who could defeat NJO luke

Escape81

Oh, and for reference. NJO Luke has an instakill technique called the 'Emerald Lightning'. Traya and Sidious have the power to kill NJO Luke, but he is also armed with an instakill - so even then, it isn't guarenteed.

As for Ragnos and the others, they may be able to, or they may not be. I'm not a fan of individuals who are marked as powerful - but where we have not seen their capabilities. Furthermore, for people like Ragnos and Revan - who are indeed powerful - they are unknowns. You do not know if they possess instakill abilities of their own - or if they are even resistant to Luke's.

Sorry, until I see some proof where Ragnos and Revan and the others have instakills or are resistant to Luke's, I don't see why they can be considered powerful enough to kill him.

Darth243

Sidious, Vader, Hord, Vodo siossk-bass, Exar Kun

Fishy

Ragnos would take him
Nihilus would eat him
Sadow could probably take him
Freedon Nadd would probably take him.
Exar Kun could probably take him
Kresh has a nice chance so does Simus

The rest are just wild guesses they might, they might not. all of these however have a pretty good chance.

Darth_Glentract

Actually, Jedi in Luke's time(I shouldn't say Jedi, because it was only a select few, namely Vergere, Jacen, and Luke) could remove themselves from the force, making them like the Exile for a time.

So, Nihilus can't eat him, neither can Traya use her instakill on him. DE Sidious doesn't actually have a instakill, it takes a while and Lukes is faster.

Ragnos
Naga
Exar
Ludo
(maybe) Simus
(maybe) Tulak
(maybe) Ajunta
Nadd
DN Luke
LotF Luke

Darth Traya

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Actually, Jedi in Luke's time(I shouldn't say Jedi, because it was only a select few, namely Vergere, Jacen, and Luke) could remove themselves from the force, making them like the Exile for a time.

So, Nihilus can't eat him, neither can Traya use her instakill on him. DE Sidious doesn't actually have a instakill, it takes a while and Lukes is faster.

Ragnos
Naga
Exar
Ludo
(maybe) Simus
(maybe) Tulak
(maybe) Ajunta
Nadd
DN Luke
LotF Luke

Even if they can remove themselves from the force, Nihilus will still beat them.

Darth Jello

focussing purely on sith, Vader in his prime, Sidious, Plaguies, Exar Kun, Darth Revan, and probably Darth Bane.

Lightsnake

There is no way that anyone listed could beat Luke in the NJO era. He's pretty much confirmed as the strongest force user who ever lived. Hell, he's the grandson of the Force and probably surpassed his father's full potential.

The true answer is: Noone.

KOTOR may've said the Ancient Sith were the best, but Kreia never met Luke and Palpatine....Palpatine, Vader, Luke and Mace firmly outclass the KOTOR era people. Sourcebooks on nthe NJO have pretty much confirmed this

DarthMaul9123

Originally posted by Darth Traya
Even if they can remove themselves from the force, Nihilus will still beat them.
well nihilus didnt impress me at all in KOTOR II i destroyed him with no sweat on my first try

Darth Traya

Originally posted by DarthMaul9123
well nihilus didnt impress me at all in KOTOR II i destroyed him with no sweat on my first try

Gameplay means nothing. Not only that, Nihilus is weak in the gameplay because he has the Sith Lord class, but without all the feats. He's level 20, but 10 of those levels are filled with nothing, no feats, skill points, extra charateristic points, force powers.

Nihilus was able to keep a ship together through his will, waste a man who was responsible for the virtual extinction of the Jedi and keep his crew alive, even beyond death.

He is pretty much amazingly powerful.

Darth Traya

Originally posted by Lightsnake
There is no way that anyone listed could beat Luke in the NJO era. He's pretty much confirmed as the strongest force user who ever lived. Hell, he's the grandson of the Force and probably surpassed his father's full potential.

The true answer is: Noone.

KOTOR may've said the Ancient Sith were the best, but Kreia never met Luke and Palpatine....Palpatine, Vader, Luke and Mace firmly outclass the KOTOR era people. Sourcebooks on nthe NJO have pretty much confirmed this

Stop your fanboyism, now.

DarthMaul9123

ohh.. well i dont think to hard on games, and when you put it like that it is kinda obviouse

Pwned61

Originally posted by Darth Traya
Stop your fanboyism, now.

Wow, what an amazing retort, you really shot his argument to hell with an amazing display of facts and knowledge.

Face it, NJO Luke may be overated, or overpowered, but he's untouchable in the star wars universe. With the exception of nihilus, he's unbeatable. If you want proof, just look at what he's done. Manipulated gravity, black holes, used the force to move ships in space, he's even claimed to able to rip the engines out of a star destroyer.

Darth Traya

Originally posted by Pwned61
Wow, what an amazing retort, you really shot his argument to hell with an amazing display of facts and knowledge.

Face it, NJO Luke may be overated, or overpowered, but he's untouchable in the star wars universe. With the exception of nihilus, he's unbeatable. If you want proof, just look at what he's done. Manipulated gravity, black holes, used the force to move ships in space, he's even claimed to able to rip the engines out of a star destroyer.

Oh God, not another one.

Manipulated Gravity? Pah! Black Holes? Ancient Sith could play ping-pong with Stars. Move ships in Space? Oh how hard, I mean that really is superior to Exar Kun freezing all 46,000 members of the senate. Rip engines out of a Star Destroyer? Naga Sadow could rip the core out of a star.

NJO Luke is very good, but there are lots of individuals that could beat him.

Pwned61

Originally posted by Darth Traya
Oh God, not another one.

Manipulated Gravity? Pah! Black Holes? Ancient Sith could play ping-pong with Stars. Move ships in Space? Oh how hard, I mean that really is superior to Exar Kun freezing all 46,000 members of the senate. Rip engines out of a Star Destroyer? Naga Sadow could rip the core out of a star.

NJO Luke is very good, but there are lots of individuals that could beat him.

To begin with, Exar Kun. I do indeed find the senate freeze impressive, but Luke's done better. Particularly, cloaking an entire planet from sight. And Sadow, I seem to recall his ship doing most of the work with that one. In fact, doesn't Aleema use that very ship to destroy a star under Kun? Correct me if I'm wrong of course.

Escape81

Originally posted by Darth Traya
Stop your fanboyism, now.

There's no need to issue commands, Traya. We all (even you) have bias for our favorite characters. For mine, Yoda, Sidious, and Kun rank up there. Thus, I have shown glimmers of fanboyism myself. But so have you. One could argue that you're a Traya fangirl.

Not saying that you are. But it is a fact that you can argue.

calvin44

Originally posted by Escape81
There's no need to issue commands, Traya. We all (even you) have bias for our favorite characters. For mine, Yoda, Sidious, and Kun rank up there. Thus, I have shown glimmers of fanboyism myself. But so have you. One could argue that you're a Traya fangirl.

Not saying that you are. But it is a fact that you can argue.
she does act like traya though, being a fanboy of revan, as traya was.

Escape81

This situation may bring some new light to the subject.

The issues of Marka Ragnos and Darth Revan are complex ones. On the one hand, both are described as immensely powerful. Yet on the other, that does not describe what they are like, compared to other Force users. Sidious and Dooku have also been described as immensely powerful in EU works.

Part of the reason is of Kreia's infamous quote:

"We are all like children compared to the Sith of old" or something of that nature.

The funny thing is this. Kreia is a liar. A dubious source. One could argue that Kreia has no reason to lie, and indeed, she doesn't. But she is also a non-canon source describing on things that later blend with canon material. As such, her words are negated.

Ragnos has shown to defeat Simus. Revan defeated Malak. We all know that Ragnos was feared by all other Sith and that Revan was the most powerful of his time. But does that really comment on Ragnos's power. Does that fear warrant him victory over an instakill technique? No. As for Revan. There is no proof that would say he was strong enough to take down Sidious or Dooku. We all (even me) like to think that he could, but there is no proof supporting it.

The fact of the matter is this.

- Kreia can wave her hand and drain Jedi Masters of the Force to the point where they are instantly killed.

- Sidious can summon Force Storms capable of ripping apart entire fleets and transporting people across the galaxy.

- Luke can emit lightning from his fingertips that instantly kill its victim.

- Exar Kun can freeze thousands of Senators in place.

Where can you all argue that the ancient Sith have done better? In the cases of Ragnos and Revan, you can't. Fear is a fickle thing. Sidious was powerful, and he feared an untrained Luke. So, obviously - by your standards - this is a sign of inferiority. And for all of you Dooku fans. Dooku feared Sidious. So I suppose he is inferior to his master as well (I think he is, but many argue otherwise).

The point is this. Revan and Ragnos have a load of fear and rumors. So what? Until you can prove to me that they can survive instakills, or have instakill abilities of their own, I see no reason why Exar Kun, DE Sidious, NJO Luke, and Traya can't rape any of them.

Then again, I operate on fact. Not fiction.

Lightsnake

Please site evidence of a Sith playing 'ping pong' with a star...without ancient artifacts.

kamikz

I agree completly with you Escape, I've thought about it that way too.

I mean, Grievous operated on fear and beated 5 jedi at once.
The Wizard of OZ also made people fear him although he was a phony.

Pwned61

Escape81 that really was an intelligent, well thought out response. I fully intend to steal that argument in the future.

*golf clap*

Fishy

Okay about Ragnos...

He ruled unchallenged over god knows how many sith Lords of great power including people like Sadow and Kressh.. Sadow who could blow up stars, and yes he created a ship that could blow up stars as well. But he used his own knowledge and alchemy and power for that. He is as brilliant as he is powerful. Yet still he was to scared to move. Simus was untouched as well until Ragnos came along and slaughtered him, and with the Sith... Well if Ragnos was weak he would have been killed. Ragnos holds power far above any other there is no doubting this.

Revan is a far harder case to argue for but even with Revan we knew he was the most powerful of a time with some pretty powerful Jedi and Sith. He wasn't a Ragnos but he was still pretty good, he couldn't take NJO Luke though. Not with the knowledge we have of him.

Lightsnake

Sadow needed artifacts to do whatever did and we never saw Ragnos in action. And Ragnos considered Palpatine an equal. Or a better when Palpy went to Korriban

Snoopbert

*cough*

Luke: Hello, I am your god.

Goku: No you're not, I'm the god of combat!!!

Luke: *Kils Goku with mind, while simultaneously creating 42 black holes, increasing in power, and trainign 111119 Jedi.

Luke: Next.

*Every single Sith Lord mentioned in EU or OM waltzes up*

Combined: We will kill you.

Luke: No you won't. You see, I have the power of fanboyism, overbearing, favoritist, and DragonBall Z inspired artists. I'll kill you, without even twitching.

*The entire ensemble collapses, dead*

Luke: I will now father a child who will become even more powerful than I.

Darth_Glentract

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Please site evidence of a Sith playing 'ping pong' with a star...without ancient artifacts.

It's not like they are going to fight naked.

I can do the same thing, please site evidence of Luke doing anythin in ESB or after without artifacts. You can't because he always had the kaiburr crystal with him.

Lightsnake

No, he didn't. There is never anything to suggest or prove he ever used the damn thing again as it is NEVER mentioned. Not once. When does it ever say he used a Kaiburr crystal? Even as a spirit, he gets the better of Kun, he cloaks a planet from view, he moves black holes, slices through an army of Vong, kills an elite group of slayers and then kills Shimrra while nearly mortally wounded. He also defeats DE Sidious in combat, recovers from the Dark Side, took out the Dark Side Elite, plus other feats scattered over the books...

Darth Traya

Splinter of the mind's eye. Luke takes the Kaiburr crystal from the temple on Pomojema.

Lightsnake

I know that. SotmE is largely ignored in the EU and that Kaiburr crystal is never mentioned again...

Darth Traya

Well, aside from some notes, like the charging lightsabre business, it is canon.

Lightsnake

Luke would've lost that saber though on Bespin. And since he's never mentioned to have or use it again, we don't know what's what there

Darth_Glentract

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Luke would've lost that saber though on Bespin. And since he's never mentioned to have or use it again, we don't know what's what there

He gave it to Mara.

Luke didn't put it in that saber though, he put it in the one that he uses later. He also doesn't have to use it, it's always "on".

Lightsnake

Which means nothing as the Kaiburr crystal is never used or seen again...he's never mentioned to have it after Splinter of the Mind's Eye at all. Kaiburr crystals themselves were totally forgotten

Darth_Glentract

Look in the new Essential Guide to Chronology. He did use it and keep it with him and it increased his power by a lot.

Lightsnake

I'm looking and it's not mentioned. The Kaiburr crystal's power decreases heavily when it's away from the temple too, so it'd be near worthless off Mimban. Here we are:

"The Recovered Kaiburr crystal did not perform as expected, Mimban appeared to be a planet with a biosphere that magnified the Force. Luke discovered the power of the Kaiburr crystal decreased in direct proportion from its distance from Mimban and more specifically the temple of Pomojema itself."

Darth_Glentract

On Mimban it was supposed to make the user 1000 times more powerful. Even if it only worked at .1% of how much it would on Mimban, Luke would be twice as powerful.

Lightsnake

It'd have lost its powers completely after a while. The only trace of its power is in the lightsaber.

And .1 percent of 1000 is just 1.

Darth_Glentract

Yes, it increases his power by the original amount, which added to his natural power is 2. 1 + 1 = 2.

Where is your proof that is became completely worthless? It decreases a lot, but it still makes a heavy effect on the user.

Lightsnake

One times as powerful?

And it says here Luke only used it as an oddity and kept it in the temple for lessons....meaning it was blown to pieces with the other temple artifacts when the Vong destroyed the temple

Darth_Glentract

Luke still has the shard that was in his lightsaber and the piece of it that he keeps with him. It never says he kept it in the Temple.

Lightsnake

It says he kept it there as a curiosity for lessons to the Jedi he was training. The shard in the lightsaber could easily be Mara's saber and a small shard that weakens periodically and just strengths the saber?

He never kept a piece with him, either that's never even hinted at

Darth_Glentract

It says he used it as a teaching item. Never does it say that he kept it there. It also says that later he experimented in using it as a focusing crystal for his lightsaber. Pre-Endor would not be later.

Lightsnake

It states nowhere that he kept it on him and NJO said the most valuable Jedi artifacts were destroyed in the temple by the Vong...this point'd be neutral, now.

Darth_Glentract

Why wouldn't he keep it with him if it increased his power? We know he kept part of it in his saber, why would he leave the rest behind?

Lightsnake

Why would he, especially when it was deadened to the point of almost no use in a time he thought was peaceful? This is a dead point now.

Darth_Glentract

During the Yuuzhan Vong War was not a peaceful time. He would bring all of the power he could to himself when attacking, and he did.

Like I said, even if it only was a thousandth as powerful as it normally would be, it would double his strength.

Lightsnake

He was forced off Yavin...since the most powerful artifacts were destroyed there, that could include the Kaiburr crystal.

At one thousandth, mathwise, it'd not help his srngth at one. Once one is still one. Plus, he went originally to the Vong wars for diplomacy and wasn't back on Yavin in time to save the temple

Darth_Glentract

He would still take it with him. Many artifacts were destroyed, but no mention of the Kaiburr crystal is made as being one of them.

It would increase his power by one. Added to his original, thats two. If you can't see that, then you are blind.

Lightsnake

No mention the Kaiburr wASN'T destroyed and it said THE most powerful artifacts were destroyed.

Face it, this is a moot point as he's never mentioned to have the Kaiburr crystal once in all of NJO. and it'd Multiply his power by one. One times one is one. Nothing said anything about addition

Darth_Glentract

He actually is. He is said to have part of it in his lightsaber. And it's not multiply, it adds to it.

You have to prove that it was destroyed. Burden of proof is on you in this instance.

Lightsnake

Considering:
A. he's never mentioned with it.
B. It'd be almost worthless, a SHARD would do nothing but increase the saber as said in guide to tech.
C. It said THE greatest artifacts were destroyed and the Kaiburr crysal's never mentioned again...
I may not be able to prove exactly it was destroyed, but you can't prove it wasn't and that Luke used it

Darth_Glentract

You're not understanding what I am saying. Unless you can prove that it was destroyed, it can't be considered that it was.

A shard would still make him more powerful. Even if it was a tenth of it and it was a hundreth as powerful as it normally would be, it would double his power.

It was mentioned in the Essential Guide to Chronology.

Lightsnake

and there's NO WAY to determine if he EVER used it. I'm going to go into the old marvel comics in a few minutes to determine it.

And it was a SPARE saber he made when he used it to fight Lumiya, one with a noticeably blue blade. I'm looking at the exact section in the chronology, NO WHERE is it said it made Luke stronger and no where is it said he carried it. Unless you can prove he did and it made him much stronger- a shard, which'd be 1/1000th already and decreasing massively...

Darth_Glentract

It is logical that he would use it. Also, no where does it say that it decreases to 1000th off Pomojema, that was just a figure I made up to show you that it will help him no matter where he is.

Lightsnake

and you have zero proof of that considering it loses power away from Mimban and even more over time. What effect do you think thirty years'll have?

and he doesn't use it in his saber...that shard is the only confirmed thing he took of it, 1, and 2: He doesn't use the spare saber with it. It's a different blade color. The only other one was used with Lumiya's light whip. Luke uses his green saber

Darth_Glentract

There is no proof that it decreases over time, it just says distance.

He could easily have put it in both and logically he would have.

Lightsnake

A small shard was all he had. The Beam is noticeably different colored with a Kaibur shard as the focusing...Luke's spare saber with the Kaibur shard was never used again after he fought Lumiya.

Darth_Glentract

Prove that it was noticably diferent because of the Kaiburr Crystal.

Lightsnake

blade intensity and the color was different than the green Luke uses

Darth_Glentract

That could be because he used a different focusing crystal in it. I said prove that the Kaiburr crystal resulted in the different color, which you have failed to do. You have no proof that the intensity was different, since Luke's green was is far more powerful then an average lightsaber.

Lightsnake

In the comic, we see that the blade is a blue color and far brighter and more intense than his green one. He uses both simultaneously when he beats Lumiya.Lumiya's lightwhip is also far more intense and bright than the average saber

And Luke's lightsaber is no stronger than another one...is Anakin Solo's lightsaber stronger just because Ganner killed a thousand or so Vong with it?

Darth_Glentract

Luke's green saber cut through the Slayer armor which normal lightsabers couldn't cut through. It is a lot more powerful. A brighter lightsaber doesn't necessarily mean more powerful. And, to prove your statement, please post pictures of both lightsabers.

Lightsnake

Jacen and Jaina also cut through Slayer armor, so? Kyp killed one as well. That's Luke's power coming into play

And post pictures of the lightsabers? I'll see if I can find any.

Darth_Glentract

Kyp lost to four of them because his lightsaber couldn't hurt them.

Jacen was able to stab one that Luke had already fried and nearly killed. Jaina didn't defeat one as far as I remember. Point is, regular lightsabers couldn't damage the armor, yet Luke's cut through it with ease.

Lightsnake

Kyp also killed one before he went down.

Luke's power again. And he didn't cut at their armor, he cut at gaps and at their heads. and Jacen killed more than one.

Darth_Glentract

No he didn't. No Jacen didn't kill more then one.

Lightsnake

There were....a dozen when the fighting started. Luke killed seven of them or so. let me get tUF

Darth_Glentract

There were 13, actually.

ssj3gohan007

The Kaiburr Crystal would considerably increase luke's power and potential beyond maybe even Anakin's. point is that he probably was not that far away from the planet, so he got a decent amount of extra power that made him as powerful as he was. He was able to do feats with his saber that regular sabers couldnt.

Lightsnake

And what happened to the ones Jacen was besting? and not one did Luke attack their armor.

Lightsnake

Actually, Mimban is well out of the way and Luke didn't ahve the Kaibur crystal

Darth_Glentract

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Actually, Mimban is well out of the way and Luke didn't ahve the Kaibur crystal

Prove up or shut up. Burden of proof is one you.

Lightsnake

Actually it's on you as you said he had it. Quote now. His saber is described as green. The Kaiburr one is blue. Point in my favor. Your turn

Darth_Glentract

I can play this game too. There is no reason to believe that the lightsaber was blue because of the Kaiburr Crystal was in it. Essentiail Guide to Chronology, Luke later experimented with putting peices of the crystal in his lightsaber. First point mutes your point, second is in my favor. Your turn.

Lightsnake

And the lightsaber he used it with was noticeably far brighter with a more intensely lit blade. Since all he had was a shard and he never cut through a Slayer's armor, the point's moot

Darth_Glentract

Reread TUF, he did cut through their armor several times. Also note that the brightness of a lightsaber does not mean the blade is more powerful. Point un-muted and back in my favor.

Lightsnake

No. He goes under the armit, across the eye and through the eye. Next.

And also note the Kaibur Crystal itself made the blade more intense. Funny that. It was so intense and bright because of the Kaibur crystal. It was the same with the Lightwhip

Darth_Glentract

All of those are armored. They were armored mask.

Prove that the Kaiburr crystal caused that.

Lightsnake

Because we see another non-Kaiburr'd Lightsaber right beside it and Lumiya saying "So, you put the Kaiburr shard in your saber."
On first sight.

ssj3gohan007

Interesting but did you not think maybe just maybe lumiya just sensed the power increase through the force, not the eyes

Lightsnake

How do you sense a power increase to an object? Especially as Lumiya's lightwhip had the same qualities thanks to a shard she'd added

ssj3gohan007

normal people can't, but if your a force user you can use the force to sense the power of a person, place, or thing, its part of the mysteries of the force

Lightsnake

If that were true, a lot of things would've been different....ORder 66 for one

ssj3gohan007

Not necessarily, It was only 1 Jedi vs thousands of Jango Fetts you could say, they were outmatched.

Lightsnake

They wouldn't have been totally caught off guard by it

ssj3gohan007

but it would make little difference, they might have killed more clones but the end would of been the same.

DarthMaul9123

only the early stage arcs were anything like jango

kamikz

I think he was merely judging how outnumbered the jedi were. These were very skilled soldiers and they were alot more than the jedi.

Treeherder

Fett could take him....Fett could take anybody!

Seriously tho, since you've said nothing about the fight, how it would go down or anything. I think Fett would take him down.

All he would need are a few ysalmiri and Luke is no different than anybody else. I'm not going to pretend it would be easy but Fett is a crafty man, really crafty and I think he could pull it off and get the ysalmiri close enough to Luke to kill his force ability.

Unless you define the fight more or gave it terms anybody who is smart enough could manage this. =P

kamikz

Fett take down NJO Luke, LMAO.

Treeherder

Originally posted by kamikz
Fett take down NJO Luke, LMAO.

Alright well if Fett did use the Ysalmiri and null the force through them what does Luke have?

If Fett didn't have the Ysalmiri to null the force than yeah. Luke would own him up something fierce. Not doubting it man but nobody defined the fight...so is Fett not allowed to use the Ysalmiri? I figured if he can bring Luke to somewhere of his choice somehow than he could do it with the Ysalmiri nulling the force.

But hey man, if you can prove me wrong than I'm all for it.

The brotherhood from ruusan could take NJO Luke as well since they made the thought bomb, that trapped every jedi and siths force essence. Even Luke couldn't withstand that.

kamikz

WTH is the Ysalmiri? Even if he had that though (whatever it is) Luke could kill him instantly.

If Jango has the "almighty Ysalmiri" why didn't he use it on the jedi on Geonosis or Obi??

(sorry if it came out a little harsh, didn't mean it that way).

Treeherder

Originally posted by kamikz
WTH is the Ysalmiri? Even if he had that though (whatever it is) Luke could kill him instantly.

If Jango has the "almighty Ysalmiri" why didn't he use it on the jedi on Geonosis or Obi??

(sorry if it came out a little harsh, didn't mean it that way).

Hehe, It's alright, didn't come out harsh at all.

Ysalmiri are sloth like creatures that, for lack of better word can create a bubble around them that pushes the force away. So if Fett wore one say around his neck any force attack Luke would use would go to the bubble and than just....nothing...

L -------force attack------( F )

L= Luke.

Lines are say force lighting or choke or whatever.

( ) are the Ysalmiri force bubble (I don't know how big this really is)

F - Fett.

Now they are part of the Force but for some reason they can manipulate it and push it away. *shrug* I don't know how they work, heh, but thats what they do. They arn't like the Vong tho, they are part of the force but can just maniuplate it like no other force user can.

Either way with a Ysalmiri around Fett's neck the only thing he'd have to fear would be Lukes sabers which is dangerous enough but if Luke could say be brought into a room where they are and bubbles are just overlapping and such.....he's got nothing to warn him of attacks or anything.

Course luke also wouldn't be able to pre-guess him either since he wouldn't be able to see into his head with the Ysalmiri around his neck. So it would all be reacting and trying to guess each others moves which level's the playing feilding alot.

Anybody could really use that tatic with the Ysalmiri. Wedge could probably pull it off. =P

Why Jango didn't even use one *shrug* Why Boba didn't ever use one...*shrug* I can't say really because I don't know but like I said. Define the fight a bit more and give it some limitations. Either way, without a Ysalmiri (or a thought bomb) the only other person who could stand up against Luke would be another Force user.

Unless you mean of course about who(force users) Could defeat Luke...than I've no idea....I don't know enough about alot of Jedi to really say.

(I seriously hope that made sense to you. Sometimes what makes sense to me doesn't make sense to others when I type it out, so sorry if it's confusing)

Lightsnake

Without the Force to aid him, Luke is still far faster than Fett and if Luke can kill literally thousands of Yuuzhan Vong without the force guiding him there, Fett's little chance. Plus, at this point, Fett'd be...into his seventies? In one story, his physical prowess has been declining. He'd have trouble taking on Han Solo, let alone a full fledged Jedi Master, even with a ysalmiri

Treeherder

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Without the Force to aid him, Luke is still far faster than Fett and if Luke can kill literally thousands of Yuuzhan Vong without the force guiding him there, Fett's little chance. Plus, at this point, Fett'd be...into his seventies? In one story, his physical prowess has been declining. He'd have trouble taking on Han Solo, let alone a full fledged Jedi Master, even with a ysalmiri

Well yeah, Fett is old....but at this point all the sith and Jedi other have listed are dead so nobody could Defeat NJO Luke during his Time. =P

My Apologies if this topic was actually ment at during the time for I was going on anybody in the sw universe from anytime.

That being said Fett in his prime would just have to stay away from Luke. He's got his Jet Pack for that. It would be a hard fight because even with a Ysalmiri luke does have fast reflexes and since the bubble is around Fett Luke can still use the force to throw things at him and deflect bolts back at him. Fett would REALLY have to plan it out. It's possible is what I'm saying. Sure Fett doesn't have the greatest odds but he's pulled off some crazy stuff before and he's a brillant person. I think Fett could pull it off if he thought it through enough and planned it out well.

If he was thrown down into an Arena with a ysalmiri and had no planning or anything and was forced to fight Luke......eh, even tho I love Fett, I know that his chances are slim to none.

I mean I'm not saying that Fett WOULD win, but if it happened....I'd take a risk and put my money on Fett if he could pick the fight, where it took place and all that jazz.

Lightsnake

Luke is fast enough to wield a lightsaber to make it seem he was using twenty and he's a very smart fighter. Fett's good, one of the best....the jetpack is an exploitable weakness, too

Illustrious

Originally posted by Escape81
Where can you all argue that the ancient Sith have done better? In the cases of Ragnos and Revan, you can't. Fear is a fickle thing. Sidious was powerful, and he feared an untrained Luke. So, obviously - by your standards - this is a sign of inferiority. And for all of you Dooku fans. Dooku feared Sidious. So I suppose he is inferior to his master as well (I think he is, but many argue otherwise).

The point is this. Revan and Ragnos have a load of fear and rumors. So what? Until you can prove to me that they can survive instakills, or have instakill abilities of their own, I see no reason why Exar Kun, DE Sidious, NJO Luke, and Traya can't rape any of them.

Then again, I operate on fact. Not fiction.

The Emperor feared Luke for being the one to dethrone him. Naga Sadow feared him to the point where he followed him. Different kinds of fear.

Secondly, that point is BS. You see no reason why they can't rape them, therefore they can? The whole point of absence of evidence is that it's an ABSENCE of evidence, not evidence for or contrary to.

That entire argument is BS.

Dark Aristokrat

Amen to that.

Illustrious

I could just as easily say "there is no evidence for Sidious, Kun, Luke, or Traya to being as uber as Ragnos" (and if I were to believe the narration and commentary by various individuals, I could easily come to that conclusion), therefore Ragnos rapes them.

That doesn't compute.

In fact, I use that data, extrapolation and inference based on logically accepted means, and there is the argument. As long as the fanboys don't have anything to counter valid first order logical reasoning, they can get into feat wars until they're blue in the face and it won't establish anything.

Lightsnake

The problem is, pretty much anything about Ragnos is total and complete conjecture

zephiel7

I think

Exar Kun
Marka Ragnos
Anakin Skywalker (Full potential)
Anakin Skywalker (Not full potential)
Revan
Darth Nihilus
Darth Sion
Darth Traya (maybe)
God
Me

Mider999

ok these are the things this NJO skywalker is famous for that i know of

being able to make black holes
being able to insta kill someone
and also being able to cloak entire planets

cant palpatine create worm holes and if he can, cant he also cloak entire planets and if any sith was to put enough power into there lightning shouldnt it be insta kill anyway.

Darth Sexy

Originally posted by Illustrious
The Emperor feared Luke for being the one to dethrone him. Naga Sadow feared him to the point where he followed him. Different kinds of fear.

Secondly, that point is BS. You see no reason why they can't rape them, therefore they can? The whole point of absence of evidence is that it's an ABSENCE of evidence, not evidence for or contrary to.

That entire argument is BS.

Different kinds of fear yes, but at the end both sets of fear are based on power. Sidious was afraid of luke's power. Sadow hated, feared, AND respected Ragnos because of Ragnos' power.

There's no logical deduction here about anybody beating NJO Luke.. Lets go down the list shall we?
1. Ragnos- He would be MY choice but unfortunately there is shit on him.
2. Sidious- By DE he was the most powerful sith of all time, his feats are self explanatory to anyone who has read the comics. However he would not measure up to NJO Luke.
3. Revan- My favorite sith. Uber powerful but wouldn't measure up to the likes of DE Sidious..
4. Kun- an amulet blast and a sexy stasis field..Very impressive as a ghost but also wouldn't measure up to NJO Luke..
5. Sadow- illusions? Wow.. He was a sith alchemist not a fighter
6. Ajunta Pall- wow, lets just add all the unknowns because we hate the NJO..

Anyways this thread seems old so I dont know why it was resurrected..

San'Doria

thought this thread died ages ago

Mider999

you should add darth nihilus

San'Doria

that depends though if luke loops out before nihilus strikes then bye nihilus. Anyways i doubt luke even knew about him. by JA he was a jedi master who knew the history of the old republic, he taught all he knew about history to his students and when he mentioned the sceptor of ragnos could drain the force, his student sounded suprised and asked "how could any1 do that", and Lukes reply was "I'm Not sure"

that means that luke had never heard of a force drain. I mean its silly for him to say he isnt sure if he already knew about force drain

Prodigal Knight

Seriously people, Luke is the strongest Jedi or Sith in existence. Nobody can kill him. His saber skils were said that to be like twenty lightsabers and his Force skill is extremely powerful. His Emerald Lightning could own hordes of Jedi and Sith. There's people who can certainly contend with him, but to beat him, nope.

That's just the fact as of right in the Star Wars universe. And this thread is way old.

Mider999

i dont know what makes you think he's the strongest ok he opens warm holes so what so did paplatine, oh the emerald lightning stuff so what they can shield it cant they or dodge it, cloaking an entire planet im sure others could do that, can he make stars go nova, or destroy whole planets, if he doesnt know about the force drain then how can he know all the powers of the force there might just be someone who has something up his or her sleeve that he wont see comming.