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Adultery Greeting Cards

Ridiculous.

Lol that is pretty funny. They might not sell, but still funny.

haha, that's hilarious.

Imagine some poor husband in a rush on the eve of his anniversery, he opens it and reads the first few lines seeing their soppy romantic crap and buys it. Oh....good stuff comine his way.

Quite ridiculous indeed.

I'm a big fan of cards that make me laugh when I read them, it's quite a rare thing nowadays.

Though I'm really sure that I missed the meeting where cheating became ok and cool to do.

-AC

Originally posted by Cinemaddiction
Adultery Greeting Cards

Ridiculous.

Well, you can get cards for just about ANYTHING these days...

And Hallmark isn't cheating on anyone, nor are they encouraging anyone to do it.

No, cheating is NOT okay, but a card is just a card....

That's just worthless. Especially if you buy it and the perosn looks at the card. Now that's what I would call a awkward moment.

Originally posted by The Omega
Well, you can get cards for just about ANYTHING these days...

And Hallmark isn't cheating on anyone, nor are they encouraging anyone to do it.

No, cheating is NOT okay, but a card is just a card....

It's not Hallmark that's making them, it was merely an expression, but apparently some card company is indeed supporting adultery, albeit indirectly.

i guess next comes the child molestation cards

I ounce foudna a card that said "While in your Coma, I kept your Girlfriedn Company"

Haha, nice....A guy going to the counter and purchasing that card would be more embarrassed than if he was buying tampons.

Originally posted by Cinemaddiction
Adultery Greeting Cards

Ridiculous.

awesome!!! not that i'd ever would, but funny.

Originally posted by Pyrosgirl
Haha, nice....A guy going to the counter and purchasing that card would be more embarrassed than if he was buying tampons.

Hmm..I do that a lot, actually. I'm cool with it, but taking a card addressing my "secret lover"? That's ****ed up, and only goes to show how jaded society really is now.

hahaha! I need to buy those for a couple of friends of mine.

Our culture has officially "jumped the shark".

Who ever made monogamy the one and only moral thing? ....what's up with you people.....

Originally posted by Bardock42
Who ever made monogamy the one and only moral thing? ....what's up with you people.....

I have no problem with people who are not monogomous. Whatever floats your boat. But adultery implies that someone who had made a marriage agreement, or an agreement of mutual monogamy, and then broke that agreement.

Making a card that celibrates deeds of mistrust, in this case adultery, is pretty lame.

Hence my "jump the shark" comment.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
I have no problem with people who are not monogomous. Whatever floats your boat. But adultery implies that someone who had made a marriage agreement, or an agreement of mutual monogamy, and then broke that agreement.

Making a card that celibrates deeds of mistrust, in this case adultery, is pretty lame.

Hence my "jump the shark" comment.
Well but that's the other side...the Card is for people in love with a Married part....therefore the card sender didn't agree to that commitment.....so I don't see a problem with that card.....and even if, yes they agreed but if they don't want it anymore that should be ok today.

I agree that breaking such a contract could be considered immoral but the card is not....

I think cheating is wrong in any way.

If you commit to someone then break that for someone else and something trivial, then that's unbelievably low.

I agree with you though.

-AC

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well but that's the other side...the Card is for people in love with a Married part....therefore the card sender didn't agree to that commitment.....so I don't see a problem with that card.....and even if, yes they agreed but if they don't want it anymore that should be ok today.

I agree that breaking such a contract could be considered immoral but the card is not....

so a card commemorating and glorifying an immoral act is fine?
how about a "congratulations on your first murder" card?

Or how about a, "I know I hit you, but I really do love you" card?

how about "i treasure every moment of our incest"

O.K., I encouraged you to cros that line, I'll take some responsibilty for that one

that was the line? shit...i have not even begun to push it

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I think cheating is wrong in any way.

If you commit to someone then break that for someone else and something trivial, then that's unbelievably low.

I agree with you though.

-AC

Well and so do I...I can't force my morals on others though....

Originally posted by PVS
so a card commemorating and glorifying an immoral act is fine?
how about a "congratulations on your first murder" card?

Yes it is....and whp are you to say its immoral..you got some "Moral-Master" Certificate from some God?

to secretly break a contract pertaining to an institution which is a foundation of our society is immoral. that is fact.

if you agree to marrage, you push those morals on yourself.
to lie and destroy a family is immoral. nice try at being a smartass,
but next time try to have a valid point.

Originally posted by PVS
to secretly break a contract pertaining to an institution which is a foundation of our society is immoral. that is fact.

if you agree to marrage, you push those morals on yourself.
to lie and destroy a family is immoral. nice try at being a smartass,
but next time try to have a valid point.

No its not...wrong definition of a moral.....it may or may not be against a law....moral or not is a whole different thing....

If you agree to a marriage you accept a legal contract if you agree to the morals or not is alone your business......

Originally posted by Bardock42
No its not...wrong definition of a moral.....it may or may not be against a law....moral or not is a whole different thing....

If you agree to a marriage you accept a legal contract if you agree to the morals or not is alone your business......

no it is NOT your business alone. it is also the business of your spouse and family. if you agree to a commitment, then it is a moral obligation to hold to that commitment. some would say indefinately, but i believe divorce is justifiable if both parties consent. but then we get into the subjective.

and yes, adultery it is immoral, because lying and hurting others is immoral. if not, then there is no such thing as morality. by that logic, i can kill some random person for the hell of it, because my personal belief states that its ok.

We don*t get into the subjective, we are deep in it......it is morally not your business to care for anyone.....there's no absolute moral.....and it might hurt your family (most probably) but if its ok for the person then it's not immoral

Now we get to it...there is no morality.....neither lying, hurting or killing others is actually immoral....and even if you believe in a moral adultery doesn't have to be immoral in that way.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Now we get to it...there is no morality.....neither lying, hurting or killing others is actually immoral....and even if you believe in a moral adultery doesn't have to be immoral in that way.

and there it is. well, sorry if you feel that morality and virtue are but superficial illusions, but i swear that you would curse and lament every moment in a society which has neither.

Originally posted by PVS
and there it is. well, sorry if you feel that morality and virtue are but superficial illusions, but i swear that you would curse and lament every moment in a society which has neither.

Not really..I live in a society that doesn't have them ..... because they don't exist.....what exists is the Morasls ouir Government tries to impose on us (workds pretty fine, people even accept them as absolute) and a conscience that is conditioned to react on these Made up Morals...
Plus Virtue exists....everyone can decide to go by their own morals although most get fed to us....

I personally agree my set of morals is against adultery...btu I am also for freedom so they ma do as they please...and they will cause there are no morals........

Oh and if you want to kill someone, go ahead....nothing wrong withn that...I wont judge you.....I hope you won't judge society and e though when we execute you .......same rights to evetryone right?

but that logic is so flawed. so because your society imposes morals, then morallity does not exist? so i guess if your parents forced you to eat your veggies when you were little, veggies are then rendered unhealthy?

just because a government may be irrational in their enforcing of morals, that does not render morals nonexistant. it just speaks for the nature of that government. you dont have to reject morals in order to reject government policy.

This was not my loigic at all though...and you are a smart one..you know that I never said that.....

I didn't say they didn't exist because Society imposes them on us but that although they don't exist Soviety imposes the on us (which actually is a good thing because it makes it much easier to live in the Society....)
And Veggies are Healthy for the Human Body to some extend, that is easily profable and therefore a fact....Absolute orals would have to be Transcendent and are therefore not provable (or disprovable for that matter)....but if you think they are there...on what do you base them?...a god?....your own beliefs?....Societies beliefs? (two of these things would of course not make them absolute)

It's not aboot government....and I am not rejecting the Morals of tour Government...I am jsut saying that it'S everyones own business to decide if they want to stick to it....because since there are no absolute Morals Society has no right to force their morals upon one.....

And you are right...you can reject government without rejecting their morals.....but what does that prove anyways?

it proves nothing, i guess i misinterpreted you. no need to patronise me on my intelligence though...anyway...

certain morals are enforced by law and some are not. "thou shalt not kill" is enforced all over, however hypocritically in many states, such as mine. (death penalty)

morals are the glue that hold society together. a culture in which adultary is permissable promotes broken families. that doesnt necessarily destroy that family, but it forces them to struggle and to some degree suffer, and greatly increases the chances of povery and deliquency. and why? for the gratification of an individual... i believe the core of all morality is simple: "dont hurt others". religious fundamentalists like to cross that line and try to enforce what you do with your own body and mind when nobody else is effected, but i assure you i dont agree with that mentallity.

and no, you are very wrong to say i have the right to do what i please like murder someone, and then go on to say that in turn, society has the right to kill me. thats a double leap of flawed logic...impressive.


i have no right to kill another and if i do, society will punish/correct me. thats the way it is, and the way it should be.

Yeah sorry.....I guess I am one of the people that try to be Winners

The thing is those are not Morals...they are laws.....the morals are another possibility to enforce the laws.....that's what I am trying to say at least.....The Morals are not the reasons for punishment they are a way to not make it necessary to punish people.....
As for the Death penalty....I actually don't have any proble with it...I wouldn't want to argue fot or against it....

Now, now...those families are an invention of our Societies...whats wrong with big Groups living together why does it have to be exactly One Father one Mother and their Children?
But that is a flawed arguement then.....you say you are pro divorce but against adultery because it could destroy families.....is it not?
And I agree Morals are certainly very important to make Societies work smoothly...but they are not set...they can change and especially they are not something above human decision....
As for your core arguement that the core of Morals is not to hurt anyone is imo almost right, but it's actually self-preservation that creates "morals" in the first place

I am an impressive person...but its not faulty....id I said you have every right to kill another person i only meant that morally...you can chose for yourself if you think it'S moral to kill someone or not....the law is set though....and it says you are not allowed to.....and society can punish you all they want because they are stronger than you...nice as they are they let you live though as long as you don't break any rules.....isn't that great?

You have morally the right to do as you please.....you have by law no right to kill someone, if you do Society (or The Government) will punish you...and can even take your life (cause they don't have to stick to their morals or laws....its great when you are powerful) ...that's the way it is...and that's the only way it can be....

Originally posted by Bardock42
Yeah sorry.....I guess I am one of the people that try to be Winners

The thing is those are not Morals...they are laws.....the morals are another possibility to enforce the laws.....that's what I am trying to say at least.....The Morals are not the reasons for punishment they are a way to not make it necessary to punish people.....

laws are structured primarily to enforce basic universal morals. for example, not killing and stealing.

Originally posted by Bardock42

Now, now...those families are an invention of our Societies...whats wrong with big Groups living together why does it have to be exactly One Father one Mother and their Children?

but you are mixing issues. although i believe it should be 1 man and 1 woman, that is a personal, yet widely accepted moral which has nothing to do with this debate. if a woman agrees to marry a polygamous man, then she has no right to complain when he's off bangin his other wives. that was the deal, she knoew it, and she signed up for it. that is where you logic is flawed i think. you presume that i would push personal morals on others. not the case at all. i just feel that lying, cheating, stealing, and killing are punishable immoral acts.
the act of hurting another person.

Originally posted by Bardock42

But that is a flawed arguement then.....you say you are pro divorce but against adultery because it could destroy families.....is it not?

well, in many cases it is more healthy or less unhealthy for a child to grow up with one parent rather than live in a volatile houshold with 2 parents who cant stand eachother. and no, i'm not "pro-divorce". too many bad deductions today. i am pro-nothing negative. because someone belives in a woman's right to choose, doesnt make them pro-abortion. both options suck and are a shitty decision to have to make, but they sometimes need to be made.


Originally posted by Bardock42
but they are not set...they can change and especially they are not something above human decision....

i believe that the only times such morals are altered are in the case of a hypocritical government, once again, the death penalty. "tough shalt not kill...unless we say so" i think that is an erosion of morals rather than a true change.


Originally posted by Bardock42

I am an impressive person...but its not faulty....id I said you have every right to kill another person i only meant that morally...you can chose for yourself if you think it'S moral to kill someone or not....the law is set though....and it says you are not allowed to.....and society can punish you all they want because they are stronger than you...nice as they are they let you live though as long as you don't break any rules.....isn't that great?

no, morally you dont have the right to kill another person. at least not in a random fashion. lets not debate revenge and death penalty, please.
you have the FREE WILL and capability to kill, but not the right.

Originally posted by Bardock42

You have morally the right to do as you please.....you have by law no right to kill someone, if you do Society (or The Government) will punish you...and can even take your life (cause they don't have to stick to their morals or laws....its great when you are powerful) ...that's the way it is...and that's the only way it can be....

not the way it should be imho. but those with such power are usually corrupt and the laws reflect that. but as i said, we cant allow the, to be the ambassadors to the cause. societies decide what is moral, not them. they are there to set laws accordingly...so it should be anyway

>>laws are structured primarily to enforce basic universal morals. for example, not killing and stealing.

No, Laws are structured primatily to enforve basic universal needs of humans. for example, not being killed, not losing their properties.....


Originally posted by PVS
but you are mixing issues. although i believe it should be 1 man and 1 woman, that is a personal, yet widely accepted moral which has nothing to do with this debate. if a woman agrees to marry a polygamous man, then she has no right to complain when he's off bangin his other wives. that was the deal, she knoew it, and she signed up for it. that is where you logic is flawed i think. you presume that i would push personal morals on others. not the case at all. i just feel that lying, cheating, stealing, and killing are punishable immoral acts.
the act of hurting another person.

I agree, I mixed up something but not everything...it is true that she/he broke a contract but you can't break morals cause you either have them or not.......


Originally posted by PVS
well, in many cases it is more healthy or less unhealthy for a child to grow up with one parent rather than live in a volatile houshold with 2 parents who cant stand eachother. and no, i'm not "pro-divorce". too many bad deductions today. i am pro-nothing negative. because someone belives in a woman's right to choose, doesnt make them pro-abortion. both options suck and are a shitty decision to have to make, but they sometimes need to be made.

I meant you are pro-divorce-being-a-decision-everyone-has-to-make-for-themselves.....to long to type everytime...let's just call it pro-divorce.....
Now, yes it is sometimes better for the people to be separated.(but now, to be honest, can you say that adultery is always bad for the people involved...it might make their lifes much easier....who knows)

Originally posted by PVS
i believe that the only times such morals are altered are in the case of a hypocritical government, once again, the death penalty. "tough shalt not kill...unless we say so" i think that is an erosion of morals rather than a true change.

That's not a change, it just shows that the people that make the Morals don't have to stick to them...cause they are subjective.....
But there are changes in Morals: Slavery is Moral - Slavery is Abolished, An Eye for an Eye - Turn the other cheek, Women are Property - Women have equal rights, Homosexuality is despicable - Homosexuality is ok, Abortion is against Morals - Abortion should be the choice os the Woman. .......it happens all the time...and although I personally believe some morals to be right and some to be wrong I know that none are bette than others...cause there is no Absolute goal to achieve....


Originally posted by PVS
no, morally you dont have the right to kill another person. at least not in a random fashion. lets not debate revenge and death penalty, please.
you have the FREE WILL and capability to kill, but not the right.

Well its not a right, but you are free to do as you please...take the consequences into consideration...but its your own choice....yes, it's not a right......but neither is it wrong....it is neutral as every other actuion too


Originally posted by PVS
not the way it should be imho. but those with such power are usually corrupt and the laws reflect that. but as i said, we cant allow the, to be the ambassadors to the cause. societies decide what is moral, not them. they are there to set laws accordingly...so it should be anyway

You can't change it...it is a natural state...not changeable in any way....Well and Society does....Society lends their power to them ...cause most people are sheep....it's the way it is...they are not powerful because of their own abilities...they are powerful because of money, charisma and other things that make people follow their beliefs....

oh yeah? well YOU'RE WRONG!!!!! I WIN!!!!

Originally posted by PVS
oh yeah? well YOU'RE WRONG!!!!! I WIN!!!!

Well then......

There are certain societies where there are multiple partners with children that are raised by the elders and the village...They think nothing of having more than one partner, even at a young age.

They have some sortr of point though...if you agree to a contract society could force you to stick to it...,.it'S not morally wrong but still....

the damage caused by such recklessness is the product of immorality.
but if you subscribe to the idea that morality is an illusion,
whats the point of debating specifics? really dude?

Originally posted by PVS
the damage caused by such recklessness is the product of immorality.
but if you subscribe to the idea that morality is an illusion,
whats the point of debating specifics? really dude?

I don't say it'*s an illusion..I say it's a personal decision...everyone can have their own morals...and they are not right or wrong....and society can have their own morals...but they are neither right or wrong either......and the point in debatring is that I have a different opinion than you and othery on here and In personally enjoy debates...if you don't great...don't reply then...but my opinion is just as much worth a debate than yours.....

I'm agreeing with PVS here.

It's not a matter of what's moral to you because a relationship is a factual commitment (or should be by definition) between two people. You enter it to commit to the person because you want to be with them. If you're not sure what you want, don't commit and if you feel like you want someone else longer into the relationship, end it before you cheat.

Cheating is unacceptable and there's simply no reason for it.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I'm agreeing with PVS here.

It's not a matter of what's moral to you because a relationship is a factual commitment (or should be by definition) between two people. You enter it to commit to the person because you want to be with them. If you're not sure what you want, don't commit and if you feel like you want someone else longer into the relationship, end it before you cheat.

Cheating is unacceptable and there's simply no reason for it.

-AC

I mean I personally agree..but on what grounds can I or you blame someone that doesn't ...it's a personal thing, nothing more.... (and what if it is only a girlfriend...you didn't really commit to a contract there....)

Originally posted by Bardock42
I mean I personally agree..but on what grounds can I or you blame someone that doesn't ...it's a personal thing, nothing more.... (and what if it is only a girlfriend...you didn't really commit to a contract there....)

Firstly, it's a girlfriend therefore it's a relationship and it's a commitment.

Second, people who don't agree are simply just ignorant. Because a relationship is a commitment and breaking the commitment in such a needless and heartbreaking way does damage in so many ways than it ever needs to.

More to the point, you asked on what grounds can you or I blame someone who doesn't agree. Well if you're being cheated on, your partner clearly doesn't agree. You're not seriously gonna say to me that you'd say to them "Well it's ok, we just had a many years long relationship of love, it wasn't marriage. Can't really blame you for f*cking another man behind my back." Surely.

Maybe I'm biased because it's happened to me, but the fact that it's wrong doesn't change anything.

-AC

Well but you assue that soeone having a girlfriend will silently agree to a monogamic relationship....this doesn't have to eb the case...

Yeah they probably are ignorant but it can hurt people as much either way...and maybe it is even good for a relationship who knows...it'S clearly not a black and white thing......everyone has to see that at least....

I asked what grounds you could blame them on......of course the person cheated on can blame them for harming their psychological state but someone outside of this relationship has no right to say it was wrong or it was right or whatever....

bardock, if you're opinion is that hurting someone else is not universally moral or immoral, then what is universally moral or immoral? nothing.
if its subjective then its just an illusion, an idea we've concocted.
and what if it is? fine whatever. maybe some topics of morality are subjective, like homosexuality, premarital sex....things that hurt nobody, but some people just cant deal with it because they love to impose their will on others...fine i'll give you that.

but there is a core to morality as i've said before: don't hurt other people.
that IS universal. and even if mankind just made it up, its a rule that is tried and true. its routinely broken of coarse, but such is humanity. point being: basic fundamental morals DO exist. made up or not, every decent person on this planet has an instinct to not hurt others. many choose to defy that instict out of anger, greed, lust etc, or perhaps they were never raise properly so they have no real concept of whats right. but i refuse to subscribe to the idea that its only opinion that hurting innocent people is wrong. thats just 'devil's advocate' nonesense and you know it. if you want to make this purely phylosophical in the same vain as "life is just an illusion" then i guess we can, but whats the point?

and as for your previous point that laws are created for self preservation rather than morality, thats a weak point. both go hand in hand. i, for example, refrain from hurting others due to my conscience and sense of right and wrong. not simply out of fear of consequence
my conscience is also a factor. laws are written from both factors: self preservation, but also good conscience.

Originally posted by PVS
bardock, if you're opinion is that hurting someone else is not universally moral or immoral, then what is universally moral or immoral? nothing.

That is exactly my point...there is no Universal Moral.
Originally posted by PVS

if its subjective then its just an illusion, an idea we've concocted.

I am not familiar with the word concocted, and checking it on Dictionary.com didn't help me what edxactly ou meant with that.


Originally posted by PVS
and what if it is? fine whatever. maybe some topics of morality are subjective, like homosexuality, premarital sex....things that hurt nobody, but some people just cant deal with it because they love to impose their will on others...fine i'll give you that.

Good.....I take that.....

Originally posted by PVS
but there is a core to morality as i've said before: don't hurt other people.
that IS universal. and even if mankind just made it up, its a rule that is tried and true. its routinely broken of coarse, but such is humanity. point being: basic fundamental morals DO exist. made up or not, every decent person on this planet has an instinct to not hurt others. many choose to defy that instict out of anger, greed, lust etc, or perhaps they were never raise properly so they have no real concept of whats right. but i refuse to subscribe to the idea that its only opinion that hurting innocent people is wrong. thats just 'devil's advocate' nonesense and you know it. if you want to make this purely phylosophical in the same vain as "life is just an illusion" then i guess we can, but whats the point?

It'S not a universal core though...it is a need of all humans...we don't want to get hurt so it is logical that the first moral we create is "Don't hurt another"
And as you said...people that don't get raised properly don't have that sense of morals (some do, because psychology is a very, very hard thing to understand) ...but the basis of that is...decent people become decent because they get raised decent....
And I really don't want to play Devils Advocate...if someone breaks the law he'll get Punished, if someone breaks the Morals of Society he might get punished too...but I won't judge them morally because there is nothing I could base such a judgement on...


Originally posted by PVS
and as for your previous point that laws are created for self preservation rather than morality, thats a weak point. both go hand in hand. i, for example, refrain from hurting others due to my conscience and sense of right and wrong. not simply out of fear of consequence
my conscience is also a factor. laws are written from both factors: self preservation, but also good conscience.

It is not a weak point..it is actually true...as you said Conscience is just another way of ensuring that people will stick to the Laws. They are not created because there is a conscience but a conscience is created because people get raised to agree to the Moral Standards of Society.
Someone that never heard of Right owr wrong won't care the least if he steals something, because a Conscience is something conditioned to us...not something universal.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well but you assue that soeone having a girlfriend will silently agree to a monogamic relationship....this doesn't have to eb the case...

If you enter a relationship and don't specify that it's "open" (which I think is bullshit anyway), then you are more or less agreeing that it's not open.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Yeah they probably are ignorant but it can hurt people as much either way...and maybe it is even good for a relationship who knows...it'S clearly not a black and white thing......everyone has to see that at least....

Have you been cheated on? I'm leaning toward no because I don't THINK anyone who has would say it's good for a relationship. It is pretty black and white, there's not any grey area. If you enter a relationship and you stray, it's cheating and it's wrong.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I asked what grounds you could blame them on......of course the person cheated on can blame them for harming their psychological state but someone outside of this relationship has no right to say it was wrong or it was right or whatever....

It is wrong though. Granted, circumstances differ, but cheating is a wrong act. If the husband beats the wife and she cheats by going with a man who cares about her, I'm inclined to say it's the lesser of the two evils but I still don't condone cheating.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
If you enter a relationship and don't specify that it's "open" (which I think is bullshit anyway), then you are more or less agreeing that it's not open.



Have you been cheated on? I'm leaning toward no because I don't THINK anyone who has would say it's good for a relationship. It is pretty black and white, there's not any grey area. If you enter a relationship and you stray, it's cheating and it's wrong.



It is wrong though. Granted, circumstances differ, but cheating is a wrong act. If the husband beats the wife and she cheats by going with a man who cares about her, I'm inclined to say it's the lesser of the two evils but I still don't condone cheating.

-AC

I guess you are right, but its only between those two...not something we can talk them in.....


I have not, and to tell that right away I haven't even been in a relationship, so i can't judge fro first hand experience aboot the eotional side involved......but there is not only pain on the side of the person that was cheated on but also the person that cheats and the person they cheat with are emotional involved...yes I guess it must be very painful to be chesated on, but maybe it's as painful to break up, or not to be able to be together with the loved person...there'S more that has to be taken into consideration. Sure, if I was invoilved I wouldn't see it objectively but we can cause we are talkign hypothetical situations here....

But by whose standards is it wrong? Surely not by the standards of thee person that cheated.....so are your Moral beliefs the right ones? Or is it societies? What if Society would now see Cheating as right? .....

Originally posted by Bardock42
yes I guess it must be very painful to be chesated on, but maybe it's as painful to break up, or not to be able to be together with the loved person...there'S more that has to be taken into consideration. Sure, if I was invoilved I wouldn't see it objectively but we can cause we are talkign hypothetical situations here....

This is one of those situations that you seriously cannot understand until you've been in it. Now I'm not patronising you here, but it's true.

It's one of the single most painful things I've ever gone through in my entire life, and I've gone through some shit.

Your whole standpoint boils down to your inexperience. As for it being wrong, I don't believe that all things considered, cheating is acceptable.

When someone gives you their trust, their love and their respect, surely it would be any decent human being's reply to respect that. Even if it means openly ending it to pursue other avenues.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
This is one of those situations that you seriously cannot understand until you've been in it. Now I'm not patronising you here, but it's true.

It's one of the single most painful things I've ever gone through in my entire life, and I've gone through some shit.

Your whole standpoint boils down to your inexperience. As for it being wrong, I don't believe that all things considered, cheating is acceptable.

When someone gives you their trust, their love and their respect, surely it would be any decent human being's reply to respect that. Even if it means openly ending it to pursue other avenues.

-AC

I agree totally, but thats an adult perspective AC as a child I did not hold to that and I suspect you did not either, you like me had to learn this for yourself the hard way.

Originally posted by PVS
the damage caused by such recklessness is the product of immorality.
but if you subscribe to the idea that morality is an illusion,
whats the point of debating specifics? really dude?


also true

Originally posted by Whirlysplatt
I agree totally, but thats an adult perspective AC as a child I did not hold to that and I suspect you did not either, you like me had to learn this for yourself the hard way.

I'm not even out of my teens yet, Whirly. This all happened, legally, while I was still a "child" in the eyes of the law.

-AC

I am sorry, yes I might be inexpirienced but this has nothing to do with it, it is a philosophical problem you either take morals as absolute or as subjective......so your unexpiriencedness as well as your biasedness don't havce anything to do with this discussion.

you mean- inexperience and bias.

anyway, it has everything to do with the topic but no bearing on your philisophical devil's advocate "everything is an illusion" spinoff of the topic.

Originally posted by PVS
you mean- inexperience and bias.

anyway, it has everything to do with the topic but no bearing on your philisophical devil's advocate "everything is an illusion" spinoff of the topic.

Yes.....I someties lose all grib of the English Language (or the German for that matter)

You are probably right, I brought this off-.topic...I apologize.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I am sorry, yes I might be inexpirienced but this has nothing to do with it, it is a philosophical problem you either take morals as absolute or as subjective......so your unexpiriencedness as well as your biasedness don't havce anything to do with this discussion.

Well considering we're discussing infidelity and you've never even experienced it's effects (which are a major relevant factor) nor the effects of fidelity, you've not got much at all to do with this discussion have you?

-AC

well, i hope that for his sake, he remains ignorant of the effects of infidelity for a lifetime. that would be quite a blessing

It is painful, beyond any doubt. However, I believe a relationship can survive infidelity and be stronger than before. It will take time for the wounds of betrayal to heal and both parties must be willing to work together to move the relationship forward.

That's ridiculous, it's celebrating failure!

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Well considering we're discussing infidelity and you've never even experienced it's effects (which are a major relevant factor) nor the effects of fidelity, you've not got much at all to do with this discussion have you?

-AC

Well the discussion is aboot our thoughts on Cards on Adultery and to that discussion my views are just as valueable as those of the people that have or got cheated on.

Originally posted by Storm
It is painful, beyond any doubt. However, I believe a relationship can survive infidelity and be stronger than before. It will take time for the wounds of betrayal to heal and both parties must be willing to work together to move the relationship forward.

screw that. if i get cheated on, thats instant grounds for a break up.
wounds of betrayal never heal, until you kick their sorry ass to the curb.
then they heal nicely.

Some people have lower self esteem than you though.

talk out of experience or...................

Originally posted by finti
talk out of experience or...................

experience both ways.
when i was young and stupid, i thought we could "work it out".
thats just a fools hope for people afraid of change and having to stand on their own again. it sucks, but sometimes you have to.

after, i fell victim to the same bullshit, but from someone else. i was devistated to hear the news, dumped her ass on the spot...and felt like a million bucks. the scars of infidelity exist because people tend to blame themselves for what happened and feel that had they done things different...blah blah.

but the fact is, if you can rise above that mentallity, and realise that you dont deserve that, you can get over shit really quick and move on, stronger and wiser.

yeah but that is the big question at hand though. Not everybody is as mentally strong and some may be so head over heels in love and so bloody infatuated with the person that cheated that the betrayal really has a devastating affect that heals sooooooooo slowly and sometimes it doesnt heal

Originally posted by finti
yeah but that is the big question at hand though. Not everybody is as mentally strong and some may be so head over heels in love and so bloody infatuated with the person that cheated that the betrayal really has a devastating affect that heals sooooooooo slowly and sometimes it doesnt heal

imho, it doesnt heal for people who cant understand that its not their fault, they never deserved it, and they are better off without them. a product of low self esteem. a forever lingering haunting thought of what could have been. "what did i do wrong" "how could i have done it different" bottom line: regret and total lack of closure.

the grief one feels should simply be the void left behind, and feeling of loneliness, personal loss. that heals over time. but if you find yourself missing someone who either doesnt miss you or would simply treat you like shit, then thats not healthy at all, and thats the type of wound that wont heal until you wake up and realise your worth.

maybe , never been in the situation myself, only observed friends being cheated on and friends who cheated

Only two things scare me, one of them is nuclear war, and the other is Hallmark fear

lol, humanity is finished