Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

I don't mean debate as in three positives and three negatives, or anything technical, i mean a discussion heated as it may be concerning two or more characters in the comic book vs. forum. The only thing i would like to see is logic instead of rabid fanboy-ishness.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f77/t385214.html

There you go. A living testimony to how things work in the comic book vs. forum nowadays.
Can people really be so in love with their favorite characters that they:

1. Cannot accept proof.
2. Accuse you of lying even though you presented said proof in considerable amounts
3. Have no better argument for their hero than "he just kicks his ass"
4. Have the IQ of an amoeba that just had a seizure

???????????????

Seriously though, the place was like this a while ago, but to a much lesser degree. Now it seems to be all around. Some of you may see me "online" in the comic book vs. forum, but i only post in a select few threads because frankly the rest disgust me to no end. And there are actually some interesting battle concepts out there, but it's just not worth the hassle trying to convince people.

Why is it not worth the hassle? Because people act like IMBECILES. Not all, mind you, i don't mean to generalize, but the ones i'm refering to.
Let me put it this way:

If i got into a debate right now with Juntai or GS or Long Pig, or Darkcrawler, or others like them, and i said "it's not worth the hassle", then it would be CLEAR that it's only a cop-out, because those people are capable of carrying well-thought out discussions and they're capable of making threads last, and making them INTERESTING.
With guys like this one in the thread i linked to, it's (as i said in another thread) like trying to convince a 3 year old that his goldfish is dead, even though his underdeveloped brain won't accept it and he'll just stare at it for hours saying "Come on fishy, you're just resting" and won't believe you.

I am incredibly frustrated right now, if for nothing else, at least for being ACCUSED of bringing false proof onto the table, and outright lying, when i have done no such thing. And furthermore, being accused by some......some.........for God's sake, there really isn't even any comparison or adjective that would even come close to describing the level at which the people i'm talking about are at.

Can this be changed? Can something be done about it? I sincerely doubt it.

Excuse me for this rant, but i simply HAD to get it out of my system.

It happens everywhere. Forums go through cycles. This is a cycle of crap. Eventually there'll be a surge in thought out, interesting and great debates. Then there'll be a surge of complete crap or mediocre debates.

Just got to hope there's a few hidden gems mixed in with all the re-hashes and crap.

yup.... you just get sick of the constant fanboy comments.... then when a decent thread with a decent and semi-original concept does come up, Golem and co create so many spam threads that it gets pushed straight to the second page and is forgotten about

Originally posted by Dark Urizen
I don't mean debate as in three positives and three negatives, or anything technical, i mean a discussion heated as it may be concerning two or more characters in the comic book vs. forum. The only thing i would like to see is logic instead of rabid fanboy-ishness.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f77/t385214.html

There you go. A living testimony to how things work in the comic book vs. forum nowadays.
Can people really be so in love with their favorite characters that they:

1. Cannot accept proof.
2. Accuse you of lying even though you presented said proof in considerable amounts
3. Have no better argument for their hero than "he just kicks his ass"
4. Have the IQ of an amoeba that just had a seizure

???????????????

Seriously though, the place was like this a while ago, but to a much lesser degree. Now it seems to be all around. Some of you may see me "online" in the comic book vs. forum, but i only post in a select few threads because frankly the rest disgust me to no end. And there are actually some interesting battle concepts out there, but it's just not worth the hassle trying to convince people.

Why is it not worth the hassle? Because people act like IMBECILES. Not all, mind you, i don't mean to generalize, but the ones i'm refering to.
Let me put it this way:

If i got into a debate right now with Juntai or GS or Long Pig, or Darkcrawler, or others like them, and i said "it's not worth the hassle", then it would be CLEAR that it's only a cop-out, because those people are capable of carrying well-thought out discussions and they're capable of making threads last, and making them INTERESTING.
With guys like this one in the thread i linked to, it's (as i said in another thread) like trying to convince a 3 year old that his goldfish is dead, even though his underdeveloped brain won't accept it and he'll just stare at it for hours saying "Come on fishy, you're just resting" and won't believe you.

I am incredibly frustrated right now, if for nothing else, at least for being ACCUSED of bringing false proof onto the table, and outright lying, when i have done no such thing. And furthermore, being accused by some......some.........for God's sake, there really isn't even any comparison or adjective that would even come close to describing the level at which the people i'm talking about are at.

Can this be changed? Can something be done about it? I sincerely doubt it.

Excuse me for this rant, but i simply HAD to get it out of my system.

The place is beyond repair .... Just prevent them from ****ing up this place !

Certain members who have already been mentioned, shouldn't be aloud to create threads on this part of the forum, IMO !

A bit elitist i know,

Originally posted by Fishy 500


The place is beyond repair .... Just prevent them from ****ing up this place !

Certain members who have already been mentioned, shouldn't be aloud to create threads on this part of the forum, IMO !

A bit elitist i know,

I think the answer is being selective, I was accused of bringing false evidence to the table today when I quoted Verbatum from the handbook

Any member who has been here long enough can point to at least 2-3 GREAT debates they've been in...and a lot of mindless ones. This site is great for comic info and occasionally good debates, but it's an unfortunate truth that one can't expect great battle-debates terribly often.

Just treasure the important stuff you get out of it...and ignore the rest. And fight the fanboy-ism if you must, but everyone succumbs to despair every now and then, so don't feel too bad.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Any member who has been here long enough can point to at least 2-3 GREAT debates they've been in...and a lot of mindless ones. This site is great for comic info and occasionally good debates, but it's an unfortunate truth that one can't expect great battle-debates terribly often.

Just treasure the important stuff you get out of it...and ignore the rest. And fight the fanboy-ism if you must, but everyone succumbs to despair every now and then, so don't feel too bad.

and in truth most of us have an element of fanboy in us.....

Is it a bird?

Is it a plane?

No it's Whirlysplat (Up, Up and away!)

^^ Right. We're all fanboys. It's how we decide to defer to logic (most of the time) that separates us from the worse-case scenarios.

I was guilty early in my KMC career too. And I'm still overly forgiving to Spidey (among others) when I debate for him....hehe.

Not so much in the comic threads but more in the general forum, I've noticed this trend: you go through the effort of presenting an intelligent point of view (well, at least I think I'm being intelligent ), then expecting a reasonably intelligent response...and I get nothing. The posts that follow read as if I had posted nothing at all (h'mm, did I just set myself up...?)

In all fairness, I think the following has to be taken into consideration, and I mean no offense by the following, but the fact is, we have a fairly wide age range here in the forum (most being under 20), and people are generally gonna "debate" with what they can grasp and on a level commensurate with their general (physical and/or mental) age and with people of like age/interests.

I know that sometimes the stuff I post can be very technical/wordy/cerebral, and if no one responds to it the way I would like, I don't necessarily see it as their being rude or stupid. Perhaps at times debates would ensue if I, personally, used plain English more.

Now, now. None of you can complain. I havent been around for some time.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
^^ Right. We're all fanboys. It's how we decide to defer to logic (most of the time) that separates us from the worse-case scenarios.

I was guilty early in my KMC career too. And I'm still overly forgiving to Spidey (among others) when I debate for him....hehe.

I just can't help it when it's big blue, He beats everyone in my book he is SUPERman to me not superMAN.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
^^ Right. We're all fanboys. It's how we decide to defer to logic (most of the time) that separates us from the worse-case scenarios.

I was guilty early in my KMC career too. And I'm still overly forgiving to Spidey (among others) when I debate for him....hehe.

but that's ok as Spidey can't actually ever lose though....

Originally posted by Mindship
In all fairness, I think the following has to be taken into consideration, and I mean no offense by the following, but the fact is, we have a fairly wide age range here in the forum (most being under 20), and people are generally gonna "debate" with what they can grasp and on a level commensurate with their general (physical and/or mental) age and with people of like age/interests.

I know that sometimes the stuff I post can be very technical/wordy/cerebral, and if no one responds to it the way I would like, I don't necessarily see it as their being rude or stupid. Perhaps at times debates would ensue if I, personally, used plain English more.

Agreed. Sometimes I feel intellectually over my head (usually not in comics but in other forums that are a bit deeper), sometimes I feel as though I'm talking with peers. And other times I feel like I'm babysitting *coughvsforumcough* but there's a wide range.



Damn straight! Finally, someone who understands.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Agreed. Sometimes I feel intellectually over my head (usually not in comics but in other forums that are a bit deeper), sometimes I feel as though I'm talking with peers. And other times I feel like I'm babysitting *coughvsforumcough* but there's a wide range.


Some older individuals can be difficult at times

^^ Indeed.

Speaking of good debating...

Not sure how long you've been around DU, but they're starting a new tourney over in the vs. forum. There's always great debates in those matches....and they rarely get into fanboyism and shouting matches (though sometimes the early rounds succumb to that occasionally). Ever since I was in a tourney almost a year ago they've been my favorite part of the vs. forum...and help us remember how to actually debate and counter-debate points made by an opposition.

-DM

Originally posted by DigiMark007
^^ Indeed.

Speaking of good debating...

Not sure how long you've been around DU, but they're starting a new tourney over in the vs. forum. There's always great debates in those matches....and they rarely get into fanboyism and shouting matches (though sometimes the early rounds succumb to that occasionally). Ever since I was in a tourney almost a year ago they've been my favorite part of the vs. forum...and help us remember how to actually debate and counter-debate points made by an opposition.

-DM

DU was Wickerman Digi, He's been around some time!

It's funny I been around here for a few years now and tbh it wasn't until the vs forum was made that all these "fanboys" started popping up. I choose to believe that most of them put on an act as I cant see how someone could actually be that dimwitted. The trend was really started by one member imo, a certain user who's love for wolverine was beyond reason, after him it just seemed like some sort of popular trend

"SNIKT"

That's why I usually spend my time on the cosmic threads. You can't be an immature fanboy and survive on those, so they usually stay out of those threads.

Then again, they're sometimes prone to being taken over by ridiculous bickering wars between Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumbass...we know who they are.

Yeah, the vs. forums in general are the most loathed by the Mod community. There's good stuff in them, but about 50% of our problems come from the 3 vs. forums out of a total of...well, I don't know the exact number, but it's lots more than 3.

I stand by the assertion that there's plenty to be gained from them (for one, I understand power levels in comics infinitely better than when I first got here which makes them easier to read) but they naturally lead to more mean-spirited debates than other forums, which can obviously escalate into other problems.

{Edit} Good point demi. There's probably some sort of fanboy curve that's horribly skewed toward street level. LOL

I can feel some fanboy hackles go up, when someone who's a favourite can't win, but I try to resist and be logical. I hope I suceed for the most part.
I haven't been in the Star Wars forums for a long time, because I'm sick of the constant whining in there, about EVERYTHING. You're so unhappy, go get another obsession, I say.
There has been times I'm not intrigued by the versus forum, because too many matchups seem the same, but fresh ones eventually come out. The books and movies section, you can ask interesting questions and the discussions don't degenerate as much. Just keep the slagging threads out ie. I-Hate-C-Master crap.

Originally posted by demigawd
Then again, they're sometimes prone to being taken over by ridiculous bickering wars between Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumbass...we know who they are.

Go me!!!

I try to use logic. I fail miserably, but I do try...

Originally posted by Mindship
Not so much in the comic threads but more in the general forum, I've noticed this trend: you go through the effort of presenting an intelligent point of view (well, at least I think I'm being intelligent ), then expecting a reasonably intelligent response...and I get nothing. The posts that follow read as if I had posted nothing at all (h'mm, did I just set myself up...?)

In all fairness, I think the following has to be taken into consideration, and I mean no offense by the following, but the fact is, we have a fairly wide age range here in the forum (most being under 20), and people are generally gonna "debate" with what they can grasp and on a level commensurate with their general (physical and/or mental) age and with people of like age/interests.

I know that sometimes the stuff I post can be very technical/wordy/cerebral, and if no one responds to it the way I would like, I don't necessarily see it as their being rude or stupid. Perhaps at times debates would ensue if I, personally, used plain English more.

Fight the power! Keep posting intelligently. Seriously, people getting confused by big words is the absolute highlight of my forum experience. Never stop!

Honestly, never lower your own standards to appease other people. If they don't like how you talk, screw 'em. You obviously care enough to keep your dignity when presenting yourself, no matter the medium. Your posts are organized, well thought out, and are a good deal easier to read than mindless drivel that is filled with misspellings and crappy grammar. It's a very good thing, the forum needs guys like you. But 50 more of them than we have now.

Oh, and just because you got paranoid about setting yourself up... DURRRR!!!!

Yes, if you look carefuly

You will be able to see that there is a KMC population boom in the last 1-2 months .... some of them are good debaters, but some of them are fanboys with 0 knowledge on comics....

The thing is, nothing can stop this fanboy flood...

What I hate is, when some expert posts a nice thread, but suddenlly 20 fanboys show up and post 20 ignorant threads.... so the thread is moved to the end of the page if not to the other page........

Did you know that there are more than 20 threads containing PC DS vs. Galactus topics............

Originally posted by Lucid Lui
It happens everywhere. Forums go through cycles. This is a cycle of crap. Eventually there'll be a surge in thought out, interesting and great debates. Then there'll be a surge of complete crap or mediocre debates.

Just got to hope there's a few hidden gems mixed in with all the re-hashes and crap.

Yeah, well, that's still not a very pretty picture being drawn out. Things are definitely worse than they were, so i think i'm seeing your point. Even so, however, i'm afraid the community will reach a point of saturation soon.

Originally posted by Scoobless
yup.... you just get sick of the constant fanboy comments.... then when a decent thread with a decent and semi-original concept does come up, Golem and co create so many spam threads that it gets pushed straight to the second page and is forgotten about

Absolutely. And even golem has a few decent threads, but the onslaught of the rest of the threads, which have already been done, but anyway, push those good ones to not just the second or third page, but way way back.

Originally posted by Fishy 500


The place is beyond repair .... Just prevent them from ****ing up this place !

Certain members who have already been mentioned, shouldn't be aloud to create threads on this part of the forum, IMO !

A bit elitist i know,

That wouldn't be necessary if they had some proper education, and some good sense. I mean, seriously, when everybody who's known and respected tells you that you're doing something wrong, maybe you should actually believe them......I blame education at home.

Originally posted by Sir Whirlysplat
I think the answer is being selective, I was accused of bringing false evidence to the table today when I quoted Verbatum from the handbook

Alright, but you could have been selective (which i'm sure you weren't). In my specific case however, i made SURE that i cannot be accused of having been selective when it came to the proof i would present. So there really is no excuse for accusing me of something like that.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Any member who has been here long enough can point to at least 2-3 GREAT debates they've been in...and a lot of mindless ones. This site is great for comic info and occasionally good debates, but it's an unfortunate truth that one can't expect great battle-debates terribly often.

Just treasure the important stuff you get out of it...and ignore the rest. And fight the fanboy-ism if you must, but everyone succumbs to despair every now and then, so don't feel too bad.

Yeah Digi, but it just keeps getting worse and worse. And i'm afraid that when school starts, the decline will be even nastier.

Originally posted by Mindship
Not so much in the comic threads but more in the general forum, I've noticed this trend: you go through the effort of presenting an intelligent point of view (well, at least I think I'm being intelligent ), then expecting a reasonably intelligent response...and I get nothing. The posts that follow read as if I had posted nothing at all (h'mm, did I just set myself up...?)

In all fairness, I think the following has to be taken into consideration, and I mean no offense by the following, but the fact is, we have a fairly wide age range here in the forum (most being under 20), and people are generally gonna "debate" with what they can grasp and on a level commensurate with their general (physical and/or mental) age and with people of like age/interests.

I know that sometimes the stuff I post can be very technical/wordy/cerebral, and if no one responds to it the way I would like, I don't necessarily see it as their being rude or stupid. Perhaps at times debates would ensue if I, personally, used plain English more.

It really doesn't matter what the manner of getting your point across is. They won't understand common logic, that's the issue. I'm sure there are some that just don't understand what you're trying to say due to the elevated vocabulary you use, but even so, even if you were to use day to day speach, it still wouldn't do any good.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
^^ Indeed.

Speaking of good debating...

Not sure how long you've been around DU, but they're starting a new tourney over in the vs. forum. There's always great debates in those matches....and they rarely get into fanboyism and shouting matches (though sometimes the early rounds succumb to that occasionally). Ever since I was in a tourney almost a year ago they've been my favorite part of the vs. forum...and help us remember how to actually debate and counter-debate points made by an opposition.

-DM

I know Digi, i already signed up to be a judge. I'm only sorry i can't be a judge in every match though, since Dizzle says we'll be rotating and such.

Originally posted by Sir Whirlysplat
DU was Wickerman Digi, He's been around some time!



Originally posted by demigawd
That's why I usually spend my time on the cosmic threads. You can't be an immature fanboy and survive on those, so they usually stay out of those threads.

Then again, they're sometimes prone to being taken over by ridiculous bickering wars between Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumbass...we know who they are.

Yeah, you're right, in the cosmic threads, there isn't usually anything they can do, because they realize how silly they'd look. So then why can't they realize the same thing when it comes to more mundane characters?

Originally posted by Sir Whirlysplat
I think the answer is being selective, I was accused of bringing false evidence to the table today when I quoted Verbatum from the handbook

lol

I know what you're, talking about .... Are you sure i wasn't may be a bit tampered ?

Originally posted by olympian
Now, now. None of you can complain. I havent been around for some time.

lol

Dont put yourself down oymps ..... you're fanboyism is much appreciated, as there is some twitsted logic behind it ! shifty

Originally posted by demigawd


Then again, they're sometimes prone to being taken over by ridiculous bickering wars between Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumbass...we know who they are.

(Cough , cough !) You forget his sidekick !

Originally posted by Fishy 500
lol

Dont put yourself down oymps ..... you're fanboyism is much appreciated, as there is some twitsted logic behind it ! shifty

Olympian isn't bad at all. He backs up his claims with proof, and uses logic.

(sorry Olympian, missed your post and was too lazy to reply directly to it )

Originally posted by demigawd
That's why I usually spend my time on the cosmic threads. You can't be an immature fanboy and survive on those, so they usually stay out of those threads.

Then again, they're sometimes prone to being taken over by ridiculous bickering wars between Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumbass...we know who they are.

Who?

Originally posted by Fishy 500
lol

I know what you're, talking about .... Are you sure i wasn't may be a bit tampered ?

no false evidence at all.

Originally posted by Dark Urizen
It really doesn't matter what the manner of getting your point across is. They won't understand common logic, that's the issue. I'm sure there are some that just don't understand what you're trying to say due to the elevated vocabulary you use, but even so, even if you were to use day to day speach, it still wouldn't do any good.

True enough. I have noticed those instances where someone is just so invested in being right or winning that simple black-n-white logic or common sense falls entirely on deaf ears. Might as well try to pierce Cap's shield with a toothpick.

See I'm a fanboy if you disagree with me...I'll cut your eyes out. ALPHA FLIGHT RULZZZ

Originally posted by Mindship
True enough. I have noticed those instances where someone is just so invested in being right or winning that simple black-n-white logic or common sense falls entirely on deaf ears. Might as well try to pierce Cap's shield with a toothpick.

Exactly. Waste of time and effort.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
See I'm a fanboy if you diagree with me...I'll cut your eyes out. ALPHA FLIGHT RULZZZ

You've just inspired me to make a new sig

Being a fanboy of Alpha Flight is smart. None of us care enough about them to know if he's right or wrong. LOL.

Originally posted by demigawd


Then again, they're sometimes prone to being taken over by ridiculous bickering wars between Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumbass...we know who they are.

All im saying is i better be Dee

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Being a fanboy of Alpha Flight is smart. None of us care enough about them to know if he's right or wrong. LOL.



Well ALpha FLight did beat the Living Tribunal when Talisman reached her full potential since she is a worker for the gods. Now am I telling the truth? Who knows jerk, I don't need to lie http://www.killermovies.com/forums/images/smilies/cartoon/mad.gif

You should care, because they would own most of the marvel characters

I don't go to the vs. forums as much anymore. It's kinda in a slump now for me.

But I'll stick around to see if it comes back.

I'd say less people know about Excalibur than about Alpha Flight, simply because Wolverine has had run-ins with them.

How many comics has marvel put wolverine in again ??