Assemble an X-men team to take out the JLA and their plot devices

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demigawd
Here's the JLA team:

Superman
Wonder Woman
Batman
Green Lantern Hal
Martian Manhunter
Flash
Plastic Man
Zatanna

All plot devices are on the table - speedblitzes, batkicks, GL-omnipotence, speed-stealing, IMPs, MM actually being good, "eid!"

Sooo....can you assemble a team of X-men to defeat the JLA?

Here are the rules:

You can pick up to 15 X-men, but if you can do it in less, bless your heart
Anybody who has ever been an X-man counts, even if it was one issue, or a team-up, and you can power them up to their classic levels, even if they didn't have that level of power at the time they were members (e.g. Juggernaut, Cable, etc.)
All X-men plot device powers (if they exist) are on the table.
Alternate X-men realities are on the table - including What Ifs
The X-men get five hours of prep
The X-men ambush the JLA
The Jean Phoenix power level is restricted to X-men #113 levels - no crazy extrapolations
The Rachel Phoenix power level is restricted to Secret Wars II level - that is, significantly below a Cosmic Cube (Beyonder)
Scarlet Witch is restricted to her Busiek power levels (equal to Thor)

The JLA is restricted to their default power levels - no sun dipping, no godwaves, no Ion, no Fernus. But any wacky plot devices that any of the characters used under their own power are OK.

The deck is stacked in favor of the X-men, but the JLA is possibly the most powerful and balanced team in comics, and when you add in plot device powers, they may well be unbeatable.

Can YOU prove otherwise?

JLAKMC members and other JLA fanboys: It's YOUR job to make use of the JLA's powers to stomp those uppity muties and those who would defend them!

The key is to be creative and wacky. Everything goes here. Except for all those rules above, lol.

Juntai
Doesn't matter what they do, Flash shares his speed with Batman and Batman batkicks them all for the KO.
GL makes a bunch of green naked cheerleaders that jump up and down.
Plastic Man cracks a joke about it.
Zatanna magics his mouth shut and tells GL to stop.
They then go defeat a god in the Syndriatrica Quadrant.

pr1983
You are a bad, bad man... this is the JLA... they piss on x-men members... not literally of course...

demigawd
Originally posted by Juntai
Doesn't matter what they do, Flash shares his speed with Batman and Batman batkicks them all for the KO.
GL makes a bunch of green naked cheerleaders that jump up and down.
Plastic Man cracks a joke about it.
Zatanna magics his mouth shut and tells GL to stop.
They then go defeat a god in the Syndriatrica Quadrant.

Just as a warning....THIS is what you X-fans are up against!

I wonder if anyone is up to the challenge. big grin

Juntai
Originally posted by demigawd
Just as a warning....THIS is what you X-fans are up against!

I wonder if anyone is up to the challenge. big grin I knew you needed an example. big grin
Figured I'd start off slow.
lol.

stormfront13
well you could have a whole team of phoenix's. there have been many phoenix people in what if's and alternate realities.

juggernaut66666
Havok (full powered), Cyclops (313), Prof X., Colossus (Ultimate), Wolverine (Ultimate), Iceman, Quicksilver, Jean Grey, Juggernaut, Storm, Gambit, Multiple Man

TheKahn

Khellendros
So, I've got an army of Wendigos, two Juggernauts, Three Magnetos, one of whom will apparently be able to keep the other two alive for a short time... oh, and the In-be-f*cking-tweener! I win, bitches.

EDIT: Christ, might help to actually post my team:
Professornaut
Juggernaut at "8th day" levels
Iceman as an Omega mutant
Uber Cable
Blink with the power of the In-Betweener from What If 75
Alternate Evil Mimic who had the combined powers of Cannonball, Magneto and Professor X
AOA Magneto
616 Magneto
Xmen: the End Magneto
Wendigo Madrox from Earth X

Knightfall93
This is weird

stormfront13
well here's my team

queen of asgard storm- had stronger weather powers than thor, and did actually beat him and took control of asgard

phoenix storm-when the phoenix used storms body as a vessel, storm had easily defeated all of earths heroes, and that included ALL of earths heroes

The end magneto- someone should read demi's thread about him

extreme rogue-where she had all of the powers of everyone she had ever absorbed, and could use all of them easily and use more than one at the same time, and a heads up, she absorbed multiple man before

evil mimic-he was bad-ass, and even stalmated xavier in a pshycic battle

AOA iceman-more ruthless and even more powerful than 616

i was going to choose the same version of link, but i don't want to sound like a copier, but what the hell. blink with in-betweener

herald dazzler

lifeguard-she can conjure any power she wanted

quantum powers moonstar

scarlet witch

jean grey

rachel grey

UniOmni
New Sun wins this by himself

demigawd
Pretty good teams...but let's throw a little battle salvo out:

How will your teams deal with Flash stealing the speed from your teams, lending superspeed to his teams, and Infinite Mass Punching everybody on your teams to death? What are your defenses against that?

Khellendros
Originally posted by demigawd
Pretty good teams...but let's throw a little battle salvo out:

How will your teams deal with Flash stealing the speed from your teams, lending superspeed to his teams, and Infinite Mass Punching everybody on your teams to death? What are your defenses against that?
Well, I've got a thousand Wendigos as cannon fodder. In the half a second it takes the JLA to superspeed punch them out, the Magnetos and Cable can all get shields up while Mimic and Professornaut start attacking the opponent's minds. Anyone with fluid in their eyes can be Iceman's ***** and watching a superspeed Batman futilely wailing on Juggernaut would be pretty funny. Basically, everyone else is just there to stall the team and protect Blink while she puts them away.

demigawd
Originally posted by Khellendros
Well, I've got a thousand Wendigos as cannon fodder. In the half a second it takes the JLA to superspeed punch them out, the Magnetos and Cable can all get shields up while Mimic and Professornaut start attacking the opponent's minds. Anyone with fluid in their eyes can be Iceman's ***** and watching a superspeed Batman futilely wailing on Juggernaut would be pretty funny. Basically, everyone else is just there to stall the team and protect Blink while she puts them away.

Hmmm....a fine plan. I think Juntai might be screwed.

Juntai?

spetznaz
Originally posted by juggernaut66666
Havok (full powered), Cyclops (313), Prof X., Colossus (Ultimate), Wolverine (Ultimate), Iceman, Quicksilver, Jean Grey, Juggernaut, Storm, Gambit, Multiple Man

Wow ....someone actually included Wolverine and Quicksilver.
Wow!
roll eyes (sarcastic)

I was actually wondering how long it would take before the clawed one (and his sparkly knuckle knives) and Magneto's slow (by DC standards)....I mean fast ....son showed up.

Lucid Lui
laughing

snoopdogg
Originally posted by Knightfall93
This is weird It's obviously a DC hater thread. shifty

TheKahn
Originally posted by demigawd
Pretty good teams...but let's throw a little battle salvo out:

How will your teams deal with Flash stealing the speed from your teams, lending superspeed to his teams, and Infinite Mass Punching everybody on your teams to death? What are your defenses against that?

To me that has been the most difficult attack to account for. Not many mutants deal with speed on that level often.The key is that my team gets five hours of prep and surprises the JLA. The first target would be the Flash. Now I have to use several attacks against him (the reason for so many is that these guys are from different universes so its tricky to say how their powers would affect the Flash/Speed Force)

The first key is the ME Rogue with the Destiny's pre-cog. I would use her to get a general idea of how the JLA will begin the fight and plan accordingly (much like Deathstroke was able to predict Wally's movements from his past experience). Merged X-Man should have enough brains to think up a effective plan.

My team would take the field protected my multiple overlapping forcefields from Magneto and Professornaut (should be enough, if not there are more who can add to it).
The Flash would be the first target. So now I know generally what he is going to do I would attack him on three fronts:

First would be a telepathic telepathic/telekinetic assault. I'm pretty sure he doesn't have any imminuity to a either so either he gets reduced to the mind of a 3 year old girl or his brain explodes. During this time Iceman and New Sun both of which can reduce kinetic energy would be making sure he is slow enough to keep track of (though the psi's shouldn't need more than a bare fraction of a second given their power and prep time). Also Scarlet Witch would do some magic to possibly miss up his connection to the speed force or cause him to trip. He should be gone withing a second after the fight starts.

Flash is potentially the most dangerous character but given preptime, pre-cog info, and the above attacks my team should be able to take out Wally quickly without every leaving their forcefields. This may be moot though as the New Sun *might* be able to take on Wally by himself as he has control also over all forms of kinetic energy (but this is debatable)

spetznaz
Originally posted by TheKahn
To me that has been the most difficult attack to account for. Not many mutants deal with speed on that level often.The key is that my team gets five hours of prep and surprises the JLA. The first target would be the Flash. Now I have to use several attacks against him (the reason for so many is that these guys are from different universes so its tricky to say how their powers would affect the Flash/Speed Force)

The first key is the ME Rogue with the Destiny's pre-cog. I would use her to get a general idea of how the JLA will begin the fight and plan accordingly (much like Deathstroke was able to predict Wally's movements from his past experience). Merged X-Man should have enough brains to think up a effective plan.

My team would take the field protected my multiple overlapping forcefields from Magneto and Professornaut (should be enough, if not there are more who can add to it).
The Flash would be the first target. So now I know generally what he is going to do I would attack him on three fronts:

First would be a telepathic telepathic/telekinetic assault. I'm pretty sure he doesn't have any imminuity to a either so either he gets reduced to the mind of a 3 year old girl or his brain explodes. During this time Iceman and New Sun both of which can reduce kinetic energy would be making sure he is slow enough to keep track of (though the psi's shouldn't need more than a bare fraction of a second given their power and prep time). Also Scarlet Witch would do some magic to possibly miss up his connection to the speed force or cause him to trip. He should be gone withing a second after the fight starts.

Flash is potentially the most dangerous character but given preptime, pre-cog info, and the above attacks my team should be able to take out Wally quickly with every leaving their forcefields. This may be moot though as the New Sun *might* be able to take on Wally by himself as he has control also over all forms of kinetic energy (but this is debatable)


thumb up

Good analysis Kahn.
And honestly I think it would work.

The JLA team would have a considerably hard time (in essence unwinnable) against a team of uber power-wielders like the ones you assembled (where they are basically kissing the viable max of their powers), that also has the abilities stemming from pre-cognition.

In Spetz's 'dictionary' the following is the hierachy of comic advantages:

no.3 on my list: Prep time.
Prep time will get almost anyone most of the time. With Prep time a person like Doom (who though powerful should not be taking down some of the folks he takes down) will defeat nigh anyone, and give Batman/Reed/Deathstroke/T'Challa prep and you have a serious situation. Although Doom still takes the cake for prep.

no.2 on my list: Pre-cognition.
This is greater/better than prep time!
Why?
Well, you can have all the prep time you need, but if I KNOW what you are going to do then all that prep time was for naught.
Hence precognition is definitely better than prep (unless you can prepare for my precog, which would be moot since my precog would let me know you were preparing for my precog, in which case YOUR prep would have to prepare for my precog knowing you were prepping for my precog, in which case I would know that you were .......well, you see what starts to happen)

no.1 on my list: PIS/CIS.
This is the single most powerful advantage a character can have.
It will enable the defeat of ANYONE ANYTIME (unlike the 'almost anyone' 'most' of the time abilities of the prep time aspect).
With PIS/CIS a character like Squirrel Girl can defeat Terrax and Thanos!
With PIS/CIS a character like Reed can defeat Galactus (this was not really prep as it was PIS/CIS).
Also with this Storm can take out WW, and Wolverine can beat Lobo.


Anyways, enough of Spetz's dictionary.

Back to this match .....the intention of the above dictionary was to show that the X-men team was using the third and second most powerful advantages in my list.
Consequently, the ONLY way the JLAers could defeat them would be if they were to use PIS/CIS (or, barring that, if they were allowed to also use a mix of prep and precog .....has to be a mix of the two).
Thus, without a prep/precog mix, or a PIS/CIS imbuement, the JLA will go down .....and they will go down hard.

PS: Actually one could argue that the X-men team is not only using prep and precog, BUT ALSO using PIS/CIS.
Why?
Well, after all the original poster made the X-men team have significant advantages (both numerical and power level),as well as collapsing universes to allow the multiple presence of the same character (eg more than one Magneto, three Juggernauts, etc etc), having the powers of all those characters be as high as they can be (that is, as high as they can get without the comic book literally catching fire), plus they have prep and precog, etc etc etc. The members of the 'x-men' could even be people who were briefly members, even in only one universe.
Add to this that the JLA team, although able to use their various powers, are not at the apex of their abilities (eg having Flash as one with the Speed Force where he becomes a god and is everywhere at the same time, having Superman soaking in solar energy, having MM as Fernus, having Aquaman has wielding the hunger aspect of the Water hand, having GL as the sole user of Oan energy, having Wonderwoman manifesting the godwave, having Zatanna literally flowing with eldritch and thus able to easily take out Despero, etc).

Thus, it could be argued that the X-team is actually using PIS/CIS as well ......although maybe I would leave out the 's' (since it is not really 'stupidity' ....after all it is a thread), however it is DEFINITELY plot-induced.
Thus it could be said that the X-team is using Prep, using pre-cog, and using PIS/CIS.

Conclusion: The X-team wins.

TheKahn
Thanks alot spetznaz big grin
But a lot of credit needs to go to demigawd, it took me almost a damn hour to make a team I thought could hold their own against his team. If he had limited it to the 616 Universe X-men I don't think it would be possible.

Juntai
Problem with this one is, Flash as a member of the JLA has undergone training by Martian Manhunter to help resist the telepathic assaults. Not to mention that Martian Manhunter himself is there as well and could easily offer protection from this.

Scarlet Witch can't mess up his connection to the Speedforce, Nothing can. It can happen to any other Speedforcer, but not Wally, he's MAINLINED to the Speedforce and can't be cut from it.



As well, Zatanna, as by the thread starter, can simply tell most of your team to die.

DigiMark007
Bah!

...stupid fanboy rhetoric. Something has to be done about this JLAKMC...

stick out tongue

Juggernaut's a good start....but you'd need something crazy to help him in the speed department.

Can SW slow down time? There's no easy answer for Flash...especially with full PIS mode on.

That's what you get for pitting X-Men against them. Now if a real team (coughauthoritycough) were to face them, my boy Jeroen could take out half the team before you can say "heroin addict". lol

TheKahn
Originally posted by Juntai
Problem with this one is, Flash as a member of the JLA has undergone training by Martian Manhunter to help resist the telepathic assaults. Not to mention that Martian Manhunter himself is there as well and could easily offer protection from this.

Scarlet Witch can't mess up his connection to the Speedforce, Nothing can. It can happen to any other Speedforcer, but not Wally, he's MAINLINED to the Speedforce and can't be cut from it.



As well, Zatanna, as by the thread starter, can simply tell most of your team to die.


I have Merged X-man (with telepathic powers that may rival Galactus), Pheonix Jean, Pheonix Rachel, Professornaut, Shaman Xman, and god-like Cable; that *should* be enough to stop any tp attack my Martian Manhunter and overcome any resistance training.

Remember that this was only the first attack my team would make (i.e. take out the Flash in the first second or so) and demigawd has set it up so that my team is ambushing the JLA so they wouldn't know what is happening until after the first attack.

I'm going to get to Zatanna and MM.

Juntai
Originally posted by TheKahn
I have Merged X-man (with telepathic powers that may rival Galactus), Pheonix Jean, Pheonix Rachel, Professornaut, Shaman Xman, and god-like Cable; that *should* be enough to stop any tp attack my Martian Manhunter and overcome any resistance training.

Remember that this was only the first attack my team would make (i.e. take out the Flash in the first second or so) and demigawd has set it up so that my team is ambushing the JLA so they wouldn't know what is happening until after the first attack.

I'm going to get to Zatanna and MM. GL can still also shield from any telepathic attack. If you look at his respect thread, he battled and defeated a guy who mentally dominated an entire galaxy. If he sets his ring as such, it won't be broken.


Not to mention Martian Manhunter and/or GL could probably rerout the whole operation into Wonder Woman's mind and your team mind****s themselves for trying.

Any portion of a picasecond is enough time for Flash to tap the speedforce and share it with the entire team. At which point, it all goes downhill for you.

TheKahn
Perhaps I should write out my entire plan then people can see how I'd take out the rest of the JLA.

Now I've used suprise attack to take out Flash (btw the New Sun can also manipulate time as well as all types of kinetic energy makeing that easier). So now the JLA has Superman
Wonder Woman
Batman
Green Lantern Hal
Martian Manhunter
Plastic Man
Zatanna

Most importantly thanks to ME Rogue each of my team has been briefed on how their assigned opponet will fight and respond to their attacks.

Remember that my team is still behind the Magneto/Professornaut sheid, so they now have to attack (this is where the preptime really comes inhandy. Professornaut will remain with merged X-man, New Sun, and Scarlet Witch to provide both a physical haven, a counter to MM's telepathy, a drain away some of their superspeed, and magic attacks.

First Zantanna- I would have Super Skrull Rogue (who didn't take part in the Flash attack so could have also attacked at the same time) will use the power of the invisible woman to create and burst a force bubble in Zantanna's throat (similar to Deathstroke's tactics) taking her out at the start.

Superman- I would send Queen Storm to face him. Since she has all of the powers of Thor she should be able to hang with Superman. That is all I need her to do as Magneto would be following her with some red-sunlight and K-nite radiation to take Superman down

Wonder Woman- Against her I would send Thor Rogue and ME Rogue. Again they are just there to hold her off until Superman is put down and Queen Storm and join in. Two Thor's and one Pre-cog Rogue should be enough to kill her.

Green Lantern- Against him I would send God like Cable, Shaman X-man, and Magneto (when he's done with Superman) also he would be the main target of Scarlet Witch's magic. As soon as WW is defeated Queen Storm would also help.

MM- against him I would send Pheonix Jean and Skrull Rogue (as she has already taken out Zantanna). Espically with the power of the Human Torch, Skrull Rogue and Jean should be albe to handle him. They would be aided by ME Rogue and Thor Rogue after WW goes down.

Plastic Man- I would send Pheonix Rachel to simply use her tk to eject him into space.

Batman- I'd have Iceman to freeze him, and then send him on to help one of the other groups.

Of couse as members of the JLA fall, my team would then conentrate on the remaining memebers.

All of their attacks would be quordinated by Merged X-man.
Also if Wonder Woman goes for the Godwave (which would kill most of her team) my team would be transported away by both Magneto and New Sun, only to come back and finish her off.

And finally my biggest weapon/PIS would be Lifeguard. As soon as any member of my team is in mortal danger, she would gain whatever power was needed to save them. So for example if the Flash was about to kill Scarlet Witch, Lifeguard would automatically be able to stop him. Or if WW tired the GodWave and we couldn't evacuate, Lifeguard would deveolp a power to save them.

Now this is roughly my plan and I reserve the right to change it if I've forgotten something major, but I think this would work.

Avalonofthewind
Originally posted by demigawd
Pretty good teams...but let's throw a little battle salvo out:

How will your teams deal with Flash stealing the speed from your teams, lending superspeed to his teams, and Infinite Mass Punching everybody on your teams to death? What are your defenses against that?

AH! But you forgot they can also pool willpower to GL for even more ridiculous feats as well!!

demigawd
Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
AH! But you forgot they can also pool willpower to GL for even more ridiculous feats as well!!


hahaha....I didn't say that was the end all and be all of the strategy. Just something I threw out.

But it sounds like TheKhan has the JLA owned. Juntai looks like he's in some trouble...how can he respond to being ambushed and caught flatfooted? Is pre-cog one of the many plot device powers the JLA has? Is there anyone who can help poor Juntai???

demigawd
Originally posted by TheKahn
Thanks alot spetznaz big grin
But a lot of credit needs to go to demigawd, it took me almost a damn hour to make a team I thought could hold their own against his team. If he had limited it to the 616 Universe X-men I don't think it would be possible.

I usually make cerebral strategy threads because they're often my favorite. But I was pretty worried that nobody would respond (as is often the case on my threads, lol).

Good job!

Scoobless
Originally posted by demigawd
Here's the JLA team:

Superman
Wonder Woman
Batman
Green Lantern Hal
Martian Manhunter
Flash
Plastic Man
Zatanna

15 members..... ok

Onslaught
8th Day Juggernaut
Full power Nate Grey
Jean Phoenix
Rachel Phoenix

Storm Phoenix (from What If stick out tongue )
Exiles Mimic with Brood Powers (unlimited amount of power copying)
Full potential Ice-Man
Rogue With Thor's power + Hammer (from What If)
New Sun Gambit

Full Power Cable
Gladiator (he's teamed up with the X-men before)
Profesor X/Juggernaut combination
Scarlet Witch
Synch (why not?)

stormfront13
damn, i just realized i didn't finish my team, well here is the full team

queen of asgard storm
phoenix storm
The end magneto
extreme full potential rogue
brood mimic
full potential iceman
blink with in-betweener
herald dazzler
lifeguard
quantum powers moonstar
THE END: moonstar
binary-she has worked with the x-men
scarlet witch
super skrull rogue
shaman x-man

Scoobless
actually i have an X-Men Unlimited where the Silver Surfer helps them out... throw him in there too

smile

stormfront13
the JLA are going to have a very tough time to even take one of our teams, if they even can

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by demigawd
Just as a warning....THIS is what you X-fans are up against!

I wonder if anyone is up to the challenge. big grin

I might be later on im a bit boozed up at the moment. eek!

Oh and Rachel wasnt significantly below a cosmic cube Beyonder as you incorrectly stated in your intro, she was significantly below a Pre retcon Beyonder wink

Scoobless
Everyone is significantly below pre-retcon beyonder

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Scoobless
Everyone is significantly below pre-retcon beyonder

Debatably. Feats wise hes been beaten by all the big cosmic powers since the IG.

demigawd
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
I might be later on im a bit boozed up at the moment. eek!

Oh and Rachel wasnt significantly below a cosmic cube Beyonder as you incorrectly stated in your intro, she was significantly below a Pre retcon Beyonder wink

It doesn't work that way. There IS no pre-retcon Beyonder. There's just Beyonder. Everything that happened in SW/SWII still happened, but got explained away and placed in its new perspective, which means that Rachel got retrograded to being punked by an incomplete Cosmic Cube.

It happens.

big grin

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by demigawd
It doesn't work that way. There IS no pre-retcon Beyonder. There's just Beyonder. Everything that happened in SW/SWII still happened, but got explained away and placed in its new perspective, which means that Rachel got retrograded to being punked by an incomplete Cosmic Cube.

It happens.

big grin

By your logic Galactus, the Celestials and Death are below Cosmic cube level as well. confused

Retcons dont work like that. At the time he was written as arguably the most powerful being in Marvel. Rachel lost to that incarnation. Beyonders feats were explained away as illusion and/or the powers playing along. Take your pick. wink

demigawd
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
By your logic Galactus, the Celestials and Death are below Cosmic cube level as well. confused

Retcons dont work like that. At the time he was written as arguably the most powerful being in Marvel. Rachel lost to that incarnation. Beyonders feats were explained away as illusion and/or the powers playing along. Take your pick. wink

No need to take my pick. It was retconned into Beyonder being a Cosmic Cube who beat up on M-bodies, illusions and a weak Galactus. By decree of the retcon, he was NEVER as powerful as he seemed. That puts Rachel significantly below a cosmic cube in power. No shame in that, though.

TheKahn
By the way here is a good list of alot of alternate earth and what-if characters for Marvel.
http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/appalte.htm

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by demigawd
No need to take my pick. It was retconned into Beyonder being a Cosmic Cube who beat up on M-bodies, illusions and a weak Galactus. By decree of the retcon, he was NEVER as powerful as he seemed. That puts Rachel significantly below a cosmic cube in power. No shame in that, though.

Nope. Where did it state any of it specifically like that my friend? Considering the length of time it took you to reply, despite remaining on-forum im thinking you just went and made that one up. Its cool. No shame in thatwink

In the comics which debuted the retcon (namely the F4 annuals) Beyonders feats were revealed to be nothing more than illusions (as per the nature of a cubes power) and the powers playing along. I dont recall anything like what you've just stated. Care to point me to the appropriate source? smile

Pepito
Onslaught was technically an x-man for a very short time.

My team: Onslaught (with Franklin and Nate), Phoenix, Magneto, Professor X the Juggernaut, Cable without techno-organic disease, Nate Grey, Juggernaut, Death Wolverine, Beast, Iceman, Gambit, Rogue with power boost (access to all absorbed powers), Sinister

demigawd
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Nope. Where did it state any of it specifically like that my friend? Considering the length of time it took you to reply, despite remaining on-forum im thinking you just went and made that one up. Its cool. No shame in thatwink

In the comics which debuted the retcon (namely the F4 annuals) Beyonders feats were revealed to be nothing more than illusions (as per the nature of a cubes power) and the powers playing along. I dont recall anything like what you've just stated. Care to point me to the appropriate source? smile

What are you talking about? Made what up? unlike you, I don't sit here hitting reload over and over again, you geek. stick out tongue

So what did I make up? That Beyonder beat up illusions and M-bodies? Um...didn't you just say the same thing? Kubik specifically said that the cosmics just put illusions into Beyonder's mind that he beat them. He didn't...and Kubik said to stay faaaar away from the Celestials. In Secret Wars, Galactus was so weak that the Avengers nearly killed him. He had to eat his ship just to get back into fighting shape.

Face it....rachel got owned by a cosmic cube. But that's ok...Cosmic Cubes are powerful, in a "get owned by Thanos" sort of way... big grin

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by demigawd
What are you talking about? Made what up? unlike you, I don't sit here hitting reload over and over again, you geek.

So what did I make up? That Beyonder beat up illusions and M-bodies? Um...didn't you just say the same thing? Kubik specifically said that the cosmics just put illusions into Beyonder's mind that he beat them. He didn't...and Kubik said to stay faaaar away from the Celestials. In Secret Wars, Galactus was so weak that the Avengers nearly killed him. He had to eat his ship just to get back into fighting shape.

Face it....rachel got owned by a cosmic cube. But that's ok...Cosmic Cubes are powerful, in a "get owned by Thanos" sort of way...

Im just interested in what point youre trying to make. Are you saying that Rachel Phoenix is below cosmic cube level? confused

GalacticStorm
We'll continue this tomorow gots ta go its drinkin time!! What are your thoughts on the strategies posted so far?

demigawd
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Im just interested in what point youre trying to make. Are you saying that Rachel Phoenix is below cosmic cube level? confused

Well, yeah...that's she far below that level...at that point. But my point is that she's restricted to that sub-CC level for this battle, mainly to prevent you from turning this into a Phoenix-owns-all thread, which isn't the purpose of this thread.

Now go away.

GODSCRIBE
Originally posted by Pepito
Onslaught was technically an x-man for a very short time.

My team: Onslaught (with Franklin and Nate), Phoenix, Magneto, Professor X the Juggernaut, Cable without techno-organic disease, Nate Grey, Juggernaut, Death Wolverine, Beast, Iceman, Gambit, Rogue with power boost (access to all absorbed powers), Sinister

Ding Ding Ding

And we have a winner!!

demigawd
The JLA is getting OWNED. Nobody will defend them.

Sad sad

X-men >>>>> JLA!

spetznaz
Originally posted by demigawd
The JLA is getting OWNED. Nobody will defend them.

Sad sad

X-men >>>>> JLA!

Actually more like this:

'X-team' (not X-men, but a losely knit affiliation of numerically superior and power-drunk characters from several universes who have some association with the X-men, even if fleeting and obtuse, and who have a whole lot of advantages going for them ranging from prep to precog to PIS/CIS) >>>>> JLA

Now, that is closer to the truth.
However X-men >>>>JLA is simply not going to happen.
But 'X-team,' with the above characteristics (prep, precog, PIS, collapsed universes) is obviously going to defeat the JLA.

Thus: X-'team' (with explained characteristics) >>>>JLA.
But X-men (real) <<<<<<<<JLA.

TheKahn
Originally posted by demigawd
The JLA is getting OWNED. Nobody will defend them.

Sad sad

X-men >>>>> JLA!

Give the JLA 5 minutes of prep and have it not be an ambush. IMO that would really make a difference. That would allow them to protect Zantanna and then Flash wouldn't get taken out at the start. If the JLA is allowed to really get going then I think most teams here would have a lot of trouble. Additionly, if Flash and Zantanna had time to enhance the JLA before the fight, then I'm not sure what could take them down.

Also for the love of Pete, replace Batman with Aquaman (magic hand could "cure" mutants?), Dr. Fate, or Firestorm or somebody who could last form more than a second

Scoobless
Originally posted by GODSCRIBE
Ding Ding Ding

And we have a winner!!

meh... I drafted Onslaught on the second page.... I freakin rule


(and i'm freakin drunk)

smile

Marcus4600
Actually, 616 Colossus is now as strong as his Ultimate counterpart. Here's the team that I would go with.

Professor X (pre-house of M)
Colossus
Cyclops
Bishop
Cable
Scalet Witch
Magneto (pre-House of M)
Quicksilver

Here's how it would work. No ambush needed. Colossus is definately as strong as Supes. Also, none of Supes' abilites aside from flight could really work on him. Anyone who uses energy wouldn't be able to harm Bishop, and he'd just throw it right back at them. Scarlet Witch could use anything to her advantage, possibly even turning the Green Lantern's ring into a party favor, Supes' costume into Kryptonite, and she's more than a match for Zatanna. Magneto, well, everyone is f*cked if there's metal around. Quicksilver could keep up with Flash for a while, and if not, then you've got the psychic abilities of Cable and Professor X.

demigawd
OK...UPDATE:

Since the JLA is getting owned right now, I'm going to flip things a bit.

No ambush.

One milisecond prep time on both ends.

NOW Lets see what the JLA's got

Blair Wind
Originally posted by Marcus4600
Actually, 616 Colossus is now as strong as his Ultimate counterpart. Here's the team that I would go with.

Professor X (pre-house of M)
Colossus
Cyclops
Bishop
Cable
Scalet Witch
Magneto (pre-House of M)
Quicksilver

Here's how it would work. No ambush needed. Colossus is definately as strong as Supes. Also, none of Supes' abilites aside from flight could really work on him. Anyone who uses energy wouldn't be able to harm Bishop, and he'd just throw it right back at them. Scarlet Witch could use anything to her advantage, possibly even turning the Green Lantern's ring into a party favor, Supes' costume into Kryptonite, and she's more than a match for Zatanna. Magneto, well, everyone is f*cked if there's metal around. Quicksilver could keep up with Flash for a while, and if not, then you've got the psychic abilities of Cable and Professor X.


Did you just say Colossus is as strong as supes?????? What the f**k?

and I MAY add my two cents in later about team members, but just for the record 616 Iceman is more powerful than AoA Iceman thanks to X-men Forever.....Ill post more on my team later though.....


and ignoring Demis post because I cant think of anything that the Flash cant do when someones NOT prepared for him...

I say this:

Wendigo Multiple Man (1000 dupes)
X-men Forever Iceman
Mimic
Magneto: The End
Northstar
Juggs
Blink
God Like Cable
Invisible Woman
Tag (New Xmen)
Prodigy (New Xmen)
Scarlet Witch
Psylocke
Onslaught
Silver Surfer



Mimic copies the Wendigos creating 500 dupes (then one of his dupes drops that power and copies the Wendigos creating an infinite loop)
he also copies Magneto, Tag, Iceman, and Northstar

they ALL tag themsevles (meaning EVERYONE runs away from them that they want to affect) basically flash cant hit him since he has to run away from him. Northstar can go about the speed of light, Magneto can yellow microwave Greenlantern, Prodigy has all the knowledge of everyone in the fight and kicks batmans ass, MM is dealing with Psylocke and Cable, Invisible Women has made everyone invisible and is creating as big ass bubble for a sheild overlapping it with the infinite magnetos running around. I know there are more people but right now I cant think of them but with tags power everyone should be out of the fight.....

spetznaz
Originally posted by Marcus4600
Actually, 616 Colossus is now as strong as his Ultimate counterpart. Here's the team that I would go with.

Professor X (pre-house of M)
Colossus
Cyclops
Bishop
Cable
Scalet Witch
Magneto (pre-House of M)
Quicksilver

Here's how it would work. No ambush needed. Colossus is definately as strong as Supes. Also, none of Supes' abilites aside from flight could really work on him. Anyone who uses energy wouldn't be able to harm Bishop, and he'd just throw it right back at them. Scarlet Witch could use anything to her advantage, possibly even turning the Green Lantern's ring into a party favor, Supes' costume into Kryptonite, and she's more than a match for Zatanna. Magneto, well, everyone is f*cked if there's metal around. Quicksilver could keep up with Flash for a while, and if not, then you've got the psychic abilities of Cable and Professor X.

Erm .....wait a minute!

A)
For one Colossus is NOT (repeat: not) as strong as Superman, and in fact is not near Superman level feats of strength.
Secondly your assertion that none of Superman's abilities (apart from flight) would work on Colossus is sadly mistaken (for one Colossus couldn't even spot Superman if he travelled at 0.01% of his top speed .....worked it out by the way).

B)
As for Quicksilver keeping up with the Flash, even for a second ....well ....what to say?!?
It just shows that you do not know anything about the Flash (or for that matter Quicksilver) if you think those two are analogous at all. Quicksilver used to be able to travel at around 300mph, and now he can go supersonic.
The Flash can breach light speed.
Now, it may seem as if surpassing the speed of sound and approaching (and passing) the speed of light are similar, but consider the following:

- When the Concorde flew (used to since the various Concordes are now retired) from New York to Paris, it flew at Mach 2 speed (2 times the speed of sound).
That flight took 3 hours 35 minutes.
And the distance from NY to Paris is approx. 3,635 miles (5,851 km)

- Light from the Sun takes 8 MINUTES to reach the Earth. Eight minutes.
The distance from the Sun to the Earth 93.2 MILLION miles (150 million kilometers).
Yet light only takes 8 MINUTES to traverse that distance.

Thus, light takes only 8 MINUTES to traverse such an enormous distance, yet a plane flying at TWICE the speed of sound takes almost 3.5 HOURS to go a 'mere' (relatively) distance of 3600 miles.
That should give you an inkling of how mismatched the Flash and QS are.
The Flash could literally be crippled and still shuffle on all fours faster than QuickSilver could zip about healthy and prime.

Yet you said Quicksilver would be of any help here?
Goodness, he is just as useless as Wolverine .....the only quy QS would be a threat to is Batman ....since WW, MM, Superman and GL are all FAR faster than QS could ever dream of.



I think you have put too much stock in Colossus (for you to think he is as strong as Superman), and have definitely drank the crazy juice if you think QS could 'keep up with the Flash for a while.'
Crazy juice with 'special' mushrooms.

spetznaz
Originally posted by Marcus4600
Actually, 616 Colossus is now as strong as his Ultimate counterpart. Here's the team that I would go with.

Professor X (pre-house of M)
Colossus
Cyclops
Bishop
Cable
Scalet Witch
Magneto (pre-House of M)
Quicksilver

Here's how it would work. No ambush needed. Colossus is definately as strong as Supes. Also, none of Supes' abilites aside from flight could really work on him. Anyone who uses energy wouldn't be able to harm Bishop, and he'd just throw it right back at them. Scarlet Witch could use anything to her advantage, possibly even turning the Green Lantern's ring into a party favor, Supes' costume into Kryptonite, and she's more than a match for Zatanna. Magneto, well, everyone is f*cked if there's metal around. Quicksilver could keep up with Flash for a while, and if not, then you've got the psychic abilities of Cable and Professor X.


< CONTINUED ..........>

Actually the rest of your team wouldn't work.
There is a reason the other posters went for REALLY powerful characters, yet you picked a team that would find taking down the Titans problematic!

Take Bishop for example. You claim that anyone who used energy wouldn't be able to take him out, and that he would just unleash it back at the assailant.
Well, for one I doubt that Bishop's energy absorption powers are limitless (in that he may be able to absorb a concussive blast from Cyclops, but I doubt he can absorb a full blast from Superman's heat vision .....which has been shown to be hotter than a sun's core).
BUT ....for the sake of argument let's say that Bishop was so powerful when it came to energy absorption that he could even absorb the mightiest blast from the Living Tribunal.
Ok, let's assume that.
How in goodness name will he be able to take a punch delivered by Martian Manhunter, WonderWoman or Superman?
They'll be coming in at him at frenetic speed, and each of them can almost shift small tectonic plates.
What in blazes will Bishop do ....shoot at them with his guns?

Cyclops .....here is another person that would be best used against Batman and no one else. His concussive blasts are for naught against Supes, MM and WW, and GL and Zatanna would just block them automatically. He wouldn't even see the Flash. Also note that Cyclops would be taken out before a second was over by either the Flash, Supes, WW, MM or GL. If he is lucky. If he is unlucky then Zatanna gets to do something really nasty to him.

Professor X .....he'd also be out before a second is over. Note, you said in your post (for SOME reason ....probably the assumption that the X-men are uber powerful ....that your team would NOT need to ambush the JLA). Prof X is taken out so fast that he wouldn't even have a single thought (I went to great lengths describing how this would happen in the Superman vs Professor X thread, where I showed that a Superman travelling at 0.01% of his TOP speed would still be fast enough to take out Xavier before the good professor could even get one thought transferred through his neurons .....even if we were to assume every nerve in him was mylineated due to his mutation).
Supes, MM, WW ....and ofcourse the Flash ....would take out the good professor before he even thought.
Especially since you, so imprudently, said that your team is NOT ambushing the JLA.

I've already dealt with Quicksilver. To be honest with you I doubt the JLA would even bother with him .....the only person he would be a threat to is Batman, and if he is protected by the rest of the team then QS wouldn't be able to harm any of the rest. They would either be too fast, too powerful, or way out of reach ....in most cases ALL three at the same time.

Colossus .....as strong as Superman .....LOL.
Nice joke.

The heavy hitters in your group are Cable (assuming you have him at his most powerful ....because if he brings his regular showing he is just as useless as the rest, but without any restrictions and no virus he can be a Nate level threat ....for there would be no difference) and obviously the Scarlett Witch (who can be bad news).
However those two will be facing the entire JLA, and they WILL go down.


Anyways, without PIS/CIS (and the need to draw out the fight for 1,000 panels when in truth it could be taken care of in half a panel), your team goes down in ....say .....1 second.
0.00001 (5 decimal places) of second to get rid of everyone in your team, and the remaining fraction of a second for the Flash to search for the best Bistro in the Western hemisphere so as to get some takeout supper for his team.

Note: The original poster said that while the JLA couldn't be at their full potential (i.e sun-dipped Superman, Fernus MM, godwave WW), that they would still have full use of their 'normal' powers.
In JLA:Trial by Fire, the Flash evacuated an entire city of 500,000 people (taking them in twos and threes) in 0.00001 of a second ....while a nuclear detonation was occuring ....and transported the people (remember in small groups of 2s and 3s) to a place far way enough that they wouldn't be hurt by the nuke.
If he can relocate 500,000 people that far (and note he is searching for them in the city),and do it in a fraction of a second, then how in goodness name will your team (that is NOT even ambushing them) fare against the Flash.
And then there is the rest of the JLA.

Goodness ....0.00001 of a second is actually too much time.
Your team would get owned.

There is a reason posters like 'The Kahn' went for teams that were extremely powerful instead of picking people like Colossus, Quicksilver, Bishop and Cyclops.

Khellendros
Originally posted by demigawd
OK...UPDATE:

Since the JLA is getting owned right now, I'm going to flip things a bit.

No ambush.

One milisecond prep time on both ends.

NOW Lets see what the JLA's got
I'm changing my team a bit:
Professornaut
Trion Juggernaut
Uber Cable
Blink with the power of the In-Betweener from What If 75
Alternate Evil Mimic who had the combined powers of Cannonball, Magneto and Professor X
AOA Magneto
616 Magneto
Xmen: the End Magneto
Wendigo Madrox from Earth X
Goblin Queen from the Mutant x universe
Phoenix Force inhabiting Colossus' body from Nocturne's timeline

So, yeah. I still win. When Blink had In-Betweeners power, she was warping time and reality with ease. One millisecond can last as long as she wills it for the other team. In the meantime, Anyone with shields gets them up. I now have FIVE uber telepaths, meaning When Cable takes out MM and Professornaut takes out AM, Phoenix can immediately take over Zatanna, shutting down her mind before she can utter a spell. Blink can reverse any enhancements Zatanna and Flash gave the team While they pound on my cannon fodder. Once the remaining JLA are down to normal levels, the Magnetos take them out.

Avalonofthewind
Originally posted by demigawd
hahaha....I didn't say that was the end all and be all of the strategy. Just something I threw out.

But it sounds like TheKhan has the JLA owned. Juntai looks like he's in some trouble...how can he respond to being ambushed and caught flatfooted? Is pre-cog one of the many plot device powers the JLA has? Is there anyone who can help poor Juntai???

It's simple really. They all pool their willpower into GL and turn off the other teams powers!

The ring CAN do anything with enough willpower. eek!

leonheartmm
SHAMAN NATE GREY
GOD CABLE
MAGNETO
XAVIER
ICEMAN
JEAN GREY
STORM
GAMBIT
BISHOP
ROGUE
SCARLET WITCH
PSYLOCKE
FORGE
LEGION
MAGMA


im sure this team is MORE than enough to take out any member there has ever been in the JLA.

grey fox
I'm surprised no one has picked scarltet witch with thors hammer.....

Scoobless
Originally posted by grey fox
I'm surprised no one has picked scarltet witch with thors hammer.....

I have Rogue with Thor's hammer

Mider
if your talking about a full potential GL then he would be good enough to fight parallax with a human host of course he'd lose to him if parallax didnt have a human host but im not sure if thats the full potential of the gl but there was one good enough to do the feat i just wrote above, and wonder women has the godwave, superman is prime? if not he is sundipped.

Khellendros
Originally posted by Mider
if your talking about a full potential GL then he would be good enough to fight parallax with a human host of course he'd lose to him if parallax didnt have a human host but im not sure if thats the full potential of the gl but there was one good enough to do the feat i just wrote above, and wonder women has the godwave, superman is prime? if not he is sundipped.
Umm, no. This is the JLA without random powerups like the Godwave, or sundipping. But this is a JLA who can use their regular powers at full potential, meaning our teams have to be able to deal with speedblitzing, and willpower pooling and the like.

TheKahn
Originally posted by demigawd
OK...UPDATE:

Since the JLA is getting owned right now, I'm going to flip things a bit.

No ambush.

One milisecond prep time on both ends.

NOW Lets see what the JLA's got


Damnit!
JLA curbstomps my team. Without one-sided prep and with the all of the JLA's plot devices in place I can't think of a way to beat them.

In the first milisecond the Flash increases the speed of everyone on the JLA. Then Hal surrounds everyone in a forcefield and gives them a duplicate of his ring (it wouldn't be nearly that hard to teach them how to use the rings as all are thinking at light speed).
So now the X-man are facing 8 flash-like, GL ring wearing opponents.
I just don't see how anyone could stop them.

demigawd
Hmm...anybody? Can any of your teams deal with TheKhan's scenario?

Scoobless
Lots of Shaman Nate, "God" Cable and full potential Onslaught characters..... trick the league into beating each other down

big grin

Khellendros
Originally posted by demigawd
Hmm...anybody? Can any of your teams deal with TheKhan's scenario?
Already done. See my last scenario. Blink had all the power of the In-Betweener without the compulsion to maintain balance.

Blair Wind
TAG IS THE MAN!!!!!! makes everyone on the JLA side run away from him.......did anyone read my team?

The Ion
Originally posted by Blair Wind
TAG IS THE MAN!!!!!! makes everyone on the JLA side run away from him.......did anyone read my team?
Yellow radiation no

Blair Wind
lol Im taking Demi's own plot devices.....evil face

The Ion
http://www.newsarama.com/WonderCon2006/DCU/besttocome.html

That's one more step towards Green Lantern omnipotence. evil face

willRules
I can do this with 2 characters. Xavier Juggernaut from the what if storyline to take out some of the bigger hitters and Deadpool. He is immortal. He can't die.

TheKahn
Originally posted by Blair Wind
TAG IS THE MAN!!!!!! makes everyone on the JLA side run away from him.......did anyone read my team?

IMO Tag's abilities seem to be a form of telepathy and I believe that the GL rings provide protection aginst telepathy (not 100% sure on that).

Also with only one milisecond of prep time, many people on your team who don't have great duribility or automatic defense (or no defense aginst the Flash stealing their speed) could be killed nearly instantly since even with GL rings most of the JLA can speedblitz.

In the original senerio with 5 hours of one sided preptime and an ambush your team (like mine) could provide a serious threat to the JLA, but one milisecond isn't enough time.

stormfront13
Originally posted by TheKahn
IMO Tag's abilities seem to be a form of telepathy and I believe that the GL rings provide protection aginst telepathy (not 100% sure on that).

Also with only one milisecond of prep time, many people on your team who don't have great duribility or automatic defense (or no defense aginst the Flash stealing their speed) could be killed nearly instantly since even with GL rings most of the JLA can speedblitz.

In the original senerio with 5 hours of one sided preptime and an ambush your team (like mine) could provide a serious threat to the JLA, but one milisecond isn't enough time.

well your opinion is right, his abilities are in fact a form og tp. anyone with very strong willpower should be able ti avoid it, and ww would be immune to it, and possibly mm would be as well. and when did scarlet witch handle thors hammer?

willRules
Aunt may, if she had a knuckle duster could do this..............



if Xavier had prep, he could read Dr Doom's mind and create a portal transporting supergirl to the x-men. they then mindwipe her and make her defeat the JLA again......................

stormfront13
isnt ultimate scarlet witch more powerful than her 616 counterpart? didn't she easily turn longshot(who has luck bassed powers as well) into a cat? it just seems like she has more of a handel, and unlike her 616 counterpart, ulimate wanda fly's. so i think she would be a better choice

Rewmac
Nothing can take my precious Justice League out big grinbig grinbig grinbig grinbig grin

stormfront13
Originally posted by Rewmac
Nothing can take my precious Justice League out big grinbig grinbig grinbig grinbig grin

actually, some of the teasm here could very well take the JLA.

spetznaz
Originally posted by stormfront13
actually, some of the teasm here could very well take the JLA.

Yep.
Some of the teams here (eh TheKahn's) can take out the JLA.
I'll even go out on a limb and say that Kahn's team would probably take out the JLA with ease (especially since they are not only uber-powerful but also have prep and precog).
The JLA goes down.
There are quite a number of very well thought out JLA-buster teams here, and a good number of people came up with very solid teams.

On the other hand there is that person who thinks Colossus is stronger than Superman, and that Quicksilver can hang with the Flash.
However that is to be expected from Marvel fanboys.
laughing

hoorayforpeepee
8th day juggernaut

xavier the juggernaut

new sun

magneto: the end

xorn

god-iceman

onslaught

silver surfer
----------------------------------

new sun has a mastery over kinetic energy, he could just slow the flash down and disintegrate him.

god-iceman can't be beaten physically, and has several avenues of attack that bypass durability.

8th day juggernaut is above skyfather (full power of cyttorak).

xavier the juggernaut is exactly what you think would be good about combining a top-tier psychic with a top-tier tank.

xorn has a black hole for a head...that means trouble. and he can harness the energy to control gravity as well, which is a huge problem for any human character or any character without powerful flight

magneto-the end is an energy being. seemingly WAY above herald.

onslaught is also an energy being, with telepathic powers far beyond xavier and magnetic powers far beyond magneto.

silver surfer: flash+superman+firestorm (err...almost...sorta). what more could you ask for?

DigiMark007
The Doctor
and
Longshot

...all I need, beyatches. Longshot's improbable luck makes it a day where The Doctor is being written to potential (which never happens) and Jeroen takes care of the rest.

Blair Wind
......when did the doctor become an xman?

Rewmac
Originally posted by Rewmac
nothing can take out my precious Justice League big grinbig grinbig grinbig grin

I was just joking. Of course there are teams that can beat Justice League, I just don't wanna read them JLA is cool....Kinda can tell me I'm a fanboy, but yes there are X-Men members can beat JLA...But.

Marcus4600
Originally posted by spetznaz
On the other hand there is that person who thinks Colossus is stronger than Superman, and that Quicksilver can hang with the Flash.
However that is to be expected from Marvel fanboys.
laughing

I hadn't read anything DC in about seven years. Doesn't mean I'm a fanboy. I did the research, and the team I put in still could take the Justice League put on there. Professor X and Magneto could do a lot of damage.
2guns

Read Planet X and you'll see what Magneto can do, and we all know that Professor X can turn someone into a drooling baby across the Atlantic.
jawdrop Also, Rewmac, if you can admit that your team can be beat, you're not a fanboy. Here's fanboy language:
jusitce legue is teh best nobady can beet them th3y r invincebale.

coosie
Can't Nightcrawler do the "time stretch" thing that flash can by teleporting the rest of the X-men to the demon dimension where he always go and where time doesn't exist and formulate their plans there then teleport back when they've finished?

demigawd
Good point. Quite possibly!

Nobody is defending the poor league...no fun!

If I had more time to devote to it, I'd do it myself like back in the day...

Cosmic Cube
Bishop alone.

Sans PIS, he can just absorb everyone's attacks and reuse the energy to destroy them.

The Ion
Doesn't Bishop have a limit? Regardless of that he could just get flung into space.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
Bishop alone.

Sans PIS, he can just absorb everyone's attacks and reuse the energy to destroy them.

He can be overloaded. Theres limits to how much energy he can take. He has reached those limits before when absorbing a barrage of lightning from Storm in X-treme X-men

Cosmic Cube
Originally posted by The Ion
Doesn't Bishop have a limit? Regardless of that he could just get flung into space.

Not that I know of. He probably does, though.

He could absorb the kinetic energy being used to fling him into space, and remain motionless (theoretically.)

Cosmic Cube
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
He can be overloaded. Theres limits to how much energy he can take. He has reached those limits before when absorbing a barrage of lightning from Storm in X-treme X-men

Damn you.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
Not that I know of. He probably does, though.

He could absorb the kinetic energy being used to fling him into space, and remain motionless (theoretically.)

Doesnt have the reactions to redirect the build up of kinetic energy his body would store up prior to reaching said limits as he is speed blitzed at sub-light speeds.

TheKahn
Besides isn't Bishop vulnerable to telepathic attacks or Superman could just pick him up and drown him in some water.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by TheKahn
Besides isn't Bishop vulnerable to telepathic attacks or Superman could just pick him up and drown him in some water.

He can absorb telepathic energy. The picking up thing falls under the absorption of kinetic energy directed at his person thing i believe. Regardless he'll quite easily be overloaded.

Marcus4600
That's why I wouldn't say Bishop alone. Bishop and Cable, or Bishop and Professor X maybe.

The Ion
I can't believe we just argued whether Bishop could beat League. laughing out loud

The Ion
Originally posted by Marcus4600
That's why I wouldn't say Bishop alone. Bishop and Cable, or Bishop and Professor X maybe.
No? Chuck would get steamrolled by any of the near lightspeed characters on the JLA roster. Cable couldn't do it either.

Cosmic Cube
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Doesnt have the reactions to redirect the build up of kinetic energy his body would store up prior to reaching said limits as he is speed blitzed at sub-light speeds.
What if he had the Quantum Bands? He'd be unbeatable.

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
What if he had the Quantum Bands? He'd be unbeatable.

My memory fails me. In what title did Bishop possess those? A What If perhaps? confused

Cosmic Cube
Originally posted by GalacticStorm
My memory fails me. In what title did Bishop possess those? A What If perhaps? confused

Hypothetically, stupid. stick out tongue

GalacticStorm
Originally posted by Cosmic Cube
Hypothetically, stupid. stick out tongue

big grin

Cosmic Cube
Seriously though, with the quantum bands, Bishop would be god-like. No one short of an uber-cosmic would be able to stop him. Besides, he deserves them more than Quasar.

Marcus4600
Originally posted by The Ion
No? Chuck would get steamrolled by any of the near lightspeed characters on the JLA roster. Cable couldn't do it either.

You don't know much about Xavier, do you? roll eyes (sarcastic)
He'd be able to tell when any of them was going to go sub-light the instant they thought about it, and then he'd have them sucking on their thumbs. Xavier's power is immense. He just hardly ever uses it. He's possibly the most humble superhero there is. In a battle of that magnitude, he's gonna use the full potential of his powers. I'm just gonna leave that at this.

HOORAY XAVIER! Happy Dance Happy Dance Happy Dance Happy Dance

Also, any team with an Omega level mutant is gonna mop up.

The Ion
Originally posted by Marcus4600
You don't know much about Xavier, do you? roll eyes (sarcastic)
He'd be able to tell when any of them was going to go sub-light the instant they thought about it, and then he'd have them sucking on their thumbs. Xavier's power is immense. He just hardly ever uses it. He's possibly the most humble superhero there is. In a battle of that magnitude, he's gonna use the full potential of his powers. I'm just gonna leave that at this.

HOORAY XAVIER! Happy Dance Happy Dance Happy Dance Happy Dance
Superman, Flash and Wonder Woman are faster than thought. Hell, The Flash has been seen to "walk" at faster than light speeds. Chuck will be dead long before he can form a thought. It would take true pre-cog to be able to do what you're talking about and even still he'd need the speed to act on it. Not to mention Wonder Woman, Superman and Green Lantern have TP resistance.

Cosmic Cube
Originally posted by The Ion
Superman, Flash and Wonder Woman are faster than thought. Hell, The Flash has been seen to "walk" at faster than light speeds. Chuck will be dead long before he can form a thought. It would take true pre-cog to be able to do what you're talking about and even still he'd need the speed to act on it. Not to mention Wonder Woman, Superman and Green Lantern have TP resistance.

Though the speed of thought is truely undefined, I tend to agree with you.

Marcus4600
Wait, I read that Supes didn't have telepathic resistence. But, you're right. It would take more than 2 people to take them. However, and Omega level mutant can manhandle a lot of JLA members.

The Ion
Of the 4 confirmed Omega level mutants, Phoenix is the only one who could manhandle them. Iceman can't. Elixir can't. Kid Omega can't unless he's a Phoenix.

Originally posted by Marcus4600
Wait, I read that Supes didn't have telepathic resistence. But, you're right. It would take more than 2 people to take them.
LOL. Basic rule of DC Comics: If it isn't K-nite or magic, Supes has a resistance. laughing out loud

Marcus4600
Blah. He needs another weakness. Well, Gog seems to be a weakness. A man after my own heart.

coosie
I thougth it has been agreed upon on the other thread that the x-men will win because of omega iceman plus jean grey.

The Ion
Originally posted by coosie
I thougth it has been agreed upon on the other thread that the x-men will win because of omega iceman plus jean grey.
Phoenix, yes. Iceman? There's been long debates on this forum on whether he can beat Superman, Flash or Green Lantern. He certainly isn't taking the whole team.

Avalonofthewind
Originally posted by Marcus4600
Wait, I read that Supes didn't have telepathic resistence. But, you're right. It would take more than 2 people to take them. However, and Omega level mutant can manhandle a lot of JLA members.

He actually does, when he remembers to turn it on. When Supes doesn't want you in his head, you aren't just getting in.
He can even make it so only certain thoughts can be accessed.
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/4250/torquasmvo4po.th.jpg

Torquasm Vo...the ULTIMATE plot device!

Rewmac
First... The Flash in full speed could punch Chuckie boy a hundred times and he still wouldn't know what's going on. And come on we got there Wonder Woman she gets very underestimated here and direspected a couple of times. She is strong as hell. OOhh and of course Green LAntern's Hal Jordan if I'm right, but do I have to explain what can he really do??? Nope big grinbig grinbig grin

demigawd
ok, so pick one of the teams the guys here assembled and counter their X-men team! big grin

TheKahn
Originally posted by demigawd
ok, so pick one of the teams the guys here assembled and counter their X-men team! big grin


Any rules or limits?

I'd think I would take on the team with just Xavier Juggernaut and Deadpooldoh

demigawd
Nope, just the rules in the original post, but remember, I changed the stips so that both teams get 1 milisecond of prep.

superbatman86
My two man team consists of Iceman and Longshot.That's all you need.

The Ion
Way to go Blair Wind. You officially got Iceman overrated on this forum. roll eyes (sarcastic)

Sir Whirlysplat
Originally posted by The Ion
Way to go Blair Wind. You officially got Iceman overrated on this forum. roll eyes (sarcastic)

laughing out loud

Rewmac
Actually the Justice League is way too underestimated on this forum. Everybody is like Marvel is the strongest comic universe and that's it. X-Men are cooler and so. And then what. I'd say assemble the whole Justice League. And then let the X freaks come and fight their way through.

stormfront13
this is still here? well, i', gonna change my team around.

1)Queen of asgard storm
2)goddess of thunder storm

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix3/stormmillvisions.htm

3)binary
4)magneto in rogues body-he was in rogues body and had her absorbing powers, as well as his magnetic powers to their full capability

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix3/xmenmillvisions.htm

5)in-betweener blink
6)brood mimic
7)phoenix storm
8)professornaught
9)herald level dazzler
10)extreme power-up rogue
11)ultimate scarlet witch-she is able to even turn people into cats
12)magneto-the end
13)earth-x, or whatever it was called iceman
14)gladiator
15)Dr.strange-he has assisted the x-men before


^^also, with blink i am able to extend the time limit for my entire team to discuss stragety, put up force-fields, stuff of the sort.

demigawd
Don't forget to choose from that "lost" team of X-men that showed up in Deadly Genesis last week. Some of them seem pretty damn powerful - at least two omegas on that team (Darwin the Evolving Boy, Vulcan). Some serious pwnage going on...

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