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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/beds/bucks/herts/4599524.stm



First of all, initial reactions to this? I was so horrified I found it very difficult to believe that it happened. A 12-week old baby? I couldn't see it as even possible...

The worst thing is, French is due to serve only 5 years in a young offender's institute because, basically, she was 'led astray'. I'm sorry, but partaking in petty crime, smoking underage, stealing your parents' alcohol and topping it up with water, these things can be considered a part of someone being led astray. But this woman isn't a child and as far as I am concerned it takes a lot more than a 'please, it'll be fun' from a boyfriend to make someone participate in such a hideous act.

What do you think? I'm not even going to ask if you think the sentences are too light. Of course they are.

How is rape applicable to a baby of 12 weeks? Just curious there, considering rape has to be going against the resistance and lack of consent (which their was, because the baby can't speak).

Still, 5 years seems pretty low of a time in jail for such a drastic crime. I'd have thought they'd have flipped and ordered a life sentence.

One question, is the baby dead?

-AC

I think Life is acceptable.

I won't even ask how a 12 week old baby is raped...but I think that is a rather disgusting crime Don't know what to say aboot it.

That's fricken' unbelievable and horrifying!

I can't believe that they let the woman off so lightly. I know that there are many people who oppose the death penalty, and I often have conflicting views on the subject. But I can honeslty say I would shed not a tear to see these two people wiped off the face of the earth.

I wouldn't either, I agree. I won't be the one to do it, nor should anyone else be (not saying you suggested otherwise, just making my own point there randomly). I'd say the same of rapists in general though.

I'm just curious as to how the legally defined it as rape and if the baby is dead or not.

-AC

Originally posted by KharmaDog
That's fricken' unbelievable and horrifying!

I can't believe that they let the woman off so lightly. I know that there are many people who oppose the death penalty, and I often have conflicting views on the subject. But I can honeslty say I would shed not a tear to see these two people wiped off the face of the earth.
Well I guess after all the damage done (assuming the baby didn't die) is not that big. Of coursee it is a sick idea to mopst of us..but as crime itself it's not in the highest category at all.

Seven other offenses, see...What do you do with people like this....Sick behavior.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Seven other offenses, see...What do you do with people like this....Sick behavior.

Lock them up and stop them doing it again.

-AC

Originally posted by Syren
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/beds/bucks/herts/4599524.stm



First of all, initial reactions to this? I was so horrified I found it very difficult to believe that it happened. A 12-week old baby? I couldn't see it as even possible...

The worst thing is, French is due to serve only 5 years in a young offender's institute because, basically, she was 'led astray'. I'm sorry, but partaking in petty crime, smoking underage, stealing your parents' alcohol and topping it up with water, these things can be considered a part of someone being led astray. But this woman isn't a child and as far as I am concerned it takes a lot more than a 'please, it'll be fun' from a boyfriend to make someone participate in such a hideous act.

What do you think? I'm not even going to ask if you think the sentences are too light. Of course they are.

I am sickened beyond belief that these things happen...it's easy to stick my head in the sand and pretend it doesn't happen, but some miscreants in the world deserve to suffer, and in this case, I hope the bastard gets his just desserts from other inmates in prison.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well I guess after all the damage done (assuming the baby didn't die) is not that big. Of coursee it is a sick idea to mopst of us..but as crime itself it's not in the highest category at all.

I think the victimization of young kids is particullarily deplorable. I don't know why, I just do. Maybe it's because I take care of my twin neices often and the emotional/protective side of me just gets worked up when such a case is publicised.

But the fact is this guy victimised this child and others. And I put rape right up there with many of the worst crimes, raping a child just shows what sick b*stards this guy and his girlfriend really were.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
That's fricken' unbelievable and horrifying!

I can't believe that they let the woman off so lightly. I know that there are many people who oppose the death penalty, and I often have conflicting views on the subject. But I can honeslty say I would shed not a tear to see these two people wiped off the face of the earth.

yeah, but there will always be a case which could be an exception.
as for me, i would rather this guy go to prison and live out his life looking forward to showertime fun and donkey punches, and for that lady to become intimate daily with a gang of broomstick wielding shebitch thugs. the death penalty is not only primative and evil imho...but far too kind.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I wouldn't either, I agree. I won't be the one to do it, nor should anyone else be (not saying you suggested otherwise, just making my own point there randomly). I'd say the same of rapists in general though.

I'm just curious as to how the legally defined it as rape and if the baby is dead or not.

-AC

True. What kind of charge is that ?

Should have been molestation.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
rape has to be going against the resistance and lack of consent (which their was, because the baby can't speak).

not resistance AC, just lack of consent. and even if child protection laws didnt exist, there was still a lack of consent.

I agree... I'd love to see these people suffer for the rest of their lives.

AC, the baby isn't dead. There was a picture in the paper today of her and her mother, faces blurred. The mother's taken it really hard and there's going to be an appeal against the sentences.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
I think the victimization of young kids is particullarily deplorable. I don't know why, I just do. Maybe it's because I take care of my twin neices often and the emotional/protective side of me just gets worked up when such a case is publicised.

But the fact is this guy victimised this child and others. And I put rape right up there with many of the worst crimes, raping a child just shows what sick b*stards this guy and his girlfriend really were.

Yeah I see that, but that'S what I meant, people get more emotional when kids are involved. But fact is that this Baby probably has every chance to live a decent live (If it's still alive...why the **** is that shit not mentioned in that damn article).
I agree that this is a crime that shouldn't be punishe with less than 20 years (and safety custody if there's no chance for rehabilitation). But The crime as such is probably not as final as murder or rape of a teen.

Originally posted by Syren
The worst thing is, French is due to serve only 5 years in a young offender's institute because, basically, she was 'led astray'. I'm sorry, but partaking in petty crime, smoking underage, stealing your parents' alcohol and topping it up with water, these things can be considered a part of someone being led astray. But this woman isn't a child and as far as I am concerned it takes a lot more than a 'please, it'll be fun' from a boyfriend to make someone participate in such a hideous act.

but she's a woman, so she must just be an innocent victim of circumstance. poor girl was abused as a child and never recieved proper love and attention...yadda yadda yadda. witness the true danger of sexism

Originally posted by Syren
I agree... I'd love to see these people suffer for the rest of their lives.

This is the kind of attitude we don't need.

PVS and KharmaDog for example, are saying they don't CARE if that shit happens to these people, which is fine. They're not lowering themselves to like minded level by wishing it upon them or saying they'd "love to see" them tortured.

The second you admit that you would like to see someone tortured, you are as bad, at least mentally, as those people.

Originally posted by Syren
AC, the baby isn't dead. There was a picture in the paper today of her and her mother, faces blurred. The mother's taken it really hard and there's going to be an appeal against the sentences.

Well at least they didn't kill it.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
The second you admit that you would like to see someone tortured, you are as bad, at least mentally, as those people.

-AC

What a nice thing to say. Although true.

I followed this link to the BBC website and found out that England is legalising small brothels!!!!

*EDIT* I typed this before I saw Syren's new thread, BTW.

Originally posted by Syren
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/beds/bucks/herts/4599524.stm



First of all, initial reactions to this? I was so horrified I found it very difficult to believe that it happened. A 12-week old baby? I couldn't see it as even possible...

The worst thing is, French is due to serve only 5 years in a young offender's institute because, basically, she was 'led astray'. I'm sorry, but partaking in petty crime, smoking underage, stealing your parents' alcohol and topping it up with water, these things can be considered a part of someone being led astray. But this woman isn't a child and as far as I am concerned it takes a lot more than a 'please, it'll be fun' from a boyfriend to make someone participate in such a hideous act.

What do you think? I'm not even going to ask if you think the sentences are too light. Of course they are.
That is the sickest thing I've read this year.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
How is rape applicable to a baby of 12 weeks? Just curious there, considering rape has to be going against the resistance and lack of consent (which their was, because the baby can't speak).

Still, 5 years seems pretty low of a time in jail for such a drastic crime. I'd have thought they'd have flipped and ordered a life sentence.

One question, is the baby dead?

-AC
I doubt the baby's dead since the article said the mother was unaware of the abuse until the detectives showed up at her home.
And if the baby would've 'mysteriously' died during the babysitter's care they would've performed an autopsy and detain the babysitters, right?

That's what I think anyway.

*edit: I just saw Syren's post.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
This is the kind of attitude we don't need.

PVS and KharmaDog for example, are saying they don't CARE if that shit happens to these people, which is fine. They're not lowering themselves to like minded level.

no AC, and damn me for saying it, but the thought of these 2 living out the rest of their miserable existance in a rape ridden hellhole gives me a sense of justice. NOT satisfaction mind you, dont get me wrong. of coarse such a fate is not state mandated(not yet thank god), but rather a "what rape?" attitude held common regarding the prison system. there are many who dont deserve this fate (most in fact) who are in prison, but imho there are a few who certainly do.

but here's the kicker. he wont be thrown in with the general population as he would be immediately killed by the other inmates (even criminals have some sense of morality it would seem). no, he will more likely be thrown in a seperate prison with other sex offenders and live a not-as-hellish existance as any other criminal would.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
This is the kind of attitude we don't need.

PVS and KharmaDog for example, are saying they don't CARE if that shit happens to these people, which is fine. They're not lowering themselves to like minded level by wishing it upon them or saying they'd "love to see" them tortured.

The second you admit that you would like to see someone tortured, you are as bad, at least mentally, as those people.

I cannot agree with that, not least because I'm defending me. How can you possibly say I'm as bad as those people? At least mentally? That's the worst part of it, their mental state leaves a lot to be desired and you're likening me to them because I would have no problem with their being locked up for life?



It is a she, and she is a baby with a mother and father who would hardly see the fact she's still alive as a blessing. It shouldn't have happened at all, whether the baby's dead or alive can't be relevant. Are you serious?

This is just one of those case you wish never happen. But unfortunally they do...harming a baby is far too cruel and evil to be accepted or even forgiven.

Oh My God....that's just so sick....Jesus...12 weeks old? ..what do you do when people are that fukked up?

Originally posted by Syren

It is a she, and she is a baby with a mother and father who would hardly see the fact she's still alive as a blessing. It shouldn't have happened at all, whether the baby's dead or alive can't be relevant. Are you serious?
Did I misunderstand that? Of course it's a blessing that they didn't kill the kid......what are you saying?

Originally posted by botankus
I followed this link to the BBC website and found out that England is legalising small brothels!!!!

*EDIT* I typed this before I saw Syren's new thread, BTW.

Sure you did.

Originally posted by Syren
I cannot agree with that, not least because I'm defending me. How can you possibly say I'm as bad as those people? At least mentally? That's the worst part of it, their mental state leaves a lot to be desired and you're likening me to them because I would have no problem with their being locked up for life?

Hahaha, typical Syren. Did you say anything about being locked up or did you say you'd love to watch them suffer for the rest of their lives? We both know it's the latter. You should have been clearer.

As soon as you admit that you would gain pleasure from watching someone else suffer, you are within the mental realm of a criminal. Like it or not, that's the truth.

Originally posted by Syren
It is a she, and she is a baby with a mother and father who would hardly see the fact she's still alive as a blessing.

Ungrateful bastards then aren't they? Their child could have been killed, it wasn't, they still have it to love and to care for. If those parents aren't thankful then they don't deserve to be parents. Simple as that.

Originally posted by Syren
It shouldn't have happened at all, whether the baby's dead or alive can't be relevant. Are you serious?

Yes I am. A horrific crime that nobody should endure, of any age. Rape is deplorable and inexcusable, but if you could stop being so rabidly defensive of a baby, look at the facts:

It's alive, not dead. One would think you'd be a bit relieved.

-AC

words can not espress what Im feeling right now regarding this

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Hahaha, typical Syren. Did you say anything about being locked up or did you say you'd love to watch them suffer for the rest of their lives? We both know it's the latter. You should have been clearer.

As soon as you admit that you would gain pleasure from watching someone else suffer, you are within the mental realm of a criminal. Like it or not, that's the truth.

I can't let you have that one.. I did mean life imprisonment, I agreed with PVS when he said;

Originally posted by PVS
yeah, but there will always be a case which could be an exception.
as for me, i would rather this guy go to prison and live out his life looking forward to showertime fun and donkey punches, and for that lady to become intimate daily with a gang of broomstick wielding shebitch thugs. the death penalty is not only primative and evil imho...but far too kind.

I think their being locked up for the rest of their lives would be enough cause for them to suffer, which is exactly what I meant. Although PVS said it's far too kind, I think that a life sentence, where they actually remained locked up for life, would be pretty just.



In comparison, to the baby's being alive and not having gone through rape, then I would say the parents would be more grateful of that. Obviously I didn't mean they would prefer the child to be dead and clearly they're going to be pleased she's still alive, I guess you have to be thankful for small mercies. She was still raped, though. The fact she's alive doesn't make it all better.



Like I said, glad she's alive. Could have been better though, the whole sorry situation could just not have happened.

Originally posted by Syren
I can't let you have that one.. I did mean life imprisonment, I agreed with PVS when he said;

I think their being locked up for the rest of their lives would be enough cause for them to suffer, which is exactly what I meant. Although PVS said it's far too kind, I think that a life sentence, where they actually remained locked up for life, would be pretty just.

Then say that and I'll agree with you. You didn't, I played the hand you dealt me. You were not clear and I went with what you posted. I'm good, but I'm not psychic. If you meant life imprisonment, say it.

Originally posted by Syren
In comparison, to the baby's being alive and not having gone through rape, then I would say the parents would be more grateful of that. Obviously I didn't mean they would prefer the child to be dead and clearly they're going to be pleased she's still alive, I guess you have to be thankful for small mercies. She was still raped, though. The fact she's alive doesn't make it all better.

Hahaha, of course the parents would be grateful of having NOTHING happen to their baby, what a silly point.

The fact is, if it's a choice between your 12 month old baby being raped and ALIVE or raped and DEAD, the choice should simple and unequivocally be the former.

Of course the fact that she's alive makes it better. It doesn't make it better in the sense of easing the pain of the rape itself, but the fact that it could have been worse.

Originally posted by Syren
Like I said, glad she's alive. Could have been better though, the whole sorry situation could just not have happened.

But it did, so be thankful she's alive. Which you are.

-AC

Originally posted by Syren
I think their being locked up for the rest of their lives would be enough cause for them to suffer, which is exactly what I meant. Although PVS said it's far too kind, I think that a life sentence, where they actually remained locked up for life, would be pretty just.

should be just, but read my last post.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
This is the kind of attitude we don't need.

PVS and KharmaDog for example, are saying they don't CARE if that shit happens to these people, which is fine. They're not lowering themselves to like minded level by wishing it upon them or saying they'd "love to see" them tortured.

The second you admit that you would like to see someone tortured, you are as bad, at least mentally, as those people.



Well at least they didn't kill it.

-AC

I have to disagree with you there. I think if you took a poll of 100 people on the street, at least 85 of them would want the people to suffer.
Additionally, Syren didn't say she wanted them tortured, she merely was saying she wanted them to suffer, as in stay in jail for life.

I was the one who wanted them tortured.

Originally posted by PVS
no AC, and damn me for saying it, but the thought of these 2 living out the rest of their miserable existance in a rape ridden hellhole gives me a sense of justice. NOT satisfaction mind you, dont get me wrong. of coarse such a fate is not state mandated(not yet thank god), but rather a "what rape?" attitude held common regarding the prison system. there are many who dont deserve this fate (most in fact) who are in prison, but imho there are a few who certainly do.

I totally agree, a sense of justice. Justice is what we're aiming for, not vengeance. The key here is that you said it's not satisfaction you get, which was my exact point. Saying that deserve something and saying you'd enjoy seeing someone suffer for the rest of their lives are two different ball parks.

That's what I said in the first place. You think they deserve it, don't care what happens to them, but not to the point of being satisfied by suffering.

Originally posted by PVS
but here's the kicker. he wont be thrown in with the general population as he would be immediately killed by the other inmates (even criminals have some sense of morality it would seem). no, he will more likely be thrown in a seperate prison with other sex offenders and live a not-as-hellish existance as any other criminal would.

Prisons suck, we know this. He's in jail and he can't do it to any more kids, that should be the goal achieved.

After all, we are after justice. Well, justice TO ME is them being locked away and not being able to do it again, which would be achieved.

-AC

Originally posted by ~Da Moose~
I have to disagree with you there. I think if you took a poll of 100 people on the street, at least 85 of them would want the people to suffer.
Additionally, Syren didn't say she wanted them tortured, she merely was saying she wanted them to suffer, as in stay in jail for life.

I was the one who wanted them tortured.
that doesn't make it right though.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Then say that and I'll agree with you. You didn't, I played the hand you dealt me. You were not clear and I went with what you posted. I'm good, but I'm not psychic. If you meant life imprisonment, say it.

Ok, I apologise. I'll make every effort to ensure this doesn't happen again. I meant life imprisonment, I'm not bloodthirsty and I most definitely would not like to watch anyone being tortured.



Yeah, I agree. But the way you said it sounded as though you thought they should be thankful she's still alive, as though they're ungrateful. That they should overlook the fact she's been raped because, it's ok, she's alive. Perhaps I read you wrong, in which case I don't think we need to discuss this any further. We both agree that it's deplorable and I think they should both be left to rot in prison. And she's 12 weeks old.

Originally posted by ~Da Moose~
I have to disagree with you there. I think if you took a poll of 100 people on the street, at least 85 of them would want the people to suffer.
Additionally, Syren didn't say she wanted them tortured, she merely was saying she wanted them to suffer, as in stay in jail for life.

I was the one who wanted them tortured.

Yes, and as I said, if you'd get satisfaction from suffering then you're in the mental realm of a criminal. Satisfaction is the key there. Nobody is saying you're wrong for hoping they get locked up for the rest of their lives and not giving a shit about them. Just the fact that if you openly admit to wanting someone to suffer and you would watch it, THEN it gets eye for eye. Which solves nothing.

Yes I know what she meant now Moose, she never said it. She said it after, which helps none. Now I know what she means, I agree with her. They should be locked away for life. Never disputed that, never will.

You want to see them tortured? You realise the contradiction? They probably wanted the same.

-AC

Originally posted by ~Da Moose~
I have to disagree with you there. I think if you took a poll of 100 people on the street, at least 85 of them would want the people to suffer.

ahh, but that is too simplified

for instance that can be translated as "85% of people would support state ordered torture" or even "85% of people here would enjoy watching them tortured"

as for me, if the question of such a poll would be "would you suddenly forget how to call 911 and turn a blind eye while the family of this child corners these pricks and tortures their sorry asses to death", then you can count me in

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
After all, we are after justice. Well, justice TO ME is them being locked away and not being able to do it again, which would be achieved.

-AC

Isn't justice a "just" punishment that befits the crime as opposed to locking someone up to prevent a similar crime?

Originally posted by Syren
We both agree that it's deplorable and I think they should both be left to rot in prison. And she's 12 weeks old.

So do I, what's the confusion?

Why did you cite her age? Yes it's disgusting, but at least she won't remember it. Again, I'm not saying we should overlook anything, but be thankful for small mercies once again.

-AC

Originally posted by KharmaDog
Isn't justice a "just" punishment that befits the crime as opposed to locking someone up to prevent a similar crime?
well the actual idea is to make sure it doesn't happen again...the revenge thing is just an addition...

Why did I read "and be left to rot in Paris" and not "and be left to rot in prison"?

Originally posted by PVS
ahh, but that is too simplified

for instance that can be translated as "85% of people would support state ordered torture" or even "85% of people here would enjoy watching them tortured"

as for me, if the question of such a poll would be "would you suddenly forget how to call 911 and turn a blind eye while the family of this child corners these pricks and tortures their sorry asses to death", then you can count me in

I couldn't do that... I think maybe if I were closer to the child, or if something like that happened to someone in my family then I'd be the first to carve holes in their bodies. But to say I could happily look away while revenge is exacted on anyone guilty of such a crime would be a lie. I know that's probably a selfish point of view but for me to condone 'an eye for an eye' I'd have to be emotionally involved.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
Isn't justice a "just" punishment that befits the crime as opposed to locking someone up to prevent a similar crime?

You're asking me if justice should differ from crime to crime? (Correct me if I'm wrong.)

If that is what you meant, then no, not im my opinion. My goal would be to take these criminals off the streets and lock them up in prison to prevent it happening again. Personal feelings don't enter into it for me.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Yes, and as I said, if you'd get satisfaction from suffering then you're in the mental realm of a criminal. Satisfaction is the key there. Nobody is saying you're wrong for hoping they get locked up for the rest of their lives and not giving a shit about them. Just the fact that if you openly admit to wanting someone to suffer and you would watch it, THEN it gets eye for eye. Which solves nothing.

Yes I know what she meant now Moose, she never said it. She said it after, which helps none. Now I know what she means, I agree with her. They should be locked away for life. Never disputed that, never will.

You want to see them tortured? You realise the contradiction? They probably wanted the same.

-AC

No, AC, as a parent, (which I am unsure of whether you are or not) my thoughts IMMEDIATELY turn to my own kids, and what I would feel if it were to happen to the criminals. I am fiercely protective and my initial response would be to do WHATEVER I could to harm them...physically, emotionally, psychologically. I would want them to feel on some level, the terror and pain that they inflicted upon a child. Having stepped back and taking a moment, torturing them is not the answer. I know, or have a fairly good idea of what they will be in for in prison, and that is satisfaction enough for me.

Originally posted by Syren
I couldn't do that... I think maybe if I were closer to the child, or if something like that happened to someone in my family then I'd be the first to carve holes in their bodies. But to say I could happily look away while revenge is exacted on anyone guilty of such a crime would be a lie. I know that's probably a selfish point of view but for me to condone 'an eye for an eye' I'd have to be emotionally involved.

i would take no part in it at all. but rather have the empathy to know that if god forbid i was in their shoes, i would demand the same justice. so, i wouldnt watch and salivate, but rather cover my ears and yell "LALALALALALA CANT HEAR ANYTHING LALALALA" and walk away

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
So do I, what's the confusion?

Why did you cite her age? Yes it's disgusting, but at least she won't remember it. Again, I'm not saying we should overlook anything, but be thankful for small mercies once again.

-AC

No confusion.

Because you got it wrong, no underlying reason. I'm thankful she won't remember it, but her parents will never forget.

Branching off from this slightly, how would you feel and what would you do if you were a parent and this happened to your child? Question to everyone.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Why did I read "and be left to rot in Paris" and not "and be left to rot in prison"?

Paris, that could work.

Originally posted by ~Da Moose~
No, AC, as a parent, (which I am unsure of whether you are or not) my thoughts IMMEDIATELY turn to my own kids, and what I would feel if it were to happen to the criminals. I am fiercely protective and my initial response would be to do WHATEVER I could to harm them...physically, emotionally, psychologically. I would want them to feel on some level, the terror and pain that they inflicted upon a child. Having stepped back and taking a moment, torturing them is not the answer. I know, or have a fairly good idea of what they will be in for in prison, and that is satisfaction enough for me.
That punishment is not there for you to feel satisfaction. It's to prevent it to happen to society again.

Originally posted by Bardock42
well the actual idea is to make sure it doesn't happen again...the revenge thing is just an addition...

Why did I read "and be left to rot in Paris" and not "and be left to rot in prison"?

I was always under the understanding that there was a punishment to be administered to fit the crime. Granted the intention to stop the crime is also considered, but isn't punishment a necessity?

Originally posted by ~Da Moose~
No, AC, as a parent, (which I am unsure of whether you are or not) my thoughts IMMEDIATELY turn to my own kids, and what I would feel if it were to happen to the criminals. I am fiercely protective and my initial response would be to do WHATEVER I could to harm them...physically, emotionally, psychologically. I would want them to feel on some level, the terror and pain that they inflicted upon a child. Having stepped back and taking a moment, torturing them is not the answer. I know, or have a fairly good idea of what they will be in for in prison, and that is satisfaction enough for me.

Exactly.

That's why it's flawed to say "Imagine if you were the parents!". Ok I will:

First off my mind would be completely irrational, my heart and emotions would be overtaking my brain and I'd be distraught.

Now appreciate that this isn't the best frame of mind in which to be deciding what the answer is.

-AC

He should be castrated.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
You're asking me if justice should differ from crime to crime? (Correct me if I'm wrong.)

If that is what you meant, then no, not im my opinion. My goal would be to take these criminals off the streets and lock them up in prison to prevent it happening again. Personal feelings don't enter into it for me.

-AC

Justice is justice. I am talking about sentencing that is proportionate to the crime commited.

Originally posted by Syren
He should be castrated.
He is a human after all. What the hell is wrong with you people. aybe I missed the time you all were made The Spectre so forgive me.

Originally posted by Bardock42
That punishment is not there for you to feel satisfaction. It's to prevent it to happen to society again.

I'm not saying it IS there for my satisfaction. I understand how laws work. I'm merely saying that as a parent, my FIRST reaction would be that I want them to suffer. End of story.

Additionally, if they are in prison, and I know what happens to child molestors in jail, then I CAN feel satisfaction, whether it was intended for me to feel it or not.

many of you are ignorant of the prison system with regards to sex offenders.
he's not going to 'oz' unfortunately. sorry, but thats reality:

Originally posted by PVS
but here's the kicker. he wont be thrown in with the general population as he would be immediately killed by the other inmates (even criminals have some sense of morality it would seem). no, he will more likely be thrown in a seperate prison with other sex offenders and live a not-as-hellish existance as any other criminal would.

just the way it is.

Originally posted by Syren
He should be castrated.

That would not make this man (or anyother) cease from victimizing others. In fact, it might make it worde.

Originally posted by Syren
Because you got it wrong, no underlying reason. I'm thankful she won't remember it, but her parents will never forget.

Branching off from this slightly, how would you feel and what would you do if you were a parent and this happened to your child? Question to everyone.

I got it wrong? She's 12 weeks? I must have mistyped it somewhere.

Her parents won't forget, no. Then it's up to them to be responsible and never, ever bring it up again isn't it? The worst thing they could do now is tell her later in life.

If it were me I'd want them locked up for life. That's enough for me. I say that with a clear mind because that's the best way to judge and that is how I feel. People make the mistake of saying, as I previously said to Moose, "Imagine if it were you!".

When you are traumatised you are in no fit state to be deciding what's best.

I also find it endlessly hilarious that you just made a suggestion that the man be castrated.

-AC

Originally posted by ~Da Moose~
I'm not saying it IS there for my satisfaction. I understand how laws work. I'm merely saying that as a parent, my FIRST reaction would be that I want them to suffer. End of story.

Additionally, if they are in prison, and I know what happens to child molestors in jail, then I CAN feel satisfaction, whether it was intended for me to feel it or not.
Yes and I can understanf that you so....and you can..but I am jsut making sure that it's not mixed up...there are kids reading these threads....they might get a wrong idea.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
Justice is justice. I am talking about sentencing that is proportionate to the crime commited.

5 years is too short, in my opinion. In this case anyway.

PVS: If I might ask, what's the point you're making about his prison location? He won't be able to molest kids anymore. Surely that's all that matters.

-AC

Originally posted by Syren
He should be castrated.
Do you seriously mean that? I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you here, by the way.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Exactly.

That's why it's flawed to say "Imagine if you were the parents!". Ok I will:

First off my mind would be completely irrational, my heart and emotions would be overtaking my brain and I'd be distraught.

Now appreciate that this isn't the best frame of mind in which to be deciding what the answer is.

-AC

Absolutely.

When I first read this, my children's faces were in my mind...and I felt myself begin to become tense and I wanted these sick freaks to be drawn and quartered...but I realize that what they have to deal with for the rest of their lives, and in some minds, afterwards, is far worse than anything I could EVER do to them.

Originally posted by PVS
many of you are ignorant of the prison system with regards to sex offenders.
he's not going to 'oz' unfortunately. sorry, but thats reality:



just the way it is.
Well that is because sex-offenders have a rather shitty live in prison..and that'S not fair..they should have a just as shitty live as the other prisoners, not worse.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Yes and I can understanf that you so....and you can..but I am jsut making sure that it's not mixed up...there are kids reading these threads....they might get a wrong idea.

I am fully cognizant, yes, and I agree that the whole object of laws and criminal punishment is to protect society as a whole and to 'deter' which in my opinion, seldom happens.

Having said that, I make NO qualms about contemplating what they have in store for them, 'inside'.

Actually baby rape isnt somethin new. I wasnt shocked and i did belive it. Theres people out there who are that sick to rape a 12 month old baby. come on now, tell me yall jus heard about this happening in life.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well that is because sex-offenders have a rather shitty live in prison..and that'S not fair..they should have a just as shitty live as the other prisoners, not worse.

Excellent point.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
PVS: If I might ask, what's the point you're making about his prison location? He won't be able to molest kids anymore. Surely that's all that matters.

-AC

that was addressed to people who believe that they will be thrown in with the general population and raped etc. they wont. funny huh? in most cases the people who really deserve to get raped in prison never do...

and i see where your going AC, but you must understand that i dont think simply being locked in a cell is justice in a case like this. thats based on my gut, and as much as i would love to rationalise that i cant. i just feel that, like i said, the people who deserve eye for an eye justice never seem to get it, as this guy most likely wont. punishment is just that. punishment. simply keeping them from raping kids is a mere precautionary measure and can be accomplished with house arrest. shall we give them just that? i think not.

Originally posted by JacopeX
Actually baby rape isnt somethin new. I wasnt shocked and i did belive it. Theres people out there who are that sick to rape a 12 month old baby. come on now, tell me yall jus heard about this happening in life.

Awe, it took awhile for the ramblings of the completely inept to appear, but here they are! I sense this thread will lose all value within 2 pages.

Originally posted by JacopeX
Actually baby rape isnt somethin new. I wasnt shocked and i did belive it. Theres people out there who are that sick to rape a 12 month old baby. come on now, tell me yall jus heard about this happening in life.

how inappropriate

thank you

Originally posted by JacopeX
Actually baby rape isnt somethin new. I wasnt shocked and i did belive it. Theres people out there who are that sick to rape a 12 month old baby. come on now, tell me yall jus heard about this happening in life.

I have to admit..although not really being shocked it was new to me that 12 week old babies were raped..jsut because well..I can't imagine it.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well that is because sex-offenders have a rather shitty live in prison..and that'S not fair..they should have a just as shitty live as the other prisoners, not worse.

i would prefer differing degrees of shittiness to fit the magnitude of the crime. but thats just me

Child molestors are most likely to get stab to death by other prison inmates. So it don't matter if the guy gets life or executed. He is very likely not to survive. And for a crime of this magnitude he certainly will NOT be ignore.

Originally posted by PVS
that was addressed to people who believe that they will be thrown in with the general population and raped etc. they wont. funny huh? in most cases the people who really deserve to get raped in prison never do...

and i see where your going AC, but you must understand that i dont think simply being locked in a cell is justice in a case like this. thats based on my gut, and as much as i would love to rationalise that i cant. i just feel that, like i said, the people who deserve eye for an eye justice never seem to get it, as this guy most likely wont. punishment is just that. punishment. simply keeping them from raping kids is a mere precautionary measure and can be accomplished with house arrest. shall we give them just that? i think not.

I believe people have things coming to them, but I also believe it's not my job to arrange that. If they get raped in prison, they got what was coming. If they don't, then that's the way it works unfortunately. Life is like that. Either way I'm not gonna waste my life sitting here thinking "Damn they didn't get raped!" or "YES! They did!" They're not worth the time.

Like I said, lock them up in prison so they can never do it again. That's my belief of justice. Justice is stopping these criminals and halting any chance for them to reoffend. No more no less, I haven't got that authority.

-AC

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
Child molestors are most likely to get stab to death by other prison inmates.

he. will. not. be thrown in with the general population

Originally posted by Eis
Do you seriously mean that? I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you here, by the way.

Yes. Why not? He obviously doesn't deserve to have full use of his appendage as he's violated a 12 week old baby. If he were castrated it would guarantee he could never have children... do you think he'd make a decent father?

Originally posted by PVS
i would prefer differing degrees of shittiness to fit the magnitude of the crime. but thats just me
Well it's not measurable thoguh...and we can't control it...so that's not jsut.

Originally posted by Syren
Yes. Why not? He obviously doesn't deserve to have full use of his appendage as he's violated a 12 week old baby. If he were castrated it would guarantee he could never have children... do you think he'd make a decent father?
hey, what did his future children do to you?

There are other, less brutal ways to do that too.

Originally posted by Syren
Yes. Why not? He obviously doesn't deserve to have full use of his appendage as he's violated a 12 week old baby. If he were castrated it would guarantee he could never have children... do you think he'd make a decent father?

I don't even know where to start with this.

That's so unbelievably irrational and hypocritical.

-AC

Originally posted by JacopeX
Actually baby rape isnt somethin new. I wasnt shocked and i did belive it. Theres people out there who are that sick to rape a 12 month old baby. come on now, tell me yall jus heard about this happening in life.

Oh really? This isn't the first case?

Thanks for the insight. I feel kinda...better now that you've enlightened us.

Originally posted by PVS
he. will. not. be thrown in with the general population

Umm....yes he will....the guards could slip in some inmates into the showers and stab buffet will be open.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I don't even know where to start with this.

That's so unbelievably irrational and hypocritical.

-AC

Ok, fine. It's also my opinion and I don't think this monster, or anyone who could do that to a baby {or anyone for that matter}, should be allowed the rights to a normal life.

Do me a favour and start somewhere. I would like to know what is so bad about my not being able to turn the other cheek regarding this man's crimes. And his girlfriend's...

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well it's not measurable thoguh...and we can't control it...so that's not jsut.

yes it is measurable. a guy gets caught with a small bag of coke and another murders an entire family. they share a cell. is that fair?

Originally posted by PVS
yes it is measurable. a guy gets caught with a small bag of coke and another murders an entire family. they share a cell. is that fair?

I meant the amount of Raping by Big Bubba is not measurable

Why do americans see it as a positive thing that such things occur in their state prisons?

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
Umm....yes he will....the guards could slip in some inmates into the showers and stab buffet will be open.

thats an arranged hit, and those guards would be risking their jobs. there would have to be some serious strings pulled to arrange that, especially since sex offenders are usually kept in a separate fenced off building. not likely

Originally posted by PVS
yes it is measurable. a guy gets caught with a small bag of coke and another murders an entire family. they share a cell. is that fair?

I don't see how this is relevant. This comes down to your personal preference as to what prison life should be like.

I don't even think the coke dude should be in prison, for one (that's another debate and I don't wish to ruin this thread with it).

-AC

Originally posted by Bardock42
I meant the amount of Raping by Big Bubba is not measurable

Why do americans see it as a positive thing that such things occur in their state prisons?

if you read my post, you would see:

Originally posted by PVS
that was addressed to people who believe that they will be thrown in with the general population and raped etc. they wont. funny huh? in most cases the people who really deserve to get raped in prison never do...

Originally posted by PVS
thats an arranged hit, and those guards would be risking their jobs. there would have to be some serious strings pulled to arrange that, especially since sex offenders are usually kept in a separate fenced off building. not likely

But is very possible. You can't deny the chances of that happening are low. Besides during a riot lots of inmates get hurt or kill. Don't be surprise if this guy is the first to go.

I forgot to make a point....they do get punished differently...on is in there longer than the other.

Originally posted by WrathfulDwarf
Umm....yes he will....the guards could slip in some inmates into the showers and stab buffet will be open.

I don't know about anywhere else, but my best friend is a corrections officer, and he has told me that they routinely allow other inmates access to the sex offenders, and that the latter have by far, the worst time of anyone in prison. The guards have absolute contempt for sex offenders, especially against children, and treat them, in his words, 'like animals'.

Originally posted by Syren
Ok, fine. It's also my opinion and I don't think this monster, or anyone who could do that to a baby {or anyone for that matter}, should be allowed the rights to a normal life.

Do me a favour and start somewhere. I would like to know what is so bad about my not being able to turn the other cheek regarding this man's crimes. And his girlfriend's...

Rather than prevent him from ever doing it again, your course of action is to take vengeance to your own further degree that is worse.

Prison isn't a normal life. If it's vengeance and torture you're after then you are not different from him. He wanted to rape a kid, you want to torture an adult. Age is different, concept is the same. You're both getting pleasure and satisfaction from horrifying events.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I don't see how this is relevant. This comes down to your personal preference as to what prison life should be like.

I don't even think the coke dude should be in prison, for one (that's another debate and I don't wish to ruin this thread with it).

-AC

im not asking of you feel if coke man should be in prison as i agree. thats not the point. my point is relevant if you would only see it.

regardless of how you feel, there is a guy who got caught with a bag of coke getting donkey punched in his cell right now by a convicted murderer, as we converse. reality.
there are buildings filled with rapists and molesters who are relatively comfortable. reality. again, is this fair?

Absolutely not, but can we do anything about the deplorable decisions and actions of the justice system?

I can't. We have to deal with what we have. Shit happens, it's not fair, but it does.

-AC

I've heard you cannot rehabilitate people like this. Now there is chemical castration, but did hear that still won't stop many of these crimes, they will find a way to do it some other way......

well, that was all addressing this point AC:

Originally posted by PVS
i would prefer differing degrees of shittiness to fit the magnitude of the crime. but thats just me

simply put, i think coke man should have a much easier time than the baby rapers living in their minimum security apartments seperate from the general population. its like they are actually rewarded for being the ultimate crem de la crem scumbags society has to offer, so depraved that even hardened criminals would tear them apart out of a sense of duty.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I've heard you cannot rehabilitate people like this. Now there is chemical castration, but did hear that still won't stop many of these crimes, they will find a way to do it some other way......

Well I guess that is different fro case to case...idf one can't rehabilitate them life-sentence might be the right choice.

Oh and I don't think....that this was rape in a "Penis pentration" way....I jsut can*t believe that would work.

Like I said, I don't think that's fair but it happens and to achieve justice, sometimes shit happens. Justice, in some cases, isn't even achieved and the wrong people get done for it. Just the way it is, it's not good, it sucks, but that's how it is.

Regardless of how prisons are, I don't think ANYONE being put in prison is being rewarded.

-AC

Originally posted by Bardock42
Well I guess that is different fro case to case...idf one can't rehabilitate them life-sentence might be the right choice.

Oh and I don't think....that this was rape in a "Penis penetration" way....I jsut can*t believe that would work. I can't imagine a mother wouldn't notice if it was rape either with penis penetration. A mother WOULD know because there would be damage.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Regardless of how prisons are, I don't think ANYONE being put in prison is being rewarded.

when being spared from what they really deserve? i beg to differ.

but i guess that ends that

Dude, that guy's going to get it so bad in prison when the other inmates hear about what he did. Ah, good times.

Originally posted by BackFire
Dude, that guy's going to get it so bad in prison when the other inmates here about what he did. Ah, good times. Unless they put him in solitary confinement.

Hopefully they won't, he doesn't deserve that kind of safety.

Originally posted by BackFire
Hopefully they won't, he doesn't deserve that kind of safety. They might just for that reason unfortunately.

Originally posted by BackFire
Dude, that guy's going to get it so bad in prison when the other inmates here about what he did. Ah, good times.

It could be just as likely that a jail or prison guard get hurt protecting him from other prisoners.

These offenders are generally protected from the general population (at least in Canada) so people's dreams and hopes that "he get's his due" are not totally based in reality.

I'd rather the laws effectively worked than other inmates taking the laws into their own hands. That being said, I once again give sh*t not if anything happens to him or her while in jail.

Originally posted by PVS
when being spared from what they really deserve? i beg to differ.

but i guess that ends that

That's the problem though, karma is out of human hands. Does he deserve what's coming around? Yes. Will he get it? Maybe, maybe not.

I'm personally not going to let it bother me either way. Shit happens be it for better or worse. It's something we can't control.

On one hand I agree with Bardock that they deserve the same prison life as everyone else, but on the other, I don't necessarily believe they deserve a worse one. They should be with the other inmates, I agree, but that doesn't mean that I would stop a guard pulling thugs off him. Whatever happens, happens. Once in prison, I couldn't give a shit what else occurs. My goal has been achieved.

-AC

Originally posted by debbiejo
I can't imagine a mother wouldn't notice if it was rape either with penis penetration. A mother WOULD know because there would be damage.

my thoguhts exactly.

well i think the whole damn system needs to be revamped.

as i said the molesters are treated as guests of honor, the most brutal and hardened criminals enjoy a status of royalty in a sort of quasi-government, while the most brutal gang thugs find protection among eachother. really the only ones that truly suffer are the weak, and those who commit lesser crimes...and who btw end up far worse of criminals when they walk out then when they walked in.

its an ass backwards abomination of our society with no true punishment to fit the crime.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
It could be just as likely that a jail or prison guard get hurt protecting him from other prisoners.

These offenders are generally protected from the general population (at least in Canada) so people's dreams and hopes that "he get's his due" are not totally based in reality.

I'd rather the laws effectively worked than other inmates taking the laws into their own hands. That being said, I once again give sh*t not if anything happens to him or her while in jail.


In America rapists and child molesters don't get any real special treatment, they usually end up getting raped/murdered by other inmates who's moral standards, while shitty, at least recognize the fact that rape and child molestation are two of the most disgusting and hateworthy crimes imaginable.

Originally posted by BackFire
In America rapists and child molesters don't get any real special treatment, they usually end up getting raped/murdered by other inmates who's moral standards, while shitty, at least recognize the fact that rape and child molestation are two of the most disgusting and hateworthy crimes imaginable.

again, not true. they are thrown into a seperate area, most often a separate fenced off building. why? because the state prisons know what we know and thats why it wont happen.

Originally posted by PVS
well i think the whole damn system needs to be revamped.

as i said the molesters are treated as guests of honor, the most brutal and hardened criminals enjoy a status of royalty in a sort of quasi-government, while the most brutal gang thugs find protection among eachother. really the only ones that truly suffer are the weak, and those who commit lesser crimes...and who btw end up far worse of criminals when they walk out then when they walked in.

its an ass backwards abomination of our society with no true punishment to fit the crime.
Yes, your prison System is our of hand..but it serves it's main purpose....the Killers in the prisons do not kill people outside of that prison...Mission Accomplished.

That's the point I made.

-AC

And they keep building more prisons too in neighborhoods that don't want them.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Yes, your prison System is our of hand..but it serves it's main purpose....the Killers in the prisons do not kill people outside of that prison...Mission Accomplished.

Untill they are released, for the most part unreformed, and most likely to repeat offend. Mission not so much accomplished as it is postponed to a later date.

you cant sweep human chaos under a rug. that very mentallity is why our prison system is expanding beyond control and everyone has their thumbs up their asses. its a temporary fix and a poor one at that since like i said, it turns lesser criminals into hardened criminals.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
Untill they are released, for the most part unreformed, and most likely to repeat offend. Mission not so much accomplished as it is postponed to a later date.

at least someone gets it

Originally posted by KharmaDog
Untill they are released, for the most part unreformed, and most likely to repeat offend. Mission not so much accomplished as it is postponed to a later date.
Well yes...that is true....the current North American Prison System seems to be less useful than ours. It has to be reforemed..but the basic teory is still the same.

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
That's the point I made.

-AC
Yeah I know...we are basically argueing the same

Originally posted by debbiejo
And they keep building more prisons too in neighborhoods that don't want them.
What has that to do with anything?

That's why life should mean life. Until then, yes it will always be a problem.

But we're getting agitated toward a cause of which we wield no power.

-AC

Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
That's why life should mean life. Until then, yes it will always be a problem.

But we're getting agitated toward a cause of which we wield no power.

-AC

by that mentallity the whole GDF may as well be shut down

Originally posted by Bardock42
What has that to do with anything? Only that our prison system doesn't work and crime is growing and there needs to be some alternative to the problem.

Originally posted by PVS
by that mentallity the whole GDF may as well be shut down
Well one that also isn't the topic of the thread.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Only that our prison system doesn't work and crime is growing and there needs to be some alternative to the problem.

she's right, you know

Originally posted by PVS
by that mentallity the whole GDF may as well be shut down

Not really, discussing the issue is all well and good but we all know what our points of view are and it's got to the point where we're just repeating them to each other or agreeing to disagree.

It's basically coming down to our preference and what we'd prefer. I just don't see any more discussion in it. If you guys do, rock and roll.

-AC

Originally posted by PVS
she's right, you know Whoa!!....I'm gonna write this date on my calender.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Whoa!!....I'm gonna write this date on my calender.

stfu

Originally posted by PVS
she's right, you know
Of course..jsut her other post didn't say that at all....

Originally posted by Bardock42
Of course..jsut her other post didn't say that at all....

well it alluded to the point...in a nonsensical kind of way....meh forget it

shock

Originally posted by Bardock42
Of course..jsut her other post didn't say that at all.... If you lived in the US you would of understood, I think...Growing prisions are a problem here.

Originally posted by Syren
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/beds/bucks/herts/4599524.stm



First of all, initial reactions to this? I was so horrified I found it very difficult to believe that it happened. A 12-week old baby? I couldn't see it as even possible...

The worst thing is, French is due to serve only 5 years in a young offender's institute because, basically, she was 'led astray'. I'm sorry, but partaking in petty crime, smoking underage, stealing your parents' alcohol and topping it up with water, these things can be considered a part of someone being led astray. But this woman isn't a child and as far as I am concerned it takes a lot more than a 'please, it'll be fun' from a boyfriend to make someone participate in such a hideous act.

What do you think? I'm not even going to ask if you think the sentences are too light. Of course they are.
Personally, excuse my language, but I think the f*ckers should die. A BABY? People are so disgusting these days. It just...I cannot explain it, it kills me inside to know people are doing these things, let alone to a child that just came into the world 3 months prior to the rape.
They had such a light sentence...5 years, am I correct? It'd be the death penalty given from me if I were a judge.

Originally posted by debbiejo
If you lived in the US you would of understood, I think...Growing prisions are a problem here.

If you had have a point I would have understood it.

Originally posted by PVS
well it alluded to the point...in a nonsensical kind of way....meh forget it
Okay, I see...nevermind

BTW, did you also have the impression that first she just said something totally unnecessary and then jsut reposted one of your earlier post to seem less nonsensical?

I know what I meant...I forget, you can't mind read..and I'm speaking to a world audience that doesn't know all our problems.

Originally posted by Bardock42
BTW, did you also have the impression that first she just said something totally unnecessary and then jsut reposted one of your earlier post to seem less nonsensical?

truthfully...i really wasnt paying much attention. but like she said, its a commonly known american problem. if you go to america and say "prison" and "back yard" in the same sentence people know the topic right away, and its the fact that our criminal population has been exploding for quite some time with no fix in sight.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I know what I meant...I forget, you can't mind read..

Of course I can..I do hav ESPN.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I know what I meant...

Well that makes one of you.

Not until now.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Not until now.

It is rape because rape is sexual intercourse without consent. A child of 13 or under cannot legally give consent.



Originally posted by DanieLs_4_Ever
Personally, excuse my language, but I think the f*ckers should die. A BABY? People are so disgusting these days.


This kind of reaction is why I hate the media. Manipulative, trouble-making idiots.

I fully agree that this crime is sickening. However, in my eyes, the fact of her being 12 weeks old is merely a weird aspect of the case, and marks it out from other such cases because it's not the usual age.

What I do not agree with, is this attitude of 'Oh my God! 12 weeks! That's twice as bad as 24 weeks! And, at least...*calculating* TWENTY-SIX times worse than 6 years old!'

A child being raped is a terrible thing, at any age: don't feel the need to muster up extra outrage when the age lessens- in fact, I'm sure the effect is more likely to be lasting- mentally- as the age increases. Unless it's not the effect that's important, but the amount of hysteria generated.

No matter how big the tabloids make the font on the words 'BABY RAPE', the man isn't actually extra amounts of big-font evil. Not like those other ones, a guys? At least they wait a while.

Hypocrisy.

If the glove dont fit..you must aquit.

Originally posted by Syren
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/beds/bucks/herts/4599524.stm



First of all, initial reactions to this? I was so horrified I found it very difficult to believe that it happened. A 12-week old baby? I couldn't see it as even possible...

The worst thing is, French is due to serve only 5 years in a young offender's institute because, basically, she was 'led astray'. I'm sorry, but partaking in petty crime, smoking underage, stealing your parents' alcohol and topping it up with water, these things can be considered a part of someone being led astray. But this woman isn't a child and as far as I am concerned it takes a lot more than a 'please, it'll be fun' from a boyfriend to make someone participate in such a hideous act.

What do you think? I'm not even going to ask if you think the sentences are too light. Of course they are.


What....the ****.

That's just...pathetic.

those criminals should be shot for what they did to that baby

That is really disgusting

these ppl are sick f ****s...but hey theyre my kinda suck f ****s...how is rape of a tweleve week old even applicable? BTW who'is gonna be the first among us to suggest therapy for the little baby

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
It is rape because rape is sexual intercourse without consent. A child of 13 or under cannot legally give consent.






This kind of reaction is why I hate the media. Manipulative, trouble-making idiots.

I fully agree that this crime is sickening. However, in my eyes, the fact of her being 12 weeks old is merely a weird aspect of the case, and marks it out from other such cases because it's not the usual age.

What I do not agree with, is this attitude of 'Oh my God! 12 weeks! That's twice as bad as 24 weeks! And, at least...*calculating* TWENTY-SIX times worse than 6 years old!'

A child being raped is a terrible thing, at any age: don't feel the need to muster up extra outrage when the age lessens- in fact, I'm sure the effect is more likely to be lasting- mentally- as the age increases. Unless it's not the effect that's important, but the amount of hysteria generated.

No matter how big the tabloids make the font on the words 'BABY RAPE', the man isn't actually extra amounts of big-font evil. Not like those other ones, a guys? At least they wait a while.

Hypocrisy.
You're calling ME a hypocrit?

Nah.

I know it's hard to believe but things like this are going to start happing more and more everyday

This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers,disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy
Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, Incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
traitors, heady, high-minded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; having a form of Godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.......

See it has already been told to us what would happen things like this are no surprise to those who know the truth!

neonight

Originally posted by neonight
I know it's hard to believe but things like this are going to start happing more and more everyday

This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers,disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy
Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, Incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
traitors, heady, high-minded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; having a form of Godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.......

See it has already been told to us what would happen things like this are no surprise to those who know the truth!

neonight

people have been that way for thousands of years.

people need to stop taking the bible literally.

Originally posted by neonight
I know it's hard to believe but things like this are going to start happing more and more everyday

This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers,disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy
Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, Incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
traitors, heady, high-minded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; having a form of Godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.......

See it has already been told to us what would happen things like this are no surprise to those who know the truth!

neonight



So that makes it ok? Because we were warned, and we chose to ignore the signs, that baby paid for our selfishness? Is that what you're saying?

Please.

No NOt at all what I,m saying is that there is no way to stop this thing it's bigger then all of us put together and for you freak your right it has been going on for thousands of years but have you ever noticed that here lately you can't even try to watch t.v. without hearing about some murder, some rape, some cult, it is worse now then ever. Oh and just so you know the bible is literall if you choose to be with the in croud you will burn with them in hell. no joke intended!

neonight

Originally posted by neonight
your right it has been going on for thousands of years but have you ever noticed that here lately you can't even try to watch t.v. without hearing about some murder, some rape, some cult, it is worse now then ever.

Yeah, I agree.

The TV hundreds of years ago didn't show all this stuff.

So if a man rapes a girl in the city and we don't stone both of them to death, we'll burn in hell?
("If a man rapes a girl in the city, you must stone him to death, and the woman as well." Deut. 22:24)

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Yeah, I agree.

The TV hundreds of years ago didn't show all this stuff.
Ah yes, good ol' hundred year old TVs.

Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Yeah, I agree.

The TV hundreds of years ago didn't show all this stuff.

Yeah, the first televised political debates between Lincoln and Douglas actually aired political commercials that called for the assassination of Lincoln. If you ask me, all this negative news really started there. It was only after Lincoln was actually assassinated that they started putting parental warnings on TV.

Originally posted by neonight
No NOt at all what I,m saying is that there is no way to stop this thing it's bigger then all of us put together and for you freak your right it has been going on for thousands of years but have you ever noticed that here lately you can't even try to watch t.v. without hearing about some murder, some rape, some cult, it is worse now then ever. Oh and just so you know the bible is literall if you choose to be with the in croud you will burn with them in hell. no joke intended!

neonight

Darn that 'In Crowd', with their satanic cult-like meetings in the dead of the night. Trying to decide what pair of shoes to wear can be such a pain in the ass

There are some very sick people in this world.

We need to adjust the administrated justice and punishments as offenders and their crimes grow more inhuman each day.
Therapy, medical treatments and imprisonment cannot correct or rehabilitate a person who is so sick and disturbed that he/she sexually abuses a 12 month old baby. A person like that has a mental malfunction that can be seen as a flaw and not a misdemeanour by the law and be seen as a reason to help this person, despite all costs, though history has revealed that freaks like this are often beyond all hope to become a normal person.
Now we can drag the whole 'even they are human and have rights' issue along or just face the fact that they are abominations among us and make up the choice; spend 500 a day in attempt to fix em up or solve the whole thing by instantly dropping every maniac proved guilty of these kinds of offends in the nearest meat-grinder