Marvel Women vs Wonder Woman

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LethalFemme
Can Diana win?



Wonder Woman

vs

Rogue(current)

Invisible Woman

Psylocke(current)

Emma Frost

Storm

She Hulk

Sage

Elektra

Metalmanx
Oooo...tough one. I don't really know actually.

spetznaz
Originally posted by LethalFemme
Can Diana win?



Wonder Woman

vs

Rogue(current)

Invisible Woman

Psylocke(current)

Emma Frost

Storm

She Hulk

Sage

Elektra

Nice one sis.

The winner would depend on how WonderWoman was written. IF written as totally taking advantage of ALL of her skills and abilities, and being totally brutal, then she would win (and most of the people on the Marvel team, eg Elektra, Storm etc etc ...even Rogue) wouldn't even be of the slightest threat if WonderWoman was going all out. She'd be moving so fast for one they couldn't even see her. She'd take them all out easily.
Now the interesting questions would be the telepaths (Emma and Sage ....and it would have to do with their telepathic skills, thus if Emma turned into her diamond form that would be foolish since to WonderWoman that would be basically like stiff cardboard. They would have to hit her mind with theirs). However would that be enough?

The question is do they pack the octane to take down a super-fast almost-superman-strong Amazon warrior-goddess streaking at them faster than the eye can see ......and more importantly do they feel lucky?
To be honest with you this battle depends on those 2 ladies, and I'd still give it to WonderWoman.



p.s: Now to wait and see how long it takes before someone states that all that needs to happen is for the Invisible Woman to plant an expanding bubble in WonderWoman's bosom .....or was it brain?

Conclusion: Let me put it this way ....if I had a choice of having one protect me from the other (i.e have the Marvel team protecting me from an enraged WonderWoman, or have an enraged WonderWoman protecting me from a determined Marvel team) ....well, I'd rather NOT have an enraged WonderWoman coming after me.
The only reason she doesn't seem that mighty is because the JLA is filled with people who can either shift small planets with might alone, have access to rings and magical hands made of water that can do all sorts of nifty things, or can come up with stratagems to stop Darkseid while driving around in a rocket-powered car. WonderWoman is actually one of the more powerful JLAers out there, and if written to her utmost even Superman would have problems stopping her.

This team wouldn't have a prime chance against a truly determined WonderWoman.

However she could also be written whereby Psylocke tags her with her psychic sword ......which really shouldn't happen, but a writer could easily have Storm beating Wonderwoman with lightning (of all things), or have Wolverine beating Lobo, or have ......wait a minute .....I believe there was some silly cross-over (where fans ....or I should say Fanboys) voted, and thus Storm won WW, and Lobo got defeated by Wolvie!

Thus the impossible can occur with the speed it takes for a penciler to draw and an inker to paint, for words to be added, and the printing mill to start churning out next month's copy.
Thus you could see Elektra by herself taking out Martian Manhunter, Superman, and WonderWoman with only her sais , dried toast, and an hour old mocha latte!

However, in this case, Wonderwoman SHOULD thrash the Marvel team.

BobbyD
Spetz, you have identified the only possible way the Marvel girls could take this. I agree.

WW 9-9.5/10?

GalacticStorm
I actually think that the Marvel women take this more times than not. It depends on the environment there fighting in, the distance they start apart etc. Once thats specified then i'll say a bit more.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I actually think that the Marvel women take this more times than not. It depends on the environment there fighting in, the distance they start apart etc. Once thats specified then i'll say a bit more.

Are you serious? She might as well be the Flash attacking them with super strength.

The only one who MIGHT stand a chance is Emma. And that's a giant maybe.

DarkCrawler
Since Storm can resist telepathic attacks because of her willpower, Emma should be walk in the park for Wonder Woman whose willpower is at least ten times of that of Storm...

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Are you serious? She might as well be the Flash attacking them with super strength.

The only one who MIGHT stand a chance is Emma. And that's a giant maybe.

WW can fly at Mach 7 but she doesnt fly anywhere near that speed in earth like atmospheres. Thats why the outcome depends on the environment and the distance apart they start from each other.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Draco69
So far she (WW) has immunities to such:

Fire/Heat
Ice/Cold
Poison/Radiaton
Magic
Absorption
Telepathy

Metalmanx
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
WW can fly at Mach 7 but she doesnt fly anywhere near that speed in earth like atmospheres. Thats why the outcome depends on the environment and the distance apart they start from each other.

That's strange. I remember Wonder Woman easily keeping up with a speeding (though not top speed) Jessie Quick.

I'd wager that's just A BIT faster than Mach 7.

So you think that Quicksilver can run faster than Wonder Woman can fly?

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Since Storm can resist telepathic attacks because of her willpower, Emma should be walk in the park for Wonder Woman whose willpower is at least ten times of that of Storm...

Thats speculation about how Storms willpower compares to WW as its hardly something that can be measured. Also its not just down to willpower why Storm is so good at resisting tp attacks. Its also because of the nature of her powers. She wields energies of the electromagnetic spectrum which in marvel at least means problems for telepaths. Your logic is a bit off.

GalacticStorm

GalacticStorm
The outcome of the battle depends on the environment and the distance apart they start from each other.

DarkCrawler
Starnet is canon now?

You should probably ask Draco for the greatest flying speed feat of Wonder Woman?

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Starnet is canon now?

You should probably ask Draco for the greatest flying speed feat of Wonder Woman?

Ive been reading Wonder woman for the last 2 years and have yet to see a speed feat beyond what is stated here.

Until theres evidence that disproves these figures i dont see anything wrong with using them as a guideline.

Theyre better than nothing which is what we had before.

roughrider
She can take all of them, but Rogue and Emma are big question marks. Rogue is psycho-powerful now, having access to all abilities she has ever absorbed; and how can she handle a psychic attack from the ruthless Emma? Invisible Woman, if she can put a forcefield around Diana's head, cutting off her air - but if she is enraged enough she could break through it, overwhelming Sue's willpower.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by roughrider
She can take all of them, but Rogue and Emma are big question marks. Rogue is psycho-powerful now, having access to all abilities she has ever absorbed; and how can she handle a psychic attack from the ruthless Emma? Invisible Woman, if she can put a forcefield around Diana's head, cutting off her air - but if she is enraged enough she could break through it, overwhelming Sue's willpower.

Rogue doesn't have those powers anymore.

Currently she has the powers of Sunfire besides her own absorption powers. Nothing else. Wonder Woman has way enough willpower to resist Emma. And Wonder Woman can hold her breath for hours.

ZephroCarnelian
She has more than enough raw power to take these guys down, yes.

But is she really reeeeaaallllly fast enough IN BATTLE to take on this large team of people?

She's fast, but not Superman fast.

For example - She Hulk is tough. She's basically a green Wonder Woman without the flight or speed. Agreed - she'll go down fairly quickly, but not instantly. It'll be a coupla seconds of punching from WW to keep her down, unless she just ring outs her.

And if she uses up a coupla seconds, maybe even one second, beating up Shulkster - that's enough for the psykers to tag her. Can she combat two psykers attacking her mind at the same time?

If Wonder Woman plays her cards right in this, if she just stuns the tough characters, leaving them to be taken care of at a later stage, then disposing of the psykers very quickly, then she could win this.

She's got the power, but the problem with fighting a team of people is that they're not gonna be standing still whilst you're smacking one of their mates around. And several of the team-mates only need to think to unleash their powers.

Like I said. she's fast. Very fast. But is she fast enough to take out not ONE but SEVERAL people, before either one of them can think??

Because if just ONE of them has a chance to think, it'll at least slow her down slightly. And once she's slowed down... BAAAAMMMM!!! Double psychic whammy with invisible spears, Rogue punches , lightning and SheHulk kicking her in the face.

It's all about the first second of the fight.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Rogue doesn't have those powers anymore.

Currently she has the powers of Sunfire besides her own absorption powers. Nothing else. Wonder Woman has way enough willpower to resist Emma. And Wonder Woman can hold her breath for hours.

Thats speculation DC. Post some scans of WW resisting telepaths.

Also WW may be able to hold her breath for hours but she wouldnt be able to do so whilst being attacked.

DarkCrawler
She can just take out the people with human durability first

Rogue(current)

Invisible Woman

Psylocke(current)

Emma Frost

Storm

Sage

Elektra

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thats speculation DC. Post some scans of WW resisting telepaths.

Also WW may be able to hold her breath for hours but she wouldnt be able to do so whilst being attacked.

Isn't it quite a fact that people with high willpower are able to resist telepaths?

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by ZephroCarnelian
She has more than enough raw power to take these guys down, yes.

But is she really reeeeaaallllly fast enough IN BATTLE to take on this large team of people?

She's fast, but not Superman fast.

For example - She Hulk is tough. She's basically a green Wonder Woman without the flight or speed. Agreed - she'll go down fairly quickly, but not instantly. It'll be a coupla seconds of punching from WW to keep her down, unless she just ring outs her.

And if she uses up a coupla seconds, maybe even one second, beating up Shulkster - that's enough for the psykers to tag her. Can she combat two psykers attacking her mind at the same time?

If Wonder Woman plays her cards right in this, if she just stuns the tough characters, leaving them to be taken care of at a later stage, then disposing of the psykers very quickly, then she could win this.

She's got the power, but the problem with fighting a team of people is that they're not gonna be standing still whilst you're smacking one of their mates around. And several of the team-mates only need to think to unleash their powers.

Like I said. she's fast. Very fast. But is she fast enough to take out not ONE but SEVERAL people, before either one of them can think??

Because if just ONE of them has a chance to think, it'll at least slow her down slightly. And once she's slowed down... BAAAAMMMM!!! Double psychic whammy with invisible spears, Rogue punches , lightning and SheHulk kicking her in the face.

It's all about the first second of the fight.

Precisely.

With a thought Psylocke or IW can shield the more vulnerable team mates. If that happens then WW goes down.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Isn't it quite a fact that people with high willpower are able to resist telepaths?

Post some scans of WW resisting telepathy/mind control to back up your claims or leave it at that.

High willpower equals resistance not an immunity to telepathy. Emma Frost is an extremely powerful an skilled telepath. Fighting her off will take all of WW's concentration she wouldnt be able to put up a decent fight against the others at the same time.

leonidas
i love ww, but i don't think she takes them -- at least not the majority. iw's shield has resisted hulk and thor. ww would need to work to get through it. she may be able to resist the psychic attacks, but they would likely still hurt her or give her pause. a combination attack by shehulk and storm as well as sue would certainly hurt her, probably enough for the group to finish it off. i think sue is the proverbial fly in ww's ointment here.

kgkg
Originally posted by leonidas
i love ww, but i don't think she takes them -- at least not the majority. iw's shield has resisted hulk and thor. ww would need to work to get through it. she may be able to resist the psychic attacks, but they would likely still hurt her or give her pause. a combination attack by shehulk and storm as well as sue would certainly hurt her, probably enough for the group to finish it off. i think sue is the proverbial fly in ww's ointment here. thumb up

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by leonidas
i love ww, but i don't think she takes them -- at least not the majority. iw's shield has resisted hulk and thor. ww would need to work to get through it. she may be able to resist the psychic attacks, but they would likely still hurt her or give her pause. a combination attack by shehulk and storm as well as sue would certainly hurt her, probably enough for the group to finish it off. i think sue is the proverbial fly in ww's ointment here.

What if she takes out Sue first?

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
What if she takes out Sue first?

You still have Psylocke who is an extremely powerful telekinetic. With a thought Sues got a shield up around herself. Yes the speed of thought isnt as fast as the Mach speeds WW capable of but you need to remember that the impulses have to travel centimetres if not milimietres as opposed to the the dozens of feet WW would have to travel so it evens out.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by spetznaz
Nice one sis.

The winner would depend on how WonderWoman was written. IF written as totally taking advantage of ALL of her skills and abilities, and being totally brutal, then she would win (and most of the people on the Marvel team, eg Elektra, Storm etc etc ...even Rogue) wouldn't even be of the slightest threat if WonderWoman was going all out. She'd be moving so fast for one they couldn't even see her. She'd take them all out easily.
Now the interesting questions would be the telepaths (Emma and Sage ....and it would have to do with their telepathic skills, thus if Emma turned into her diamond form that would be foolish since to WonderWoman that would be basically like stiff cardboard. They would have to hit her mind with theirs). However would that be enough?

The question is do they pack the octane to take down a super-fast almost-superman-strong Amazon warrior-goddess streaking at them faster than the eye can see ......and more importantly do they feel lucky?
To be honest with you this battle depends on those 2 ladies, and I'd still give it to WonderWoman.



p.s: Now to wait and see how long it takes before someone states that all that needs to happen is for the Invisible Woman to plant an expanding bubble in WonderWoman's bosom .....or was it brain?

Conclusion: Let me put it this way ....if I had a choice of having one protect me from the other (i.e have the Marvel team protecting me from an enraged WonderWoman, or have an enraged WonderWoman protecting me from a determined Marvel team) ....well, I'd rather NOT have an enraged WonderWoman coming after me.
The only reason she doesn't seem that mighty is because the JLA is filled with people who can either shift small planets with might alone, have access to rings and magical hands made of water that can do all sorts of nifty things, or can come up with stratagems to stop Darkseid while driving around in a rocket-powered car. WonderWoman is actually one of the more powerful JLAers out there, and if written to her utmost even Superman would have problems stopping her.

This team wouldn't have a prime chance against a truly determined WonderWoman.

However she could also be written whereby Psylocke tags her with her psychic sword ......which really shouldn't happen, but a writer could easily have Storm beating Wonderwoman with lightning (of all things), or have Wolverine beating Lobo, or have ......wait a minute .....I believe there was some silly cross-over (where fans ....or I should say Fanboys) voted, and thus Storm won WW, and Lobo got defeated by Wolvie!

Thus the impossible can occur with the speed it takes for a penciler to draw and an inker to paint, for words to be added, and the printing mill to start churning out next month's copy.
Thus you could see Elektra by herself taking out Martian Manhunter, Superman, and WonderWoman with only her sais , dried toast, and an hour old mocha latte!

However, in this case, Wonderwoman SHOULD thrash the Marvel team.




Aw I'm your sis big grin

LethalFemme

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by LethalFemme
Basically all I read was Wonder Woman holds back?

Until those presumptions translate into on panel feats then we cant really use them in debate. Its just speculation.

LethalFemme
I assume you're correct

Draco where are you when I need you....

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by LethalFemme
I assume you're correct

Draco where are you when I need you....

He'll know. WW's his b*tch!! wink

LethalFemme
Isn't that the pot calling the kettle black? stick out tongue laughing out loud

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by LethalFemme
Isn't that the pot calling the kettle black? stick out tongue laughing out loud

I guess you could say that. wink

kgkg
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Post some scans of WW resisting telepathy/mind control to back up your claims or leave it at that.

High willpower equals resistance not an immunity to telepathy. Emma Frost is an extremely powerful an skilled telepath. Fighting her off will take all of WW's concentration she wouldnt be able to put up a decent fight against the others at the same time.
yep perfect example is Hector Hammound

LethalFemme
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I guess you could say that. wink

I can definitely say that...... stick out tongue wink

LethalFemme
Originally posted by kgkg
yep perfect example is Hector Hammound

For those who may not know what happened with Mr. Hammond the mindf**king emperor of half a galaxy please explain kgkg........

Metalmanx

LethalFemme
Me to MM but GS...................

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Metalmanx
What I was asking is if you believe Wonder Woman cannot run nor fly faster than Quicksilver? Because I have seen scans where Wonder Woman is keeping up with Jessie Quick, and they're both going extremely fast.

Quicksilver can run in upwards of Mach 10 so far, so that would make him faster than her? Just seems kinda farfetched to me. I've always seen or believed Wonder Woman to be quite fast, like below Superman Speed.

Those speeds are still really fast. This bio is a few years old so hopefully Draco will be able to clarify her speed even further. Until then all we have is this bio. Ive been reading WW for 2 years now and i havent seen anything from her to suggest the bio isnt true. confused

Tony Stark
Originally posted by leonidas
i love ww, but i don't think she takes them -- at least not the majority. iw's shield has resisted hulk and thor. ww would need to work to get through it. she may be able to resist the psychic attacks, but they would likely still hurt her or give her pause. a combination attack by shehulk and storm as well as sue would certainly hurt her, probably enough for the group to finish it off. i think sue is the proverbial fly in ww's ointment here.


wink


You are correct...


WW is going down too many... too powerful...

DarkCrawler
From Wonder Woman respect thread...

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=362733&highlight=Respect+Wonder+woman

http://img34.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img34&image=JLA43pg09.jpg

She did catch Jesse Quick with her lasso:

http://img199.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img199&image=wwropesjessie19hj.jpg
http://img199.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img199&image=wwropesjessie25fd.jpg
http://img199.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img199&image=wwropesjessie35ra.jpg

-

http://img163.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jla43pg078pu.jpg

Metalmanx
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
From Wonder Woman respect thread...

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=362733&highlight=Respect+Wonder+woman

http://img34.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img34&image=JLA43pg09.jpg

She did catch Jesse Quick with her lasso:

http://img199.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img199&image=wwropesjessie19hj.jpg
http://img199.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img199&image=wwropesjessie25fd.jpg
http://img199.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img199&image=wwropesjessie35ra.jpg

-

http://img163.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jla43pg078pu.jpg

Thanks, DarkCrawler. Those were some of the scans I was talking about.

Wonder Woman can take out all of them before any thoughts are processed.

leonidas
those lightspeed scans were in space. the scan where she's racing flash they weren't moving very quickly, relatively speaking. probably around quicksilver speed.

doesn't rogue have superspeed a la quicksilver? based on what i've seen of ww on earth, that would be enough speed to avoid her. if she DID take sue out first (a possibility no doubt seeing as how quicksilver gave the ff some trouble in the past) the time it took would still give the others a chance to attack. the psy attacks would slow her down, the others would pile on. even all together there is no guarantee they win, but i think they win the majority. shulkie is in herc's class (apparently) and the others are very powerful.

besides, (no offense mm) speedblitzes are so utterly ridiculous and unrealistic -- she would never in a million issues use an attack that would wipe them all out before they could 'think'. i WISH the mods would install a 'no speedblitz' rule in this forum. make debates a lot better.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by leonidas
those lightspeed scans were in space. the scan where she's racing flash they weren't moving very quickly, relatively speaking. probably around quicksilver speed.

doesn't rogue have superspeed a la quicksilver? based on what i've seen of ww on earth, that would be enough speed to avoid her. if she DID take sue out first (a possibility no doubt seeing as how quicksilver gave the ff some trouble in the past) the time it took would still give the others a chance to attack. the psy attacks would slow her down, the others would pile on. even all together there is no guarantee they win, but i think they win the majority. shulkie is in herc's class (apparently) and the others are very powerful.

besides, (no offense mm) speedblitzes are so utterly ridiculous and unrealistic -- she would never in a million issues use an attack that would wipe them all out before they could 'think'. i WISH the mods would install a 'no speedblitz' rule in this forum. make debates a lot better.

Believe me, I hate the speedblitz, too. But while it's an option, well, I guess it should be used until a mod decides not to.

Like Flash, for example. He's my favorite DC character, but you can't put him up against anyone who's slower than him or doesn't have the necessary durability to withstand him.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Believe me, I hate the speedblitz, too. But while it's an option, well, I guess it should be used until a mod decides not to.

Like Flash, for example. He's my favorite DC character, but you can't put him up against anyone who's slower than him or doesn't have the necessary durability to withstand him.


So are bubbles in the brain, heart and lungs from IW... But most of the DC and X-lovers act as if it's laughable tactic.

She has used it in the past... So she can... and will use it again.

Like it or not.

Draco69
Originally posted by Tony Stark
So are bubbles in the brain, heart and lungs from IW... But most of the DC and X-lovers act as if it's laughable tactic.

She has used it in the past... So she can... and will use it again.

Like it or not.

Won't work. Her insides are as tough as her outsides. Not to mention WW will be moving WAY too fast for IW to get a decent bead on her. The last one standing WILL be IW though.

leonidas
whose powers does current rogue have the opportunity to call upon?

Draco69

Draco69
Originally posted by leonidas
whose powers does current rogue have the opportunity to call upon?

Sunfire. That'll help alot. laughing

LethalFemme
Thanks Draco for setting the record straight WW kicks a**

Superherovandal
I thought that WW was immune to telepathy? Draco isn't that true?

Draco69
Yes. Apparently everyone has forgotten in a space of only three days...

no

LethalFemme
I knew that that's why I put in Psylocke and Emma so you could prove them wrong.........

leonidas
<<Sunfire. That'll help alot. >>

SUNFIRE!!??
blink

i thought someone claimed she could now call upon the powers of all those she had absorbed in the past?? what the -- ??

LethalFemme
WW wins and so fast it isn't even funny and if Emma or Psylocke attempt to use their tp it'll backlash on them.

xmarksthespot
A speedblitz isn't just about speed it's about reflexes and reaction time. No one on the list even comes close. Sage is probably the best bet to even be able to react due to her cyberpathic mind and complete control of her movements. Even at Mach 3 Wonder Woman would be moving at over 1000 m/s. A speedblitz should take down everybody with human durability before they even have time to react.

Metalmanx
Exactly.

LethalFemme
yep

Juntai
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thats speculation DC. Post some scans of WW resisting telepaths.

Also WW may be able to hold her breath for hours but she wouldnt be able to do so whilst being attacked. She resisted Max Lord in Sacrifice Concludes, and said it was impossible for him to attack her in this manner, since bla bla Gods.. bla bla Truth.
Wonder Woman 219, right before she fights Superman.

Don't know if anyone else gave you a decent answer yet, GS, so I figured I would.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by Draco69
Won't work. Her insides are as tough as her outsides. Not to mention WW will be moving WAY too fast for IW to get a decent bead on her. The last one standing WILL be IW though.





laughing




So now your saying that Sue can't enlarge a force field inside of WW because her insides are to strong...




laughing




And all sue needs to do is see WW to do any of those things...

WW doesn't move that fast...




WW is dead if Sue wants her to be...

LethalFemme
Please don't post in my threads............... evil face laughing out loud

Metalmanx
Originally posted by Tony Stark
laughing




So now your saying that Sue can't enlarge a force field inside of WW because her insides are to strong...




laughing




And all sue needs to do is see WW to do any of those things...

WW doesn't move that fast...




WW is dead if Sue wants her to be...

WW doesn't move that fast?

http://img67.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img67&image=WWplusJQ1.jpg
http://img67.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img67&image=WWplusJQ2.jpg

http://img199.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img199&image=wwropesjessie35ra.jpg
http://img195.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img195&image=wwropesjessie44oa.jpg
http://img168.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img168&image=wwropesjessie75ac.jpg

You're right. Wonder Woman is far too slow to handle this team.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Metalmanx
WW doesn't move that fast?

http://img67.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img67&image=WWplusJQ1.jpg
http://img67.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img67&image=WWplusJQ2.jpg

http://img199.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img199&image=wwropesjessie35ra.jpg
http://img195.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img195&image=wwropesjessie44oa.jpg
http://img168.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img168&image=wwropesjessie75ac.jpg

You're right. Wonder Woman is far too slow to handle this team.

I'm pretty sure he says what he says to be annoying..........so it's probably best to ignore his opinion.....

Tony Stark
Originally posted by LethalFemme
I'm pretty sure he says what he says to be annoying..........so it's probably best to ignore his opinion.....




roll eyes (sarcastic)


Who's opinion should be ignored...?


Have you ever heard of reverse-sexism... Thats how most all of your posts read when a woman is a characters in the threads.


The woman characters don't get enough respect...

Not true...

It's not that the women characters don't get the respect that they're do...

They do...

It's just that alot of the women characters are crap...

Not that they don't have the potental to be great characters some of them that is...

It's that Marvel and DC don't put forth the effort to make them better because the readers aren't there for them in comparison to the male characters.

In that same breath there are some very good woman characters too...

But most of your posts when there is a woman character in the thread is like your just sticking up for the woman character just because your a woman also... And a us chicks need to stick together thing...

It ends up being blah...blah...blah...

And to my comment about WW not being that fast...

I'm saying she is not faster than what the human eye can see... She's not Flash or Gladiator... not even close.

So that being said if Sue can see her she can kill her if she wants to...

And with the other gals from Marvel in the fight too she will be standing still at some point during the fight...

Because she will be knocked on her ass more than once...

WW is dead...


ps. If you want women characters to get more respect in the comic world tell more of your friends (girls) to buy and read comics maybe Marvel/DC will try a little harder with them.

Metalmanx
...Did you not even click the links I countered you with, Tony?

Clearly not.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Tony Stark
roll eyes (sarcastic)


Who's opinion should be ignored...?


Have you ever heard of reverse-sexism... Thats how most all of your posts read when a woman is a characters in the threads.


The woman characters don't get enough respect...

Not true...

It's not that the women characters don't get the respect that they're do...

They do...

It's just that alot of the women characters are crap...

Not that they don't have the potental to be great characters some of them that is...

It's that Marvel and DC don't put forth the effort to make them better because the readers aren't there for them in comparison to the male characters.

In that same breath there are some very good woman characters too...

But most of your posts when there is a woman character in the thread is like your just sticking up for the woman character just because your a woman also... And a us chicks need to stick together thing...

It ends up being blah...blah...blah...

And to my comment about WW not being that fast...

I'm saying she is not faster than what the human eye can see... She's not Flash or Gladiator... not even close.

So that being said if Sue can see her she can kill her if she wants to...

And with the other gals from Marvel in the fight too she will be standing still at some point during the fight...

Because she will be knocked on her ass more than once...

WW is dead...


ps. If you want women characters to get more respect in the comic world tell more of your friends (girls) to buy and read comics maybe Marvel/DC will try a little harder with them.


All the people in this are women and I only complain about WW needing more respect when she's in threads people seem to completely forget her feats and strengths because she is a woman.............and it's already been posted why WW would win this so maybe YOU should read a little more carefully and not get overwhelmed or excited when it comes to replying when more than one character or the Thing is involved.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by LethalFemme
All the people in this are women and I only complain about WW needing more respect when she's in threads people seem to completely forget her feats and strengths because she is a woman.............and it's already been posted why WW would win this so maybe YOU should read a little more carefully and not get overwhelmed or excited when it comes to replying when more than one character or the Thing is involved.


You mean that someones OPINION has been posted on why WW would win.

Just like mine and some others OPINION is that she would lose and or die...

That must mean that both parties are right because it's been posted right?

rolling on floor laughing

And ooooooooooooo... yyyyyyyyyyaaaaaaaaaaa... I'm tooooooo excited to think and type at the same time.

By the way WW still dies... And your still touching yourself...

Wonder if theres any correlation?


Happy Dance

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Tony Stark
You mean that someones OPINION has been posted on why WW would win.

Just like mine and some others OPINION is that she would lose and or die...

That must mean that both parties are right because it's been posted right?

rolling on floor laughing

And ooooooooooooo... yyyyyyyyyyaaaaaaaaaaa... I'm tooooooo excited to think and type at the same time.

By the way WW still dies... And your still touching yourself...

Wonder if theres any correlation?


Happy Dance


guy you have like zero cred cause you're the same person who said WW would have a hard time with the stupid Thing roll eyes (sarcastic)

and please explain just exactly how she would die.

Mindship

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Mindship
Mathematical correction: all those "miles per seconds" figures noted above are really Miles Per Minute (kindly do the math). I've seen this error many times on quite a few sites and posts. If you wanna know her "mps" speeds, divide by another 60 (eg: Mach 10 equals 7000 mph equals 116 miles per minute equals 1.9 miles per second).

Which just goes to prove that WW is indeed fast enough to beat all of them before they knew how to react.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by LethalFemme
Which just goes to prove that WW is indeed fast enough to beat all of them before they knew how to react.

Not necessarily. The outcome depends on the environment and how far apart they start from each other. In a cityscape her speed would be severely hindered for example. Also while speed of thought is slower than the speeds WW can travel at electrical impulses have millimetres/centimetres to travel so those with psionic based powers could arguably think before WW could take them out. Psylocke and IW with a thought could erect protective shields, Emma Frost with a thought would be in diamond form. It would take time to take anyone of those women out if they had a chance to do those thing , allowing the others to lend a hand. Just a thought.

Mindship
According to some sites, nerve impulses can travel as fast as 400 feet per second...less than Mach 0.5. So unless her opponents have amped nerve impulses, WW will indeed literally strike before they know what's hitting them.

Related topic - Which is more powerful: Godwave or Phoenix Force? Or are they just the same thing with different names cuz of different universes?

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Mindship
According to some sites, nerve impulses can travel as fast as 400 feet per second...less than Mach 0.5. So unless her opponents have amped nerve impulses, WW will indeed literally strike before they know what's hitting them.

Even though those impulses have millimetres, centimetres to travel at the most in comparison to the (possibly, dependent on threadmaker) hundreds of feet WW would have to travel? Id say thats debatable.

Originally posted by Mindship
Related topic - Which is more powerful: Godwave or Phoenix Force? Or are they just the same thing with different names cuz of different universes?

Phoenix would equal the Source. Godwave is below or at least derived from the Source is it not so it would be below the Phoenix.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by Mindship
According to some sites, nerve impulses can travel as fast as 400 feet per second...less than Mach 0.5. So unless her opponents have amped nerve impulses, WW will indeed literally strike before they know what's hitting them.

Related topic - Which is more powerful: Godwave or Phoenix Force? Or are they just the same thing with different names cuz of different universes?




I believe the new term is Reedforce or Richardswave...


big grin


And by the way WW would have start running so she would not be at whatever her full speed at to begin with.

And she is not able to fight at those high top speeds either...

IW and Emma would be able to react...

ie... Bubble in the brain expanding WW dead...

LethalFemme
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Even though those impulses have millimetres, centimetres to travel at the most in comparison to the (possibly, dependent on threadmaker) hundreds of feet WW would have to travel? Id say thats debatable.



Phoenix would equal the Source. Godwave is below or at least derived from the Source is it not so it would be below the Phoenix.


The shields may work but, not for long and I doubt they could put WW down before she'd do it to them.



On the phoenix force and godwave although I could have sworn the godwave was the source but, in any case thanks for your thoughts. wink

Superherovandal
The GodWave is a small (well so to speak) fragment of the Source. It is a part of the part of the whole.

Superherovandal
And for all we know Phoenix may also be derived of the Source like the Godwave.

Mindship
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Even though those impulses have millimetres, centimetres to travel at the most in comparison to the (possibly, dependent on threadmaker) hundreds of feet WW would have to travel? Id say thats debatable.

Good point. So lemme take out my Calculator Which Imposes Real Numbers onto the Comic World...

Given let's say an "average" neural distance of 1 centimeter, a nerve impulse could cover that in about 1/12,000th of a second.

For Diana to throw a punch which will connect before her opponents could react (let's say she's toe-to-toe, so we're talking a distance of maybe 2 feet); to cover 2 feet in 1/12,000 of a second (actually, a lil' faster), her fist would have to be moving at least Mach 21.

Do-able? WW gonna have to hustle her star-spangled booty, even faster if she's beyond arm's reach.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Mindship
Good point. So lemme take out my Calculator Which Imposes Real Numbers onto the Comic World...

Given let's say an "average" neural distance of 1 centimeter, a nerve impulse could cover that in about 1/12,000th of a second.

For Diana to throw a punch which will connect before her opponents could react (let's say she's toe-to-toe, so we're talking a distance of maybe 2 feet); to cover 2 feet in 1/12,000 of a second (actually, a lil' faster), her fist would have to be moving at least Mach 21.

Do-able? WW gonna have to hustle her star-spangled booty, even faster if she's beyond arm's reach.

Thanks for that. So until we have conclusive proof that in an earth like atmosphere Wonder Woman can move faster than those speeds listed from that site then it looks like the heroes with psi based powers will be able to react before theyre taken out.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Mindship
Good point. So lemme take out my Calculator Which Imposes Real Numbers onto the Comic World...

Given let's say an "average" neural distance of 1 centimeter, a nerve impulse could cover that in about 1/12,000th of a second.

For Diana to throw a punch which will connect before her opponents could react (let's say she's toe-to-toe, so we're talking a distance of maybe 2 feet); to cover 2 feet in 1/12,000 of a second (actually, a lil' faster), her fist would have to be moving at least Mach 21.

Do-able? WW gonna have to hustle her star-spangled booty, even faster if she's beyond arm's reach.

True but, her only competition is IW's and Psylocke's shields.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Superherovandal
And for all we know Phoenix may also be derived of the Source like the Godwave.

Phoenix was presented as being one and the same as the Source in the past and now in current continuity Phoenix represents the Crown in creation so it is indeed an aspect.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thanks for that. So until we have conclusive proof that in an earth like atmosphere Wonder Woman can move faster than those speeds listed from that site then it looks like the heroes with psi based powers will be able to react before theyre taken out.




yes You are correct...



clapping


The truth has been told...



For now...

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by LethalFemme
True but, her only competition is IW's and Psylocke's shields.

Whats to stop them protecting the others in a shield? They do it all the time in their respective comics. Its a standard battle procedure. Then what? Either Psylocke or IW can suffocate WW while the others restrain and pound WW.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Whats to stop them protecting the others in a shield? They do it all the time in their respective comics. Its a standard battle procedure. Then what? Either Psylocke or IW can suffocate WW while the others restrain and pound WW.

I'm not saying they wouldn't I'm just identifying IW and Psylocke as the big guns and for those with range powers such as Rogue I can see that working against them seeing as WW has the bracelets and don't count out the lasso.

Mindship
So are we saying WW can't top Mach 21? Seems to me, in order to have fought Superman, she'd have to be faster than Mach 21... unless Supes is not that fast, at least reflex-wise.

Juntai
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thanks for that. So until we have conclusive proof that in an earth like atmosphere Wonder Woman can move faster than those speeds listed from that site then it looks like the heroes with psi based powers will be able to react before theyre taken out.

IN WW:219, Sacrifice Concludes.

She told Max Lord, when he tried to take her over "I see with a Gods eyes, and understand with a Gods wisdom, Max Lord. Your power will not work on me"
And then he said "I didn't think it would. But you can't blame a guy for trying."

I would also assume she's powerful enough to get through the shields created by IW. There's been lesser things that pounded through them. Gladiator did it with ease.

Superherovandal
was as one or an aspect of the Source?

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Juntai
IN WW:219, Sacrifice Concludes.

She told Max Lord, when he tried to take her over "I see with a Gods eyes, and understand with a Gods wisdom, Max Lord. Your power will not work on me"
And then he said "I didn't think it would. But you can't blame a guy for trying."

I would also assume she's powerful enough to get through the shields created by IW. There's been lesser things that pounded through them. Gladiator did it with ease.

I knew she could see them, were just debating if she can get through IW's and Psylocke's shields before she's "choked to death"

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Mindship
So are we saying WW can't top Mach 21? Seems to me, in order to have fought Superman, she'd have to be faster than Mach 21... unless Supes is not that fast, at least reflex-wise.

Well GS is saying that WW hasn't shown to be able to move at those speeds in the earths atmosphere. So in theory she can't and it would leave her open to attack.

Juntai
Originally posted by LethalFemme
I knew she could see them, were just debating if she can get through IW's and Psylocke's shields before she's "choked to death" I would also be led to believe it would take a moment.. seeing as a page or two after what I just posted, Superman carries her into space, and they fight. I think choking her to death would take a moment... at least long enough to smash both of their heads with a rock at super-speed. wink

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by LethalFemme
I'm not saying they wouldn't I'm just identifying IW and Psylocke as the big guns and for those with range powers such as Rogue I can see that working against them seeing as WW has the bracelets and don't count out the lasso.

Wonder woman has a good chance in this battle. I just dont think its the blow out that all of the Dc crowd are presenting it as. I dont believe WW will be able to take out all of these characters in a speed blitz before they could react.

Mindships calculations have gone a big way in helping out my case. Emma Frost can transform to diamond form, IW and Psylocke could erect shields. All of that could arguably happen before WW reaches them. Iw or Psylocke could arguably even protect the others in a shield prior to WW reaching them.

Say Psylocke protected herself and Storm. IW protected herself and Emma got into diamond form. They could restrain her temporarily (winds/telekinesis) suffocate her (IW's shields) and pound away at her (Emma in diamond form/lightning) which would shorten the duration WW could hold her breath for example.

Just a possible scenario.

Spawnrules
I FOUND SOMEONE I FOUND SOMEONE
Elina_Egyptian

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Mindship
So are we saying WW can't top Mach 21? Seems to me, in order to have fought Superman, she'd have to be faster than Mach 21... unless Supes is not that fast, at least reflex-wise.

Yeah but theres a limit to how fast you can fly in an atmosphere. Thats why im saying this battle depends on the environment and how far they are from each other.

Also fighting Supes isnt conclusive proof of her being able to fight/fly at mach 21 or whatever because Supes doesnt always fly/fight at those speeds. Thats why we need scans depicting conclusively how fast WW can fly and move through an earth like environment.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Wonder woman has a good chance in this battle. I just dont think its the blow out that all of the Dc crowd are presenting it as. I dont believe WW will be able to take out all of these characters in a speed blitz before they could react.

Mindships calculations have gone a big way in helping out my case. Emma Frost can transform to diamond form, IW and Psylocke could erect shields. All of that could arguably happen before WW reaches them. Iw or Psylocke could arguably even protect the others in a shield prior to WW reaching them.

Say Psylocke protected herself and Storm. IW protected herself and Emma got into diamond form. They could restrain her temporarily (winds/telekinesis) suffocate her (IW's shields) and pound away at her (Emma in diamond form/lightning) which would shorten the duration WW could hold her breath for example.

Just a possible scenario.

True, I still just see WW winning I can't she them holding her that long and she does have speed and flight plus her weapons and we both know that eventually she'd use her bracelets to deflect an attack. The thing is they'll have to work to take her out for awhile and in her case she just needs one hit see where I'm coming from.erm

Juntai
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Yeah but theres a limit to how fast you can fly in an atmosphere. Thats why im saying this battle depends on the environment and how far they are from each other.

Also fighting Supes isnt conclusive proof of her being able to fight/fly at mach 21 or whatever because Supes doesnt always fly/fight at those speeds. Thats why we need scans depicting conclusively how fast WW can fly and move through an earth like environment. Superman and Wonder woman fought at first on Earth, then he carried her into space all the way to the sun, they fought there too, then they came all the way back they fought for another several pages on Earth...

near the end of the comic..

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y112/avalonofthewind/ww3.jpg

Look at how long it took from start to finish.

1 minute, 54 seconds.


Note that it takes light 8.4 minutes, one way... with no fighting.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by LethalFemme
True, I still just see WW winning I can't she them holding her that long and she does have speed and flight plus her weapons and we both know that eventually she'd use her bracelets to deflect an attack. The thing is they'll have to work to take her out for awhile and in her case she just needs one hit see where I'm coming from.erm

One hit wont cut it against Psylocke/IW shields or Emma Frosts diamond form. It would take time for her to take any of those members out.

I just think she can be restrained temporarily long enough for Sue to work her magic be it suffocation or bubbles in the brain. The brain thing would probably take her out instantly whilst the suffocation thing can be aided via a pounding from the other members.

I dunno. I just dont think its as easy as was previously being made out.

Mr _Whirlysplat
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Phoenix was presented as being one and the same as the Source in the past and now in current continuity Phoenix represents the Crown in creation so it is indeed an aspect.

wtf its a Phoenix thread confused

no

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Juntai
Superman and Wonder woman fought at first on Earth, then he carried her into space all the way to the sun, they fought there too, then they came all the way back they fought for another several pages on Earth...

near the end of the comic..

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y112/avalonofthewind/ww3.jpg

Look at how long it took from start to finish.

1 minute, 54 seconds.


Note that it takes light 8.4 minutes, one way... with no fighting.

Didnt Superman chokehold her off the planet lol. I cant remember?

Mr _Whirlysplat
Originally posted by Juntai
Superman and Wonder woman fought at first on Earth, then he carried her into space all the way to the sun, they fought there too, then they came all the way back they fought for another several pages on Earth...

near the end of the comic..

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y112/avalonofthewind/ww3.jpg

Look at how long it took from start to finish.

1 minute, 54 seconds.


Note that it takes light 8.4 minutes, one way... with no fighting.

Which makes it hilarious smile fun comic battle though smile

Juntai
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Didnt Superman chokehold her off the planet lol. I cant remember? Yah, when they took off, he had her in a chokehold, most of the way to the sun. I laughed through most of Sacrifice at how Superman made most of the heros look weak and slow footed and minded.

Point is, a good 16 pages of battle, that took place from Earth to sun and back, took less than the time it takes light to move one way. Like 10 or 11 of which, take place after landing again.

LethalFemme
I just can't see WW losing

Mindship
Coupla points here...

1. Seems to me flight speed is not the same as - and probably faster than - reflex speed, if for no other reason that one has time to accelerate in flight; so Superman and Wonder Woman getting to the sun and back in so short a time highlights flight speed but not (necessarily) reflex speed. Plus, as I've read on many a post/site, Superman and WW don't actually do much fighting at "superspeed." Flash does cuz he's Flash, but the others: they may be quick, but super reflex speed appears to have limited deployment.

2. Possibly a reason for the above is the limitation of speed in an atmosphere. Is this a self-imposed limitation, to minimize collateral damage? Or is it an actual limit, imposed by (eg) friction with the air, something Flash can avoid due to the Speed Force?

Personally, I like seeing these limitations. If nothing else, it makes for more interesting confrontations, such as posed by this thread.

And just for the hell of it, when the space shuttle enters our atmosphere, coming down, it's moving way faster than Mach 10. I'm not sure if that limitation is "really" legit...probably something plot-devised, no?

Superherovandal
Its more of a collateral damage kinda thing. She probably could go a bit faster.

Juntai
Originally posted by Mindship
Coupla points here...

1. Seems to me flight speed is not the same as - and probably faster than - reflex speed, if for no other reason that one has time to accelerate in flight; so Superman and Wonder Woman getting to the sun and back in so short a time highlights flight speed but not (necessarily) reflex speed. Plus, as I've read on many a post/site, Superman and WW don't actually do much fighting at "superspeed." Flash does cuz he's Flash, but the others: they may be quick, but super reflex speed appears to have limited deployment.
You're also ignoring the fact they fight for another 10 pages after getting to the sun and back.
And the ENTIRE thing took less than 2 minutes.
This shows land speed as well as reaction time, far above and beyond the norm.. They were only fighting for about 6 pages before landing back on Earth to finish the fight.

Mindship
Originally posted by Juntai
You're also ignoring the fact they fight for another 10 pages after getting to the sun and back.
And the ENTIRE thing took less than 2 minutes.
This shows land speed as well as reaction time, far above and beyond the norm.. They were only fighting for about 6 pages before landing back on Earth to finish the fight.

I guess when someone is choking the crapolla out of you near the sun...yeah, I guess I'd be hustling too.

GalacticStorm
This is getting good. Keep it up guys its 12.30 am over in the U.K so im gonna hit the sack in a bit. Give me something good to come back to lol

Juntai
Originally posted by Mindship
I guess when someone is choking the crapolla out of you near the sun...yeah, I guess I'd be hustling too. So in less than 2 minutes, they fought on Earth for a page or two.. went to the sun and fought.. came back.. and fought on land for the rest of the bulk of the fight.... in less than 1/4 of the time it takes LIGHT to go ONE WAY...
They had to be fighting in and out of the atmosphere at something like 10 times the speed of light.

Mindship
Let's see...if someone can tell me (eg) how many punches or moves were done by WW and S in the <2min's they were fighting, maybe I can calculate average reflex speed...hoover

Of course, if he was just choking her - which is sorta static, not dynamic, like punching - then maybe reflex speed was not so quick, or rather, not illustrated here.

Juntai
Originally posted by Mindship
Let's see...if someone can tell me (eg) how many punches or moves were done by WW and S in the <2min's they were fighting, maybe I can calculate average reflex speed...hoover Obviously the reflexes wouldn't be based on amount of punches thrown, but rather on the fact they are seeing and adapting to eachothers attacks on the battlefield at the aformentioned nearly 10 times the speed of light or more. To fight and sustain and react at this level of speed would require this level of reflexes.

Mindship
Originally posted by Juntai
Obviously the reflexes wouldn't be based on amount of punches thrown, but rather on the fact they are seeing and adapting to eachothers attacks on the battlefield at the aformentioned nearly 10 times the speed of light or more. To fight and sustain and react at this level of speed would require this level of reflexes.

I dunno. Flying to the sun at 10c is one thing, doesn't necessarily mean their limbs are going that fast...that's why punching as opposed to choking is important, number of moves per unit time. I've never read this comic, so I don't know what the battle was like.

And besides, I thought Supes was limited to 0.1c?

Juntai
Originally posted by Mindship
I dunno. Flying to the sun at 10c is one thing, doesn't necessarily mean their limbs are going that fast...that's why punching as opposed to choking is important, number of moves per unit time. I've never read this comic, so I don't know what the battle was like.

And besides, I thought Supes was limited to 0.1c? 10 or 11 of the 16 pages were fighting on Earth though. The flying through space and back was momentary at best. He rushed her on the first page of the fight, carried her to the sun where they fought, they landed back on Earth by the end of the 4th page. Page 5 and 6 were a splash of giant crater her body created after landing. There for the next 10 or 11 pages between her and where Max said it had took 1 minute and 54 seconds from start to where the fight was, was entirely blows thrown and adapted to inside the Earth's atmosphere.

Mindship
So sounds like the serious dukin' it out was on Earth; doesn't sound like a lot of moves-per-unit-time was happening en route to Sol. All I've seen of the actual fighting while flying was 1) he's choking her, 2) he starts frying her with heat vision, and 3) she does to him what Supes did to Darkseid (thumb over eyes). I'm sure she was reacting quite quickly -probably with superspeed (>Mach 21?, they werent in an atmosphere)- but IMO it doesnt sound like reflex speed was matching flight speed.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Mindship
Let's see...if someone can tell me (eg) how many punches or moves were done by WW and S in the <2min's they were fighting, maybe I can calculate average reflex speed...hoover

Of course, if he was just choking her - which is sorta static, not dynamic, like punching - then maybe reflex speed was not so quick, or rather, not illustrated here.

Wonder Woman was good and smart enough to use Superman's powers against him while barley holding back. She predicted when he was using his hearing and used it for her advantage to cripple him.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Juntai
10 or 11 of the 16 pages were fighting on Earth though. The flying through space and back was momentary at best. He rushed her on the first page of the fight, carried her to the sun where they fought, they landed back on Earth by the end of the 4th page. Page 5 and 6 were a splash of giant crater her body created after landing. There for the next 10 or 11 pages between her and where Max said it had took 1 minute and 54 seconds from start to where the fight was, was entirely blows thrown and adapted to inside the Earth's atmosphere.


Don't forget that once back one earth she blacked out for half a second. Which shows her recovery rate and Superman used his ice breathe to freeze her and she got out of that quickly enough to cripple his ears.

Juntai
Originally posted by Mindship
So sounds like the serious dukin' it out was on Earth; doesn't sound like a lot of moves-per-unit-time was happening en route to Sol. All I've seen of the actual fighting while flying was 1) he's choking her, 2) he starts frying her with heat vision, and 3) she does to him what Supes did to Darkseid (thumb over eyes). I'm sure she was reacting quite quickly -probably with superspeed (>Mach 21?, they werent in an atmosphere)- but IMO it doesnt sound like reflex speed was matching flight speed. Right, but the earth-to-sun and back, was only like a third or fourth of the fight or so. Making it like.. a 40 second or something feat of the total.

You're completely igoring that fact, that it took place in space AND A MAJORITY ON LAND, at roughly 10 times the speed of light or more. She was blocking heat vision wither her bracelets and dodging it. They were close-quarters trading kicks and punches for most of the fight, dodging, moving, blocking, adapting, at this level of speed.

You're taking it as if the trip to the sun was the entire 2 minute fight, but that was the smallest part of the rather long fight.

Juntai
Originally posted by LethalFemme
Wonder Woman was good and smart enough to use Superman's powers against him while barley holding back. She predicted when he was using his hearing and used it for her advantage to cripple him. True. But she was also using Kryptonite. So don't let that holding back claim fool you too much. She was doing nearly everything in her power to stop him.


Yep.

Mindship
To have been trading blows at 10c for even a minute would entail (nope, not gonna calculate this one) probably something like millions of punches/kicks/etc...of course this also ignores relativistic problems, let alone ignoring what limitations have been set for the characters previously (so much for Mach 10 or 21 or even Mach 10,000)...just to be able to "see" heat vision coming implies that Diana is using some kind of superluminal sense, since the light from the heat vision is moving no faster than the beams themselves.

If this is the case, then Diana is not limited to Mach 21, and, well, so much for trying to minimize collateral damage.

In which case we can readdress the topic of this thread: can Diana react faster than the nerve impulse in her opponents can move? If Juntai is intepreting the Earth-bound fighting correctly (and I will give you that benefit of the doubt, since I wasn't there), then the answer is yes. In fact, if Diana can fight even at just lightspeed, no one but Superman or the Flash could tackle her.

In fact: since Diana is based on magic, one could argue she is immune to relativistic effects, while Superman is not.

Well, DC, put That in yer blender and puree..

Juntai
Also, not sure if you noticed it, but someone posted a few pages back, of Wonder Woman chasing Jesse Quick to the barrier of the Speed Force, and lassoing her. She was trying to catch her before she went through the barrier because it makes you simply become lost in the speed force. Not sure how she did that without tapping the speed force, but yea... it happened, I guess. lol.

Juntai
Originally posted by Mindship
To have been trading blows at 10c for even a minute would entail (nope, not gonna calculate this one) probably something like millions of punches/kicks/etc...of course this also ignores relativistic problems, let alone ignoring what limitations have been set for the characters previously (so much for Mach 10 or 21 or even Mach 10,000)...just to be able to "see" heat vision coming implies that Diana is using some kind of superluminal sense, since the light from the heat vision is moving no faster than the beams themselves.

If this is the case, then Diana is not limited to Mach 21, and, well, so much for trying to minimize collateral damage.

In which case we can readdress the topic of this thread: can Diana react faster than the nerve impulse in her opponents can move? If Juntai is intepreting the Earth-bound fighting correctly (and I will give you that benefit of the doubt, since I wasn't there), then the answer is yes. In fact, if Diana can fight even at just lightspeed, no one but Superman or the Flash could tackle her.

In fact: since Diana is based on magic, one could argue she is immune to relativistic effects, while Superman is not.

Well, DC, put That in yer blender and puree.. Yep, but she was also dampening Superman's power with Kryptonite. She couldn't even really react to him properly until she had it out and in her possession to wield against him.. Leading me to believe Superman is undeterminedly faster than she is. The feats to the sun and back were "mostly" belonging to Superman.. I would assume they did slow down after this, since she pulled the Kryptonite in space, but the fact remains the bulk of the fight is on the ground, in under 2 minutes. It's pretty undeniable still that she's far beyond the mach 21 mark, in and out of a vaccum. That's the main point here.

Juntai
And for the final point-- I think this at least shows Wonderwoman far more than capable of dismantling this team, though I do agree that if proper tactics are used, they may stand up momentarily.... but if she could do these things, I don't see it as unlikely that she would defeat the team in a rather quick manner... timetable-wise.

Superherovandal
Superman is undoubtedly much faster than her. And him approaching the sun only made it worse. Thats why she took out the k-nite ring. She would have been pummeled if she hadn't

Juntai
Originally posted by Superherovandal
Superman is undoubtedly much faster than her. And him approaching the sun only made it worse. Thats why she took out the k-nite ring. She would have been pummeled if she hadn't Agreed.

But it's also agreed that she's far faster than mach 21, as stated earlier in the thread?

Superherovandal
Of course or she wouldn't have been able to hold him off for that long.

Mindship
Even if she is not a lightspeed fighter, yes, I would agree Mach 21 is not her limit.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Juntai
True. But she was also using Kryptonite. So don't let that holding back claim fool you too much. She was doing nearly everything in her power to stop him.



Yep.



She didn't use the kryptonite until they were by the sun which of course put Superman in another league so I viewed it as evening out the balance. He was being powered and weakened at the same time.

xmarksthespot
Originally posted by Mindship
Good point. So lemme take out my Calculator Which Imposes Real Numbers onto the Comic World...

Given let's say an "average" neural distance of 1 centimeter, a nerve impulse could cover that in about 1/12,000th of a second.That's not an accurate figure. I'm pretty sure the speed of thought given in Tron's rules is the speed at which action potentials travel along axons in the peripheral nervous system. It doesn't take into account that the electrical signal has to be transduced into a chemical signal that crosses the synaptic cleft to be transduced back into an electrical signal - which takes time. Secondly, you're also making the assumption that a single nerve firing is sufficient to utilise a power, which imo is highly unlikely. Thirdly, citing the speed of thought given by Tron is only really relevant when two people have comparable reflexes, no one on the Marvel side has comparable reflexes to Wonder Woman, I recall her deflecting automated gunfire from enemies encircling i.e. all directions standing only a few feet away.

It's fallacy to imply that anyone without (very) highly enhanced reflexes could get out an attack or defense in 1/12,000th of a second. Average human reaction times (which excludes subsequent thought and action) are probably around 0.75-1 second. Since they're heroes it's safe to assume they're faster maybe around 0.25 to 0.5 seconds. Including any subsequent thought for someone who is peak but normal human, it would probably amount to around 1 second or so. And then add additional time for the actual consequences of that thought e.g. time for lightning to travel (except in the case of telepathy, which imo is both thought and action concurrent although irrelevant here). Considering Wonder Woman has faster, physical speed and faster reflexes, up to 20x faster according to that thing, I'd assume any process that for example Psylocke was to do if done by Wonder Woman would be 20x faster (if that bio is correct) so approximately 0.05 of a second for reaction and thought, so she has about 0.95 seconds for the consequential action. Add to that, if I recall correctly, practiced physical actions require less neuronal activation than complex conceptual thought. If we assume she flies at Mach 3 that's 3,349 ft/s, however this doesn't factor in time to accelerate which I've no idea where to determine from. She really only has to eliminate two people. If the path between her to Invisible Woman to Psylocke is greater than maybe 2,500-3,000 ft then she can't speedblitz them. If her max speed is Mach 10 due to atmospheric disturbances then the total path would have to be around 9,500-10,000 ft. So it depends on the environment and what Wonder Woman's max speed is.

I s'pose I should add some sort of disclaimer: the above is based on several assumption where adequate information is not available.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
That's not an accurate figure. I'm pretty sure the speed of thought given in Tron's rules is the speed at which action potentials travel along axons in the peripheral nervous system. It doesn't take into account that the electrical signal has to be transduced into a chemical signal that crosses the synaptic cleft to be transduced back into an electrical signal - which takes time. Secondly, you're also making the assumption that a single nerve firing is sufficient to utilise a power, which imo is highly unlikely. Thirdly, citing the speed of thought given by Tron is only really relevant when two people have comparable reflexes, no one on the Marvel side has comparable reflexes to Wonder Woman, I recall her deflecting automated gunfire from enemies encircling i.e. all directions standing only a few feet away.

It's fallacy to imply that anyone without (very) highly enhanced reflexes could get out an attack or defense in 1/12,000th of a second. Average human reaction times (which excludes subsequent thought and action) are probably around 0.75-1 second. Since they're heroes it's safe to assume they're faster maybe around 0.25 to 0.5 seconds. Including any subsequent thought for someone who is peak but normal human, it would probably amount to around 1 second or so. And then add additional time for the actual consequences of that thought e.g. time for lightning to travel (except in the case of telepathy, which imo is both thought and action concurrent although irrelevant here). Considering Wonder Woman has faster, physical speed and faster reflexes, up to 20x faster according to that thing, I'd assume any process that for example Psylocke was to do if done by Wonder Woman would be 20x faster (if that bio is correct) so approximately 0.05 of a second for reaction and thought, so she has about 0.95 seconds for the consequential action. Add to that, if I recall correctly, practiced physical actions require less neuronal activation than complex conceptual thought. If we assume she flies at Mach 3 that's 3,349 ft/s, however this doesn't factor in time to accelerate which I've no idea where to determine from. She really only has to eliminate two people. If the path between her to Invisible Woman to Psylocke is greater than maybe 2,500-3,000 ft then she can't speedblitz them. If her max speed is Mach 10 due to atmospheric disturbances then the total path would have to be around 9,500-10,000 ft. So it depends on the environment and what Wonder Woman's max speed is.

I s'pose I should add some sort of disclaimer: the above is based on several assumption where adequate information is not available.

Feel free to post in any of my threads. wink

Tony Stark
Originally posted by Juntai
IN WW:219, Sacrifice Concludes.

She told Max Lord, when he tried to take her over "I see with a Gods eyes, and understand with a Gods wisdom, Max Lord. Your power will not work on me"
And then he said "I didn't think it would. But you can't blame a guy for trying."

I would also assume she's powerful enough to get through the shields created by IW. There's been lesser things that pounded through them. Gladiator did it with ease.


#1 she's not Gladiator... WW's maybe half as strong...

#2 He also uses some sort of mental feedback along with his punches... WW punches won't effect her field in the same way...

#3 IW could keep her shield up for quite sometime against WW (HULK, THOR Etc...). Not indefinately but long enough for SHE-HULK to get her big green mitts on her and let her out the clamp down.

evil face

Tony Stark
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
That's not an accurate figure. I'm pretty sure the speed of thought given in Tron's rules is the speed at which action potentials travel along axons in the peripheral nervous system. It doesn't take into account that the electrical signal has to be transduced into a chemical signal that crosses the synaptic cleft to be transduced back into an electrical signal - which takes time. Secondly, you're also making the assumption that a single nerve firing is sufficient to utilise a power, which imo is highly unlikely. Thirdly, citing the speed of thought given by Tron is only really relevant when two people have comparable reflexes, no one on the Marvel side has comparable reflexes to Wonder Woman, I recall her deflecting automated gunfire from enemies encircling i.e. all directions standing only a few feet away.

It's fallacy to imply that anyone without (very) highly enhanced reflexes could get out an attack or defense in 1/12,000th of a second. Average human reaction times (which excludes subsequent thought and action) are probably around 0.75-1 second. Since they're heroes it's safe to assume they're faster maybe around 0.25 to 0.5 seconds. Including any subsequent thought for someone who is peak but normal human, it would probably amount to around 1 second or so. And then add additional time for the actual consequences of that thought e.g. time for lightning to travel (except in the case of telepathy, which imo is both thought and action concurrent although irrelevant here). Considering Wonder Woman has faster, physical speed and faster reflexes, up to 20x faster according to that thing, I'd assume any process that for example Psylocke was to do if done by Wonder Woman would be 20x faster (if that bio is correct) so approximately 0.05 of a second for reaction and thought, so she has about 0.95 seconds for the consequential action. Add to that, if I recall correctly, practiced physical actions require less neuronal activation than complex conceptual thought. If we assume she flies at Mach 3 that's 3,349 ft/s, however this doesn't factor in time to accelerate which I've no idea where to determine from. She really only has to eliminate two people. If the path between her to Invisible Woman to Psylocke is greater than maybe 2,500-3,000 ft then she can't speedblitz them. If her max speed is Mach 10 due to atmospheric disturbances then the total path would have to be around 9,500-10,000 ft. So it depends on the environment and what Wonder Woman's max speed is.

I s'pose I should add some sort of disclaimer: the above is based on several assumption where adequate information is not available.



Another thing that has to be taken in consideration is because WW has no knowledge about whom is whom with these girls of Marvel and what they all can do and the same goes for them. It's most likely that WW tries to take down SHE-HULK 1st because she is the most imposing. And SHE-HULK will take a conciderable beating before going down one attack by WW isn't going to take her out. Which gives IW and Psy time to do their thing... Along with the rest of them.

Mindship
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
That's not an accurate figure. I'm pretty sure the speed of thought given in Tron's rules is the speed at which action potentials travel along axons in the peripheral nervous system. It doesn't take into account that the electrical signal has to be transduced into a chemical signal that crosses the synaptic cleft to be transduced back into an electrical signal - which takes time. Secondly, you're also making the assumption that a single nerve firing is sufficient to utilise a power, which imo is highly unlikely. Thirdly, citing the speed of thought given by Tron is only really relevant when two people have comparable reflexes, no one on the Marvel side has comparable reflexes to Wonder Woman, I recall her deflecting automated gunfire from enemies encircling i.e. all directions standing only a few feet away.

It's fallacy to imply that anyone without (very) highly enhanced reflexes could get out an attack or defense in 1/12,000th of a second. Average human reaction times (which excludes subsequent thought and action) are probably around 0.75-1 second. Since they're heroes it's safe to assume they're faster maybe around 0.25 to 0.5 seconds. Including any subsequent thought for someone who is peak but normal human, it would probably amount to around 1 second or so. And then add additional time for the actual consequences of that thought e.g. time for lightning to travel (except in the case of telepathy, which imo is both thought and action concurrent although irrelevant here). Considering Wonder Woman has faster, physical speed and faster reflexes, up to 20x faster according to that thing, I'd assume any process that for example Psylocke was to do if done by Wonder Woman would be 20x faster (if that bio is correct) so approximately 0.05 of a second for reaction and thought, so she has about 0.95 seconds for the consequential action. Add to that, if I recall correctly, practiced physical actions require less neuronal activation than complex conceptual thought. If we assume she flies at Mach 3 that's 3,349 ft/s, however this doesn't factor in time to accelerate which I've no idea where to determine from. She really only has to eliminate two people. If the path between her to Invisible Woman to Psylocke is greater than maybe 2,500-3,000 ft then she can't speedblitz them. If her max speed is Mach 10 due to atmospheric disturbances then the total path would have to be around 9,500-10,000 ft. So it depends on the environment and what Wonder Woman's max speed is.

I s'pose I should add some sort of disclaimer: the above is based on several assumption where adequate information is not available.

Several good points are being raised (and the disclaimer at the end is also appreciated). Since several factors have to be considered to "compute" time to perceive-sensory-nerve-signal-brain-processing-motor-nerve-signal-muscle(or whatever)-respond, I was vastly simplifying, as I hoped would be noted in my saying "average" neuronal transit distance we'll say is 1 centimeter.

EVEN SO...as I understand it, WW has used her bracelets to deflect lightning (which travels about 0.5c) and lasers, as well as Superman's heat vision. There are only two ways she can do this...1) she is able to anticipate (by reading body language?) when "the trigger is about to be pulled," so to speak and raise her arm before the bolt of power is on its way; or 2) via some superluminal sensing mechanism (which, no doubt, would be magical in nature, though this has never even been hinted at), Diana is able to perceive these near-light and lightspeed attacks already on their way to her, which implies not just FTL reflexes, but also FTL neural-signal speed and brain processing (just like the Starship Enterprise's computers).

Though the fight with Superman would imply #2, any bios on WW appear to imply #1 (which, personally, I tend to favor, cuz it's more believable). Even so, there is a HUGE difference between the speed of sound and the speed of light. Diana does not have to speedblitz at Mach 1,000,000 (about lightspeed), but she can still be way faster than Mach 21. Mach 30 - Mach 1000 (what I generally refer to as "cometary" speeds cuz this is roughly how fast comets fly) is still fast enough to traverse half a mile before see-process-react occurs in her opponents, especially so if see-process-react takes significantly longer than 1/12,000 of a second.

Man, if only we could get paid debating this stuff... rolling on floor laughing

GalacticStorm
LethalFemme define the distance then because as you've seen if WW is anything short of a few miles away from the team then she wins quite conclusively end of debate. If she beyond that distance then we've still got a debate to be had.

yahman
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
That's not an accurate figure. I'm pretty sure the speed of thought given in Tron's rules is the speed at which action potentials travel along axons in the peripheral nervous system. It doesn't take into account that the electrical signal has to be transduced into a chemical signal that crosses the synaptic cleft to be transduced back into an electrical signal - which takes time. Secondly, you're also making the assumption that a single nerve firing is sufficient to utilise a power, which imo is highly unlikely. Thirdly, citing the speed of thought given by Tron is only really relevant when two people have comparable reflexes, no one on the Marvel side has comparable reflexes to Wonder Woman, I recall her deflecting automated gunfire from enemies encircling i.e. all directions standing only a few feet away.

It's fallacy to imply that anyone without (very) highly enhanced reflexes could get out an attack or defense in 1/12,000th of a second. Average human reaction times (which excludes subsequent thought and action) are probably around 0.75-1 second. Since they're heroes it's safe to assume they're faster maybe around 0.25 to 0.5 seconds. Including any subsequent thought for someone who is peak but normal human, it would probably amount to around 1 second or so. And then add additional time for the actual consequences of that thought e.g. time for lightning to travel (except in the case of telepathy, which imo is both thought and action concurrent although irrelevant here). Considering Wonder Woman has faster, physical speed and faster reflexes, up to 20x faster according to that thing, I'd assume any process that for example Psylocke was to do if done by Wonder Woman would be 20x faster (if that bio is correct) so approximately 0.05 of a second for reaction and thought, so she has about 0.95 seconds for the consequential action. Add to that, if I recall correctly, practiced physical actions require less neuronal activation than complex conceptual thought. If we assume she flies at Mach 3 that's 3,349 ft/s, however this doesn't factor in time to accelerate which I've no idea where to determine from. She really only has to eliminate two people. If the path between her to Invisible Woman to Psylocke is greater than maybe 2,500-3,000 ft then she can't speedblitz them. If her max speed is Mach 10 due to atmospheric disturbances then the total path would have to be around 9,500-10,000 ft. So it depends on the environment and what Wonder Woman's max speed is.

I s'pose I should add some sort of disclaimer: the above is based on several assumption where adequate information is not available.

Ooooh Action Potentials, we doing this at the moment. Other things have to be taken into consideration, such as the time taken to for the myosin filaments in the muscle's to synthesis ATP (or whatever the magical substitute), and contract ! smile X do you know a lot about this, as i was wondering if it scientifically possible to substantially increase ones reactions ?

yahman

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by yahman
You do realise how out dated and inaccurate that site is : Superman = 100 000 tons confused Um mm I'm under the impression that a third of the moon weighs a bit more than a 100 kilo tons. As does probably War World and the various oil tankers and mountain sized rocks he has lifted.

Black Bolt is listed at class 50 confused although he is going toe toe with the likes of Gladiator, Hulk and Thor. This stuff is from memory, ill go back and find more example's of BS this site is loaded with. smile

G.S., for someone who is always pointing that people 'should read the comics' you do use a lot of Internet reference sites as primary sources.

Already dealt with by all of the objective posters who have been posting in this thread. Sorry mate but you're dragging up an old issue. We've moved on here. Thanks for your contribution. smile

DarkCrawler
That's some crazyyyy science here.

Never seen stuff like that in other discussion forums.

Juntai
Originally posted by Tony Stark
Another thing that has to be taken in consideration is because WW has no knowledge about whom is whom with these girls of Marvel and what they all can do and the same goes for them. It's most likely that WW tries to take down SHE-HULK 1st because she is the most imposing. And SHE-HULK will take a conciderable beating before going down one attack by WW isn't going to take her out. Which gives IW and Psy time to do their thing... Along with the rest of them.
Read the forum rules.
Specifically, this piece:

Basic knowledge

Each side receives basic knowledge of the other. A good measure of this would be what the general population of the character's homeworld knows.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by Juntai
Read the forum rules.
Specifically, this piece:

Basic knowledge

Each side receives basic knowledge of the other. A good measure of this would be what the general population of the character's homeworld knows.


If thats the case then why doesn't IW an Pys go into the fight with their fields up and around their teams pre the start of the fight...?

Juntai
Originally posted by Tony Stark
If thats the case then why doesn't IW an Pys go into the fight with their fields up and around their teams pre the start of the fight...? Because of the other rule, regarding prep.

Prep time

Neither side receives any notable prep time before the starting bell. Neither side may take any offensive or defensive actions before the starting bell. Planning is allowed and powers that are automatic or 'always on' can be up, but actions such as setting up forcefields, taking flight, or consciously activating powers is not.



Can't you read this stuff yourself?
It's pinned on the forum.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
LethalFemme define the distance then because as you've seen if WW is anything short of a few miles away from the team then she wins quite conclusively end of debate. If she beyond that distance then we've still got a debate to be had.


Fine since there doesn't seem to be away to distance them without giving someone the upper hand I'll do it like this. All the Marvel women are informed they will be fighting an enemy and they will be a team. They will have no knowledge of WW what so ever. WW is informed she will be fighting these women and is also given no knowledge of them at all. Then they are all instantly transported in the danger room all scattered about so WW can't speedblitz them all at once and IW and Psylocke can't just instantly surround everyone with a shield.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by LethalFemme
Fine since there doesn't seem to be away to distance them without giving someone the upper hand I'll do it like this. All the Marvel women are informed they will be fighting an enemy and they will be a team. They will have no knowledge of WW what so ever. WW is informed she will be fighting these women and is also given no knowledge of them at all. Then they are all instantly transported in the danger room all scattered about so WW can't speedblitz them all at once and IW and Psylocke can't just instantly surround everyone with a shield.

Also for those of you who may be having trouble regarding prep. This is instantaneous no one has a Chance to react or use powers until they're in the danger room so IW can't and won't be Invisible no one will be flying,etc.

Mindship
Let's say this danger room has a diameter of a football field: 300 feet (this is way bigger than X-men's danger room, no?). That gives it a perimeter of about 1000 feet. Anyone capable of, say, a Mach 100 attack speed (that's over 100 feet per millisecond), is gonna be able to zip around that perimeter in about 1/100 of a second.

Know the expression "in the blink of an eye?" That takes 1/10 of a second. This means Wonder Woman (granted a Mach 100 attack speed), can zip around the perimeter of this danger room in 1/10 the time it takes to blink an eye.

Can her opponents - even if spaced out evenly around the danger room's perimeter - react within this time frame? My first impression: I don't think so.

What Diana may do - to her detriment, since she has no foreknowledge of her opponents - is pause before attacking, trying to gauge what her opponents are about. If she does this, then she could well have her work cut out for her.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by Mindship
Let's say this danger room has a diameter of a football field: 300 feet (this is way bigger than X-men's danger room, no?). That gives it a perimeter of about 1000 feet. Anyone capable of, say, a Mach 100 attack speed (that's over 100 feet per millisecond), is gonna be able to zip around that perimeter in about 1/100 of a second.

Know the expression "in the blink of an eye?" That takes 1/10 of a second. This means Wonder Woman (granted a Mach 100 attack speed), can zip around the perimeter of this danger room in 1/10 the time it takes to blink an eye.

Can her opponents - even if spaced out evenly around the danger room's perimeter - react within this time frame? My first impression: I don't think so.

What Diana may do - to her detriment, since she has no foreknowledge of her opponents - is pause before attacking, trying to gauge what her opponents are about. If she does this, then she could well have her work cut out for her.

That's why I made it like this to give each side a equal opportunity to win.

xmarksthespot
Originally posted by yahman
Ooooh Action Potentials, we doing this at the moment. Other things have to be taken into consideration, such as the time taken to for the myosin filaments in the muscle's to synthesis ATP (or whatever the magical substitute), and contract ! smile X do you know a lot about this, as i was wondering if it scientifically possible to substantially increase ones reactions ? I do neuroscience. I don't know whether a speedblitz would utilise aerobic or anaerobic respiration but I'd assume the latter so she'd likely be using creatine phosphate to synthesize ATP. - assuming a speedblitz would utilise the entirety of her ATP stores. Since she's capable of sustained superfast movements I'm not convinced that she would. Also, I don't know if people created from clay and given life by gods would have something akin to human physiology.

This is the deflecting gunfire from all directions from a few feet (if even that) away and while distracted thing I mentioned earlier.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
I do neuroscience. I don't know whether a speedblitz would utilise aerobic or anaerobic respiration but I'd assume the latter so she'd likely be using creatine phosphate to synthesize ATP. - assuming a speedblitz would utilise the entirety of her ATP stores. Since she's capable of sustained superfast movements I'm not convinced that she would. Also, I don't know if people created from clay and given life by gods would have something akin to human physiology.

This is the deflecting gunfire from all directions from a few feet (if even that) away and while distracted thing I mentioned earlier.

thanx for the pic so who do you thin wins?

xmarksthespot
Hmm... if the Danger Room has a diameter of 300 ft, the circumference is approximately 940 ft. At Mach 3 it would take less than 0.3 seconds to circle this perimeter...

It also depends on whose positioned where.

LethalFemme
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Hmm... if the Danger Room has a diameter of 300 ft, the circumference is approximately 940 ft. At Mach 3 it would take less than 0.3 seconds to circle this perimeter...

It also depends on whose positioned where.

use your imagination

Mindship
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
This is the deflecting gunfire from all directions from a few feet (if even that) away and while distracted thing I mentioned earlier.

Very cool pic, but, for me at least, it begs the question: if she's so blinkin' durable, why does she have to do this at all?

The Demoralize Opponents Reason
As I posted once before, it would be even more demoralizing if she just stood there and took it (ie, bullets bouncing off her), especially with a you-can't-hurt-Me smile on her face.
Neo: You mean I'll be able to dodge bullets?
Morpheus: I'm saying, you won't have to.

The Blunt Force Durability Reason
WW can't handle "pointy objects" (bullets, arrows); though she can handle (eg) a punch from Superman. Thing is, Superman's punch is soooo much stronger and faster than a bullet, the impact force of his fist more than compensates (IMHO) for its increased surface area (kinetic energy equals 1/2 the mass times velocity squared: plug in your own numbers, see what ya get).

Of course, the reason is probably what I would call the Character Defined reason: deflecting bullets with her bracelets is what she does, it is a defining trait of WW, whereas Superman's (eg) is, stand there, take it and smile (well, maybe not smile).

Perhaps a good comicological reason would be this: WW doesnt take the full force of Supes' punch, but she is such a well-trained fighter that she is able to roll (somewhat) with his punches. This would give her a more consistent (if reduced) level of durability, which is okay, because she is relying on other skills to achieve the same end result.

And (just curious) why was her "attack speed" reduced to Mach 3?

Juntai
deflecting energy attacks.

Juntai
Originally posted by Mindship
Very cool pic, but, for me at least, it begs the question: if she's so blinkin' durable, why does she have to do this at all?

The Demoralize Opponents Reason
As I posted once before, it would be even more demoralizing if she just stood there and took it (ie, bullets bouncing off her), especially with a you-can't-hurt-Me smile on her face.
Neo: You mean I'll be able to dodge bullets?
Morpheus: I'm saying, you won't have to.

The Blunt Force Durability Reason
WW can't handle "pointy objects" (bullets, arrows); though she can handle (eg) a punch from Superman. Thing is, Superman's punch is soooo much stronger and faster than a bullet, the impact force of his fist more than compensates (IMHO) for its increased surface area (kinetic energy equals 1/2 the mass times velocity squared: plug in your own numbers, see what ya get).

Of course, the reason is probably what I would call the Character Defined reason: deflecting bullets with her bracelets is what she does, it is a defining trait of WW, whereas Superman's (eg) is, stand there, take it and smile (well, maybe not smile).

Perhaps a good comicological reason would be this: WW doesnt take the full force of Supes' punch, but she is such a well-trained fighter that she is able to roll (somewhat) with his punches. This would give her a more consistent (if reduced) level of durability, which is okay, because she is relying on other skills to achieve the same end result.

And (just curious) why was her "attack speed" reduced to Mach 3? I'm left to assume she does it because... she did it in the 40s 50s 60s 70s 80s and 90s?
A bulk of the time being that she couldn't take those levels of attack.
See her old show for instance with Linda Carter... she couldn't fly yet, and probably would have got lit up by a mac11 without those bracelets.

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