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Darth Revan, Count Dooku, and ROTS Anakin are marching through the Jedi Temple. They have slaughtered nearly all but three Jedi. NJO Luke, Mace Windu, and Obi-Wan. They clash in the Jedi Archives room.

Jedi but just barely, Luke would win and assist the others before they finish.

More like the other way around. Obi and Mace will finish before Revan and Luke, so it's three on one, Jedi win.

two ways at this. NJO Luke stalls Revan. Obi gets killed my Dooku. Mace beats Anakin. Mace beats Dooku (Janus might debate saying that Dooku could beat Windu). Then Mace assists Luke to destroy Revan. OR Mace beats Dooku. Obi beats Anakin. And the two helps Luke annihilate Revan

I don't know. Unless Obi-Wan can get Anakin to pull an idiotic stunt like the one on Mustafar, they'll be pretty caught up. And it is likely that Mace will fall to Dooku, although it coud go the other way. So basically, it comes down to three big stalemates. You've basically combined the two biggest stalemates we know of, plus a less difficult one, into one battle. Now, I think that Luke will take out Revan before the others finish their respective matches.

Exactly my thoughts.

they're in the jedi temple, so i doubt Obi can get Anakin to make a stupid stunt. Otherwise, Revan fights forever with Luke, and Obi duels for the rest of his life with Anakin

Oh great, let's slap three giant stalemate chess matches into one thread and see who wins. This fight could take hours, depending on the location.

Hell, make an episode out of this fight alone. Revan, Dooku, Anakin vs. NJO Luke, Mace, Obi-Wan in the Jedi Temple, yay!

are you making fun of my thread?

No, but I am saying make the threads a bit more managable, so as not to have a huge melting pot of speculation. There was a reason why there is 3v3 limit in the first place.

And each of these sub-duels, Luke vs. Revan, Mace vs. Dooku, and Obi-Wan vs. Anakin, are all duels on there own. It's nigh impossible to judge who the victor as a team would be.

To many unknowns..

Obi and Anakin would duel for an eternity.

Mace and Dooku I can't tell you who will win.

Luke and Revan will fight for ever as well, the winner will depend on idiocy and a mistake... So Anakin is the weak link, Jedi win.

I think it will come down to Luke beating Revan and assissting the others as I have already said.

Revan could take Luke. It would be a really tough fight, but he could win. Dooku is slightly better than Mace, so he wins, and Anakin would beat Obi-wan with Dooku and Revan's help.

Revan and luke will go on forever and ever and ever with revan having a slight edge.

Dooku has beat mace in the past so i'm betting on him

Anakin was all over obi most of the fight, you might say obi didn't want to kill him but when it came down to it he wasn't left with much of a choice. Even if anakin is dumb and gets chooped up dooku pwns obi.

how can u say that revan has a slight edge in all the other threads revan get smashed by ragnos and every1 also says that luke could stand up to ragnos mayb even beat him now i don't like luke that much now but still just using this logic u can't tell the luke would own revan

Originally posted by Luke Is Better
how can u say that revan has a slight edge in all the other threads revan get smashed by ragnos and every1 also says that luke could stand up to ragnos mayb even beat him now i don't like luke that much now but still just using this logic u can't tell the luke would own revan

Where does it say Luke beats Ragnos? Ragnos is cited as "the Dark Lord of the Sith -- the most powerful of the most powerful."

I agree though, how do they "go on forever and ever and ever" yet Revan has a slight edge? If he had a slight edge, it likely wouldn't go on forever. That line right there is showing your true colors -- you WANT Revan to win, but you don't want to say outright that Revan will, so you use "going on forever and ever" as some kind of mask.

This thread is plain unmanageable. You have three duels in one that are almost too close to call.

Saying that because Dooku beat Mace once, he could beat Mace now is invalid. Dooku beat Anakin, but Anakin beats Dooku later, so it can't be considered fullproof. I believe RotS Mace could take Dooku. Anakin and Obi-Wan would continue, but with Mace's help, Anakin goes down. Now Revan and Luke would be difficult, but I consider NJO Luke the strongest, only being able to be bested by possibly Ragnos.

Mace beats Dooku.

Obi-Wan and Mace beat Anakin.

Luke, with or without the help of Obi and Mace, beats Revan.

Originally posted by Illustrious
Ragnos is cited as "the Dark Lord of the Sith -- the most powerful of the most powerful."



Is that actually documented somewhere or did you pull that out of your ***(no offense intended)

Originally posted by Great Vengeance
Is that actually documented somewhere or did you pull that out of your ***(no offense intended)

What the hell do you think "cited" means?

It's in The Tales of the Jedi: The Golden Age of the Sith TPB and is one of those solid evidence narrations.

I don't pull stuff out of my ass besides logical inferences, sorry to disappoint you.

Originally posted by Illustrious
What the hell do you think "cited" means?

It's in The Tales of the Jedi: The Golden Age of the Sith TPB and is one of those solid evidence narrations.

I don't pull stuff out of my ass besides logical inferences, sorry to disappoint you.

I havent read that book yet, ill take your word for it that its in there until I read it myself.

i never said he COULD beat him it's just that some people have said he MIGHT b able to beat him

Originally posted by Luke Is Better
i never said he COULD beat him it's just that some people have said he MIGHT b able to beat him

"some people"? They have no authority on the matter, if it doesnt come from GL or another canon source its pretty much a steaming pile of bs.

Okay why are you debating people?

None of these fights have a clear winner right.

So you would have to look at who is the biggest idiot and who would most likely lose, thats Anakin.

So Obi Wan helps Mace defeat Dooku, and then those two help Luke defeat Revan.

Exactly.

Originally posted by Illustrious
Where does it say Luke beats Ragnos? Ragnos is cited as "the Dark Lord of the Sith -- the most powerful of the most powerful."

I agree though, how do they "go on forever and ever and ever" yet Revan has a slight edge? If he had a slight edge, it likely wouldn't go on forever. That line right there is showing your true colors -- you WANT Revan to win, but you don't want to say outright that Revan will, so you use "going on forever and ever" as some kind of mask.

This thread is plain unmanageable. You have three duels in one that are almost too close to call.

sorry i've been a way for a while and while looking for another thread I came across this,

About the revan having a slight edge, all that means is that while it would go on forever if there had to be a winner chances are it would be revan nothing more nothing less it just means ultimatley if they had to fight until there was a winner then it would be super long to the point it would be unbeleivable but ultimatley Revan could pull it off.

Originally posted by Illustrious
What the hell do you think "cited" means?

It's in The Tales of the Jedi: The Golden Age of the Sith TPB and is one of those solid evidence narrations.

I don't pull stuff out of my ass besides logical inferences, sorry to disappoint you.

Oooh, like that's totally canon and cannot be contradicted at all. Lucas himself contradicts himself.

ever thought why no credible star wars site mentions anything about Ragnos' "immense power" if they even bother to mention him at all? That's hardly indisputable proof that Ragnos is the most powerful, especially considering how many sith lords have emerged or been talked more in depth about since that book.

if revan fought obi wan obi would get screwed

Originally posted by Emperor Revan
Oooh, like that's totally canon and cannot be contradicted at all. Lucas himself contradicts himself.

ever thought why no credible star wars site mentions anything about Ragnos' "immense power" if they even bother to mention him at all? That's hardly indisputable proof that Ragnos is the most powerful, especially considering how many sith lords have emerged or been talked more in depth about since that book.

Wow, I don't even know why I bother for this.

First it's "You don't know Ragnos was powerful, you know he ruled over people who were powerful." Never mind that Sadow and Kressh stopped fighting, showed their respect while Ragnos' spirit came from the grave, and that it's Sith ideology that the strongest rule, which Ragnos did for 150 years.

Then it's "You only know of one person Ragnos defeated, and you don't know how powerful he is." Even though it was mentioned in canon that Simus was extremely powerful (arguably the most powerful of his era), that he could keep his head alive in a jar, and that he trained Sadow.

Then it's "No credible star wars site mentions Ragnos." Starwars.com also seems surprisingly devoid of Revan too, doesn't that seem to be counterintuitive to both sides? The fact still remains that they are EU, and most "credible" star wars sites are for die hard MOVIE fans.

Then it's "That's hardly indisputable proof" even though it's mentioned as NARRATION and that he ruled during the height of the Sith Empire. Are you going to try to argue that Palpatine didn't kill 3 Jedi Masters in seconds now too? The fact of literature is: Narration = Fact, Dialogue, monologue, thoughts = possibly fact. It's that simple.

Then it's "Considering how many Sith Lords have emerged since then." So what? The newer Sith Lords are the most powerful? Ragnos ruled at the "Golden Age" of the Sith, canonically and in narration described as the HIGH TIME of the Sith Empire, the most powerful point of the Sith Magicians/Warriors. Yet somehow, he's going to be beaten by individuals who've "emerged since then" like Revan, right? Poorly veiled fanboy attempt here.

He's CANONICALLY cited as "the Dark Lord of the Sith -- the most powerful of the most powerful" during the era of the greatest Sith. Unless evidence appears to contradict this, it's fact, it's in narration, it's writtten. Bring your evidence before you bring the heat. Otherwise drag your ass out of the kitchen.

Stop trying to debate what the narration said. Next you're going to be trying to debate that Sidious' lightsaber wasn't red, or that Yoda's not green as long as it supports your position.

I could be proving you wrong all day, but if you decide that narration and canonical evidence suddenly "is not necessarily true," then we're back at square one.

Originally posted by Illustrious
Wow, I don't even know why I bother for this.

First it's "You don't know Ragnos was powerful, you know he ruled over people who were powerful." Never mind that Sadow and Kressh stopped fighting, showed their respect while Ragnos' spirit came from the grave, and that it's Sith ideology that the strongest rule, which Ragnos did for 150 years.

Then it's "You only know of one person Ragnos defeated, and you don't know how powerful he is." Even though it was mentioned in canon that Simus was extremely powerful (arguably the most powerful of his era), that he could keep his head alive in a jar, and that he trained Sadow.

Then it's "No credible star wars site mentions Ragnos." Starwars.com also seems surprisingly devoid of Revan too, doesn't that seem to be counterintuitive to both sides? The fact still remains that they are EU, and most "credible" star wars sites are for die hard MOVIE fans.

Then it's "That's hardly indisputable proof" even though it's mentioned as NARRATION and that he ruled during the height of the Sith Empire. Are you going to try to argue that Palpatine didn't kill 3 Jedi Masters in seconds now too? The fact of literature is: Narration = Fact, Dialogue, monologue, thoughts = possibly fact. It's that simple.

Then it's "Considering how many Sith Lords have emerged since then." So what? The newer Sith Lords are the most powerful? Ragnos ruled at the "Golden Age" of the Sith, canonically and in narration described as the HIGH TIME of the Sith Empire, the most powerful point of the Sith Magicians/Warriors. Yet somehow, he's going to be beaten by individuals who've "emerged since then" like Revan, right? Poorly veiled fanboy attempt here.

He's CANONICALLY cited as "the Dark Lord of the Sith -- the most powerful of the most powerful" during the era of the greatest Sith. Unless evidence appears to contradict this, it's fact, it's in narration, it's writtten. Bring your evidence before you bring the heat. Otherwise drag your ass out of the kitchen.

Stop trying to debate what the narration said. Next you're going to be trying to debate that Sidious' lightsaber wasn't red, or that Yoda's not green as long as it supports your position.

I could be proving you wrong all day, but if you decide that narration and canonical evidence suddenly "is not necessarily true," then we're back at square one.

This is all sound.

This is why Lucas is an *******. He says Sidious is the strongest Sith Lord, yet Ragnos shows way more immense power. I fail to see how Sidious could manage to compete with Sith from the age of Ludo, Marka, and Ajunta.

When the hell does he say that.

Originally posted by Se7in
This is why Lucas is an *******. He says Sidious is the strongest Sith Lord, yet Ragnos shows way more immense power. I fail to see how Sidious could manage to compete with Sith from the age of Ludo, Marka, and Ajunta.

He doesn't. To be fair to GL, most of what he says pertains only to the movies moreso than it can to the EU. The Sith during the high time of the Sith Magicians, aka during the Golden Age of the Sith comics, were practically godlike entities compared to the other Sith from later ages.

And that is due to GL's company allowing such to stand as EU. If GL had come out and said "Whoa, that's some bull. Sith can't do that." Then we wouldn't be having this discussion.

It does make some sense that knowledge was lost after the complete disintegration of the powerful and wealthy Sith Empire. It would effectively be the loss of culture from the fall of the Roman Empire through the Middle Ages, except replace culture with power.

Pretty much.

So who're the Irish monks then?

Manifestation of Jawa hatred.

I KNEW it!

Luke beats Revan after a long battle.
Luke helps Mace before Dooku kills him.
Luke and Mace helps Obi-Wan who could defeat Anakin by himself.
Jedi wins!

Revan beats Luke
Dooku beats Maces
Obi-wan beats Anakin and is then screwed by Revan and Dooku.

revan can't beat luke is a force god revan is very powerful but not a god the only other force users in my opinion that can even stand up to luke r ragnos sadow kun and simus i guess but not revan(not sayin he's bad but the way luke is played out in NJO theres no way he could fall to revan)

hmmm alright then lets see

-Luke can instakill a vong and cloak himself from the force he also killed many vong at once including the supreme overlord who's a damn good warrior.

-Revan had more knowledge and power then someone who dropped the three most powerful jedi in the galaxy with one hand movement, this same person also did the same to 12 sith assasins feeding off the power of malachor v. Revan has the highest level of battle pre-cog knowing his opponents moves before they even think of them. Revan killed countless jedi and sith numbering in the thousands as well as turning many, many more. he singlehandedly one two wars if we're talking darkside he crushed the mandalorians including their leader,the republic ,the sith and then the republic again. Revan also learned from all the great sith lords of the past on korriban and then he learned from malachor which is a planet sized warehouse of sith knowledge.

so lets see here

experience:Revan
knowledge:Revan
Natural ability:unknown probably luke but Revan is supposed to be very naturally powerful but until we know it's Luke.

force techniques: If we're going by post star forge Revan with all his memories he wins if it's kotor revan luke wins but not by much.

Lightsaber skills: Hard to say Revan has killed more powerful opponents then luke has he's also killed more then luke+ he has more experience/knowledge with a saber. however Luke has killed more people at one time then Revan has and has a lot of natural ability,he's very fast with the force but that's using a master speed technique which revan also has, I'll leave it up to you to decide, I'm leaning towards Revan but I'm a bit biased as I like Revan for the most part but i hate Luke with a passion.

special non-force related abilities:Revan has pre-cog and is extremely charismatic as well as patient and cunning, Luke is calm and won't be tricked into spazzing out like his father.

overall: Revan but barely, a tie for those who beleive luke has better saber skills.

Originally posted by Luke Is Better
revan can't beat luke is a force god revan is very powerful but not a god the only other force users in my opinion that can even stand up to luke r ragnos sadow kun and simus i guess but not revan(not sayin he's bad but the way luke is played out in NJO theres no way he could fall to revan)

Please don't mention "Luke" and "God" in the same post.

Originally posted by darthrevan89
Please don't mention "Luke" and "God" in the same post. agreed, he's good but he's definitley beatable.

Everyone's beatable.

Except Artoo.

As are his underlings, the Master of the New Jawa Order. We are blessed by his power and astromech guidance.

Yes my username change finally came though!

That's your fictional character, yes? And that's pretty good manga right there.

Originally posted by Darth Faunus
That's your fictional character, yes? And that's pretty good manga right there.

Yea he is the main character in the series of books I'm writing. And the manga is not my work I just did some digitial editing with Photoshop to make it look like Rayvann.

Here is a full pic of him.

Hm. Nice job.

Looks like Alucard from Castlevania to me.

Yea thats who I used since the dude pretty much fit my picure of Rayvann.

Gotcha.

Hmm I think this is my favorate sig yet.

Nice color scheme.

Yea, Rayvann in the books I am writing is borderline evil and for some reason white, green and black seemed like borderline evil colors to me.

http://www.fictionpress.com/read.php?storyid=1948171

Oops I haven't updatd my story yet and changed his eyes to green.

Damn, I finally checked every new post in under an hour.

Why does it take you so long?

Because I'm multitasking either at work or with AIM, YIM, and other things.

Lol I suck at multitasking.

Me too.

Hey Janus I love the sig.

Thanks! I just had to redo it

I see your getting the hang of using layers.

I love layers.