Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

i personally say anaken he defeated sidiouse and gave into love so its vader=anakin

The "Chosen One" is referenced as "the one who will bring balance to the Force" in its direct interpretation in the movies (Obi-Wan once took liberty with his interpretation of how it originally was). This would mean to me that good equals bad (things aren't equal if the Sith are destroyed - then things are overbalanced in favor of the Jedi). So, Vader brought about the death of all of the Jedi except two: Yoda and Obi-Wan Kenobi. What do you know, there happen to be two Sith as well. Force balanced. Prophecy fulfilled. Then, Luke Skywalker begins training as a Jedi. The Force is unbalanced. There are soon to be three Jedi, while there are still only two Sith. So, Vader kills Obi-Wan Kenobi, thus making room for Luke to become a Jedi. Then, when Yoda dies, the balance is for once in favor of the Sith (Vader and the Emperor) while there is only one Jedi (Luke Skywalker). One of the Sith has got to go: so Vader kills Sidious, once again balancing the Force and almost simultaneously destroying the Sith. He balanced the Force, in a conventional interpretation, several times.

Originally posted by Darth L. Dipsit
The "Chosen One" is referenced as "the one who will bring balance to the Force" in its direct interpretation in the movies (Obi-Wan once took liberty with his interpretation of how it originally was). This would mean to me that good equals bad (things aren't equal if the Sith are destroyed - then things are overbalanced in favor of the Jedi). So, Vader brought about the death of all of the Jedi except two: Yoda and Obi-Wan Kenobi. What do you know, there happen to be two Sith as well. Force balanced. Prophecy fulfilled. Then, Luke Skywalker begins training as a Jedi. The Force is unbalanced. There are soon to be three Jedi, while there are still only two Sith. So, Vader kills Obi-Wan Kenobi, thus making room for Luke to become a Jedi. Then, when Yoda dies, the balance is for once in favor of the Sith (Vader and the Emperor) while there is only one Jedi (Luke Skywalker). One of the Sith has got to go: so Vader kills Sidious, once again balancing the Force and almost simultaneously destroying the Sith. He balanced the Force, in a conventional interpretation, several times.


NICE!

Thanks, man. By the way, is the new sig okay?

Originally posted by Darth L. Dipsit
Thanks, man. By the way, is the new sig okay?

As a Master of the New Jawa Order, i would say blending an Ewok with a Jawa is a disgrace.

Ummm....Guys...Uhhhh this topic is in uhhh *Cough cough* sshhhh nvm...

Originally posted by Lil Krueger
Ummm....Guys...Uhhhh this topic is in uhhh *Cough cough* sshhhh nvm...

You had better keep it to yourself.

Originally posted by Redeemer
As a Master of the New Jawa Order, i would say blending an Ewok with a Jawa is a disgrace.

I know - I figured I'd try to play along with the new theme going. It's a cursed existence, being a half-breed. But then again, so were Marka Ragnos and Luke Skywalker.

i agree with dipsit

Originally posted by Darth L. Dipsit
The "Chosen One" is referenced as "the one who will bring balance to the Force" in its direct interpretation in the movies (Obi-Wan once took liberty with his interpretation of how it originally was). This would mean to me that good equals bad (things aren't equal if the Sith are destroyed - then things are overbalanced in favor of the Jedi). So, Vader brought about the death of all of the Jedi except two: Yoda and Obi-Wan Kenobi. What do you know, there happen to be two Sith as well. Force balanced. Prophecy fulfilled. Then, Luke Skywalker begins training as a Jedi. The Force is unbalanced. There are soon to be three Jedi, while there are still only two Sith. So, Vader kills Obi-Wan Kenobi, thus making room for Luke to become a Jedi. Then, when Yoda dies, the balance is for once in favor of the Sith (Vader and the Emperor) while there is only one Jedi (Luke Skywalker). One of the Sith has got to go: so Vader kills Sidious, once again balancing the Force and almost simultaneously destroying the Sith. He balanced the Force, in a conventional interpretation, several times.

Nicely written and well thought out, but ultimately wrong. Sorry, Dipsit, but GL was clear on this: Sith create imbalance; Jedi try to maintain it. Therefore, imbalance only comes about when the Sith are actively working to bring it about (i.e. Sidious' plotting and treachery for all those years, an unseen menace) Your definition of balance is an unrealistic D & Dish type balance, where a = b, but that's not the case.

If it were, then there would perpetually be an imbalance throughout the ages, since the number of sith and jedi were never comparable. And if the situation were that for every time of imbalance a chosen one must be created to remedy that imbalance, there would be more chosen ones than you could name off in under a day, that's for sure.

No, the real sense of the prophecy here is that Anakin is -supposed- to bring balance to the Force. But how is only guessed at, and indeed the senior Council members begin to doubt that Anakin is the chosen one at all by the time of ROTS. It is important to realize the nature of predestination at this point. Let me see if I can help...

The future does not exist for linear beings such as you or I. We have the present, with the future being totally unknown to us and the past being a nebulous fog of memories. That way, it is impossible for us to predict the future since it would require a "God's eye view" (Or the view of someone who is outside of time, such as God would be, and could see everything before them not unlike a comic strip of events) . Now, assuming something like that exists (A person who can see all events at once) you have to imagine "Could the prophecy have come from this source?" If not, then the prophecy is just a prediction made by another linear being like us.

If so, then you have to determine whether the prophecy is neccessarily true because of the nonlinear observation or because of something else. To cut to the chase, this nonlinear being may have knowledge of the future, but they do not neccessarily control it. Therefore, the actual future event has rooting in choice; in this case, the choices of Anakin Skywalker.

So the question becomes not "Is there a prophecy about Anakin Skywalker" since that can't be proved or disproved without knowing the source and its original source... The question instead becomes "How closely does this prophecy conform to Anakin's choices and his eventual outcome?" Well, since GL has said that the Sith create imbalance and the jedi retain it, you can do the homework from this point on.

And this is in the wrong section, btw.

I did not know that the Sith made imbalance - thank you. I just thought that the theory had too many coincidences involved to be just, well, coincidence. Thanks, though.

Also, you never did tell me what you thought of the whole "Jawok" thing. I thought it was kind of original.

I believe that we are yet to see the Chosen One- if the prophesy is true.

I like it!

And don't mind the rant. I just like to make sure everyone's on the same page. Remember, I used to specialize in pwning the prophecy until ROTS came out.

well writen janus so the way ur saying it with the sith being the unbalance vader brings balance to the force because vader is reformed to the lightside when he kills sidious therefor bringing balance to the force if the sith are the unbalance. so luke cant be because vader takes the cheese. if im wrong someone please tell me so i can fix myself.


yes and janus i do aplaud how well written ur argument was

Thanks, but I won't take all the credit for it. A great deal of it comes from a book on Star Wars and Philosophy, but I did condense it and clean it up a bit. In the end, GL asks us again to think outside of the box. And in doing so, we can say the prophecy is nothing more than what one believes.

dont have a reason becuase they have already been stated ANNAKIN/VADER oh yeBut honostly how many of these threads are going to b made, there was probably about a dozen of these made b4 i signed on these forums, please strop making these forums(luke/vader chosen one forums) im no mod but it does got annoying. thanks.

Originally posted by Aduruth
dont have a reason becuase they have already been stated ANNAKIN/VADER oh yeBut honostly how many of these threads are going to b made, there was probably about a dozen of these made b4 i signed on these forums, please strop making these forums(luke/vader chosen one forums) im no mod but it does got annoying. thanks.

Um... What?

Try writing in cohesive understandable sentences, because how you write now is annoying. Thanks.

If Darth Sidious or his master created Anakin, whose to say they didn't create the prophecy?
Just a thought.

A valid point. Are you coming back? Vapaad Master was just online, too.

this could help if anybody found out how old sidious was. because he could have quite possibly formed it long ago. but it was said to have been formed in the times of the ancient jedi. so if sidious was alive around then or a time period relevant to the date the prophecy was created he probably could have made his plan for the future as an uprising.


give me some feedback guys

I'd say Luke is the chosen one. Luke was the catalyst for ending the sith, he brought Vader back to the good side, he was the one who restored the Jedi knights, so I think it's Luke.

I don't think ether of them were the chosen one in fact I think the whole phophasy is bullshit.

i just dont know

I have got the truth. Anakin did destroy vader. They are the 2 sides of him so one sith is down. Then in saving his son luke he destroys sidious ending the sith. It just took some of lukes help to do it. But anakin is the chosen one.

Anakin is the chosen one and I don't see why it's still a debate. he killed sidious, re joined the light, balance

another reason is that luke wasnt the chosen one because there was also lea and they didnt need luke if he died there was still lea and plus obiwan would have trained her or even yoda because his time came once he trained luke not once he was that age so i still think that this is anakins because without luke there was still hope

ITS a possibility but yes vader/anikan is the chosen 1

good its settled

Originally posted by Darth Nhilus
I have got the truth. Anakin did destroy vader. They are the 2 sides of him so one sith is down. Then in saving his son luke he destroys sidious ending the sith. It just took some of lukes help to do it. But anakin is the chosen one.

No, the Sith live on after that.

No they dont its a cult of dark jedi



there is a diffrence between dark jedi and sith

starwars

Originally posted by Baston Alveron
No they dont its a cult of dark jedi



there is a diffrence between dark jedi and sith

starwars

Yes, and if you call the others after Sidious and Vader Dark Jedi, then so were they.

Originally posted by DarthMaul9123
another reason is that luke wasnt the chosen one because there was also lea and they didnt need luke if he died there was still lea and plus obiwan would have trained her or even yoda because his time came once he trained luke not once he was that age so i still think that this is anakins because without luke there was still hope

I'm sorry. I don't see a single punctuation in this entire post. So it must be clear you are not trying to convey a message; instead, you are trying to spew incoherent jargon.

Anakin is the chosen one if there is a prophecy, he was the individual that completed the task of destroying the then Sith. It doesn't matter that Luke is the catalyst, the prophecy stated that Anakin would destroy the Sith and he did.

yes, yes we already covered that.

Good, atleast you guys know anakin was the chosen one, up where live we constantly have debates who was the chosen one when clearly anakin was and he did destroy the sith. He destroyed vader from within then destroyed the emperor. Sith gone, balance brought to the force. Anakin is the chosen one, end of story.

exactly you are my savior thanks for listening

Hm.

Let's try this:

Anakin is only the chosen one IF the prophecy is given by someone who was have explicit knowledge of the future. Since only a being who can see past, present, and future at once could have such knowledge, that being would exist OUTSIDE of time, meaning? The prophecy has to come from an external source, it cannot come from the jedi, Qui-Gon Jinn, or the Sith at all.

But since we don't know for certain if it is or isn't from such a godlike source, we can only conclude that Anakin conformed to the prophecy because of his choices. If you decide that this is not so, then you must say that in the realm of Star Wars, there is no free will. People are ultimately compelled to do their duty to the Force.

So? This has been known for a while.

I really should write up this theory:

Wise man make argument.
Other wise men nod in agreement.
Dumb men shake head, can't figure out argument, go off topic.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Hm.

Let's try this:

Anakin is only the chosen one IF the prophecy is given by someone who was have explicit knowledge of the future. Since only a being who can see past, present, and future at once could have such knowledge, that being would exist OUTSIDE of time, meaning? The prophecy has to come from an external source, it cannot come from the jedi, Qui-Gon Jinn, or the Sith at all.

But since we don't know for certain if it is or isn't from such a godlike source, we can only conclude that Anakin conformed to the prophecy because of his choices. If you decide that this is not so, then you must say that in the realm of Star Wars, there is no free will. People are ultimately compelled to do their duty to the Force.

You could be right of course, the prophecy could have been created by something outside of time and outside of live, but if it was created by something like that (the force) then the prophecy is false and not completed at all.

For the force to be in balance it would have to have both light and dark, both sides of the force. Otherwise the force itself would not be in balance, and why would the force create a prophecy about balance that destroys balance?

So its far more logical that one Jedi made it, and probably not even anything specific just that one special Jedi would always show up and destroy the dark side.

I think Ana was the choosen one as with out him Sid would of never of been found out and in the end his actions are the ones that really bring balance to the force. Thou I really dont understand the balance thing as it seems that balance is when there is no sith, shouldnt it be equal

Again, the prophecy is NOT about destroying evil or darkness, since that is impossible. Good and evil, light and dark will always be opposed to one another; there is no other conceivable way of life. But in this case, it's not about you have two apples, I also have two apples. We bring balance to the kitchen table. No, it's the Sith seek to destroy good utterly and crush it under oppression, while teh jedi seek to defeat evil's machinations and restore the universe to its natural state, with at least some good present. If the jedi did not seek to merely restore the balance, they would install a regime of their own and conform everyone to be "good", and thus it would lead to eventual corruption and thus evil yet again. Therefore Lucas' point is that good can work for the balance and evil against it.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Again, the prophecy is NOT about destroying evil or darkness, since that is impossible. Good and evil, light and dark will always be opposed to one another; there is no other conceivable way of life. But in this case, it's not about you have two apples, I also have two apples. We bring balance to the kitchen table. No, it's the Sith seek to destroy good utterly and crush it under oppression, while teh jedi seek to defeat evil's machinations and restore the universe to its natural state, with at least some good present. If the jedi did not seek to merely restore the balance, they would install a regime of their own and conform everyone to be "good", and thus it would lead to eventual corruption and thus evil yet again. Therefore Lucas' point is that good can work for the balance and evil against it. But the Sith seek power not destruction and they also have emotions which the jedi don't. Wouldnt be more of a balance to have ajedis that loved and felt something as Ana did

Originally posted by Revan Souer
But the Sith seek power not destruction and they also have emotions which the jedi don't. Wouldnt be more of a balance to have ajedis that loved and felt something as Ana did

You are confused as to the Sith's goals, and that's actually pretty sad when considering your moral development.

Sith seek power, which leads to domination and eventually comformity or destruction. You cannot simply "have" power and "have" emotions and not want to nuke some little country or planet because they piss you off and don't send you exactly a hundred credits for every person every day.

And everyone ASSUMES that the jedi don't love. They do. They are encouraged to show compassion, and they do have a special kind of love for one another, and for their duties and what they protect. But they are forbidden attachment, because attachment borderlines on obsession, and obsession is a chaotic emotion that leads back to wanting power... which leads back to destruction and oppression.

If the Sith ideal as you see it (Having power and emotions without reprocussions or possibly falling to evil) was possible, there would be dozens of enlightened despots in the world today. But there are none.

(edit: and I forgot to add, the Sith's ultimate goal is the destruction of the jedi and the rule of the galaxy. How is this a fitting goal for anyone to aspire to?)

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
You are confused as to the Sith's goals, and that's actually pretty sad when considering your moral development.

Sith seek power, which leads to domination and eventually comformity or destruction. You cannot simply "have" power and "have" emotions and not want to nuke some little country or planet because they piss you off and don't send you exactly a hundred credits for every person every day.

And everyone ASSUMES that the jedi don't love. They do. They are encouraged to show compassion, and they do have a special kind of love for one another, and for their duties and what they protect. But they are forbidden attachment, because attachment borderlines on obsession, and obsession is a chaotic emotion that leads back to wanting power... which leads back to destruction and oppression.

If the Sith ideal as you see it (Having power and emotions without reprocussions or possibly falling to evil) was possible, there would be dozens of enlightened despots in the world today. But there are none.

(edit: and I forgot to add, the Sith's ultimate goal is the destruction of the jedi and the rule of the galaxy. How is this a fitting goal for anyone to aspire to?) You make a good urguement but you feel love and you don't run around chopping up people so its claerly possible. Take Jolee B he feels love real love would you class him as a power hugry maniac

True, but he is a rare case. The jedi discourage younger jedi from following the path of passion because they do not have the neccessary discipline. As for Jolee... well... he's not very ambitious by nature.

So if they where more careful with there selection process then it might work my way. Surely Ana fellings for Luke in the end helped him fight thou the pain of the lightering from Sid and made him make the right choice

True, but there wouldn't have been any reason for that choice had Anakin had any self control to begin with, and had heeded the jedi's ways.

That just speculation as we dont know what Sid would of done if Ana had stayed true to the teachings. But drawing from feelings of love during battle has probably kept more people alive then staying in a zen like state. Emotions can help and thats watch the Jedi should of taught there Pads but that they shouldn't let them control there actions as you and I do day in day out

I don't agree ont hat at all. If anything, a zenlike state would aid one in battle, whereas a passionate stance would blind one. It's pretty obvious that attachment and passion weaken one in battle and outside of battle.

I think it again depends on the person, thinking of my kids would get me through such things as war and conflicted. My love for them would make me fight harder to stay alive. As Im sure other people would say the same

True, but that's resolve. And one can have resolve of many things. Attachment is not limited to other people, although this is a particular attachment the jedi discourage, perhaps because it is so tenative.

But a jedi could just as easily have an attachment to his duty, to his honor or pride... to his fellows. Attachment in general does exist, and it can fuel resolve that can turn the tide in a battle or otherwise. But in particular, relationships between beings are fickle and chaotic. I know this, and you should note this as well. And for this very reason, they can spawn emotions and feelings that are very unjedilike more often and to a much stronger degree than can others... Most of the time.

Like I said, it's a failsafe, not the ultimate truth.

Anakin is the Chosen One...

Thanks for the input.

Pfft...

Originally posted by Darth Plagues
Anakin is the Chosen One...

Ha! I knew Plagues would come out of hiding and declare some statment corrupted by fanboyisim.

I don't get why people just read the thread title, pop in, write two to eight words, and then never check on or debate the thread at all. DO those people think we care about their unsupported, fleeting opinion at all?

Well, I suppose that's not fair. No one cares about my overblown and drawn out opinion, so meh.