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Setting is in an open field in Dantooine.

general grievous, he defeated jedi masters, i thougt unduli was just a knight

GG takes this, but not because of the retarded reasons mentioned in the previous post(Luminara was a Master, but that makes little difference in how strong she is).

vpokdekjyafmidp, Anakin was just a Knight, so do you think GG could take him too?

yes actually i do

and i was confusing luminara unduli with aayla secura

you spelled luminara unduli and aayal secura right but you spelled anakin wrong (aniken)?

and no, GG cannot take on Jedi Knight Anakin in ROTS

Luminara would destroy Grievous. Like Obi-Wan, she had mastered Form III.

It's very hard to say.

It's close bit I agree with Aristocrat. She is a Soresu master and would probably be able to deal with him just like Kenobi did.

Lik shooting a blaster at him, while hanging off the side of a landing platform? Ya, Form 3 really helped.

Is Luminara strong in the force? Cause one force push by Kenobi and Grievous lost all his sabers.

Originally posted by DE Calvin
Lik shooting a blaster at him, while hanging off the side of a landing platform? Ya, Form 3 really helped.

In the actual lightsaber duel before, Kenobi's use of Soresu was what helped him out duel him.

Originally posted by kamikz
Is Luminara strong in the force? Cause one force push by Kenobi and Grievous lost all his sabers.

She was able to prevent those rocks in Illum with the force, so she was pretty strong in the force.

Originally posted by kamikz
Is Luminara strong in the force? Cause one force push by Kenobi and Grievous lost all his sabers.
He lost 2 sabers, not all.

So you think he would keep his other two from flying away if he had them when he coulden't do a shit about the once he had already?

He lost all of his remaining sabers (2 from his duel and the other 2 from the force push).

Yeah, Luminara was good with the Force. Read The Approaching Storm.

How big a part does Unduli play in it. I recently downloaded it as an Ebook but haven't read it yet.

You rebel!

Originally posted by DE Calvin
You rebel!

Sorry?

Yeah, rebel!

Originally posted by Numan
Sorry?
It was a harmless joke.

You do know that downloading it isn't illegal right, well at least the way I downloaded it wasn't.

Ya, I know.

Originally posted by Numan
How big a part does Unduli play in it. I recently downloaded it as an Ebook but haven't read it yet.

She plays a big role, as does Obi-Wan, Barriess Offee, and Anakin. Luminara also has cameos in Cloak of Deception and Medstar Duology.

Luminara for sure. She's extremely strong, ROTS Obi-Wan actually regards her as a better Soresu master as himself. Although Mace regards Obi-Wan as the better Soresu Master nonetheless, Luminara's a Soresu Master, and a strong Jedi. Soresu is the form that excels against Grievous. Now, I'm not gonna say Barriss Offee could beat Grievous or anything, but someone as strong as Luminara who is a Soresu master could definately beat Grievous.


Edit: Me and Aritokrat disagree alot of them time but it's nice that it seems like we in most threads that involve Luminara.

Well, she is damn good for a background character.

Originally posted by Dark Aristokrat
Well, she is damn good for a background character.
I know I wish all of these backrounders were in the movies as much as Obi or Yoda.

Luminara all the way but Grievious would put up a great fight.

Originally posted by Janus Marius
She plays a big role, as does Obi-Wan, Barriess Offee, and Anakin. Luminara also has cameos in Cloak of Deception and Medstar Duology.

Actually, Barris could probably beat Grievous.

I say General Grievous wins, but Luminara makes him work for it.

As has been said, Form 3 is a good counter to Grievous's attacks. However, it would be wrong to say that Form 3 is an automatic win against Grievous, who has gone toe-to-toe with Jedi Council Members. And I do not believe Unduli was ever a Council Member.

Some people are forgetting that Grievous once took on 5 Jedi (including Shaak Ti and Ki Adi Mundi) at once and won, dodging their force attacks and outdueling them. He has also been able to fight evenly against Ventress after her defection, and Ventress managed to defeat Unduli.

Granted, Unduli's force powers might give her an edge. But Grievous has tanked force attacks in the past. He also has much better feats than Unduli. Recall that Mace Windu himself considered Grievous a dangerous being in ROTS. So overall, I would give Grievous the win here.

EDIT: And no, Barris could not defeat Grievous.

Originally posted by Vensai
I say General Grievous wins, but Luminara makes him work for it.

As has been said, Form 3 is a good counter to Grievous's attacks. However, it would be wrong to say that Form 3 is an automatic win against Grievous, who has gone toe-to-toe with Jedi Council Members. And I do not believe Unduli was ever a Council Member.

Some people are forgetting that Grievous once took on 5 Jedi (including Shaak Ti and Ki Adi Mundi) at once and won, dodging their force attacks and outdueling them. He has also been able to fight evenly against Ventress after her defection, and Ventress managed to defeat Unduli.

Granted, Unduli's force powers might give her an edge. But Grievous has tanked force attacks in the past. He also has much better feats than Unduli. Recall that Mace Windu himself considered Grievous a dangerous being in ROTS. So overall, I would give Grievous the win here.

EDIT: And no, Barris could not defeat Grievous.

Luminara has better feats than some Council Members. Namely Kit Fisto who got tooled by Ventress, where as Luminara held her own while blind. I think Grievous will win after awhile simply because even in ROTS 4 sabered Grievous was overloading Kenobi's defenses.

I agree Luminara loses though. Mainly because I think Fisto with Jar'Kai would fair way better against Ventress than he did in Cetus Deception.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
Luminara has better feats than some Council Members. Namely Kit Fisto who got tooled by Ventress, where as Luminara held her own while blind.



Most Council members would get tooled by Ventress.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Actually, Barris could probably beat Grievous.



Barriss pwned Ventress and pimpsmacked Ahsoka, who held her own against General "teh four blade!!1!" Grievous, who beat Obi-Wan, who pwned Maul and Savage combined, who held their own against Sidious.

Logically, the current hierarchy looks something like this:

Barriss > Ventress > Grievous > Ahsoka ~ Obi-Wan > Yoda ~ Sidious > Darth Maul&Savage Opress ~ Dooku > Mace Windu

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Actually, Barris could probably beat Grievous.

Possibly since she did tool Ashoka who held her own against Grievous.

Although Ashoka's style is 2 Blades and she was restricted to one in her fight against Bariss. So that might have had an impact on her performance.

Of course Bariss purposefully Cheap Shotted Ventress, but who can blame her. That gal can tool "Celebrated Masters" like Fisto any day of week so it's no surprise Bariss was too scared to face her in fair combat.

On the subject of Grievous no one has ever given Grievous the complete and total Saber Tooling ROTS Kenobi gave him. Especially impressive since that was Grievous in his prime after years of training from Count Dooku during the Clone Wars and after Analyzing and Imitating Mace's Vapaad.

So... why did Barris go darkside? I can only find the German version on youtube.

Originally posted by Nephthys
So... why did Barris go darkside? I can only find the German version on youtube.

Stay tuned for next week's episode!

I think Tarkin is ramming his proton torpedo down her exhaust port, myself.

That would wreck untold havoc on my shipping chart. mmm

Ahsoka x Barriss 4 eva!

...threesome? Tarkin and Ahsoka clearly have potential for gratuitous grudge sex.

Get your filthy manmeat away from my glorious yuritopia.

Originally posted by Nephthys
So... why did Barris go darkside? I can only find the German version on youtube.

Lol I didn't even realize it was her until these guys started jumping in joy about how she cheap shotted Ventress and... wait for it... Beat Ashoka!

But next week's looks exciting. Anakin will confront Ventress and he doesn't look very happy.

I was only speculating.

Inb4 Kenobi-level Luminara

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
Inb4 Kenobi-level Luminara

It's funny you mention Kenobi.

I went back and rewatched Obi-Wan's brief duel with Grievous in season 5 during the Younglings arc and Grievous, with two sabers, spanked Obi-Wan's ass, forcing Kenobi to rely on the Force, an explosive, and Commander Cody's assistance to survive.

The same Grievous that Ahsoka held her own against very well in the very next episode... except the general was wielding all his lightsabers.

By virtue of KMC's patented Lightsaber Sum Formula, this doesn't look good for ol' Obi-Wan.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
Inb4 Kenobi-level Luminara

I haven't been keeping up on TCW - but honestly?

It doesn't surprise me in the least that Luminara is being implied to rival Kenobi in sabers.



Years back when I studied her character, her dossier explained how she was a refined Master of Soresu, and that she could bend and twist her body to evade attacks.

Other Jedi have not been noted to fight in this way.

I've long thought that Master Unduli was definitely a top-tier Jedi based on her swordsmanship alone.


So, none of these developments surprise me.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
It's funny you mention Kenobi.

I went back and rewatched Obi-Wan's brief duel with Grievous in season 5 during the Younglings arc and Grievous, with two sabers, spanked Obi-Wan's ass, forcing Kenobi to rely on the Force, an explosive, and Commander Cody's assistance to survive.

The same Grievous that Ahsoka held her own against very well in the very next episode... except the general was wielding all his lightsabers.

By virtue of KMC's patented Lightsaber Sum Formula, this doesn't look good for ol' Obi-Wan.
TCW has been ****ing with the powerscales so much. Asoka lasting a second against Grievous is horse shit.

Originally posted by Visage
I haven't been keeping up on TCW - but honestly?

It doesn't surprise me in the least that Luminara is being implied to rival Kenobi in sabers.



Years back when I studied her character, her dossier explained how she was a refined Master of Soresu, and that she could bend and twist her body to evade attacks.

Other Jedi have not been noted to fight in this way.

I've long thought that Master Unduli was definitely a top-tier Jedi based on her swordsmanship alone.


So, none of these developments surprise me.

Luminara isn't quite Kenobi level...but fending off Ventress while blind is an accomplishment.

On the other hand, Master Plo Koon was able to fend her off with a broken arm, and then apparently lost to Savage Oppress...so take that as you will.

Lol, Ventress kicked her ass. And she was only somewhat aggravated in one eye. It was only when Ahsoka arrived that Ventress chose to leave. She wasn't even forced back or anything, she just jumped away almost immediately, no doubt to rescue Nute Gunray as was her mission. She wasn't 'fended off.'

Whats even funnier is that Luminara was talking smack about Ventress' Makashi being 'sloppy' about 10 seconds before Ventress beats her.

Wait - when did Plo Koon lose to Savage?

Originally posted by Nephthys
So... why did Barris go darkside? I can only find the German version on youtube.

You expect TCW to describe such an important detail... Please.

Ventress most certainly did not "kick ass." Would she now? Most likely: We see in "Cloak of Darkness" that Sidious is contemptuous of Ventress and rebukes the Count for granting her the assignment to capture/kill Gunray. Two seasons later and she's a potential threat to him.



Sith Hunters comic. He doesn't really beat Plo Koon outright, they fight and Savage physically tears off Koon's respirator mask, which brings him to his knees.



A little, but not gratuitously. Of course, if you subscribe to the hilariously inane "moar lightsabers!!1!" theory, then yes... but Tzeentch., Neph, myself, and others have already debunked that one thoroughly.

Originally posted by The_Tempest

A little, but not gratuitously. Of course, if you subscribe to the hilariously inane "moar lightsabers!!1!" theory, then yes... but Tzeentch., Neph, myself, and others have already debunked that one thoroughly.

Not thoroughly enough apparently, because it seems that in that other thread since Windu doesn't have two sabers he's not a skilled enough duelist to survive.

Originally posted by Jinsoku Takai
Wait - when did Plo Koon lose to Savage?

In the comic book Sith Hunters. Based between season 4 and 5 of Clone Wars. Dave Filoni and Katie Lucas both contributed to that comic.


Originally posted by Nephthys
Lol, Ventress kicked her ass.

Hardly. They were stalemating. And you honestly think her bad eye wouldn't have effected the outcome

Originally posted by Ascendancy
Not thoroughly enough apparently, because it seems that in that other thread since Windu doesn't have two sabers he's not a skilled enough duelist to survive.

Facing 2 Opponents is clearly more difficult with 1 Lightsaber. And easier with 2 (assuming your skilled at using 2).

I really can't help those who can't see that seen as the Episode "Revival" made that perfectly clear.

Originally posted by The_Tempest


Barriss pwned Ventress and pimpsmacked Ahsoka, who held her own against General "teh four blade!!1!" Grievous, who beat Obi-Wan, who pwned Maul and Savage combined, who held their own against Sidious.

Logically, the current hierarchy looks something like this:

Barriss > Ventress > Grievous > Ahsoka ~ Obi-Wan > Yoda ~ Sidious > Darth Maul&Savage Opress ~ Dooku > Mace Windu

Wait, you guys actually allow ABC logic on these forums?

^ Not really. He's just being an ass trying to make a point that A>B>C doesn't work in Saber fights. Even though he started the whole thing with "Lol Fisto =/> Kenobi because he tooled Grievous.."

But it's a bit extreme claiming it doesn't work AT ALL. Context of fights, consistent showings and high end feats all need to be considered.

Oh and Grievous has never even beaten Kenobi. Kicking Kenobi hardly constitutes a win. Grievous has always fled Kenobi when ever they've fought one on one and for more than a few seconds.

Oh, okay.

Originally posted by Ascendancy
Not thoroughly enough apparently, because it seems that in that other thread since Windu doesn't have two sabers he's not a skilled enough duelist to survive.

I cannot be responsible for the enduring idiocy of others, but you are welcome to crush them on my behalf. I deem you my representative in such affairs.

Now go and gratify me with their anguish.

Originally posted by Ascendancy
Not thoroughly enough apparently, because it seems that in that other thread since Windu doesn't have two sabers he's not a skilled enough duelist to survive.


That argument came from the same exact person who said Sidious was struggling against Maul and Savage.

I am pretty confused about Grievous' place in all this. I mean the guy was stalemeating Mace ****ing Windu in sabers during LOE. And yet Ventress cut his arm off quicker than even Mace could. Smells like BS to me.

Mace fought Grievous on a train that was moving at great speed, so calling on the force to keep his body from flying off could have hampered his ability to call on the force for speed, IDK. Grievous was also intended to be a greater threat back then.

I'd still say he is pretty good though, considering the consistent struggles he gives Obi Wan.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
That argument came from the same exact person who said Sidious was struggling against Maul and Savage.

You still crying about an angry Maul challenging Sidious all on his own

Or you looking for the hidden meaning behind Filoni outright telling us that Opress alone did better than your 3 "celebrated" stooges

Or about Obi-Wan's smackdown of the Brothers being easily as impressive as Sidious's

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
I am pretty confused about Grievous' place in all this. I mean the guy was stalemeating Mace ****ing Windu in sabers during LOE. And yet Ventress cut his arm off quicker than even Mace could. Smells like BS to me.

That was before the Lucasian edict that Grievous be a moderately talented fighter. Mace or Yoda would trash Grievous.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
You still crying about an angry Maul challenging Sidious all on his own


Actually, I'm more mad about Bariss being able to compete with Sidious. And not just in sabers, but in an all-out.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Actually, I'm more mad about Bariss being able to compete with Sidious. And not just in sabers, but in an all-out.

Compete? That's pretty generous... to the Dark Lord.

In other words, Barriss curbstomped Ahsoka, who in turn held her own against a four-blade-wielding Grievous, who in turn defeated season 5!Obi-Wan with only two blades. (That means Grievous was twice as powerful when he fought Ahsoka vis a vis Obi-Wan.) The same Obi-Wan who annihilated Savage and Maul combined and can compete with Sidious.

Barriss currently sits atop the mountain on a gilded throne.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Compete? That's pretty generous... to the Dark Lord.

In other words, Barriss curbstomped Ahsoka, who in turn held her own against a four-blade-wielding Grievous, who in turn defeated season 5!Obi-Wan with only two blades. (That means Grievous was twice as powerful when he fought Ahsoka vis a vis Obi-Wan.) The same Obi-Wan who annihilated Savage and Maul combined and can compete with Sidious.

Barriss currently sits atop the mountain on a gilded throne.


Well Barriss needed two sabers to fight Ahsoka otherwise it might have been a tie.

Perhaps Sidious would be able to compete with Barriss if she had only one lightsaber and he had two. Maybe?

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Well Barriss needed two sabers to fight Ahsoka otherwise it might have been a tie.

Perhaps Sidious would be able to compete with Barriss if she had only one lightsaber and he had two. Maybe?

I think the idea that adding more lightsabers would significantly increase one's fighting potential is ridiculous. Logically, if more lightsabers equals more power, than every jedi would take a second lightsaber to make themselves more effective. Besides, Obiwan's tooling of 4-armed Grievous in ROTS clearly shows that spamming lighstabers is overrated.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Actually, I'm more mad about Bariss being able to compete with Sidious. And not just in sabers, but in an all-out.


???

Yeah because sucker punching Ventress is really comparable to challenging Sidious.

Originally posted by Vensai
I think the idea that adding more lightsabers would significantly increase one's fighting potential is ridiculous. Logically, if more lightsabers equals more power, than every jedi would take a second lightsaber to make themselves more effective. Besides, Obiwan's tooling of 4-armed Grievous in ROTS clearly shows that spamming lighstabers is overrated.

They're making fun of me. But I don't even say "The more Sabers the more Uber."

The only thing I've suggested is 2 Sabers is better suited to take on 2 opponents. Especially if they're surrounding you from opposite sides. It was clearly useful to Obi-Wan in his situation against the Brothers. But NOT the all and end all.

As for one on one's it depends on what the person's style is. I'd say Ashoka was at a disadvantage against Barris because it's her usual style to wield a Shoto with her Lightsaber.

Just like Ventress was probably at a disadvantage when she fought Opress for the same reason.

But I've never said or even suggested that when someone picks up a second Saber they're automatically twice as powerful. The main advantage would be in being able to switch styles to see what works best against your opponent. Kasim switched from 1 Saber to Jar Kai and as a result began defeating Bane.

There's a lot of different factors to fights. The number of weapons would be A factor. I've never suggested it's everything.

Grievous takes it.