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No prep for Marvel Earth. Zoom II has full access to any and all information regarding the Marvel Earth. He has four weeks of prep. Lex Luthor, Pre-Crisis Darkseid, and Brainiac are helping him with prep. Marvel Earth has ABSOLUTELY no warning whatsoever of Zoom's presence, plans, nor intentions to attack Marvel Earth. Cosmic awareness be damned. Just how f***ed is Marvel Earth? Can they win?

Has The One Above All declared Marvel Earth a disaster zone? That's vital info right there.

Originally posted by Draco69
No prep for Marvel Earth. Zoom II has full access to any and all information regarding the Marvel Earth. He has four weeks of prep. Lex Luthor, Pre-Crisis Darkseid, and Brainiac are helping him with prep. Marvel Earth has ABSOLUTELY no warning whatsoever of Zoom's presence, plans, nor intentions to attack Marvel Earth. Cosmic awareness be damned. Just how f***ed is Marvel Earth? Can they win?

Ummmmm no !

Not unless Longshot inherits the UNi power ??????????? ...... guys help me out.

Originally posted by The Ion
Has The One Above All declared Marvel Earth a disaster zone? That's vital info right there.

God is taking a piss while Zoom ravages the Earth.

Stay away, Phoenixlites!

How bout Molecule Man?

Zoom II with Cytorrak would ravage DC earth too.

I don't think Marvel Earth has anyone fast enough to complete. Especially when Zoom will be coming in with a genius plan. Maybe if Surfer happens to be kickin it on Earth at the time.

Zoom II (with the gem) might be fast and powerful, but he isn't invincible. I could see Strange taking him out if he had to.

I thought invincibility was what the gem did?

Originally posted by Space M ummy
Zoom II (with the gem) might be fast and powerful, but he isn't invincible. I could see Strange taking him out if he had to.
Zoom would know about that because Zoom has seen everything before it happens. He is Zoom.

I don't see anything in Zoom's arsenal (even with the gem) capable of taking out Strange. Strange goes toe to toe with Eternity and can resist the effects of the infinity gems. Zoom isn't on that level.

Also IIRC, Strange has auto defenses up around his person and residence AT ALL TIMES that brute force wouldn't be sufficient to break through. What's to stop strange from sitting in his mansion and punking zoom at a distance?

Interesting matchup tho. I'd pay good money to see this fight in print.

I don't see anything in Zoom's arsenal (even with the gem) capable of taking out Strange. Strange goes toe to toe with Eternity and can resist the effects of the infinity gems. Zoom isn't on that level.

Also IIRC, Strange has auto defenses up around his person and residence AT ALL TIMES that brute force wouldn't be sufficient to break through. What's to stop strange from sitting in his mansion and punking zoom at a distance?

Interesting matchup tho. I'd pay good money to see this fight in print.

**edit** the gem of cyttorak doesn't grant instant invincibility. It grants indeterminate class 100 strength (which in terms of hitting power, zoom should have anyway) a force shield, does away with the need to eat or breathe, grants a super healing factor, resistance to physical damage (though not invincibility...juggy got cut up by shatterstar, though healed back pretty fast), and the ability to not be stopped when moving forwards (though you can be slowed considerably..i.e. down to a crawl)

It won't prevent against magic from a greater source of power than cyttorak (which strange has plenty of..hell, strange can call on cyttorak when he wants to) psychic assaults (onslaught just ripped the gem out of him and imprisoned him IN it) or whatever it was that nimrod did to him that messed up his nervous system. *whew*

Remember folks. Prep.

Originally posted by Draco69
Remember folks. Prep.

Dr. Strange still. Adam Warlock as well. Not sure how Zoom's going to beat Strange in astral form with Strange putting a barrier around his body. Or if he dimension hops and plans his attack from there.

Warlock is on Earth? Since when? Do cosmics ever visit another planet?

Zoom can beat Strange...by using a specially-designed astral-form nullifer that enables him to attack astral forms. And barriers are meant to be broken.

Zoom II can dimension-hop as well.

Originally posted by Draco69
Warlock is on Earth? Since when? Do cosmics ever visit another planet?

Zoom can beat Strange...by using a specially-designed astral-form nullifer that enables him to attack astral forms. And barriers are meant to be broken.

Zoom II can dimension-hop as well.
... God DAMNIT I wish I'd known about that during the last tournament.

Originally posted by Draco69
Warlock is on Earth? Since when? Do cosmics ever visit another planet?

Since he came from Earth. Duh, the HIVE. Since, his base is on Monster Island.



Into what dimension? There's various dimensions. And I'd like to see him travel into the Dark Dimension where next to nothing is none by him. Strange, however, does. Or the realm of Muspelheim and battle Strange in that environment. How's about Mephisto's realm? Neither Zoom nor Strange will be welcomed, but atleast the Meph knows Strange and Strange knows how to deal with Mephisto. Zoom doesn't want a piece of Mephisto.

Gee, I'd like to see Zoom trying to attack Strange while he's devising a plan or asking for a tricket in Agamotto's realm.

Strange simply has too many options for Zoom. Strange wins here, with the rest of marvel earth sitting this one out on the sidelines eating crackerjacks.

It also occurs to me that Graviton could crush zoom through sheer force of will from anywhere on earth-or from orbit-if he was so inclined.

He could render him helpless to even move, use gravity to crush him into the earth's core...fling him into space...

IIRC, He held every hero on Marvel Earth suspended and/or unable to move while simultaneously rearranging the continents into a reflection of his own face.

His own personal gravity/density also makes him insanely resistant to even the strongest of physical attacks, should zoom manage to get the drop on him first.

I don't see Zoom posing much of a problem to him, either.

God himself would have trouble breaking down Strange's barriers.

How far back can Zoom go in time?

Originally posted by Beyonder
Since he came from Earth. Duh, the HIVE. Since, his base is on Monster Island.

Ah. Learned something new.



Originally posted by Beyonder
Into what dimension? There's various dimensions. And I'd like to see him travel into the Dark Dimension where next to nothing is none by him. Strange, however, does. Or the realm of Muspelheim and battle Strange in that environment. How's about Mephisto's realm? Neither Zoom nor Strange will be welcomed, but atleast the Meph knows Strange and Strange knows how to deal with Mephisto. Zoom doesn't want a piece of Mephisto.

Phantom Zone. Dimension of Starhearts. Etc.

Mephisto? Bah. Zoom will just use the Spear of Destiny.


Originally posted by Beyonder
Gee, I'd like to see Zoom trying to attack Strange while he's devising a plan or asking for a tricket in Agamotto's realm.

No. I was thinking the more logical choice where Strange is bonked in the same timeframe he kills just about everyone else on Earth

Originally posted by Space M ummy
Strange simply has too many options for Zoom. Strange wins here, with the rest of marvel earth sitting this one out on the sidelines eating crackerjacks.

Do you even know who Zoom is? This guy's makes the Flash look like a snail.

How is Strange even gonna know he's being attacked? Or the rest of the world for that matter?

Originally posted by Space M ummy
It also occurs to me that Graviton could crush zoom through sheer force of will from anywhere on earth-or from orbit-if he was so inclined.
He could render him helpless to even move, use gravity to crush him into the earth's core...fling him into space...

Won't work. Gravity doesn't affect Zoom. He can just zip into the timestream.

And again, HOW will Gravitron even know that Zoom exists?

Zoom on his own managed to punch people from continent to continent. Imagine what would happen if he had the Gem.


Originally posted by Space M ummy
He could render him helpless to even move, use gravity to crush him into the earth's core...fling him into space...



Originally posted by Space M ummy
His own personal gravity/density also makes him insanely resistant to even the strongest of physical attacks, should zoom manage to get the drop on him first.

Immune to a 1000 times faster than light punch from A high-end Class 100 character. Yeah....

Originally posted by Space M ummy
I don't see Zoom posing much of a problem to him, either.

Again. Do you even know who Zoom is?

Originally posted by long pig
God himself would have trouble breaking down Strange's barriers.

Now that's just exaggerating Strange's abilities.

Originally posted by long pig
How far back can Zoom go in time?

You don't understand. Zoom isn't like the Flash. He's displaces him self in and out of the timestream. Thus he can exist in the beginning of time itself.

Originally posted by Draco69
Ah. Learned something new.

Glad to help.






No, no. I mean how's Zoom fighting Strange on Strange's turf? Especially, Agamotto's realm? Strange preps. for Zoom in another dimension like Agamotto's.

As for the Spear of Destiny, you sure it can take out Meph? Usually pure souls and mages beat Mephisto. Otherwise, Meph has stalemated Galactus and melted Mjlnonir on a whim just for kicks.



Not while in his house. Unless Zoom knows about everything in Strange's house? Both Surfer and Warlock were lost in Strange's mansion until Strange showed up. First hafta get pass defenses.

!

Not really, no. His house is even more protected than his artifacts.

http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/3807/godhi1lm.th.jpg

Seriously, getting into Strange's house while Strange is conscious is near impossible.

Just wanted to reply to a few things before I hit the sack for the night.

Once again, Strange (and Graviton, but he's less of an issue) have defenses that are PERPETUALLY on. Strange keeps the most powerful items in the Marvel U. in his residence and on his person. The Darkhold, The books of the Vishanti, they're all there. The spells he has up are sufficient to keep beings like Dormammu at bay. even going at lightspeed with class 100 strength, Zoom is *not* going to penetrate them.

Strange will know he's being attacked when Zoom immolates himself on his force shields like a bug on my windshield.

In regards to Time travel, the book of the Vishanti also includes a treatise on magical time travel. I'm 100% certain Strange is more than familiar enough with time travel to contend with Zoom in the time travel department.

Graviton is a similar case: I dont have time to cut and paste everything (work in the morning) but Graviton's personal gravity field makes him nigh invulnerable to physical attack. These fields are on ALL THE TIME, even when distracted, sleeping, or knocked out. Graviton has also done ridiculous things like increase his mass to 100x that of the mutated thing (stronger than the current version) with ZERO effort (he was simultaneously pinning down two Things and the human torch and dropping a skyscraper on all three of them) which, combined with his fields is more than sufficient to take a hit from a high class 100 character going at lightspeed.

Wonder Woman took a lightspeed hit from Zoom and while hurt, was still concious and able to stand. Now imagine Wonder Woman 100x as dense (or at 100x her defense, if thats easier) and you'll see where I'm coming from here.

Graviton is also globally aware of everything that goes on with the earth's gravitational field. He'll be aware of zoom's presence the instant he appears on marvel earth. and an instant is all he needs to react to neutralize zoom. How do you figure zoom is immune to gravity? Graviton can effect even intangible beings, and claimed to be able to stop the dimension of limbo from merging with earth single handedly through force of will during inferno, so extradimensional beings arent a problem for him either.

Check the Graviton vs. Magneto thread for some more info on him, he's a beast when properly written.

Zoom may be fast, and powerful, but sheer speed and strength alone arent sufficient to overcome every opponent.

You also specified Zoom with the Gem of cyttorak, not "zoom with every plot device in the DCU." I'm not sure where things like the spear of destiny are coming from...

Faster than Flash? So?
Strange's defenses are up 24/7, as long as he is in the house, he can prep all the wants and fight.

I'm not exactly sure what can beat Zoom, but how would he handle and Earth wide time stop?

Originally posted by long pig
Strange's defenses are up 24/7

Not true.

He doesn't seem to be defending very well in that scan.

Zoom wins, b*tches! And Strange dies first.

Originally posted by jrodslam
Not true.
You're wrong.
His house defenses are always on unless P.I.S kicks in. Other than that, 99.999999% they are on.

Still getting all your info on Strange with that one comic, huh? The Order sucked.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
He doesn't seem to be defending very well in that scan.
I was just showcasing the scan and the quote of Strange saying "God himself would have trouble getting past my defenses."

Originally posted by long pig
You're wrong.
His house defenses are always on unless P.I.S kicks in. Other than that, 99.999999% they are on.
Since Zoom has unrestricted prep, all he has to do is plan the attack for a time when Strange is out of his house but not doing battle.

Won't work.

Strange has massive pre-cog, and if any time he is in danger of being killed, he gets a good ten minute warning as a sign of life on his forehead. He'd know a few minutes before Zoom attacked.

I mean, Zoom can always time travel, but so can Strange, probably better. And since Strange can't die, even if Zoom decapitates him, his astral form will still fight on.

dude God would have absolutely no problem getting past his defences. Or TOAA as he is known in Marvel. That is pure hyperbole.

Um, of course it was a hyperbole.

It was intended to show how tough his defenses are. They are tough enough for Strange to say "Even God would have trouble.".

C'mon people, use your heads here.

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
He doesn't seem to be defending very well in that scan.

C'mon Swank, Zoom would be a b!tch to Dormammu's dog, Hulk. Zoom ain't worth jack compared to Dormammu.

Check out the Dr. Strange thread. Zoom's got nothing on Dormammu... Or In-Betweener... Or Shuma Gorath... Or Eternity... Oh, jrod, Strange has 24/7 auto shields on.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=367940&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

People are forgetting that zoon has prep time and know all about marvel earth. and has Cytorrak backing him up

but how would he beat

Sentry, Quasar , CM , PF (a.k.a)(GS)?

Or MM

Other like strange won't have time , and will get K.O'ed

he would probably take most of the heroes down.

But higher cosmic heroes might be able to stop him

Originally posted by Adam Warlock
Check out the Dr. Strange thread. Zoom's got nothing on Dormammu... Or In-Betweener... Or Shuma Gorath... Or Eternity... Oh, jrod, Strange has 24/7 auto shields on.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=367940&perpage=20&pagenumber=1
he beats them using magic that is opposite to that force , and there is it's always some big plot hole.

Originally posted by Adam Warlock
Oh, jrod, Strange has 24/7 auto shields on.

No sir, he doesnt.

Originally posted by jrodslam
No sir, he doesnt.
Go to http://neilalien.com, scroll down until you see "Dr. Strange's invisible passive automatic shields of everlasting enchantment"

I proved that point so hard that a damn Strange website has quoted me.

Originally posted by long pig
Go to http://neilalien.com, scroll down until you see "Dr. Strange's invisible passive automatic shields of everlasting enchantment"

I proved that point so hard that a damn Strange website has quoted me.

Link is dead. Either way, regardless of what a site says, its something else in the comics. And its not 24/7.

http://neilalien.com/

No, there is proof if you go look. They are 24/7

Originally posted by long pig
http://neilalien.com/

No, there is proof if you go look. They are 24/7

Proof? He gets blasted and is stunned and on the floor. If you say 24/7 shields are up, then fine so is everyhero. Its up 24/7, but hes still stunned after a blast. Or knocked out from a punch.

Plus, you say its 24/7. Thats not the case. The shield will go up or is supposed to go up when hes about to get struck or blasted. Much like a GL's shield. If it has to go up, then its not on 24/7 as you mnake it seem.

http://img420.imageshack.us/img420/6136/strangesautoshields14ta.th.jpg
http://img420.imageshack.us/img420/5810/strangesautoshields26mt.th.jpg

"Strange had no time for defence!"

What in gods name was Surfer talking about. Doesnt he know that Strange has defences up 24/7?

He's got shields up at all times, you don't seem to understand. He's got a human body, but takes hits from Hulk/Jugs and shakes it off.

How? Because he's got enchantment shields 24/7, if he sees a threat and thinks he needs a stronger shield, he has to throw it up.

But, his auto shields are always up, otherwise he'd be dead from 99% of the damage he takes.

I mean, there's a website about it, and scans proving it, yet you don't comprehend.

http://img398.imageshack.us/img398/6549/autoshield2xz.th.jpg

"The invisible shield of everlasting enchantment absorbed most of the blast,"

Strange is hit by something that "no conceivable power of science could resist the destructive power." Strange against remarks about his everlasting autoshields.
http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/7464/autoshield27wo.th.jpg

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/3083/jug5wr.th.jpg
Should have snapped his spine, but didn't.

Why? Auto shields.

What's this? Strange being surprised by an attack? Wow, I wonder what that the arrow is bouncing off of?
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/5749/deathurgedr6gr.th.jpg
Ah, auto shields.

Taking a punch from an angry Hulk? How?
http://img446.imageshack.us/img446/5229/hulk1hw.th.jpg

Ahhh, I realize now, it's auto shields.

Originally posted by long pig
What's this? Strange being surprised by an attack? Wow, I wonder what that the arrow is bouncing off of?
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/5749/deathurgedr6gr.th.jpg
Ah, auto shields.
that F#@cker tried to kill Surfer.

Strange doesn't always have the auto shield.

i think it's like the Gl's autoshild

Bullshit used sometimes but if you read most of the comics it doesn't work

Being hit with an attack that K.O's the Silver Surfer? And he survives? How? Me no undtertantsd
http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9820/ss5gb.th.jpg

Ah, auto shields.

Originally posted by kgkg
that F#@cker tried to kill Surfer.

Strange doesn't always have the auto shield.

i think it's like the Gl's autoshild

Bullshit used sometimes but if you read most of the comics it doesn't work

Deathurge would easily kill surfer. The Watchers are afraid of his arrows.

Nah, they're there. Strange with them has a very high durability. They can be broken of course, but being human, anything helps.

He's never defensless.

Originally posted by long pig
He's got shields up at all times, you don't seem to understand. He's got a human body, but takes hits from Hulk/Jugs and shakes it off.

So is DD, yet he took hits from Namor, Diamond form Absorbing Man, and a Angry Spiderman, and shakes it off. Does he have shielding too? If the blows were intnded to kill, many many heroes would be dead. Its something called PIS.

Originally posted by long pig
What's this? Strange being surprised by an attack? Wow, I wonder what that the arrow is bouncing off of?
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/5749/deathurgedr6gr.th.jpg
Ah, auto shields.

Thats a nice example of a shield going up.

Originally posted by long pig
Taking a punch from an angry Hulk? How?
http://img446.imageshack.us/img446/5229/hulk1hw.th.jpg

Ahhh, I realize now, it's auto shields.

Was Hulk trying to kill him? Highly doubt it. Hulk wasnt trying to kill him here either. I guess the so called auto sheild are selective in when they want to go up huh? Go figure.

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/4595/strangesautoshield38ah.th.jpg

Originally posted by long pig
Being hit with an attack that K.O's the Silver Surfer? And he survives? How? Me no undtertantsd
http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9820/ss5gb.th.jpg

Ah, auto shields.
say what

keep reading Someone else hits Surfer

and in caption it says: Strange and SS were downed for a moment.

none were k.o'ed as you will see both of them fine.

what does Strange say there?

"Quickly, I must erect a mystic shield!"

Tooo late. Auto shields huh?

What are you, slow?

That would KILL a normal human. It obviously didn't kill Strange. Why? Ahh, autoshields.

Originally posted by long pig
Deathurge would easily kill surfer. The Watchers are afraid of his arrows.

Nah, they're there. Strange with them has a very high durability. They can be broken of course, but being human, anything helps.

He's never defensless.
Deathurge already lost to SS

Originally posted by kgkg
say what

keep reading Someone else hits Surfer

and in caption it says: Strange and SS were downed for a moment.

none were k.o'ed as you will see both of them fine.
Even better.

Originally posted by jrodslam
what does Strange say there?

"Quickly, I must erect a mystic shield!"

Tooo late. Auto shields huh?
Enchanted Shields are automatically up 24/7. Shields of seph' have to be conjured.

Is this really that hard?

Originally posted by long pig
Being hit with an attack that K.O's the Silver Surfer? And he survives? How? Me no undtertantsd
http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/9820/ss5gb.th.jpg

Ah, auto shields.

Haha! LP That attacked ko'd Strange too. Plus Surfer go hit right after the hit from Absorbing man. They were all meant to survive. Was that attack supposed to kill Strange? No it wasnt. The scan you posted proves my point even further. No auto shield went up. Stranges ass was ko'd.

Originally posted by kgkg
Deathurge already lost to SS
Did his arrows ever touch Surfer?

They supposedly kill anything/everything. Even cosmic types.

Originally posted by long pig
Did his arrows ever touch Surfer?

They supposedly kill anything/everything. Even cosmic types.
the battle went something like this.

SS use his power cosmic. ------------- guy just laughs at it
death ------- arrows -------- SS uses faster than light speed

SS gets pissed speedblitz his ass.

end of story

Originally posted by jrodslam
Haha! LP That attacked ko'd Strange too. Plus Surfer go hit right after the hit from Absorbing man. They were all meant to survive. Was that attack supposed to kill Strange? No it wasnt. The scan you posted proves my point even further. No auto shield went up. Stranges ass was ko'd.
You don't have a point, how can you? You don't understand the topic.

Strange=Human
Human body=Frail
Strange's body=Taking hits that would turn any human into stains i.e Hulk/Surfer attacks.

How? Ah, auto shields.

Originally posted by kgkg
the battle went something like this.

SS use his power cosmic. ------------- guy just laughs at it
death ------- arrows -------- SS uses faster than light speed

SS gets pissed speedblitz his ass.

end of story
The point was that his shields blocked attacks that other cosmic types would rather not take.

Has either one of you ever read a Strange comic? Not a app in spiderman or Defenders, but a solo Strange comic?

Originally posted by long pig
The point was that his shields blocked attacks that other cosmic types would rather not take.
I was just defending SS

When you said that guy would punk SS.

But SS punked him

man how many time have you seem Strange suck up to Surfer?

as for autoshield i beileve he has some sort of Strong defence you can call it shield or whatever , that protects him to some degree. ( but not like the ones your thinking protect him from everything)

i beilve it gives him a lot more resistance to attack ( at cosmic level)

if not Strange whould have been dead already. because he has been hit too many times by cosmic forces.

Originally posted by kgkg
I was just defending SS

When you said that guy would punk SS.

But SS punked him

man how many time have you seem Strange suck up to Surfer?

as for autoshield i beileve he has some sort of Strong defence you can call it shield or whatever , that protects him to some degree. ( but not like the ones your thinking protect him from everything)

i beilve it gives him a lot more resistance to attack ( at cosmic level)

if not Strange whould have been dead already. because he has been hit too many times by cosmic forces.

It's kind of silly to think he DOESN'T have enchantments 24/7 if you've ever read about him.

I never said it'd take all the damage, I even posted pics of him being K'O'd by Creel. The reason was to show durability that isn't the norm.

A normal human would die in space, Strange doesn't, hell, he talks in space.

The point is, Strange has a high durability, not perfect or unbreakable, but never defenseless.

Ahh good ol auto shields.

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/4733/strangesautoshields47ki.th.jpg

Originally posted by long pig
It's kind of silly to think he DOESN'T have enchantments 24/7 if you've ever read about him.

I never said it'd take all the damage, I even posted pics of him being K'O'd by Creel. The reason was to show durability that isn't the norm.

A normal human would die in space, Strange doesn't, hell, he talks in space.

The point is, Strange has a high durability, not perfect or unbreakable, but never defenseless. i agree

Originally posted by kgkg
as for autoshield i beileve he has some sort of Strong defence you can call it shield or whatever , that protects him to some degree. ( but not like the ones your thinking protect him from everything)

i beilve it gives him a lot more resistance to attack ( at cosmic level)

if not Strange whould have been dead already. because he has been hit too many times by cosmic forces.

Thats what im saying to a degree. It doesnt protecting from getting ko'd on many occasions. thats why its not 24/7.

Gl's are also supposed to have 24/7 auto shields, but thats mainly for life threatening attacks. Gls have also been ko'd on occasions.

Originally posted by jrodslam
Ahh good ol auto shields.

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/4733/strangesautoshields47ki.th.jpg
Ah, good ol' reading comprehension.

Originally posted by long pig
I never said it'd take all the damage, I even posted pics of him being K'O'd by Creel. The reason was to show durability that isn't the norm.

When hit from Creel, it was supposed to knock him out. It did its job. True hes withstood more devastating attacks before, but that just shows that its kinda selective.

Originally posted by long pig
A normal human would die in space, Strange doesn't, hell, he talks in space.

Via enchantment. I understand that. No arguement there.

Originally posted by long pig
The point is, Strange has a high durability, not perfect or unbreakable, but never defenseless.

Hes been caught off guard before and knocked out. If that can happen then hed be defenseless, yes? Defenseless to protect himself. One would be naive to think otherwise. Or blind.

Originally posted by kgkg
I was just defending SS

When you said that guy would punk SS.

But SS punked him

man how many time have you seem Strange suck up to Surfer?

as for autoshield i beileve he has some sort of Strong defence you can call it shield or whatever , that protects him to some degree. ( but not like the ones your thinking protect him from everything)

i beilve it gives him a lot more resistance to attack ( at cosmic level)

if not Strange whould have been dead already. because he has been hit too many times by cosmic forces.
You know Surfer got K.O'd by one hit from Karnak, right?

Originally posted by jrodslam
When hit from Creel, it was supposed to knock him out. It did its job. True hes withstood more devastating attacks before, but that just shows that its kinda selective.



Via enchantment. I understand that. No arguement there.



Hes been caught off guard before and knocked out. If that can happen then hed be defenseless, yes? Defenseless to protect himself. One would be naive to think otherwise. Or blind.
No.

Defenseless means no defence, Strange's autoshields are his first defence, therefore he isn't Defenseless.

123

Even when Strange is K.O'd by say Absorbing Man or Hulk, he wasn't Defenseless, it's just his defenses weren't strong enough to make him invulnerable, but they ARE strong enough to keep him from dying.

Originally posted by long pig
You know Surfer got K.O'd by one hit from Karnak, right?
what issue?

i mean people think getting hit is K.o'ed

Shit, hold on.

Karnak owns.
http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/6588/surf7rw.th.jpg

Hah...
http://img374.imageshack.us/img374/2873/surf27cx.th.jpg

Originally posted by long pig
No.

Defenseless means no defence, Strange's autoshields are his first defence, therefore he isn't Defenseless.

LP, i agree that his auto shield are his first defense. However if hes taken by surprise, hes not able to put them up. If hes ko'd by surprise because he doesnt have enough time to put up a shield, then guess what? Hes defenseless.

Originally posted by long pig
Even when Strange is K.O'd by say Absorbing Man or Hulk, he wasn't Defenseless, it's just his defenses weren't strong enough to make him invulnerable, but they ARE strong enough to keep him from dying.

Strange wasnt defenseless when he was ko'd by Absorbing Man? He was totaly defenseless. The blow from Creel wasnt meant to kill him, so hed have no reason to die. Just because he wasnt "dead" after getting hit by Creel, you think he had up his auto defenses?

If Strange keeps getting ko'd by mediocre attacks that arent meant to kill him but yet keeps getting ko'd, then why doesnt he just put up stronger shields?

Karnak would **** Strange's shield up too. Whoever described Stranges "auto" defenses like a GL's shields was right ont he money. Writer wants an attack to fail, well hey lookit that his autodefenses just happened to be on. strange needs to get KTFO, oops, auto shields were down that day.

You missed the point completely. He doesn't HAVE to put them up. They are always up. They aren't indestructible, but they do make him tons more durable than a normal human. Do you honestly think a normal human could take a punch/ball & chain to the head from Hulk/Creel and survive?
Hopefully not.


Because no one would want to read about an indestructible hero, people who do, read something crappy. Like Superman.

Originally posted by Khellendros
Karnak would **** Strange's shield up too. Whoever described Stranges "auto" defenses like a GL's shields was right ont he money. Writer wants an attack to fail, well hey lookit that his autodefenses just happened to be on. strange needs to get KTFO, oops, auto shields were down that day.

Karnak gets no love here.

I mean, although that fight looks dumb, Karnak K.O'ing Surfer like that is well within his power.

Originally posted by long pig
You missed the point completely. He doesn't HAVE to put them up. They are always up.

He doesnt HAVE to put them up? They are alwyas up?
1. Strange - "I must quickly erect a mystic shield..." Ko'd
2. Surfer - "Strange had no time for defense..."
3. Absorbing Man - "See, your crummy shield is cracking..."
4. See pattern here?

Originally posted by long pig
Do you honestly think a normal human could take a punch/ball & chain to the head from Hulk/Creel and survive?
Hopefully not.

Daredevil did.

See, you're confusing his enchantment shields for his stronger shields.
His shields that are 24/7 aren't nearly as strong as say Shield of the Seraphim, but they keep him alive. i.e getting his back crunched by Juggernaut/taking a full on punch by Hulk/falling 100ft mid flight/flying faster than sound unaided/surviving in outerspace....etc.

The whole point was to say his durability is way higher than normal human due to his auto shields.


Now you're just being a pisser.

Originally posted by jrodslam
He doesnt HAVE to put them up? They are alwyas up?
1. Strange - "I must quickly erect a mystic shield..." Ko'd
2. Surfer - "Strange had no time for defense..."
3. Absorbing Man - "See, your crummy shield is cracking..."
4. See pattern here?



Daredevil did.
piggy he does have good argument.

jrod don't you think Strange has some sort of resistance to attack? I mean sure he gets hit and yall , but most of the hits should kill them , or defiantly k.o a normal human

Being hit by Juggernaut and Creed says "I've put holes in trailor trucks with that punch, imagine what it'll do to your spine!"

Strange is only winded, Jug then says "You're in better shape than you look".

Originally posted by long pig
Being hit by Juggernaut and Creed says "I've put holes in trailor trucks with that punch, imagine what it'll do to your spine!"

Strange is only winded, Jug then says "You're in better shape than you look".

I think Juggy was just talking s**t.

Originally posted by long pig
See, you're confusing his enchantment shields for his stronger shields.
His shields that are 24/7 aren't nearly as strong as say Shield of the Seraphim, but they keep him alive. i.e getting his back crunched by Juggernaut/taking a full on punch by Hulk/falling 100ft mid flight/flying faster than sound unaided/surviving in outerspace....etc.

The whole point was to say his durability is way higher than normal human due to his auto shields.


Now you're just being a pisser.

Ok ill just say this then im done with this arguement here. True Strange getting hit by Juggs, Creel, should do more than ko him. But thats only if the hit is truly intented to ko him. A 24/7 auto shield to me means that non stop you have a shield up. If you can gett snuck up on and punched by me and get knocked out, then ill call you auto shield garbage.

If an attack is made to kill Strange and hes unaware of it, then i can see a auto shield going up. Just like a GL. Ill post this pic to give something to think about. Good night.

PS. About DD taking the shot from Absorbing Man, LP. It happened. Ill be a pisser.

Take a look.

http://img418.imageshack.us/img418/3048/strangesautoshields51cp.th.jpg

Jug meant to break his back. When they attempt to hit a human with all their 100ton strength, it's meant to kill.


But, the difference between you and the people K.Oing Strange are they are 100ton bricks. You're not. If they can't kill him, you'd be lucky to make him flinch.

Originally posted by long pig
But, the difference between you and the people K.Oing Strange are they are 100ton bricks. You're not. If they can't kill him, you'd be lucky to make him flinch.

Did you see the scan above? They arent 100ton bricks. they are regular people, mind controled. Strange was caught by surprise then was ko'd.

You just proved my point. Strange says "He's protected against my sorcery by some sort of psychic aura". Meaning, he was able to bypass Strange's auto shields BECAUSE of the psychic aura. Strange's magic(His auto shields) got nulled.

Now, I shot that down easily enough, why didn't Hulk/Jug/Creel/Dormmamu/Mindless Ones just squish him?

Ah, Auto shields.

Originally posted by long pig
You just proved my point. Strange says "He's protected against my sorcery by some sort of psychic aura". Meaning, he was able to bypass Strange's auto shields BECAUSE of the psychic aura. Strange's magic(His auto shields) got nulled.

Now, I shot that down easily enough, why didn't Hulk/Jug/Creel just squish him?

No no LP. The person Strange was blasting was the mage who mind controlled everyone. "He" is the bad guy that Strange was trying to attack.

The people who jumped him wer regular mind controlled citizens. Sorry LP nice try.

Why didnt Hulk, Juggy, Creed squish him? If they tried to after he was ko'd they would have. However that wasnt the objective.

Originally posted by jrodslam
Ok ill just say this then im done with this arguement here. True Strange getting hit by Juggs, Creel, should do more than ko him. But thats only if the hit is truly intented to ko him. A 24/7 auto shield to me means that non stop you have a shield up. If you can gett snuck up on and punched by me and get knocked out, then ill call you auto shield garbage.

If an attack is made to kill Strange and hes unaware of it, then i can see a auto shield going up. Just like a GL. Ill post this pic to give something to think about. Good night.

PS. About DD taking the shot from Absorbing Man, LP. It happened. Ill be a pisser.

Take a look.

http://img418.imageshack.us/img418/3048/strangesautoshields51cp.th.jpg
Weren’t you using the same arguments for Hal Jordan’s auto shield?

Originally posted by jrodslam
No no LP. The person Strange was blasting was the mage who mind controlled everyone. "He" is the bad guy that Strange was trying to attack.

The people who jumped him wer regular mind controlled citizens.
Again, these Defender comics.....

Have you ever read an actual Strange comic?

Originally posted by long pig
Again, these Defender comics.....

Have you ever read an actual Strange comic?

Havent read a Strange comic in years.

So who cares if they are Defenders comics. Im proving my points.

He's downplayed in every comic he's in other than his own. Same with Surfer.

Reading the Defenders, no wonder you always argue that he's weak. He IS weak there, as is the Surfer.

In their own comic, it's far different.

That's why most people shouldn't talk until they get information from more than one source.

Originally posted by long pig
He's downplayed in every comic he's in other than his own. Same with Surfer.

Reading the Defenders, no wonder you always argue that he's weak. He IS weak there, as is the Surfer.

In their own comic, it's far different.

That's why most people shouldn't talk until they get information from more than one source.

1 thing. Please dont put words in my mouth. Ive never stated that Strange was/is weak.

And regardless of its his own series or not, with the many Defenders sources i do have, i can make the statements i make. Even if i did own many Strange comics, i still wouldnt say he has shields up 24/7. Just for what my Defenders comics show.

You argued in favor of Zatanna against him, that'd make him no more than streetlevel.

I just checked his durability stats at marvel.com and he's considered enhanced-human. Daredevil is normal.

Originally posted by long pig
You argued in favor of Zatanna against him, that'd make him no more than streetlevel.

I just checked his durability stats at marvel.com and he's considered enhanced-human. Daredevil is normal.

I argued in Zatannas favor. So? Are yousaying that Zatanna can only beat street level opponents? That shows your ignorance there alone. With that i merely said it could go either way. Depending on what spell Zatanna was able to get off or vise versa.

His durability stats from Marvel that gives him a 3, isbecause of his so called 24/7 shielding or just because they decided to give him a 3? Electra has a 3 as well as Shadowcat. Even Spiderman who Daredevil ko'd. Whats your point?

Daredevil has a 2, yet was still able to take punches from Namor and Creel and shrug them off.

Originally posted by kgkg
Weren’t you using the same arguments for Hal Jordan’s auto shield?

Here, Hal Jordan's auto-shield:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v345/sifu1/4d776def.jpg

DC's fake looking Thor takes Hal, Batgod trips up Thor.

Auto-Shields? Sure Jrod.

Originally posted by Adam Warlock
Here, Hal Jordan's auto-shield:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v345/sifu1/4d776def.jpg

DC's fake looking Thor takes Hal, Batgod trips up Thor.

Auto-Shields? Sure Jrod.

Ok and if you can read back I said that Stranges shields are much like a GL's. They are auto for any type of life threatening attacks. Otherwise, they are open for knock out as well. Thank you for posting that scan and helping me prove my point.

Auto shields here however.

http://img424.imageshack.us/img424/8131/b75d772c0ra.th.jpg
http://img424.imageshack.us/img424/4586/6254e4b23vh.th.jpg

Originally posted by Swanky-Tuna
He doesn't seem to be defending very well in that scan.

He got out of it, didn't he?