

impossible. The bible states god existed before man

yes, i know that. But you just seemed to miss the part where i said "Jesus=100% God."

Originally posted by Evil Dead
sorry Rob.....nowhere does Jesus say the words, "I am god". Many christians have tried to put the words into his mouth by taking other words.......reciting them out of context then telling us it means "I am god".......but those three little words are nowhere to be found in the Holy Bible.

No worries and I didn't mean those saying verbatim. I will get back to you were in the NT it says Jesus & God are the same so you can research.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
not answered. I know why the religion is called Christianity.....although I'm surprised you do after admitting last year that you have never read the bible in your life. The question is how Christians do not recognize it as a sin. The religion is named after the diefied "son" of god....not god himself. This clearly breaks the first commandment, "thou shalt have no other gods before me". Being the church of christ as opposed to the church of god is the greatest sin, breaking the very first law given to man by god.



again, not answered. You don't need to worship the cross for it to be a sin. Pagan's didn't worship idles......they made idles to represent the gods they worshiped......just as Christians use the cross to represent Jesus in all it's blasphemy. This is ofcourse breaking the second commandment. If you ever read the bible chibi boy you'll see this.


why are you back? didn't I run your 13 year old ass out of this forum last year via point by point dissection of your posts and lack of any knowledge pertaining to religion, christianity specificly, physics, just about anything in general contained therein?

1. Lol, i never said i had never read it, i just accepted that i didn't read it well, also including my bad memory = well....
And what's so wrong with worshipping god himself? Jesus christ is part of god but as his son, and it doesn't disobey the commandment firstly because he's god anyway, and secondly because we don't actually know what gods name is. We are technically naming it after god, as we don't know gods original name we must stay with the title he had on earth, the title WE gave him. Just cause it's named after him/his son, doesn't mean we aren't worshipping him.

2. Jesus is part of god, and the only part of god of whom we actually know was ever human, and since we don't know what the other parts of god look like... The cross is for us to remember the pain he went through for us, and how he did it so willingly, with gods son (or god). Just cause our symbol includes gods son/god, doesn't mean we aren't worshipping him.

And you didn't "run my 13 year old ass" lol You do realise that we aren't in the realm of science anymore, so technically...

Originally posted by Alliance
DUH!

No. And you cant make two posts without contradicting yourself.
I know i'm contradicting myself, it's true, i'm just denying the silly part of what i said before

Originally posted by Evil Dead
no sir. Jesus = flesh and blood man, born of this earth some 2000 years ago........supposed sun of god, result of some heeby-jeeby union between god and a mortal woman......a half-breed........hercules.

Urm, god = spirit, spirit = inside of Jesus

Originally posted by Evil Dead
impossible. The bible states god existed before man......therefore Jesus (the human form of god as you put it) could not have existed at the same time as the other. This means that Jesus had to be created after man........which means god had to be created (atleast part, Jesus).

Jesus, as told of in the NT, was born 2000 years ago. This leaves only two conclusions. Jesus was god, which means god was born 2000 years ago........after humans so the entire old testament is a work of fiction or that Jesus was indeed not god and therefore the very name and symbol of Christianity are blaspehmous.
God could have existed at the same time as the other, cause god is a supreme being! He can do what he likes! You seem to believe a useless peice of nothing(the universe) can do amazing things liek make itself but u can't believe a supreme being(god) can do much atall!

You seem to be missing large parts of... well... everything

Originally posted by ESB -1138
Jesus came to serve, he came to heal, he came to forgive, but above all he came to save. There is no way to the Father expect through the Son. Before Jesus there was no hope for man. When he died on the cross he gave us a trade: our sin for his salvation.

So then before Jesus came, there was no point to worshipping God then...what was the point? That renders the Old Testament Invalid, and that renders HALF the Bible Invalid.

Is that what you are saying?

Damn, you Christian Debators contradict each other all the time !