Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Any one tells who me, i should have put this in the comic book questions thread is gay !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (No offense to gay people)

How strong and durable are the following :

Ult Iron Man
Ult Thor
Ult Hulk
Ult Colossus
Ult Giant man
Captain Britain and co
Cap Mar Vehl


Please, Im desperate ??????????

you should have put this in the comic book question thread



handbooks suck, they often contradict things the characters have been shown capable of doing in the actual comics

Originally posted by Scoobless
you should have put this in the comic book question thread



handbooks suck, they often contradict things the characters have been shown capable of doing in the actual comics

You Suck !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Handbooks have a difficult job they try and make sense of different writers opinions, ideas and a messed up continuity. Thats why handbooks are the best reference.

Ok, I want to say this though. It's an example how handbooks are odd.

Before his first handbook appearance, Namor had lifted things that weighed well past 100 tons, and never shown struggling with them. Handbook writers put his strenght as Class 85 IN WATER. He had flew with WWII fighters that fly well past 60 MPH. In handbook, his speed was 40 MPH. He made whirlpools by swimming, writers put his swimming speed as 60 MPH which is less then Sailfish can swim, even though the comics had stated that Namor can swim far, far faster then any undersea creature. And he had done similar feats for fourty years before the first handbook was created.

Now, I want to ask this.

Where the **** did the writers of handbooks base Namor's bio? Did they research him AT ALL?

Originally posted by Sir Whirlysplat
Handbooks have a difficult job they try and make sense of different writers opinions, ideas and a messed up continuity. Thats why handbooks are the best reference.

I just want to prove to Olympian that Ultimate Colossus is stronger than the 616 one !

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Ok, I want to say this though. It's an example how handbooks are odd.

Before his first handbook appearance, Namor had lifted things that weighed well past 100 tons, and never shown struggling with them. Handbook writers put his strenght as Class 85 IN WATER. He had flew with WWII fighters that fly well past 60 MPH. In handbook, his speed was 40 MPH. He made whirlpools by swimming, writers put his swimming speed as 60 MPH which is less then Sailfish can swim, even though the comics had stated that Namor can swim far, far faster then any undersea creature. And he had done similar feats for fourty years before the first handbook was created.

Now, I want to ask this.

Where the **** did the writers of handbooks base Namor's bio? Did they research him AT ALL?

Agreed he's one of the characters, with Wonderman and Photon whose needs a serious upgrade ! If Ult colossus is listed as level 7, so should Wonder man / Iron Man and definitely Namor. I consider all of these guys to be stronger !

Oh cum on .... some one must have bought it ?

Originally posted by Fishy 500
Oh cum on .... some one must have bought it ?
I was just at the shop and I seen it but ....................


I have learned not to trust handbooks

Originally posted by thesilverspider
I was just at the shop and I seen it but ....................


I have learned not to trust handbooks

Did you have a rummage ?

Originally posted by Fishy 500
Did you have a rummage ?

Originally posted by thesilverspider


What ?

Ultimate Colossus is a 6 in strength and 6 in durability....Ultimate Thor is a 6 in strength and 5 in durability.....and Ultimate Hulk is a 7 in strength and a 6 in durability.....(Ultimate Thing is a 6 in strength and 6 in durability too, but his handbook came out a while ago)

I didnt buy it, since i dont ever buy handbooks.....but i skimmed thru it and remember all that...

Originally posted by Valeciano
Ultimate Colossus is a 6 in strength and 6 in durability....Ultimate Thor is a 6 in strength and 5 in durability.....and Ultimate Hulk is a 7 in strength and a 6 in durability.....(Ultimate Thing is a 6 in strength and 6 in durability too, but his handbook came out a while ago)

I didnt buy it, since i dont ever buy handbooks.....but i skimmed thru it and remember all that...


Cheers !

Are you sure Ultimate Colossus is a 6 in strength ?

What about Iron Man ?

Poor Thor.

Originally posted by The Ion
Poor Thor.

It was expected ! His strength is hardly impressive !

Im surprised about Colossus being a 6 in strength !

It's not the strength rating that surprises me, it's the durability. A 5 is pretty weak for the supposed Norse God of Thunder.

Originally posted by The Ion
It's not the strength rating that surprises me, it's the durability. A 5 is pretty weak for the supposed Norse God of Thunder.



Especially seeing as he took on the entire Ultimates team ! He should have level 6 durability and Colossus should level 7 strength !

Anyone else ?

Ultimate Thor has a 6 in durabilty not a 5 and strength he is a 6 also. A 7 in speed and a 4 in energy projection.

Colossus has a strength level of 6 but it says he can move a submarine that weighs thousands of tons.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Ultimate Thor has a 6 in durabilty not a 5 and strength he is a 6 also. A 7 in speed and a 4 in energy projection.

Colossus has a strength level of 6 but it says he can move a submarine that weighs thousands of tons.

As can Namor, who is also listed as Level 6 !

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Ultimate Thor has a 6 in durabilty not a 5 and strength he is a 6 also. A 7 in speed and a 4 in energy projection.

Colossus has a strength level of 6 but it says he can move a submarine that weighs thousands of tons.

This confirms my suspicions that Level 6 does not actually mean 75 - 100 tons !

She Hulk, Namor, Wonderman, Ultron, Thing, Ultimate Collosus, Iron Man, Atlas have alll shown they can lift in excess of over 100 tons and yet they are all listed as level 6. I think this gives more Support to the idea that we should ignore the Numerical values associated with the strength system!!!!!!!!!!!

Level 6 does not mean from 75 - 100 tons !

I my oppinion Level 6 now stand for :

The character has demonstrated strength in excess of 100 tons, but has shown measurable limits to their strength !



Level 5 should be 25 - 100 tons

Originally posted by Fishy 500
As can Namor, who is also listed as Level 6 ! True. But none of Namors bios say he can lift thousands of tons either.

But comics do.

Meh! the handbook says Sasquatch can only lift 75 tons, but he has been shown to lift way more than that. Such as tossing a DC-10 1000 feet, as well as lifting a Destroyer our of the water.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
But comics do. Well Colossus has both.

That's why handbooks:

What is Hulks best strength feat? because it seems's in the Ultimate Universe Hulk has not done anything comparable to Colossus, but they still have him ranked higher.

I'd say they've ranked him higher just because he is the Hulk. Strongest one there is. He hasn't done anything yet to match Colossus' feats, but he probably will eventually.

Or he might not. He seems more interested in eating people and uhh, satisfying himself will the local women.

Originally posted by Lucid Lui
I'd say they've ranked him higher just because he is the Hulk. Strongest one there is. He hasn't done anything yet to match Colossus' feats, but he probably will eventually.

Or he might not. He seems more interested in eating people and uhh, satisfying himself will the local women. I agree.

He's the Hulk so he has to be the strongest.

Is Ult Thor really a god of thunder?

Originally posted by joesha28
Is Ult Thor really a god of thunder?
Well I guess so since Ultimate loki is gonna come out.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Colossus has a strength level of 6 but it says he can move a submarine that weighs thousands of tons.

"Echo-II class submarines are 115.4 meters long and have 5,760 tonnes displacement submerged."

http://www.bellona.no/en/international/russia/navy/northern_fleet/decommissioning/25241.html

The Kursk was 155 metres long and had an 18,300 metric tonne displacement. I think when the hull is breached and a submarine takes on water it's mass is more than it's displacement (?) and deep sea pressure also increases the effective weight (?).

Ultimate Thor now has a character entry on the www.immortalthor.net
site, with stats.


ULTIMATE THOR

First Appearance: The Ultimates #4

Real Name: Thor or Thorlief Golmen
Known Aliases: None
Identity: (Thor) publicly known; (Golmen) known to authorities
Occupation: Guardian deity; formerly psychiatric nurse
Citizenship: (Thor) Asgard; (Golmen) Norway
Place of Birth: (Thor) Asgard; (Golmen) Norway
Known Relatives: (Thor) Odin (father), Loki (half-brother); (Golmen) Gunnar Golmen (brother)
Group Affiliation: Formerly Ultimates
Education: Unrevealed

Height: 6'5"
Weight: 285 lbs
Eyes: Blue
Hair: Blond

Abilities & Accessories: Thor possesses immense superhuman strength, endurance, and resistance to injury. Much of his power seems to come from his belt, which is either powered by advanced technology or Norse iconography. His hammer, Mjolnir, enables him to fly, control storms, direct thunder and lighting, and teleport.

Intelligence: Normal
Strength: Superhuman (75-100 ton range)
Speed: Warp Speed (transcending light speed)
Durability: Superhuman
Energy Projection: Medium range, duration, single energy type
Fighting Skills: Experienced fighter

History: He claims he is the legendary Norse thunder deity Thor, sent to Earth by his father Odin. Official records say he is Thorlief Golmen, who stole his scientist brother Gunnar Golmen's super-soldier technology. Both accounts agree that he believed he was different from an early age, but only came to believe he was Thor after suffering a nervous breakdown just before turning 30, spending the next 18 months in an asylum. After discovering (or stealing, as the case may be) his powers, Thor began spreading his message of social change through lecture tours and books. He initially refused to join the Ultimates, but did help them subdue the monstrous Hulk after the U.S. President met Thor's demand of doubling the U.S.'s foreign aid budget. Thor began working with the Ultimates thereafter, forming a fast friendship with teammate Tony Stark (Iron Man). He helped the Ultimates in their attempt to recruit Hawk-Owl; though Thor declined fulltime Ultimates duty, he reliably aided the team against serious threats. He helped defeat the extraterrestrial Chitauri invasion force, and neutralized a Chitauri doomsday weapon which would have destroyed the solar system. After failing to prevent Magneto from breaching the SHIELD Triskelion, Thor battled X-Men members Storm and Colossus, finding the latter's strength matched his own. When Norman Osborn's "Six" attacked the White House, Thor defeated fellow lightning wielder Electro. He also helped the Ultimates and Fantastic Four gather information about the world destroyer Gah Lak Tus.

Thor met (or hallucinated) fellow Asgardian warrior Volstagg the Voluminous, who warned that Thor's evil half-brother Loki had escaped from the "room without doors," and that the Ultimates were pawns of the New World Order. Quitting the Ultimates in protest after they began operating uninvited in foreign countries, Thor was publicly accused by Captain America of leaking team secrets. Thor later intervened to protect protestors from police at an Italian demonstration against the European Defense Initiative's super-soldier program. Persuaded by Gunnar Golmen that Thor was simply a madman using stolen technology, the Ultimates and the E.D.I. hunted down Thor in Norway, attacking him despite his claims that Gunnar was actually Loki in disguise. Thor held his own until Quicksilver removed his belt, depriving him of his powers. Thor currently resides in a high-security cell in the Triskelion, where he is haunted by gloating visions of Gunnar/Loki warning of a traitor in the Ultimates' ranks.

that's been there for a while... i used it in the tourney drafts (but he got banned )

I want to know how strong Ultimate Captain America is. He took the Hulk down with a few punches, and beat on Giant Man. Maybe the super-soldier serum gives him temporary access to great strength, when he concentrates.

Don't think so, and I think Juggernaut has lv 7 in strength, has he shown limits to his strength.

displacement really has more to do with the weight/volume ratio of water than it does with the weight of the displacing item. if a certain volume of water weighs 18,000 tons, and the submarine displaces that much, it only means that the submarine has that same volume, not that same weight. for example, a marble could displace a negligible amount of water from a glass, but still weigh several grams. a marshmallow, while much larger, could weigh the same amount as the marble, but displace a much larger volume of water.

saying they can lift a sub with a displacement of x amount of weight doesn't mean they can lift x amount of weight.

What the hell are the Ultimates? all seem to be some super-soldier.

Is there an entry on the Ultimate Captain Marvel? I'd love to see scans of that...

....................?

>.>...

Originally posted by Lucid Lui
Is there an entry on the Ultimate Captain Marvel? I'd love to see scans of that... Yes there is. If I'm not too drunk when I get home tonight I'll scan it for you.

If not you might have to remind me.

Ahh, cool. Thanks alot

So I'm guessing last night was a good one for Mr. Dogg?

Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman


I think this gives more Support to the idea that we should ignore the Numerical values associated with the strength system!!!!!!!!!!!



That was my idea!!!

Originally posted by Lucid Lui
Is there an entry on the Ultimate Captain Marvel? I'd love to see scans of that...

He's puny as hell

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/4828/image115jg.th.jpg

Anyone want any scans from this handbook just ask and i'll help you out if im not in a lazy mood.

U know i got luv for you Yahman lol:

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/7289/image137mg.th.jpg

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/5987/image251gv.th.jpg

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/2156/image271dc.th.jpg

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/9204/image444mi.th.jpg

Thats enough of that. I dont like you that much

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
He's puny as hell

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/4828/image115jg.th.jpg I think he's cool. One of my more favourite Ultimazed characters yet.

Thanks for the scans

wolvie is 5'9 now

Do they have entries on Ult. Captain Britain and/or Hawk-Owl? Scans of those would be muchly appreciated.

bump... ?

Ultimate Colossus kind of sucks according to the handbook.

Here's Captain Britain:
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y116/anticryste/TOHOTUMUTUXM2005page10.jpg

Ultimate Ironman is the shit acording to the handbook.

Thanks for the scan xmarksthespot


Yeah, the handbook shows just how powerful Ult. Iron Man could be if it didn't have drunked piloting it.

Lucid who is that in your avatar I thinks its Sinister, but im not sure?

It's Gladiator when he was possesed by the Uni-Power...

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
That was my idea!!!

The new A - Z supports the idea even more .... they haven't even put the values in the back of the book !!!!!!!!!!

They have gone a bit crazy with the values as well !! A lot of people who don't deserve it have been given 7 for durability, including Atlas who has deservedly been given a 7 for strength ! I cant understand why Atlas can be a 7 for durability when Count Nefaria is only a 6 !

Evidence to proof how shit the numerical values are :

Akethma Ultrons robot biatch has been given a level 5 for strength, meaning she bench presses between 25 and 75 tons.

And yet during the Ultron unlimited serries, she was able to pick up Vision with one hand, while he was in his ultra dense form and weighed over 90 tons. Note that Vision even stated he weighed this much during the same comic. Akethma then proceeded to throw Vision like a tennis ball, with enough force to flatten Thor. With this in mind it safe to say she can lift more than 75 tons !

New Numerical System employed by Marvel, according to Yahman

Level 5 : Able to lift between 25 and 100 tons

Level 6 : Have shown strength on par/and beyond modern day lifting devices, but have also shown limits to strength (This covers all, including Namor and Ultimate Colossus both of whom can lift over a 1000 tons)

Level 7 : Have yet to shown defined limits to strength, therefore can conceivably be as strong as the character 'needs to be'. Many can amplify strength with a near limitless energy source.

Originally posted by Lucid Lui
It's Gladiator when he was possesed by the Uni-Power...

I thought it was Dr. Strange.

Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
The new A - Z supports the idea even more .... they haven't even put the values in the back of the book !!!!!!!!!!

They have gone a bit crazy with the values as well !! A lot of people who don't deserve it have been given 7 for durability, including Atlas who has deservedly been given a 7 for strength ! I cant understand why Atlas can be a 7 for durability when Count Nefaria is only a 6 !

Evidence to proof how shit the numerical values are :

Akethma Ultrons robot biatch has been given a level 5 for strength, meaning she bench presses between 25 and 75 tons.

And yet during the Ultron unlimited serries, she was able to pick up Vision with one hand, while he was in his ultra dense form and weighed over 90 tons. Note that Vision even stated he weighed this much during the same comic. Akethma then proceeded to throw Vision like a tennis ball, with enough force to flatten Thor. With this in mind it safe to say she can lift more than 75 tons !

New Numerical System employed by Marvel, according to Yahman

Level 5 : Able to lift between 25 and 100 tons

Level 6 : Have shown strength on par/and beyond modern day lifting devices, but have also shown limits to strength (This covers all, including Namor and Ultimate Colossus both of whom can lift over a 1000 tons)

Level 7 : Have yet to shown defined limits to strength, therefore can conceivably be as strong as the character 'needs to be'. Many can amplify strength with a near limitless energy source.

Thats much better and seems more in linewith what Marvel are doing with their handbooks right now. Your last system was so damn convoluted.

I cant wait for the Ultimate version of Phoenix to make a proper appearance

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
I thought it was Dr. Strange. Well... I have absolutely no idea how you came to that conclusion.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I cant wait for the Ultimate version of Phoenix to make a proper appearance

She's seems to be the only Ultimate character who isn't in twined with science of some sort. I.e. she seems more godlike than either Gah lak tus, and the asgardian patheon. X-men is still a pretty good read, i just wish the art would improve ! The last arc involving magneto was very cool !

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Thats much better and seems more in linewith what Marvel are doing with their handbooks right now. Your last system was so damn convoluted.

Thats a bloody good word for it .... i had no idea what it meant until i looked it up .... yes the last system was very 'convoluted'. The barriers between each level where ambiguous to say the least

This system gives you a far better guide to how much they can lift.

Modernage machinery can lift Kilo tons of mass, and many of the level 6 characters have shown they can lift such weights.

Also this system allows for the fluctuations in strength of the level 7 characters, who rarely ever show consistent limitations. Most of them are usually illustrated around the 100 ton mark, and yet on bizarre ocassions they have shown they can lift ridiculuosly heavy objects.

This aplies to D.C. aswell, e.g. Superman rarely ever shows planet moving strength when he is fighting others. People would be regularly travelling to DISTANT planets in the solar sytem, and entire cities would be flattened under immens shock waves if Superman Hulk and Wonderwoman FOUGHT at the same strength, at which they could LIFT.

As the system clearly states, these characters can be as strong as 'they need to be'

Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
She's seems to be the only Ultimate character who isn't in twined with science of some sort. I.e. she seems more godlike than either Gah lak tus, and the asgardian patheon. X-men is still a pretty good read, i just wish the art would improve ! The last arc involving magneto was very cool !

Indeed:

http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/2792/ultimatexmen25p151si.th.jpg


http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/1694/ultimatexmen25p16176za.th.jpg

http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/1983/ultimatexmen25p18196mp.th.jpg


http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/8550/ultimatexmen25p20214kn.th.jpg


http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/2199/ultimatexmen25p22230dy.th.jpg

http://img491.imageshack.us/img491/3527/ultimatexmen25p24257ir.th.jpg

http://img491.imageshack.us/img491/8522/ultimatexmen25p26278oy.th.jpg

http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/6876/ultimatexmen25p28291dy.th.jpg

Theres the Big Bang link and its the most powerful force in the Ultimate universe

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Indeed:


Theres the Big Bang link and its the most powerful force in the Ultimate universe

I have a sneaky suspicion that phoenix may have a role to play in Ultimate exstinction. How else are they suppose to beat Galactus, I hope they don't have Jonny getting the 'Ultimate ' Nulifier . I don think the Surfers going to save the day either, he was put down by a hail of bullets.

Originally posted by R.O.T. Yahman
I have a sneaky suspicion that phoenix may have a role to play in Ultimate exstinction. How else are they suppose to beat Galactus, I hope they don't have Jonny getting the 'Ultimate ' Nulifier . I don think the Surfers going to save the day either, he was put down by a hail of bullets.

That would be the best thing ever!! For once Yahman im really hoping youre right lol.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
That would be the best thing ever!! For once Yahman im really hoping youre right lol.

It makes a lot of sense ... I know Xavier is going to contact 'Gah Lak Tus' (mann i hate writing his name out like that ! ) and he's going to be as sucessful as he was in the Secret Wars. I would make sense phoenix saving the day, as she done little to nothing so far except stop that nuclear disaster. The Ultimate range is such a good idea, they have a lot of creativity at their disposal and they can prevent making the mistakes of the old comics.

I looked forward to a seeing several Ultimate Characters, namely :

Sentry (I'd have him like Supreme Power Hyperion)
Cage
Cable (eventually)
Taskmaster
Ultron
Apocalypse (Actually doing something)
Wendigo
Other Gods
And Of course THANOS !!!!!!!!!!