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The setting is the Geonosis Arena. Fett's jetpack was disabled by the fourth Red Guard, who Jango managed to subsequently kill with a quick burst to the chest.

What weapons are the red guards using?

Without his jetpack? He probably loses.

But he has blasters. Wouldnt he just shoot and then bam, they're dead? The red guards have spears.

Jango. Yoda pwnd 2 Guards in a second without drawing a weapon. Surely he could take a third with hardly any more difficulty. Jango, even without his jetpack, would do better against Yoda than that.

Jango. Red Guards use Force Pikes, they couldn't touch him.

Originally posted by darthsith19
Jango. Yoda pwnd 2 Guards in a second without drawing a weapon. Surely he could take a third with hardly any more difficulty. Jango, even without his jetpack, would do better against Yoda than that.

Yoda also is a Jedi Master.

Originally posted by SS_181st_Snow
Yoda also is a Jedi Master.

my point exactly

Originally posted by SS_181st_Snow
Yoda also is a Jedi Master.
So what? The point still stands that if he could defeat 2 guards that easily surley Jango could defeat three with or without his jetpack.

Yoda is the most powerful jedimaster. I belive Jango would win yes, but not really easy. There is a difference between Jango taking down guards and Yoda taking them down. Yoda has the force, he can make it effect anyone around him, as knocking down those guards. Jango does not have that abilitie and needs to shoot them with a blaster, which can be dodged by them. If they come into melee distance I think they would win.

You can't say because Yoda can take two easily with the Force, that Jango immediately can do the same. So Exar Kun could take Vodo with no trouble, it doesn't mean Obi-Wan or Maul can do the same of close enough.

Originally posted by kamikz
Yoda is the most powerful jedimaster. I belive Jango would win yes, but not really easy. There is a difference between Jango taking down guards and Yoda taking them down. Yoda has the force, he can make it effect anyone around him, as knocking down those guards. Jango does not have that abilitie and needs to shoot them with a blaster, which can be dodged by them. If they come into melee distance I think they would win.
Jango wouldn't let them come that close. Dodge the lasers? That'd be hard. But I'm using Yoda beating them so easily as an example. He can beat them that easily but do you think he could beat jango that easily? That's my point.

No, no, no, no, no. But lets say Exar takes out 2 super battle droids with a wave of his hand. Now lets say someone makes a thread saying ROTS Obi-Wan without a saber vs. Two Super Battle Droids. Well, if Exar can beat them that easily surely Obi-Wan could at least beat them. My point is Yoda can defeat three more easily than he can defeat Jango, meanign Jango's stronger than 3.

Yes I think Yoda could take out Jango quite easy.
There is a big difference between Yoda taking them out and Jango taking them out. Yoda does not need to move nor concentrate hard to beat them, does that make Jango being able to kill them easy if he really tries hard. Well no.
Yoda can with the force send them flying wherever he wants with his mind. Mace can crush GG's stomach because he has the force, can Jango kill GG at all?? I doubt it. Jango has to hit them with his laser which could be a hard task considering the guards are the Emperors best and most trusted guards. He has to aim, focus and actually try to kill them, not letting them come close like Mace did and that would be hard since they're probably be running from 3 different directions.

Jango would kill the Red Guards. All they do is stand...big deal.

No.. They actually sleep their whole lives long.

What? No, that is not logical either. Yoda took out those two while they were unaware and with a ability Jango doesn't possess. Mace could take out Sidious, but Yoda could take Mace, yet lose to Sidious. This is true, so your theory has a loophole. While I don't doubt Jango's ability to win this fight, we can't use his relation to Yoda, considering we've never seen them fight. So Yoda could easily beat Obi-Wan, does this mean Jango could at least beat him? No.

Yes, Obi-Wan got beated by Dooku, who in turn got defeated by Anakin, who in turn got defeated by Obi-Wan. Just because Yoda can own those guards doesent make Jango able to because he has his weapons drawn.

Uh, the point here is that the Red Guards have melee weapons, and Jango sports dual pistols among other things. We know from AOTC that his accuracy is unparelleled. Hell, he shot Zam from atop a building in the neck with a saber dart without hitting cloth or the jedi nearby. That's pretty impressive.

Red guards are also impressive up close, but Jango would own them badly.

Depends on how close they are too him in the beginning of the match, if there armor can take a hit or two, if Jango is fast enough to shot 3 of them running from 3 different directions.

ROAR!!! I'm going to stab you!!!

LMAO, when is that????

It's a deleted scene with Vader choking a moff again. This time the red guards release scary sticks to threaten Vader.

Awesome, how did you get access to that?

Originally posted by kamikz
Awesome, how did you get access to that? Accidently came across it.. Don't know wich site anymore..
But I think it was a fairly well known site though.

Originally posted by Se7in
What? No, that is not logical either. Yoda took out those two while they were unaware and with a ability Jango doesn't possess. Mace could take out Sidious, but Yoda could take Mace, yet lose to Sidious. This is true, so your theory has a loophole. While I don't doubt Jango's ability to win this fight, we can't use his relation to Yoda, considering we've never seen them fight. So Yoda could easily beat Obi-Wan, does this mean Jango could at least beat him? No.
Unaware! Right, that's why they had their poles up to him, they were unaware. Sure Jango doesn't posses it, but so what. Doesn't matter. Point is Yoda could take them out easier than he could take out Jango. Jeeze. You make somthing simple turn into something complicated. Sidious let Mace beat him. Still waiting for a quote to contridict this.

GL, "Mace overpowered Sidious." WTF more do you need?

A drink.

Oops. That question wasn't to me.

On the matter of Super Battle Droids vs Force-User....

Take a Look at the Clone Wars Cartoons and the episode where mace is fighting on the planet with endless wheat like fields. He waved his hand and POOF! All the bolts and such holding the stupid thing together came out resulting it falling apart!

And on the matter of Jango VS Royal Guard...

Jango is a good shot so thats not that much of a factor.

Yussren, feats displayed in the CW Cartoon are more or less uncanon here.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
GL, "Mace overpowered Sidious." WTF more do you need?
Fine. Sidious is still more powerful, though. H eonly lost because he tried to go all out with dueling, not using the Force.

Mace OVERPOWERED Sidious. How the hell would Sidious be more POWERful?

Glentract, Anakin could overpower Dooku (Physically). Does that make him more powerful?

It doesn't say that Mace overpowered Sidious physically, now does it.

Why should Lucas spell out exactly what happens in every scene?

It certainly was not a Force battle, Glentract. All Lucas did was state the obvious: Mace Windu is in a better physical condition than Sidious.

But of course you like to tout this one quote around as evidence of Sidious' inferiority, for reasons unknown to me. Nevermind that the fight was perfectly set-up to reach the conclusion. In my opinion, there were too many coincidences for it to not have been planned by Sidious.

I don't want your foolish opinion. If you feel someway and GL states the other, why should anyone give a rats ass what you think?

It never says Mace physically overpowered Sidious, it just says overpowered.

Why didn't Sidious use the force to enhance his strength if he was so powerful?

Stop parading your BS opinion around.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
It doesn't say that Mace overpowered Sidious physically, now does it.
Overpowered: To supply with excessive mechanical power. Yes, it appears it does.

Ah, you're losing the argument so you resort to namecalling. That's cute.

I'm not the one seizing on a single quote, to the exclusion of all other evidence, and throwing it around like it's absolute proof of anything. Nor am I the one attempting to insult my opposition and telling them to "stop parading their opinions around."

Please, next time, argue against what I wrote, not against me.

Yeah, I know, don't you love it when they do that? It happens alot around here. Sorgo was the master at it. He'd insult you until you gave up and then say he won.

Ahh. How sweet. I am so glad you two are banding together to vanquish the evil Glentract.

I'm guessing that you got your definition from dictionary.com. I also notice that you chose the one that best suites your needs.

"To overcome or vanquish by superior force; subdue. " Was the first definition.

"To affect so strongly as to make helpless or ineffective; overwhelm." Was the second.

"To supply with excessive mechanical power." Was the third.

Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary online dictionary states the following for overpower, "to affect with overwhelming intensity."

Notice one of four definitions imply physical ability as related to overpowering someone.

EVEN IF Mace overpowered someone through physical superiorly, why would this work against Mace?

ROTS Mace is always going to have physical superiority over ROTS Sidious. It's never going to change.

Also, why didn't Sidious use the force to enhance his strength beyond Mace's level. Yoda does it, why doesn't Sidious?

Overall, you've proved nothing other than you fanboy level of devotion to Sidious. You have not shown that Mace overpowered Sidious only physically or why Sidious didn't use his force powers to overwhelm Mace with physical prowless. To top it all off, you have failed to prove that Sidious faked the fight with Mace Windu.

Not to gang up on you, but you're being unnecessarily sharp.

Originally posted by Darth Faunus
Not to gang up on you, but you're being unnecessarily sharp.

Yeah, I know. I'm a bit tired from several attacks by Darth Real Life and I'm a little edgy because of it.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Ahh. How sweet. I am so glad you two are banding together to vanquish the evil Glentract.

I'm guessing that you got your definition from dictionary.com. I also notice that you chose the one that best suites your needs.

"To overcome or vanquish by superior force; subdue. " Was the first definition.

"To affect so strongly as to make helpless or ineffective; overwhelm." Was the second.

"To supply with excessive mechanical power." Was the third.

Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary online dictionary states the following for overpower, "to affect with overwhelming intensity."

Notice one of four definitions imply physical ability as related to overpowering someone.

EVEN IF Mace overpowered someone through physical superiorly, why would this work against Mace?

ROTS Mace is always going to have physical superiority over ROTS Sidious. It's never going to change.

Also, why didn't Sidious use the force to enhance his strength beyond Mace's level. Yoda does it, why doesn't Sidious?

Overall, you've proved nothing other than you fanboy level of devotion to Sidious. You have not shown that Mace overpowered Sidious only physically or why Sidious didn't use his force powers to overwhelm Mace with physical prowless. To top it all off, you have failed to prove that Sidious faked the fight with Mace Windu.
Whatever. Who's to say which defination is right. But to say Mace is really the stronger of the two is complete Mace fanboyism. Don't call me a Sidious fanboy, I'm far more a Mace fanboy than a Sidious fanboy I just don't let my eyes devieve me. Why doesn't he use the Force to help him defeat Mace? You know my answer. It's always going to end up as he intended to have Mace win. Maybe if he used the Force to help him and then let Mace win Mace'd sense his great Force powers and know he lost purposefully, but by not using his Force powers he tricked Mace. Either way if you watch the Yoda duel it's extremely clear he didn't use the Force to enhance his powers. And for all the proof I've shown I don't fell like posting it again. I've posted it many, many times on many, many sites. On this one I got Nai making bad comebacks and Sorgo throwing insults back. If you want to find it help yourself.

It doesn't work against Mace, but A) it shows that Mace is not more powerful than Sidious, just physically so, and B) This is not contested. Like I said, Lucas stated the obvious: Mace is in better physical shape than Palpatine.



Who is to say that he doesn't? As well, who is to say that Mace doesn't either?

Oh, and I'd like to note that you made my argument for me: Because he threw the fight.



More namecalling. I could easily state that your "fanboy devotion" either against Sidious or for Windu is more apparent given that you have only one scrap of evidence to support you. A very weak one at that.

Like I said before, it is clear that theirs was not a Force battle, one which I maintain that Sidious would win easily. As well, either both of them used the Force to enhance their physical abilities, or Sidious didn't, or neither did. However it happened Mace would still be physically stronger.

I'll just quote myself for your last statement:

Funny. The bodies where RIGHT in the doorway.

No, they weren't. They moved to another room. Watch the sets more carefully. It moved from the "situation room" to the hallway to the "conference room." Watch the desks before and after the fight. They are certainly not the same. It's a different room.

Okay, so I rewatched that scene. Yes, it does go to the other room. You're correct. However, that was a conscious decision by Mace. I don't really see how that was part of the PLan.

How was it a conscious decision of Mace's? Did he lead Palpatine into the hallway, or was it the other way around?

Even if it was Mace "leading" then it may have been a product of Palpatine's offense. So who is leading? Palpatine. There doesn't seem to me to be a reason for Mace to leave the room. Palpatine, however, has plenty of reason to.

From what I can gather Sidious wasn't attacking at all when Mace made the decision. Mace just backed up into the hall. Obviously he'd rather have larger room; the first room was SMALL.

Then all we're left with is assumptions. My assumption is that even if Mace hadn't moved into the hall, Palpatine would have taken the fight there anyway. It makes sense and works perfectly with how events unfolded.

Well, that does make sense, but I think it's also possible that he was a benefactor of the circumstances as it were. And really, I don't think Anakin would have batted an eye over three jedi lying dead if one of them is menacing Sidious and he never really trusted them anyways. It's effect would be hard to calculate.

I don't believe that Sidious was merely lucky. He orchestrated virually every other occurance in the PT, it's not hard to believe he could have orchestrated this one.

And Anakin would have been effected by the three dead masters. He saw what Windu did as an assassination attempt. I can speculate that his feelings on the matter would be somewhat different if he saw that Sidious had struck down three other Jedi.

In self defense? Not at all. Anakin suspects the jedi of plotting to take over, and suspects they don't trust him. He could be easily swayed to think that Palpatine had to do such in order to preserve himself and more importantly the knowledge he held which could save Padme.

And while I do give Sidious his due for being a manipulative genius, I don't think he micromanaged every single blow, feint, parry, move, or otherwise unless he has foresight of unparalleled ability, which ROTJ ending proved was not the case.

Originally posted by IKC
Then all we're left with is assumptions. My assumption is that even if Mace hadn't moved into the hall, Palpatine would have taken the fight there anyway. It makes sense and works perfectly with how events unfolded.

It seems like you are trying to draw conclusions from where there are none. It is an inference that Mace drew the fight into the hall. It is an assumption that Sidious would have anyway.

No, it is an observation that Mace drew the fight into the hall, because he did. It is my assumption that the fight would have gone there anyway, because Sidious had a reason for it to.

Exactly how can my assumption be a conclusion?

I don't think that the bodies would have affected Anakin that much as long as Sidious told Anakin that he just wanted to keep the secrets that could keep Padme alive, however, just to be safe, he moved into a room where Anakin would come into first. I do know that everything played out into Sidious' hands and it was no mere coincidence. Sidious planned it.

P.S. Why would Mace want to move into a bigger room? Sidious could just get away and fry or choke him or something if the room was bigger. Oh well, this isn't a great argument (thats why it's a P.S.).

A bigger room gives both advantages. I mean, in that small room three jedi masters got saber-raped. It wasn't exactly a great battleground.