American Idol

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powerfulone1987
Whose watching?

Don't front.

Is It Comprehensible.....

rej1587
It sucks. major.

Koala MeatPie
TV talk no?

I did, while waiting for House.

i only like the parts wher Simon screams at the people.

He is loosing his touch.

LiL nAstY GirL
I only watch like the first 4 episodes

KENobi™
I only (sometimes) watch the first few episodes to see the losers.

powerfulone1987
you mean the auditioning episodes?

is it comprehensible.....

KENobi™
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
you mean the auditioning episodes?

is it comprehensible.....

Yep

Other than that, the music choices suck. I don't like soft rock or oldies. Give me an American Idol with heavy metal or punk and I'll be happy.

powerfulone1987
Give me an idol with r&b, oh wait, they do that occassionally every blue moon.

is it comprehensible.....

Bardock42
Nope, not comprehensible to me.

Mišt
They're still doing Idol shows...?sleeping

powerfulone1987
um yes

is it comprehensible.....

Raven Guardia
I am watching it laughing out loud but its soon over for the night here.

Alpha Centauri
These type of shows are, and will remain, one of THE worst aspects of worldwide culture until the day they are abolished forever.

They serve no purpose other than to continually pump "musical" garbage into the world whilst somehow spellbinding the viewers into believing that any of these people bear talent or integrity. No real artist would ever be seen dead on one of these puppet for hire TV shows. It disturbs me that a guy or girl is getting a record deal and a chance to be a "musician" by winning a damn game show. It used to be a car, a vacation, a boat. Now you win the right to be an "artist". Pathetic.

Furthermore, these deluded "winners" say "I'm living out my dream! I'm doing what I love!" Are you? Unless your dream was to be a corporate puppet singing songs that are wrote for you and doing exactly as you are told by "the man" then no, you're not. The sole purpose of those shows is to create parasitic vessels with which to drain the life and money out of impressionable people everywhere. As someone who is rabidly passionate about music it sickens me to see such things.

However, like all things, it has it's purpose. To captivate an audience who quite frankly do not and could not know any better.

-AC

Lana
Nope, not watching it. I refuse to watch such garbage.

(I loathe reality TV and this show is really just the lowest of the low)

LiL nAstY GirL
They really are horrible. I just like watching the idiots stick out tongue

powerfulone1987
(Alpha)

Maybe you don't know any better, who are you to speak down to somebody.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Hahaha, good one smile. Me not knowing better, about music.

Who am I to speak down on someone? Nothing I said in my above post is untrue and I will challenge you to prove otherwise.

Also, to those saying "I like watching the idiots." They're all idiots for being on there.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
(Alpha)

Maybe you don't know any better, who are you to speak down to somebody.

is it comprehensible.....

No, what he says is right. These people aren't working to become singers - it's handed to them on a silver platter, so long as they do as they're told.

Disgusting.

powerfulone1987
There you go again with your high all mighty, above other people complex. You will never change.

is it comprehensible.....

Koala MeatPie
Originally posted by Lana
Nope, not watching it. I refuse to watch such garbage.

(I loathe reality TV and this show is really just the lowest of the low)

Hear hear.

Althought the first two series of Amazing Race Was pretty Cool.

powerfulone1987
(lana)

i'm referring to what he said about the viewers.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
There you go again with your high all mighty, above other people complex. You will never change.

is it comprehensible.....

We're discussing music, obviously you don't know me very well in regards to it.

If you can prove my comments wrong, do so. Nothing I've said is untrue. People who watch American Idol with the belief that they are witnessing "talent" know no better. Why? Because that show exhibits zero talent.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
(lana)

i'm referring to what he said about the viewers.

is it comprehensible.....

So? He's still not wrong.

powerfulone1987
(alpha)

uh huh, whatever you say "god"

(lana)

well you're as blind as he is then.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Your words, not mine.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
(alpha)

uh huh, whatever you say "god"

(lana)

well you're as blind as he is then.

is it comprehensible.....

Apparently you know nothing about how that show is basically a slap in the face for truly talented people who are working their asses off to achieve their dreams.

And no, I am not blind at all. Rather, you are. You're clueless.

Raven Guardia
dear lord its getting deep in here.

powerfulone1987
I told you I'm not talking about the singers and all of that crap and the show, I'm talking about the alpha's fasle perception of the viewers which you agree with so there's nothing to say.

IS IT COMPREHENSIBLE.....

LiL nAstY GirL
You make no sense at all...you always contridict yourself

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
I told you I'm not talking about the singers and all of that crap and the show, I'm talking about the alpha's fasle perception of the viewers which you agree with so there's nothing to say.

IS IT COMPREHENSIBLE.....

its okay I know what you mean hug

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by LiL nAstY GirL
You make no sense at all...you always contridict yourself

OK. how?

is it comprehensible.....

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
I told you I'm not talking about the singers and all of that crap and the show, I'm talking about the alpha's fasle perception of the viewers which you agree with so there's nothing to say.

IS IT COMPREHENSIBLE.....

It's not false perception.

People who watch this show think that these people are actually talented and working for it and deserve their fame. If this wasn't true, the show wouldn't be popular. Rather, it's a disgusting parade of "let's find some halfway talented people and let the prettiest one win and turn them into a corporate puppet". And people actually buy this shit.

It's deplorable.

powerfulone1987
You nor anybody else knows what other people are thinking, so get off of your high horse. And if they watch it, oh well, they are no worse than anybody else.
And if somebody can sing, they can sing, and if they can't, they can't.

is it comprehensible.....

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
You nor anybody else knows what other people are thinking, so get off of your high horse. And if they watch it, oh well, they are no worse than anybody else.
And if somebody can sing, they can sing, and if they can't, they can't.

is it comprehensible.....

Reality TV is popular for one reason - people think it's real. They don't realize that 99% of the time it isn't. And in the case of this show, they don't realize what a disgrace it really is.

So you get off your damn high horse and learn what you're talking about before you start spouting garbage.

The people on that show go on about how they've had voice lessons for years....so they can sing. Ask them to sing a style they haven't learned and they're ****ed.

Alpha Centauri
Halfway talented? There's no talent on that show, at all. None.

None of those people have anything that you or I couldn't learn at singing school. It's like praising someone for knowing things you learn in class. Viewers who know no better are impressed because they can croon a little or hit a few notes, so can anyone with training, there are schools for that kind of thing.

Anyone who watches that show and believes they are watching talent, know no better. End of story. If you feel you can debate this, do so. Just don't sit there saying you hate that I'm saying it.

-AC

Bardock42
Originally posted by Lana
"let's find some halfway talented people and let the prettiest one win and turn them into a corporate puppet".

You are wrong.........sometimes the second prettiest gets a contract too.

Mišt
Ha, it seems the top 5 people end up with a contract, so it doesnt even matter who wins it...

Cyber Ninja
the offopc forum is worse than the comic book vs shock

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Lana
Reality TV is popular for one reason - people think it's real. They don't realize that 99% of the time it isn't. And in the case of this show, they don't realize what a disgrace it really is.

So you get off your damn high horse and learn what you're talking about before you start spouting garbage.

The people on that show go on about how they've had voice lessons for years....so they can sing. Ask them to sing a style they haven't learned and they're ****ed.

whether they deserve it or not, stop speaking for other people. The only person you can speak for is yourself.

is it comprehensible.....

Bardock42
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
the offopc forum is worse than the comic book vs shock

So you mean te second someone steps in that can actually debate and decides to do so, it gets worse? You are strange.

Alpha Centauri
If these shows are going to exist, hold them on a damn radio station where nobody can be swayed by image or "Awww he looks after his family", where it'll be judged on sound. Don't do it on TV. Then you'd notice that all these idiots sound the same. Bog standard voices that come a dime a dozen.

Just don't do it. Music isn't a f*cking game.

Originally posted by powerfulone1987
whether they deserve it or not, stop speaking for other people. The only person you can speak for is yourself.

is it comprehensible.....

Nobody is speaking for anyone, but if you watch American Idol and feel there is talent, you know no better. Simple.

-AC

Cyber Ninja
Originally posted by Bardock42
So you mean te second someone steps in that can actually debate and decides to do so, it gets worse? You are strange. debating in here is it ? Ok sure..I will just watch then.

Lana
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
If these shows are going to exist, hold them on a damn radio station where nobody can be swayed by image or "Awww he looks after his family". Don't do it on TV.

Just don't do it. Music isn't a f*cking game.

-AC

Art, period, isn't a game.

Seriously. Have some damn respect for people who are talented and work their asses off for ANY recognition, and don't bastardize it with crap like these shows.

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Lana
It's not false perception.

People who watch this show think that these people are actually talented and working for it and deserve their fame. If this wasn't true, the show wouldn't be popular. Rather, it's a disgusting parade of "let's find some halfway talented people and let the prettiest one win and turn them into a corporate puppet". And people actually buy this shit.

It's deplorable.

now see saying people who watch this show. your are judging everyone who watches it. I watch it, but I don't sit there dazed at the screen thinking everyone is so very talented. I know about music and voices, I have taken four years of vocal lessons. I watch the show and critique the people see where they need to improve or what there strengths are. No I cant obviously tell them what they suck at, but I enjoy watching it anyway. and so flipping what. You cant just go around giving your opinion and judging everyone saying that if they watch it there stupid. Because that would be untrue. Just because you don't like it and think its dumb is just your opinion. There are many artists who have not become famous on American Idol and still became corporate sellouts. you need to not be so judgmental.

Alpha Centauri
I'm not debating whether the shows are shit or whether the people who believe there is talent there know no better, because it's open and shut.

What I'm puzzled by is all this attempted backlash by powerfulone. If you have a problem with what I'm saying, if you believe what I'm saying is false, try to counter it. Don't sit there whining.

-AC

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
now see saying people who watch this show. your are judging everyone who watches it. I watch it, but I don't sit there dazed at the screen thinking everyone is so very talented. I know about music and voices, I have taken four years of vocal lessons. I watch the show and critique the people see where they need to improve or what there strengths are. No I cant obviously tell them what they suck at, but I enjoy watching it anyway. and so flipping what. You cant just go around giving your opinion and judging everyone saying that if they watch it there stupid. Because that would be untrue. Just because you don't like it and think its dumb is just your opinion. There are many artists who have not become famous on American Idol and still became corporate sellouts. you need to not be so judgmental.
exactly.

is it comprehensible.....

Cyber Ninja
I say you all fight in mortal kombat...

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
exactly.

is it comprehensible.....

Don't bandwagon someone else's post, come up with your own.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
You cant just go around giving your opinion and judging everyone saying that if they watch it there stupid. Because that would be untrue. Just because you don't like it and think its dumb is just your opinion. There are many artists who have not become famous on American Idol and still became corporate sellouts. you need to not be so judgmental.

Yes, we can actually go around giving our opinions. Sorry for the shock.

Moving on, it's a dumb concept and it's a disrespectful concept to art. There's zero debate there. It's bastardising music as art, or attempting to. It's putting out the message that anyone can be a "talented musician" and this is false. It's dumbing people down and encouraging them just to buy what they're told as opposed to looking for it themselves.

The show is shit and so are the people on it. If they had talented they'd make a name themselves and never be on the show anyway, fact. Logical fact.

I'm so tired of all this "I like shit, but that's my choice so therefore I can never be debated against." You're not wrong for watching it, but accept it for what it is, don't try to defend it because that just makes you look naive.

-AC

powerfulone1987
Yes, i'm sure seeing simon blow someone down really portrays the idea that anybody can be an artist. And of course it's highly doubtful that without american idol. The winners would not have been recognized for their talent.

is it comprehensible.....

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
Yes, i'm sure seeing simon blow someone down really portrays the idea that anybody can be an artist. And of course it's highly doubtful that without american idol. The winners would not have been recognized for their talent.

is it comprehensible.....

See, you're not getting it.

The people on this show have no real talent. The only reason they are thought decent at all is because they've taken lessons their whole lives. Like I said, ask them to sing a style other than what they wre taught and they're screwed. They'll be like a fish out of water. Face it, the people on there are no good.

Simon's a b!tch for the sake of it. Watch how the other two judges get totally hyped up and excited over the worst of the contestants.

Cyber Ninja
Relax everyone..go write to american idol instead of trying to eat each others faces I mean debating on kmc forums.

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
Yes, i'm sure seeing simon blow someone down really portrays the idea that anybody can be an artist. And of course it's highly doubtful that without american idol. The winners would not have been recognized for their talent.

is it comprehensible.....

Simon Cowell is a gimmick and if you can't see that then my point is unequivocally proven.

He's the one that is designed to make everyone root for whoever he DOESN'T like. He's a pawn and it clearly works.

Talented people with integrity should realise that fame isn't necessary for talent. If you have talent then you can achieve fame on your OWN terms without being a sell out. If you don't have talent and you still want fame, then you have no choice but to do whatever the record companies tell you to, hence American Idol.

A show for people who couldn't have got it any other way. There's no talent there.

-AC

powerfulone1987
so let them stick to their style if that's what they're good at.

You don't see a rapper singing gospel.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
so let them stick to their style if that's what they're good at.

You don't see a rapper singing gospel.

is it comprehensible.....

Exactly. If they're not good at being a musician (having musical talent) then they have no right to try to be one.

End of debate.

-AC

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Don't bandwagon someone else's post, come up with your own.



Yes, we can actually go around giving our opinions. Sorry for the shock.

Moving on, it's a dumb concept and it's a disrespectful concept to art. There's zero debate there. It's bastardising music as art, or attempting to. It's putting out the message that anyone can be a "talented musician" and this is false. It's dumbing people down and encouraging them just to buy what they're told as opposed to looking for it themselves.

The show is shit and so are the people on it. If they had talented they'd make a name themselves and never be on the show anyway, fact. Logical fact.

I'm so tired of all this "I like shit, but that's my choice so therefore I can never be debated against." You're not wrong for watching it, but accept it for what it is, don't try to defend it because that just makes you look naive.

-AC

you give your opinions as if your God. roll eyes (sarcastic)

A LOT of music these days is bastardizing music as art. Look at freaking MTV that sucks ass. Its just not American idol. American idol is not the devil of "bastardizing art". Yeah there are a lot of people who go on there that have no talent what so ever, but who cares. they have the right too. Let them. They are not going to ruin music or art more then any of the shit music played on MTV.

Cyber Ninja
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Exactly. If they're not good at being a musician (having musical talent) then they have no right to try to be one.

End of debate.

-AC

yes the 11th commandment smile

Lana
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
you give your opinions as if your God. roll eyes (sarcastic)

A LOT of music these days is bastardizing music as art. Look at freaking MTV that sucks ass. Its just not American idol. American idol is not the devil of "bastardizing art". Yeah there are a lot of people who go on there that have no talent what so ever, but who cares. they have the right too. Let them. They are not going to ruin music or art more then any of the shit music played on MTV.

MTV is shit. And shit like this IS ruining music and art as a whole. It makes talentless idiots think that they can become big, and because of it, the people who really ARE talented are often passed over and ignored, because anyone with real talent, self-respect, and integrity for their art will not whore themselves out like that.

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Exactly. If they're not good at being a musician (having musical talent) then they have no right to try to be one.

End of debate.

-AC

well then we wouldn't have any artist in the world.

All singers stick to their one style that they're good at.

Let me know when Eminem, starts singing country.

And who are you once again after mutliple attemtps to "end a debate".

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
you give your opinions as if your God. roll eyes (sarcastic)

A LOT of music these days is bastardizing music as art. Look at freaking MTV that sucks ass. Its just not American idol. American idol is not the devil of "bastardizing art". Yeah there are a lot of people who go on there that have no talent what so ever, but who cares. they have the right too. Let them. They are not going to ruin music or art more then any of the shit music played on MTV.

Thanks for referring to me as God, I have yet to do it myself but I appreciate it. You don't like people giving opinions besides you, you're a hypocrite in that area.

On the second part, that's my point. It's not JUST American Idol but it IS included. My only point was that it's absolutely shit, pointless and it's demeaning to music and musicians with talent. Fact. Nobody on there has any natural, unattainable and genuine talent, at all.

Just because there's already a lot of ideas and shows out there that are detrimental to music, it isn't a green light to go ahead and make more is it? No.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
well then we wouldn't have any artist in the world.

All singers stick to their one style that they're good at.

Let me know when Eminem, starts singing country.

is it comprehensible.....

That's just stupid.

There are many artists who are good in more than one style.

I'm an artist, and while I do have one style I am best in, I am more than proficient in MANY others as well.

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Lana
MTV is shit. And shit like this IS ruining music and art as a whole. It makes talentless idiots think that they can become big, and because of it, the people who really ARE talented are often passed over and ignored, because anyone with real talent, self-respect, and integrity for their art will not whore themselves out like that.

thats because the media has already a set image of what they want. Look at Britney,Christina,Jessica. Thats what people "want". They don't look for real talent like what use to be played. Bands will never be as good as they use too. There is to much focus on image and not the talent

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
well then we wouldn't have any artist in the world.

All singers stick to their one style that they're good at.

Let me know when Eminem, starts singing country.

is it comprehensible.....

Haha, stupidest logic ever.

People who have talent, use their talent. Exactly. People with no talent still want to be seen as people with talent.

If all you can do is walk out of a singing school with the ability to do kareoke (which is all these "idols" do) and a voice that anyone could achieve in time, then don't think you're worthy of anything else.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
thats because the media has already a set image of what they want. Look at Britney,Christina,Jessica. Thats what people "want". They don't look for real talent like what use to be played. Bands will never be as good as they use too. There is to much focus on image and not the talent

And that's not true either.

People who want shit, deserve shit.

However there are many people who want good music by talented musicians....and believe it or not, they still exist. You might just actually have to work to find it, as opposed to having it handed to you.

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
thats because the media has already a set image of what they want. Look at Britney,Christina,Jessica. Thats what people "want". They don't look for real talent like what use to be played. Bands will never be as good as they use too. There is to much focus on image and not the talent

False, that's where MTV is influencing you too.

"Bands will never be as good as they used to."

They are, actually. You're just not aware of them because you know no better, this is exactly what American Idol and MTV are doing. Keeping you glued to your TV in the belief that the people you see on there are all there is. That's as far from the truth as you can get.

Point proven again.

-AC

powerfulone1987
yall just think you know everything about everything and everyone and you don't.

All you can do is state your opinions about yourselves, no one else.


And Raven wasn't referring to your opinions themselves, just your opinions that speak for other people.

is it comprehensible......

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
False, that's where MTV is influencing you too.

"Bands will never be as good as they used to."

They are, actually. You're just not aware of them because you know no better, this is exactly what American Idol and MTV are doing. Keeping you glued to your TV in the belief that the people you see on there are all there is. That's as far from the truth as you can get.

Point proven again.

-AC

Funny, when Raven speaks for a large number of people, it's wrong and only her/him.

But when you do it, it's so accurate and END OF DEBATE. Your famous phrase.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
yall just think you know everything about everything and everyone and you don't.

All you can do is state your opinions about yourselves, no one else.


And Raven wasn't referring to your opinions themselves, just your opinions that speak for other people.

is it comprehensible......

Originally posted by powerfulone1987
Funny, when Raven speaks for a large number of people, it's wrong and only her/him.

But when you do it, it's so accurate and END OF DEBATE. Your famous phrase.

is it comprehensible.....

I'm not speaking for anyone else, I've said this to you. What I have said in this thread regarding the show however, is true, whether you like it or not. It's not true because I've said it, it's true because it's fact. If you would like to go research this then you'll find that for yourself.

I don't know everything about everyone, nor have I claimed I did, but we're discussing music. I know some stuff about music, some stuff indeed (that's a big understatement), so I'm more than qualified to speak on it and I have exercised my right to do so.

Stop whining and bitching, counter my argument if you can. Because at the moment all you are doing is sitting there moaning that I'm saying things.

-AC

Cyber Ninja
And on the 7th day God created Hypocrites shifty

Alpha Centauri
I just realised that you're Twister from the CandVG Forum. Odd.

-AC

Cyber Ninja
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I just realised that you're Twister from the CandVG Forum. Odd.

-AC

yup


testing the water in this thread. Prooving this other guy that said it is not hostile in here wrong.

Alpha Centauri
Not hostile to me, I just find it kind of funny that despite my saying that I'm not speaking for anyone or saying that anyone is wrong for watching the show, they still claim I'm saying such things.

Watch the show all you want, but don't try to deny what it is to save your face. You've chosen to watch it, the honourable thing to do would be to admit that.

-AC

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I'm not speaking for anyone else

yes you are.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
yes you are.

is it comprehensible.....

Hahaha, so lame.

-AC

Victor Von Doom
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
I'm not speaking for anyone else


Originally posted by powerfulone1987
yes you are.



Hahaha.

That is genuinely amusing.

Cyber Ninja
Well so far I read ************* and thats why ************ but I am not ******8 damn shit f*ck ***** well you know. Not hostile well I say the tone is a little implying . keep going droolio guys

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Thanks for referring to me as God, I have yet to do it myself but I appreciate it. You don't like people giving opinions besides you, you're a hypocrite in that area.

On the second part, that's my point. It's not JUST American Idol but it IS included. My only point was that it's absolutely shit, pointless and it's demeaning to music and musicians with talent. Fact. Nobody on there has any natural, unattainable and genuine talent, at all.

Just because there's already a lot of ideas and shows out there that are detrimental to music, it isn't a green light to go ahead and make more is it? No.

-AC

well you can be a bit opinionated your self.

out of all the people that try out, its untrue to say they all don't natural talent. I am very sure that out of 10,000 some people there is bound to be someone with natural talent. They don't show everyone that tries out.

hey, as long producers can make money from something. There gonna do anyway no matter who if offends.

Originally posted by Lana
And that's not true either.

People who want shit, deserve shit.

However there are many people who want good music by talented musicians....and believe it or not, they still exist. You might just actually have to work to find it, as opposed to having it handed to you.
I didn't say good musician's didn't work hard. I said producers try to hard to please an image.
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
False, that's where MTV is influencing you too.

"Bands will never be as good as they used to."

They are, actually. You're just not aware of them because you know no better, this is exactly what American Idol and MTV are doing. Keeping you glued to your TV in the belief that the people you see on there are all there is. That's as far from the truth as you can get.

Point proven again.

-AC
Because truthfully they wont be. I am not influenced by TV, American Idol or lana and your "know it all knowledge" roll eyes (sarcastic). Bands are not made like they use to be. There just not. And they wont be if people keep focusing on looks or image. These days its just all about the image. Main stream music well never be great.

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
Well so far I read ************* and thats why ************ but I am not ******8 damn shit f*ck ***** well you know. Not hostile well I say the tone is a little implying . keep going droolio guys

If you are willing to share how you get tone from text, I'll listen to your theories. I've not been abusive, I don't regard this as hostile.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
well you can be a bit opinionated your self.

out of all the people that try out, its untrue to say they all don't natural talent. I am very sure that out of 10,000 some people there is bound to be someone with natural talent. They don't show everyone that tries out.

hey, as long producers can make money from something. There gonna do anyway no matter who if offends.


I didn't say good musician's didn't work hard. I said producers try to hard to please an image.

Because truthfully they wont be. I am not influenced by TV, American Idol or lana and your "know it all knowledge" roll eyes (sarcastic). Bands are not made like they use to be. There just not. And they wont be if people keep focusing on looks or image. These days its just all about the image. Main stream music well never be great.

You are displaying nothing but ignorance here.

There are a great many bands now that are just as good as and in some cases better than older ones. There ARE good bands in the mainstream, ones who are truly talented and don't care about image.

Don't try and feed crap like that to people who are more knowledgable in a subject. It doesn't work.

Cyber Ninja
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
If you are willing to share how you get tone from text, I'll listen to your theories. I've not been abusive, I don't regard this as hostile.

-AC


Sorry to defy you, you are right embarrasment

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Lana
You are displaying nothing but ignorance here.

There are a great many bands now that are just as good as and in some cases better than older ones. There ARE good bands in the mainstream, ones who are truly talented and don't care about image.

Don't try and feed crap like that to people who are more knowledgable in a subject. It doesn't work.
i wouldn't call it "more knowldgable" at all, but I would call it something else.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
well you can be a bit opinionated your self.

The difference is, I more than welcome anyone sharing their views with me. Conflicting or not, agreeing or not. You like to say yours and then have no one say anything in return.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
out of all the people that try out, its untrue to say they all don't natural talent. I am very sure that out of 10,000 some people there is bound to be someone with natural talent. They don't show everyone that tries out.

Why are they BOUND to have talent? Think about what you're saying. If the ones who get on the actual show and are deemed great, have no talent, what makes you think that the failures are any better? Your logic is flawed.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
hey, as long producers can make money from something. There gonna do anyway no matter who if offends.

Right, who said otherwise? I just said it was wrong.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
I didn't say good musician's didn't work hard. I said producers try to hard to please an image

Who said otherwise?

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
Because truthfully they wont be. I am not influenced by TV, American Idol or lana and your "know it all knowledge" roll eyes (sarcastic). Bands are not made like they use to be. There just not. And they wont be if people keep focusing on looks or image. These days its just all about the image. Main stream music well never be great.

There are so many great, amazing bands out there. The fact that you don't know them doesn't mean they don't exist, learn this. Mainstream music will never be good? Hahahaha, some of the world's best bands are, to one degree or another, mainstream and well known. Mainstream doesn't mean you lack talent, MANUFACTURED does. That's exactly what these "idols" are. Manufactured nobodies with zero talent.

Music today isn't "all about the image", you watch too much MTV. Oh and don't reply with "No I don't", because the fact that you believe that music is all about image and that bands will never be as good as they were, suggests that you do. Because you're wrong.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
i wouldn't call it "more knowldgable" at all, but I would call it something else.

is it comprehensible.....

No, I would call it more knowledgable. I know music. AC does even more so.

Get over it already, you haven't been able to counter anything said with anymore than "nuh-uh that's not true!"

Tails x 20
Did you see today's episdoe, that crazy white guy and fat black toothless guy!!

Alpha Centauri
Exactly.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with all that Raven is saying, she's just wrong about the "bands aren't as good, it's all about image" thing. That's not the case.

My whole point was that nobody is WRONG for watching these shows, but if you make the choice to watch them, then admit what they are. Don't try to defend it to make yourself look better.

-AC

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Lana
No, I would call it more knowledgable. I know music. AC does even more so.

Get over it already, you haven't been able to counter anything said with anymore than "nuh-uh that's not true!"
nuh uh, that's not true!

And how about we get off of this Alpha wagon, you're starting to sound just like him now, and that's not a good thing.

is it comprehensible.....

RedAlertv2
Lets face it: whoever wins American Idol will jsut be the next bland pop act, and will surface for a few weeks and then be forgotten.

lol @ OT people trying to debate music with the likes of AC and Lana.
Seriously, keep it up. Its entertaining

Cyber Ninja
Originally posted by RedAlertv2
Lets face it: whoever wins American Idol will jsut be the next bland pop act, and will surface for a few weeks and then be forgotten.

lol @ OT people trying to debate music with the likes of AC and Lana.
Seriously, keep it up. Its entertaining do you care for some popcorn old chap ?

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
nuh uh, that's not true!

And how about we get off of this Alpha wagon, you're starting to sound just like him now, and that's not a good thing.

is it comprehensible.....

How about you contribute something to this thread besides a tantrum? Leave the thread if not.

All you're doing is moaning about us posting while at the same time trying to defend your right to post. Post something of value or post nothing at all.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
nuh uh, that's not true!

And how about we get off of this Alpha wagon, you're starting to sound just like him now, and that's not a good thing.

is it comprehensible.....

You know, you honestly make me laugh.

And not because you're entertaining.

You've yet to contribute anything to this debate but moaning and complaining because you don't like what we're saying. Deal. Sorry I left my rose-colored glasses at home.

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by RedAlertv2
Lets face it: whoever wins American Idol will jsut be the next bland pop act, and will surface for a few weeks and then be forgotten.

lol @ OT people trying to debate music with the likes of AC and Lana.
Seriously, keep it up. Its entertaining
Was kelly Clarkson, or Fantasia forgotten within a few weeks?

I actually remember Kelly winning a couple awards.

is it comprehensible.....

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Lana
You are displaying nothing but ignorance here.

There are a great many bands now that are just as good as and in some cases better than older ones. There ARE good bands in the mainstream, ones who are truly talented and don't care about image.

Don't try and feed crap like that to people who are more knowledgable in a subject. It doesn't work.

yes and you would know all about ignorance.

if you like todays music good for you, but I don't care for it. Yeah some bands maybe good. But the majority of music today is mostly about image.

oh I forgot, your the all mighty knowledgeable lana. OH my how could I forget . you know more then anyone about everything. shame on me.

Victor Von Doom
Would someone care to sum up the salient points of this argument, because it's going all over the place.

What is actually being disputed here? The talent? The mindset of the viewers?

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
Was kelly Clarkson, or Fantasia forgotten within a few weeks?

I actually remember Kelly winning a couple awards.

is it comprehensible.....

So? Britney Spears has an MTV trophy cabinet.

Awards mean nothing. None of them are talented.

-AC

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
How about you contribute something to this thread besides a tantrum? Leave the thread if not.

All you're doing is moaning about us posting while at the same time trying to defend your right to post. Post something of value or post nothing at all.

-AC
i created this thread and will stay for as long as i want. There you go again ordering things to happen.

is it comprehensible.....

And that's good lana b/c i'm not trying to be entertaining.

IS IT COMPREHENSIBLE.....

RedAlertv2
They do nothing unique. They dont write their own music. And they only perform the vocals, which should be no more important than the rest of the music.

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
But the majority of music today is mostly about image.

This is factually incorrect. It's not about opinion, you're actually wrong.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
yes and you would know all about ignorance.

if you like todays music good for you, but I don't care for it. Yeah some bands maybe good. But the majority of music today is mostly about image.

oh I forgot, your the all mighty knowledgeable lana. OH my how could I forget . you know more then anyone about everything. shame on me.

And I'll bet you've never taken the time to really seek out any good bands that are around today. Because if you did, you'd know that there are a great many that are good and do not rely on image and rather on talent.

It's usually not wise to speak about things you know nothing of, as you usually wind up looking foolish.

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
So? Britney Spears has an MTV trophy cabinet.

Awards mean nothing. None of them are talented.

-AC

i'm not talking about britney.

is it comprehensible.....

Lana
Originally posted by RedAlertv2
They do nothing unique. They dont write their own music. And they only perform the vocals, which should be no more important than the rest of the music.

Exactly. Give them an instrument, ask them to write their own song, tell them to sing a style other than pop....they'd be completely lost because they wouldn't know how to.

Tails x 20
Why you always say is it comprehensible? no expression

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
i'm not talking about britney.

is it comprehensible.....

His point is that awards mean ****-all.

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by Victor Von Doom
Would someone care to sum up the salient points of this argument, because it's going all over the place.

What is actually being disputed here? The talent? The mindset of the viewers?

My original point was that besides the shows in general being complete shit, the people who watch them with the belief that they are witnessing talented musicians, know no better than to think that.

I don't think anyone is wrong for watching these shows, but I believe that in choosing to watch them you should also be willing to openly admit what they are, which is what I've said they are. Instead, people are defending it because they don't wish to look bad for watching American Idol.

-AC

RedAlertv2
This thread pretty much exposes all the worst qualities of today's average music listener

Alpha Centauri
That is exactly what they are, Red. Average music listeners, passive. Which is why people like Raven feel that it's mostly about the image and there are mostly no good bands.

Mostly to someone with little knowledge, isn't a lot.

-AC

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Lana
Exactly. Give them an instrument, ask them to write their own song, tell them to sing a style other than pop....they'd be completely lost because they wouldn't know how to. who is they. I know musicians that write and play instruments and sing.

is it comprehensible.....

Cyber Ninja
What is good,bad or talented exactly. Different people have different tastes...I like popcorn but that killer down the street hates it...is popcorn bad ?

who is who to decide.
To each his own embarrasment

K.Diddy
Originally posted by rej1587
It sucks. major.

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
That is exactly what they are, Red. Average music listeners, passive. Which is why people like Raven feel that it's mostly about the image and there are mostly no good bands.

Mostly to someone with little knowledge, isn't a lot.

-AC

You don't know anything about the people who watch this show.

is it comprehensible.....

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
who is they. I know musicians that write and play instruments and sing.

is it comprehensible.....

So do I. I'm talking about the people on American Idol.

Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
What is good,bad or talented exactly. Different people have different tastes...I like popcorn but that killer down the street hates it...is popcorn bad ?

who is who to decide.
To each his own embarrasment

Talent is regardless of taste and something that can actually be measured.

RedAlertv2
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
That is exactly what they are, Red. Average music listeners, passive. Which is why people like Raven feel that it's mostly about the image and there are mostly no good bands.

Mostly to someone with little knowledge, isn't a lot.

-AC

Unfortunately, in today's world it's almost impossible for the casual music fan to discover good music.

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
who is they. I know musicians that write and play instruments and sing.

is it comprehensible.....

Not big on attention span, I take it?

Cyber Ninja: What we each hear is subjective. Nobody on Earth can prove one band to be better than the other in terms of what music is made. Talent IS provable because talent isn't about preference.

You can't say "She's talented, I prefer her." If she's not got any talent, then that's how it is. These American Idol people can't create anything on their own, they have no technical prowess with vocals, they're talentless.

If you prefer the music they make, fine. I hate it, but that's all subjective. To claim they are talented is to step into an area where things become provable.

-AC

Cyber Ninja
Originally posted by Lana
So do I. I'm talking about the people on American Idol.



Talent is regardless of taste and something that can actually be measured.
By a ruler shifty who measures it ? shifty

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
You don't know anything about the people who watch this show.

is it comprehensible.....

You know, you're really starting to sound like a parrot. Come up with an actual counter, okay?

Victor Von Doom
The situation is pretty much this.

The first few weeks are funny, because you see the truly bad competitors.

From then on, the show is poor, because the viewers seem to think that the rest of the contenders are not bad. They are, they just don't realise it.

The judges have no idea about music, other than what sells. Hence their track records (excuse the pun) of Zig and Zag, Westlife, and so on.

Anyone watching because they think the competitors are good- you find good music in a record store, not on some cheap-shit tv talent show.

Anyone watching even though they know it's shit- ask yourself why you might want to do that? Doesn't seem very sensible.

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
The difference is, I more than welcome anyone sharing their views with me. Conflicting or not, agreeing or not. You like to say yours and then have no one say anything in return.



Why are they BOUND to have talent? Think about what you're saying. If the ones who get on the actual show and are deemed great, have no talent, what makes you think that the failures are any better? Your logic is flawed.



Right, who said otherwise? I just said it was wrong.



Who said otherwise?



There are so many great, amazing bands out there. The fact that you don't know them doesn't mean they don't exist, learn this. Mainstream music will never be good? Hahahaha, some of the world's best bands are, to one degree or another, mainstream and well known. Mainstream doesn't mean you lack talent, MANUFACTURED does. That's exactly what these "idols" are. Manufactured nobodies with zero talent.

Music today isn't "all about the image", you watch too much MTV. Oh and don't reply with "No I don't", because the fact that you believe that music is all about image and that bands will never be as good as they were, suggests that you do. Because you're wrong.

-AC

I dont mind other peoples opinions. I just dont always agree with them

because some may have talent but that doesnt mean they will get on the show...People have been turned down on there because there hair isnt nice, or they are too heavy. The judges do not always focus on voice.

I didnt say I didnt disagree with you about so many shows

I was talking to lana

I didnt say mainstream= no talent. I am saying the people/bands that focus on Image/appearance in mainstream suck. like Brittney,Ashley etc

seriously I dont watch MTV's music at my house on my own will. I babysit a girl in middle school who watches it all the time thats how I see the garbage.

and here we go with the "your wrong" yes AC everyone will always be wrong in yours eyes.

Lana
Originally posted by Cyber Ninja
By a ruler shifty who measures it ? shifty

AC can field that better than I can.

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Lana
You know, you're really starting to sound like a parrot. Come up with an actual counter, okay?
how about you stop repeating what alpha keeps saying. I'll say what i want to say.

is it comprehensible.....

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Not big on attention span, I take it?

Cyber Ninja: What we each hear is subjective. Nobody on Earth can prove one band to be better than the other in terms of what music is made. Talent IS provable because talent isn't about preference.

You can't say "She's talented, I prefer her." If she's not got any talent, then that's how it is. These American Idol people can't create anything on their own, they have no technical prowess with vocals, they're talentless.

If you prefer the music they make, fine. I hate it, but that's all subjective. To claim they are talented is to step into an area where things become provable.

-AC

oh yes, anybody who disagrees with you is just WWWRRROONNGGG.

is it comprehensible.....

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
how about you stop repeating what alpha keeps saying. I'll say what i want to say.

is it comprehensible.....

Wow, dodging again.

I'm not copying or repeating what he says, 99% of the time while I'm posting his post isn't even up yet. It's known as posting at the same time.

Not to mention that we've ALWAYS had the same feelings when it comes to music, though admittedly I don't take it quite as seriously as he does.

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Lana
AC can field that better than I can.

i'm sure he can lana, get off of his.....nevermind.

is it comprehensible.....

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Lana
And I'll bet you've never taken the time to really seek out any good bands that are around today. Because if you did, you'd know that there are a great many that are good and do not rely on image and rather on talent.

It's usually not wise to speak about things you know nothing of, as you usually wind up looking foolish.

holy ****amoly

I said already I prefer the older music from the 80's. I like some modren music, BUT I prefer to listen to the older stuff. I have no disere to "seek" music. I have more important stuff to do with my life then go around seeking music.

no nothing of...oh thats right. Its comming from you. Even when I talk about the subject I "do" know of I still know nothing compared to you all great one.

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
because some may have talent but that doesnt mean they will get on the show...People have been turned down on there because there hair isnt nice, or they are too heavy. The judges do not always focus on voice.

Exactly. If they have talent they wouldn't be auditioning on TV to win a record contract based on judges deciding based on image would they? Think about it.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
I didnt say I didnt disagree with you about so many shows

You've lost yourself there...

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
I didnt say mainstream= no talent. I am saying the people/bands that focus on Image/appearance in mainstream suck. like Brittney,Ashley etc

Yes, what's your point and who's saying any different?

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
seriously I dont watch MTV's music at my house on my own will. I babysit a girl in middle school who watches it all the time thats how I see the garbage.

Then you should know better than to think most music today is about image.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
and here we go with the "your wrong" yes AC everyone will always be wrong in yours eyes.

No, listen carefully. Stop being so insecure.

Just because you don't know enough bands to judge, doesn't mean that ALL music today or even most, is about the image. That kind of thing is the material you see on MTV. In a record store, if you kids bothered to go into one and stop downloading shit, you'd see that you are actually wrong.

And here is my proof:

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
I have no disere to "seek" music. I have more important stuff to do with my life then go around seeking music.

Then don't sit there claiming that most music is about image today. You don't know enough to make that claim. Maybe most music you KNOW about, but not most music.

If you're not seeking out new music, then you'll never see why you're wrong. If you just stay in your box, you can continue to convince yourself.

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
i'm sure he can lana, get off of his.....nevermind.

is it comprehensible.....

Oh, I'm sorry for fielding a question to someone more knowledgable than I in a subject.

Why don't you just shut up until you know what you're talking about?

RedAlertv2
Instead of watching American Idol, people should spend the hour looking up some good music

Tails x 20
Originally posted by RedAlertv2
Instead of watching American Idol, people should spend the hour looking up some good music
I agree!

powerfulone1987
Why go on the show if they have talent?

Because, no matter how talented someone is, they'll still do whatever they have to to get recognize. Not all talented people, if any, share your views on this matter. However hard that is to believe.

is it comprehensible.....

Lana
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
holy ****amoly

I said already I prefer the older music from the 80's. I like some modren music, BUT I prefer to listen to the older stuff. I have no disere to "seek" music. I have more important stuff to do with my life then go around seeking music.

no nothing of...oh thats right. Its comming from you. Even when I talk about the subject I "do" know of I still know nothing compared to you all great one.

You said it right there -- you don't try and find good music. Therefore, you're in no position to judge.

You like older music, that's fine. But that doesn't mean that your claims about music today are right, and your admitted apathy towards music today just proves your ignorance about it.

RedAlertv2
Or be like me, and spend it bashing American Idol!

powerfulone1987
oh, they are doing just that.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
Why go on the show if they have talent?

Because, no matter how talented someone is, they'll still do whatever they have to to get recognize. Not all talented people, if any, share your views on this matter. However hard that is to believe.

is it comprehensible.....

If they'll do whatever they can to achieve fame, even reduce themselves to becoming a puppet, then they have absolutely no integrity or talent at all.

You're not too good at this.

Originally posted by powerfulone1987
oh, they are doing just that.

is it comprehensible.....

And you're just spending it whining. You've not tried to involve yourself intelligently into this debate at all.

-AC

RedAlertv2
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
Why go on the show if they have talent?

Because, no matter how talented someone is, they'll still do whatever they have to to get recognize. Not all talented people, if any, share your views on this matter. However hard that is to believe.

is it comprehensible.....

There are bands that arent interested in gaining mainstream recognition. Believe it or not, some bands play music for *gasp* fun. Not everyone is in it to make a quick million.

powerfulone1987
untrue.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
untrue.

is it comprehensible.....

You don't actually know anything about music do you?

-AC

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
Why go on the show if they have talent?

Because, no matter how talented someone is, they'll still do whatever they have to to get recognize. Not all talented people, if any, share your views on this matter. However hard that is to believe.

is it comprehensible.....

No no no no NO!

FFS!

If someone is really talented in something, they are going to work their ass off for recognition. Whoring yourself out like the people on American Idol goes against all sense of self-respect and integrity for your art.

I am an artist. And I will admit that yes, I am quite good at what I do. I will NEVER do anything to disrespect my work - I'd rather have little recognition yet know that what I have is because of my talent than sell myself out and be popular. And you know what, my approach is finally getting me someone after years of work - I sell my works now and was recently featured in a magazine.

Not everyone is in it for fame and money, you realize.

And if you don't, you truly ARE clueless.

Victor Von Doom
Everytime time I refresh this page, say 20 seconds after reading the last post: 5 new posts.

Conclusion- no-one is listening to each other.

Second conclusion- this won't end via logic.

RedAlertv2
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
untrue.

is it comprehensible.....

So youre saying that when I jam in my garage with my band, we are doing so in an attempt to garner attention from the mainstream audience?

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Lana
No no no no NO!

FFS!

If someone is really talented in something, they are going to work their ass off for recognition. Whoring yourself out like the people on American Idol goes against all sense of self-respect and integrity for your art.

I am an artist. And I will admit that yes, I am quite good at what I do. I will NEVER do anything to disrespect my work - I'd rather have little recognition yet know that what I have is because of my talent than sell myself out and be popular. And you know what, my approach is finally getting me someone after years of work - I sell my works now and was recently featured in a magazine.

Not everyone is in it for fame and money, you realize.

And if you don't, you truly ARE clueless.
im sorry, but not everybody shares your views, so yes, talented people will do what they have to do.

is it comprehensible.....

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Alpha Centauri
Exactly. If they have talent they wouldn't be auditioning on TV to win a record contract based on judges deciding based on image would they? Think about it.



You've lost yourself there...



Yes, what's your point and who's saying any different?



Then you should know better than to think most music today is about image.



No, listen carefully. Stop being so insecure.

Just because you don't know enough bands to judge, doesn't mean that ALL music today or even most, is about the image. That kind of thing is the material you see on MTV. In a record store, if you kids bothered to go into one and stop downloading shit, you'd see that you are actually wrong.

And here is my proof:



Then don't sit there claiming that most music is about image today. You don't know enough to make that claim. Maybe most music you KNOW about, but not most music.

If you're not seeking out new music, then you'll never see why you're wrong. If you just stay in your box, you can continue to convince yourself.

-AC

they would if they thought they had the image

no, I said that producers will make shows like American idol if they know they will get rich off it.

I am not being insecure, but you always tell people there wrong.

I dont download music erm I listen to my CD's...the only record stores they have around here is walmart and FYE.

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by RedAlertv2
So youre saying that when I jam in my garage with my band, we are doing so in an attempt to garner attention from the mainstream audience?

ummm.......ok that's nice.

is it comprehensible.....

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
im sorry, but not everybody shares your views, so yes, talented people will do what they have to do.

is it comprehensible.....

And what place are you in to judge this? How many truly talented musicians and artists do you know?

Alpha Centauri
Discussing anything besides the time with PowerfulOne is a bit of a stretch. I don't see the point anymore.

He's not contributing anything. He'll get no more replied from me unless they're valid.

-AC

RedAlertv2
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
ummm.......ok that's nice.

is it comprehensible.....

Id appreciate it if you answered the question.

powerfulone1987
Originally posted by Lana
And what place are you in to judge this? How many truly talented musicians and artists do you know? im to judge it the same way you are judging everybody else, capeesh.

is it comprehensible.....

Cyber Ninja
So Ac...what you are trying to say is, that if a tree falls and no one is around to hear it, that it still makes a noise ?

Maybe, but who would care if they don't see it shifty

Raven Guardia
Originally posted by Lana
You said it right there -- you don't try and find good music. Therefore, you're in no position to judge.

You like older music, that's fine. But that doesn't mean that your claims about music today are right, and your admitted apathy towards music today just proves your ignorance about it.

why should I try and find "good" music if I already like the music I listen to and believe its good.

what part of artiest that focus on image= suck. don't you get? I am not saying all of todays artiest suck. The ones that focus mainly on image suck.

Cyber Ninja
I don't know if you answered this alread Ac but who measures talent and with what ?

Lana
Originally posted by powerfulone1987
im to judge it the same way you are judging everybody else, capeesh.

is it comprehensible.....

People who are more knowledgable/experienced in a subject are much better placed to judge.

So tell me. How many people do you know are talented yet will sell themselves out for fame? How many talented artists do you know, period?

powerfulone1987
Raven, don't waist your fingers "breath", they are too single minded and ignorant to look beyond they own views and opinions b/c of course the rest of the world thinks the same as them.

is it comprehensible.....

Alpha Centauri
Originally posted by Raven Guardia
they would if they thought they had the image

THINK about what you are saying. THINK about it for once. If someone is auditioning on American Idol to be a singer because they think they have the IMAGE, what does that say to you? It means that they are willing to exploit anything they possess in order to get on the show and win it, and people will vote because people are stupid.

If you want to go on there, then you immediately have no integrity. None of them have talent.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
no, I said that producers will make shows like American idol if they know they will get rich off it.

Yes and I said "I know". You're not pointing anything new out.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
I am not being insecure, but you always tell people there wrong.

Here's the equation:

If we're discussing an issue and you happen to be on the wrong side of it, then that's how it goes. You may not like that, but that's life. I have proven to you why what you've said is wrong, so stop trying to make out that it's me accusing you of it needlessly. You're uninformed and uneducated on music, you are making judgement calls that you have no place to be making due to your lack of knowledge and musical apathy.

Originally posted by Raven Guardia
I dont download music erm I listen to my CD's...the only record stores they have around here is walmart and FYE.

I wasn't specifically referring to you.

Point: You were wrong when you claimed that most music today is about image. That's not just me saying it, it's true. You don't know enough about music to judge that.

-AC

Cyber Ninja
Originally posted by Lana
People who are more knowledgable/experienced in a subject are much better placed to judge.

So tell me. How many people do you know are talented yet will sell themselves out for fame? How many talented artists do you know, period?

If you were given a billion dollars to go on american idol and try to win(if you were a talented singer) then would you go shifty

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