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who will win this

Not that Wolverine has no chance, but I think Colossus more often then not.

y i mean wolverine can cut threw collossus like a hot knife threw butter and hes like the second best fighter in marvel

No he can't.... he could, with repeated effort on the same point, eventually drive his claws through Peter's skin, but he'd get batted away before then.... his best chance is to go for the eyes, insides of the nose, mouth, or ears....

Did you used to have the name blackwolverine?

i remember in an early issue of ultimate x-men, wolverine cut colossus without a sweat in the danger room. i think that would be true in the real marvel world.

lol i get that so much its not even funny

He is blackweaponx, and he has come to avenge his fallen brother blackwolverine.....

Originally posted by JirK
i remember in an early issue of ultimate x-men, wolverine cut colossus without a sweat in the danger room. i think that would be true in the real marvel world. You remember wrong. Ultimate Wolverine was unable to cut Ultimate Colossus. Just as 616 Wolverine is unable to cut 616 Colossus.

swear the classic wolverine could cut him but wat comic did u get that from

Originally posted by Piedmon
He is blackweaponx, and he has come to avenge his fallen brother blackwolverine.....

its not him u fool....i would recognize...him he has a different grammer and shit....its not him....

colossus definatly takes this. i no that wolvies adamantium are sharper than colossus but wolverine doesnt have the strength to do it.

if he cant cut threw collossus but can cut threw hulk then that means collossus can beat hulk

Originally posted by blackweaponx
if he cant cut threw collossus but can cut threw hulk then that means collossus can beat hulk That's some nice flawed reasoning.

Originally posted by blackweaponx
if he cant cut threw collossus but can cut threw hulk then that means collossus can beat hulk

Ummm...no. Cutting does not mean winning. Hulk could cut the Hulk, but it would not matter since he would just heal shortly after and piss him off even more...which is a no-no

no things are diffrent here the hulk can definetly take down colossus.see colossus has steel skin but the hulk has skins that could be pierced. colosses only has strength and doesnt have anything thats sharp like wolverine does. if we match the hulks power to colossus's power the hulk is stronger which means the hulk can kill colossus.

exactlyand hulk and wolverine is like a tight if they were fighting i got a comic when they r whoopen eachother but they always end up fighting someone stronger than both of them like wendigo so that means wolverine can beat colossus

Hulk and Wolverine is tight... hmm... well this thread just went to hell.

wat u mean

Originally posted by blackweaponx
y i mean wolverine can cut threw collossus like a hot knife threw butter and hes like the second best fighter in marvel
hes the FIRST best fighter in Marvel and i dont give a damn what anyone says, and he would win, he'd stab Colossus in the eyes. and he can cut him....if he needed too.

see i like guys liike king kam dat foo knows wat he talkin bout

but wolverine is a tight with captaion america thats y i said 2nd

oh ya so colosuss would just stand there and say "hey logan u could cut me up"? colossus does have the power to kill wolverine if he has to.
(although feral wolverine would stand more of a chance)i would give feral wolvie a 2/10 at the most..........

Wolverine all the way!!!

Originally posted by spiderboy5
oh ya so colosuss would just stand there and say "hey logan u could cut me up"? colossus does have the power to kill wolverine if he has to.
(although feral wolverine would stand more of a chance)i would give feral wolvie a 2/10 at the most..........
did you expect more from Spderboy15 hes a canadian....
(wolverine is one of FEW cool canadians)

Originally posted by King KAM
did you expect more from Spderboy15 hes a canadian....
(wolverine is one of FEW cool canadians)

shut the hell up kam...............

Originally posted by King KAM
did you expect more from Spderboy15 hes a canadian....
(wolverine is one of FEW cool canadians)

Originally posted by spiderboy5
shut the hell up kam...............
canada sucks.....

Originally posted by King KAM
canada sucks.....

u r becoming an ******* just like me....i am so proud....

Um...Colossus's eyes can easily withstand the impact of a .45 caliber magnum bullet.

If you don't know how powerful that is, well...find out. I'm lazy.

His eyes will definitely withstand Wolverine's claws.

Not that Wolvie would get anywhere near his face after he's punted to Siberia.

Originally posted by colossus17
u r becoming an ******* just like me....i am so proud....
thanks pop

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Um...Colossus's eyes can easily withstand the impact of a .45 caliber magnum bullet.

If you don't know how powerful that is, well...find out. I'm lazy.

His eyes will definitely withstand Wolverine's claws.

Not that Wolvie would get anywhere near his face after he's punted to Siberia.

exactly

Originally posted by King KAM
canada sucks.....

canadians killed my uncle joe they just ate him.......for nothing!..but thats because he was weak and wasent made of rage like me

Originally posted by colossus17
canadians killed my uncle joe they just ate him.......for nothing!..but thats because he was weak and wasent made of rage like me

Colossus would fckin rape wolverine

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Hulk and Wolverine is tight... hmm... well this thread just went to hell. The thread is Wolverine vs Colosus, right?

What was it doing before that point? Getting in the hand basket?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Um...Colossus's eyes can easily withstand the impact of a .45 caliber magnum bullet.

If you don't know how powerful that is, well...find out. I'm lazy.

His eyes will definitely withstand Wolverine's claws.

Not that Wolvie would get anywhere near his face after he's punted to Siberia. Not that I disagree with Colossus winning, but Hulk's skin can also deflect bullets, and yet it still is feesable for Wolverine to peirce that. . .

Of course that's not to say that he could peirce the ruskie's eyes. It's just that

Wolverine's Claws > .45 caliber magnum bullet

And

Colossus's eyes > .45 caliber bullet.

The formula is incomplete since the .45 caliber feat might not be high end durability feat.

W> 5
C> 5

W ? C

Originally posted by colossus17
canadians killed my uncle joe they just ate him.......for nothing!..but thats because he was weak and wasent made of rage like me
dude i thought you werent made of rage anymore....

Originally posted by spiderboy5
colossus definatly takes this. i no that wolvies adamantium are sharper than colossus but wolverine doesnt have the strength to do it.
Short, precise and CORRECT!!!

I could take a handmade Katana forged out of titanium and try to cut through a wall made of gold (a really "soft" metal)...and would fail, not because the weapon is not sharp or durable enough, but because i would need superstrength to perform this stunt.
Does Wolverine have superstrength? I guess we all know the answer.

NO !!

Originally posted by ImmortalOne
NO !! Right answer...an A+ for you!

Originally posted by Piedmon
Not that Wolverine has no chance, but I think Colossus more often then not. Wolverine has no chance...

Originally posted by Creshosk
Not that I disagree with Colossus winning, but Hulk's skin can also deflect bullets, and yet it still is feesable for Wolverine to peirce that. . .

Of course that's not to say that he could peirce the ruskie's eyes. It's just that

Wolverine's Claws > .45 caliber magnum bullet

And

Colossus's eyes > .45 caliber bullet.

The formula is incomplete since the .45 caliber feat might not be high end durability feat.

W> 5
C> 5

W ? C The missing portion = plot device, going by the logic of that, wolverine wouldn't cut hulk, and if he could at the start, he wouldn't for long.

WOLVERINE IS NOT THE BEST FIGHTER IN MARVEL, NOR DC!!!!

Wolverine would lose this, and when Hulk first fought Wolverine, wolverine couldnt cut the hulk but then the comic book comany was like hmmmmm i think people are starting to like this Character so lets make him look bad ass by letting him cut the hulk

Originally posted by superman302
Wolverine would lose this, and when Hulk first fought Wolverine, wolverine couldnt cut the hulk but then the comic book comany was like hmmmmm i think people are starting to like this Character so lets make him look bad ass by letting him cut the hulk
EXACTLY!!!
Wolvie, as cool as he may be, can only win this due to bad and exaggerating writing.

I could take a handmade Katana forged out of titanium and try to cut through a wall made of gold (a really "soft" metal)...and would fail, not because the weapon is not sharp or durable enough, but because i would need superstrength to perform this stunt.
Does Wolverine have superstrength? I guess we all know the answer.
So there is no logical way for him to be able to cut Colossus OR the Hulk.

Originally posted by wannabe
Short, precise and CORRECT!!!

I could take a handmade Katana forged out of titanium and try to cut through a wall made of gold (a really "soft" metal)...and would fail, not because the weapon is not sharp or durable enough, but because i would need superstrength to perform this stunt.b And what would happen if you tried? the blade would dull as it's not as durable as adamantium wouldn't it?

And that's the real problem is the material and how sharp it is. and the resistences of the materials.

When you strike the wall of gold some of the force does indeed bend the metal blade. because if you hit it hard enough the sword would snap or bend wouldn't it?

Now if you were to use a material that does not bend nor break, then that force that bent or broke the sword would instead be applied to the wall.

And due to the aplication of force over a smaller area, it's not like you're trying to cut the wall with a baseball bat.

Originally posted by wannabe
Does Wolverine have superstrength? I guess we all know the answer. In the strictest sense of the word. . . Wolverine is listed as a 4, in strength, which according to marvel is superhuman strength. . . even if he has the basest, basest amount to barely make him qualify.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
The missing portion = plot device, going by the logic of that, wolverine wouldn't cut hulk, and if he could at the start, he wouldn't for long.I don't follow. could you write out the steps to show "that logic" leding to the outcome of Wolverine starting off being able to cut the hulk, and eventually not being able to?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
WOLVERINE IS NOT THE BEST FIGHTER IN MARVEL, NOR DC!!!! Never said he was. This isn't about skill, this is about druability.

Originally posted by superman302
Wolverine would lose this, and when Hulk first fought Wolverine, wolverine couldnt cut the hulk but then the comic book comany was like hmmmmm i think people are starting to like this Character so lets make him look bad ass by letting him cut the hulk The reason why doesn't matter. The retcon still occured.

Originally posted by Creshosk
And what would happen if you tried? the blade would dull as it's not as durable as adamantium wouldn't it?

And that's the real problem is the material and how sharp it is. and the resistences of the materials.

When you strike the wall of gold some of the force does indeed bend the metal blade. because if you hit it hard enough the sword would snap or bend wouldn't it?

Now if you were to use a material that does not bend nor break, then that force that bent or broke the sword would instead be applied to the wall.

And due to the aplication of force over a smaller area, it's not like you're trying to cut the wall with a baseball bat.
I took Titanium and Gold because of their strong difference in durability!

Adamantium may be harder than Titanium but organic steel is also harder than Gold!

A titanium blade would not bend when any of us would hit a gold wall with it, because the STRENGTH we posses does not deliver the necessary force to do so.

The force applied to the wall would still not be enough to tear it apart...and it would not only be applied to the wall but also, if not to the "unbendable" blade, to the one who wields the weapon (you would feel it in your bones and in your back flung arms).
As long as the principles of physics are working in 616, the energy of a hit will NEVER fully be applied to the target!
Originally posted by Creshosk
In the strictest sense of the word. . . Wolverine is listed as a 4, in strength, which according to marvel is superhuman strength. . . even if he has the basest, basest amount to barely make him qualify.
The question would still be: Is this "basest" amount enough?
To cut something as durable as organic steel you would surely need much more than 1ton class superstrength and Wolvie is not even in THIS class.

Originally posted by wannabe
I took Titanium and Gold because of their strong difference in durability!

Adamantium may be harder than Titanium but organic steel is also harder than Gold! I'm not saying that Wolverine's claws CAN cut Colossus, or even that they should. I'm merely trying to explain why he is able to cut things with the force he has.

As these things happen in the comic books with a consistency that is not a one time shot like bone claw cutting thanos.

Originally posted by wannabe
A titanium blade would not bend when any of us would hit a gold wall with it, because the STRENGTH we posses does not deliver the necessary force to do so. But the blade would dull. A bending of the material on a smaller scale.

Originally posted by wannabe
The force applied to the wall would still not be enough to tear it apart...and it would not only be applied to the wall but also, if not to the "unbendable" blade, to the one who wields the weapon (you would feel it in your bones and in your back flung arms).
As long as the principles of physics are working in 616, the energy of a hit will NEVER fully be applied to the target! Real world physics or comic book physics?

Originally posted by wannabe
The question would still be: Is this "basest" amount enough?
To cut something as durable as organic steel you would surely need much more than 1ton class superstrength and Wolvie is not even in THIS class. The basest superhuman strength is more than peak human, it doesn't need to be massively large, just more than peak human.

To be superhuman you simply have to be above the strength a human at maximum potential can achieve. This is accomplished through the adamantium. Being peak human before applying the admanitum. When Wolverine tears the mucle tissue it due to the high rate of cellular regeneration, the mucles heal much faster than a normal human. So his workouts are a bit more effective because they are faster. This would place him at peak human level. Then when you add the adamantium, you can brace the weight off of the adamantium skeleton and gain that extra boost that takes you just barely above peak human.

Anyway, once again, I'm not arguing that he can peirce Colossus's skin, or even his eyeballs. I was merely saying that Wolverine has peirced things that .45 calibre magnum bullets cannot. And that this fact also does not show that he can peirce collosus's eye as we do not know if this is a high level feat of durability, or if Colossus's eye can take much, much more than a .45CM bullet. . .

Originally posted by Creshosk
And what would happen if you tried? the blade would dull as it's not as durable as adamantium wouldn't it?

And that's the real problem is the material and how sharp it is. and the resistences of the materials.

When you strike the wall of gold some of the force does indeed bend the metal blade. because if you hit it hard enough the sword would snap or bend wouldn't it?

Now if you were to use a material that does not bend nor break, then that force that bent or broke the sword would instead be applied to the wall.

And due to the aplication of force over a smaller area, it's not like you're trying to cut the wall with a baseball bat.

In the strictest sense of the word. . . Wolverine is listed as a 4, in strength, which according to marvel is superhuman strength. . . even if he has the basest, basest amount to barely make him qualify.

I don't follow. could you write out the steps to show "that logic" leding to the outcome of Wolverine starting off being able to cut the hulk, and eventually not being able to?

Never said he was. This isn't about skill, this is about druability. Last comment wasn't aimed at you, it was aimed at someone esle.

It had wolverine unable to cut the hulk, but now he can.

Hulk is denser than colossus, so by that logic...

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Last comment wasn't aimed at you, it was aimed at someone esle.

It had wolverine unable to cut the hulk, but now he can.

Hulk is denser than colossus, so by that logic... *shrugs* it was retconned so that he could cut, hulk just healed quickly. . .

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Um...Colossus's eyes can easily withstand the impact of a .45 caliber magnum bullet.

If you don't know how powerful that is, well...find out. I'm lazy.

His eyes will definitely withstand Wolverine's claws.

Not that Wolvie would get anywhere near his face after he's punted to Siberia.

I am so freaking sick and tired of hearing that....

You know what else can withstand a .45 caliber bullet? THE HULL OF A FREAKING TANK.

Who here has not seen Wolverine go through a tank before?

Wolverine is the best fighter in marvel, he Ko'ed Shang Chi, Iron Fist, Punisher, DD, and Shatterstar before, all in h2h fights.

Originally posted by King KAM
Wolverine is the best fighter in marvel, he Ko'ed Shang Chi, Iron Fist, Punisher, DD, and Shatterstar before, all in h2h fights. Going by your logic lol, many people have defeated wolverine...

He isn't the best, he's like the 5th best, he's dc's batman, maybe.

He doesn't apply all the time though...

Originally posted by Creshosk
*shrugs* it was retconned so that he could cut, hulk just healed quickly. . . You are agreeing with me.

I was saying logically...

he is atleast second......man...he cant get no damn respect..well hes atleast 3rd if we count COTU, he is as good as captain...he just doesnt get the respect captain gets.

Originally posted by King KAM
he is atleast second......man...he cant get no damn respect..well hes atleast 3rd if we count COTU, he is as good as captain...he just doesnt get the respect captain gets. No repect? He's overrated as shit, its fact he isn't the best, he's ONE of the best, but not the best.

Captain america is marvel's batman...

lol

Thing jumps in at the last minute and beats them both

I am waiting for Wolverine to have his showdown with cap toe to toe, to settle it....i got my money of Wolverine...i think he is better...

Originally posted by King KAM
I am waiting for Wolverine to have his showdown with cap toe to toe, to settle it....i got my money of Wolverine...i think he is better... Wolverine can just barely beat cap...

Originally posted by Wynndar
Thing jumps in at the last minute and beats them both


Wolverine and cap? Maybe.

Wolverine and colossus? Those fightin words!!!

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
You are agreeing with me.

I was saying logically... Just trying to find a logical explination for it is all.

Outside of comic books, if hulk is denser than big c

Originally posted by Creshosk
I'm not saying that Wolverine's claws CAN cut Colossus, or even that they should. I'm merely trying to explain why he is able to cut things with the force he has.
And i'm trying to explain why he shouldn't.
Originally posted by Creshosk
As these things happen in the comic books with a consistency that is not a one time shot like bone claw cutting thanos.
The consistent repetition of something rather stupid doesn't make it more believable or even logical. I try to discuss the vs.-confrontations here with more rationalism and less thoughts about readers opinions and wishes in mind than the regular comic writer...though i admit, that this is just ONE possible way of handling things here.
Originally posted by Creshosk
But the blade would dull. A bending of the material on a smaller scale.
My point was, that the part of the assembled force going into bending the blade is so small, that it can be neglected...and still the wall would not be seriously harmed.
Originally posted by Creshosk
Real world physics or comic book physics?
Marvel comics feature the same basics of physics like the real world, there are just some additional aspects when it comes to super powers and super sciences.
Adamantium's only super characteristic is his indestructibility, in all other aspects it's a normal metal, following known real physics.
Wolverines only super characteristics are his senses, the healing factor and some slightly increased physical attributes, in all other aspects going beyond this he is bound to the laws of known real physics.
Originally posted by Creshosk
The basest superhuman strength is more than peak human, it doesn't need to be massively large, just more than peak human.
To be superhuman you simply have to be above the strength a human at maximum potential can achieve. This is accomplished through the adamantium. Being peak human before applying the admanitum. When Wolverine tears the mucle tissue it due to the high rate of cellular regeneration, the mucles heal much faster than a normal human. So his workouts are a bit more effective because they are faster. This would place him at peak human level. Then when you add the adamantium, you can brace the weight off of the adamantium skeleton and gain that extra boost that takes you just barely above peak human.
When i said that he would need superhuman strength to cut colossus, i meant something with more impact than "just more than peak human", even if this is enough to pass as superhuman strength...and i think you know that; you seem rather intelligent.

its all a question of whether wolvie can cut throught peters organic metal, which i would say he can, this goes to wolvie

Originally posted by King KAM
hes the FIRST best fighter in Marvel and i dont give a damn what anyone says, and he would win, he'd stab Colossus in the eyes. and he can cut him....if he needed too.

Please refresh my memory, in how many of his fights with Deadpool has he won?

Oh... right...

Originally posted by wannabe
And i'm trying to explain why he shouldn't.

The consistent repetition of something rather stupid doesn't make it more believable or even logical. I try to discuss the vs.-confrontations here with more rationalism and less thoughts about readers opinions and wishes in mind than the regular comic writer...though i admit, that this is just ONE possible way of handling things here.

My point was, that the part of the assembled force going into bending the blade is so small, that it can be neglected...and still the wall would not be seriously harmed.

Marvel comics feature the same basics of physics like the real world, there are just some additional aspects when it comes to super powers and super sciences.
Adamantium's only super characteristic is his indestructibility, in all other aspects it's a normal metal, following known real physics.
Wolverines only super characteristics are his senses, the healing factor and some slightly increased physical attributes, in all other aspects going beyond this he is bound to the laws of known real physics.

When i said that he would need superhuman strength to cut colossus, i meant something with more impact than "just more than peak human", even if this is enough to pass as superhuman strength...and i think you know that; you seem rather intelligent. took the words right out of my mouth

Originally posted by Nataku8188
Please refresh my memory, in how many of his fights with Deadpool has he won?

Oh... right... KK is a bit of a fanboy lol.

Wolverine isn't even the second-best fighter in Marvel. Just off the top of my head, both Cap and Elektra can school him. Elektra flat-out EMBARASSED him.

As for Wolverine vs. Hulk ... omigod ... dumbest match-up ever dreamed up in comics. The best representation I ever saw of what would REALLY happen in a fight like that was in Garth Ennis's Confederacy of Dunces, when Hulk sent Wolverine practically into the stratosphere ... which of course still didn't kill him but DID end the fight by effective ring-out.

And yes, I know Ennis loathes Wolverine, but still ... realistically ... that's what would (and should) happen in a Wolverine versus Hulk fight. But I mean, hey, anyone else at Wolverine's level of strength and skill would be KILLED by a Hulk punch, not just sent out of the ring, so it's not like it's much Wolverine hating to point this out.

Originally posted by wannabe
And i'm trying to explain why he shouldn't. What good does that do when he does all the time?

Originally posted by wannabe
The consistent repetition of something rather stupid doesn't make it more believable or even logical. Like in comic books?

No, seriously. The idea that we could get superpowers from our DNA being altered or different is a stupid concept. Particularly the more far out powers. Energy projectors/manipulators wouldn't make any sense. The only "mutants" or heros that would make sense are the purely physical types, but even those sometimes stretch the limitations of what's beleiveable.

But this "stupidity" is repeated quite frequently. IT has become an accepted core of being.

Originally posted by wannabe
I try to discuss the vs.-confrontations here with more rationalism and less thoughts about readers opinions and wishes in mind than the regular comic writer...though i admit, that this is just ONE possible way of handling things here. Selective rationalism is not rational in itself.

Originally posted by wannabe
My point was, that the part of the assembled force going into bending the blade is so small, that it can be neglected...and still the wall would not be seriously harmed.Then how would you explain this thing that shouldn't happen but does all the time?

Originally posted by wannabe
Marvel comics feature the same basics of physics like the real world, But alot are largely ignored. Newton's third law is quite often discarded.

Originally posted by wannabe
there are just some additional aspects when it comes to super powers and super sciences. And this additional data needs to be accounted for as well.

Originally posted by wannabe
Adamantium's only super characteristic is his indestructibility, in all other aspects it's a normal metal, following known real physics. That we know of.

Originally posted by wannabe
Wolverines only super characteristics are his senses, the healing factor and some slightly increased physical attributes, in all other aspects going beyond this he is bound to the laws of known real physics. I would say that being a comic book character he should obey those physics. As he has derived his powers from a comic book science rather than a real one, and even then his healing factor has done things that it shouldn't anyway. His wounds don't cauterize.

Originally posted by wannabe
When i said that he would need superhuman strength to cut colossus, i meant something with more impact than "just more than peak human", even if this is enough to pass as superhuman strength...and i think you know that; you seem rather intelligent. I'm not saying that he can cut colossus. I'm just trying to explain why he can cut the things he does.

Originally posted by Orestes
As for Wolverine vs. Hulk ... omigod ... dumbest match-up ever dreamed up in comics. The best representation I ever saw of what would REALLY happen in a fight like that was in Garth Ennis's Confederacy of Dunces, when Hulk sent Wolverine practically into the stratosphere ... which of course still didn't kill him but DID end the fight by effective ring-out. The ring out is not a rule here, even if it should. Simply ringing someone out is insufficent here if the person can still return under their own power.

Originally posted by Orestes
And yes, I know Ennis loathes Wolverine, but still ... realistically ... that's what would (and should) happen in a Wolverine versus Hulk fight. But I mean, hey, anyone else at Wolverine's level of strength and skill would be KILLED by a Hulk punch, not just sent out of the ring, so it's not like it's much Wolverine hating to point this out. Aatually since Wolverine was originally a Hulk villian, I'm not too certain of the animosity claim. . . As he would obviously be created to be able to hassle the hulk in the first place. Other wise he'd simply be like a hand ninja to wolverine. . . canon fodder no one would care about.

Well lets get back on topic for a second, becasue this isn't a comic book, if he isn't technically strong enough to force the blade through, he just isn't.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Well lets get back on topic for a second, becasue this isn't a comic book, if he isn't technically strong enough to force the blade through, he just isn't. Which is why I'm saying there has to be something that is being overlooked, like a property of the metal. . .

For all we know the claws were sharpened enough to almost be molecularly thi on the edge of the blade. . . not quite THAT sharp, but pretty darned sharp.

So what little force he does have is applied effiecently enough to do the things he does. . .

Originally posted by Creshosk
Which is why I'm saying there has to be something that is being overlooked, like a property of the metal. . .

For all we know the claws were sharpened enough to almost be molecularly thi on the edge of the blade. . . not quite THAT sharp, but pretty darned sharp.

So what little force he does have is applied effiecently enough to do the things he does. . . Yep, but that is alot of specualtion.

colossus has evolved his metal, and I can see where you are coming from, they are sharp, and exert ALOT of force in a small area, but just not enough.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Yep, but that is alot of specualtion.

colossus has evolved his metal, and I can see where you are coming from, they are sharp, and exert ALOT of force in a small area, but just not enough. I'm not going to say one way or another where Colossus is involved. Had Wolverine been able to cut him just once I would have. But as he hasn't I really can't say anything one way or the other on this.

Originally posted by Creshosk
I'm not going to say one way or another where Colossus is involved. Had Wolverine been able to cut him just once I would have. But as he hasn't I really can't say anything one way or the other on this. Rephrase that for me...

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Rephrase that for me... The things I'm refering to are things he's already cut.

Things he hasn't before that are quite durable I have no way of judging.

We don't know exactly what the properties of Colossus's metal is, they could be akin to Vibranium, which would dampen the force exerted by wolverine in the first place.

I mean look at Cap'n A's sheild for example. . .

Originally posted by Creshosk
The things I'm refering to are things he's already cut.

Things he hasn't before that are quite durable I have no way of judging.

We don't know exactly what the properties of Colossus's metal is, they could be akin to Vibranium, which would dampen the force exerted by wolverine in the first place.

I mean look at Cap'n A's sheild for example. . . Gotcha

Maybe your going about this wrong. Instead of looking at what Wolverine has cut before, maybe its best to look at what has cut Collossus before, and then compare that to wolverine.

Originally posted by Onikirimaru
Maybe your going about this wrong. Instead of looking at what Wolverine has cut before, maybe its best to look at what has cut Collossus before, and then compare that to wolverine. AGAIN. . I'm not saying that Wolverine can cut Colossus. . .

Originally posted by Onikirimaru
Maybe your going about this wrong. Instead of looking at what Wolverine has cut before, maybe its best to look at what has cut Collossus before, and then compare that to wolverine. god that sig rocks

This is another case of Wolverine not cutting Colossus. He even knew that when playing tag in the danger room.

Kitty kneeled down behind Colossus and Wolverine used his claws to push him down.

It must hurt Colossus a little though cause he kinda said owww!

Originally posted by snoopdogg
This is another case of Wolverine not cutting Colossus. He even knew that when playing tag in the danger room.

Kitty kneeled down behind Colossus and Wolverine used his claws to push him down.

It must hurt Colossus a little though cause he kinda said owww! Thanks for that, like I said he will annoy Colossus, or hurt him like scraping on a fence.

Other than that, no he won't.

I posted this one in another thread. Maybe some of you didnt see it.

Again the same thing just sparks flying and scored him a little but not enough to do any damage cause Colossus sent Wolverine for a a ride.

Yea Colossus shouldn't have too much trouble fighting Wolverine.

Originally posted by Creshosk
What good does that do when he does all the time?
We are discussing our opinions and thoughts about comic characters here!
This whole forum would be quite boring and meaningless if we would take all things that happen in the comics unquestioned...wouldn't you agree?!
Originally posted by Creshosk
Like in comic books?

No, seriously. The idea that we could get superpowers from our DNA being altered or different is a stupid concept. Particularly the more far out powers. Energy projectors/manipulators wouldn't make any sense. The only "mutants" or heros that would make sense are the purely physical types, but even those sometimes stretch the limitations of what's beleiveable.

But this "stupidity" is repeated quite frequently. IT has become an accepted core of being.
Along our discussion i made clear, that i'm talking about stupidity within the boundaries of the given fictional world. Superpowers are an integral part of this particular world, so unquestionable. If Wolverine had super strength, a super ability to make him cut steel etc. like he does very often, i would not debate over it or call it a stupid stunt.
Originally posted by Creshosk
Selective rationalism is not rational in itself.
When you read any of my other postings in this forum, you will come to see, that my way of debating and using ratio is by no means selective. I use the same criteria and parameters for all characters and comic books.
Originally posted by Creshosk
Then how would you explain this thing that shouldn't happen but does all the time?
I already said it SEVERAL TIMES...EXAGGERATION to exploit a characters publicity in giving fanboys what writers think they would like and non thinking about consequences and effects powers and stunts should have...even in a comic.
Originally posted by Creshosk
But alot are largely ignored. Newton's third law is quite often discarded.
Yes, like those laws are ignored in this case...that's what i'm talking about. Nonetheless these laws exist even in Marvel comics.
Originally posted by Creshosk
And this additional data needs to be accounted for as well.
I always do..like you SHOULD have noticed till now.
Originally posted by Creshosk
That we know of.
That's an argument in which way???
Originally posted by Creshosk
I would say that being a comic book character he should obey those physics. As he has derived his powers from a comic book science rather than a real one, and even then his healing factor has done things that it shouldn't anyway. His wounds don't cauterize.
When there are things not working with known natural laws due to powers, i do not question them. As i already said, if wolvie had real super strength, i would not debate at all.

Well that should make it pretty clear, Wolverine has attempted to cut him and failed.

Originally posted by wannabe
We are discussing our opinions and thoughts about comic characters here!
This whole forum would be quite boring and meaningless if we would take all things that happen in the comics unquestioned...wouldn't you agree?! Nah, plenty of room for speculation.

Originally posted by wannabe
Along our discussion i made clear, that i'm talking about stupidity within the boundaries of the given fictional world. Superpowers are an integral part of this particular world, so unquestionable. If Wolverine had super strength, a super ability to make him cut steel etc. like he does very often, i would not debate over it or call it a stupid stunt. Well obviously its not with Wolverine's strength that allows him to cut the things he does. It's obviously in his weaponry, claws sharpened so fine that what little pressure Wolverine does apply is efficenit enough to cut not only steel but titanium alloys.

That is one of the described abilities of adamantium, being able to cut through most metals like a hot knife through butter.

Originally posted by wannabe
When you read any of my other postings in this forum, you will come to see, that my way of debating and using ratio is by no means selective. I use the same criteria and parameters for all characters and comic books. As do I, if something has enough consistency I don't question it as much. Unless of course someone else is being inconsistant about something. . .

Originally posted by wannabe
I already said it SEVERAL TIMES...EXAGGERATION to exploit a characters publicity in giving fanboys what writers think they would like and non thinking about consequences and effects powers and stunts should have...even in a comic. And?

That means that he doesn't do it?

Originally posted by wannabe
Yes, like those laws are ignored in this case...that's what i'm talking about. Nonetheless these laws exist even in Marvel comics. laws thjat are ignored exist. . . right. . .

Originally posted by wannabe
I always do..like you SHOULD have noticed till now.till now?

Originally posted by wannabe
That's an argument in which way???If their are more porperties (like being said to be able to cut through any metal excpt more adamantium for example)

Originally posted by wannabe
When there are things not working with known natural laws due to powers, i do not question them. Except for this time. Your theory isn't working with natural laws due to powers, yes the claws and adamantium are enhancments thatnormal people don't have. I for one don't have the power to extend three claws from my hands. . . Adamantium or otherwise.

Originally posted by wannabe
As i already said, if wolvie had real super strength, i would not debate at all. but you still do, despite the adamantium.

Originally posted by Creshosk
Well that should make it pretty clear, Wolverine has attempted to cut him and failed.
When this is referring to the comic scan from snoopdogg, i only have to say:"Thats the way it should be (imo)...sparks maybe, but no real cuts!"
Originally posted by Creshosk
Nah, plenty of room for speculation.
Last time i checked, speculations were a form of articulating opinions and thoughts.
Originally posted by Creshosk
Well obviously its not with Wolverine's strength that allows him to cut the things he does. It's obviously in his weaponry, claws sharpened so fine that what little pressure Wolverine does apply is efficenit enough to cut not only steel but titanium alloys.
That's your interpretation of given data. Nothing wrong with that, but it's not mine.
Originally posted by Creshosk
That is one of the described abilities of adamantium, being able to cut through most metals like a hot knife through butter.
Titanium alloy blades are also able to cut through gold without difficulty...with the sufficient force behind it.
Originally posted by Creshosk
As do I, if something has enough consistency I don't question it as much. Unless of course someone else is being inconsistant about something. . .
That would be who?
Originally posted by Creshosk
And?

That means that he doesn't do it?
NOOO...OBVIOUSLY NOT!!! It just means that he SHOULDN'T be able to do it IN MY OPINION.
That's what we are discussing here after all: What would happen to these characters in given confrontations in our opinion. And then we try to support and explain our thought in several ways. Or have i misinterpreted the situation?
Originally posted by Creshosk
laws thjat are ignored exist. . . right. . .
Laws that are usually shown and are only ignored in situations when writers think the situation needs more drama or a character more profile...yes.
Originally posted by Creshosk
till now?
Sorry, English is not my mother tongue I meant "by now"(i guess).
Originally posted by Creshosk
If their are more porperties (like being said to be able to cut through any metal excpt more adamantium for example)
I already answered to this argument above.
Btw...Your comment to my statement that unbreakability is the only super characteristic of adamantium was:"That we know of". This comment is an agreement to given knowledge as stated then, but implies further adamantium characteristics yet unknown. I questioned this agreements validity as an argument and now you justify it with FURTHER "given knowledge" about this metal?
Originally posted by Creshosk
Except for this time. Your theory isn't working with natural laws due to powers, yes the claws and adamantium are enhancments thatnormal people don't have. I for one don't have the power to extend three claws from my hands. . . Adamantium or otherwise.
No! A normal person without superpowers CAN have an adamantium enhanced skeleton in Marvel (Bullseye).
And i don't question otherwise impossible stunts when the DIRECT cause is a super power. The direct effects of Wolverines super abilities are regeneration, hyper senses, enhanced physical attributes and extendable claws...no problem with that. But the direct cause for being able to USE the claws for cutting organic steel (to get back to topic) would be super strength, an ability Logan does not have.
Originally posted by Creshosk
but you still do, despite the adamantium.
OF COURSE I DO!!! I explained several times that i don't accept the material of the claws as an explanation for the stunt in question, when imo it should be strength.
My god...which part of... Originally posted by wannabe
"As i already said, if wolvie had real super strength, i would not debate at all."...did you not understand???

Originally posted by wannabe
When this is referring to the comic scan from snoopdogg, i only have to say:"Thats the way it should be (imo)...sparks maybe, but no real cuts!" And I'm saying that's the way it happened.

Originally posted by wannabe
Last time i checked, speculations were a form of articulating opinions and thoughts. Yeah, which there is plenty of room for on these forums.

Originally posted by wannabe
That's your interpretation of given data. Nothing wrong with that, but it's not mine. Well, my interpritation coincides with the data.

An event occurs and I'm trying to understand why, you seem to be saying why it should not have happened, neither of which really changes the fact that the event happened. Your side is needed for a better understanding, especially with challenging antiquainted ideas.

Originally posted by wannabe
Titanium alloy blades are also able to cut through gold without difficulty...with the sufficient force behind it. Appearently Adamantium capitalizes on the force that is being used effiecently enough to succeed. What cuts better? Bronze, iron, steel or titanium?

Originally posted by wannabe
That would be who? I'm not nameing names. Not you, but others who switch to use whatever is in their favor, regardless of waether or not it was in their favor in another place.

Originally posted by wannabe
NOOO...OBVIOUSLY NOT!!! It just means that he SHOULDN'T be able to do it IN MY OPINION.
That's what we are discussing here after all: What would happen to these characters in given confrontations in our opinion. And then we try to support and explain our thought in several ways. Or have i misinterpreted the situation?Well part of the discussion involves understanding the characters and what they are capable of. If Wolverine is capable of cutting through titanium on a consistant basis, then things stating that he can't or shouldn't, really don't fit in with the character. and are an abstraction of the character rather than the character itself.

Originally posted by wannabe
Laws that are usually shown and are only ignored in situations when writers think the situation needs more drama or a character more profile...yes.Unless they aren't usually shown, and quite contrarily are often not shown, one would question the existence of these in the first place, IF one were to question the existence of other scientific priciples.

Originally posted by wannabe
Sorry, English is not my mother tongue I meant "by now"(i guess). You're quite good. People are known for cleaverly using words in such a way that it's hard to tell what one means exactly.

I thought you might have been making a comment on this being our first conflict.

Originally posted by wannabe
I already answered to this argument above.
Btw...Your comment to my statement that unbreakability is the only super characteristic of adamantium was:"That we know of". This comment is an agreement to given knowledge as stated then, but implies further adamantium characteristics yet unknown. I questioned this agreements validity as an argument and now you justify it with FURTHER "given knowledge" about this metal? Hmm. . point. Maybe I choose my words poorly before. But that was another property of the metal, though "unbreakability" is questionable as I've seen it broken before. . . And not just by Hulk.

Originally posted by wannabe
No! A normal person without superpowers CAN have an adamantium enhanced skeleton in Marvel (Bullseye). But wouldn't that give them a superhuman durability to their bones, enabling them to lift more than before and survive more than before?

Wouldn't you consider superhuman durability a power?

Originally posted by wannabe
And i don't question otherwise impossible stunts when the DIRECT cause is a super power. The direct effects of Wolverines super abilities are regeneration, hyper senses, enhanced physical attributes and extendable claws...no problem with that. But the direct cause for being able to USE the claws for cutting organic steel (to get back to topic) would be super strength, an ability Logan does not have. Or a property of the metal. a person can far easier cut down a tree with steel as opposed to something softer, like another wood.

Originally posted by wannabe
OF COURSE I DO!!! I explained several times that i don't accept the material of the claws as an explanation for the stunt in question, when imo it should be strength. When you've eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.

Since it couldn't BE his strength it HAS to be something else. The next suspect would be the material you are cutting with.

Originally posted by wannabe
My god...which part of... ...did you not understand??? The "why".

Why question one occurance with only one question if you're trying to get to the truth, when there are other questions that could be asked.

Originally posted by Creshosk
But wouldn't that give them a superhuman durability to their bones, enabling them to lift more than before and survive more than before?

I've got to hear this explanation. How the hell does having an unbreakable skeleton allow you lift more? Seriously, I mean this in a purely scientific way. Explain to me how having an adamantium skeleton allows Wolverine to lift more. I'd love to hear this.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I've got to hear this explanation. How the hell does having an unbreakable skeleton allow you lift more? Seriously, I mean this in a purely scientific way. Explain to me how having an adamantium skeleton allows Wolverine to lift more. I'd love to hear this.
I dont feel like his Skeleton should be why he is peak human, i feel its his healing factor, it works better than steroids, he can work out more than humanly possible because he wont ache from the intense excersise, allowing him to work harder with faster results and less down time.....

sound right?

Well I actually heard that the adamantium on his bones enhances his strength but not very much. It makes sense to me.

But Colossus' whole body is made of steel which is why I always wonder why he wasnt one of the strongest guys in Marvel.

Originally posted by King KAM
I dont feel like his Skeleton should be why he is peak human, i feel its his healing factor, it works better than steroids, he can work out more than humanly possible because he wont ache from the intense excersise, allowing him to work harder with faster results and less down time.....

sound right?

See, that makes perfect sense. And that's actually how I already assumed it was. That makes 100% perfect sense compared to the skeleton making him stronger thing.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Well I actually heard that the adamantium on his bones enhances his strength but not very much. It makes sense to me.

But Colossus' whole body is made of steel which is why I always wonder why he wasnt one of the strongest guys in Marvel.

Colossus is one of the strongest (Just purely physical-wise) in Marvel actually, I'd say. I mean, there's like...Gladiator, Hulk, She-Hulk...and then somewhere in there is Colossus. He's quite the powerhouse, I just wish he would be used more often. He's not underrated, just severely underused.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
See, that makes perfect sense. And that's actually how I already assumed it was. That makes 100% perfect sense compared to the skeleton making him stronger thing.
well i agree.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Colossus is one of the strongest (Just purely physical-wise) in Marvel actually, I'd say. I mean, there's like...Gladiator, Hulk, She-Hulk...and then somewhere in there is Colossus. He's quite the powerhouse, I just wish he would be used more often. He's not underrated, just severely underused. Are you reading his mini series?

Its kinda spooky. The art kinda sucks but the story is good so far.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Are you reading his mini series?

Its kinda spooky. The art kinda sucks but the story is good so far.

Colossus? Has his own mini series?

...I was not aware of this.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I've got to hear this explanation. How the hell does having an unbreakable skeleton allow you lift more? Seriously, I mean this in a purely scientific way. Explain to me how having an adamantium skeleton allows Wolverine to lift more. I'd love to hear this. By bracing the weight on the bones, or when he punches he's hitting with the equivilent of an adamantium baseball bat.

His healing makes him peak human, the bones push him up a little bit furter than that.

Originally posted by Creshosk
And I'm saying that's the way it happened. Good to know that we agree on that!
Originally posted by Creshosk
Yeah, which there is plenty of room for on these forums..We are going circle on this when you look back on our previous posts!
Originally posted by Creshosk
Well, my interpritation coincides with the data.

An event occurs and I'm trying to understand why, you seem to be saying why it should not have happened, neither of which really changes the fact that the event happened. Your side is needed for a better understanding, especially with challenging antiquainted ideas.

Appearently Adamantium capitalizes on the force that is being used effiecently enough to succeed. What cuts better? Bronze, iron, steel or titanium?.

Well part of the discussion involves understanding the characters and what they are capable of. If Wolverine is capable of cutting through titanium on a consistant basis, then things stating that he can't or shouldn't, really don't fit in with the character. and are an abstraction of the character rather than the character itself.

Or a property of the metal. a person can far easier cut down a tree with steel as opposed to something softer, like another wood.

When you've eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.

Since it couldn't BE his strength it HAS to be something else. The next suspect would be the material you are cutting with.Usually i would postulate your logic as flawless and would gladly submit to it. Who am i to question Mr.Holmes (or was it Data or Spock)?
BUT what got me on my line of thinking was Magneto, ripping the metal from Logans body!
After this incident Wolverine kept on slicing through steel, stone and the likes with his bone claws.
These claws were by no means as durable or as sharp as those covered with adamantium...so why was he still able to perform in this way?
Since it couldn't BE his strength and it obviously ISN'T the material he's cutting with it HAS to be something else.
The next suspect would be the writers using exaggeration to exploit a characters publicity in giving fanboys what they think they would like and non thinking about consequences and effects powers and stunts should have...even in a comic.(There the circle is again!)
Since we are able to discuss hypothetical events in this forum without sales, fan wishes and bathos in mind, i came to question Wolvies abilities the way i did.
Originally posted by Creshosk
Unless they aren't usually shown, and quite contrarily are often not shown, one would question the existence of these in the first place, IF one were to question the existence of other scientific priciples.Agreed, but leaving this highly theoretical (and imo quite interesting)discussion of ours aside, it's pretty safe to say the Marvel universe is supposed to be a world just like ours with some "super" ADDITIONS. I don't believe the Writers purposely dumped some of the more basic natural laws entirely. I guess they are simply not consciously aware of them from time to time...like most people in the world. But i am, as are you...also in this forum!
Originally posted by Creshosk
You're quite good. People are known for cleaverly using words in such a way that it's hard to tell what one means exactly..Thank you...and i know what you mean!
Originally posted by Creshosk
Hmm. . point. Maybe I choose my words poorly before. But that was another property of the metal, though "unbreakability" is questionable as I've seen it broken before. . . And not just by Hulk..I know, but for the course of our debate, as much as i appreciate accuracy, it's rather nit-picking, is it not?
Originally posted by Creshosk
But wouldn't that give them a superhuman durability to their bones, enabling them to lift more than before and survive more than before?

Wouldn't you consider superhuman durability a power?I definitely would! But this superhuman power would be a RESULT of the bonding and we were talking of a non super character being able TO GET this metal!!!
Originally posted by Creshosk
The "why".

Why question one occurance with only one question if you're trying to get to the truth, when there are other questions that could be asked. I hope i answered this question to your satisfaction.
Btw...i like it when you get philosophical!