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meh?

Would love to say Katarn, but all I know about Bandon is he was killed by Revan after he was mind-wiped. Anyone have anything else on Bandon?

Bandon was the second most powerful person in Revan's Sith Empire. I think is was mentioned that Bandon killed at least one Council Member.

Great thread by the way. I am going to have to think about this one to tell for sure, but first thought gives it to Bandon.

Both Katarn and Bandon are exceptionally skilled Force-users and duelists. But Katarn has more experience and has practiced the Force longer, as well as his work with a saber. I don't think Bandon is his equal in either category; though it is close. After a long duel, Katarn will win, I think.

Think of it this way though. Out of all of the people who followed Revan, there were many Masters. Bandon was Chosen above all of the former Jedi Masters. He has to be capable.

He might also have around as much experince. He looks like what? 35, maybe? Katarn began using the Force when he was twenty or so, I think. He's like 40/45 in NJO, so thats 25 years experince. Bandon has about that much experince, since I personally don't consider the first decade very important since the Jedi mainly work on morals and such during that time, rather than fighting skill.

Where did you learn of this? Not that I'm doubting you, but wouldn't it make sense that Revan chose Malak above Bandon?

Sorry, I meant after Revan left his Empire. During KOTOR Bandon was second in Revan's Empire.

Wha....I still don't understand. Do you mean during Kotor Bandon was second in MALAK's Empire?

It was still Revan's Sith Empire. Malak lead it for a time, but it was Revan's.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Think of it this way though. Out of all of the people who followed Revan, there were many Masters. Bandon was Chosen above all of the former Jedi Masters. He has to be capable.

He might also have around as much experince. He looks like what? 35, maybe? Katarn began using the Force when he was twenty or so, I think. He's like 40/45 in NJO, so thats 25 years experince. Bandon has about that much experince, since I personally don't consider the first decade very important since the Jedi mainly work on morals and such during that time, rather than fighting skill.
And all those other sith raven defeated were real challanges.

It's Revan, not Raven.

You are making to mistakes.

The first, using gameplay as a demonstration of power.

The second, assuming that just because someone isn't extremely difficult for Revan to defeat, that person must suck. Revan is above Yoda in power.

Look at it this way. Dooku defeated ROTS Obi-wan. Does that mean Obi-wan sucks? No. But he still took him out without much difficulty.

Actually in the grand scale of continuum, Obi Wan was pretty bad. Yet he still was arguably in the top 3 of the ROTS Jedi Order.

Also, because Malak selected him does not necessarilly indicate he is a cut about anyone and can beat them in a duel. He very well could have picked him for his potential, or perhaps saw him as an individual who could operate the StarForge. There's just too many unknowns to crown him second best simply because he was picked.

Agreed. And Glentract, where do you get these inferences from?

Revan is more powerful than Yoda? A Jedi Council member, and several masters, joining the Sith? You need to prove up. The first point may very well be true, but there is no visible evidence of it.

Sorry. It was the general consensus here a while back, I thought it still was, so I didn;t think it was necessary to post reasons for that. I'll get to that soon.

Well, just because it is the general consensus doesn't necessarily mean its a proven fact, don't you think?

Revan in my opinion would be superior to Yoda, yet due to lack of information I cannot give solid reasons as to why.

However anyway, whilst we have little information about Bandon, it is testament to his power that he was second in the Sith Empire out of thousands of Sith.

Originally posted by Escape81
Well, just because it is the general consensus doesn't necessarily mean its a proven fact, don't you think?

I love this guy. . .

BUMP

Hmm......This is a really tough one. Katarn was a dangerous Jedi who could effectively use powers from both sides of the force while Bandon was Malak's sith apprentice who wielded a double-bladed lightsaber to a deadly effect. I dunno, I say Katarn by a very small margin.

Katarn could probably take Bandon. It'd be rough, but I don't think Bandon's good enough to take someone as crafty and seasoned as Kyle.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Think of it this way though. Out of all of the people who followed Revan, there were many Masters. Bandon was Chosen above all of the former Jedi Masters. He has to be capable.

If you were Malak would you personally chose the strongest person you can find to be the second most powerful person under you ? I personaly think that some people are above Bandon for example the leaders of the Academy on Korriban.



I personally think you're wrong here. Kyle has already run through Imperial training and became a spy / mercenary before the events shown in Dark Forces. He must be at least in his mid 20s at that point (ANH time). The events shown in Jedi Knight happen 5 years ABY which means he's at least in his late 20s there...more likely in his early 30s (he could be even older) which means he's somewhere in his mid 50s during the NJO series.

And thinking about that I don't think that Bandon would be able to defeat Kyle. Kyle has much more combat experience and when it comes down to force potential we have seen that Kyle was able to defeat 7 people personally trained by the Emperor and Vader without having any force or lightsaber training.

What did Bandon have ? Maybe some fights during the Mandalorian Wars and the War against the Republic that followed and less than one year training under Malak. Kyle on the other hand did fight and defeat tons of Dark Jedi and a huge amounts of people even without using the force (including Boba Fett, Dark Troopers, some monsters and an entire base filled with Imperial soldiers). I personally think he's more impressive when it comes down to combat when comparing him to Bandon.

Actually, read Bandon's profile on the KOTOR website, dude. It might change your mind on that first point.

All Malak really cared about was getting somebody to take over after him, its all he ever talks about really... Well he cares about more but still getting killed by his apprentice someday is very important to him. So yeah I wouldn't find it strange if he would go out and look for the most powerful. Of course he wouldn't go and see every Sith there is and test them but he would still pick the most powerful he could find. and members of the Jedi council joined him and Revan. Malak would have known about them, so Bandon was more powerful then some people of the Jedi Council.

Bandon would also have been killed if he was weak, it was the Sith way. So really he would have been very powerful, skilled and talented. To have such a position at that young a age. He could most likely take Katarn.

And I know its gameplay, but Bandon was harder to kill then Uthar when you face them both on Koriban. Now of course thats gameplay so it doesn't really count, just saying.

Technically, gameplay wise Bandon is stronger or weaker than the Korriban sith because of a little thing called level adjustment. But really in practice, Bandon was a Sith Lord, and did kill jedi in combat. Uthar just trained fledglings of little power. It'd be ridiculous to compare Uthar and Bandon and say Uthar is clearly better when you have no evidence other than a "gut feeling" from a game play experience which is fit to level.

Originally posted by Ianus
Technically, gameplay wise Bandon is stronger or weaker than the Korriban sith because of a little thing called level adjustment. But really in practice, Bandon was a Sith Lord, and did kill jedi in combat. Uthar just trained fledglings of little power. It'd be ridiculous to compare Uthar and Bandon and say Uthar is clearly better when you have no evidence other than a "gut feeling" from a game play experience which is fit to level.

I didn't want to say that Uthar is stronger than Bandon but at least those people seem to have more experience than Bandon although Bandon might have more potential and be a better duellist.

The thing is that Bandon and his two friends were killed by Revan and two of his followers when Revan and his friends didn't have reached the full extent of their powers for the game. Malak himself did simply put Revan's friends (Bastila and Carth) out of the fight when he first met Revan on the Leviathan.

So Bandon is still weaker than Malak and I don't think he can defeat Kyle Katarn who (according to NJO logic) can use Dark Side abilities, has more fighting experience and has shown the ability to cut peoples connection to the force off (he did that to Jerec and to himself).

Originally posted by Borbarad
I didn't want to say that Uthar is stronger than Bandon but at least those people seem to have more experience than Bandon although Bandon might have more potential and be a better duellist.

The thing is that Bandon and his two friends were killed by Revan and two of his followers when Revan and his friends didn't have reached the full extent of their powers for the game. Malak himself did simply put Revan's friends (Bastila and Carth) out of the fight when he first met Revan on the Leviathan.

So Bandon is still weaker than Malak and I don't think he can defeat Kyle Katarn who (according to NJO logic) can use Dark Side abilities, has more fighting experience and has shown the ability to cut peoples connection to the force off (he did that to Jerec and to himself).

I think I already stated that I think Kyle will win, so we agree on the conclusion. It's your methods I'm not agreeing with.

You're operating under the largely unsupported assumption that Revan grew in power after the battle with Bandon up until he fought Malak. Revan may very well be more powerful than Malak and Bandon starting out because of his raw potential and innate knowledge too; it's not like Revan underwent a lot of training during KOTOR. He was "trained" as a jedi inside of two weeks. Obviously his fast learning is more an attribute to regaining bits and pieces of his former knowledge as opposed to actual relearning.

So really, saying Bandon must be weak because of the time in game that he's fought doesn't really hold a lot of weight. You would have to prove first that location didn't help, the partners and their contribution, the circumstances of the fight, and whether or not Revan's fighting power grew much more beyond that fight to when he fought the Sith academy instructors.

Oftentimes the most straightforward and obvious answer is the right one. Bandon was DLOTS. Uthar wasn't.